Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Vipin_Upadhyay · Post by **Vipin_Upadhyay** » 28 Apr 2013 19:44

^^ Yes I checked SuvarnaTV on net was running live.

I cant read Kannad, but they were running some subtitles. Can some Kannadigas verify plz?

Muppalla · Post by **Muppalla** » 28 Apr 2013 19:47

SM Krishna ko vaat laga diya.

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 28 Apr 2013 19:48

Halo status of Nehru been ripped apart by NAmo in his BLR speech. This is the courage that is lacking in BJP top management to unmask colonial anti-Hindu face of Congress.

Muppalla · Post by **Muppalla** » 28 Apr 2013 20:01

It is unfortunate that more rallies of NaMo are not planned in KA. It just got every element that is required for the election. Got live relayed across the country and there will be an upshot of an extra percent of votes.

I feel happy to say that NaMo== media crisis(circus too)

Gus · Post by **Gus** » 28 Apr 2013 20:14

Tv studios will fall in line when TRP ratings come out. There are so many channels that somebody is going to telecast and everybody interested will watch.

abhik · Post by **abhik** » 28 Apr 2013 20:37

Muppalla wrote:SM Krishna ko vaat laga diya.

That part was hilarious, touché NaMo.

JohnTitor · Post by **JohnTitor** » 28 Apr 2013 20:47

https://twitter.com/ArunTatTvamAsi/stat ... 2162124800

Follow

Arun!
‏@ArunTatTvamAsi
@surnell Congress is providing Voter IDs to all the muslim immigrants in Bangalore! My colleagues who are from Bihar Kerala have multiple ID

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 28 Apr 2013 20:54

is Uddhav Thackarey like Rahul Gandhi type of young leader? A dynasty leader and without capability?

RoyG · Post by **RoyG** » 28 Apr 2013 21:03

ramana wrote:is Uddhav Thackarey like Rahul Gandhi type of young leader? A dynasty leader and without capability?

Yes. He doesn't have any policy prescriptions, just empty rhetoric.

saumitra_j · Post by **saumitra_j** » 28 Apr 2013 21:06

ramana wrote:is Uddhav Thackarey like Rahul Gandhi type of young leader? A dynasty leader and without capability?

That is correct Ramana.. in fact, that was the reason Raj Thackarey split since he is far more capable as a politician. Udhav's ascendency is a classic case of dynastic politics in the Shiv Sena... resulting in its growing irrelevance over the years. What this means is that MH has had completely incompetent governments for last so many years as the opposition is completely neutralized because of this dynastic politics.

disha · Post by **disha** » 28 Apr 2013 21:57

Amazing crowd control by NaMo. I have seen his speeches earlier and the way he connects with crowd is always electrifying (yes he also brought in Guj elections in a local meeting about India not able to send wrestlers in the Olympics due to IOC decision!)., anyway, he was always electrifying.

First time saw him control crowd with just few words!

krisna · Post by **krisna** » 28 Apr 2013 22:15

as per twitter reports,
Namo has the largest fan base among any city in India.
Hindi is well known in this part of India compared to other southern states/cities.
the capacity of stadium is 1.2 lakhs and was jam packed.
literally tore into the teflon phamili without naming them, but crowds were aware of it.

the main question is how many of this will translate into votes.
Bengaluru is a urban constituency where congis are always underdogs relative to rural areas.

The other issue is - it has fired up a lot of local BJP workers which is good as it is a cadre based party.

-----------------------------------
in another state - Rajasthan- vasundhara Raje is getting good crowds in her sankalp yatra. Folks verify this.

Sanku · Post by **Sanku** » 28 Apr 2013 22:16

ramana wrote:is Uddhav Thackarey like Rahul Gandhi type of young leader? A dynasty leader and without capability?

Yes and no. Yes he is a dynasty leader, same as Raj T.

Does he have capability -- yes he does, he has been handling SS for at least 5 years now, with BT having taken a back seat. Despite Raj T deeply and grievously hurting SS because he did not get his way in SS, UT has managed to keep SS on a roughly even keel, no small achievement for a party built by a single man and run single handedly by a single overwhelming larger than life figure.

That said, UT is not a young leader like Rahul, he is 53 and he has had three angioplasties already. He is therefore not a "dynamic" leader and is limited in the kind of politics that he can do, specifically the sort of street politics that RTs strong point.

