Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

[Sagar G]

Absolutely unacceptable, IMO. This is the act of cowards. The response to Pakistan must be through our military and our diplomacy . This is cheap gimmickry.

The "diplomacy" works overtime to weaken our military "response". I don't get it why some people still reside in their la la land of high morals when dealing with shit-is-tan.

[member_26255]

Blast in Quetta: Explosion on Sariab Road kills two

Two persons were killed and another sustained injuries in a blast near Sariab Road, Quetta, on Monday night.
According to police, unknown persons planted an Improvised Explosive Device on a road side near Irrigation Colony which exploded with a loud noise.....

[member_26255]

Karachi police arrest suspect, recover Indian passport

KARACHI: Karachi police on Monday arrested a suspect from Lyari and recovered Indian passport and Pakistan national identity card from his possession, Geo News reported.

SSP Tariq Dharejo said the accused, arrested from Baghdadi, hails from Uttar Pradesh (UP) India, adding police have recovered Indian passport and Pakistani NIC from the custody of the accused.

The name of the accused written on the NIC is Shah Alam. The intelligence agencies are interrogating him.

[SSridhar]

Absolutely unacceptable, IMO. This is the act of cowards. The response to Pakistan must be through our military and our diplomacy . This is cheap gimmickry.

The "diplomacy" works overtime to weaken our military "response". I don't get it why some people still reside in their la la land of high morals when dealing with shit-is-tan.

What to do ? people like me have very little knowledge about Pakistan, perhaps ?

[member_26255]

Finally some balls from GoI

India Foreign Office spokesperson, Syed Akbaruddin said India will not hold talks with Pakistan till matters of cross border firing and army are not fully resolved, Express News reported on Tuesday.
According to the spokesperson, Pakistan should also take action against Hafiz Saeed in order to help the Pakistan-India relationship. Saeed is alleged to be responsible for the 2008 Mumbai attacks in India.
.....

[kittoo]

Apologies if it was posted earlier, but I found this amazing article today and thought it was worth posting. It takes immense courage to write such an article in Pakistan, blaming and denouncing Islam for the problems and saying it must go and is beastly. Wow! The writer seems a Sindhi guy. I am not sure if Hindu or Muslim, but going by the Kunwer in his name, even if he is a Muslim, he and his ancestors must have been Rajputs and he is proud of his original religion and culture.

http://www.pakistantoday.com.pk/2013/03 ... -the-room/

He’s deadly when he gnashes his teeth

Pak Zoo was carved out of Hind Zoo in 1947, when the imperialistic British zoo-owners got bored of toying with the inhabiting animals, and decided to abscond from animal parks all over the world. For the decade or so leading up to the British selling Hind Zoo, it was clear that the zoo’s ownership would be returned to the locals, but the dynamics of the final deal weren’t quite as unambiguous. After much deliberation and debate, the future of Hind Zoo hinged over the fate of one animal, an elephant named Malsi.

Malsi was born in Saudi Arabia, what seems like ages ago, and was brought to the subcontinent by Arab warriors, who used him to destroy any resistance that they faced in their long journey. Malsi encouraged their imperialistic cravings – among other fetishes – as he stampeded over anyone who denounced the Arabs or didn’t accept the elephant as the supreme authority. After reaching the subcontinent, Malsi first threatened to ‘Arabanise’ Hind, but when that didn’t materialise he found acquiescing followers who ended up creating a whole new zoo for Malsi.

Despite being bestial, perilous and ferocious, Malsi mustered a massive fan following after his arrival in the region. His fans were extremely loyal and made sure – some inadvertently, others intentionally – that Malsi was always depicted as a humble and peaceful creature, which in turn ensured that the aficionados grew in numbers. It was believed that Malsi wouldn’t get proper coverage in Hind because of the presence of other star animals, and hence a struggling lawyer named A M Hannij, taking inspiration from an incoherent poet Labqi, decided to give his own career a massive boost by leading the movement for a separate zoo where Malsi would hog the limelight. But bizarrely, following Pak Zoo’s creation, Hannij addressed the zoo’s management committee on August 11, 1947 announcing how everyone in Pak was free to follow any animal they wanted, much to the bemusement of the committee. 65 years down the line, Hannij’s summersault is still being debated as zoo commentators continue to mull over Pak Zoo’s raison d’etre.

Regardless of what the founding fathers intended, Malsi remains the star of the show in Pak Zoo. His dangerous self is preserved under the pretentious shroud of tranquility as he continues to live in a gargantuan room, designed exclusively to cater to his needs, with other inhabitants being sidelined in crammed cages. Malsi is as popular as ever, and is the centre of just about everything associated with Pak. Throughout the past 65 years or so Malsi has been forced into matters that have got nothing to do with him, and as a result Pak Zoo is taking a nosedive into crisis upon crisis with the Malsi obsession precipitously accelerating. And as the obsession escalates, what no one is realising is that there is no bigger predicament facing Pak than Malsi – the reason behind the zoo’s inception.

