India-US Strategic News and Discussion

[member_28380]

IDSA K Subrahmanyam memorial lecture

Father of ambassador Jaishankar, strategic affairs analyst, was a passionate advocate of India's nuclear weapons program

[member_28380]

So other nations are watching all right. How is GOI explaining people who are facing charges in Indian courts being taken out on T visas, with tax-free tickets, through New Delhi airport? How is GOI going to explain allowing wholesale tax fraud, people sitting across from the HQ of the Income Tax dept and the MEA and putting out memos to their employees to cheat on taxes to the tune of millions of dollars a year?? The Singapore Dean is sending a not-too-subtle message that people are at the GOI.

He means timid Indians have stood up for the first time

This was completely involuntary reaction of GoI thanks to making a Draupadi out of Devyani thanks to PB. You would only hope this give a psychological boost and change supplicant behavior in the future.. we shouldn't be too optimistic.

I think PB deserves at least a Padma Shri for this

[UlanBatori]

In 1971, several fighter pilots volunteered to fly out to stop the 7th fleet, knowing that these would be suicide missions. Many of us expected the bombing to start, having read all about the "carpet-bombing" of North Vietnam, Laos and Kampuchea. But Indians showed spine.
Mansur Ali Khan, Bishen Bedi, Sunil Gavaskar and Ajit Wadekar showed spine.
In 1998, Indians showed spine.
In 1999, Indians showed spine.
It is only since 2001, with the selling-out Open Globalization in full swing, that the spine got turned into spaghetti.

[Amber G.]

Indian-Americans save most for children's college education

WASHINGTON: Indian-Americans, who have the highest income among America's multicultural groups, save much of their higher household income for their children's college education, according to a new study.

This heavy emphasis on higher education, however, leads to times when Indian Americans prioritise saving for their children over saving for themselves, according to the third biennial 2013 State of the American Family Study.
<snip>

[shiv]

Gus, matrimc - interesting inputs from both of you. By coincidene I found an INYT article in the Hindu today
Guns make killing way too easy

Third, gang shootings are everywhere. You see it in the big cities, like Chicago, Detroit and Miami, and you see it in smaller cities in economic decline like Flint, Mich., and Fort Wayne, Ind. Drive-by shootings are prevalent in California, especially Los Angeles and Fresno. As often as gang members shoot each other, they kill innocent victims, often children who happen to be in the wrong place at the wrong time.

Among the readers who post daily comments to The Gun Report are a number of gun rights advocates. What has been astonishing to me is the degree to which they tend to dismiss inner-city violence, as if to say that such killings are unavoidable. The code word they often use is “demographics.”

It is unquestionably true that the most gun homicides occur in the inner cities — the anecdotes we collect in The Gun Report are confirmed by such studies as a May 2013 Bureau of Justice Statistics report. And, yes, plenty of them are the result of gang violence. But why should that make them any less lamentable, or preventable?

There are an estimated 300 million guns in America, and that’s not going to change anytime soon. But to read The Gun Report is to be struck anew at the reality that most of the people who die from guns would still be alive if we just had fewer of them. The guys in the movie theatre would have had a fist-fight instead of a shooting. The momentary flush of anger would pass. The suicidal person might have taken a pause if taking one’s life were more difficult. And on, and on. The idea that guns, on balance, save lives — which is one of the most common sentiments expressed in the pro-gun comments posted to The Gun Report — is ludicrous.

This article is a mix of what both of you said. Yes it is the people outside cities who own guns and support gun ownership, while dismissing inner city shootings as "inevitable"

Without intending to take the side of a brutal police force in the US, it appears that the US is equipping all police forces to win "their wars" in exactly the same way as the US military aim to win wars. The same tactics, equipment and training are used. This means that the US no longer considers the police to be people who use discrimination to stand between criminals and the community. They are a force who will ensure their personal safety and security to ruthlessly sanitize all human action in their area of interest. These tactics are more akin to Pakistan army tactics in Swat than India army tactics in Kashmir. The latter are more human centered but the army takes more casualties.

