Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

Post by SSridhar »

Foreign Policy and Army Doctrinal Mythology or Reality ? - Shahryar Khan in DT
Presently, the foreign policy issues of Pakistan include Afghanistan, drones, internationalisation of the Balochistan crisis, nuclear proliferation and the global war on terror.


An astounding articulation by a former Pakistani foreign secretary and present Special Adviser on India to Nawaz Sharif !! No India at all as the Centre of Gravity !!!

Obviously something seriously cooking. Whatever that is, it is not to India's comfort.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

Post by Prem »

The Pakistan IEDddodology: History of a grand concoction

Yeh NC Inbreds Abhi Tukk Ro Rahe Hain
Pakistan had come into being in 1947 on the back of what its founders called the ‘Two Nation Theory.’ The Theory was culled from the 19th Century writings of modernist Muslim reformists in India who, after the collapse of the Muslim Empire in South Asia, began to explain the region’s Muslims as a separate political, cultural, and, of course, religious entity (especially compared to the Hindu majority of India). This scholarly nuance, inspired by the ideas of the nation-state introduced by the British Colonialists, gradually evolved into becoming a pursuit to prepare a well-educated and resourceful Muslim middle-class in the region.
Eventually, with the help from sections of the Muslim landed elite in India, the emerging Muslim middle-classes turned the idea into a movement for a separate Muslim homeland comprised of those areas where the Muslims were in a majority in India. However, when the country’s founding father, Muhammad Ali Jinnah - a western-educated lawyer and head of the All India Muslim League (AIML) - navigated the Movement towards finally reaching its main goal of carving out a separate Muslim homeland in South Asia, he was soon faced with an awkward fact: There were more Muslims in India than there were in the newly created Muslim-majority country of Pakistan.Jinnah was conscious of this fact when he delivered his first major address to the country’s Constituent Assembly on August 11, 1947.Though during the Movement some factions of his party had tweaked the Two Nation Theory to also mean that the Muslims of India desired an Islamic State, Jinnah was quick to see the contradiction in this claim, simply because more Muslims had either been left behind in India or refused to migrate to Pakistan. Islam during the Movement was largely used as an ethnic card to furnish and flex the separate nationhood claims of the Muslims. It was never used as a theological roadmap to construct an Islamic State in South Asia. In his August 11 speech, Jinnah clearly declared that in Pakistan the state will have nothing to do with matters of the faith and Pakistan was supposed to become a democratic Muslim-majority nation state.He went on to add: ‘ … you will find that in course of time (in Pakistan) Hindus would cease to be Hindus and Muslims would cease to be Muslims; not in the religious sense, because that is the personal faith of each individual, but in the political sense as citizens of the State.’Some extraordinary circumstances (World War II, the receding of British Colonialism and rising tensions between the Muslim, Hindu and Sikh communities in India) had combined to hand Jinnah a Muslim-majority country that had fewer Muslims compared to those who stayed behind in India.Within this Muslim community were various sects and sub-sects with their own understanding and interpretations of the faith. Then, the country also had multiple ethnicities, cultures and languages - some of them being more ancient than Islam itself! Keeping all this in mind, Jinnah’s speech made good sense and exhibited a remarkable understanding of the complexities that his new country had inherited. But it seems many of his close colleagues were still in the Movement mode. A number of League members thought that with his August 11 speech, Jinnah was being a bit too hasty in discarding the Islamic factor from the new equation and opting to explain the new country as a multi-ethnic and multi-cultural Muslim-majority state.

