Islamism & Islamophobia Abroad - News & Analysis

[jamwal]

[akashganga]

Inth Ka Jawab Patthar ....

kool man.

[jamwal]

It's somewhere in US. I just posted the whole picture as it is. A minimum of 3-4 people would have been dead and property worth crores destroyed for sure if anybody said that Islam is a violent religion in places with significant muslim population like India

[akashganga]

It's somewhere in US. I just posted the whole picture as it is. A minimum of 3-4 people would have been dead and property worth crores destroyed for sure if anybody said that Islam is a violent religion in places with significant muslim population like India

I saw islamic bill boards last year december in orlando, florida. I have seen islamic ads in SFO bay area couple of years back when I was there. These islamists are masters at milking the system.

[shiv]

When the lady is fined for wearing burkha then the money comes from pocket of her husband/father and that is punishment for him for insisting her to wear burkha. Simple. Plus it is an statement (symbolic) to momeen gangs that their jungle raj (aka sharia) will not be tolerated meekly.

Oh of course they will pay. But the woman gets bitch slapped and prevented from going out after that. So it is a cop out to target women's costumes. Quite apart from that there are women who prefer the burqa or veil for some reason or other - not necessarily Islam. A woman may want to wear a veil one day and not wear one on another. If Islamic coercion of women is the problem, coercion of women by another law that targets their actions is simply keeping fingers crossed and hoping for the best. It is no solution and will not work. Both ways the women are being screwed. A Muslim woman who wants the least trouble will wear a veil and stay at home, perpetuating the Islamic ghetto mentality encouraged by Islam. She is safe at home because she is covered up and she does not get targeted by stupid European laws by going out, and the husband does not have to pay a fine and then come and slap her and her kids for giving him trouble. If she has to follow stupid laws, better to follow stupid Islamic laws that keep her family intact rather than idiotic European laws that stress out her family apart from solving nothing for her.

[RamaY]

^ what logic is this?

Why would woman want to go in a burqa or veil when they have equal freedoms? Since when it became acceptable to put veil on women because the society cannot provide freedom for women or not interested in it?

Coming to the excuse of woman liking burqa is being used, is it ok for men to wear face covers in civil society?

Muslim women have been going out without burqa and veil in many Islamic as well as non-Islamic soceities.

There is no need for idiotic reasonings to support some non-local customs in the name of religion.

http://www.anapsid.org/cnd/mcs/maskcodes.html

[shiv]

^ what logic is this?

Why would woman want to go in a burqa or veil when they have equal freedoms?

Why would a woman want to wear panty and bras if they can have freedom to walk naked? Last time I checked women in Europe got booked for indecent exposure for parading naked in public place say a supermarket.

Freedom is in your mind. You think that one freedom is good and another is bad. Not everyone needs to agree with your views on freedom. Are you trying to tell me that showing face is mandatory but showing boobs/awrat is bad? And you call this logic? This is western Christianist logic. Let me show you a scanned photo of topless Indian tribal women photographed by Brit "anthropologists" in late 1800s. The rules now imposed on the whole world which you blindly accept as logical are "Don't show boobs except at beach. Always show face. Never expose vulva. For you this is "freedom" because you blindly accept western mores as freedom.

Like the saying "Islam is a religion of peace" the saying "West stands for freedom" has been swallowed by you wholesale

[uddu]

Shiv, it's better to fine the persons husband or guardian for she wearing the veil. In that way it ensures that the one who enforces this rule on her will be fined. If the women is saying she is wearing it on her own, then she has to pay the fine. Also someone asked the source from where the ideology originate. In other belives or ideology it'snot necessary to pray to god by looking at a particular direction. That matters a lot in the ideology of Islam.

[RamaY]

Context Shivji, context!

I am not "blindly accepting" any thing. In fact you are "blindly accepting" Islamic customs imposed on women, especially in Western countries.

We are in Islam and "Islamophobia Abroad thread", not in India or Saudi Arabia.

