Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

BijuShet · Post by **BijuShet** » 10 Jun 2013 21:20

Muppalla wrote:That is really bad. He should have give a multiple choice of ashrams to retire. BJP is mean in not giving ahsrams as face savers.

Saar better to have the camel inside the tent pissing outside rather than the other way around. This episode will be forgotten soon and in 2 years after Advaniji retires he will be given his due respect within the party by old timers who know how much he helped grow the BJP. Today he is like a senior cricketer who does not recognize that it is time to hang up his shoes.

BijuShet · Post by **BijuShet** » 10 Jun 2013 21:21

Sanku wrote:
BijuShet wrote: When it came to dealing with pakistan I chose MMS over LKA. I distrust LKA THAT much. It is a personal choice. Anyway, lets move on.
.

I am surprised, I would expect people to be at least penitent about such choices at least now?

[/quote]
Sankuji attribution is to wrong poster. Those were Abhijitji's words not mine.

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 10 Jun 2013 21:25

Comer · Post by **Comer** » 10 Jun 2013 21:27

BijuShet wrote:
Muppalla wrote:That is really bad. He should have give a multiple choice of ashrams to retire. BJP is mean in not giving ahsrams as face savers.
Saar better to have the camel inside the tent pissing outside rather than the other way around. This episode will be forgotten soon and in 2 years after Advaniji retires he will be given his due respect within the party by old timers who know how much he helped grow the BJP. Today he is like a senior cricketer who does not recognize that it is time to hang up his shoes.

Am not quite which causes more damage Biju saar. He hasn't quit the NDA post. If he wants to do damage then he can use the tag to create mischief. Outside the tent, his value may not be that high.

vivek.rao · Post by **vivek.rao** » 10 Jun 2013 21:27

Sushupti wrote:

if true why didn't he write that in the letter.

Spin by PAID MEDIA. The cowards of janata party did. Dual membership of RSS & janasingh was used to dethrone Morarji even though jagjivan,charan Singh, Chandra Shekar were fighting like dogs to be PM.

LKA is acting thru his paid media stooges and acting o. The instructions of MAINO.

No going back. Let the old crook who is destroying this party since 2004 defeat go to hell. We don't care. That guy has no shame. He destroyed the party in Ktaka with the help of Sonia. Hopefully, no one goes back. If they can be firm now, the worst days of BJP are behind them. Otherwise, he will be biting them every day to death.

Tell Nitish to suck it up or go and die. We don't care. Nitish and Advani can move together after.

fanne · Post by **fanne** » 10 Jun 2013 21:28

Them last thing Advani wants to do is an interview with Bakra, he will loose whatever respect is left of him.

abhijitm · Post by **abhijitm** » 10 Jun 2013 21:33

Sanku wrote:I am surprised, I would expect people to be at least penitent about such choices at least now?

No remorse. Consciously chose lesser of two devils in 2009.

Sanku · Post by **Sanku** » 10 Jun 2013 21:38

abhijitm wrote:
Sanku wrote:I am surprised, I would expect people to be at least penitent about such choices at least now?

No remorse. Consciously chose lesser of two devils in 2009.

Wonderful. We are paying for your wisdom.

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 10 Jun 2013 21:39

Budda Baccha , Dhono Kacca. LOL PooRush turning out to be a Fokka Leader.
Desh Bikk Jayye, Par Hai Hai
Meri Leedri Naa Jayye.

LKA Yeh Soch Kar Resignation Diya Thha
KI Modi Yaan Party Manna Legi Ussko
Lafaz Aise Andaz Sey Likhe Hue Thei
Ki Bahane Ka Mauka Baacha Lega Ussko
PAR
Naa Modi Nei Rokka Naa Party Nei Tokka...
Jisse Smajhe Thei Neta , Nikla Sikka Khotta.

They never seem to cease disappointing . How many people here know about the old Indian tradition of Maama gone sulking when the Bhanja is in the horse ready to take the Baarat to bride's house? Whole family and the sundries rush to sooth Maama's idiotic shenanigans knowing very well that sulking is just the inherent stupidity on that happy occasion. This is LKA. Send the man one dozen Lollipops and Khes to cover himself. Not a pretty sight to see an old man so brazenly naked,insisting on getting attention.

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 10 Jun 2013 21:39

Muppalla · Post by **Muppalla** » 10 Jun 2013 21:39

abhijitm wrote: When it came to dealing with pakistan I chose MMS over LKA. I distrust LKA THAT much. It is a personal choice. Anyway, lets move on.