As the Bengalis went on strike and held widespread demonstrations protesting the contradiction in the government’s decision, Jinnah ordered that the Bengali writing system (close to Vedic and classic Sanskrit) be replaced with Arabic script and even with the Roman script. It was as if the government was suggesting that Bengali could not be adopted as the national language because its writing system looked too much like that of Hindi. Jinnah’s desperate attempt to replace the Bengali writing system was vehemently challenged by Bengali intellectuals and politicians and he had to beat a hasty retreat on the issue. But Urdu did become the national language. The Bengalis’ resentment found immediate sympathisers within other non-Punjabi and non-Mohajir ethnic communities.
Sindhi, Pushtun (and eventually Baloch) intelligentsia were alarmed by the way the state and government had treated the Bengalis’ demands, and foresaw the same happening to their own languages and ethnic cultures. But instead of anticipating future fissures in the country on ethnic lines, the League (after Jinnah’s death), became even more myopic and wallowed in its self-serving naivety about using Islam as a slogan that was supposed to dissolve ethnic nationalism among the Muslim majority of the country. The slogan might have worked to haphazardly pull together the Muslim minority of various ethnicities and cultural leanings of India during the Pakistan Movement; but there was no guarantee that it would be able to do the same in a country where this minority had become an overwhelming majority. Ideally a system and constitution advocating direct democracy should have been worked out to facilitate and streamline the political and cultural participation of all ethnicities in the nation-building process. But this wasn’t done. Political and cultural expressions of ethnicity were immediately treated as being threats to the unity of the nation and the answer to this threat, ironically, came from elements, most of who were once staunchly against the creation of Pakistan. Prime Minister Liaquat Ali Khan, though steeped in the progressive Modernist Muslim tradition of Sir Syed’s ‘Aligarh School of Thought,’ was, however, willing to continue to use Islam selectively to maintain the cherished unity of the Muslim majority of Pakistan. Being a Mohajir, he wasn’t the ‘son of the soil.’ Meaning, unlike most Sindhis, Pushtuns, Punjabi, Baloch and Bengalis, he was born outside of what eventually became Pakistan and didn’t have a large constituency based on language and ethnicity in the country. So it is understandable why the notion of Islam being a unifying factor was important to him.But the question was what kind of Islam?



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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

Post by sanjaykumar »

So it is understandable why the notion of Islam being a unifying factor was important to him.But the question was what kind of Islam?


That question is being answered in Orangi township, Khyber-Pakthunkwa, Rawalpindi to every one's satisfaction.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

Post by member_22872 »

India, Pak Special Representatives to conduct back-channel talks in Dubai today
Former Pakistan foreign secretary Shahryar Khan and former Indian diplomat Satinder K. Lambah are reported to be meeting in Dubai today to ease tensions between the two countries and firm up a planned meeting between Prime Ministers Nawaz Sharif and Manmohan Singh leaders in New York next month.
According to the paper, the Nawaz Sharif government has been keen from the outset to remain engaged with India and to move forward through constructive and result-oriented dialogue.
Why Dubai?
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

Post by ramana »

Dawood Ibrahim will host them both.

Doobai is like the space port cafe in Star Wars where all the dregs hangout.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

Post by anupmisra »

ramana wrote:Dawood Ibrahim will host them both.

Doobai is like the space port cafe in Star Wars where all the dregs hangout and double cross each other without conscience.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

Post by anupmisra »

Bach gaya sala
Sheikh Rasheed escapes unhurt in firing attack
According to reports, unknown gunmen targeted the veteran politician near Zero Point in the federal capital
The scum bag in his previous avatar
Yasin Malik meets Sheikh Rashid Ahmed
JKLF Yasin Malik met chief of Awami Muslim League (AML) Sheikh Rashid Ahmed... He appreciated the effort of Sheikh Rashid Ahmed who took great interest to introduce the Kashmir issue on international level in the capacity of former Federal Minister
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Who's the greenest of 'em all ?

Post by SSridhar »

anupmisra wrote:Bach gaya sala
Sheikh Rasheed escapes unhurt in firing attack
According to reports, unknown gunmen targeted the veteran politician near Zero Point in the federal capital
So, one after another, those who thought of themselves as the greenest are being shown by the 'greener than the greenest' that they are not so. The list is impressive. Fazlur rehman, Qazi Hussain, Munawar Hasan, Sheikh Rashid Ahmed et al. The rogue gallery is being built.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

Post by SSridhar »

Jhujar wrote:The Pakistan IEDddodology: History of a grand concoction

Yeh NC Inbreds Abhi Tukk Ro Rahe Hain
Jinnah ordered that the Bengali writing system (close to Vedic and classic Sanskrit) be replaced with Arabic script and even with the Roman script. It was as if the government was suggesting that Bengali could not be adopted as the national language because its writing system looked too much like that of Hindi. Jinnah’s desperate attempt to replace the Bengali writing system was vehemently challenged by Bengali intellectuals and politicians and he had to beat a hasty retreat on the issue. But Urdu did become the national language. The Bengalis’ resentment found immediate sympathisers within other non-Punjabi and non-Mohajir ethnic communities.
Sindhi, Pushtun (and eventually Baloch) intelligentsia were alarmed by the way the state and government had treated the Bengalis’ demands, and foresaw the same happening to their own languages and ethnic cultures.
TSP is a bundle of contradictions because it always wanted to fit its square peg of the exclusivist new religious identity in the inclusivist round hole of millennia of history, culture, heritage, legacy and common ancestry.