Your point is that western societies are wrong in banning Burqa. I am showing the logic why it is not wrong per western standards and especially when it comes to Muslims wearing Burqa.

We are not talking about West banning Burqa in Saudi Arabia or India.

[shiv]

Shiv, it's better to fine the persons husband or guardian for she wearing the veil. In that way it ensures that the one who enforces this rule on her will be fined.

Uddu, you have restated what someone else said above. This is what I am calling as an ignorant cop out because it really is ignorance of the internal dynamics of family and islamic society.

The law in this case is an ass. The idiotic law imagines that the husband/male is being punished and assumes that if the husband shows cruelty to the woman she will again come to the cops and the cops can then punish the man for cruelty.

That is very naive and very ignorant. A woman who gets fined for wearing a burqa will simply be told by her husband not to go out. If he slaps her for going out she has to make a choice between breaking up her home and making her kids fatherless by complaining to the cops. if you look at real life behavior of women in these situations you find that women, more often than not, accept the abuse and follow the rules set by husband rather than risk losing husband and core family security.

Unless these internal dynamics can be addressed simply imagining that the husband gets punished by forcing a law on the woman is downright ignorant. The woman should have the freedom to wear or take off the burqa at will. Wearing a burqa should not be punished. Punishment of women by Islamic society for not wearing burqa needs to be stopped.

Don't punish the woman for wearing a burqa. It is ultimately the woman who is being punished for wearing and for not wearing. Make it mandatory that the burqa should be lifted for positive identification and punish those who object, man or woman or mulla.

[shiv]

Your point is that western societies are wrong in banning Burqa.

Yes

I am showing the logic why it is not wrong per western standards and especially when it comes to Muslims wearing Burqa.

There is no logic in what you say either, You are now doing a downhill ski and saying that banning burqa is fine in a particular context. I have stated that I think you are wrong as is the law in Europe. I think the logic is wrong. I am not asking you to change your illogical thought process. It is yours to keep and cherish. But I am not going to agree and will merely state what I think is right

[RamaY]

So you think allowing Burqa will make women go out and interact with rest of the society, and that may include some "interesting" behavioral patterns? How is that helpful to women as long as they are under the control of Muslim men for all the reasons you mentioned?

What will you do next when Muslims want to impose forced fasting on rest of the public during Ramzan as they started asking for? Where will this end? How will this help defeat Islam in EU?

[Agnimitra]

Finallcall.com -

The Rise of the Nation of Islam in the West and the Establishment of God’s New World Kingdom on Earth

[devesh]

the shiv's among us should live under Islam. feel the benevolent hand of Islam. many of the men among "us" might even feel a perverse pleasure in having the power to enforce our will on "our" women. many of us will also feel truly disgusted at the power that Islam will give to "the" man over any and every aspect of society as long as he is willing to serve the purpose of expansion of Jihad and eradication of all dissent. I increasingly see why B'ji has arrived at the conclusion that only a "forward" and "overt" expansion of Jihad in the subcontinent will wipe out the "ideological" subversives among us who will destroy us before the fight even begins.

so the Islamic men made it a law for "their" women to disallow them from any expression of personal/individual beauty. generations later, it has been accepted as "freedom" of choice.

so my question is, if me and few other "real men" get together and just like the "real men" in 7th century, decide to have our own law expressly stating that all "expression" of "suppression of individual beauty" should be outlawed. generations later, it will also become a "freedom", no?

there is no point in arguing with Shiv'ji or anyone else on this matter.

our position is simple: if a death cult in Arabia can impose its misogyny and eventually it becomes a "freedom of expression", there is no reason to believe that we cannot bring forceful changes (except, in the opposite direction), and the spirit of history will carry us forward.

forget the fork-tongued arguments. do you believe in the rightness of your argument? if you do, and if you are facing a violent ideology which will go to any lengths to destroy your dissent, then you know exactly what to do.