From Pak Zoo’s Subjective Solution in 1949 to 1973’s Zoo License Act, Malsi has always been thrust upon the way the zoo would be governed. When you keep a precarious monster, nourish it, make it the be-all end-all of your foundation and then pretend that it’s passive and tranquil, you’re obviously laying the groundwork for eventually being eaten up by the beast. And that is precisely what Malsi has been doing, as we turn a blind eye to the elephant in the room.

Pak Zoo has become a haunted place, with inexplicable occurrences becoming a norm in Malsi’s room. There are mysterious killings, murders, rapes, incidents of violence and bloodshed all over the place, and all in the room belonging to Malsi – the animal of peace. In October last year, Alalam, a 15-year-old school girl was attacked; the previous year a politician named Namlas Reesat was hunted down; the same year, Pak’s representative for other animals, Zabhahs, was killed, and these are just a few high profile cases among incidents of brutality that occur every single day in the zoo. And despite all evidence pointing towards Malsi as the culprit – who would readily accept the blame if anyone bothered checking– the zoo authorities find someone else to point fingers at and ignore the elephant in the room.

Another mindboggling reality about Malsi’s viciousness is that he doesn’t even spare his own followers. The thing is, Malsi’s followers are divided into a plethora of groups and every one of them takes Malsi’s help to butcher the rest. And so, Malsi has helped cement the discriminatory lines that were drawn by the Arabs to distinguish themselves from the rest, and has created hostile divides among its own followers as well. One can gauge the loyalty of Malsi’s followers by the fact that despite being pulverised by the elephant they refuse to abandon their allegiance to Malsi. Perhaps it’s more of a case of loyalty towards your own group, in some cases, more so than any diehard faithfulness with regards to the elephant, which has seen the powerful sects massacre the rest through Malsi.

The Malsi apologists are an interesting creed as well, who despite being vociferous flag-bearers of the elephant’s superiority, never actually pay him a visit. Nevertheless they claim that they know more about Malsi, than those who interact with him on a daily basis. The apologists tow the “animal of peace” line, and conjure nonsensical counter-explanations every time Malsi does someone in. These apologists are a funny lot, they raucously condemn Malsi’ victims and extol the elephant at the same time. They highlight Hannij’s August 11 speech to claim that Pak wasn’t created for Malsi and ignore the lawyer’s speeches over the preceding decade. They assert that everyone should be allowed to follow the animals of their choice, and forget that if that were the case Malsi would never have reached their zoo in the first place. The apologists paint a beautiful picture whenever Malsi smiles, and close their eyes when he gnashes his teeth.

Pak has been feeding and grooming the elephant for 65 years, and in turn paying heavily for the ensuing destruction. The zoo has paid no regard to the animals that have inhabited it for centuries, and has completely destroyed its cultural essence to accommodate a foreign species. It is obvious that Pak can no longer carry Malsi’s weight; it is obvious that Pak can no longer afford being obliterated from the core; it is obvious that Pak can no longer bear Malsi’s violent antics; it is obvious that Pak cannot continue to ignore the elephant in the room; and it is extremely obvious that for Pak Zoo to live on, Malsi must depart.

[SSridhar]

kittoo, yes, it has been posted here and discussed, but no harm reading it once again.

[Sagar G]

What to do ? people like me have very little knowledge about Pakistan, perhaps ?

Oh please I am not challenging your knowledge about pukes but I have seen this tendency among lot's of educated people to always expect spotless high moral behaviour from Indians while dealing with absolute scumbags of earth. This tendency amazes me. Why shall we carry the burden of morality when none is required w.r.t. the situation ???

[Garooda]

Yes pukis are MFN for India. Now 5-star circuit chatters have more on the plate to push files.

Yeah pukis are more like Most Fuc*edup Nation for India

[arun]

X posted from the “Oppression of minorities in Pakistan” thread.

In the Islamic Republic of Pakistan, a country claimed to have been formed to provide a safe haven for the Mohammaddens of the Indian Sub-Continent, members of the minority Aga Khan led Ismaili aka Khoja sect of Mohammaddenism find out that they have no immunity from the religion inspired predatory actions of their co-religionists. The Green on Green Intra Mohammadden religion inspired predatory action being the demonstration of the IEDology of Pakistan targeting a Jamaat Khana ie: a place of worship of the Ismaili / Khoja sect:

Consecutive cracker blasts in Karachi Jamaat Khana leaves 2 dead

[Peregrine]

Pak-China ties : Gawadar port one part of a larger plan

BEIJING: The Gwadar Port is a key component of the China-Pakistan economic corridor which is aimed at strengthening economic links with the neighbouring regional states, said Special Secretary for Asia-Pacific affairs at Pakistan’s Ministry of Foreign Affairs, Noor Muhammad Jadmani, while commenting on the speculations in media on the use of the port.
The Gwadar port forms one part of a larger economic corridor project stretching from Gwadar, Balochistan, to Kashgar, in the Xinjiang Uygur autonomous region, linking China to the Arabian Sea.