There is no need to have such a hatred. MMS is purely a different animal and he has proven his abilities with SharmElShake type stuff.

LKA had his abilites and had his missed opportunities. The only thing that he is doing now is irritating and in the interest of future/nation there should be no sentiments and emotions. He is at this juncture completely eligible to be thrown out. The party has tried it best to honor him and he did not reciprocate with magnaimity.

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 10 Jun 2013 21:42

What the maama does not know is his family dancing can make the richer gauntlets on other vote bank continue their kinds to be richer and corrupted onlee = If people think congress is not benefited by these bickering, they are wrong.

BijuShet · Post by **BijuShet** » 10 Jun 2013 21:45

fanne wrote:Them last thing Advani wants to do is an interview with Bakra, he will loose whatever respect is left of him.

That may be the last straw for BJP as it will be a burning of bridges moment for him. No matter what, the next few days will be interesting and not necessarily all bad for BJP. Let the news of these intra party fires reach the hinterland. It will help in raising NaMo's profile as the one who prevailed in the end. NaMo's story of sacrifice for the nation (his tyag of grahhasth ashram for rashtra seva), a rise from a nobody to a PM aspirant and that too from a modest background and with no upper caste credentials. This is a story that must be told to every child of India so they may learn to dream big and not be satified with the NREGA morsels being handed out to them today.

abhijitm · Post by **abhijitm** » 10 Jun 2013 21:45

Sushupti wrote:

Absolutely. The last thing Congress wants is an easy passage for NM within BJP. The time is to grab the opportunity and clean the party.

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 10 Jun 2013 21:47

RajeshA · Post by **RajeshA** » 10 Jun 2013 21:47

Actually Advani should go and chullu bhar paani men doob marna chahiye!

Everyday there are hundreds of thousands of Karyakartas doing work all over India to improve the chances of a Bharatiya Nationalist alternative.

And what does the varishta neta, the tallest leader, the patriarch do, he calls BJP a bunch who have lost their idealism and are only vying for personal benefit.

He destroys the work of thousands!

What Yeddi did was bad, but he was not the Peak of the Mountain. What Advani did is far worse! This is less than a year before general elections, this is one day after the BJP jubilantly celebrated a new dawn which was going to finish off Congress. This is bursting the enthusiasm of the Karyakartas when they were most ecstatic after a long long time.

Rajnath Singh had promised all will go home "happy, energized and enthusiastic", and this they did, and then LK Advani chooses to throw this nuke on their aspirations.

Shame on LKAdvani!

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 10 Jun 2013 21:56

Nice discussion on Ramayana going on at NDTV. Advani is being equated with Parashuram. "I being the top devotee of Shiva how anybody else can put his hand on Shiva's bow."

fanne · Post by **fanne** » 10 Jun 2013 21:57

As sheldon sir said
Rath Purush to wrath Purush!!

Klaus · Post by **Klaus** » 10 Jun 2013 21:59

While the media-space is filled to the brim with the ongoing LKA-mujra, there seems to be an information vacuum on the chaos within the INC, its high time the heat is turned on Ahmed Patel, who is the lynch-pin.

RajeshA · Post by **RajeshA** » 10 Jun 2013 22:00

Just as one has a phase in Jinnah's life when he was considered the ambassador of Hindu-Muslim unity and then there was a phase when he became the architect of Indian Partition, and LK Advani moved to embrace Jinnah for his earlier phase in life, similarly BJP would have to do with Advani himself.

This is just not the same Advani of the 80s, 90s or the one who was our Deputy Prime Minister. This is some other Advani, a sathiyaya hua Advani!

abhijitm · Post by **abhijitm** » 10 Jun 2013 22:06

It is the first time BJP has found an alternative to Congress other than Advani and he cannot swallow it. And he knows the writing on the wall that NM is his alternative too.

svenkat · Post by **svenkat** » 10 Jun 2013 22:09

Sushupti wrote:

http://samvada.org/2013/news/sanghpariv ... eadership/

NDTV Ticker....

If Advani quits, he won't leave alone: RSS leader MG Vaidya
See the utter falsehood of NDTV in attributing some nonsense to MG Vaidya.

Can someone in BJP sue NDTV for blatant false reporting.