The US police forces don't, to my knowledge, take that many casualties but I need to check my facts. The article says that the US has at least 32.000 gun deaths a year. Other sources say that police kill at least 500 people a year - many innocent. Of course these might all add up mainly to "gun related deaths" but clearly the police go into situations assuming that they will get shot at and they arm themselves accordingly.

I had a strange thought yesterday. Overall the US government and law enforcement apparatus agree with the contention that "Guns don't kill people. People kill people". In other words it is the people you have to watch out for. While the US trusts guns in the hands of people it's the people's hands they don't trust. And that lack of trust makes the "law enforcement" enforce laws brutally. In a sense they are right. The US has 200 300 million firearms in the hands of people. With 300 million odd people and a huge country, it is entirely possible that disgruntled groups could form armies that amount to internal rebellions.

Unfortunately there is no way out as far as I can tell.This is a strange US-style dysfunctionality that appears to keep most law abiding people safe, at the expense of some people facing brutality and all people being afraid of the police. This also means that the police force itself, the courts, lawyers and some wealthy people could have undue influence over law enforcement ensuring that they have more freedoms than other US citizens. That certainly seems to be the case as far as I can tell. It also means that "liberty and euality" for all is advertised more than practised.

[g.sarkar]

Exactly whom are the US police arming themselves against?
We all have to hope that the US does not become a failed state in a civil war say 50 or 100 years down the line. That would be a world war. The US is a dangerous nation heading in a dangerous direction.

Dr. Shiv,
My two bits on this:
Due to the recent wars the the US is involved in, there are a great number of ex-service men on the loose. A good number of them have used the programs in the military to learn vocations such as driving trucks, welding, electronics, Computers, flying, navigation etc. Mostly they are finding jobs. However, there is a core group of people that learned to kill, and kill only. Such ex-service men are often not able to find gainful employment as the skills that they have obtained are not in demand in a law abiding society. Furthermore, they have been thick in the middle of killing people and suffer from physical and mental illness stemming from such actions. Most of such men that I meet, believe in strange (to Indian ears) conspiracy theories. They are the ones that collect arms and ammunition and food. They are also the ones that are digging bunkers in their back yards, waiting for the world to end. I know many people who are currently unemployed and short of money, yet are spending most of their meager income in buying arms, ammunition, canned food and water for the coming Armageddon. These were the people who said that Boutros Boutros-Ghali was sending the UN black helicopters to take over the US government and now say similar things about BO. It is very easy to dismiss them as crack pots, but they are armed to the teeth and know how to use weapons.
Gautam

[saip]

Can anyone find names of the teachers whose spouses were llegally working at American Embassy School? There is an IRS form 3949-A to report them.

[saip]

Indian-Americans save most for children's college education

WASHINGTON: Indian-Americans, who have the highest income among America's multicultural groups, save much of their higher household income for their children's college education, according to a new study.

This heavy emphasis on higher education, however, leads to times when Indian Americans prioritise saving for their children over saving for themselves, according to the third biennial 2013 State of the American Family Study.
<snip>

I can relate to that. When my son graduated from engineering school he had no debt and a brand new car to boot.

[shiv]

Indian-Americans save most for children's college education

I can relate to that. When my son graduated from engineering school he had no debt and a brand new car to boot.

Wrong thread for this but its simple. Whether Indians as a group are dharmic or not "dharma" is to look after one's children - including their education. Our parents did just that for us - skimping on personal luxuries, holidays and sometimes even on food and clothing for our education. The same thing happens in the US.

This what i mean by saying that a person who is torn away from his family in India is being torn away from his culture and his remuneration should really compensate for that because Indian society is less of an "it's about me" and more of an "It's about us" society - at least when it comes to family.

That family connect is also why you find that there is a "hole" in the family in India when someone goes off to the US (for example) and that hole is never filled - it is always there if that person should come back and the hole expands for his wife and children. The same thing holds true for children.

[Shreeman]

Just a thought: There are, in fact, third-party US citizens that are affected here--DK's husband and children. They could bring suit if they wish, I'd think.