He described bilateral cooperation in infrastructure projects as “salient”, saying many Chinese engineers have given their lives for the Karakoram Highway that connects the two countries. Bilateral trade reached more than $12 billion last year, and Islamabad is “working in the direction” of raising this figure to $15 billion by 2015. Chance would be a fine thing!

SBP EXPORT RECEIPTS BY COUNTRY - IN US$ BILLIONS :

China : US$ 02.697594 + Hong Kong : US$ 00.4948460 – Total Exports : US$ 03.192440 Billion

SBP IMPORT PAYMENTS BY COUNTRY

China : US$ 04.761513 + Hong Kong : US $ 00.508384 - Total Imports : US$ 05.269897 Billion

Total Trade Between Pakistan and China including Hong Kong : US$ 08.462337 Billion

Comparison : India - China Trade including Hong Kong : Over US$ 85 Billion.

Cheers

[RCase]

Absolutely unacceptable, IMO. This is the act of cowards. The response to Pakistan must be through our military and our diplomacy . This is cheap gimmickry.

What to do ? people like me have very little knowledge about Pakistan, perhaps ?

Saar, why the heart burn? It was the work of Non-State Actors onlee! India too is a victim of Non-State Actors. Pakistan should be more understanding as it is the bigger brother when it comes to Non-State Actors! These non-state actors in India were not even trying to pretend to be state actors by wearing state uniforms!

[member_26255]

Absolutely unacceptable, IMO. This is the act of cowards. The response to Pakistan must be through our military and our diplomacy . This is cheap gimmickry.

The "diplomacy" works overtime to weaken our military "response". I don't get it why some people still reside in their la la land of high morals when dealing with shit-is-tan.

Sir jee, had the diplomacy been active in international arena in its true sense, suwaristanis would be licking our feet like an
obedient dog. Intense lobbying would have seen some reduction in the baksheesh from khans especially the AMRAAM's and stuff and
the nuclear program as well. Not to mention the water option that we have, could always be used for some leverage. Instead of that, our diplomats were busy, enjoying the chai-biskoot sessions with kabab-biryani and giving TSP a long hand to do as they please.
Even now why waste the expensive bullets, just open the dams and blame it on non state actors. After all, piglets from TSP have threatened in the past to bomb the dams. Simple onlee

[Prem]

Woh Jo Din Bhar Karte ho Miyan?

Bowing down before terrorism is not solution, says Kayani

SLAMABAD: Pakistan’s top military commander at midnight on Tuesday said that there could be difference of opinion on counter terrorism strategy, however, to bow down before the militancy can never be a solution.Speaking at the annual military parade at Kakul Military Academy in Abbottabad, Chief of the Army Staff General Ashfaq Pervez Kayani emphasised on early execution of steps against terrorism by evolving a national consensus.

“It is important to get united, evolve a national consensus and implement it at earliest to find a solution,” he said.“The war against terrorism can only be won when we all are on the same page….so there is no doubt in our and terrorists’ minds,” he added.“We as a nation have never failed….and we will not in the future also,” said Kayani. The statement from the army chief has surfaced when the newly elected government of Pakistan Muslim League-Nawaz (PML-N) is busy in preparing a new national security policy against terrorism.Speaking during a press conference in Islamabad earlier on Tuesday, Interior Minister Chaudhry Nisar Ali Khan had outlined some key features of the government’s security policy to counter terrorism in the country, announcing to formulate a joint intelligence secretariat.The army chief, on the occasion however, refrained himself from issuing any statement regarding recent clashes between Pakistani and Indian forces at the Line of Control (LoC) in Kashmir.

[SSridhar]

Sir jee, had the diplomacy been active . . .

That's exactly the point. Diplomacy does not mean simply 'talking'. There is a range of options that we never tried. Even when we have to take military action, diplomacy is involved. Our meek behaviour with Pakistan over the years has somehow instilled in us that diplomacy means surrender.

[SSridhar]

Absolutely unacceptable, IMO. This is the act of cowards. The response to Pakistan must be through our military and our diplomacy . This is cheap gimmickry.

What to do ? people like me have very little knowledge about Pakistan, perhaps ?

Saar, why the heart burn? It was the work of Non-State Actors onlee! India too is a victim of Non-State Actors. Pakistan should be more understanding as it is the bigger brother when it comes to Non-State Actors! These non-state actors in India were not even trying to pretend to be state actors by wearing state uniforms!

No RCase saar. The incongruity is that when disproportionate military response should have been our answer when our armymen were beheaded in January and shot dead now in an ambush, we choose to remain mum and our non-state actors simply tar the sign boards and throw pamphlets ? That adds insult to injury. We would have been better off without a demonstration of this impotency. If these our non-state actors, they are absolutely no patch on those from across the border. That is the heart burn.

[SSridhar]

Why is New Delhi Dithering ? - G.Parthasarathy, Business Line

Alongside its economic problems, India now faces a situation where two of its neighbours — China and Pakistan — are jointly and separately undermining its security and influence worldwide.