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 10 Jun 2013 22:10

Swpan D tearing Sosai belt theory into pieces on NDTV.

negi · Post by **negi** » 10 Jun 2013 22:12

It would be nice if likes of MMJ leave BJP to give LKA company; they can all practice kapalbhati and anulom-vilom in vasant vihar or some such place in Dilli.

svenkat · Post by **svenkat** » 10 Jun 2013 22:14

News X is claiming that Narendra Modi lied that LKA had conveyed to him(modi) LKAs best wishes.(NewsX claims that sources in LKAs household denied that statement of Modibhai and claim that LKA did not talk to modibhai at all).

Did modibhai make any such statement that LKA conveyed his best wishes to modibhai.

Atri · Post by **Atri** » 10 Jun 2013 22:28

svenkat wrote:Did modibhai make any such statement that LKA conveyed his best wishes to modibhai.

http://www.dnaindia.com/india/1845608/r ... -blessings

https://twitter.com/narendramodi/status ... 9322932224

Narendra Modi wrote:Spoke to Advani ji on the phone. He gave me his blessings. Honoured and extremely grateful to receive his blessings

https://twitter.com/narendramodiH/statu ... 7792447489

Narendra Modi wrote:आडवाणी जी से फोन पर बात हुई. अपना आशीर्वाद दिया. उनका आशीर्वाद और सम्मान प्राप्त करने के लिए अत्यंत आभारी

Viv S · Post by **Viv S** » 10 Jun 2013 22:32

What's with all the vitriol against Advani? If he feels that developments in the party are (in his opinion) inadvisable, there's nothing wrong with his resignations. Its been suggested that the ideal way to go about it, would have have to give Modi his blessing before quitting. Why? If he's sincere and adamant in his belief that Modi isn't the man for the job, supporting him would have been hypocrisy.

On a related note, in some ways Modi's campaign for PM resembles Imran Khan's campaign for PM. In both cases you had a larger-than-life individual with a legion of truly die-hard supporters, the backing of the urban middle class, and considerable mass support in their backyard. But if ground realities are ignored, the final result will be underwhelming.

Couple of points to be made here.

First, India does not have a presidential system. For a country with 22 official languages, a parliamentary system is the only practical means of governance. (By the way, if we did have a presidential system, the Congress would never have lost power being the party with the largest vote-share even in 1999).

Second, the BJP's position as a national party is at arguably at its lowest ebb. In 1999, as a party it won seats all the way from J&K to Tamil Nadu (where it won 4 of the 6 seats it contested). Today its non-existent east of Bihar, and after the drubbing in Karnataka appears to have been wiped out of the South as well. In Odisha and Haryana it doesn't appear to be in the running, and its been eclipsed by the JD(U) in Bihar. There is no doubt a considerable scope for revival in the long run, but revival before 2014 is unlikely.

Third, some on the forum seem to have simply written off the election for the BJP and appear to be viewing current events through a perspective of mid-term elections post-2015. That is a defeatist attitude, especially when you consider the fact that it took only 145 seats for the Congress to form the govt in 2004.

Fourth, if (as I believe) the BJP ought to be fighting to win in 2014, the focus needs to be on planning/building a coalition at all points. And while the country may be disillusioned (to put it mildly) with the Congress, non-allied parties are not going to line up behind the BJP post-election, even if it is the single largest party in the LS.

There are two questions to be asked here -

1. Can Modi as the leader of the BJP forge an alliance strong enough to form the govt in 2014, bringing X,Y and Z parties on board, as ABV once did? Because so far, the BJP itself doesn't seem to be fully on board and the only ally who's voiced firm support is the Akali Dal. Given the circumstances, I'm surprised the BRFites can so nonchalantly write off Nitish Kumar as a spent force and therefore irrelevant to the coming election.

There's another school of thought that suggests that Modi's candidature itself will swing the vote hard enough to put the BJP is an unassailable position in 2014. That would be an 'optimistic' thought. The Hindi-heartland where Modi will be expected to have the maximum impact has the lowest media and newspaper penetration among the various parts of India. There are only so many rallies a leader can attend, eventually its only consistent work at the grassroots level that will bear fruit. Fact is the BJP is will win where it will win (such as MP, Rajasthan, Gujarat, Chattisgarh), with the identity of the PM nominee having only a marginal impact, especially on the rural electorate.