He also has his father's sensibilities in some respects, he is a noted photographer; with his book of photographs published.

http://rahulbemba.blogspot.in/2012/12/m ... keray.html

suryag · Post by **suryag** » 28 Apr 2013 22:25

RT was always an underdog when it comes to helming the part and he was really working hard. UT the more suave cousin is probably as sharp(if not better) as his cousin but for every set of ideas you need executioners to take it to closure, so two in a box with clear division of responsibilities is probably better, of course all of this is from a person who lived in Mumbai only for two months so take it FWIW. Balasaheb probably anticipated this and he and his brother married sisters and despite that they have misunderstandings. Like people say you appreciate the importance of shaded location only after toiling in the sun, both RT and UT realise that they can be complementary and may come together say an alliance or informal understanding - hope it happens

James B · Post by **James B** » 28 Apr 2013 22:50

NaMo Speech in Bangalore

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 28 Apr 2013 23:49

Vipin_Upadhyay wrote:Watch NaMo live addressing Bangalore Election rally. #MITOA

Can this video be made viral in the the internet. Just making this Blore speech go viral will create enough buzz among the Indians globally

krisna wrote:as per twitter reports,
Namo has the largest fan base among any city in India.
Hindi is well known in this part of India compared to other southern states/cities.
the capacity of stadium is 1.2 lakhs and was jam packed.
literally tore into the teflon phamili without naming them, but crowds were aware of it.

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 28 Apr 2013 23:54

Narendra Modi Rocks Bangalore

http://www.sandeepweb.com/2013/04/29/na ... bangalore/

suryag · Post by **suryag** » 29 Apr 2013 00:02

Get Yeddy but shift him to Delhi responsibilities and slowly assimilate his support base

Sanku · Post by **Sanku** » 29 Apr 2013 00:03

It would be very interesting to note what the local Media (both branches of national and purely local) cover this. How much buzz it creates in media would be one indication of how much the message has managed to break through the paid media at National ELM levels.

If there are folks in Bangalore and Kkta on the thread, I would request them to post their views (with as much neutrality and even cynicism if possible) of the coverage of the rally on the ground.

Sanku · Post by **Sanku** » 29 Apr 2013 00:21

Major blow to Modi....

RajeshA · Post by **RajeshA** » 29 Apr 2013 01:02

NaMo said, "One person can't do anything ? Sardar could integrate several Princely states, Nehru couldn't integrate even one!"

That was a kick in the balls! Nehru's Atma must be in tumult!

RoyG · Post by **RoyG** » 29 Apr 2013 01:22

RajeshA wrote:NaMo said, "One person can't do anything ? Sardar could integrate several Princely states, Nehru couldn't integrate even one!"

That was a kick in the balls! Nehru's Atma must be in tumult!

I don't think the Congress really cares. They just want to keep the ₹ flowing into their pockets. Their strategy is to string together a coalition of public sector workers, business houses, and populist state leaders through CBI, IB, and income tax department. Fortunately, it won't work. They've lost their shine in the eyes of the middle and upper class and soon most of the rural class will follow when they realize that the handouts they receive isn't sustainable and enough to counter inflation.

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 29 Apr 2013 02:37

Laugh riot

Rahul Gandhi visits cubicles of IT professionals in Bangalore’s Infosys campus during campaigning

Rahul made an unannounced stopover at the cubicle of Cobol Prasad, a freshmen software engineer. “He tapped me on my shoulder while I was busy coding to meet a deadline,” recalls Cobol. “Not realizing who it was, I brusquely told him to f*** off initially but as soon as I realized it was indeed Rahul after turning around, I apologized profusely and scrambled to shut down some of the windows on my screen. I then got Rahulji a chair to sit on and stale coffee from the nearby office machine and then we began to chat.”

http://www.theunrealtimes.com/2013/04/2 ... mpaigning/

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 29 Apr 2013 03:00

manju · Post by **manju** » 29 Apr 2013 03:28

Vipin_Upadhyay wrote:Watch NaMo live addressing Bangalore Election rally. #MITOA

Watch between 1:05 and 1:10

Ananth kumar was due to speak followed by jadadish shettar and then modi. When AK came, the crowd start shouting that they want modi to take over. In spite of AK requesting the crowd would not budge.

What happened next really reflects modi's popularity and his presence of mind. He walked up to the mike and said (translated by me) "Bholo bharath matak ki jai.." crowd goes "jai....." then he said "i have come all the way from Gujrath to hear your leaders AK and Jagadish shettar speak so please allow me to hear them. When it is my turn I wont stop until you give me permission" The crowd was humoured and they laughed. Then AK and JS spoke briefly and modi took over... rest is history, as they say!!

disha · Post by **disha** » 29 Apr 2013 04:17

^^ Thanks for the video clipping. I did not find it on narendramodi.in.

