Re: India-US Strategic News and Discussion

JE Menon · Post by **JE Menon** » 17 Apr 2013 11:02

"go to the ends of the Earth"....

OK, then Pakistan is about to be designated as "major extra-terrestrial non-NATO Ally".
Iran better prepare to be bombed to shite.

anmol · Post by **anmol** » 17 Apr 2013 11:06

Boston attacks began in Mali, top Muslim Brotherhood official says

Wednesday, 17 April 2013

Al Arabiya With Agencies -

A high-ranking Egyptian Muslim Brotherhood official has linked the deadly Boston attacks to the U.S.-backed French war in Mali.

Essam Elerian, vice chairman of the Brotherhood’s Freedom and Justice Party (FJP), wrote in a statement posted in Arabic on his Facebook account that the “events began with the sending of French battalions to Mali in a war against organizations that are said to be part of al Qaeda.”

Elerian expressed sympathy with the families of the victims, but said the attacks “do not stop us from reading into the grave incident.”

“Who interfered in democratic transformations, despite the difficult transition from despotism, corruption, poverty, hatred and intolerance to freedom, justice, tolerance, development, human dignity and social justice?” he asked. “Who created Islamophobia through research and media? Who funded this violence?”

Earlier, Elerian’s FJP party published a statement in English condemning the “heinous attacks in Boston,” which killed three people and wounded more than 170 others.

The party said it “offers heartfelt sympathies and solemn condolences to the American people and the families of the victims.”

“Islamic Sharia [law] strongly condemns the attacks on civilians and the terrorizing of innocent people.”

Muslim Brotherhood leader points to conspiracy behind Boston bombing

Posted By David Kenner Tuesday, April 16, 2013 - 7:43 AM

A common criticism of Egypt's Muslim Brotherhood has always been that it delivers one message in English to an international audience, and another message entirely in Arabic to its domestic audience. If anyone is ever looking for an example of this, they need to look no further than the Islamist organization's reaction to the bombing of the Boston Marathon.

In English, the Brotherhood's political party released a statement "categorically reject[ing] as intolerable the bombings committed in the U.S. city of Boston," and "offer[ing] heartfelt sympathies and solemn condolences to the American people and the families of the victims."

In Arabic, senior Brotherhood leader and the vice chairman of the group's political party Essam el-Erian took a different tack. In a post on his Facebook page, he condemned the Boston attack -- but also linked it to the French war in Mali, the destruction in Syria and Iraq, and faltering rapprochement between the Turkish government and Kurdish rebels.

El-Erian is making the case that all of these setbacks -- from Boston to Baghdad -- are somehow connected. "Who disturbed democratic transformations, despite the difficult transition from despotism, corruption, poverty, hatred, and intolerance to freedom, justice tolerance, development, human dignity, and social justice?" he asked. "Who planted Islamophobia through research, the press, and the media? Who funded the violence?"

El-Erian just poses those questions -- he doesn't accuse any specific group of masterminding the Boston Marathon attack or the unrest across the Middle East. But while Brotherhood leaders feel free to indulge in such conspiracy-mongering in Arabic, these claims are notably absent from the group's English-language media.

VikramS · Post by **VikramS** » 17 Apr 2013 11:12

kish · Post by **kish** » 17 Apr 2013 11:54

If True, this would be truly amazing way for Bitchistan to show gratitude towards its customers(US, China)

Local paper names Chinese victim in Boston blasts

A state-run Chinese newspaper says the third person killed in the Boston Marathon bombings is a Chinese graduate student at Boston University originally from China's northeastern city of Shenyang.

kish · Post by **kish** » 17 Apr 2013 12:37

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/04/16/17784776-boston-marathon-blasts-investigators-eye-range-of-suspects-and-motives#commentsa

Images of Pressure cooker and back pack.

Sources involved in the investigation said that the pressure-cooker bombs were powerful "homemade claymore," directional explosives that appeared to include a triggering mechanism using a battery pack and a circuit board. Both of those elements were recovered at the scene.

"directional explosive"???

