Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - Aug 21, 2013

[Brad Goodman]

Number of polio cases reach 82 in Pakistan this year

Subhanallah and we have 2 more days before 2013 retires

[Brad Goodman]

I have army's backing over treason 'vendetta', Musharraf says
This is what Gola says..

"I would say the whole army is upset. I have led the army from the front," Musharraf told reporters at his farmhouse on the edge of Islamabad.

"I have no doubt with the feedback that I received that the whole army is ... totally with me on this issue."

This is what it really means

Analyst Talat Masood, himself a retired general, voiced scepticism about Musharraf's claims of widespread support among the military.

typical paki bravado. Now I am getting hang of it

Analyst Talat Masood, himself a retired general, voiced scepticism about Musharraf's claims of widespread support among the military.

He said that while some elements might be sympathetic, to say that the whole army was behind Musharraf was an "inflated assessment".

[Peregrine]

SHRIEKING BEMARI

Cheers

[vishvak]

"becoming superpower by stealing .. water" - paki rhetoric ®™

There seem to be no connect in paki mind for relationship between water, river, dam, power plant, electricity, power grid- to begin with. And there is overt claim of superpower ban rahaa he when the fact is Indians are doing all this needed work at each step.

[SSridhar]

^ There was no planning by the All India Muslim League on how to manage Pakistan once that dream was achieved. Some people wanted it for personal reasons, the British obliged them and Pakistan just happened. The barrister carved out a moth-eaten piece of real estate from the ancestral property to settle personal scores without really bothering to manage the piece of real estate. Once the goal was achieved, he lost interest and neither he had a plan for governance nor he had groomed anyone to succeed him with a plan. The only blinding thought in their mind was to somehow destroy India and that is the only policy on which that God-forsaken country has been running.

[RCase]

Zahil Hamid on Kishanganga verdict. An a$$fart debate.

"hamarahi paani chori karke bharat superpower banta dikhai de raha hai" [India is becoming superpower by stealing our water...]

All praises to Allah. Bakistan has discovered that its long lost Birader is one of the phouphathers! - Turkey. One nation, Two countries! If ZH is to be believed, Turks are so desirous of pakistaniyat!

Thanks for the video and the ensuing comic relief for the morning.

[Peregrine]

The Quaid of hagiographers – Dr. Tahir Kamran

Dr. Tahir Kamran is ex-Chairperson – History Department – Government College University, Lahore.

He has written the Article Ideology in Changing times : Discovering a secular image for Pakistan from the sayings and speeches of Jinnah alone is fated to be a lost cause.

His Book Democracy and Governance in Pakistan – on Page 10 – does show Jinnah as he really was.

Cheers

[Peregrine]

Number of polio cases reach 82 in Pakistan this year

Subhanallah and we have 2 more days before 2013 retires

Brad Goodman Ji :

So much to do and only two days left to do it in!

Karo-kari murders : Four people shot dead in honour killings

Cheers

[Peregrine]

Indian Mujahideen wanted to nuke Surat, Yasin Bhatkal tells cops

NEW DELHI : The prospect of terror organisations getting their hands on a nuclear device has long concerned both security agencies and thriller writers. Now, it seems Indian Mujahideen India chief Ahmad Zarar Siddibappa alias Yasin Bhatkal too was thinking along similar lines. Bhatkal recently told interrogators that he was planning to explode a nuclear bomb in Surat, according to sources.

Bhatkal was arrested on August 27 in Pokhra, Nepal and has been constantly questioned by the NIA, Intelligence Bureau and police of several states. TOI has accessed the interrogation report.

Bhatkal told the interrogators that he had asked his Pakistan-based boss, Riyaz Bhatkal, over phone whether the latter could arrange a small "nuclear bomb". According to him, Riyaz responded, "Anything can be arranged in Pakistan".

"Riyaz told me that attacks can be done with nuclear bombs. I requested him to look for one nuclear bomb for Surat," Yasin told the officials.

