Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

Sanku · Post by **Sanku** » 18 Aug 2013 22:19

Sushupti wrote:I wish rest of the supporters of Loh Purush had same foresight as Mr Sinha.

How strange, what happened, why did you take a break from bad mouthing Mr Sinha?

Nevertheless a good improvement.

archan · Post by **archan** » 18 Aug 2013 22:23

muraliravi wrote: Yah yah u still worship advani after he sucked up to sonia and drank chai with sonia the biggest criminal in india

This is the level of posts you guys want to make on this thread?
I'm unsure if this thread will last much longer with such informed and profound posts being made.

kapilrdave · Post by **kapilrdave** » 18 Aug 2013 22:26

LK Advani praises Narendra Modi, says BJP will secure a record victory in 2014

Narendra Modi can breathe a sigh of relief. Senior BJP leader and party patriarch LK Advani reportedly praised the party's poll panel chief on Sunday.

Advani said that the BJP was going in the right direction under the guidance of Modi, as per reports. He is also supposed to have said that BJP will secure a record win in the 2014 General Elections.

I don't know how to react to this

Main rou ya hasuu...
Karu me kya karuu...
-------------------------------------------------------
I knew an unambiguous man who broke Babri, fearlessly brought POTA and banned SIMI. From those heights he came down to praising Jinnah, then further down to inexplicable inaction as opposition leader, then further down to opposing NM and now doing U-turn perhaps due to RSS's warning. What a fall

.

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 18 Aug 2013 22:27

Sanku wrote:
Sushupti wrote:I wish rest of the supporters of Loh Purush had same foresight as Mr Sinha.
How strange, what happened, why did you take a break from bad mouthing Mr Sinha?

Nevertheless a good improvement.

You missed the pun intended. Anyway, i am waiting for the day when Sushma Didi will be working hard to attract the attention of Modi, like Yashwant Sinha doing now.

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 18 Aug 2013 22:28

LK ji will be more than Sonia ji (position and role), if NM gets PM ship. He has that repsect in the party.. good show. when govs ban modi's password LKA can go for such places still get the job done for the party. .. but then, other govs can ban LKA for ayodhya.

btw, did MMS ban USA kerry and obama gang for wisconsin shootings on sikh community?

chaanakya · Post by **chaanakya** » 18 Aug 2013 22:32

Lilo wrote: He is unquestionably a strong and efficient administrator. Gujarat has prospered under him, and given him three successive terms of office. But he is known as a man who tolerates no opposition, cuts all colleagues to size, and rules with an iron fist. Such a person will fail miserably as prime minister of a disparate coalition that can be brought down by any of several minor partners.

reminds me of a Very famous Goongi Goodia.

Supratik · Post by **Supratik** » 18 Aug 2013 22:35

SAiyer has always been pro-INC but never ideological i.e. he has criticized the INC when required. What he says is partly true. The NDA according to polls is hovering between 150+ to 170+ but needs 200 to form a Govt. So Modi has a humongous challenge in front of him.

kapilrdave · Post by **kapilrdave** » 18 Aug 2013 22:52

In a way it is good that all MSM stay in denial mode and the opinion polls deliberately showing conservative results for BJP. In the last two elections the polls predicted more seats than they actually got. Perhaps overstating the figures incurs over confidence in the party workers AND voters. The fear of losing marginally would get maximum out of workers. In this situation voters will come out to vote aggrasively. NM is making this electioin nail biting so we should accept heavy polling. In that scenario BJP has to make sure their ALL votes are casted. Nothing works better than fear when it comes to mass mobilizing heck muslims are master of this art.

chaanakya · Post by **chaanakya** » 18 Aug 2013 23:27

For mission 272+, BJP plans to go micro, inclusive

Top BJP leaders on Sunday exhorted central and state office bearers to focus on booth-level activity and include all sections of society to ensure the party’s victory in the coming Lok Sabha polls.

The message was clear: get back to basics to defeat the Congress and aim at “Mission 272+” (to form a majority).

“All out effort should be made to take all sections of society with the party and strengthen organisation in the next 200 days,” said Gujarat chief minister Narendra Modi as he focused on his state’s efforts to include minorities in local bodies by giving them poll tickets. The idea: the BJP was including the minorities in a bottom-up manner.

BJP chief Rajnath Singh, meanwhile, disapproved of the Bihar unit naming Modi as PM candidate and said that a state unit passing such a resolution was a bit odd. Top party leaders will announce a name through proper channels, he added.