[RajeshA]

The reason why "burqa" is such an ideal whipping boy is because it is one of the few outward practices of Islam which can be associated with a value in Islam which runs counter to modern European society - subjugation of woman, and which Europeans feel they do not need to accept for reasons of religious freedom and right to cultural individualism.

The behavior of Islamic society in the West is one in which they build a parallel society with its own implicit laws and in the protection of the laws of the land, continues to expand and assert itself at the cost of the native societies.

Europeans have actually chained their own hands and feet and don't know how to react to this parallel society expanding, asserting and demanding exclusive space for itself, unwilling to integrate with the host native society. The only avenue left for Europeans to express their exasperation, frustration and rejection is on the basis of "Values" but that too only at their outward expression because there is freedom of thought, and Europeans can't really get into the heads of Muslims and change their "Values" either.

So basically the modern European political-philosophical system is simply not geared to fight Islam!

Europeans can fight Islam legally only when Islam's misbehavior becomes a systemic phenomenon, and Islam in Europe just wants to bide some more time, before it expresses itself violently! It wants to wait till Europeans simply do not have the means left to do anything against it.

[RamaY]

Shivji's logic about panties and bras is similar to someone claiming victory over islam because he screwed some Muslim women in Burqa that he cannot recognize nor the woman will be proud of.

It will be paraphilia in normal societies.

How can any society fight Islam, forget defeating it, when people comeup with such great ideas to support nonsensical traditions of Islam especially those that involve social interactions?

Actually burqas had a reverse effect on non-Muslim women elsewhere. There is a growing trend that non-Muslim woman are wearing Burqa to hide their love/sexual affairs from their families and immediate surroundings. This idea already reached the movie/tv-serial industry.

[RamaY]

^ continuing above thought...

It is in fact not in the local society's interests to allow Burqa by muslims.

1/ Imagine a muslim woman wearing Burqa and is allowed to go out. Then comes the question of her interactions with muslim/non-muslim men in the society. Islamists then can demand that muslim woman are accompanied by family members only. This means the social interaction of muslim-woman is controlled by muslim men even outside the family.

This will either lead to unproductive society, where men accompany women or women are forced to stay home for lack of free family men members.

2/ Imagine a non-muslim woman wearing Burqa for anonymity or for freedom to do "interesting" things. Then comes an "interesting" scenario where a non-muslim man interacting with non-muslim woman in Burqa, but appears to be a muslim woman. This can cause lot of confusion and Islamists may think their women are going around with non-muslim men. Since one cannot distinguish who the woman is the islamists can either demand the woman stay home or non-muslim men do not interact any woman in burqa, even if they are non-muslim. In essence non-muslim women become muslims in disguise.

[shiv]

Targeting burqas remains stupid notwithstandng the loud wails. It gives a false sense of satisfaction that islam is being dealt with when nothing is being achieved. It only pushes Islamic women to stay at home which is exactly what the men want. Europe is making a silly mistake cheered on by ignorant rah rahs who see a great victory in meaningless symbolism.

All the uptight crusaders on here will come into line when European lawmakers realise how they are egging on islamic ghettoization by doing this. After that the laws will change and there will be total silence on this idiotic issue on this forum. Burqas are a result of Islam. Fighting burqas is not fighting Islam. it is simply fighting some women who can't retaliate using the pathetic excuse that the men will have to pay fines and will repent and become non Islamic by doing that. Stupidity.

Besides. Some women really need to be covered up.

[shiv]

Europeans have actually chained their own hands and feet and don't know how to react to this parallel society expanding, asserting and demanding exclusive space for itself, unwilling to integrate with the host native society. The only avenue left for Europeans to express their exasperation, frustration and rejection is on the basis of "Values" but that too only at their outward expression because there is freedom of thought, and Europeans can't really get into the heads of Muslims and change their "Values" either.

+1 This is a good assessment of European actions. Europe invented white racism and went through so much war and strife that they do not have the stomach for religious war any more. They seem to think that symbolic secular laws will somehow handle a 1300 year old doctrine of subversion of competing societies.