Yes, they can and they should.
Actually thanks to google chacha (and it's scanning of people' emais) even I am swamped with ads from:
places like (No all these places are real - I checked )
http://www.falsearrestlawsuit.com
http://www.falsearrestnewyork.com/
http://www.expertatlaw.com/you_can_sue_ ... rrest_how/
http://www.agulnicklaw.com/false_arrest ... y_new_York

I am being informed - One can sue a city (suing state of feds is harder, they say) - not only for the conduct of their employees but even for "hiring wrong doers"

(Seriously, civil suits go (propelled by lawyers who make their living from this) where there are deep pockets, expect massive law suits - and plentiful plaintiffs will be found)

Amber,

IANAL. The above may or may not apply here. Truth in advertising is hard to find or understand. Civil suits are not what they are made out to be, or class action would never arise. IANAL.

Irrational exuberance only leads to disappointment later. As someone knowledgeable once told me, the law is like a large blunt hamner, even if applied correctly there is collateral damage. The civil process is not a panacea and looking to it --even with deep pockets --is irrational for the most part. My advice to anyone ever iin such a situation would be to avoid it.

Just a humble opinion from someone who is pushing for something come 3/24.

I can only advise patience to anyone here, and keeping hopes low. Internet arguments wont change any outcome. Members are so eager for something particular, they are unable to see beyond 1 mouse click right now.

Edit - For a simpler analogy, its like the lottery. May be marginally worse. You only hear about the large jackpots and the winners.

[Philip]

How the US always lets its favourite rent-boy Pak off the hook,now stroking the ungodly taliban!

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/f ... iban-talks
US scales back Pakistan drone strikes during Taliban talks, say reports
Islamabad calls for restraint but senior US official denies informal agreement reached, says Washington Post

Reuters in Washington
theguardian.com, Wednesday 5 February 2014 08.08 GMT

Drone strike kills in Pakistan
People gather at the site of a drone strike in Hangu, Pakistan, in November during which senior Taliban leaders were killed. Photograph: Basit Gilani/EPA

The US has cut back sharply on drone strikes in Pakistan after Islamabad asked for restraint while it pursues peace talks with the Pakistani Taliban, the Washington Post reported on Tuesday.

The Post quoted an American official as saying: "That's what they asked for, and we didn't tell them no." The newspaper said there had been a lull in drone attacks since December, the longest break since 2011.

The Post said the Obama administration indicated it would continue carrying out strikes on senior al-Qaida officials if they were to become available or to thwart any immediate threat to Americans.

Reuters was not immediately able to confirm the report.

The Post quoted a senior Obama administration official as denying an informal agreement had been reached, saying: "The issue of whether to negotiate with the Pakistani Taliban is entirely an internal matter for Pakistan."

While some Pakistanis welcome the strikes, saying they kill fewer civilians and are more effective against Taliban militants than traditional military operations, others argue they still cause civilian casualties, terrify residents and violate Pakistani sovereignty.

The Pakistani prime minister, Nawaz Sharif, has said he wants the drone strikes to end.

The Post said the current US pause came after a November strike that killed Pakistani Taliban leader Hakimullah Mehsud.

That attack took place a day after Pakistan's foreign policy chief, Sartaj Aziz, was quoted as saying the US had promised not to conduct drone strikes while the government tries to engage the Taliban in peace talks.

An annual study by the Bureau for Investigative Journalism found that CIA drone strikes against militants in Pakistan killed no more than four civilians last year, the lowest number of reported civilian deaths since the drone programme began in 2004.

PS:No wonder that only "4" civilians were killed by US drone strikes in Pak,because the whole bl**dy country is filled and populated with terrorists!

[CRamS]

Singapore's Dean Mahbubani says... (From his Lecture: "Can India be Cunning"

Devyani’s return shows India’s clout, Kishore Mahbubani says

Guys, just a few cautionary remarks on this guy Mahbubani for the unsuspecting and taking his comments at face value.

First of all, this guy is a Singapore version of a MUTU and Uncle Tom, a consummate side kick of former Singapore dictator Lee Kwan Yu (or wherever). Recall, Lee Kwan Yu would jail people for spitting chewing gum on the street. (Granted, Singapore is more successful and spic and span than India where people spit pan and p!ss and crap on the roads with impunity).