"Riyaz told me Muslims would also die in that (nuclear bomb blast), to which I said that we would paste posters in mosques asking every Muslim to quietly evacuate their families from the city," Yasin said, according to the report.

However, the plan could not be initiated since Yasin was tracked by the IB and arrested in August.

Surat has always been on Yasin's radar and he had also played an important role in preparing 27 bombs along with Atif Ameen in 2008 when serial blasts took place in Delhi, Jaipur and Ahmedabad.

Yasin himself was the bomb expert of Indian Mujahideen and the outfit's bomb-making capabilities have been affected after his arrest, say intelligence officials.

The IM leader has also given details of army level training of IM cadres and other terrorists in Pakistan, which shows that advanced training is given to terrorists with the help of Pakistan. Elaborating on training schedule for IM members in Pakistan, Yasin said, "Training included morning PT, weapon handling and explosive/IED training, pistols to revolvers, AK-47 etc. Indian weapons like LMG, SLR and sniper rifles and so forth".

Yasin further stated that "we were also exposed to handling of explosives like PE3A (black colour explosive), C4, C3, TNT, etc. Besides this, we were also exposed to fabrication of IEDs with the help of ammonium nitrate, hydrogen peroxide, gelatin stick and so forth. This training schedule was for 50 days".

For all the plans and active operations, Yasin remained in touch with Riyaz Bhatkal. Riyaz, according to sources, had sent Yasin Rs 17 lakh in 2013 out of which his personal expenses every month were Rs 25,000.

A senior intelligence official said, "We have been coming across different kinds of IEDs over the years. The reason is that terrorists are undergoing all kind of advanced army level training in Pakistan with the help of ISI. And if terror outfits have access to nuclear bombs, then it is very dangerous for us (India)".

Cheers

[Cosmo_R]

Indian Mujahideen wanted to nuke Surat, Yasin Bhatkal tells cops

Cross posted:

http://forums.bharat-rakshak.com/viewto ... 3#p1567093

[archan]

What are you guys talking about. Modi and Shah allegedly snooped a lady. That is the real threat to India.
In any case, India is a state of mind.

[SSridhar]

Indian Mujahideen wanted to nuke Surat, Yasin Bhatkal tells cops

So, the dirty nuke threat is not to the US, but to India !

[Singha]

india is a low risk target for any form of mischief monger. our PMO will send a strong demarche and thats it. MSM will gleefully report it happened in GUJARAT so its well deserved retribution and go to town about state govt failure to deal with the aftermath of such a disaster.

[partha]

Blow to Modi: nuke dropped on Surat.

Tonight on Face The Palm: Does the Surat bombing bring a sense of closure to the riot victims? SMS Y or N.

[Karan M]

Partha - brilliant sarcasm. If not for the seriousness of the issue, would go overboard with smilies.
In fact, your second comment is EXACTLY like what the great Ghose would write.

[SSridhar]

partha, I second Karan. Really brilliant.

[Inder Sharma]

In a ToI article posted by Peregrine; in third para, where Bhatkal asks for nukes, Riyaz responds with: “Anything can be arranged in Pakistan”.

This is more serious. It implies that:-
1) Jihadis, esp India centric, are confident that Pakistani establishment would deliver the Chinese bomb were the need arise.
2) This means that, at the very least, Jihadis and their handlers have talked about it, and some assurance has been provided.

Alternately:
It may also mean that Pakistan has gone to dogs and control over nukes is precarious. Thus, the pro-establishment Jihadis have some comfort that they can get their hands on nukes.

[Prem]

Blow to Modi: nuke dropped on Surat.

Tonight on Face The Palm: Does the Surat bombing bring a sense of closure to the riot victims? SMS Y or N.

I will say No, it wont bring closure as main threat to India from Majority Hindu fundamentalists remain.

