Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

VikramS · Post by **VikramS** » 10 Apr 2013 08:42

Gus wrote:request for starting a youtube channel for good speeches by NM and subtitles for those who aren't good in hindi. anybody up for this?

send it to nm.in they have the resources.

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 10 Apr 2013 08:53

Narendra Modi taunts PM, mocks Congress
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/vide ... 462327.cms

Desh ka Neta Kaun Hai ?

Arjun · Post by **Arjun** » 10 Apr 2013 09:13

Anti Sikh riots decision by court

Decision by court today on plea against Tytler relating to anti-Sikh riots.

As was pointed out by a leading commentator a few days back - 'riots' is the wrong term to describe what happened in 1984:

More often than not, rioting and attacks involve the direct or indirect collusion of political parties in provoking attacks, but in the case of 1984, it was Congress party members who led mobs in attacks on the Sikh community in retaliation for the assassination of Indira Gandhi by her body guards. 1984 thus does not fall into the category of communal riots between communities, and was in fact a direct attack by political party cadres on one community.

This was a pogrom against Sikhs, far surpassing the Gujarat riots of 2002 in sheer brutality and scale, instigated and led by the Dynasty and its cadres.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 10 Apr 2013 09:26

and that too in new delhi with a huge police force and army cantonment on call, with more cantonments nearby. PMO or HMO could have requisitioned any number of forces to crack down and stop the massacres.

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 10 Apr 2013 09:45

VikramS · Post by **VikramS** » 10 Apr 2013 09:52

Singha wrote:and that too in new delhi with a huge police force and army cantonment on call, with more cantonments nearby. PMO or HMO could have requisitioned any number of forces to crack down and stop the massacres.

Singha

Army men had contacted political leadership and offered to help.

Were ask to stay in the barracks.

There was no Army presence for almost a week

I still remember the day, looking out from the terrace of my home. In each of the 12 directions you could see smoke rise as Sikh owned small businesses were burnt.

Chandragupta · Post by **Chandragupta** » 10 Apr 2013 10:35

Just a thought, what if BJP doesn't officially proclaims NaMo as the PM designate, while constantly appreciating & putting the limelight on him just to release the steam from the cadre. And when the party gets 180 seats, which at the moment given the momentum looks quite likely, bring on either Loh Purush or SS or AJ as the PM? What happens then? I'm pretty sure there is no way Nitish can be the NDA PM, BJP cadre will lynch each leader, Loh Purush notwithstanding. But what if it is LP or SS or AJ? What then? What are Modi's options?

Right now, its only Rajnath Singh singing his praise & I don't trust him.

jamwal · Post by **jamwal** » 10 Apr 2013 11:02

Arjun wrote:Anti Sikh riots decision by court

Decision by court today on plea against Tytler relating to anti-Sikh riots.

As was pointed out by a leading commentator a few days back - 'riots' is the wrong term to describe what happened in 1984:
More often than not, rioting and attacks involve the direct or indirect collusion of political parties in provoking attacks, but in the case of 1984, it was Congress party members who led mobs in attacks on the Sikh community in retaliation for the assassination of Indira Gandhi by her body guards. 1984 thus does not fall into the category of communal riots between communities, and was in fact a direct attack by political party cadres on one community.
This was a pogrom against Sikhs, far surpassing the Gujarat riots of 2002 in sheer brutality and scale, instigated and led by the Dynasty and its cadres.

Oh please ! Why don't you say anything about the anti-Hindu pogroms of Khalistanis then ? Whatever happened in 1984 was indeed shameful and the guilty irrespective of their affiliations should be punished , but trying to milk it for political gains 30 years later is just as bad.

In related news, US rejected the demand to declare these riots as genocide just a few days back

Murugan · Post by **Murugan** » 10 Apr 2013 11:04

NaMo was GS of BJP and worked in northern parts of Bharat for a long time before he was selected to be a CM and then was elected in subsequent elections.

NaMo has started Bharat Yatra this year only, and should keep visiting places of Bharat energizing people, telling them success stories etc he is a good example of hands on experience and that he can speak at length on any subject related to governance and other daily life issues, doable ideas etc. This will make more people of Bharat believe in themselves + the fact that Modi comes from a very humble background, a family who used to do petty trade of goni (gunnybags). The need of the hour is instilling confidence in people of bharat that one can grow to a stature of his by hardworking and despite negative propaganda against him. After LBS, only ABV who got top post, may be PVNR, hailing from a very humble background.

While NaMo whether he is projected as PM or not, has proved to be a leader people take pride.