But one must remember that Mahbubani guy has internalized this hard-core nonsense about Asian values BS as a superior alternative to western civilization. That explains why he is a darling of East Asian dictators. (As an aside, I prefer, the rational, supreme intellectual Rajiv MalohotraJi's purva paksha approach to gazing and critiquing western civilization from the outside).

Grated, I am no fan of US smooth talk on "liberty" and all that BS as PR talk and then going and gang raping Iraq to loot their oil and protecting their pet boy Israel based on some Biblical prophecy, or subjecting DK to custodian rape on some specious moral grounds. But one must evaluate Mahbubani's statements on whether there is any logic or truth to them. His statements are mostly based on some imagined impending demise or decline of western civilization, in particular US as the torch hearer, and rise of Asian values (Confucian) as a superior alternative. And everything he says derives from that deeply flawed premise.

Seasoned BRtes like me can recall his statements about TSP which will make many-a-BR nationalist puke. He is a quintessential "South Asian" India TSP equal equal guy. Heck, even Jihadi Lodhi admires this guy for his glowing tributes to TSP as "moderate Muslims democracy" in some BS book of his. Finally, in his writings, he comes across as a self-loathing Hindu, for e.g., phrases like the "Hindu ossified mind" as what ails India abound in his writings.

[UlanBatori]

The contrast between the rules for au pair and "domestic workers" for minimum wage, working hours, overtime, treatment of in-kind benefits etc. needs much more highlighting. This is at the root of the hypocrisy of the BO admin. They want to keep the au pair system, of course. Most of the senior officials have au pairs, instead of the Interns preferred by COTUSppl and the WH Oval Office...

(au pair means "on par" as in "White estate owners in the Southern states were au pair with their imported agriculture specialists from Africa until 1865")

[chaanakya]

I can only advise patience to anyone here, and keeping hopes low. Internet arguments wont change any outcome. Members are so eager for something particular, they are unable to see beyond 1 mouse click right now.

Edit - For a simpler analogy, its like the lottery. May be marginally worse. You only hear about the large jackpots and the winners.

I am sure that patience is advisable. Time for suing is not yet there but it will be there. As long as the present case in not concluded in favour of DK that is the course of action. But as soon as case is decided in favour of Dk or dismissed even DK can sue. And I believe whoever is in a position to sue should do that. In a high profile cases like this could be something of an embarrassment for USD. Krittika Biswas has also sued NYC for wrongful arrest etc once it was proved that she was falsely implicated and arrested. One has to teach counter lesson and no one is more suited then DK as of now.

[UlanBatori]

Which is why it is important to focus on the things that can be productively done now, to make a long-term difference. Like asking COTUS to start asking questions on "Qui bono?"
Like asking GOI why tax laws are not enforced.
And what's wrong with "reciprocity" as a core concept of international diplomacy.
And why the Indian MEA in India is soo ****** SLOW in doing what needs to be done. In some things patience is a virtue, but sloth is not a virtue at any time.
And why the law for au pair is so different from those for "domestic workers" who, being generally more mature, and even government employees themselves, need "protection" a WHOLE LOT less than the vulnerable teenagers who come as au pairs into the homes of the rich and powerful. I bet 50% of au pair nannies/cooks/misc. servants can't read or understand English and Forms nearly as well as SR can.

[SanjayC]

Singapore's Dean Mahbubani says... (From his Lecture: "Can India be Cunning"

Devyani’s return shows India’s clout, Kishore Mahbubani says

Guys, just a few cautionary remarks on this guy Mahbubani for the unsuspecting and taking his comments at face value.

First of all, this guy is a Singapore version of a MUTU and Uncle Tom, a consummate side kick of former Singapore dictator Lee Kwan Yu (or wherever). Recall, Lee Kwan Yu would jail people for spitting chewing gum on the street. (Granted, Singapore is more successful and spic and span than India where people spit pan and p!ss and crap on the roads with impunity).

Singapore is a well-known parking ground used by Uncle Sam for assorted brown sepoys from India. These people are usually given an assignment in some university or think tank. Some Indian journalists known to propagate US view points too are beneficiaries of the racket.

