INS Vikramaditya: News and Discussion

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 09 Jan 2014 19:39

Singha,any further info on the Jag upgrade.It seems to be going nowhere.

The MIG-29 one has always maintained is a very good aircraft that has excelled even in German colours post reunification.
Wik

The Federation of American Scientists claims the MiG-29 is equal or better than the F-15C in some areas such as short aerial engagements because of the Helmet Mounted Weapons Sight (HMS) and better maneuverability at slow speeds.[71] This was demonstrated when MiG-29s of the German Air Force participated in joint DACT exercises with US fighters.[72][73] The HMS was a great help, allowing the Germans to achieve a lock on any target the pilot could see within the missile field of view, including those almost 45 degrees off boresight.[74] In contrast, the American aircraft were only able to lock onto targets in a narrow window directly in front of the aircraft’s nose. It was not until late 2003 that the USAF and US Navy achieved Initial Operational Capability of the Joint Helmet Mounted Cueing System.

The upgrades have given the aircraft massive all round improvement and the 35 takes it even further,all at affordable prices.The IN's 29Ks come in at around only $32M per plane.A further upgrade to 35 std. with an AESA radar and perhaps TVC will eventually happen.Once the modified air0launched version of BMos is available,it will be part of the MIG's game-changing weaponry.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 09 Jan 2014 20:05

having around 65 upg Mig29S + 50 new Mig29K (of IN std) even without any new aesa would give us good strike options vs Cheen where in the himalayas neither the jaguar or the Mig27 really excel in performance or survivability or self-protection ability. for example a formation of Jag/Mig27 have to be provided cover by sukhois/mig29/m2k/bison from another airbase while here some Mig29 from same squadron can carry a load of a2a weapons and provide the same cover.

member_23455 · Post by **member_23455** » 09 Jan 2014 20:12

Murugan wrote:What are they firing?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iPeEItcREGE

Do check out the comments section under such videos...

It's a standard fit PK-2M/Zif decoy launcher for missile defense. Mostly useless.

More here:

http://www.harpoondatabases.com/encyclo ... y2676.aspx

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 09 Jan 2014 20:18

but every warship in the world still seems to carry these chaff launchers as a softkill measure.
bremen class ffg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CoduG_AkQeQ
I like this salvo mode thing
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B6oMDAnYHFs

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 09 Jan 2014 20:53

Wont be useless if it still fires a modernized jamming round. This is a PK-2M not a PK-2. Having said that, the firing shows explosions so perhaps conventional rounds were used as well.. these would be useful in addition to ECM systems using deception and other methods. Basically overload the seeker.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 09 Jan 2014 20:59

Yes,an extra 60 MIG-29s for the IAF would be a good cost-effective interim measure to maintain strike capability until other programes mature.Along with IN 29Ks would be easier to support logistically with the new planned support infrastructure at the last Indo-Russian mtg. in Nov.

member_28041 · Post by **member_28041** » 09 Jan 2014 21:27

Philip wrote:I think that the speed and secrecy in the VikA's flotilla reaching Karwar was to avoid being tailed by unwelcome "marine species",who expected it to reach later.

True, more so since viky is coming without any self-defense weapons. Any idea when are we planning to fit her with surface to air missiles?

member_28041 · Post by **member_28041** » 09 Jan 2014 21:44

Philip wrote:.Once the modified air0launched version of BMos is available,it will be part of the MIG's game-changing weaponry.

2.5 tonne Brahmos on a MIG29????

member_23455 · Post by **member_23455** » 09 Jan 2014 23:01

nitinraj wrote:
Philip wrote:.Once the modified air0launched version of BMos is available,it will be part of the MIG's game-changing weaponry.
2.5 tonne Brahmos on a MIG29????

...Don't forget doing a barrier assisted recovery on a carrier with an underslung Brahmos .

Anthony Hines · Post by **Anthony Hines** » 09 Jan 2014 23:36

If the IAF were really that keen on the Mig29 or 35, they would have at least ensured including them in MMRCA downselect. Time to move on.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 10 Jan 2014 04:27

The air-launched variant is supposed to be smaller and lighter.