2. The Indian public (well .... at least the urban educated public) has been looking for a strong and able leader to take the reins, demolish the status quo and push through true change from the highest level. Assuming the BJP wins and forms the next election, is Modi the best man to manage a fractious alliance and push through critical reform through the Parliament, whether it is land reform, tax reform, labour reform or state reorganisation? If Congress with 206 seats could be stonewalled in the Lok Sabha, without a good working relation with others, how does a BJP with say 175 seats (a generous assessment) do better?

svenkat · Post by **svenkat** » 10 Jun 2013 22:32

Atriji,sunnypji,

Thanks.

Arjun · Post by **Arjun** » 10 Jun 2013 22:33

BJP crisis: Narendra Modi may gain from Advani resignation gambit

If Advani revisits his decision, it will probably be on the party’s terms, which means he will effectively end up endorsing Modi as the prime ministerial candidate in 2014

If he doesn’t, the experts add, then Modi will no longer have the problem of having to deal with a party patriarch who doesn’t particularly like him.

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 10 Jun 2013 22:37

Listen to Swapan D 23:31, 31:15 very strong words "Mr. Advaani has made rubbish of BJP".

http://www.ndtv.com/video/player/ndtv-s ... eststories

Punch line: "With You preferable without you inevitable"

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 10 Jun 2013 22:40

Bijushet, Saik was berating LKA for his antics. Need to put on your saiklogical decoder.

Saik, it will help all of us you convey your ideas in simple sentences and not like a C program.

Also vina has not changed sides. He has been a constant nationalist.

----

I think LKAji has tremneous pressure to do whatever it takes to stop Modi. All those ambassador vists and the INC minons commenting is towards that goal. Having not succeeded in that task he is publically telling those people he has done all he could.

Meantime all BJP cadre is very upset with him not realising his compulsions.

In effect has has sucided himself as he can't stop Modi.

And suicide is very adharmic.

Mahendra, Kudos for your

loh Purush->Lol pursush

Hari Seldon, for your

rath yatra->wrath yatra!

--------------

One more thing is respect has to be earned and not demanded. Hope people learn the importance of proper critcism.

Yashwant Sinha demanding LKA be respected for his age and 'seniority' is same as people demanding MMS be respected for his position and not question their actions.

Satire/lampooning is the easiest for it conveys the criticsm effectively.

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 10 Jun 2013 22:45

svenkat wrote:News X is claiming that Narendra Modi lied that LKA had conveyed to him(modi) LKAs best wishes.(NewsX claims that sources in LKAs household denied that statement of Modibhai and claim that LKA did not talk to modibhai at all).

Did modibhai make any such statement that LKA conveyed his best wishes to modibhai.

Or LKA and his household are doing what they have done so far, which is to put their personal interests above those of the BJP, and in turn, the nations.

Arjun · Post by **Arjun** » 10 Jun 2013 22:47

Viv S wrote:What's with all the vitriol against Advani? If he feels that developments in the party are (in his opinion) inadvisable, there's nothing wrong with his resignations. Its been suggested that the ideal way to go about it, would have have to give Modi his blessing before quitting. Why? If he's sincere and adamant in his belief that Modi isn't the man for the job, supporting him would have been hypocrisy.

There is a difference, Viv - between not voting for someone in the course of the Parliamentary Board meeting and actually resigning from the Parliamentary Board.

Once the Parliamentary Board had decided based on majority vote on the candidate, Advani should have abided by the decision.

As for the rest of your post - they assume that BJP is announcing Modi as the PM candidate. As of now, Modi is just the campaign committee head and technically satisfies the JDU demand even if BJP cadre do correctly see Modi as the de facto leader.

Muppalla · Post by **Muppalla** » 10 Jun 2013 22:49

Even if Modi lied, he is still trying to give respect to a sulking octagenerian. If he does not know how to handle respect then he does not even deserve it. There are several cupboards of skeletons that can be opened in KA's reddy bros and others to make LKA fall further down. He better stop the nautanki in the next 48hrs.

Muppalla · Post by **Muppalla** » 10 Jun 2013 22:51

Chauti Duniya had predicted that an all out war will happen in BJP about two weeks ago. He is having so much of internal news.

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 10 Jun 2013 22:51

Viv S wrote:What's with all the vitriol against Advani? If he feels that developments in the party are (in his opinion) inadvisable, there's nothing wrong with his resignations. Its been suggested that the ideal way to go about it, would have have to give Modi his blessing before quitting. Why? If he's sincere and adamant in his belief that Modi isn't the man for the job, supporting him would have been hypocrisy.