Emboldened by Chinese assistance leading to the strengthening of its navy (4 new frigates), air force (JF 17 fighters) and nuclear armoury (plutonium-based tactical nuclear weapons), Pakistan now believes that it can effectively deter India from responding firmly to terrorist strikes emanating from its soil. India’s Mandarins, resorting to clichés such as “Pakistan is also a victim of terrorism” and “Action on terrorism (by Pakistan) should not be linked (by India) to the Composite Dialogue Process,” now referred to as the “Sharm el Sheikh Syndrome,” would like us to believe that Pakistan is having a “change of heart”.

It is this approach to diplomacy that has led Nawaz Sharif to insist that the “Composite Dialogue Process” with India should commence at where it was, when he was ousted in 1999. He wants us to forget that the Red Fort was attacked by the Lashkar-e-Taiba (now generously financed by his brother, the Chief Minister of Punjab) in 2001, and ignore the attack on our Parliament in 2001 and the 26/11 outrage in Mumbai, executed by jihadis from Pakistan.

Chinese highway link

Nawaz Sharif has returned from China, fully assured that the Chinese will build a highway linking the Xingjian Province to the Gwadar Port. This project, which will be largely executed by Chinese Army engineers, together with their development of hydro-electric projects and infrastructure in Gilgit-Baltistan, gives the Chinese the capability to establish a security presence adjacent to the LoC, astride our Lines of Communication to Ladakh and Siachen.

If Pakistan succeeded in pushing New Delhi to de-link the Composite Dialogue Process from its support for terrorism, China has successfully scuttled all possibility of an early border settlement, by upping its border claims in both Arunachal Pradesh and Ladakh. Successive Indian National Security Advisers have strutted around pretending that they have devised brilliant new ideas to resolve the vexed border issue. The reality is somewhat different. Prime Minister Wen Jiabao agreed in 2005 that the “boundary should be along well-defined and easily identifiable natural geographical features” and that in “reaching a border settlement, the two sides shall safeguard the interests of their settled populations in the border areas”. Yet, just a year later, the Chinese Ambassador in New Delhi proclaimed that the whole of Arunachal Pradesh, re-designated as “South Tibet,” is a part of China.
Mere spectator

It should have been evident to New Delhi that China had no intention of resolving the border issue, when it refused to exchange maps delineating the “Line of Control” in the crucial western (Ladakh) and eastern (Arunachal Pradesh) sectors. India claims the Line of Control in the Ladakh Sector lies along the Karakoram Mountains up to the Indus River Watershed. Chinese intrusions into Debsang, Chumar, Chushul, Pangong Lake, Daulat Beg Oldi and Demchok are clearly in areas where they have no business to intrude into, going by the terms of the Guiding Principles of 2005. Moreover, India’s claims are also validated by agreements on the Ladakh-Tibet border.

Instead of directly confronting Chinese “assertiveness” on the border issue, New Delhi has been a mere spectator. China has made inroads, undermining Indian influence in Bhutan, Maldives and Nepal, while building bridges to a possible Khaleda Zia dispensation in Bangladesh. China has even undermined India’s defence ties with the US and Japan by forcing a dithering security establishment in South Block to cancel participation in proposed Joint Naval Exercises in the Pacific with the US and Japan. While Premier Li Keqiang’s visit to Delhi was linked to his trip to Pakistan, would Manmohan Singh reciprocate by visiting Vietnam, Japan and the Philippines after his forthcoming visit to China? Should we not engage Japan, Vietnam, the Philippines and others for devising a “string of pearls” in the South China Sea?
American pressure

The economic downturn and delays in defence acquisitions have only added to errant and assertive Chinese and Pakistani behaviour.

After dithering for over two years, the Cabinet has finally sanctioned the raising of Strike Corps for deployment along the Siliguri Corridor. But what use will such a Strike Corps be without mountain artillery whose acquisition has been hanging fire for years, the deployment of mechanised tank formations and the establishment of air dominance over our borders?

Economically, the Chinese are obtaining a stranglehold on the power, communications and electronics sectors in India, thereby getting the potential to disrupt power and communications in the country. After much procrastination, the Government has slapped a 22 per cent duty on imports of Chinese power equipment. Hopefully, Indian public and private companies will be given incentives to face state supported and subsidised Chinese companies.

The picture is unfortunately bleak in the electronics and communications sectors where our imports, substantially from China, could well exceed our petroleum imports by 2020. This issue was sought to be addressed by the establishment of manufacturing parks for chips and IT equipment. Such manufacturing facilities would naturally require preferential access in purchases by Government organisations and private companies. The Government is, however, now showing signs of buckling to American pressure, demanding substantive and non-discriminatory market access for American products in these areas.

The Americans have obviously concluded that there is no reason to hesitate in applying pressures on an Indian Government that bends backwards to pressures from Pakistan and China.

(The author is a former High Commissioner to Pakistan.)