In our desh, very few from such background make it to the top. If this becomes a trend for future and if a common man aspire to achieve such feat, that will be success of the whole nation. NaMo will be known as Nimitt, a cause of such a change in mindset. This is what Bharat needs.

Jay Mahakal and Jay Mahakali!

Arjun · Post by **Arjun** » 10 Apr 2013 11:47

jamwal wrote:Oh please ! Why don't you say anything about the anti-Hindu pogroms of Khalistanis then ? Whatever happened in 1984 was indeed shameful and the guilty irrespective of their affiliations should be punished , but trying to milk it for political gains 30 years later is just as bad.

In related news, US rejected the demand to declare these riots as genocide just a few days back

Jamwal ji,

1. The Khalistanis were terrorists and deserved to be hunted down. Why the doubts as to what I would think about them? But I haven't quite understood why you would do an == between the Dynasty and its cadres and Khalistani terrorists ? I admit I hadn't quite thought of this equivalence earlier, but those guilty in 1984 should probably be getting the same treatment as is reserved for terrorists in Indian law.

2. As was explained in the quote in my earlier post, 1984 cannot be described as a communal riot. It was one Party's cadres against an entire minority community. What the US thinks about the 1984 situation is hardly relevant given that they don't know their arse from their heads in many cases - but 1984 was far more serious and condemnable than just a communal riot.

3. Nobody is wanting to milk for political gains in this sordid affair. However, in any scenario where there is analysis by the media or governmental bodies into past riots (including Gujarat 2002) - it is important to repeatedly highlight the fact that 1984 was possibly THE biggest blot in the history of communal relations in India and this was led by the Dynasty and its cadres. We definitely don't want wrong conclusions drawn based on inconsistent analysis of past riots / genocides.

Klaus · Post by **Klaus** » 10 Apr 2013 11:51

@dhanu_lagna: BRF Poster?

VikramS · Post by **VikramS** » 10 Apr 2013 12:01

jamwal wrote:
Oh please ! Why don't you say anything about the anti-Hindu pogroms of Khalistanis then ? Whatever happened in 1984 was indeed shameful and the guilty irrespective of their affiliations should be punished , but trying to milk it for political gains 30 years later is just as bad.

In related news, US rejected the demand to declare these riots as genocide just a few days back

What?

2002 is like the rising sun; no mention of Modi is incomplete without it.

But what Congress did to the Siks in 1984 not?

Khalistani's did not grow in isolation. Bindranwalan nurtured by the INC.

And since when did India needed US endorsement of anything?

VikramS · Post by **VikramS** » 10 Apr 2013 12:05

https://twitter.com/madhukishwar/status ... 0525216768

"Rattu-Totas"

@rajsekharpattem Those who want Modi to take more questions should have brains to follow his speech. Rattu totas don't deserve answers

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 10 Apr 2013 12:36

calm down guys. we have a long march from kunming to peking via gansu here. its a marathon not a sprint.
sith lords are secure in mordor and with powerful armies, they will strike back.

dont get into finishing line in sight mode. just view last weeks events as the first major battle of a LONG war.

INC is not known for crumbling, not by a long shot. they must be digging high and low for dirt or attack vectors now.

also let us say 90% of voting public are not aware of these twitter or fbook stuff...so victories or losses there are not decisive , though still useful. the task of routing these english media MSM is somewhat of a sideshow to the main task of breaking the gates of Mordor and demolishing it in detail. see them as a errant pack of hyena beasts and orcs on the grasslands.

rkirankr · Post by **rkirankr** » 10 Apr 2013 13:14

jamwal wrote: Oh please ! Why don't you say anything about the anti-Hindu pogroms of Khalistanis then ? Whatever happened in 1984 was indeed shameful and the guilty irrespective of their affiliations should be punished , but trying to milk it for political gains 30 years later is just as bad.

In related news, US rejected the demand to declare these riots as genocide just a few days back

Oh yeah, so US said it is not genocide , so it is not genocide. US did not give Visa to Namo, so 2002 is genocide.

I thought we were independent, but seems I am wrong

Virendra · Post by **Virendra** » 10 Apr 2013 13:36

Pranav wrote:From Modinama 5 (http://www.manushi.in/articles.php?arti ... pe=&pgno=1) -
A Muslim once wrote to Modi saying, “You should not judge Islam from the behaviour of current day Muslims. I want you to read this biography of the Prophet to understand Islam in its true spirit.”

"A religion is as evil as its membership. No more no less."
Read it somewhere recently.