[KLNMurthy]

I can only advise patience to anyone here, and keeping hopes low. Internet arguments wont change any outcome. Members are so eager for something particular, they are unable to see beyond 1 mouse click right now.

Edit - For a simpler analogy, its like the lottery. May be marginally worse. You only hear about the large jackpots and the winners.

I am sure that patience is advisable. Time for suing is not yet there but it will be there. As long as the present case in not concluded in favour of DK that is the course of action. But as soon as case is decided in favour of Dk or dismissed even DK can sue. And I believe whoever is in a position to sue should do that. In a high profile cases like this could be something of an embarrassment for USD. Krittika Biswas has also sued NYC for wrongful arrest etc once it was proved that she was falsely implicated and arrested. One has to teach counter lesson and no one is more suited then DK as of now.

We tend to confuse passivity with patience. There are courses of action that can be taken individually and collectively. Patience comes automatically when a deliberate action is taken knowing the expected timeframe of results.

UB has outlined some of these courses of action.

[UlanBatori]

See this Obama appointment

Tubelight moment: Could it be that BO is appointing ppl based on merit (as opposed to "Cultural Appropriateness/Western Culture" as my former redneck mongol(oily) bosses coded their sheer racism), and that people who can't stand that are targeting Indian-Americans VIA India? The common factor is racism.

In this scenario, Asst. SOS Zeya has been set up big-time, by the Central Park Muggers of the SD. So has the Bray of PiBs, but to a lesser extent.

Worth thinking about. That's still a CT that gives a lot of credit to cretins, but it's not as convoluted a CT as the others seen here. If you think about this mess, ALL the past, present and future victims are desi. Except the Mays and what's his name Shoot-Self-In-Da-Foot.

[Vayutuvan]

Singapore the place where
- people get cruel and unusual punishments like whip lashes even for seemingly small infringements
- cars older than 5 years whatever their mechanical condition are considered not roadworthy. They are literally shredded to prevent them being on the roads - not exported for sale or donated to have nots in say Malaysia or Indonesia. I am sure there are lot of poor in both countries of even Brunei.
- people do not apply for citizenship. When the government feels they have been good boys they are invited. I wonder what happens to people who decline
- if you think that IIT preparation has reached absurd levels then don't look Singapore parents for solutions. High school suicides are the norm.

Thanks but no thanks. If India doesn't have anything from massa it has even less to learn from Singapore. The late benevolent dictator was lionized by India by calling as a chief guest for one of our republic days. The guy waxed eloquent from the soap box and gave moral lectures to India.

[UlanBatori]

About Sikhs 4 Justice vs. Sonia G

rejected a request by (SFJ seeking 21-day extension) to respond to a motion filed by Congress President Sonia Gandhi to dismiss a human rights violation case against her in the 1984 anti-Sikh riots.

SFJ was given time till February 6 to "investigate" whether Gandhi was in the city between September 2 and September 9, 2013 Gandhi had submitted a new declaration on January 13 to the US court in support of her motion to dismiss the lawsuit. In the declaration, Gandhi stated that she has "not been in New York or in the United States during the period of September 03, 2013 through September 09, 2013."

SFJ has said that Gandhi was in the city for medical treatment at the Sloan Kettering Cancer Centre during September.

[Vayutuvan]

UB: Mays were uncloaked due to anmauling. Otherwise they would have gone scot free.

[Amber G.]

Saip - Congrats for success of son(s and children).

To add to:

Can anyone find names of the teachers whose spouses were llegally working at American Embassy School? There is an IRS form 3949-A to report them.

Here is a link to step by step guide to:
How Do You Report Suspected Tax Fraud Activity?

The form 3949-A can be printed or filled .. here is the link:
http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/f3949a.pdf
You can call Tax Fraud Hotline t -800-829-0433 to order the form or just send written letter (even without a form to : Internal Revenue Service, Fresno, CA 93888)

Include as much information you have (You may also get a reward if they think it was helpful)

eg N

ame and Address of person or business you are reporting
The individual’s social security number or the business’ employer identification number
A brief description of the alleged violation(s), including how you became aware or obtained information about the violation(s)
The years involved
The estimated dollar amount of any unreported income
Your name, address and telephone number*

*Although you are not required to identify yourself, it is helpful to do so. Your identity will be kept confidential.