"It appeared to be built from scratch but with a sophisticated triggering mechanism. And frankly, at the end of the day, all bombs are crude devices, and it is the way they are triggered that can be sophisticated," said one official with strong knowledge of explosives. "They functioned as designed."(WTF, It did, there are causalities. People are intelligent than you think.. NOROM )

Also Tuesday evening, the Chinese consulate in New York confirmed that the third victim was a Chinese national. The victim, whose family has requested she not be identified, was also a student at Boston University, the school said.

pentaiah · Post by **pentaiah** » 17 Apr 2013 13:03

Even after so many years on this forum the jones & tims of the world still believe TSP is an ally of USA and TSP can be turned around to hate India only!

........
Lucky that the pressure cooker is aluminum type these days you get stainless steel type whose shear stress and tensile strength is much more than Al type and cause more severe damage

The part shown is the lid part because the safety valve assembly can be seen, it's that lead plug that blows away if steam temperature exceeds capacity

chaanakya · Post by **chaanakya** » 17 Apr 2013 14:17

Could it be electric pressure cooker which might have built in timer and could be modified?

Muppalla · Post by **Muppalla** » 17 Apr 2013 15:45

shiv wrote:
matrimc wrote:It is not a question of not learning. The people who have learnt are not at the helm and a new set of people are learning the same old lesson.
In fact I think that in the US there is a general belief that things don't/won't change. Particularly, America and Americans are blind to changes outside of America. The US has got used to covering up reverses and highlighting victories, just like Pakistan. Afghanistan is a shameful episode considering that the head of Al Qaeda was caught in Pakistan, an ally. After two countries were attacked.

There is a deep sense of belief in the American way - which is not such a bad thing in itself, but it is a fossilized mindset that is unable to respond to the outside world other than reacting to external entities as something inferior or a fearsome adversary to be vanquished by force. Force will gradually get applied on America.

US is very successful in using global Terror to its geopolitical advantage. I wrote this before. The emotion for its' citizens' deaths are just lip service. The real Terror event on it's territory is once in a blue moon. In a period of last 20 years it only lost about 4000 and the only visible one was still 9/11. What is this Boston stuff (about three dead) to even have a 10 page thread.

On the contrary by not even trying to remove the global terror see its success story. India is cornered from its rise as a global power. Nuke blackmailed. S.Korea is nuke blackmailed. Using terror pretext it bombed Iraq to smithereens. Using the same it will do to anyone in the middle east.

Just easily one more happened today in Bangalore, a month ago in HYD. It takes one hell of a time for these abduls to achieve same in US. Effectively irrespective of its citizens' emotions, US establishment was very successful in maintaining the global terror by funding it. Every dollar they are spending on Pakistan is funding terror and they are doing willfully.

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 17 Apr 2013 15:47

Here is that blast site photo from another angle, notice the black mail / newspaper box, and the tree
Bomb was somewhere in the crowd.

Also notice the burned out bomb material here. Looks like the bomb was placed next to the wall so that the blast force would be directed at the crowd. Th glass has shattered outwards onto the street!

Very graphic:
See the kind of degloving injuries that people get. This man has all the skin and muscles removed from his legs, and the leg bones (Tibia) are exposed
Very Graphic

Muppalla · Post by **Muppalla** » 17 Apr 2013 15:48

pentaiah wrote:Even after so many years on this forum the jones & tims of the world still believe TSP is an ally of USA and TSP can be turned around to hate India only!

Their belief is right. US did achieve a lot on that aspect. The damage/cost to US is bare minimum to almost negligible.

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 17 Apr 2013 15:50

Very shocking and sad.
VERY GRAPHIC PICS

Muppalla · Post by **Muppalla** » 17 Apr 2013 15:54

anmol wrote:
Boston attacks began in Mali, top Muslim Brotherhood official says

Muslim Brotherhood leader points to conspiracy behind Boston bombing

If you remember, while people are still dying during 9/11, a decorated ex-CIA chief (from Iraq-1 war fame) came on TV after TV with a 100% confidence that 911 was the Iraqi thingy. Using his types of theories they bombed Iraq to smithereens. But every report pointed to Pakistan ISI. Later Bin Laden was found in Pak Army garrison.

So all these first news are deliberate plants to extract something using the events.

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 17 Apr 2013 16:24

I feel that the US authorities already have photos of the suspected bomber(s). The entire place was very highly photographed. The US also deploys surveillence cameras all over crowd gatherings. These are mobile vans with a telescopic mast with multiple cameras and telecom equipment to transmit images, they even have small two wheeled pull along carts with telescopic masts with floodlights and cameras they can deploy.
In addition there must be thousands of people with Hi Def digital cameras all over the place, snapping pictures every few seconds.