If he had been as forthright as you suggest he should be, it would have been one thing. Instead he did everything to scuttle Modi's elevation against the wishes of the rest of the party, using cheap politicking. Asking for two election panels and one headed by Gadkari (whom he had pushed out), propping Nitish vs Modi (several reports citing this), and finally attempting to make it a Shivraj vs Modi battle (Shivraj and RNS scuttled that attempt). In short, LKA has done everything possible to NOT take a forthright stand and play the game from the shadows. When that failed, and he tried to use his seniority etc directly, he was overruled, so he plays this resignation drama. If he was so into resigning, why did he not resign the remaining two posts that he has still clung onto, the head of the NDA and the other one? Simply put, its obvious to most folks here, that his lust for power & desire to be PM or kingmaker (as versus his one time protege who is now running an independent ship) is having sabotage the BJP.

Last, the rest of your comments about whether Modi is suitable or not, are to be decided by the BJP by its internal mechanism. That they have to some degree, and the rest will follow. If Advani cannot respect that process, he should leave, and if so, should leave in entirety, not merely offer his resignation for the 3rd time in 8 years. He is anyways too old for the job of becoming a PM, a thankless 24-7 job which demands an energetic, younger individual. And if hes thinking of playing the kingmaker, India has had enough of unelected kingmakers ruling by proxy - we have seen that over UPA1 and UPA2, and thanks but no thanks.

muraliravi · Post by **muraliravi** » 10 Jun 2013 22:52

Muppalla wrote:Even if Modi lied, he is still trying to give respect to a sulking octagenerian. If he does not know how to handle respect then he does not even deserve it. There are several cupboards of skeletons that can be opened in KA's reddy bros and others to make LKA fall further down. He better stop the nautanki in the next 48hrs.

Muppalla ji, I think Ramana ji has hit the bulls eye. LKA is under blackmail/pressure whatever we call it. Severe pressure has been mounted on him to stop modi at all cost.

Atri · Post by **Atri** » 10 Jun 2013 23:00

ramana wrote:I think LKAji has tremneous pressure to do whatever it takes to stop Modi. All those ambassador vists and the INC minons commenting is towards that goal. Having not succeeded in that task he is publically telling those people he has done all he could.

Meantime all BJP cadre is very upset with him not realising his compulsions.

In effect has has sucided himself as he can't stop Modi.

And suicide is very adharmic.

Plus 1..

http://forums.bharat-rakshak.com/viewto ... 6#p1290016

UP was last chance given to old guard.. one of the oldies in distant family said that mohan bhaagwat was perhaps one of the best things that happened to India in recent times. A little late but welcome nonetheless. While I do not share that optimism, I do hope that they show the essential ruthlessness required to cut off the diseased and adharmik parts of self and enemy.. If they do they have bright chance in 2019.. I said this two years ago. They should not even look at having a power in center until 2019.

India is heading into a trap, no matter who leads. I wish NM successfully fights off the Minotaur and come out of labyrinth well with golden fleece. Of course it isn't wise to have hopes on a person. we need a robust system. dharma. rest is expendable. The labyrinth is beginning to unravel itself. If one can wait for opportune moment one may be saved from the trouble of finding the way through the labyrinth. The Minotaur is eager to come out himself. Then all that is left is generation or two long fighting..

entering the labyrinth which is falling apart will make one a part of those who wish to preserve the structure. Delhi lobby is way inside the labyrinth along with Anglo-Americans and Continentals and hans since 250 years. It was clear when the american ambassador met LKA in 2009.. The lobby which roots for NM, NG and others is outside. if labyrinth collapses they won't loose much. If they enter they will have to spend most of their energy in saving the labyrinth and their asses thereby compromising in the process.

If one wishes to enter the mouth of "surasaa" then one must have the guile and power of Hanuman to come out unharmed either by miniaturizing OR tearing apart the stomach. I am curious to see whether this lobby has that in them..

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 10 Jun 2013 23:02

How can Americans/Isrealis blackmail him? What has he done?

Muppalla · Post by **Muppalla** » 10 Jun 2013 23:03

Atri ji, excellent reminder. I was avoiding to get into this US amby stuff to just wait until things cool down. Dilli Billi has to be defeated if we want resurrect any thing called India.