Pranav · Post by **Pranav** » 10 Apr 2013 13:41

Virendra wrote: "A religion is as evil as its membership. No more no less."
Read it somewhere recently.

Yes, and the membership starts with the founder.

Not that I want Modi to get into religious debates, but one does need a proper understanding of historical facts, and of what kind of long-term social engineering is required.

Manish_Sharma · Post by **Manish_Sharma** » 10 Apr 2013 14:16

suryag wrote:Yaaron kahin nazar na lage modi pey, seriously am worried about the possibility of him losing because of the high expectations i have from him

Suryag ji when these dark clouds cover my mood I watch this video of Shri Vajpayee ji when his 13 days govt. fell, its inspiring and he promised he'll keep fighting to come back and come back he did for 6 years:

Pranav · Post by **Pranav** » 10 Apr 2013 14:27

Jaitley comes out against Modi -

2014 polls: BJP fears minority voters may go with Congress

New Delhi: BJP leader Arun Jaitley fears that the polarisation of minority community votes can create problems during the Lok Sabha elections for the party. Jaitley expressed the apprehension at a party meeting and the move is seen as a hurdle in projecting Gujarat Chief Minister Narendra Modi as the prime ministerial candidate even though the party is claiming that all its leaders are united.

At the meeting on Sunday Jaitley said that if in the 2009 Lok Sabha elections votes of the minority community had gone to regional parties and not the Congress, then the BJP would have gained a lot of seats. ...

It is interesting to note that even though there has been a clamour to project Modi as BJP's prime ministerial candidate, leaders like Shatrughan Sinha and Vijay Goel have praised Lak Krishna Advani and advocated that he would make a good prime minister. Even JD(U) leader and Bihar Chief Minister Nitish Kumar has praised Advani.

http://ibnlive.in.com/news/2014-polls-b ... 37-64.html

Pratyush · Post by **Pratyush** » 10 Apr 2013 14:34

^^^

Just spin, from the paid media. Besides with or without Modi, the Muslim vote is not going to come to BJP. But Modi may just give enough impetus to the non-committed voter who is sick and tired of the Mal-governence of MMS, to vote out the INC. By voting for Modi as PM.

Pranav · Post by **Pranav** » 10 Apr 2013 14:40

Pratyush wrote:^^^

Just spin, from the paid media. Besides with or without Modi, the Muslim vote is not going to come to BJP. But Modi may just give enough impetus to the non-committed voter who is sick and tired of the Mal-governence of MMS, to vote out the INC. By voting for Modi as PM.

Well, Jaitley has the option of clarifying his stand by unambiguously supporting Modi as the PM candidate.

Pranav · Post by **Pranav** » 10 Apr 2013 14:42

I think what is necessary at this point is an "operation Sitaram Kesri" to throw out Dilli Billis from the BJP.

kittoo · Post by **kittoo** » 10 Apr 2013 14:47

I really don't think BJP will loose any mass base if it throws out these dilli 4 guys. They have no vote getting capabilities themselves and are questioning Modi's capabilities? These guys can't even win a single seat on their own. Throw them out and be done with it. Then just focus on one thing- making Namo PM.

fanne · Post by **fanne** » 10 Apr 2013 16:04

Guys we know Ibn is anti bjp. Who would in bjp tell them about
What jaitley said in bjp parliamentary meeting. Ibn is lying and we
Like fools are falling for it.
The only clamor on tv to declare Modi as pm comes from congress pasand
Msm. Why? I can think few reasons - Nk will be forced to leave denting the
Momentum, con and msm can attAck him, right now they are confused, sometime
They praise advani sometime rss. This anticipation about modi is also adding
To its appeal.
Moreover you do not have to go far. On this forum, Bjp supporters know modi is the candidate.
There may be occasional ha hu against d4 depending on what pAid media says but look at political
Affiliation of people who really are pushing that bjp declare him the candidate.
Bjp most likely is doing furious weekly surveys to see what will get them the highest number and then they will declare. No bjp wallah has a doubt on who should that be if that will get the highest seAt.

Chandragupta · Post by **Chandragupta** » 10 Apr 2013 16:39

Nitish will be decimated in Bihar if he leaves the NDA citing sekoolarijam. The voters will give a massive jhapad to this wannabe Vajpayee that he will be destined to the dustbin of history. I would like the BJP to be combative, name NaMo as the PM designate and if two bit jokers like Nitish leave, it will add a sympathy wave and bring more voters.