A new, smaller variant of the air-launched BrahMos is also under development. This variant would arm the Sukhoi Su-30MKI, Mirage 2000, future inductions such as the 126 Dassault Rafale, and the Indian navy's MiG-29K.[6] A model of the new variant was showcased on 20 February 2013, at the 15th anniversary celebrations of BrahMos Corporations. The miniaturized version would also have a range of 290 km, but it will be shorter by three metres as compared to the present missile. The Sukhoi SU-30MKI would carry three missiles while other combat aircraft would carry one each.[67][68]

MMRCA-IAF wanted the best.EF and Raffy were the latest on the menu.At a far higher cost one must add.At least $25M extra /aircraft.That's the cost of an LCA!

BMos variants:

Surface-launched, Block I

Ship-launched, anti-ship variant (operational)
Ship-launched, land-attack variant (operational)
Land-launched, land-attack variant (operational)
Land-launched, anti-ship variant (In induction, tested on 10 December 2010)

Surface-launched, upgraded variants

BrahMos Block II land-attack variant (Operational)[47]
BrahMos Block III land-variant (being inducted)[42][43][77]
Anti-aircraft carrier variant (tested in March 2012) - the missile gained the capability to attack aircraft carriers using the supersonic vertical dive variant of the missile that could travel up to 290 km.[78]

Air-launched

Air-launched, anti-ship variant (under development, expected completion in 2012)
Air-launched, land-attack variant (under development, expected completion in 2012)[11][79]
Air-launched, miniaturised variant (under development)[67][68]

Submarine-launched

Submarine-launched, anti-ship variant - Tested successfully for the first time from a submerged pontoon on 20 March 2013.[55][56]
Submarine-launched, land-attack variant (under development, expected completion in 2011)[80][81]

Niranjan · Post by **Niranjan** » 10 Jan 2014 04:32

India Unveils Ambitious BrahMos Missile Expansion Plan

Work is also underway on a modified lighter and smaller-diameter version of the BrahMos for deployment on the Indian navy's MiG-29K and, potentially, the Dassault Rafale, as part of the Medium Multi-Role Combat Aircraft acquisition, which is still under negotiation.

Lack of clarity. Since the article does not specifically state that these 29Ks will be shipborne, one has to assume it is so. More than likely that would/should be the case.

John · Post by **John** » 10 Jan 2014 05:34

nitinraj wrote:
Philip wrote:I think that the speed and secrecy in the VikA's flotilla reaching Karwar was to avoid being tailed by unwelcome "marine species",who expected it to reach later.
True, more so since viky is coming without any self-defense weapons. Any idea when are we planning to fit her with surface to air missiles?

The original plan called for 6 Kashtan then it was changed 2 Kashtan along with mixture VL-Shtil i believe they were canned due to cost negotiations. Most likely to be fitted with Ak-630 and Barak during a refit here perhaps in 2018?

member_23455 · Post by **member_23455** » 10 Jan 2014 08:43

Niranjan wrote:India Unveils Ambitious BrahMos Missile Expansion Plan

Work is also underway on a modified lighter and smaller-diameter version of the BrahMos for deployment on the Indian navy's MiG-29K and, potentially, the Dassault Rafale, as part of the Medium Multi-Role Combat Aircraft acquisition, which is still under negotiation.
Lack of clarity. Since the article does not specifically state that these 29Ks will be shipborne, one has to assume it is so. More than likely that would/should be the case.

Dr. Pillai, for better or worse is an accomplished media manager. The Rafale/Mig29K Brahmos version - the so-called Brahmos 3 (not to be confused with Block III) exists on paper and will take a longer time to develop than adapting the current Brahmos for the Su30s, as it will be totally new missile. So we can cross that bridge when we come to it.

John wrote:Most likely to be fitted with Ak-630 and Barak during a refit here perhaps in 2018?

The AK-630s would have also happened in Russia had we decided to not fit the desi produced ones back home. That should happen in the next year or so.

Barak-8 will most probably happen around 2018.

Vikramaditya's AAD - both organic and the CBG's, is a noticeable Achilles heel. By all accounts the Kolkata class is not an Aegis/Kirov equivalent, so we will see how that pans out.

Aditya_V · Post by **Aditya_V** » 10 Jan 2014 10:54

nitinraj wrote:
Philip wrote:I think that the speed and secrecy in the VikA's flotilla reaching Karwar was to avoid being tailed by unwelcome "marine species",who expected it to reach later.
True, more so since viky is coming without any self-defense weapons. Any idea when are we planning to fit her with surface to air missiles?

