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The external affairs ministry might like to portray the demand for withdrawal of a US diplomat from India as reciprocal action for the 'persecution' of Devyani Khobragade, but it doesn't cut ice. The fact is that Khobragade did violate US laws, even if the violation is of a sort that has in the past been winked at by the American establishment. The whole sordid episode smacks of overreaction by the Indian government. Incompetence allowed the situation to develop into a full-blown row and the weakness of the political leadership has meant that it is the IFS that is dictating terms. That is never a good idea, particularly when the foreign service, of which Khobragade is a member, is an interested party in the issue at stake. It has been allowed to conflate its own sectional interests with 'national interest'. Georges Clemenceau, an early 20th century French PM, famously said: "war is too important a matter to be left to the generals". By the same token, foreign policy is too important to be left to service diplomats.
What should have the politicians done? as it is, the MEA responded with very little. If the US had dealt with this delicately, none of this would have happened.
Lilo wrote:
Dipanker ji,
When the White sahibs sitting in Massa embassies as in Delhi and rest of the turd world stop employing maids (like seen in other members of SR's extended family), may be indians too will lend an ear to your lecturing on employing of Maids ?
You should pronto begin speaking up for that end....
Ohh then it will mean lecturing the White Sahibs which could be construed to be uppity which is definitely not how one must not come across in yer neck of woods especially if one is of Indian origin .. I assume ?
If there is case of exploitation of an Indian maid by any of these foreign embassy staff in India ( or for that matters by any Indian in India) that person should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of India law and put behind the bar for a long time.
The US has confirmed that an American official will leave its embassy in Delhi at India's request, amid a worsening diplomatic row.The US state department said it deeply regretted the move and hoped that it would bring closure to the case.Speaking to reporters, spokesperson Jen Psaki said: "This has clearly been a challenging time in the US-India relationship."
Wayne May seems to be the American diplomat who was expelled by India because of his involment in DK affair
Look at his interview. A typical arrogant and boorish self righteous 'manifest destiny' kind of american who think the challenges working in India are "unhealthy living conditions like air and water pollution, the threat of disease and sickness, bad traffic" among others.
I wonder how they can ask a court to issue a warrant. PB said they wont proceed with the case until DK returns to US sans immunity. She is not a fugitive from justice as she was forced by the SD to leave. You cant have it both ways, IMHO. (If anyone was a fan of Earl Stanley Gardener, there was a book (The Harder They Fall) in a similar vein written under his pen name AA Fair.)
The two remaining charges - according to the Telegraph article - are visa fraud (DK did not sign the application so there is an issue of proving it) and making false statements.
So to say she broke US law in terms of the Criminal charge - not so.
She has been accused of breaking US law - that is fine.
If the Telegraph is to be believed (correct me if I am wrong - they've been pretty good so far), then Bharara of the Bailey (anyone get the reference ?) has botched this totally.
Indictment can remain, DK barred from US - who cares. The fact is that the US didn't get to convict her.
They sacrificed everything in India for what ? Not justice (that would have demanded a different approach).
Of note is the approach by the new Ambassador - better than I had hoped (then again, Trinidad is saddled with the worst Indian HCs you can imagine).
For the record - I do not approve of the way too many "domestics" are treated by Indians (including diplomats). Exploitation is rife.
That said, the US made no example of DK.
Last edited by Sanjay on 11 Jan 2014 03:32, edited 1 time in total.
From the Video above, India did name an individual. Wonder who? The guy who facilitated Richard's family's escape by buying diplo tickets for them and avoiding taxes?
Rony wrote:Wayne May seems to be the American diplomat who was expelled by India because of his involment in DK affair
Look at his interview. A typical arrogant and boorish self righteous 'manifest destiny' kind of american who think the challenges working in India are "unhealthy living conditions like air and water pollution, the threat of disease and sickness, bad traffic" among others.
Lilo wrote:
Dipanker ji,
When the White sahibs sitting in Massa embassies as in Delhi and rest of the turd world stop employing maids (like seen in other members of SR's extended family), may be indians too will lend an ear to your lecturing on employing of Maids ?
You should pronto begin speaking up for that end....
Ohh then it will mean lecturing the White Sahibs which could be construed to be uppity which is definitely not how one must not come across in yer neck of woods especially if one is of Indian origin .. I assume ?
If there is case of exploitation of an Indian maid by any of these foreign embassy staff in India ( or for that matters by any Indian in India) that person should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of India law and put behind the bar for a long time.
And would you advocate that they put an end to the practice of hiring help at all? After all, in the US everyone mows their own lawns don't they?