[ramana]

Probably GP doesnt know the principal threat perception conveyed by INC stalwarts to US envoys as reported in Wikileaks?

[Prem]

The Cabinet Mission Plan: Pakistan and India —Patient Qooinsar Raswhit
BC Inbreds still Brooding

In the context of the history of Pakistan and India, there is still a moot point: if the Indian National Congress (INC) had accepted the Cabinet Mission Plan of 1946, what would have been the contours of both Pakistan and India today?
In the ‘long term’ part of the plan, the provinces of united India were to be divided into three groups: Group A consisting of six provinces (Madras, Bombay, Utter Pradesh, Bihar, Central Province and Orissa); Group B consisting of four provinces (Punjab, North Western Frontier Province, Sindh and Balochistan); and Group C consisting of two provinces (Bengal and Assam). In a way, when All India Muslim League (AIML) accepted the plan, it postponed the demand of a separate Muslim state raised in the Lahore Resolution on August 14, 1940.In the acceptance of the plan, there were two gains for the AIML: first, the future state of Pakistan would be based on the provinces having Muslim majority population such as the provinces in the Group B and C of the plan; and second, the British government had acceded to the Muslim dream of Pakistan that the Muslims saw in 1940. However, in the acceptance of the plan, there were two losses to the AIML: first, the Muslims living in the Hindu majority provinces such as the provinces in the Group A of the plan were excluded from living with other Muslims; and second, the Muslims did not immediately gain Pakistan.
The plan also said: “The constitution of the Union and of the Groups would contain a provision whereby any province could, by a majority vote of its Legislative Assembly, call for a reconsideration of the terms of the constitution after an initial period of ten years and at ten yearly intervals thereafter... Provinces would be free to form Groups with executives and legislatures, and each Group could determine the Provincial subjects to be taken in common.” The language of this part of the plan showed that the British government wanted a consensus based division (or unity) and not an unplanned and enforced one. Secondly, the British government wanted a smooth transition of power.Earlier, the Lahore Resolution had said: “Resolved that it is the considered view of this session of the All-India Muslim League that no constitutional plan would be workable in this country or acceptable to the Muslims unless it is designed on the following basic principles viz., that geographically contiguous units are demarcated into regions which should be so constituted, with such territorial readjustments as may be necessary, that the areas in which the Muslims are numerically in a majority as in the North-Western and Eastern Zones of India should be grouped to constitute ‘Independent States’ in which the constituent units shall be autonomous and sovereign.” In this paragraph of the Resolution, a point is clear: the Muslims of India thought that the constitutional protection of their rights was not possible without the division of united India (and having a separate homeland, whether it consisted of one state or multiple states).After the Resolution, the AIML strived to remove the ambiguity surrounding the word ‘Independent States’ contained in the resolution. In 1941, at the Madras session of the AIML, a resolution was passed which stated, “Everyone should clearly understand that we are striving for one independent and sovereign Muslim state.” However, in a way, the Cabinet Mission Plan disagreed with this explanation and remained focused on translating the meaning of the Northwestern and Eastern Zones of India in the context of Muslim majority provinces. The plan used the word ‘province’ and not ‘unit’ or ‘area’ (and the word ‘group’ and not ‘zones) as written in the Lahore Resolution. Hence was the existence of the Group B and C in the plan. This point also shows that not only the Muslims in 1940 but also the British government in 1946 understood the reality of geographical remoteness in defining the borders of the future state of Pakistan. In that way, (like the Lahore Resolution) the Cabinet Mission Plan (also) envisaged two Pakistan and not one. By accepting the plan, the AIML also endorsed the same. Perhaps, the AIML preferred one or two conglomeration(s) of Muslim majority provinces to a combination of Muslim majority ‘units’ or ‘areas’ and to achieve that the AIML was ready to wait for another 10 years.
In the Cabinet Mission Plan, there was a low risk of the denial of Pakistan (whether one or two). The division of India into two or three (independent) states was ingrained in the plan. The risk of division was after every 10 years. The plan also showed that both the AIML and the British government were convinced that the solution to the ills of united India lay in its division. The 10-year formula, which was enshrined in the plan, was also to edify the INC to rethink its politico-economic strategy towards the Muslims before another 10 years lapsed. Hence, the 10-year provision would have been a Damocles’ sword hanging over the head of the INC.By not accepting (one provision or another of) the Cabinet Mission Plan, the INC might have thought of obviating the division of united India. Even the Lahore Resolution and the Cabinet Mission Plan could not convince the INC that both the Muslims and the British government were thinking in terms of the division of India, owing to their own separate reasons. Though the division took place in 1947 but the hasty and enforced division of united India was a loss to both the Hindus and Muslims. The next community that was at loss was the Sikhs, as most of them had to take refuge in the Indian part of the province of Punjab. The hasty and enforced division was materialised through the Radcliffe Award of 1947, which sowed the seeds of permanent hatred between the newly founded states of Pakistan and India.