I think Antony has cleared fresh purchases of Barak-1 and Ak-630 CIWS will be fitted in India. Barak-8/NG and some torpedoes will be fitted later.

member_28334 · Post by **member_28334** » 10 Jan 2014 21:48

Finally got hold of these pics of Vicky at Karwar base.. i hope we get to see more of em'. Really looking forward.

Aditya G · Post by **Aditya G** » 10 Jan 2014 23:30

Nice. Fitting base for this magnificent ship.

Shalav · Post by **Shalav** » 11 Jan 2014 00:12

About 10 years ago, when negotiations were still ongoing for the Vik and Karwar's construction had just started, there was a lengthy discussion here on the the drought of the (then) Adm. Gorshkov, and if Mumbai or Karwar would have any problems accommodating it.

I suppose we have our answer now - though there was very little doubt about INS Kadamba, Mumbai's ability to harbour the Vik is yet to be seen.

Shrinivasan · Post by **Shrinivasan** » 11 Jan 2014 03:01

Singha wrote:I am getting a strong liking for the Mig29K. it has a future as the RuN will be using it too. perhaps we should get 50 more of that and use as a combined fleet with our upg Mig29S.

their T:W ratio and high alt performance will be lot better than Jaguar which struggles in the himalayas and whose F125 honeywell engine deal shows no sign of being signed.

Agree with this 400%, couple more SQ of Mig 29K, in IN or IAF Colors... or what the heck ICGS colors will be a welcome addition. these can complement the Maritime strike Jags... Extended range, IFR, fairly large payload and latest Avionics coupled with an array of A2G, A2A and A2 Ship weaponry would make these a potent weapon in our arsenal.

a Noob Pooch, what is the Anti-sub weapon on Mig 29-K?

Shrinivasan · Post by **Shrinivasan** » 11 Jan 2014 03:01

Singha wrote:I am getting a strong liking for the Mig29K. it has a future as the RuN will be using it too. perhaps we should get 50 more of that and use as a combined fleet with our upg Mig29S.

their T:W ratio and high alt performance will be lot better than Jaguar which struggles in the himalayas and whose F125 honeywell engine deal shows no sign of being signed.

Agree with this 400%, couple more SQ of Mig 29K, in IN or IAF Colors... or what the heck ICGS colors will be a welcome addition. these can complement the Maritime strike Jags... Extended range, IFR, fairly large payload and latest Avionics coupled with an array of A2G, A2A and A2 Ship weaponry would make these a potent weapon in our arsenal.

a Noob Pooch, what is the Anti-sub weapon on Mig 29-K?

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 11 Jan 2014 03:08

It is more likely that Barak-1 and the AKs,will be fitted immediately during the course of the year,and B-8 when it arrives at a later date.Since the aircraft aboard a carrier are meant to provide long range air defence,supported by AEW helos, B-8 is a requirement for the major surface warships,increasing their air defence capability to a range of around 70+KM from the 25+KM of the Shtil SAM .The carrier's defences should be capable of dealing with saturated missile and air attacks.B-8's range can be extended to 100km.Whether the extended range version is going to be fitted on our Kol. class DDGs remains to be seen.Being modular,it is supposed to take up little deck space.

John · Post by **John** » 11 Jan 2014 06:37

^ I remember it was mentioned it will be during 2018 on an article. Also the Barak-8 with 100+ Km is ER-SAM.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 11 Jan 2014 06:56

2018 is too late. without even a ciws like ak630+barak1 the ship is virtually nanga against any ASM unless you rely on those manually loaded decoy launchers which would be height of faith! it would be no more than a training ship in that case unable to be called a FOC ship.

I do not think fitting these ak630 or barak1 is such a big deal that it will need to be drydocked and done during mid life refit. small footprint systems with only 1 level of deck penetration. should be possible dockside with OEM engineers.

cheap but good kit these weight 1.8tons minus the ammo http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t3w5NFMddXw

there is no room for Barak8 radar + deep VLS on Vik/IAC1 and no need for it. other than kuznetsov, no other carrier doest he LR SAM thing......the carrier escorts are supposed to take care of it.

member_23455 · Post by **member_23455** » 11 Jan 2014 08:56

Shrinivasan wrote:a Noob Pooch, what is the Anti-sub weapon on Mig 29-K?

Provided the sub is surfaced, the KH-35 and the 30mm cannon.

If its submerged, its time to call in the ASW choppers and hopefully a P8I lurking nearby.

John wrote:^ I remember it was mentioned it will be during 2018 on an article. Also the Barak-8 with 100+ Km is ER-SAM.