Above form is good for reporting:

False Exemptions or Deductions
Kickbacks
False/Altered Document
Failure to Pay Tax
Unreported Income
Organized Crime
Failure to Withhold

There are other forms (see the link I gave above) for the following (I am sure some of these may apply to AES)
>>> Use form 1414 for: suspect fraudulent activity or an abusive tax scheme by a tax return preparer or tax preparation company..

>>>form 14242 for: suspect an abusive tax promotion or promoter
>>> form 13909 for suspect misconduct or wrongdoing by an exempt organization

If you really have juicy information, want to claim reward, use form 211

[UlanBatori]

UB: Mays were uncloaked due to anmauling. Otherwise they would have gone scot free.

True. And shot-self-in-da-foot is out of reach. So, 100% of the victims, past, present and future, are Indians/Indian-Americans(-hu-support-BO).

Last part in parentheses because the muggers may well be demikats themselves, except racists/anti-Indian.

CT tubelight just became a big red flashing light.

[member_28434]

"In this scenario, Asst. SOS Zeya has been set up big-time, by the Central Park Muggers of the SD. So has the Bray of PiBs, but to a lesser extent."

That theory sounds like disinformation to me.

In the first place, I don't believe that ordinary educated Americans are rampant racists, as such.

They are subjected to a lot of propaganda and act accordingly. So do many Indians...only less so, because being the underdog in the international scene keeps them real.

However, the major foundations and think-tanks actively promote racial division, so that their own manipulation goes undetected or ignored and concerted action against their machinations is subverted.

Secondly, the fact that an Indian is being appointed doesn't make the appointment necessarily meritorious.

Such appointments seem to me to be a way of putting a "brown" face on policies (gun control, Obamacare) that are wildly unpopular with middle Americans of all colors (especially white) for ideological reasons. American culture at least in theory is libertarian.

Appointing brown faces gives mere political divisions a racial tinge, so that visceral feeling can be whipped up as needed. Mob feeling precludes rational analysis.

Gun control and Obamacare are unpopular because constitutionally they don't fly. They are also attacks on the mainstream of American self-perception and tradition, which is libertarian and not socialist.

By putting brown faces on socialist policies, the banking cartel which is identifiably white, Western, and Anglo-Jewish, deflects public anger from the real culprits onto Indo-Americans.

Then, on one hand, the Indo-Ams get conflated with all Indians as un-American by the center-right wing of the political spectrum (anti-socialist middle America) and their targets get vilified as criminals by the center-left wing of the political spectrum (as corrupt, anti-good governance, human rights abusers).

However, in fronting for the cartel's long-term agenda against India, as PB and Zeya have done, PB, Zeya etc. also provide cover for charges of racism against those policies.

These Indo-Ams are being used are TOOLS and bag-holders and may not know how they are being used. But they are not innocent.

PB is well aware that he has not prosecuted any high--profile criminals and has gone after people on petty offenses.

Zeya is an Asian woman and Democrat - since when do liberal Asian women support the stripping and voyeuristic abuse/rape of suspects, especially female suspects?

Tools are not victims.

[UlanBatori]

Tools are not victims.

True. They are not PRESENT victims, but intended to be FUTURE expendable casualties. win-win to the planners. I am not suggesting sympathy for the tools (SR is also a tool, very obviously), just that each may not have known - or realized too late- the full scope or purpose of their silo-ed actions. For instance, Zeya may have been asked to approve T-visas for these 3 poor injuns who are needed in a federal TRAFFICKING case to testify. PB was simply asked to arrest and prosecute. Each does something "straightforward" where refusal to cooperate would have been alien to their nature (and I am not elaborating on that), and hence their cooperation was assured.

So while as tools they are not *yet* seen to be **targets**, demonizing them may not be particularly productive - esp. as that makes us tools too - to demonize those future targets. Then again, we may be future targets too. How does one break this chain and get to those pulling it?