Within two months after the death of Quaid-e-Azam Jinnah, the national anthem that he had asked a Hindu Urdu litterateur, Jagannath Azad, to pen, was discarded as not being sufficiently patriotic and passionate and a new one was chosen in the 50s. Pakistan was therefore without a national anthem for a couple of years. The new anthem by Hafeez Jalandhari was also Persianised lyrics which for some strange reason was more acceptable than the one written in the national language, Urdu. After all, Urdu was forcibly thrust on reluctant people of the Sind and East Pakistan and yet Persinaised lyrics of the National Anthem was chosen.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

Post by Gus »

shaik rasheed - isn't he the guy who boasted of running a safehouse for jihadis on their way to kashmir?
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

Post by Joseph »

Gus wrote:shaik rasheed - isn't he the guy who boasted of running a safehouse for jihadis on their way to kashmir?
He does have quite a background.

Pakistan's ex-minister detained in US airport used to train J&K jihadis
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

Post by SSridhar »

Joseph wrote:
Gus wrote:shaik rasheed - isn't he the guy who boasted of running a safehouse for jihadis on their way to kashmir?
He does have quite a background.

Pakistan's ex-minister detained in US airport used to train J&K jihadis
But, you see, all that 'green' effort has come to a nought. He came under the cross hairs of the bad Taliban as early as c. 2008 when GoP issued a threat warning.

Gus, it was Yaseen 'Mahatma' Malik who made the statement that Sheikh Rashid Ahmed set up a camp. Later, it was revealed that the ISI in c. 1989 had handed over a hundred acres at Tarnol, near Islamabad. It was BB as the PM then. In addition, Sheikh Rashid's mansion in Rawalpindi was used as a 'guest house' and for 'arms storage' as well during the period 1987-1992 and it was guarded by “men of TSPA in civies”.

Sheikh Rashid Ahmed has also been famously demanding that the Britis return the Kohinoor to TSP because it belonged to a Mughal emperor and TSP is the legatee.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

Post by Vikas »

^Isn't he the one who goes by the name 'Tuli" in paki press circles
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

Post by Gagan »

Shiekh Rashid is NOT green.

The guy is unmarried, he drinks booze, prolly has a bevy of mujra gals to keep him company.

He was cashing in on the Kashmir movement that the ISI was running, by opening his farmhouses for the JKLF to do Weapons training in, probably making money off the ISI purse. Also that might have brushed up his credentials as a neta - the whole society there was going crazy in those days about 'liberating kashmir'.

On a side note: The whole pakistani society back in the 90s, thought that if they shouted at the top of their voices in the gallis of isloo/pindi/lawhore/karachi etc etc, kashmir would be free. As usual they had / have no inkling about the might of the indian armed forces.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

Post by pankajs »

Pakistan Supreme Court bars President Asif Ali Zardari from leaving Pakistan over Abbottabad court hearing
Pakistan’s Supreme Court (SC) has issued a notice to the Pakistan Muslim League-Nawaz (PML-N) government to bar President Asif Ali Zardari from leaving the country to enable him to be present for a court hearing on the Abbottabad Commission revelations.

The apex court has barred Zardari from leaving the country over the investigations to be held on the Abbottabad operation conducted by the United States on May 2, 2011 to kill Al Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden, the Express Tribune reports.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

Post by SSridhar »

pankajs wrote:Pakistan Supreme Court bars President Asif Ali Zardari from leaving Pakistan over Abbottabad court hearing
Pakistan’s Supreme Court (SC) has issued a notice to the Pakistan Muslim League-Nawaz (PML-N) government to bar President Asif Ali Zardari from leaving the country to enable him to be present for a court hearing on the Abbottabad Commission revelations.

The apex court has barred Zardari from leaving the country over the investigations to be held on the Abbottabad operation conducted by the United States on May 2, 2011 to kill Al Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden, the Express Tribune reports.
Oh. . . Zardari made a mistake. He should not have waited till the end. He knew it was coming in some form or another. One by one, other things will be raked up as immunity disappears. However, the SC may not have any authority to prevent the President from leaving the country. It is only trying to act with alacrity. It seems to have exceeded its brief here. If, however, PML-N takes the bait, then Zardari is going to be confined to his country for some time to come.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

Post by pankajs »

Perhaps he can make one last "Official" trip to Dubai/London/DC and fall sick just before his return date? Can Official trips within his term be denied? The wheels have certainly been set in motion to trap him.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

Post by SSridhar »

The SC is essentially asking GoP to put the highest constitutional authority of the country (even by the various Constitutions that TSP is famous for) on Exit Control List like a common criminal. This is the same CJP who took a new oath of office under the Provisional Constitution Order of Musharraf. The same guy who sat on a bench that inquired the criminal case against his own son.