[Prem]

Why Muslims have fewer Nobel Prizes than Trinity College?
Onlee If there was Nobel Prize in Different way to Slaughter life , Muslims would have won all the Nobels

When Richard Dawkin passes an inflammatory statement, it should come with no surprise. An ethologist, evolutionary biologist and most famously, an atheist known for his derogatory attacks on God in his book, “The God Delusion”, Dawkin’s recent epiphany this Eid, has successfully managed to provoke Muslims and well-wishers of the faith all around the world.
“All the world’s Muslims have fewer Nobel Prizes than Trinity College, Cambridge. They did great things in the Middle Ages, though”Plainly speaking, this tweet reeks racism and apartheid at its best, and pronounces a judgment on Muslims that they may perhaps have done nothing since the Middle age. How very convenient of Mr. Dawkins to just drop a bombshell!While there might be some merit to critics’ backlashing on Dawkin’s impolite mannerism and cruelly insensitive statement, it may also be the case that there is some correctness to a comment that appears to be pure incendiary and sectarian.And so, what might seem sectarian to us Muslims may just be an insightful comment. But why is it that each time a belief is brought to question, it’s taken as a fascist attack of Muslims. In a similar realm of questioning beliefs, it is worth asking why is Bertrand Russell’s robust critique of Christianity considered as one the most influential books in 20th century? Russell was not accused of being a bigot for attacking Christianity? Was his polemic against the faith any less vehement than Dawkins’ on Islam? Would Russell’s seminal essay ‘Why I am not a Christian’ be branded as bigoted since t directly questioned ‘powerful and life-consuming belief’ of millions of that particular faith?
The question is, how would critics of Dawkins react if the words “Christian” and “church” are replaced by Muslim and mosques when Russell states,” I say quite deliberately that the Christian religion, as organized in its churches, has been and still is the principal enemy of moral progress in the world?” The answer to this is very obvious. We Muslims as a unit, disregard and resent any question that’s ever raised on us.Even if we concede that Dawkins tweet is intended to be offensive and is a form bigotry, is it not worth asking why are there only 10 Muslim Nobel laureates compared to 32 from Trinity college, and some 200 plus Jewish recipients of the prize? Why has there been virtually no major scientific contribution from Muslims after the 13th century? Is it possible that those very forces that have stifled democracy, individual liberty and free speech in Islamic societies, have also restricted the blossoming of ideas generally, and science in particular? Could it be that that freedom in every sphere of human activity leads to the release creative and productive energy among people, and if constrained the society as a whole suffers?o brandish Dawkins as a ‘Muslim Hater’ on a mission to smear the people seems disingenuous would only be an exaggeration. He may not like Islam, but I don’t see any animus against Muslims as a people. If anything, he might actually have sympathy for the oppression they suffer by various authorities/governments who viciously use religion to deny basic freedoms. He might in fact be doing Muslims a favor by provoking us to ask unpleasant questions about our own heritage. By stifling debate we are likely to remain mired in mediocrity, and ensure that even fewer Muslims receive Nobel prizes than any other comparable group in the future.

[SSridhar]

The Cabinet Mission Plan: Pakistan and India —Patient Qooinsar Raswhit
BC Inbreds still Brooding

The provisions of the Cabinet Plan were to fragment India and keep fragmenting for decades to come while having a well-defined and stable Pakistan which would possibly incrementally add the fragments of India to itself in the future. The British did not want a large, united India at all after they left.

[Baikul]

Why Muslims have fewer Nobel Prizes than Trinity College?
Onlee If there was Nobel Prize in Different way to Slaughter life , Muslims would have won all the Nobels

...........is it not worth asking why are there only 10 Muslim Nobel laureates....

Of which 10, 6 have won it for Peace- often a political statement* - and of the remaining 4, one (Abdus Salam) is not a Muslim according to the country of his birth.

Edit: And of the remaining 3, 2 won it for literature, and by the dint of their profession both would be 'secular Muslims' anyway.

So well done Ahmed Zewail, 1999 winner of the Nobel for Chemistry!

* And of that list, the only one I personally respect is Muhammad Yunus

[partha]

*facepalm*



Only mosques. Typical RAPE.

[SSridhar]

Pak Parliament Backs Struggle in Kashmir - The Hindu

Even as Pakistan Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif talks of peace with India, the National Assembly on Tuesday passed a resolution, accusing Indian troops of “unprovoked aggression” on the Line of Control and extending support to the “struggle” of Kashmiri people.

After having inflicted death on us, they are now inflicting humiliation. This is another form of militaristic and diplomatic coercion on us. TSP is always a smart purveyor of these tactics. Why do they appear smart ? Because, we never retaliate, we bumble, mumble and speak useless words, often cliched, like 'talks must be uninterrupted and uninterruptible', 'there is a peace constituency in Pakistan whose hands must be strengthened', 'we must isolate the army within Pakistan', 'half the world will go blind', 'India must help Pakistani democracy' etc only to find that time and again, the Pakistanis outsmart us. We then express our 'shock' but do nothing except to ask Pakistan throw us a lifeline through some face-saving statement.