[johneeG]

In a ToI article posted by Peregrine; in third para, where Bhatkal asks for nukes, Riyaz responds with: “Anything can be arranged in Pakistan”.

This is more serious. It implies that:-
1) Jihadis, esp India centric, are confident that Pakistani establishment would deliver the Chinese bomb were the need arise.
2) This means that, at the very least, Jihadis and their handlers have talked about it, and some assurance has been provided.

Alternately:
It may also mean that Pakistan has gone to dogs and control over nukes is precarious. Thus, the pro-establishment Jihadis have some comfort that they can get their hands on nukes.

Saar,
this is something that has always boggled my mind: why didn't some baki backed jihadhi try to blast a nuke in bhaarath so far? I never quite understood this.

Possible explanations are:
a) ISI/PA are responsible enough to not let such a thing happen.
b) jihadhis have not been able to come up with such a plan.
c) bhaarath's internal security is so tight that the terrorists have been unable to infiltrate it.
d) jihadhis and their backers fear Bhaarath sarkaar's response if such an attack is carried out.
e) amirkhan is saving Bhaarath by putting a tight leash on PA and PA is allowing itself to be controlled on that leash and then PA, in its turn, is putting a tight leash on all its jihadhi assets and keeping a tight control on nukes and nuke material.

But all of the above seem like silly explanations. I mean who really believes that PA/ISI is a responsible Org? or who would believe that they fear Bhaarath sarkaar's reaction?

The only thing that makes sense to me is that perhaps the bakis don't have the capability. If they really had the capability, then even if the PA/ISI does not want to do that, there would some rogue jernail/kernail and some jihadhi attack dogs wanting to use that capability to attack Bhaarath. So, if they could, they would. Thats perhaps the only reason why they haven't used nuke on Bhaarath so far.

[saumitra_j]

The only thing that makes sense to me is that perhaps the bakis don't have the capability. If they really had the capability, then even if the PA/ISI does not want to do that, there would some rogue jernail/kernail and some jihadhi attack dogs wanting to use that capability to attack Bhaarath. So, if they could, they would. Thats perhaps the only reason why they haven't used nuke on Bhaarath so far.

I am not to sure about that. I would rather believe that the Generals in Pakiland are far more rational than we give them credit for and our own national security apparatus is much better than what we think here. For the Jihadi, a nuke bum with all it's mushrooom cloud is not necessarily the ultimate aim - in fact they know that there would be sure retaliation and they would all be glass pretty soon after pulling off such a feat. For them, a dirty bomb makes far more sense as it gives them the deniability and is much much easier to pull through - well they do not need to know anything more than what they already know - i.e. IED Mubarak and they just need to add some radioactive maal and they will be achieve what they want without the fear of immediate retaliation. Much as I find it comforting to believe that Pakis are nuke nood, the reality is quite different unfortunately.

[SSridhar]

The dirty nuke attack on Bharat by jihadists is not a question of if but when. Now is not the time because the US has been studiously avoiding any flare up of tension between India and Pakistan because of its presence around. If Karzai or his successor refuses to sign the Treaty that would allow stationing of American troops on Afghan soil after 2014, then that irritant would be gone for the jihadists. The next thing is to ensure that the strategic depth is re-established in Afghanistan. Because of the most likely scenario of civil war there, this may take some time.Once everything fell in place, an attack would become imminent.

saumitra_j, unlike conventional terrorist attacks, where TSP can play 'plausible deniability' game, the nuke attack is not going to give them that opportunity. We will not wait for proof before retaliating. It is as simple as that, IMHO.

[Anand K]

X-Posting from Intel Thread

I'm channeling Clancy's "Sum of All Fears" here but doesn't every weapons grade nuke material have it's own "signature"? You can pinpoint the antecedents/source of the nuke with that here?

and

^^ Even if it is pinpointed and has a hand-written note attached by TSPA Chief and DG, ISI, am sure 400% that we will not move a muscle against TSP and will do the usual noises for public sake and then resort to dossier-giri.