Note that someone decided to drop the "Trafficking" charge along the way, which begs the question: why was the "evacuation" of PR and two college-going kids justified or needed? And why are they still in the US now? They are not on asylum, not refugees, they were brought as WITNESSES per those visas (otherwise that was visa fraud). If they are not needed as witnesses since there is no trafficking charge, what is the basis for their continued stay? Are they still in the US? So maybe Bray of PiBs balked at the trafficking charge, leaving Zeya holding that bag.

Maybe the fact that PR's parents worked for Zeya was guaranteed to get Zeya's stamp on the T-visas without too many questions asked.

Notice that if was an asylum-persecution issue, then the parents are at possibly greater risk, as they are the ones who continue to work for the US embassy. So that reasoning does not hold water.

[UlanBatori]

Then again, per the other news todin - the fed court dissing SFJ's demand for more time - maybe this was what the GOI has been waiting for. If the court dismisses that suit, danger (of embarassment, mainly) to SG is past - Pandus-e-Dilli may want to go for chai-biskoot about "institutional fraud" at AES.

[member_28434]

Ulan Batori:

So while as tools they are not *yet* seen to be **targets**, demonizing them may not be particularly productive - esp. as that makes us tools too - to demonize those future targets

Yes, that is very astute. I don't think it's wise to pile on PB or Zeya, as such, or claim they are Uncle Toms, necessarily.

There are Toms in the media, although public officials are not Toms if they deal dispassionately with their own co-ethnics.

However, the accusation is that they (PB and Zeya) are NOT dealing dispassionately with them, but in effect targeting them....

The problem is complex.

I think looking higher up the food chain is warranted....
Good point about not demonizing expendable tools.
Even better point about not forgetting our own possible status as unsuspecting tools.

[Mahesh_R]

I am sure that patience is advisable. Time for suing is not yet there but it will be there. As long as the present case in not concluded in favour of DK that is the course of action. But as soon as case is decided in favour of Dk or dismissed even DK can sue.

MEA would be least interest abt DK's case..as of now DK is out of US and safely in India...happy ending for MEA ...
There are no retaliation from GoI or MEA...
I am hearing the story that GoI will take retaliation once
1) DK gets Immunity
2) DK is Out of US
3) DK's case is NOT dismissed or in favor of DK
4) DK ....
5) Now SG case in the CoUS....
6) XYZ case..
7) ABC case...

It's like Docji's analogy between India and TSP..every time there is an attack GoI says next time if this happens you will see different response from India.. and cycle continues...

The story goes on... I understand IFS lobby might be looking for some retaliation for what happened to DK but MEA or GoI will NOT take any actions with respect to interests of GoUS..
What happened to Jan 16th or Jan 9th date when they asked to CLOSE all the business activities in the Embassy ?
What happened to tax returns or pay slips requested by MEA from Embassy ? this was supposed to be in Dec..and the excuse was Christmas which was like 45 days back...is the embassy still in Christmas mode ???
What happened to the probe of Embassy school ?

Nothing HAPPENED and nothing is GOING TO HAPPEN...atleast with the current GoI incharge..

All that IFS lobby can do is sit for a drink and curse the MEA ...
I hope their Moral is NOT down and still have India's interest in their heart...

[member_28434]

why was the "evacuation" of PR and two college-going kids justified or needed?

They would have had to face trial in Delhi High Court for aggravated harassment and extortion and visa fraud. Children could have been witnesses that went against Sangeeta's claim of abuse, since they'd told friends how happy she was.

[UlanBatori]

Ah! But those are not grounds for a T-visa which is a non-immigrant visa. May be grounds for refugee visa, but that is not what happened. So one could argue that the intent was all along to file some silly charge of Trafficking, use the filing to apply for a T-visa, and get these ppl here to work as lifelong domestic workers for sr. US bureaucrats - then of course the charge is dropped as being silly. If I were a T-Party COTUSperson, those are grounds to demand an investigation into trafficking BY the SD, are they not? What's Zeya going to say: "Oh I THOUGHT..."????

So I think that investigation IS needed. Right now SD's interest would be in covering this part up and get everyone to forget about the trafficking charge.

[chaanakya]

Nothing HAPPENED and nothing is GOING TO HAPPEN...atleast with the current GoI incharge.. ...

Couldn't agree with you more.