I hate to make this comparison. They may be 'strategically stupid' and they may be 'going down the drain'. These are things one has heard repeatedly in the last 60 odd years and yet Pakistan has survived to give us very sleepless nights, hit us hard every passing day and keep us confined to a particular paradigm and a region. Look at the way Pakistanis planned the latest incident. They hit us and we made a mess of accusing the Pakistani state machinery of carrying out the act. Immediately the Pakis exploited the situation. Their High Commissioner in New Delhi made a telling statement. GoP said MFN is now delayed. Now, they pass a resolution supporting the struggle in Kashmir and accusing the IA of aggression. Their practice of statecraft is admirable.

OTOH, AK Antony's reaction in the Parliament and Salman Kurshid's comical attempt to clutch at the straws by referring a three month old Nawaz Sharif interview show how statecraft must simply not be practised.

[partha]

Salman Khurshid is an idiot. And also whoever drafted this and approved -

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 804864.cms

NEW DELHI: India on Tuesday said it was still in a sense of shock over ceasefire violations by Pakistan in Jammu & Kashmir and called for a return to peace and tranquility on the border.

"There is a sense of disappointment. We first need to get back to normal. There are other priorities," external affairs minister Salman Khurshid told reporters on the sidelines of a function here.

"There has to be peace and tranquility on the border. Ceasefire should not be violated. We are still in a sense of shock."

I banged my head to the wall reading that. Seriously, even after 47, 65, 71, Kargil, 13/12, 26/11, frequent LoC violations, countless other terror attacks if this shocks you as if this was not expected, you are a clueless idiot. Also, that statement screams of weakness. We deserve better leaders.

[Anujan]

I have a different view of Pakistan and why they are deadly. Basically the civvies don't control anything. All they can do is make promises and think up of clever statements to issue. India and the world gets fooled by that (or maybe they clutch at straws and want to get fooled). It is not any chunkian statecraft on their part.

Basically Pakistan is one big army and jihadis and they call the shots. And they hate India.

Think about this: Nawaz himself doesn't know if he would complete his term or hang from a lamp post after being deposed in a coup: which by the way is long overdue. What kind of deal, agreement or settlement can we expect from him which invariably requires a change in foreign policy and restraining the army?

[Anujan]

Something to think about: we see others the way we see ourselves. One paki enlightened worthy speculates that the latest incident is due to inter services rivalry in India and Indian army chief is hawkish against Pakistan. Let us forget the pakiness of this statement for a second. Basically Pakistan sees its army as an institution that lost half the country, dragged the country into wars it lost, manipulated elections, conducted coups, struck shady deals with west, peddled nukes, hung elected prime minister, created terrorists, killed journalists and functions opaquely.

So they think indian Army is equal equal and pursue their own agenda and foreign policy.

Indians on the other hand, see some random Bihar minister saying armys duty is to die, a senior politician saying five lives are not a big deal, a defence minister who overrules army report -- all the while the army is restrained and willing to perform the bidding of their political masters. So we think Pakistan army equal equal and they will listen to their netas and peace is just a matter of signing a few papers.

[SSridhar]

I am not basing my assessment to just this incident or even since the time the Army began to play a prime role in Pakistan's India affairs. In fact, AIML outwitted the INC or one must go to the 1904 Mussalman delegation to Viceroy Minto.

[Rudradev]

Here is the Pakis' game plan.

1. They know the US is withdrawing from Afgh next year; and they know that the US is desparate to avoid being humiliated with a chaknachoor Saigon Farewell.

2. The US is basically promising the TSPA anything it wants right now, including acqiescence to restoration of a Talib govt in Kabul, if the TSPA will only do them this one last favour of preventing a Saigon Farewell.
This means TSPA keeping its forces in strength on the Af border until the US pulls out, among other things.

3. TSPA in its tactical brilliance perceives this American desperation as a Card, perhaps the last Card they will ever have to try and get Kashmir resolved in their favour with international support.

4. The Card is to be played as follows:

A) Provoke India by military, terrorist and diplomatic means until, just to avoid further embarrassment, the GOI makes some show of diplomatic recalcitrance, or of preparing for some kind of military response in Kashmir. NOTE that TSPA knows that it is quite safe from any ACTUALLY dangerous Indian response, such as Cold Start type stuff, because MMS would never actually lift a finger to jeopardize his biss brize ambitions.

B ) When India makes ANY show of hardening its stance- eg, moving more troops to LOC to defend against incursions, or clamping down militarily against Kishtwar type herrows- Make a big noise and complain to the Americans that India is warmongering in Kashmir, so we will be forced to move 150000 troops to LOC and Eastern border from the Afgh border.

C) Tell the Americans that if they want TSPA to stay on the Afgh border to prevent a Saigon Farewell... they must lean on India with all their might, and force major concessions out of New Delhi on Kashmir, immediately.