Even as we speak massa must be capturing or interrogating the guys responsible - very possible.

The US Media must know something, but are keeping quiet/have been instructed to shut-up, and are resorting to the usual dorky news reporting - spirit of boston etc

shyamd · Post by **shyamd** » 17 Apr 2013 16:56

^^ I Dont think so - you know they are appealing for more photographs, camera shots of the event from passengers at Logan airport - which is fine but I think by now the first raids should have taken place if they had a rough idea of who he was

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 17 Apr 2013 17:01

the pressure cooker seems to be of prestige type not hawkins type going by the lid. I had one of these in massa, and hated it because the lid used to rotate into place from outside and no locking clip on the handle. from childhood I was used to the hawkins type and I guess 90% indians prefer that.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 17 Apr 2013 17:02

if it was the work of a independent person like Unabomber with no network or social contact, this could be unsolved for a long time, and in time perhaps only a relative can point him or her out.

kish · Post by **kish** » 17 Apr 2013 17:10

Muppalla wrote:
anmol wrote:Boston attacks began in Mali, top Muslim Brotherhood official says

If you remember, while people are still dying during 9/11, a decorated ex-CIA chief (from Iraq-1 war fame) came on TV after TV with a 100% confidence that 911 was the Iraqi thingy. Using his types of theories they bombed Iraq to smithereens. But every report pointed to Pakistan ISI. Later Bin Laden was found in Pak Army garrison.

So all these first news are deliberate plants to extract something using the events.

[OT Alert]

Mupalla ji,

one can find a parallel to that incident in Indian context. After 26/11, CONgrass minister Antulay and Dickvijay singh said the attack was perpetrated by RSS. Still they came to power in 2009.
[/OT]

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 17 Apr 2013 17:16

there are imo four categories of indians relevant to india-US relations
1. PIOs or NRIs who have american citizenship
2. NRIs who retain indian citizenship but live and work permanently in US
3. India residents who work for american HQed cos (me for example) or have close relatives/siblings/children there
4. India residents who do not have any close relatives in US nor work for american cos

Now I fully realize the US policy of safeguarding its homeland by paying off TSP and indulging in setting various fires make the "moths" gather around these flames is not all taking indian welfare into consideration. it has worked for them - only 2 domestic attacks in 12 yrs. its fairly low cost - whats $10b to a country that can print its way out of trouble. the media is under tight control not to sensationalize american reverses abroad.

people in bucket1 & 2 are imo reluctant to call the truth due to being in their system, conflicted mind torn between the reality and what they want to believe. people in bucket3 and 4 incl Shiv are the ones who tend to raise their voices and call US policy stupid instead of trying to find some chankian convergence mode where US and Indian interests are aligned - it is not aligned imo wrt middle east/south asia for sure and perhaps not for east asia either.

at the tactical and emergency services level they do a good job, but we have nothing to learn from their higher strategic handling of this thing unless we also want to join the queue behind the 3.5 and start bribing TSP by handing over Kashmir, sir creek, 10000 virgins/month, free food, gold, goats and other stuff to feed the monster - because that is the US higher direction of war on TSP

I would not say our MMS, mithaiwala and co have covered themselves with glory, quite the contrary, but atleast I doubt we are sending shiploads of live goats and virgins to the karachi port monthly to keep the monster off our backs.

and we are still in one piece.

svenkat · Post by **svenkat** » 17 Apr 2013 17:24

Singha wrote:there are imo

Completely OT,but a 'necessary' reality check on the issue.

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 17 Apr 2013 17:58

Muppalla,

Excellent points. Any life lost, any serious injury is sad and tragic, I wouldn't want that to happen to me or to my near ones.

But talking in terms of geo-political terms, I mean by the standards of US munna TSP pigLeT terror, this is nothing. And it sickens my stomach when every f@#king racist b@stard, conscious or subconscious, come on TV and mentions every terror attack against the west and call for solidarity, but not a single world on pigLeT attacks against India. That transvestite-looking b@itch on Fox, Greta whatever, even had the audacity to do an equal equal on potential terror suspects between India and Paaaakistaaan. This is how they peddle lies and propaganda.