This is not about "freedom". That is only an excuse. Europeans need not fight this silly pointless fight for some imagined women's freedom in Islam. How about freedom from Islam for everyone who wants out or wants nothing to do with it? Problem is Christianity is very similar. Islam can be fought from within Christianity. But Europe has defeated Christianity and is now using worthless means to fight Islam. Ban burqas? What rubbish. As if that will bring Islam crashing down.

You cannot fight religion using secularism. You are only setting religion aside and wearing blinkers. Religion needs to be fought directly and openly and not by silly symbolism. Islam got there first by setting up the burqa strawman knowing that people will attack the strawman and they can fight that easily while the core doctrines remain untouched.

The core doctrines that coerce people to do thousands of things apart from burqas need to be attacked directly, ignoring pointless symptoms like burqas and beards.

[RamaY]

^ Shivji,

I guessed this from your first post, itself. But as you said one cannot fight Islam with Secularism. For secularism has to go away, first the followers need to understand its futility.

There are multiple beasts at play - Islam, Christianity, Secularism, communism etc. All of them are detrimental to human freedom with varying degrees.

Let them fight their fights. Let us see which one wins.

In the meantime, the pagans need to figure out who they are - pagans or secularists. And prepare for the final conflict.

[Agnimitra]

Young Moroccan 'Apostate' (in exile) on The Arab Spring and Islam

Die Welt: What do you think of the so-called "Arab Spring? Can you discern positive changes?

al-Ghasali: The beauty of Spring comes from various colors. Unfortunately, the supporters of the Arab Spring do not know these distinctions. They want everyone to think the same, dress the same and pray at the same time. Most of the supporters of the Arab Spring do not believe in human rights as the West understands them. For them, democracy is just a ladder for the climb to power. Then they fasten knives to the treads so that no other political parties can climb the ladder. What is happening in the Arab World now is comparable to what Europe went through in the 17th and 18th century. The difference is that this phase at that time brought forth enlightened philosophers and thinkers. In the Near East, on the contrary, the supporters of divine laws and the followers of Islam are coming to power.

Die Welt: But couldn't Islam reform as happened with Christianity?

al-Ghasali: In my opinion, there can be no reformation or enlightenment in Sunni or Shiite Islam, because there is no church to be reformed. In Islam, we are subject to the power of a sacred book and the instructions it gives. Identity and understanding of self come from the Koran. If Muslims could use their reason without the instructions of a book which is recognized as the Word of God, then we could talk about enlightenment. But today most Muslims are against the ideas of the Western Enlightenment. And they do not know that Muslims would be capable of achieving the same rights as the people in Western society. Historically, there were several attempts at reform in Islam, but they were not welcomed. Any moderate Muslim who would like to reform Islam should admit to himself that terror and violence are in the Koran. The unmitigated horror. But no Muslim could admit that the Koran is a politically- and historically-determined book - and not the word of Allah.

------------------------------

Non-Moslem British Students Discover Islam...

Encouraging their non-Muslim colleagues to explore what Islam really is, Muslim students in the Newcastle University has held a Week to raise awareness about the Islamic religion and clear misconceptions on the faith.

...Organizers say the event has helped dispel misconceptions that hijab is a symbol of repression of Muslim women. {And non-Moslem women got to try on colorful hijabs}

...while Moslem students at a British Islamic school were discovering: Three held over claims of sexual assault and false imprisonment at Islamic girls school
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‘How I escaped child slavery in Sudan’

“For all those years that I was a slave, the dog lived better than I did,” he says.

“My slave master told me that to be treated like a human being, I must do three things: convert to Islam, take an Arab name, and become their son. To give up my identity. Now, nobody can take my identity away.”

Deng was nine when he was abducted, put on a boat going up the Nile and given to a northern Sudanese family as a “gift”...

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Ahmadinejad under fire for consoling Chavez's mother

While it is not a full embrace, the Iranian president and Mr Chavez's mother have their faces brushed against each other, with their hands clasped in a moment of shared grief. Several news agencies released photos of the unexpected scene.