Similar to how we did diddly-squat against our Kabul embassy attack though it was a virtual ISI sign-off with them not even bothering to hide their prints

[Anand K]

^^

A nuke is a game changer. Like, Wrath of God retaliation stuff. IMO a TSP that still doesn't give Stingers/Anzas to Valley based piglets will not give a nuke to some very deniable and expendable mawali from the Deccan.
But if push comes to a shalwar-phaad, then all bets are off I guess. Nothing like a Jihadi Delivered dirty bomb in Chandigarh or Pune to slow things down.

[Baikul]

On a side note, the SHQ was at an event in Delhi where there were a couple of senior (and, incidentally, drinking like fish) anal-ists from the Islamic Republic of Bakistan.

During the course of the conversation, she asked one of them a question on Pakistan.

This was the answer: " I can only answer that from a South Asian perspective".

I ##%ing kid you not.

[SSridhar]

I'm channeling Clancy's "Sum of All Fears" here but doesn't every weapons grade nuke material have it's own "signature"? You can pinpoint the antecedents/source of the nuke with that here?

Of course yes, but that needs sophisticated sample gathering techniques that we possibly do not have. Besides, unlike earlier times, the tests these days are done deep underground with little venting.

[vishvak]

I ##%ing kid you not.

How do we justify entertaining selective perspective within India at public expenditure while thinking this as acceptable Foreign relation exercise is shocking. May be this line is also under USA prodding only, even when paki is not ready to talk from paki perspective.

[SSridhar]

Whatever it may be, we cannot blame the Pakistani jihadists for not getting their hands on nukes for trying. Dera Ghazi Khan, Sargodha, Wah, Kamra have all come under attacks or infiltratiion attempts.

[Anand K]

Despite all the talk (and reams of fiction on the subject), keeping a small nuke in foreign territory for extended periods pose many problems right?

First we can assume they won't put the nuke in the hands of some terrorist yahoo.... it will be the best ISI/MI agent they've got. The defensibility of such an action poses a problem, no? That is, after the deed (assume it to be their "first strike") is done? It's not like a green-paint nuke tipped missile launched from TSP territory striking us.... there's the cold-blooded pre-meditation and willful disregard of sovereignty aspects and all that. If the war is limited and TSP remains intact (inevitably in a greatly weakened form though), the long term issue of turning into the international pariah due to this still remains, right? Nobody's going to believe it was the serendipitous action by non-state actors this time.

PS: Desperate TSP offloading of nukes to terrorists in case of looming total defeat is entirely another issue. IMO they won't do it, what if the yahoos use this windfall divert it to US or something? I know there's a theory of JDAM already in US but I don't believe it 400%.

JM2c... just thinking out loud.

[Brad Goodman]

Pakistan Needs a Mandela

poor Madiba will be turning in his grave. What bakis really need is another bin qasim to inject green Arabian dna inside them and their mothers as that will bring them closer to the desert of Arabia and the true deen

[Peregrine]

Indian Mujahideen wanted to nuke Surat, Yasin Bhatkal tells cops

So, the dirty nuke threat is not to the US, but to India !

SSridhar Ji :

We are all aware of the USA Dog being wagged by the Pakistani Tail. Why?

Is it that the Pakistanis already have Nuclear Devices stored away in the USA?

By nuking India Pakistan will not get the chance to Islamize India and raise the Flag of Islam on the Red Fort. Thus the Pakistanis will not LIKE to Nuke India as they will have lost over a Billion Non-Muslims who would otherwise have converted to Islam.

P.S. Despite my remark above I take this threat V S I - Very Seriously Indeed!

Cheers

[SSridhar]

We are all aware of the USA Dog being wagged by the Pakistani Tail. Why?

Is it that the Pakistanis already have Nuclear Devices stored away in the USA?

Peregrine ji, salaam.