Amazing crowd control as mentioned before. How much crowd in the stadium do you think? Stadium capacity was some 30k, but since there were seats on the ground as well, I would expect some 50-60k. Some figures mention 100k. Not sure what is the actual number.

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 29 Apr 2013 06:04

Malnutrition puts State in the dock

Kerala’s claim to robust health indices has received a jolt with a report by the Comptroller and Auditor General (CAG) of India saying that as per the World Health Organisation (WHO) growth standard, the percentage of malnourished and severely malnourished children in Kerala is 36.92 per cent and 0.08 percent respectively as on March 2011

Kerala lags behind neighbouring Tamil Nadu which has 35.22 per cent malnourished and 0.02 per cent severely malnourished children.

In Assam, the figure is 31.32 per cent and 0.46 per cent. Madhya Pradesh has a better track record with 28.49 per cent and 1.88 per cent respectively

http://www.thehindu.com/news/national/k ... 664017.ece

suryag · Post by **suryag** » 29 Apr 2013 09:35

it was fun seeing the speaker beg the audience for 5-10 mins for the CM and Ananth Kumar. OMG Ananth Kumar might be fuming so much. Btw NaMo put the sentence to the audience(i have come to hear blah blah) shows what a sharp mind he has. Amazing NaMoji koi tho nazar utaro yaar please

kmkraoind · Post by **kmkraoind** » 29 Apr 2013 10:00

From Dailymail.co.uk

prahaar · Post by **prahaar** » 29 Apr 2013 10:39

It is quite strange that Dailymail UK is taking so much interest in India 's day to day events. We should not allow foreign media any influence.

Manish_Sharma · Post by **Manish_Sharma** » 29 Apr 2013 11:00

muraliravi wrote:
gakakkad wrote:insider info..expect split in JD(U) in due course of time.
I said this a few days ago that NaMo will hit back at this dirty Nitish. I proved with numbers and vote shares that Nitish has not gotten any incremental vote between the Oct 2005 and 2010 elections. It was BJP which got 3% extra. But some Nitish-BJP alliance supporters ignored that. They said NaMo will stupid to hit back at Nitish. NaMo will hit on his own terms, he wont bark loud like empty vessel Nitish and his coterie in BJP led by Loh Purush.

JD(U) will split. Nitish opposes modi only for one reason, Modi being on election committee, he will ask for 1:1 seat sharing which is not acceptable to dalals in JD(U).

Main worry I have regarding NiKu being hit is, would it give chance to snakes like lalu and paswan to rise again? If there is a danger of that happening then better Modi ji tolerates NiKu.

Atri · Post by **Atri** » 29 Apr 2013 11:24

prahaar wrote:It is quite strange that Dailymail UK is taking so much interest in India 's day to day events. We should not allow foreign media any influence.

+1.

But

Firstly, India is not a nation, remember? It was put together by british. So, that is that.

Secondly, Though Yudhishthira said वयं पंचाधिकं शतं, Duryodhana did not care about this sentiment. The dynasty duryodhana has gone far ahead amd revealed itself as extension of British. Nothing can be done after duryodhana committed his refusal to give as much land as on needle-point.

Hence Anna Hazare said it right when he said this is second independence struggle. Whether or not he knows the implication of what he said, I do not know. So it is natural that British will try to protect their assets in India. And everyone knows MMS is a mask or a Condom - To be discarded when one session of gangrape of India is over. This one proved effective for two sessions, well and good.

I have been saying this for years here. There is uncanny similarity of dienasty with TSP. Both arise from Mughal power structure which british continued and modified and are twin brothers. One will not let oyher die. Good that this line is getting popular on BRF. I have stopped considering INC as Indian and think of them as brit-mughal satrapy. This makes my conscience better.

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 29 Apr 2013 11:32

It is mostly a Brit - It behaves like a Brit, Talks like Brit and works like a Brit

darshhan · Post by **darshhan** » 29 Apr 2013 11:39

krisna wrote: the capacity of stadium is 1.2 lakhs and was jam packed.

Yesterday while watching news on various channels(NDTV,Times now,abp etc), I noticed while broadcasting Namo's Blr speech no cameraman ever focussed on the crowd. Every psec is scared to the core.

James B · Post by **James B** » 29 Apr 2013 13:43

R Jagannathan, Editor of Firstpost chimes in. Indirectly compares Rahul Gandhi to Duryodhana.

Narendra Modi, Rahul Gandhi and the Power of One

In the Mahabharata, there is a story about Arjuna and Duryodhana, who both sought Lord Krishna’s support before the war in Kurukshetra. The cousins reached Krishna’s palace around the same time, and he decided that since he could not discriminate between the two, he would offer one of them his personal support, and the other his Yadava army. But Krishna gave Arjuna the first choice, since he saw him first.