I expect a 'NO' from Nawaz Sharif.

There is never a dull moment in TSP cuckooland.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

Post by Lalmohan »

maybe mushy and duspercenti are going to hang from the same lampost?
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

Post by pankajs »

Didn’t rule out report regarding Muhajir Republican Army: Nisar
The report presented by the attorney general mentioned a new group in Karachi, the Muhajir Republican Army. The report called for action against members of the group when they were identified.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

Post by pankajs »

Zahid Khan calls for court martial of intelligence officials if involved in extortion
A report published in Jang newspaper by Agha Khaild revealed that some officers and an activist of the naval intelligence had formed a gang which was kidnapping traders and industrialists and receiving a huge ransom. The kidnapped persons used to be kept in the headquarters of naval intelligence, adjacent to the Chief Minister’s house in Karachi.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

Post by Lalmohan »

re tspn involvement in extortion - reminds me, did we hear any more about the identities and affiliations of the herrows who raided pns mehrban? (er... i mean mehran!)
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

Post by SSridhar »

Regarding extortion, kidnapping and ransom in Karachi, these have been the modus operandi of the Taliban there for many years now. Though Karachi is a lawless place where such things have taken place before, the Taliban took over this mode of making money in a big way since 2007 and they are the single most dominant player doing in it in a methodical manner. If naval personnel are now accused of the same crime, then they may very well be part of the same ring. This also reinforces the insider involvement in the PNS Mehran case.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

Post by pankajs »

While there are always bad apples what is surprising is that the headquarters of naval intelligence was used to keep the kidnapped persons. How does one explain that? I can understand one of their safe houses being used, away from the prying eyes of higher-ups.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

Post by SSridhar »

pankajs wrote:While there are always bad apples what is surprising is that the headquarters of naval intelligence was used to keep the kidnapped persons. How does one explain that? I can understand one of their safe houses being used, away from the prying eyes of higher-ups.
Naval Intel HQ is the best 'safe house' just like GHQ is at Pindi or the other HQ at Aabpara.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

Post by habal »

SSridhar wrote:Pakistan Supreme Court bars President Asif Ali Zardari from leaving Pakistan over Abbottabad court hearing
Pakistan’s Supreme Court (SC) has issued a notice to the Pakistan Muslim League-Nawaz (PML-N) government to bar President Asif Ali Zardari from leaving the country to enable him to be present for a court hearing on the Abbottabad Commission revelations.

The apex court has barred Zardari from leaving the country over the investigations to be held on the Abbottabad operation conducted by the United States on May 2, 2011 to kill Al Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden, the Express Tribune reports.
Oh. . . Zardari made a mistake. He should not have waited till the end. He knew it was coming in some form or another. One by one, other things will be raked up as immunity disappears. However, the SC may not have any authority to prevent the President from leaving the country. It is only trying to act with alacrity. It seems to have exceeded its brief here. If, however, PML-N takes the bait, then Zardari is going to be confined to his country for some time to come.
Kiyani is around till November, & Zardari's term ends in September. I think he's safe.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

Post by pankajs »

Pakistan bans mobile phone packages on ‘moral grounds’
Pakistan’s telecom regulator has directed all companies to discontinue voice and text chat packages to stop youth from indulging in activities “contrary to the moral values of society.”
They should ban the phone and the TV and the electricity ..
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

Post by vishvak »

[=>quote="pankajs"]
Zahid Khan calls for court martial of intelligence officials if involved in extortion
A report published in Jang newspaper by Agha Khaild revealed that some officers and an activist :lol: of the naval intelligence had formed a gang which was kidnapping traders and industrialists and receiving a huge ransom. The kidnapped persons used to be kept in the headquarters of naval intelligence, adjacent to the Chief Minister’s house in Karachi.
[<=/quote]

piousness of pukis - you are either with extortionists or against - never ending and all encompassing! Naval headquarters next to house of Chief Minister is the extortion center! :lol:
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

Post by arun »

The Islamic Republic of Pakistan demonstrates how to ooze Mohammadden piety. Telecom regulator, the Pakistan Telecommunication Authority (PTA), bans chat and SMS packages offered by cellular operators as it is deemed to be “contrary to moral values of society” :lol: :

PTA bans all chat packages on cell phones, day or night
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