Simble as that. Pakis know they have a very small time window to play this Card. They must do it before US leaves AfPak, and during the remaining months of India's MMS regime (which will never actually go to war against Pakistan, and is also very pliable when it comes to bending over and selling out Indian interests for Unkil's benefit.)

[Lalmohan]

fully agree rudradev, and the US knowing that india will not concede on kashmir will lean on india to not retalliate

[SSridhar]

Rudradev, yes, that is the plan. But, this 'very small time window' will extend with further developments after 2014. I am sure that China will play its card after that in Afghanistan and GB and take over the US role of keeping India at bay.

[member_20292]

I have a different view of Pakistan and why they are deadly. Basically the civvies don't control anything. All they can do is make promises and think up of clever statements to issue. India and the world gets fooled by that (or maybe they clutch at straws and want to get fooled). It is not any chunkian statecraft on their part.

Basically Pakistan is one big army and jihadis and they call the shots. And they hate India.

Think about this: Nawaz himself doesn't know if he would complete his term or hang from a lamp post after being deposed in a coup: which by the way is long overdue. What kind of deal, agreement or settlement can we expect from him which invariably requires a change in foreign policy and restraining the army?

Which is why Manmohan and Khurshid are for once, EXACTLY correct when they say, let us continue to talk and trade and WKK.

Because that is the one sure way to get the RAPES and then ultimately the Mango Abdul richer, and thus less likely to wage war and want peace more.

[habal]

Which is why Manmohan and Khurshid are for once, EXACTLY correct when they say, let us continue to talk and trade and WKK.

Because that is the one sure way to get the RAPES and then ultimately the Mango Abdul richer, and thus less likely to wage war and want peace more.

The richer they get, the more pindi channa they ingest, the more they fart, the higher the chance that they choke in a methane explosion right at home. That's what you meant . right !

[Vikas]

^ So the new expected miracle now is to make terrorist Abdul rich and in turn he will not wage Jihad against India.
Let Gazanavi loot Somnath temple couple of times and then he will not return to loot and maim some more. Hallelujah !!

[Neela]

[ Slow clap ]

[Atri]

Chankianness and earth e shastar at its best.

[habal]

relax guys. Just taking a poke a mahbhu.

[Virupaksha]

Yes, yes mahadevbhu, Osama was begging for food behind a mosque when he decided to attack towers. Hafiz Sayeed had 72 sisters and 144 brothers whom he had to feed, get them educated and have them married when he decided to attack mumbai. dawood ibrahim had both his legs cut off and was being fed from a tube, when he decided to bomb mumbai and kill more than 300 people.

[SSridhar]

It is now the turn of The Hindu to unleash a series of op-eds on why India must continue to engage in talks with Pakistan. The quintessential INC apologist and p-sec Harish Khare has written an op-ed, Hold the Vajpayee - Manmohan Line. There are so many comments but two-thirds of them subscribe to his views. They neither understand the Pakistani perfidy nor the futility of talks.

Even TSP's DT describes the Pakistani perfidy in all its g(l)ory in today's edit and yet many Indians have no idea.

We have been double dealing on virtually every issue. On the one hand we are churning out human bombs (suicide bombers) and on the other have been complicit in US drone attacks. We shook hands with India way back in 1999 and invited Prime Minister Vajpayee to Pakistan on a friendship bus. Even before the euphoria of the Lahore Declaration was fully absorbed, the Kargil adventure was staged. We allied ourselves with the US to hunt down the most wanted man of the world, Osama bin Laden, took money for our services, but were unable to trace him to the garrison city of Abottabad. We installed our favoured government of the Taliban in Afghanistan and later ostensibly helped the US against them while providing them safe havens on Pakistani soil. We want friendship with India yet spare no chance to infiltrate jihadists into Kashmir. This double dealing has now become the hallmark of our reputation, with the result that countries like the US and even our all-weather friend China have developed mistrust for us.

The homes of Christians have been burnt. Ahmadis continue to be violently targeted. Hindu girls have been converted to Islam through forced marriages with Muslims. Many Hindus have migrated to India because of this. And the state is silent.{The State is silent because it is complicit. The Deep State's leaders subscribe to the views of the radical clerics, violent jihadists and sectarian terrorists. Everybody is in it together and willingly too.}

[Peregrine]

Dawood Ibrahim desires to watch OUATIMD

At a time when Pakistan is waffling over the whereabouts of Dawood Ibrahim, a certain film publicist seems remarkably confident about his location. The said publicist contacted mediapersons late on Monday night to inform that Dawood had apparently expressed a desire to watch Ekta Kapoor's upcoming film set in the Mumbai underworld.

What's more, the publicist offered to set up a telecon with D-man himself, for anyone interested in having... you know... a little chit-chat about films and the weather we presume. In this season of outrageous publicity gimmicks where no familial relation or faith is sacrosanct, this one could well come out tops. Hope the goodfellas at our intelligence agencies are reading this. At least they'd know who to call now to get to the country's most-wanted man.

OUATIMD : Once upon a time in Mumbai Dobaara

Cheers