“The idea is that top leaders will announce the decision at the correct time, but the party rank and file in the states should concentrate on working from the grassroots,” the BJP leader said.

BJP patriarch LK Advani also endorsed what Modi said – referring to him two or three times in his speech – recalling how the Jana Sangh had posted a surprise victory in Delhi in 1960s because it went door-to door to reach the people.

Lilo · Post by **Lilo** » 18 Aug 2013 23:27

Harbans ji , Sanku ji , Supratik ji

Saiyer has damaged his reputation because of the crass comparison he made of Modi 's resolve to vest delhi ki gaddi with Sheila ji jawani song.
Modi is in my books a future PM if not in 2014 , then in 2016 .... Even if Saiyer is in congress camp he should write bearing in mind that modi is a legitimate challenger deserving of respect.

Also inspite of his misdirection suggesting that only RSS cadres are enthused by Modi , facts on ground don't change that whole of nation is enthused by Modi.

Bringing in the global - local debate of yumbeeya giri is also passe ... If he is frank he should also acknowledge that inspite of the local nature of elections witnessed these days Modi is capable of generating a wave in the election because he can make the most parochial person feel as an Indian again and empathize with the fate and future of our country on any national issue .

chaanakya · Post by **chaanakya** » 18 Aug 2013 23:37

And this is what Hari Sheldon and I wrote in the other thread titled RJB

http://forums.bharat-rakshak.com/viewto ... 1#p1492161

chaanakya wrote:
Hari Seldon wrote:I can only hope and pray I live to see a grand temple at RJB in this lifetime.

I ask one Q to uber secularists: When have muslims even acknowledged the atrocities on the natives of India by muslim invaders?

I have no doubt that NM with 272+ can and will change the terms of the debate such that it becomes reality. The key is the 272+part only. Rest all is maya.
+100

BJP is planning to contest on 340 seats, methinks. With hard work and with NaMo as full charge and PM nominee this might become possible but not with 3 and half friends of BJP. Since most of NDA constituents have deserted it and SS is not much liked by Bihar, it would be better if NaMo goes alone , may be with Akalis.

With 272, Game changes irreversible for others and that is what they fear most. RJB and 370 both are possible. But NaMo has not yet revealed his mind or action plan. May be at opportune time or when he collects Loha from Villages of India during his Padayatras.

This is OT here

So it is Mission 272+

ashish raval · Post by **ashish raval** » 19 Aug 2013 00:17

There are some rumours that on the day modi is declared pm candidate by BJP, baba is going to play master stroke of giving 5 acre land per family for the people of SC/ST and other weaker sections of the society. Not sure how true but if it is UPA-3 is certain.

kumarn · Post by **kumarn** » 19 Aug 2013 00:20

5 acre/family! Where will they find land? Is Pappu reading BRF and thinking of taking over Australia, or what?

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 19 Aug 2013 01:31

arrey.. that is the agreement before voting and becomes invalid after voting. simple logic na? they have to read tiny texts written below or behind somehwere in the canvas pamplets.

krisna · Post by **krisna** » 19 Aug 2013 03:07

ashish raval wrote:There are some rumours that on the day modi is declared pm candidate by BJP, baba is going to play master stroke of giving 5 acre land per family for the people of SC/ST and other weaker sections of the society. Not sure how true but if it is UPA-3 is certain.

this was tried in Gujarat by baba's congis but recd drubbing there.
Infact the media were saying this was a masterstroke like ysr did to CBN.

yawn.

VikramS · Post by **VikramS** » 19 Aug 2013 03:47

kumarn wrote:5 acre/family! Where will they find land? Is Pappu reading BRF and thinking of taking over Australia, or what?

Land is also a state of mind.

Hari Seldon · Post by **Hari Seldon** » 19 Aug 2013 05:46

Modi says if 25% Muslims in Gujarat can vote for BJP why not the rest of India

Of course, the cong reacts with grace, class and poise etc to this statement of intent from NM...

Reacting to Modi's claim to woo minority voters, Congress leader Rashid Alvi said that only two Muslim voters in the whole country may cast their votes in Narendra Modi's favour. One belongs to Bihar (Shahnawaz Hussain) and another to Allahabad (Mukhtar Naqvi)

Meanwhile, speaking of grace, poise etc., sushmaji's body language belies her great confidence at not getting upstaged by this regional upstart from the boondocks...