Listening and seeing the coverage, you get the impression that US is this saint and can do no wrong, its as if the US itself is squeaky clean. I just read about the torture chambers US ran post 9/11 picking up so called "terror suspects", most likely its munnas like ISI and other Arab tinpots picking disposable innocent Muslims off the streets of Peshawar or Cairo and handing them over to be sent to bay area in exchange for a few billion $s. And how can we forget US aid to TSP as they dispatch pigLeTs into India. You won't hear the useless so called "free press" talk about all this.

And I have had enough of this spirit of Boston BS. DDM emulates this to the fullest, spirit of Mumbai and crap like that. The terrorists who attack are not impressed with the spirit of Boston or Mumbai, they actually like people to come out enforce so they can execute again.

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 17 Apr 2013 18:54

pentaiah, if it was 18/10 next gen steel pressure cookers, then it can handle upto 15-18psi(that is what i see on the back of my home cooker). so, from your expertise (request/gyan), please to explain the amount of pressure that is required to cross to reach the sheer strength + threshold to blast out of the construction/release gauge-strength?. Is that possible with black powder?

my question is the directional aspect comes only from lid /pressure release system technology.. that is where the weak points are.. it is a crude device.. but can be very lethal only in the direction of the charge. the bottom of pressure cooker should have prevented those nails to escape.

Varoon Shekhar · Post by **Varoon Shekhar** » 17 Apr 2013 19:06

CRamS, the Indian media is displaying the name and face of the 8 year-old victim of the Boston blast. When do the American media show the names and faces of Indians killed in terrorist attacks in India, particularly when they have Hindu names?

Parochialism, stand offishness, ignorance, colonial-cold war mentality, the odd time, outright racism, are the reasons.It's time Indians/ethnic Indians in the US make their voices heard on this media perfidy.

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 17 Apr 2013 19:08

^It is not restricted in the media onlee.. the perfidy is wide spread.. it is a cultural thing and OT here.

Garooda · Post by **Garooda** » 17 Apr 2013 19:20

Someone posted clear images speculating the suspects. But not sure if its really them.
Although the person seems to have moved away towards the road in the subsequent images.

saip · Post by **saip** » 17 Apr 2013 19:28

In the pressure cooker lid photo above, what is that nut and bolt thing? I just checked two pressure cookers at home and neither of them have that. Did it come originally with that or did the bomber modify the lid?

Thinking again bomber seems to have replaced the pressure relief valve on the lid with this nut and bolt thing.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 17 Apr 2013 19:31

Varoon Shekhar wrote:CRamS, the Indian media is displaying the name and face of the 8 year-old victim of the Boston blast. When do the American media show the names and faces of Indians killed in terrorist attacks in India, particularly when they have Hindu names?

Parochialism, stand offishness, ignorance, colonial-cold war mentality, the odd time, outright racism, are the reasons.It's time Indians/ethnic Indians in the US make their voices heard on this media perfidy.

The opposite is also true - a "lock fits key perfectly" Macaulayite slavishness of India. On NDTV the interviewer was asking the Bangalore correspondent if the Bangalore bomb was in a pressure cooker like the Boston blast. Forgotten was the fact that pressure cookers have been used in Indian blasts. By instinct slavish Indians forget what happens in India but Yamerika sticks.

Kati · Post by **Kati** » 17 Apr 2013 19:34

Unkil wants to (and does mostly) wear an aura of invinsibility in the global arena.
That aura was badly damaged by 9-11. More than the man and material cost, it was the
sense of humiliation that hurt unkil in the aftermath of 9-11. That's why, justified or not,
unkil went gung-ho to kick some butts. Afghanistan and Iraq were the results of regaining
that lost "glory". However, from the rest of the world it was shielded how much unkil
spent on security arrangements at airports and other public places. In some estimate, that
took away nearly 1% of the national growth (and that's what the jihadists wanted to do).
To some small extent, this also contributed to the recession of 2007-2010. ...
...But now the Boston incident. It is not how few people have died or how well the emergency
respondents worked, it has again hurt unkil's invinsibility aura. It hurts even more with
every passing hour that no leads are found. If no leads are found in coming days then the
cracks will emerge in the amirkhan national solidarity....... unkil will look for another cooked
up story to kick some butts to regain the lost "glory". Will it be Syria? or, Iran? or......TSP?

Garooda · Post by **Garooda** » 17 Apr 2013 19:40

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... loded.html

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 17 Apr 2013 19:42

Kati wrote:unkil will look for another cooked
up story to kick some butts to regain the lost "glory". Will it be Syria? or, Iran? or......TSP?