[akashganga]

Young Moroccan 'Apostate' (in exile) on The Arab Spring and Islam

Die Welt: What do you think of the so-called "Arab Spring? Can you discern positive changes?

al-Ghasali: The beauty of Spring comes from various colors. Unfortunately, the supporters of the Arab Spring do not know these distinctions. They want everyone to think the same, dress the same and pray at the same time. Most of the supporters of the Arab Spring do not believe in human rights as the West understands them. For them, democracy is just a ladder for the climb to power. Then they fasten knives to the treads so that no other political parties can climb the ladder. What is happening in the Arab World now is comparable to what Europe went through in the 17th and 18th century. The difference is that this phase at that time brought forth enlightened philosophers and thinkers. In the Near East, on the contrary, the supporters of divine laws and the followers of Islam are coming to power.

Die Welt: But couldn't Islam reform as happened with Christianity?

al-Ghasali: In my opinion, there can be no reformation or enlightenment in Sunni or Shiite Islam, because there is no church to be reformed. In Islam, we are subject to the power of a sacred book and the instructions it gives. Identity and understanding of self come from the Koran. If Muslims could use their reason without the instructions of a book which is recognized as the Word of God, then we could talk about enlightenment. But today most Muslims are against the ideas of the Western Enlightenment. And they do not know that Muslims would be capable of achieving the same rights as the people in Western society. Historically, there were several attempts at reform in Islam, but they were not welcomed. Any moderate Muslim who would like to reform Islam should admit to himself that terror and violence are in the Koran. The unmitigated horror. But no Muslim could admit that the Koran is a politically- and historically-determined book - and not the word of Allah.

------------------------------

Arab apostates are best suited to fight islamists. Arab apostates take the fight to the source arabia. A long time ago I read VS Naipaul comment that world should forcibly reform Saudi Arabia (sunni leader), and iran (shia leader). Only top down approach from the source will work. Bottom up approach of trying to reform pakistan or bangladesh will never work.

[Prem]

Europeans have actually chained their own hands and feet and don't know how to react to this parallel society expanding, asserting and demanding exclusive space for itself, unwilling to integrate with the host native society. The only avenue left for Europeans to express their exasperation, frustration and rejection is on the basis of "Values" but that too only at their outward expression because there is freedom of thought, and Europeans can't really get into the heads of Muslims and change their "Values" either.

+1 This is a good assessment of European actions. Europe invented white racism and went through so much war and strife that they do not have the stomach for religious war any more. They seem to think that symbolic secular laws will somehow handle a 1300 year old doctrine of subversion of competing societies.
.

Remember the Pain in thinking Vein it caused When Jaswant Singh told his good friend Strobe Talbott about no one having more experience with all the favors of Izzy-laam than India. Those were Pre 911 days.IMHO, It is the divine destiny of Indians to remove this threat to civilized world.

[Varoon Shekhar]

"When Jaswant Singh told his good friend Strobe Talbott about no one having more experience with all the favors of Izzy-laam than India. Those were Pre 911 days."

In those Pre 9-11 days, were there large numbers of Moslems from the subcontinent, and elsewhere, projecting the idea of Islam being a religion of peace? And strongly denouncing terror against India and other places? Or is it only when the most powerful country, the US, was affected, that the strong condemnations of violence and terror took place. As well as the insistence of Islam being solely a religion of peace? I for one, do not recall any forceful, unequivocal denunciations of terror in Kashmir and other parts of India, from the global Moslem community. Only from some Indian Moslems.

[Agnimitra]

In those Pre 9-11 days, ...I for one, do not recall any forceful, unequivocal denunciations of terror in Kashmir and other parts of India, from the global Moslem community. Only from some Indian Moslems.

Du'as for Kashmir freedom struggle are ritually invoked along with Palestine, Chechnya, etc. in mosques in the US - especially where there is a Paki component in the congregation. (If there is no Paki component, then Kashmir usually gets left out.) So there is no condemnation of terrorism in Kashmir from Moslems internationally, whether it is pre- or post-9/11.