Post by Anujan »

anupmisra wrote:Bach gaya sala
Sheikh Rasheed escapes unhurt in firing attack
According to reports, unknown gunmen targeted the veteran politician near Zero Point in the federal capital
The scum bag in his previous avatar
Yasin Malik meets Sheikh Rashid Ahmed
JKLF Yasin Malik met chief of Awami Muslim League (AML) Sheikh Rashid Ahmed... He appreciated the effort of Sheikh Rashid Ahmed who took great interest to introduce the Kashmir issue on international level in the capacity of former Federal Minister
He once boasted of running a terror training camp in his house.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

Post by SBajwa »

nPakistan failed to qualify for the world cup at Hague next year. India qualifies defeating Malaysia 2-0

http://www.rediff.com/sports/report/hoc ... 130830.htm

Finals against S. Korea tomorrow.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

Post by sadhana »

Re Sheikh Rashid, saw this tweet some days ago but haven't searched for the interview yet:
Smita Prakash ‏@smitaprakash 28 Aug
@filter_c see Sheikh Rashid intvw : threatens birds won't sing flowers won't bloom for a 100 years in India.
This sort of loose talk(which might not be loose in the speaker's mind) shows the strength of conflict economy in Rawalpindi/Islamabad IMO.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

Post by Mahesh_R »

SSridhar wrote: I expect a 'NO' from Nawaz Sharif..
SSji,

Any reason why NS will say NO ?
Is it to control the judiciary ?

I am sure he does not want to meet the same fate of grooper in one case or the other.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

Post by Mahesh_R »

habal wrote: Kiyani is around till November, & Zardari's term ends in September. I think he's safe.
Habalji,

I haven't seen Kayani trying to save anyone be it grooper or Mush
Why would he do this time around ?
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

Post by member_23658 »

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QtXFbyUvgWI
this is seriously for those who have way too much time to kill. i watch mubashar lucman when i am a bit low, the sheer stupidity of the joker makes me feel better about being myself. i am posting this particular talk show here purely because of the amazing amount of mind numbing moronic arguments that have been compressed into a 30 minute show, with all the paki sense of righteousness and entitlement. the issue is on sood (interest) being haram in islam and how pakis (being the bestest of all the momeens,) should fight this evil.
there is a good amount of piskology lessons to be gleaned for those who would want to. one of the beards on the show goes on to say something like the whole developed world is moving towards lower interest rates because they have found that interest is killing their economies. and goes on to substantiate it with examples of japan and europe.
on a side note, one thing i have to clarify : at arround 11.40 one of the beards gives an example of Raja Ambhi giving money or horses to babur to fight battles. the only ambhi i know is the king of the jhelum region who sided with alexander against puru, from an entirely different era. mubashar interjects with a smirk and a note for the 'hindu' viewers that the beard is referring to raja ambedkar :O. does anyone have any sort of rational explanation for WTF the jokers are talking about?
i realise this post may not be something that most of the ppl on this thread are interested in, so apologies in advance for the benis like post, its just that i find certain talk shows that showcase pakiness interesting and wanted to share what for me is a special one!
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

Post by vishvak »

Just to note, Amol.D hi you are not alone in this : ) I am not able to understand some coarse things of baki life like todays ban on mobile package schemes, or waater kit and so on and so forth. Alas, some things are never to go through.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

Post by Vipul »

Pakis are a special lot. Mubashir Luqman goes about on a messiah creating(for himself) image who cares for the common man and is against corruption and wants justice to prevail when just a year ago he was exposed live on TV trying to protect a tainted businessmen by doing planted interview through coached question/answers. He went off air for a short period and was back after a short while on another channel as if nothing had happened.

Here is the link:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WT14P6jySLk
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

Post by SSridhar »

Mahesh_R wrote:Any reason why NS will say NO ?
Is it to control the judiciary ?

I am sure he does not want to meet the same fate of grooper in one case or the other.
After his return from exile, Nawaz Sharif has shown some maturity in local politics. He entered into a deal with the PPP on democratic charter, largely stuck to it though PPP ditched him, supported the 18th amendment to the Constitution as an opposition party, has gone smoothly with Zardari as President in the last few months etc. Compared to the days when his supporters drove out CJP Justice Shah literally and physically from the premises of the SC, his behaviour nowadays is vastly mature. I expect him therefore to realize that the SC cannot take unconstitutional administrative actions that can also rebound on himself later even though it may look attractive for him to go along with the SC now to decimate the PPP or the Bhutto clan.
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