@Ramana ^^^ re 'Beehives' etc. You give these DoS types too much credit for having the forethought to gather the honey before kicking over the hive. Typical MO in DoS is to punch one's fist into what looks like a hive and extract the honey. Nine out ten times, it turns out to be a hornets' nest. No honey only money down the toilet.
@matrimc ^^^ re message to others etc. Most likely this person
wanting to show her mettle, started the whole thing without thinking it through and precipitated the whole thing.
Wayne May is a good target. I'm sure he will enjoy life back in Buffalo
Personally, I think the episode will have some benefits: the MEA is not going to rollover at the US' behest over regional and other issues. Nothing beats babudom scorned.
Sanjay wrote:The Times View again smacks of "she is guilty".
The two remaining charges - according to the Telegraph article - are visa fraud (DK did not sign the application so there is an issue of proving it) and making false statements.
So to say she broke US law in terms of the Criminal charge - not so.
She has been accused of breaking US law - that is fine.
It is true DK helped to fill the online application but did not sign it. She did sign a contract on that day. These documents are not false by any means. So what they are saying is that she is mentally lying (thought police?) when she prepared another contract fully 12 days later. 'Caused to be submitted' seems to be the operative phrase.
As far as this particular issue is concerned, the MEA buffoons should take stock of all practices similar to this and put at an end to it, so that our officials are not exposed to nonsense like this. It doesn't need a systemic change but merely procedural. Like someone said, maintain them out of the consulate payroll or work out a solution with the host country on duties/rights etc.
What an arrogant,vulgar pr*ck! He even has his initials embroidered on his "T" shirt! The height of bad form and boorishness.If he indeed is the man being turfed out,good riddance to garbage.
Yes Ramana.Kipling's "IF" should be on every MEA desk.The silver lining in this spat has been the "outing" of the true US WASP racism that permeates the Washington establishment and the covert activities of the embassy.
SaiK wrote:munna, inadvertent touching is not battery, only an offensive one is. what you ask is an immediate sorry, and it should not repeat.
I said interpreted just as one PB interpreted what was at best a civil wage dispute if any into a grave offence. Diplomats are a no go zone even if they violate laws. Plain and simple declare png and move on, no more of this adhering to law bit.
Actually to rub it in the MEA has enforced a very nice red-line. This reads that GOI and its servants in official capacity are liable only to the GOI and people of India and not his lordship Preet Bharara Commander of MUTUs and Persona Non Grata in Russia.
A very loose upper bound for maid payroll would be $200 million per year for MEA - diplos can be asked to defray part of the cost.
200 countries x 50 maids/country on the average x $10K PA/maid on the average = $100 Million. What is the budget of MEA and what percentage this would be?
ramana wrote:Thats OK RajeshA.
Kipling's poem 'If' should guide us in times of crisis.
IF you can keep your head when all about you
Are losing theirs and blaming it on you,
If you can trust yourself when all men doubt you,
But make allowance for their doubting too;
If you can wait and not be tired by waiting,
Or being lied about, don't deal in lies,
Or being hated, don't give way to hating,
And yet don't look too good, nor talk too wise:...
...
Sources said the Indian side had initially thought of taking action against a woman diplomat of the rank of first secretary who had used her privileges to procure tax exempted air tickets for the husband and children of Sangeeta Richard to allow them to fly out of India on a human trafficking visa last month. This diplomat, sources said, had illegally availed of a discount available to diplomats and their families that waives taxes on airline tickets to procure tickets for the family. However, India subsequently decided that “reciprocal action” should be taken against a diplomat of the same rank as Khobragade, resulting in the notice to the US to withdraw a consular level officer.
...
...
Sources said the Indian side had initially thought of taking action against a woman diplomat of the rank of first secretary who had used her privileges to procure tax exempted air tickets for the husband and children of Sangeeta Richard to allow them to fly out of India on a human trafficking visa last month. This diplomat, sources said, had illegally availed of a discount available to diplomats and their families that waives taxes on airline tickets to procure tickets for the family. However, India subsequently decided that “reciprocal action” should be taken against a diplomat of the same rank as Khobragade, resulting in the notice to the US to withdraw a consular level officer.
...
Why didn't they expel both together?
Strict Reciprocity. Rank for Rank.
The scum have full immunity. So can't do to them what they did to DK. That would breach the Vienna Convention.
Target has to be a creature of the female persuasion from a consulate without full immunity. I also do not think that it should be done immediately.
The MEA put out a statement early on Friday morning, announcing Ms. Khobragade’s departure. It also said that U.S. Energy Secretary Ernest Moniz would not cancel his visit to India, as was announced by the State Department a day earlier.