Arjuna chose Krishna the individual, but Duryodhana was thrilled he got the army. We know how the story ended. Arjuna’s choice proved right, and Krishna guided the Pandavas to victory.

The moral: one committed individual is better than a mercenary army. It is about the Power of One – the power of one committed individual to change the course of history.

The power of One is undeniable

Fast-forward to the present. Some weeks, back, Rahul Gandhi, speaking before a business audience, rejected the idea that “one hero riding a horse” would be able to achieve anything. The apparent reference was to Narendra Modi, who many see as the answer to India’s governance problems.

Gandhi is, of course, right. Change needs many, many people to get behind the wheel. But he also got his riposte yesterday from Modi, who emphasised that committed individuals can indeed make a difference.

Speaking at an election rally in Bangalore, Modi pointed out that Sardar Patel single-handedly got the princely states to sign the letter of accession to IndiaNot Nehru or Gandhi. He also cited the example of Lal Bahadur Shastri and how he set off the Green Revolution that finally helped India end its food shortage and reduce hunger.

Some liberals worry that belief in one individual can sooner or later degenerate into hero worship and authoritarianism. This, of course, happens, as we can notice from the hero worship of BR Ambedkar by Dalits, and the personality cult created around so many of our regional leaders.

Vinod Mehta, a former editor of Outlook magazine, compared Modi with Sanjay Gandhi, the autocratic son of Indira Gandhi, and wrote in The Times of India yesterday: “The strong leader, meanwhile, has three defining characteristics. One, he has a solution to every problem and the timeframe in which it can be solved is usually a few months. He is a loner. He works alone. There are no hangers on, no chamchas, no family. He is personally incorruptible. Naturally, he collects a few henchmen/henchwomen to execute his orders. Finally, the strong one has minimal interest in means. He is concerned solely with things being done. Indeed, he does not wish to be bothered by means. “

I doubt this is the right characterisation of Modi, who may be a loner and also fairly authoritarian, but he functions within a democratic polity and has been re-elected several times.

Now apply the same concept to Rahul and see which one makes more sense. Rahul is not anybody’s idea of a strong leader. He has no solution to the country’s problems beyond platitudes. Like Modi, he too is a loner and he seems to work alone. Like Modi, he and his family have lots of “hangers on, and chamchas”. Unlike Modi, the family is not seen as incorruptible by many Indians. Rajiv Gandhi had his Bofors. And Sonia and son recently took over a Rs 1,600 crore property using party funds. The UPA is steeped in corruption scandals despite being run by a seemingly incorruptible PM.

Given these similarities and contrasts, one wonders why people would not see Modi as a better choice. Mehta himself sees the attractiveness of the Modi option and concludes: “If the majority of our countrymen and countrywomen are so keen to see Narendra Modi sitting in 7, Race Course Road, we the sceptics should have the grace to fall in line. However, our guard must be up. Civil society, the media, the courts, need to remain vigilant and alert so that the strong leader does his job within the statute of democratic India. Strong leadership, yes. Extra-constitutional authority, no.”

Valid points in general, but Mehta does not see the irony of Sonia and Rahul serving as extra-constitutional authorities in the UPA government. And the fact that the government’s arbitrariness has been repeatedly called to account by civil society, the media and the courts. So he need not worry about Modi getting a free ride either.

However, the larger issue is about the Power of One. Is the expectation that Modi will solve some governance problems just illusion?

Of course, we cannot presume he will deliver at the centre. The complexities of running a coalition may tie his hands down just as it has tied Manmohan Singh’s.

As against this, the Indian experience is one of strong, even authoritarian, leaders working within a democratic structure. Even Indira Gandhi called elections in 1977 after the internal emergency. She lost and bowed out.

Indians, it seems, believe in two opposite things: a broad democratic pluralism, and the ability of one individual to make things change. We believe in the Power of the Multitude and the Power of One simultaneously.

The Indian experience, as Modi pointed out, is that individuals do make a difference. Here are a few recent examples of the Power of One.

TN Seshan, former Chief Election Commissioner, managed to make the Election Commission a powerful body and ensured that never again will political parties challenge its legitimacy or question its power to conduct free and fair elections.

Vinod Rai has single-mindedly brought the focus back to corruption, despite having the entire system ranged against him.

LK Advani rebuilt the BJP in one decade after the debacle of 1984.

It has taken only one individual to create entirely new political parties: from MGR to NTR to Kanshi Ram to Mamata Banerjee to Mayawati, to Jayalalithaa and almost every other regional party in India.