In concept, BJP should finally do what it should have done with the RJB - make it non negotiable and fight. In this case it is Modi's PMship instead of RJB.

jamwal · Post by **jamwal** » 10 Apr 2013 16:45

As far as 1984 riots are concerned, the sparks were already lit by Khalistani terrorists. Sure Congress politicians led the carnage, but I don't believe that there was no anger amongst non-Sikhs about the shit that happened earlier. Why were there no anti-Tamil riots after Rajiv's assassination ?
If Modi can be blamed and vilified for Gujarat riots in a state which was already one of the most riot prone states without any proof of his involvement, then what stopped the concerned people from fighting for justice in case of 1984 for so long ? There has been no cohesive action in this direction by any group. Most people who should have fought for justice used it to get asylum in foreign countries. A lot just piggy backed and milked the issue to get easy visas and defame India.

I want justice for victims of 1984 riots, but giving it a political tint seems distasteful in spite of the irony.

My statement about US is not an endorsement of anything. I couldn't care less about what they think. It was motivated by the fact that the petition in US to declare 1984 riots a genocide was put up by a Sikh body. Why don't they care about fighting for justice in India is anybody's guess

Chandragupta ji,

Are you sure about Bihari voters dumping Nitish for Modi ? He has done some good work in Bihar. His anti-Modi BS stance is nothing but hankering after muslim vote. If that factor is removed, I believe that he will change his mind.

Pratyush · Post by **Pratyush** » 10 Apr 2013 16:46

Nitish, is important to the Bihar. Besides his battle is not with the BJP. It is with Lalu, he needs to sit down, keep quite and let the dust settle. Then only decide what he is going to do. Because any premature move on his part and he will be politically finished and he knows it. So does every political party. It is only the paid media that is trying to spin Nitish as a Modi challenger & confuse the voters.

Also, it is not in the interests of Nitish to ally with INC, in its current state. if he does, he will be in the same state Lalu is in today.

member_22539 · Post by **member_22539** » 10 Apr 2013 16:58

+1 Just like that geriatric ass wipe Vinod Mehta did on that debate on times now (the one that was posted on this thread). He was jumping in with NiKu's name after supposedly denouncing both Mr. Modi and Pappu. Who is this guy to bandy about his name for PM? Old farts like him need to just retire, there are more than enough congi bootlicking paid media of the next gen. There is no need for such fossils to leave brown bed stains on public discourse.

Murugan · Post by **Murugan** » 10 Apr 2013 17:04

He is a default debater of TNow

Pranav · Post by **Pranav** » 10 Apr 2013 17:14

jamwal wrote:Sure Congress politicians led the carnage, but I don't believe that there was no anger amongst non-Sikhs about the shit that happened earlier. Why were there no anti-Tamil riots after Rajiv's assassination ?
If Modi can be blamed and vilified for Gujarat riots in a state which was already one of the most riot prone states without any proof of his involvement, then what stopped the concerned people from fighting for justice in case of 1984 for so long ? There has been no cohesive action in this direction by any group. Most people who should have fought for justice used it to get asylum in foreign countries. A lot just piggy backed and milked the issue to get easy visas and defame India.

Anger against khalistanis does not equate support for killing ordinary Sikhs. Please don't defame people of Delhi for acts of Congi goons.

Also, the reason the usual suspects did not follow it up is the the Congress is the defender of the colonial system in India.

vijayk · Post by **vijayk** » 10 Apr 2013 17:47

Arun Menon wrote:
RoyG wrote:

Thank you for this video. It was positively delicious seeing congis and their bootlickers getting thrashed so soundly

The sick PAID media scoundrels are twisting in their chaddis.

First of all, BJP folks should ask

1. How come your talking points and CON Gandoo talking points are same? Do they come from 10 janpath?

2. Did Muslims give you power of attorney to represent them? Did they tell you that you represent the 18% ? How do you know? Are you part of EVM committee or magic that you know how 100% of them vote?

3. Did Sonia/MMS/tarun gogoi apologize all the tribals ans Muslims killed under their watch in Assam?

RoyG · Post by **RoyG** » 10 Apr 2013 18:23

Feku became an anti-rahul tag. What war? It was a massacre of the Congress SM brigade. Poonawala threatened with defamation...

anmol · Post by **anmol** » 10 Apr 2013 19:54

ankitash · Post by **ankitash** » 10 Apr 2013 20:08

(Title of the article is a bit misleading)

Gujarat chief minister Narendra Modi had apparently wished to be a monk of the Ramakrishna Mission (RKM) order in his youth but was turned away thrice. On the last occasion, he had met Swami Atmasthanandaji Maharaj — now president of Ramakrishna Math and Mission — at RKM's Rajkot centre. The monk headed the centre at Rajkot from 1966. It was under Atmasthanandaji's tutelage that Modi increased his knowledge about Swami Vivekananda's teachings and the scriptures.