So this visit is back on. How important is US representation on this summit? AFAIK, we don't source energy supplies from the US.
Last edited by arshyam on 11 Jan 2014 04:08, edited 1 time in total.
Unkil should be thanked for giving a free helping hand to indian counter intelligence efforts. First Rabinder singh ( Unkil pissed off for getting a name tag but no substance , ever wonder why Rabinder Babu is a dhobhi ka kutta na gher ka na ghat ka , had he provided something substantial , there would have been no book published ) & now DK what more can you ask .
(Mr. Arshack) He also noted that Sangeeta Richard, domestic worker who alleged that Ms. Khobragade underpaid her in violation of a contract that Ms. Khobragade signed to obtain an A-3 visa for Ms. Richard, and her family “now enjoy permanent residency in the U.S. … as a result of the false claims and shoddy investigation.”
Since the final indictment did not contain trafficking charges, will SR and family still have these visas, and what happens after they expire? I suppose we should take the 'permanent residency' part literally.
The issue of the maid is tangential.The core issue is that of espionage.The Richards' family being whisked off to the US appears to have been done after suspicion fell upon them as being "company" employees.Does anyone seriously think that the US of A has such deep concern for the welfare of a maid from a turd-world country? The way O'Bomber's drone attacks have been killing innocents in our region by the hundreds and thousands,indicates his true concern for human rights in the deprived world .
To cover up their covert activities,the US decided to manipulate the case into a human rights cause celebre ,depicting an Indian diplomat treating her domestic like a slave.Hilarious, as we know which nation has the worst record of slavery,whose mentality has not changed to this day.What better way to smear the poor lady diplomat than by getting one of her own kind to prosecute her,to show the world that her own people were convinced of her guilt! A claque (organized body of professional applauders in French theatres and opera houses) of Quislings were trotted out to add to the cacaphony ,while the quisling legal eagle,banged on his table to bolster his weak flawed prosecution and the US's grave flouting of Indian law in whisking away the Richards two insulting the Indian judicial system.This was to the white superiors inconsequential,as Yanquis believe that only their law holds good anywhere on the globe. Truly did the Native American Indian speak about the "white man having a forked tongue".Persecuting "Injuns" yesterday has become persecuting "Indians" today.Unfortunately for Uncle Sam and his tribe ,though it would like to think so,India is not an American "reservation" for the natives!
>>How important is US representation on this summit? AFAIK, we don't source energy supplies from the US.
Very. Energy is not just about a buyer/seller relationship.
The Cobragate thing seems to resolving. A way will be found to reunite the lady with her family including in the US. Goi did play hardball. The US will not repeat such nonsense in the foreseeable future. And if we do something of the sort in the future the same can be expected.
It'll be pure fun if DK heads the american desk at MEA......and one day she becomes
the foreign Sec (may be by NaMo, to sow his support for dalits) and visits amir khan
with full immunity.
If there is any self-respect, India should quietly initiate a ramp-down of all defence, security, and terrorism-related cooperation right now. No US military refuelling, flyovers, or any other courtesies. This is our greatest leverage. We are giving way too much, and getting way too little in any regard.
On energy, there is a lot (I mean a lot) - we can do ourselves. Where does the question of begging the US come in? Let's first use the resources at our disposal wisely - coal. Ramp up our own nuclear production. Rest will come.
The dirt on "sangeetha richards" and her NGO-friends (including the SD staffers) must be dug up and published.
The so-called twitter rightwing (mostly US-based "Modi" supported) are clueless, confused and do not see the truth in plain sight. Pitiable fools do not know what a true giant like Modi himself would do. More concerned about satisfying their white masters - watch these rats scurry, squirm and complain when Modi takes his first pro-India anti-US establishment foreign policy move. Only a matter of time.
Paras,quire right.An expose of the Quisling claque,servants of Uncle Sam ,needs to be accomplished,and treated as anti-nationals.Removing PIO status and restrictions/conditions while on visits to India (regular check in at local cop shops,etc.) should be imposed for identifiable PIOs who are susoected/engaged in active subversion of the nation and acting as catspaws for their host country.A few arrests of the guilty too would send a shockwave up the "exits" of our diaspora,a signal warning not to involve themselves in any acts that harm India's interests.For too long has the US in particular used NRIs and PIOs as fifth-columnists in destabilising the nation.
WM seems to be BDS and his expulsion ios for the custodial rape. Its his service that facilitated that atrocity. Had the guy been in a consulate he would have the treatment before expulsion.
Next shoe to fall will be the T visa facilitators for the sub judice exfiltration.