[shiv]

I have been saying for a long time that the biggest event in support of Islamic extremism was the creation of Pakistan. The seeds of what we see today were sown in pre-partition India. While Indians in general were clamouring to get the British out - a set of Muslims positioned themselves as if they were moderate people of the book just like British Christians (who saw themselves as enlightened civilizers of the world) and would suffer greatly under the yoke of pagan Hindus with their bloodthirsty gods. The British fell for this and created a Northern Ireland in India.

Pakistan means jihad. It means Islamic exclusivism. Now that it has come this far, Pakistan's Islam must be allowed to thrive in Pakistan and in Europe, their sponsors and mentors. These people really never learned about Islam and they need to learn. They also need to learn how useless secularism is in fighting religion. Secularism ignores religion, while Islam fights everything else - including secularism. Religious war is not a thing of the past. It is necessary. It is simply blinkered old European thinking to imagine that the days of religious war are gone. Those days have arrived again. May it be fought in the west. After all the west never ever stopped fighting religious war in India. The creation of Shitistan was simply a continuation of that

[Prem]

I have been saying for a long time that the biggest event in support of Islamic extremism was the creation of Pakistan. The seeds of what we see today were sown in pre-partition India. While Indians in general were clamouring to get the British out - a set of Muslims positioned themselves as if they were moderate people of the book just like British Christians (who saw themselves as enlightened civilizers of the world) and would suffer greatly under the yoke of pagan Hindus with their bloodthirsty gods. The British fell for this and created a Northern Ireland in India.Pakistan means jihad. It means Islamic exclusivism. Now that it has come this far, Pakistan's Islam must be allowed to thrive in Pakistan and in Europe, their sponsors and mentors. These people really never learned about Islam and they need to learn. They also need to learn how useless secularism is in fighting religion. Secularism ignores religion, while Islam fights everything else - including secularism. Religious war is not a thing of the past. It is necessary. It is simply blinkered old European thinking to imagine that the days of religious war are gone. Those days have arrived again. May it be fought in the west. After all the west never ever stopped fighting religious war in India. The creation of Shitistan was simply a continuation of that

These are Tungustan words. OTOH, all these points point to the global Pakistaani Paedeological problem
divinly ordained to be solved by Indians only. JC (Jinnah and Chruchil) had a short term plan and Allah had a long term Plan and Allah is the best of planeer. He will succeed in escaping "Paakistan".

[member_22872]

Posted by Anindya ji in B'desh forum

From Niticentral....

3:21 pm: The Hindu temple was built 250 years back where around 10,000 people of adjoining villages offer their prayers.
3:19 pm: Islamists vandalised 23 idols of Shiva at a temple in Kaliganj upazila of Jhenidah, striking terror among the people of local Hindu community.

Have you seen huge school of small fish being eaten by a large but numerically inferior fish? Each time the large fish takes a chunk of the school, the small ones try avoiding it, but the large one persists and keeps taking chunks, each time chipping away the numerical superior school till it is no more a school or a school of one single little fish. Complacency and secularism can lull numerically superior school to think they are invincible until it is too late.

[arun]

In a display of one of the more medieval practices of the Mohammadden religion, a Uniformed Jihadi of the Army of the Islamic Republic of Pakistan gets stoned to death for attempting to elope:

Man Reportedly Stoned To Death In Pakistan

[AbhiJ]

Muslims Forced to Shave Beards at Gunpoint in Russia

[Haresh]

In my experience of the followers of the RoP (MA) in the UK. They think they can have their cake and eat it. They are incredibly niave about their own religion. The women especially are the weak link.
My firm belief is that sharia should be allowed in the UK and other parts of the infidel west.
Of course the condition will be....it ONLY applies to moslems. Infidels would be exempt. In any conflict between a moslem and an Infidel sharia law does not stand.
Sharia courts should be set up with the authority to pass death sentences and physical punishments.