Meanwhile, in furthering his exclusivist, elitist and divisive and polarizing agenda, NM pulls out yet another ace from his sleeve...

In an interesting observation, Modi said there are different segments within the Muslims like Shias, Sunnis, Bohras and others and they can be reached out with promises of redressing their specific grievances.

Modi and Leader of the Opposition in Lok Sabha Sushma Swaraj underscored the need for strengthening the party at the booth level.

BJP spokesperson Shahnawaz Hussain later told reporters that "One booth, ten youth" would be the aim of the party.

niran · Post by **niran** » 19 Aug 2013 06:39

Sushupti wrote:I wish rest of the supporters of Loh Purush had same foresight as Mr Sinha.

he is shushupt agint, will carry out guerrilla attacks loike the "Vadra Gate" attack last week
mind you since NaMo pointed the flaws in food security bill the kangrez are themselves loath to let it pass
hence their very onw MPs goes into the well and shouts few slogans a huge turbaned mans walks and whispers something in the speaker's ear lo and behold "House is adjourned"

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 19 Aug 2013 07:10

kumarn wrote:5 acre/family! Where will they find land? Is Pappu reading BRF and thinking of taking over Australia, or what?

babaji will have to attack tibet & TSP and take it over to get so much land. masterstroke indeed - if he can pull it off , even brf would vote for his govt!

devesh · Post by **devesh** » 19 Aug 2013 07:11

which baba? ramdev?

Arjun · Post by **Arjun** » 19 Aug 2013 07:15

Sanku wrote:The fact of the matter however is, that SA Iyer, is not talking hot air. There is resistance to Modi amongst others. He DOES NOT have ABV like authority and figure. Heck ABV had to be pulled out by BJP because Advani the man primarily responsible for the work that culminated in 1998 was not acceptable.

Lets accept the reality as it is folks, even if unpalatable. These are REAL challenges before NaMo. Why pretend otherwise?

This however does not mean that like ABV/Advani, NaMo should not, and will not spare a single possible effort in making sure BJP wins, and hopefully a PM which the BJP party wants and as by rights should be.

I disagree. SA Iyer is worth listening to when it comes to economics - but when it comes to politics he is much an idiot as his brother.

His entire article boils down to two sentences: (1) Opinion polls show NDA in front of UPA but not enough yet to form a government & (2) Modi is not acceptable to other potential leaders to form NDA+.

While both have some kernel of truth in them - there are a series of assumptions built into both statements that are obvious to any intelligent person and the counter-arguments are also quite obvious to the intelligent. For SA Iyer to arrive at a definitive stance like he did in his article, rather than to a nuanced conclusion like any intelligent person would from the data - shows the working of an agenda-driven and / or intellectually deficient mind.

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 19 Aug 2013 07:36

Cong decides to put Rahul in the front, facade intact

To this end, plans are afoot to organise public meetings and rallies by Rahul across the country, starting with around 25 state capitals.

http://www.indianexpress.com/news/cong- ... t/1157023/

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 19 Aug 2013 07:37

devesh wrote:which baba? ramdev?

amul/farex baba.

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 19 Aug 2013 08:36

Kushwaha backs Narendra Modi's prime ministerial candidature

Jehanabad (Bihar): Upendra Kushwaha, who quit the JD(U) to launch his own political party in March, on Sunday praised Gujarat Chief Minister Narendra Modi saying his party would support BJP to ensure defeat of the UPA in the next general elections.

"We will work together with the BJP if it decides to contest the next general elections under the Gujarat Chief Minister's leadership and wrest power from the UPA," he said.

"Coming from the Extremely Backward Caste background that he does, Modi is the right choice for the prime minister's post given his credentials as an administrator," Kushwaha told reporters here during his party's conclave.

Asked whether his Rashtriya Lok Samata Party (RSLP) would merge with the BJP or enter into pre-poll alliance in Bihar, Kushwaha refused to divulge his cards saying he would decide after consulting party colleagues and BJP leadership.

On Bihar Chief Minister Nitish Kumar's antipathy towards Modi, the RSLP president said he "harbours ill will towards any EBC leader who dreams big".

This is the first time that Kushwaha, an ex-Rajya Sabha MP and known Nitish-baiter, announced that he would back Modi's prime ministerial candidature.

The RLSP's support to Modi came a day after Bihar BJP adopted a resolution urging the party's central leadership to declare Modi as its prime ministerial candidate without delay.