Now that the DK issue is settled (at least for her), let us hope GoI will show similar zeal when ordinary Indian citizens get in undeserved trouble abroad.
....
There was a second shock this week that forced the US to initiate action at high levels of the administration to resolve the impasse over Khobragade. It was a belated realisation within the US government that the callous disregard of Indian sensitivities on the issue that brought on a crisis in Indo-US ties was not getting any support from Capitol Hill.
US legislators are normally in the vanguard of trumpeting their patriotism and upholding American exceptionalism to the exclusion of multilateral treaties and international covenants because such actions are populist.
But the mood on Capitol Hill has been sombre and a sense of disappointment has been setting in that the Obama administration wantonly spoiled a blooming relationship with the largest democracy in the world.
As Senators and members of the House of Representatives returned from holidays this week, the new Indian ambassador here, S. Jaishankar, has been spending long hours with Senate and House leaders, putting across India’s case on its deputy consul-general in New York.
Jaishankar is known to every Congressman and Sentaor who has had anything to do with India in recent years. He was the pointman for India’s nuclear negotiations with the US after the high profile deal was announced in 2005. So he had no difficulty getting a hearing on Capitol Hill.
Aides to several US legislators whom the ambassador met this week said Jaishankar did not rail about any injustice done to the Indian diplomat in New York. His attitude was very different from that of some of his predecessors, political appointees who constantly lectured Americans on why India is right.
Instead, he emphasised the need for an honourable end to the slide in Indo-US relations because of a misguided housemaid and conveyed India’s desire to resolve the issue and move on. As a result, any attempt to whip support for prosecutor Bharara’s case against Khobragade using human rights or human trafficking as pet causes was nipped in the bud in Senate and House lobbies.
That came as a surprise to many people here and in New York who are used to pursuing such cases under the garb of civil society. Before US legislators went on vacation, Taranjit Singh Sandhu, then charge d’affaires at the Indian embassy here had prepared the ground for making India’s case on Capitol Hill as soon as Jaishankar arrived to take charge as ambassador.
Sandhu effectively put together the India Caucus in the House of Representatives in the late 1990s as a middle-level diplomat here. Political operatives who worked with him then are now occupying high-level positions across this city.
If anything, the resolution of the Khobragade issue has proved the critical importance of the India Caucus — now in the Senate as well — in bilateral relations with the US.
Hat tip to BR member who called me and said there seems to be a hidden player that made the WH move the cheese and defuse the crisis. We thought it was some one in the legislative branch for both Executive and Judiciary branch were on Kaildasa mode.
PB was on a war path and ended up delivering brutus fulmen!
as a general thumb rule, really sensitive materials are NOT supposed to leave any embassy or office. if DK was "bringing work home" of that nature for SR to steal, I hope her seniors take her to task for it.
SR would not have had any access to the consulate itself other than the lobby just like anyone else.
I had found another blog by a woman posted as a intern in the consulate delhi. did not post it as OT. but the same sneering drain inspector attitude. 20% of her blog was about the fact "65% of indians dont have access to toilets, much less afford a roof" . she seems to have no social dealings with indians other than in very subservient posts like her driver. constant whining about things...went on some ziplining trip and whined some bad yindus on the hill taped her on their cellphones....
these people live in a bubble here, house -> consulate -> ACSA -> gora party -> house....they have no real contact with the real india they are supposed to serve here as consulate reps other than occasional trip to luxury resorts (or khan market shopkeepers) on back of strong $$ or some official do where they meet the lutyens elites like sibal/ramesh/scindia types.
so its no surprise all their preconceived notions and superiority complexes just live on and get reinforced here...like a roman camp in the middle of gaulish/germania countryside trying to impose "high civilization" on the unwashed they firmly believe they are above the system, beyond the system and deal only with local elite warlords. any local serf approaching their gate is booed and shooed away for fear of picking up some "disease".
was this news bit posted here, didn't look up previous pages
Crackdown on US embassy cars in Delhi
Somreet Bhattacharya,TNN | Jan 11, 2014, 03.03 AM IST
NEW DELHI: The traffic police have booked 10 US embassy cars since Thursday after MEA directed them not to be lenient with American mission officials violating rules.
Registration numbers of US embassy cars have been brought to the notice of traffic police personnel to ensure they don't escape breaking rules. Officers said of the 10 embassy vehicles, four were booked for tinted glasses and fined Rs 100, one was booked for non-compliance.
On Friday, five cars were fined for parking against rules and challanned, officers said. They added if embassy cars are driven by Indian drivers they are prosecuted under normal rules. For foreigners, the standard protocol is followed. No special consideration is to be shown if the driver claims diplomatic immunity.