TSP tail has always wagged the US even when it did not posses the nukes. IMO, that's the audacious way the brave martial race operates. Alternately threatening, bluffing, double-crossing and begging. What Jinnah said about the need of Pakistan for US being more than the other way about came true within a decade and has largely held sway though there were periodic ups and downs.

Pakistan knows the US like the palms of its own calloussed hands. It does not trust it, especially with the crown jewels. Also, the crown jewels are entirely not its own, They also belong to KSA. Besides, the Chinese would not like their stores to be kept in a US warehouse.

By nuking India Pakistan will not get the chance to Islamize India and raise the Flag of Islam on the Red Fort. Thus the Pakistanis will not LIKE to Nuke India as they will have lost over a Billion Non-Muslims who would otherwise have converted to Islam.

You are right indeed. IMHO, there are three streams operating within TSP vis-a-vis India. One, based on the Mawdudian principle of converting the dar-ul-harb of India into dar-ul-aman completely. This was the old Jamaat-e-Islam (JI) whose view on India has changed to drastic radicalism after the Pashtun Qazi Hussain took over the reins. Today, it is seen as one of the incubators of the most radical Taliban. The other is the PA with its desire to avenge the 1971 defeat and the loss of Siachen/Saltoro and lately Kargil. The Ahl-e-Hadees LeT, being a part of the PA, subscribes to the PA view. The PA has always laboured under the impression that India does not retaliate or retaliates in a measured way or retaliates only slowly by which time enough international pressure can be brought to bear upon it. The Bhatkal brothers and the IM are part of the LeT and hence their desire to lob a few nukes on India does not come as a surprise. However, the PA is being slowly consumed by the spreading wahhabbi/deobandi/takfiri islamist tentacles within the PA, which too want to eliminate the foreign kafir, but only after first eliminating the local kafir within Pakistan. In all these cases, the nukes play a central theme. What if a hundred million co-religionists die if only it can bring the biggest kafir land to its knees and an abject surrender ? That is their reckless thinking, a trait to which all streams of Islamists mentioned above subscribe mindlessly.

That said, the trigger on the nuke is still under the PA control.

[member_28336]

Indian Mujahideen wanted to nuke Surat, Yasin Bhatkal tells cops

I tend to think that it is more of a calculated mis-information to send the investigating agencies on a wild goose chase. Most agents / spies are taught how to confuse the investigators with such stories if they are caught. The problem is that since the risks are too high, we cannot afford to ignore it altogether even if the Bhatkal thug is bluffing.

[abhijitm]

Indian Mujahideen wanted to nuke Surat, Yasin Bhatkal tells cops

So, the dirty nuke threat is not to the US, but to India !

Ever since 26/11 my fear was pakis exploding tactical nuke in Mumbai. God forbid, but when I die, more than dying from the radiation I will die in the pain knowing GoI will not avenge death of my beloved family.

[rsingh]

Indian Mujahideen wanted to nuke Surat, Yasin Bhatkal tells cops

So, the dirty nuke threat is not to the US, but to India !

Me think it is a desperate attempt to maintain keep IM relevent. May be it is a signal to somebody that IM is very strong. What i am worried is the dirty bomb or just the the speculation of a dirtybomb. It can be stollen radioactive material or even stollen radioactive waste ie CO60 which is used for research etc. You cannot prove it came from bakistan and it can panic in cities.

[Prem]

I'm channeling Clancy's "Sum of All Fears" here but doesn't every weapons grade nuke material have it's own "signature"? You can pinpoint the antecedents/source of the nuke with that here?Of course yes, but that needs sophisticated sample gathering techniques that we possibly do not have. Besides, unlike earlier times, the tests these days are done deep underground with little venting.

At least 50 of them should/are on red alert to fly from QJU to Poakland in less than 6 Minutes and with no self destruct or recall provision, Good Luck to Paki in their journey on Vapour plane to Brothel Up-on Heaven. Pakjab will be depopulaized in few days afterward.