Janes has it at 2017 in this article but any delays won't be surprising given that the Barak-8 programme is also beset with the usual shenanigans.

http://www.janes.com/article/32159/indi ... -home-port

The only conjecture on why the IN wants a heavy hitter like Barak-8 on the carrier is that it has not planned for Kolkata class to be a dedicated AAD escort.

Maybe it has to throw in two of these ships instead of just one in a CBG - just one more item to keep an eye out for when figuring out whether the IN plans to evolve the CBG any further.

member_20292 · Post by **member_20292** » 11 Jan 2014 09:39

WHy cant Mig29 s and F 18s do a Fairey Swordfish and launch torpedoes from their wing pylons?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Torpedo_Advanced_Light

This is 22o kg.

KiranM · Post by **KiranM** » 11 Jan 2014 09:51

mahadevbhu wrote:WHy cant Mig29 s and F 18s do a Fairey Swordfish and launch torpedoes from their wing pylons?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Torpedo_Advanced_Light

This is 22o kg.

Carrying torpedoes is not the problem. Detecting a submerged sub to target is the problem. Even if a fighter carries sonabuoys, it lacks a dedicated sonar operator to process the signals from the buoy to give a firing solution to the torpedo. This is where a dedicated ASW helicopter or plane with long loiter time comes into play. There were some talks of using an FLIR on fighters to detect and track subs. But it only worked when the subs were just under surface. Besides the fighters had to be cued to an approximate location.

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 11 Jan 2014 10:18

INS Vikramaditya completes transoceanic voyage, arrives in India

India’s flagship carrier reached the Karwar naval base this week after a month-long journey. 75 Russian specialists will remain in India to help the crew prepare the aircraft carrier to enter the service of the Indian Navy.

Exactly a month ago, the INS Vikramaditya aircraft carrier left Russia's territorial waters after officially being handed over to the Indian Navy.

For 26 consecutive days (with a short stopover in Lisbon) the vessel traversed 10,212 nautical miles. That was the distance from the quay of Sevmash, Russia's largest ship-building complex where the former cruiser Admiral Gorshkov was reborn, to the naval base at Karwar, where the Indian Navy's newest and most powerful warship will be stationed.

According to Rossiyskaya Gazeta, the final stage of the passage (through the Mediterranean Sea, the Suez Canal, the Red Sea, the Gulf of Aden, and the Arabian Sea) was relatively uneventful. The same cannot be said about the North Atlantic crossing, during which both vessel and crew experienced a raging storm. An Indian corvette accompanying the aircraft carrier even suffered a crack in the hull, which had to be urgently sealed up in Lisbon. This planned stopover gave a welcome respite to those on board.

Together with the crew, the Vikramaditya was (and still is) home to a team of Russian experts, led by Sevmash senior engineer Igor Leonov, who was responsible for the handover. In total, 174 specialists were assigned to the transfer. In addition to the general obligation to guarantee the material working condition of the vessel, they were tasked with testing the operation of the air conditioning and refrigeration units in the environment of the southern seas, where the temperature of the air and water differs markedly from Murmansk and Severodvinsk.

These tests, in the Red Sea and the Gulf of Aden, demonstrated the design performance of the equipment. At an air and water temperature of around 28°C, the desired 20-25°C was maintained in the cabins. In the engine boiler room, where cooling is provided by seawater (as per the design), the mercury rose to 40°C — but that is a price that most surface ships have to pay.

On the approach to Indian shores, in addition to testing the ship's most critical systems in “domestic conditions,” Commodore Berry's crew took part in tactical exercises with other Indian Navy vessels. The senior officers who boarded the Vikramaditya noted with unconcealed admiration the vessel's efficient operation, radar capabilities and seaworthiness.

On January 7, when the Orthodox world celebrated Christmas, the aircraft carrier arrived at its destination and dropped anchor outside the Karwar naval base. Before that, a special entry was made in the logbook: since the commencement of sea trials, the vessel under the name Vikramaditya has covered a total of 30,000 nautical miles. The next day, January 8, the carrier docked at its destination.

The Indian sailors were followed ashore by the Russian team of specialists — their first footsteps on dry land since the voyage began. Most of them will return home soon, while 75 will remain in India to help the crew prepare the aircraft carrier to enter the service of the Indian Navy. According to Indian sources, the process will take 3 to 4 months.