My reasoning is this.
Once these so called western moslems see the reality of their religion they will abandon it.
Marriages break up, under sharia, all advantage is with the husband.
The only way a woman could get justice would be to abandon islam.

I have known moslem women, date non- moslems, have affairs, wear western clothes etc etc
If they were to have the "pleasure" of sharia, enforced legally and also by some sort of islamic police force, then they would be abandoning it in droves.

They (moslems) have the idea that all of their western freedoms are compatible with the RoP (MA).
They need a wake up call.

Have a read of these stories from the al guardian, islams best friend and apologist in the UK.

Muslim women are caught in the crossfire between bigots on both sides http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree ... ots-sexism

Shereen El Feki: sexual revolution in the Middle East may never happen – video http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree ... east-video

And probably the funniest of them all.......
Why I want to open a gay-friendly mosque in Paris http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree ... dly-mosque

[brihaspati]

^^^wouldnt work - the primary statutes in sharia include "murtad" - in practicality, execution of those who try to abandon Islam after taking it up once. So they would make an example out of the women - they already do, and if sharia is allowed - they will claim it is onlee their faith and they are bound to honour the rule, even if it appears unpleasant. Once women are beaten sufficiently, and the males as well as the society proves well-able to defend such beating down to a pulp [literally and legally] against surrounding liberal forces, women themselves make virtue out of necessity and will fall more strongly in love with the theology. It happens with western (and Hindu) female converts all the time.

Enjoying liberation also needs long term training. Men often think that women would think like them over liberty - but conditioning has worked differently for women for thousands of years. It will take conscious training and social pressure for generations - to be seen to be starting to be effective.

[RajeshA]

brihaspati garu,

isn't somewhere also written in our scriptures that we need to fight adharma, so if we also start chopping off heads, wouldn't that too be "freedom of religion"?

[Prem]

brihaspati garu,
isn't somewhere also written in our scriptures that we need to fight adharma, so if we also start chopping off heads, wouldn't that too be "freedom of religion"?

Add the Mahapaap of Treachery to Bharti Sanskriti . Guillotine Gunah Games to be played on Every Brihaspati Din.

[Agnimitra]

An "Avaaz.org" report is spreading shock and horror in the online Moslem community - especially British Moslems:

No pork in our fish

In weeks, fish secretly raised on pork will be on our dinner plates unless we raise a massive resistance now.

Europe just decided to allow ground up pig meat into fish feed. This fish is imported and sold in vast quantities across the Middle East and there won’t be any labels to let us know that the fish we are eating and feeding our families were raised on pork!

The report has this picture:


-------------------

Hmm...interesting read in "Daily News Egypt":
Islam’s enemy!

It goes without saying that the Egyptian crisis is now beyond repair. None of the parties involved, including the military, have the power to resolve the conflict that the country seems destined to engage in. At some point there was hope for such a solution, but it now all seems that we are heading to an unprecedented economic and political disaster of epic proportions, with the complete collapse of all state institutions, alongside with the economy.

On the flipside, such disasters offer some unique opportunities for those entrepreneurially minded; for example, anyone starting a private security company now will be making insane money in the near future.

Given that I mainly work in the area of social media, my new business of choice will be a dating website for former Muslims to find like-minded partners in their countries. I bet that by the end of the Muslim Brotherhood’s rule of Egypt, I can have as many users as Facebook does in this blessed country. As the old saying (that I just made up) goes “Wherever there is a crisis of faith, there is an opportunity”.

I am not the first or the last person to write about Egyptian Muslims’ crisis of faith that started the moment Islamists took power and enlightened Egyptians on the fantastic legislations and policies they wanted to implement in the name of Shari’a, with Islamic jurisprudence to back it up. I also will spare you anecdotal evidence on the rise of atheists in Egypt, or the kind of conversations that are now acceptable to have in Egyptian society.

I will simply propose the following argument: What is happening in Egypt, no matter how unfortunate, seems to have a single silver lining, which is the complete and utter defeat of the political Islam project worldwide. At this point, it seems that Egypt’s destiny is to either defeat or contain Islamism, thanks to the Muslim Brotherhood, who is now officially the most ferocious enemy that Islam as a faith has ever seen.