[Peregrine]

Peregrine ji, salaam.

TSP tail has always wagged the US even when it did not posses the nukes. IMO, that's the audacious way the brave martial race operates. Alternately threatening, bluffing, double-crossing and begging. What Jinnah said about the need of Pakistan for US being more than the other way about came true within a decade and has largely held sway though there were periodic ups and downs.

Pakistan knows the US like the palms of its own calloussed hands. It does not trust it, especially with the crown jewels. Also, the crown jewels are entirely not its own, They also belong to KSA. Besides, the Chinese would not like their stores to be kept in a US warehouse.

Sridhar Ji :

Namaste - Vannakum.

Pakistan's Nukes also belong to KSA. The Chinese have the Firing Codes. The Chinese must be aware that after "doing India " the Pakis will surely turn on the Chinese. What prevents the Paki Tail from wagging the Chinese Dog?

This is the only point in India's hand to ensure that the Chinese do not provide the Firing Codes. Does India have to keep sacrificing its Lands to bring a rift between the Pakis and the Chinese. How else does India ensure that it is not Nuked with the Chinese Devices.

You are right indeed. IMHO, there are three streams operating within TSP vis-a-vis India. One, based on the Mawdudian principle of converting the dar-ul-harb of India into dar-ul-aman completely. This was the old Jamaat-e-Islam (JI) whose view on India has changed to drastic radicalism after the Pashtun Qazi Hussain took over the reins. Today, it is seen as one of the incubators of the most radical Taliban. The other is the PA with its desire to avenge the 1971 defeat and the loss of Siachen/Saltoro and lately Kargil. The Ahl-e-Hadees LeT, being a part of the PA, subscribes to the PA view. The PA has always laboured under the impression that India does not retaliate or retaliates in a measured way or retaliates only slowly by which time enough international pressure can be brought to bear upon it. The Bhatkal brothers and the IM are part of the LeT and hence their desire to lob a few nukes on India does not come as a surprise. However, the PA is being slowly consumed by the spreading wahhabbi/deobandi/takfiri islamist tentacles within the PA, which too want to eliminate the foreign kafir, but only after first eliminating the local kafir within Pakistan. In all these cases, the nukes play a central theme. What if a hundred million co-religionists die if only it can bring the biggest kafir land to its knees and an abject surrender ? That is their reckless thinking, a trait to which all streams of Islamists mentioned above subscribe mindlessly.

That said, the trigger on the nuke is still under the PA control.

So India's "Mission Impossible" is to have a Mr. Phelp to neutralize the Pakis Nukes. Alternatively India has to have the ability to fire its Nukes - in a massive Response - whilst the Pakis Nukes First Strike are still in the Air on the way to India. IOW it will have to have its Nuke Missiles situated very close to the India-Pak Border.

Distancewise the Indo-Pak Border is about 50 Miles from Islamabad, Spitting Distance from Lahore and about 125 Miles from Karachi.

In comparison Delhi is about 200 Miles from the Border and Mumbai, Chennai & Kolkata are Far, Far Far and Far, Far & Far Away. Surely Pakistan will be "Flied Lice" before the Paki Nukes land in the Four Indian Metropolitan Areas.

Could that be a deterance to the Pakis?

Armchair ramblings. What?

Cheers

[Gerard]

Jacqueline Kennedy - Invitation to Pakistan (1962)

[Anujan]

Pakistan contended three points with the court.

1. There is a river.
2. India is building a dam on it.
3. India should not build a dam on it.

The court sided with pakistan in the first two points and therefore Pakistan won 66.66% of the case. India won only the last point and therefore only 33.33% of the case.

[SSridhar]

Anujan, simply superb.

[SSridhar]

Jacqueline Kennedy - Invitation to Pakistan (1962)

Ayub Khan presented her with a horse which, IIRC, was the lone horse we saw in the funeral of her husband later.