Nitish Kumar severed ties with the BJP-led NDA after Modi's elevation as the poll panel chief two months ago.

http://zeenews.india.com/news/nation/ku ... 69955.html

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 19 Aug 2013 09:03

Sonia Gandhi is a problem for governance, says Mark Tully

http://indiatoday.intoday.in/story/mark ... 60848.html

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 19 Aug 2013 09:07

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 19 Aug 2013 09:13

Very long article.

Modi’s ‘allied worldview’: Realpolitik or Gandhian folly?

by Radha Rajan

Is the BJP merely replacing Advani with Modi and will Modi replace good governance with ideology? Hindu nationalists cannot jump on the Modi bandwagon without answers to this fundamental question.

Modi made laudatory reference in Hyderabad to Jayalalithaa’s good governance model which, Modi told Hyderabadis, is worthy of emulation. We do not know which individual from Tamil Nadu fed Modi with selective information about Jayalalithaa’s good governance, but because Modi has held out his hand to Jayalalithaa hoping their personal friendship will lead to political alliance in 2014, other lesser-known facts about her good governance need to be placed in public domain; just three facts which raise serious doubts not only about what Modi-led BJP will stand for in 2014 if the BJP continues to woo the likes of Jayalalithaa and Chandrababu Naidu (and horror of horrors, Mamata Banerjee?) but also about Jayalalithaa as a political ally of the BJP were Modi to assert Hindu nationalism over good governance.

Three less-known facts about recent events in Tamil Nadu which Modi should know because they best exemplify Jayalalithaa’s Politics of Minority-ism:

1. Tamil Nadu government and Innocence of Muslims

2. Tamil Nadu government announcing memorials for “freedom fighters” Tipu Sultan and Hyder Ali

3. Tamil Nadu government embarrassing the Director-General of Police in the exact same manner and for exact same reasons as the UPA government embarrassed the Army Chief after the Poonch ambush

http://www.vijayvaani.com/ArticleDisplay.aspx?aid=2914

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 19 Aug 2013 09:16

Sushupti wrote:Sonia Gandhi is a problem for governance, says Mark Tully

http://indiatoday.intoday.in/story/mark ... 60848.html

Surprisingly, for an Englishman who was knighted by the British monarchy in 2002, Tully was less than enthusiastic about the growing status of English as an aspirational language of the Indian middle class. "Learning English is an economic asset," he said. "But the problem is its impact on regional languages. English is a mark of India, not Bharat," he added.The response prompted Thapar to ask Tully the reason behind his fascination for India. "It will be an absurd proposition if I try to become more Indian than an Indian," Tully said. "My ancestors have all lived in India. Having lived in India, I too have started to believe in Karma," he replied philosophically

disha · Post by **disha** » 19 Aug 2013 09:19

Sanku wrote: ... Given that Sadhu Yadav is pure poison -- why did Modi meet him and open himself up to such a self goal? ...

Thinking about it when travelling., two things come to mind:

1. Diamond cuts diamond
2. Booths

I explained item #1 to another person not enamored by Modi and immediately his comment was "Crooks cut crooks". So if one has to stop RJD/SP/JD(U)/Congress goondas from "capturing booths" or intimidating voters., who would you like to have on your side?

<personal_plug>
Do not tell me that booth capturing or voter intimidating does not happen "nowadayas"., have been witness (and to a great degree been a victim) to that (and by the way, the goondas are smart statisticians!!!, have to give it to them)
<end_personal_plug>

The question is why the media is silent and by extension RJD, JDU, Cong(I)? Do not want to reveal their hands too early?

To people who are "morally scoffed"., I have found business dirtier than politics!

disha · Post by **disha** » 19 Aug 2013 09:20

Singha wrote:
devesh wrote:which baba? ramdev?
amul/farex baba.

Let us go with FAREX baba. Amul is a good ol' Indian brand.

Arjun · Post by **Arjun** » 19 Aug 2013 09:26

Sushupti wrote:Sonia Gandhi is a problem for governance, says Mark Tully

http://indiatoday.intoday.in/story/mark ... 60848.html

Sad that many of the prominent voices speaking out strongly against dynastic politics in India are Western. Seriously - this kind of tawdry vaudeville over 5 generations would NEVER have been tolerated in any Western democracy...