...

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San Francisco leaders denounce bus ads about Islam

Civic officials joined Arab and Muslim leaders to denounce what they call offensive anti-Islamic ads that will appear on 10 buses for the next month in San Francisco.

The ads were paid for by the American Freedom Defense Initiative..

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Another case of right-wing anti-Islamic loonies in the West "surprised" by how "innocuous" Islamism is and how they were mistaken. They don't have any Dharmic context to judge what is poison and what's not.

Salon.com - Anti-Islam writer “infiltrates” Muslim conference, finds it “innocuous”

But he says that it's all part of the Muslim Brotherhood's plot to win "the hearts and minds of the young"

Mark Tapson, a writer for the conservative and anti-Islam FrontPage Magazine, detailed how his secret infiltration of the Muslim Student Association’s yearly West Coast conference did not yield the expected results. “It was largely very innocuous. I mean, there was nothing beyond what I’ve already told you, really. There was very little that you’d consider radical. Highly politicized, yes, but nothing damning,” Tapson said.

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The fruits of Canadian vijja:
Naqvi distances himself from controversial book on Islam

Ontario Labour Minister and Ottawa Centre MPP Yasir Naqvi denies endorsing a controversial book on Islam that says it’s OK for men to physically punish their wives.

[brihaspati]

RajeshA and Jhujar ji,
plenty of mastaka/shiras-chedis in the pantheon - Shiv, his wives as Chandi's forms, Vishnu and most of his avatars, all seem to have ease with off-with-the-head.

[Prem]

RajeshA and Jhujar ji,
plenty of mastaka/shiras-chedis in the pantheon - Shiv, his wives as Chandi's forms, Vishnu and most of his avatars, all seem to have ease with off-with-the-head.

Only one question for PSers, Find one Devta among the Multi Millions who do not carry the Weapon!. I read some where that Porus army used over 300 types of weapons in war against Alex. Lord Budha turned original true Klingons into Firangi natured society.

[RamaY]

Hmmm...

So by controlling the food chain, denying halal food, denying Burkha in public places, denying multiple wives etc., while at the same time implementing 100% education till 12th grade and free sex socity and so on, west can infact control it's Islamic population and infact make the Islamists show their true colors sooner than later.

Then they can use their Christian ethos to crush the dissent. They get to enjoy the Muslim demographics to their advantage till this comes. After all secularism is Christianity without church.

So it is a fight for time. Let us see if Islamists can wait till the demographics turn their favor and Christians can push Islamists to show their hand before that happens.

[shiv]

I believe our minds are coloured by a western imposed need to talk about women's equality, equal rights and equal opportunities. Some of the equality rhetoric is like socialism (and Islamic egalitarianism) - it expresses ideal stuff that cannot work.

Why does women's equality not work in practice?

It does not work because women behave differently from men. Lots of sociological studies have shown that if you pay a man he will use a large chunk of money for himself and pay a small bit to his family. If you pay a woman, she tends to put money aside for family first. Men are more likely to fight other men in situations that they do not like. Women tend to get cowed down. They will accept indignities if the payoff means some stability and security and continued life. Men will confront and fight. Many studies show how women are more likely to feel hurt but still excuse their husbands for having an affair. Men in general simply crack up if they discover their wife doing hukkupukku with someone else.

This is so easy to see that it does not actually require sociological studies except for us people who accept facts only when presented in the correct format. Islam recognized this about women long ago and realized how they can be tools who are used as the frontline, as strawmen who will get hit first and divert attention away from core islam. And women in Islam will not protest much if the payoff for loss of freedom is security, and security has to be sacrificed for freedom.

[RamaY]

^ I don't think the discussion is about woman's rights or their equality with others.

The discussion is can the 'woman's rights (whatever they may be depending on our goals)' be a useful tool to destroy/fight Islamism?