And, let’s not forget, it has taken only one Gandhi family to run the Congress party for decades. In the current UPA dispensation, all the critical programmes – from farm loan waivers to social sector spending – have been driven by one individual, Sonia Gandhi. It has put the country on the road to economic ruin, but we are talking about the Power of One to change destinies, for good or bad.

In Gujarat, Modi has put paid to the ambitions of all his detractors, both within the party and outside it, despite being targeted by the entire national establishment.

One Jawaharlal Nehru can be largely credited with the building of India’s democratic structure post-independence. One Nehru also lost us the 1962 China war.

Globally, too, the Power of One is apparent.

One Abraham Lincolm managed to end slavery, despite a civil war. FDR led the US through the Great Depression.

One Winston Churchill led Britain through the dark days to victory in World War II.

On the negative side, we have single individuals making all the difference – from Hitler to Mao to Stalin and Pol Pot.

There is no denying the Power of One.

It is interesting that Vinod Mehta should raise the spectre of Hitler and authoritarianism in India. The truth is, India is inherently pluralistic – we don’t even believe in one god, even while we believe in the Power of One.

All the mega-tyrants of the world were created in the West, which believes in the idea of One God and One Power Structure – which automatically creates an “either you are with us, or against us” argument.

It is unlikely that Modi, if actually elected to lead his party or the country, will turn out to be the Great Dictator. In India, all dictators have bitten the dust – without mayhem – and we have a tradition of authoritarian leaders working within a democratic setting.

http://www.firstpost.com/india/narendra ... 36215.html

kapilrdave · Post by **kapilrdave** » 29 Apr 2013 15:05

I'm bit late getting into the 'No Hindu Neta' remark from NM but would still point out my view.

There is nothing wrong in criticizing NM for making that unneeded statement. In fact he must be reminded EVERYDAY that he is supposed to be a Hindu leader only. Denying it is equal to denying his very identity. He has taken the first step towards secularism by saying this. Come the next one or two steps and he will be Advanified. Hindus want a leader of their own and if NM fails, they will have to find another one. Good thing is that if that happens, NM would have showed the next Hindu leader exactly what NOT to do. Just like LKA showed NM what not to do i.e. admire Jinna, being soft at congi etc.

People ridicule this thought by saying there is nothing wrong in equality, Hindutva means equality bla bla. Everyone knows that. But what people are pissed off today is the nuisance and notoriousness of muslims. They want bangladeshis to go out, they want muslim rioters to be dealt with ruthlessness, they want muslim terrorists to be arrested without fear of pissing their community, they want protection of Hindus in Pak, they want Kashmiri Pandits to go back to their place again and more. Will NM do this? His supporters definitely think he will and NM has no right to put a doubt in the voters' mind. I understand that all these cannot be done in one single (full)term and the priority should be to root out congi first. But that doesn't mean he should alienate himself from what is expected from him.

Also, this election is just the entrance test of NM. His real test will be when he comes to power. The last NDA govt failed in this test. We will see how the great man performs in his real test.

AjayKK · Post by **AjayKK** » 29 Apr 2013 15:11

James B wrote:R Jagannathan, Editor of Firstpost chimes in. Indirectly compares Rahul Gandhi to Duryodhana.

Narendra Modi, Rahul Gandhi and the Power of One

Good article by the author as usual. Mahabharata is a good pointer towards all that which needs to be done and the way it needs to be done.

BTW, Jamesullah, no gussa, but is your journey with Aam Admi types up ?

Sanku · Post by **Sanku** » 29 Apr 2013 15:17

Sanku wrote:It would be very interesting to note what the local Media (both branches of national and purely local) cover this. How much buzz it creates in media would be one indication of how much the message has managed to break through the paid media at National ELM levels.

If there are folks in Bangalore and Kkta on the thread, I would request them to post their views (with as much neutrality and even cynicism if possible) of the coverage of the rally on the ground.

Repeating my questions, any feedback on the ground ?

member_20317 · Post by **member_20317** » 29 Apr 2013 15:24

Atri wrote: Hence Anna Hazare said it right when he said this is second independence struggle. Whether or not he knows the implication of what he said, I do not know.

I also feel like it is a second freedom struggle. Kya karein

Muppalla · Post by **Muppalla** » 29 Apr 2013 15:31

^^^
Sanku ji,
Per several tweets, local TV covered live and also had Kannada captions as translation. In addition, suvarna TV sent a tweet that they will telecast next day morning for those who missed.

It is also front page spread on Kannada Prabha. Now after this meet Modi decided on two more locations Mangalore and Belgaum.