It is believed that Commodore Berry's crew will set sail for training combat missions as early as January 15-16. And in February, according to unofficial information, the ship is due to arrive in Mumbai, where a grand welcome is being planned. The ceremony is expected to be attended by Prime Minister Manmohan Singh and guests from Russia.

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 11 Jan 2014 10:20

So after all the ship will come to Mumbai and we will have a Ceremony attended by MMS .... Vikram should be able to dock on the pier side along with Viraat.

IF Vikram can dock then even our own new INS Vikrant would be able to dock in Mumbai .... lets see

member_23455 · Post by **member_23455** » 11 Jan 2014 11:03

mahadevbhu wrote:WHy cant Mig29 s and F 18s do a Fairey Swordfish and launch torpedoes from their wing pylons?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Torpedo_Advanced_Light

This is 22o kg.

If folks are invoking specific examples then do read through specific resources on them. A while back we had "Why don't C130s fly off carriers."

Understanding context answers a lot of such "why can't x do y kind of questions".

http://uboat.net/allies/aircraft/swordfish.htm

Here are a few snippets which should help connect the dots, if one has a working understanding on how ASW ops are conducted:

Although the Swordfish was stable around all axes, it could make remarkably short turns. It could also be dived vertically to very close to the sea surface, and then make an abrupt pull-out. Very little speed built up in the dive. Therefore the Swordfish was not necessarily an easy prey for a fighter, but it was during the long, slow and straight run that was required to launch a torpedo.

One fixed forward-firing Browning .303 machinegun, and one .303 Vickers K gun in the rear cockpit.

arshyam · Post by **arshyam** » 11 Jan 2014 13:38

Looks like this wasn't posted earlier (no HD though

). Awesome video of a Harrier hovering on the Vicky's deck. Was hoping it would land! I wonder why they didn't show the rest of the fleet.

PS: Is this an official IN channel, by any chance? They have some good videos...

malushahi · Post by **malushahi** » 11 Jan 2014 14:21

chackojoseph wrote:SHAR may have actually taken off from Vik. The landing gear is down.

The SHAR actually took off from Vicky. Here is what the "photographer" has to say in a personal FB post:

Code: Select all

This snap clicked by me has appeared in many newspapers and is all over the internet …i was in a Helicopter about 150 ft above capturing the historic flight flown by a collegue (sic) , the first, by a Sea harrier on INS Vikramaditya…Many such moments remain etched in my memory and snaps now form part of the Naval History

JimmyD · Post by **JimmyD** » 12 Jan 2014 00:02

Austin wrote:
The same cannot be said about the North Atlantic crossing, during which both vessel and crew experienced a raging storm. An Indian corvette accompanying the aircraft carrier even suffered a crack in the hull, which had to be urgently sealed up in Lisbon.

Isn't the hull crack a little worrying? Which corvette was this?

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 12 Jan 2014 00:21

Lalmohan wrote:^^^ mig29K looks like a good equivalent for a high end F18

Lets compare it to a Rafale-M, latest variant. No AESA, no sensor fusion, no internal EW - haven't checked these but wouldnt be surprised if Rafale-M has better payload and range as well.

tsarkar · Post by **tsarkar** » 12 Jan 2014 00:52

RajitO wrote:By all accounts the Kolkata class is not an Aegis/Kirov equivalent, so we will see how that pans out.

Why does Kolkata need to ape Aegis/Kirov? Why can't it be an AAD in its own right custom built for the environment it'll operate in & & threats it will face?

RajitO wrote:...it has not planned for Kolkata class to be a dedicated AAD escort.

How do you conclude that?

Barak-8 is an active radar homing missile with a high Pk having a two way datalink that receives updates from a network fusing multiple sensors. That is the reason it'll be fitted on Vikramaditya & Vikrant.

Note all 8 fins are actuated control surfaces on Barak-8/LRSAM giving unmatched manoeuverability against turning/climbing/diving/rolling aerial targets. http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-VBWSXH5O05U/U ... a+2013.JPG

On the other hand, AAD has fixed fins fore & actuated rear fins + TVC for agility in engaging high speed gas thruster manoeuvered skidding missile terminal stages http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_zUe7sq7m3h0/S ... 110826.JPG

Shtil is SARH & Barak-1 is beam riding ACLOS. Which other missile in India is as capable as Barak-8? Once SRSAM is ready, it too should've IIR & ARH, but it wont reach FOC until the next 10 years.