"It was Swami Atmasthanandaji Maharaj who told Modi that his calling lies elsewhere and he is not meant to become a monk. On Tuesday, when Modi met the Swami at Belur Math, he offered his gratitude for the advice," a source at Belur Math told TOI.

"Modi was influenced by Swami Vivekananda's teachings from his childhood. When he was a youth, he wanted to become a monk of the Ramakrishna Mission and came to Belur Math. Swami Madhabanandaji Maharaj was then the president of the Ramakrishna Math and Mission. After being turned away from Belur, Modi went to RKM's centre in Almora and finally Rajkot where he met Swami Atmasthanandaji Maharaj. On Tuesday, Modi spoke of all this when he met the president and other senior monks. He has had a long relationship with the Ramakrishna Mission and said whatever he is today is due to the blessings of the maharajs. He also expressed his personal gratitude to the president for having guided him so many years ago," sources said.

While leaving the mission, Modi told reporters, "This is my first visit to Belur Math as chief minister. RKM is involved in a lot of good work. It has influenced my life greatly. I am a follower of Swami Vivekananda and his message that India will lead the world one day. My mind has been purified after this visit. I am very happy today."

According to Swami Subiranandaji Maharaj, assistant secretary of the Ramakrishna Math and Mission, there was a lot of personal interaction between the Gujarat CM and the maharajs. "He reminisced about the past and sought the blessings of the president maharaj. He was presented with a shawl and prasad by the Ramakrishna Math and Mission," he said.

Modi wanted to be Ramakrishna monk, rejected thrice

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 10 Apr 2013 21:31

Off Topic for this thread...

chaanakya · Post by **chaanakya** » 10 Apr 2013 21:59

Well Divisional Commissioner (eqv to DM in a State District) has the authority by Law to call Army. A Fax and telex /Phone call followed by WC is enough for Army to Mobilise in aid of civil administration. All officers worth his salt knows that. Officer in MHA in IAS level would be certainly above DM ( as usual mostly all are in front line of decision making system whatever post they may be holding , mainstream or shunting) and would have authority to mobilise Army esp when 1984 riots are still fresh in memory.

Tamang · Post by **Tamang** » 10 Apr 2013 22:02

Has this been posted?

Link

Gujarat chief minister Narendra Modi, who is widely seen as the BJP’s favourite PM candidate, joined top party leaders and officials from across the country at a closed-door session on Sunday, and pressed for an “aggressive” strategy against the Congress for a sure shot at the next Lok Sabha polls.

In his first appearance before a crucial BJP meeting since his elevation to the party’s parliamentary board, a tough-speaking Modi pushed his colleagues to drop their “kid glove” approach and learn from his experience to knock out the ruling combine, as its unpopularity was at “its peak”.

Modi did not mince words in saying the hitherto approach of the BJP of “being too gentle” with the Congress government won’t do.

“Unless you make the people really hate the Congress by exposing their track record and the mess in every key area of governance and the havoc wrought by them, you can’t make them choose you,” the Gujarat chief minister said.

Virtually sounding the war bugle, Modi outlined “ways” to take on the Congress leadership and offered several “tips” to “neutralise” its network of “influence” in different spheres, by working really hard to woo voters right from the booth level in each Lok Sabha constituency, highly-placed BJP sources told HT.

Stating that “half-baked and half-hearted ideas won’t do”, Modi drew a parallel to the decade in Madhya Pradesh between 1993 and 2003 when Digivijaya Singh was chief minister. Saying that it took the BJP 10 years to force the Congress out of office there, Modi recalled the follies of the BJP till it gained force.

Com'on BJP, do what this man says! Hit and hit Congress hard.

suryag · Post by **suryag** » 10 Apr 2013 22:10

NaMo may have a game plan here, hitting the congies hard would lead to some skeletons of Dx BJP gang tumbling out. with this he can do house cleaning and anyways keep hitting congies as they cannot unearth any skeleton with his name(he enhances his credibility)

vishvak · Post by **vishvak** » 10 Apr 2013 22:51

Just wondering what if these are varifiable? MHASecy incommunicado, army told to be barracks-by whom etc.

vishvak · Post by **vishvak** » 10 Apr 2013 22:52

Is it not treasonous to talk of Hindoo terror to a US delegate?