The fact that there is so little protest from Indians does point to a serious cultural defect. Thankfully this infection seems to be more severe in the case of the burkhawalas and left liberals, than the Indian right. Probably linked to low-IQ of the aforementioned groups.

disha · Post by **disha** » 19 Aug 2013 09:27

muraliravi wrote:Yah yah u still worship advani after he sucked up to sonia and drank chai with sonia the biggest criminal in india

Just a wisecrack

:

While sipping Chai were they talking of THE CHAIWALA?

disha · Post by **disha** » 19 Aug 2013 09:30

SwamyG wrote:NaMo will attract attention from good, bad and the ugly. NaMo should keep company with the good and shun the other two.

Are all ugly people bad?

Then I am bad at core - I was called ugly right from when I remember - LKG !!!!

disha · Post by **disha** » 19 Aug 2013 09:34

SaiK wrote:... btw, did MMS ban USA kerry and obama gang for wisconsin shootings on sikh community?....

Quite a saikological gem! Full marks to you SaikJi!!

disha · Post by **disha** » 19 Aug 2013 09:41

Arjun wrote:
Sushupti wrote:Sonia Gandhi is a problem for governance, says Mark Tully

http://indiatoday.intoday.in/story/mark ... 60848.html
Sad that many of the prominent voices speaking out strongly against dynastic politics in India are Western. Seriously - this kind of tawdry vaudeville over 5 generations would NEVER have been tolerated in any Western democracy...

Wrong on both counts.

Journos and (in general) public are deferential to "whites" does not mean desis are dumbos who have not raised this earlier. And "western democracy" is either American democracy or French "libertainism"., and look no further than "Jeb Bush".

Arjun · Post by **Arjun** » 19 Aug 2013 09:47

disha wrote:Wrong on both counts.

Journos and (in general) public are deferential to "whites" does not mean desis are dumbos who have not raised this earlier. And "western democracy" is either American democracy or French "libertainism"., and look no further than "Jeb Bush".

I have argued against both of your objections so many times on this forum, that I have lost count.

Waste of my time, really - so will not get into it again.

Bottomline - there is a cultural defect in India. And it seems to be primarily a 'burkhawala' defect - which needs to be set right.

disha · Post by **disha** » 19 Aug 2013 09:55

Arjunji, simple - if your arguments had logic., it would have won me over!!

At the end of the day, we mortal carry the weight of our own biases.

Arjun · Post by **Arjun** » 19 Aug 2013 10:03

disha wrote:Arjunji, simple - if your arguments had logic., it would have won me over!!

Don't doubt it...and I am simply too tired to detail out my logic for the 25th time or thereabouts.

Jeb Bush is not a valid comparison at all, considering the magnitude of the issue in India. Perhaps the search function can bring up some of my earlier posts on this topic, over several years.

Sanku · Post by **Sanku** » 19 Aug 2013 11:27

Arjun wrote: While both have some kernel of truth in them - there are a series of assumptions built into both statements that are obvious to any intelligent person and the counter-arguments are also quite obvious to the intelligent.

I agree with the above, however

For SA Iyer to arrive at a definitive stance like he did in his article, rather than to a nuanced conclusion like any intelligent person would from the data - shows the working of an agenda-driven and / or intellectually deficient mind.

There is also a third option, that he has examined all the probabilities and is now taking a bet on the future -- he may be wrong or right, but one is entitled to take a bet. He knows what the stakes are, his credibility will be impacted if NaMo is PM, there will be many quite willing to use this to rub his nose into mud, which they should.

However, just to remind ourselves, the bet is not closed. It is NOT a foregone conclusion. Let us call him an idiot, BY making sure that he has been proved wrong, that would be far more satisfactory I think.

Arjun · Post by **Arjun** » 19 Aug 2013 11:48

Sanku wrote:There is also a third option, that he has examined all the probabilities and is now taking a bet on the future -- he may be wrong or right, but one is entitled to take a bet. He knows what the stakes are, his credibility will be impacted if NaMo is PM, there will be many quite willing to use this to rub his nose into mud, which they should.

However, just to remind ourselves, the bet is not closed. It is NOT a foregone conclusion. Let us call him an idiot, BY making sure that he has been proved wrong, that would be far more satisfactory I think.

Maybe he is taking a bet. But I would question the logic /agenda of anyone taking a bet so early in the game when elections have not even been announced.

There are two parts to the bet- (1) what will current NDA close in # of seats, and (2) whether Modi will become PM.

(2) obviously depends on (1) and we can all worry about that later. Let SA Iyer first take an explicit bet on (1) and say that irrespective of all moves over the next few months, current NDA tally will be in the ballpark he has mentioned.