FWIW, the proposed CIWS on Vikrant will be four OTO 76/62, that is a main gun on many ships. Refer here http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-2li8m82WId0/U ... 741206.jpg there are four OTO on each quadrant and two clusters of LRSAM port aft and starboard fore.

Sid · Post by **Sid** » 12 Jan 2014 03:15

But Vik already got zif 121 launchers where you said it will have air defence guns? http://www.aame.in/2013/07/ins-vikramad ... f-121.html

sivab · Post by **sivab** » 12 Jan 2014 03:49

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city ... 694734.cms

Russian sailors roam naked on Karwar beach, cops in a tizzy

KARWAR: The behaviour of Russian naval personnel who accompanied INS Vikramaditya to Karnataka's Karwar caused some embarrassing situations on Saturday.

About 120 Russians came with the aircraft carrier to train Indian naval personnel.

On Saturday, some of them went out shopping and drank alcohol in public while moving around on the main roads. This made many people uncomfortable especially women. When journalists caught this on camera, these personnel said 'thank you' without knowing why they were being photographed. Some even shook hands with people from the media.

On Saturday, about 50 Russians were found swimming in the nude off Karwar beach which made the large number of tourists present there uncomfortable. The police had to intervene and convinced the Russians that it was not allowed on the beaches in Karnataka. The Russians left soon after that.

"We found it difficult to communicate with them as most of them don't understand English," said a police officer. But locals were angry by this behaviour. 'It's not their mistake. It's the mistake of Indian Navy staff who didn't educate them about the local culture," said Prem Naik, a shopkeeper.

The Indian Navy should educate these men about the dos and don'ts of behaving in public before allowing them to move around in Karwar," said MN Naik, a retired teacher.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 12 Jan 2014 03:59

Remember that great comedy film,"The Russians are coming,the Russians are coming"? With the Russian team going to be in India for a year maintaining the VikA,and not much entertainment in Karwar,its going to be a gold rush town for some,setting up beach eateries,speak easies,et al. years ago when it was announced that Karwar would be a new naval base for the IN,the town was invaded by "hippies"!

Culture shock.Some education about local customs and Indian etiquette should be printed in a booklet in Russian.Enjoying the sun,sand,sea and golden beaches,Europeans just love to strip off! In the old days the KGB minder was enough to keep the team in place.

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 12 Jan 2014 04:05

I agree.. not a laughing matter. they need to respect cultures of the land where they are in.

--

btw, nice video of harrier paying respect vikramaditya. now, harrier jet will be much missed!

Hitesh · Post by **Hitesh** » 12 Jan 2014 04:38

Since the trangression was harmless, I would give the Russians a pass in the interest of maintaining relations and good working relationships to get the ship ready and prime for warfighting. At the same time, I would give them gentle reminders to obey local culture norms and give them training on local culture so this episode won't be repeated.

member_23455 · Post by **member_23455** » 12 Jan 2014 09:11

tsarkar wrote:
RajitO wrote:By all accounts the Kolkata class is not an Aegis/Kirov equivalent, so we will see how that pans out.
Why does Kolkata need to ape Aegis/Kirov? Why can't it be an AAD in its own right custom built for the environment it'll operate in & & threats it will face?

Absolutely...hence the part that I have highlighted. There are more than one ways to skin a cat, and one will see what the IN does about the air defense threat...but the jury is out either way.

tsarkar wrote:RajitO wrote:
...it has not planned for Kolkata class to be a dedicated AAD escort.
How do you conclude that?

Can you quote from IN sources about how they plan to use the Kolakata class ships, either independently or in a CBG?

We have followed, right from the Godavari to the Delhi class, a "multi-purpose" philosophy on our ships, maybe with good reason, but that was then.

One of the underlying themes on this thread is that we are transitioning to a new kind of CBG doctrine which will require a degree of specialization in platforms. There are also certain operational/tactical aspects that come into play with designating a ship as an AAD escort which is not as sexy as quoting weapon system specs, but goes into the down and dirty of how a CBG fights.

tsarkar wrote: FWIW, the proposed CIWS on Vikrant will be four OTO 76/62, that is a main gun on many ships. Refer here http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-2li8m82WId0/U ... 741206.jpg there are four OTO on each quadrant and two clusters of LRSAM port aft and starboard fore.

Source? All the MSM have it down as desi AK630 but it wouldn't be the first time they are wrong, so if you know different feel free to share.