Iran probably. Pakistan never.

Noko has nukes.

Having said that it suddenly strikes me that in a very curious way the ummah at large have relegated the US to the same position as India - where they will keep kicking India every now and again and nothing much can be done. The US is being put into a similar position. The US cannot blame the real culprits but has to tippy toe around the issue. The US, unlike India hits someone else so hard that all is forgotten as the world watches agape thinking something is happening. After a decade or two nothing much would have changed and the world simply moves on.

The US simply gives up on lost causes and diverts attention. India simply gives up on lost causes and does not even divert attention.

saip · Post by **saip** » 17 Apr 2013 19:46

Normally there are dozens of official photographers on the route of the marathon and also at some points. They normally use have high perches to take photographs. You can see one of those things on X-type legs near the finish line. When the race is over they identify you with your bib no and they email you thumb nail photos and you have to pay to get the bigger pictures. (I bought several of them) These pictures above look like the ones taken from above at the finish line. Normally there are several photographers on those high perches at the finish line and they tell you to look up and smile so that they can get best picture of you as you cross the finish line.

saip · Post by **saip** » 17 Apr 2013 19:48

Is the pressure cooker made in INDIA?

Kati · Post by **Kati** » 17 Apr 2013 19:52

^^^ Most of the pressure cookers (PCs) marketed in the US are made in China.

saip · Post by **saip** » 17 Apr 2013 19:52

Is the pressure cooker made in INDIA? Below the letters "Gas electric" I see the letters IND.

Thanks Shiv. So it is Swiss made.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 17 Apr 2013 19:55

saip wrote:Is the pressure cooker made in INDIA? Below the letters "Gas electric" I see the letters IND.

That is INOX
http://www.kuhnrikon.ch/co-uk/en/produc ... _inox.html

Garooda · Post by **Garooda** » 17 Apr 2013 19:57

I am not sure if it indicates 'INDIA' as in 'Made In India' on the cooker or not. Image # 7 from the top seems to indicate that. I could be wrong. I have not seen too many(any) 'Made In India' cookers selling in the regular department stores in the US. Most of them are sold in Desi grocery stores. Few families bring them from India.

saip · Post by **saip** » 17 Apr 2013 20:04

From Shiv's link it is Inox, without the long handle (only that comes in 6 L size) and Swiss made.

Garooda · Post by **Garooda** » 17 Apr 2013 20:07

saip wrote:From Shiv's link it is Inox, without the long handle (only that comes in 6 L size) and Swiss made.

That makes more sense. Now that I looked at the image closely and the link posted by Shiv.

chaanakya · Post by **chaanakya** » 17 Apr 2013 20:08

From the words that are seen on the Remanents of the bomb the model of pressure cooker seems to be Inox Gas-Electric Plaksteel Pressure Cooker. Fagor brand?

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 17 Apr 2013 20:14

saip wrote:Is the pressure cooker made in INDIA?

No. The brand name is INOX if you read the lettering. It says gas electric use.

sanku, Its not clear yet who did it as it has domestic and foreign signatures. IOW there is lot of noise and few signals.

As someone said "We dont know what we know till we know!"

Am sure some one who lugs ~40 lbs duffel bag + back pack would be quite hefty and would be noted and remembered. Unless there were two to place them at either locations.

Could be some ex-military like the Oklahoma City bomber who learnt the trade in Af-Pak. Off late the rhetoric on Fox News had been quite visecral about how the Second Amd rights will be eroded and taken away.
So much hate is not good in a powder keg democracy. So who knows. Let the evidence talk.

Most likely the second one(the pics of which are in this thread) blew the lid off and acted as a short barrel cannon. CNN was reporting in the morning that the intact lid was found on a roof top.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 17 Apr 2013 20:18

Correction brand Name Fagor

LINK Daily Mail UK

BTW Philip, Simon Jenkins was wrong. Had an alert bystander in Bosoton noted the abandoned bag in the second bomb incident lives would have been saved.

I do wish that guy takes back his idiotic rant about periodic warnings to notify police about abandoned bags!!!!

pentiah the pzr cooker was stainless steel per above report and most likely pressed steel lid. Shows the high ductility which deformed it instead of shattering it.

--

The glass is on the street as its the compression/suction wave after the initial shock/expansion blast wave. The bldg wall reflected the wave leading to the suction wave.