[UlanBatori]

Secondly, the fact that an Indian is being appointed doesn't make the appointment necessarily meritorious. Such appointments seem to me to be a way of putting a "brown" face on policies (gun control, Obamacare) that are wildly unpopular with middle Americans of all colors (especially white) for ideological reasons. American culture at least in theory is libertarian.

Well... these ppl are actually quite competent in their jobs. Look at the high-profile names so far. Jindal (republican I know) but seems to be a reasonably competent governor. First in LA to not have been indicted, after multiple years as governor
SC guvnor - stays out of the news, which means quite competent.
PB - whatever we may think of him, seems to be doing SOMETHING. Credentials excellent.
Zeya - Effective. Covered up for HC and others and stonewalled the barking republicans very effectively.
And now the new Surgeon General appt - that is a big deal, you know, lots of face time, esp in telling ppl to eat less and exercise. Excellent credentials.

OF COURSE each of these had to be a loyal follower of whatever party/leader to move up so fast and so high at a young age. But competent they are. Also compare to appointments in India. Congress Party Leader PM candidate Ministers for various critical functions, like External Affairs The Good Ol'BoysNGals appointed in the US are usually like that onlee as well, too often.

I don't know if you remember the benchmarks that I can remember: Ed Meese (y would u be a suspect if u r not guilty?) Attorney General. And any number of other appointees to the EPA, Sec. of Labor, ambassador to Norway, Bush amby to Mexico... Compared to any of them, IA appointees have solid, solid credentials, and actually do deliver on the job.

[Lilo]

....Now by breaking away from its strict equidistance policy and supporting the Hasina Wajed government, China is seeking to warm up to India as well and drive home the message that it would be only too happy to work with India in the region. That this comes at a time when India-US relations are at a low following l’affaire Devyani is significant. Chinese officials have previously dropped broad hints to Indian diplomats that the deep sea port they plan to build at Sonadia off the Cox’s Bazar coast would be useful to India in accessing its Northeast. Beijing is keen to draw India out of the US ambit and what better time than now? The expression of support for Wajed, who is seen as close to India is, for China, like killing two birds with an arrow....

http://forums.bharat-rakshak.com/viewto ... 9#p1589689

Now as RD ji averred at the beginning of the DK issue the takleef due to disappointment in BD probably contributed to the collective khujli in SD as expressed in the humiliation meted to IFS symbolized in this case by DK.

[member_28434]

So one could argue that the intent was all along to file some silly charge of Trafficking,

Yes, of course. That is the conspiracy FACT. It's obvious that the SD needed a high-profile victim for a trafficking case to make their NGO agenda valid; the eye eff ess babus fit the bill.

That group also fits the bill for anti-Indian sovereignty propaganda (check the comments on media reporting on this by sock-puppet brigade) centering around the Babu-Neta complex...

Anti-Indian sovereignty rhetoric is tied to pro-AAP rhetoric.

This tying of the DK case to the pro-AAP position is very, very interesting...and a dead give-away that it is a foreign-funded nexus.

The eye-eff-ess constitutes the Babu side....

Under the cover of "the liberal," "human rights," anti-Babu/Neta, good governance rhetorical onslaught, the realpolitik Machiavellian agenda is to cripple the diplomatic image of India to further the "failed state" accusation....

Devolution of all "other" states is the agenda for the Anglo-Zionist globalist cartel.

Such complexity undeniably shows the hand of intelligence agencies, which in turn means it is a long-term strategy to Balkanize the Indian state and provoke feuds internally and with neighbors.

The SingaporeGuru preaching Singapore (cited on this forum) as a model for India is wrong on that point, but he is right that having good (that is, trade-based, cordial, strong, firm, and quid-pro-quo) relations with neighbors, great and small, neutralizes both Robert Clives and Mir Jaffirs in the making.

[member_28434]

Jindal (republican I know) but seems to be a reasonably competent governor. First in LA to not have been indicted, after multiple years as governor
SC guvnor - stays out of the news, which means quite competent.
PB - whatever we may think of him, seems to be doing SOMETHING. Credentials excellent.
Zeya - Effective. Covered up for HC and others and stonewalled the barking republicans very effectively.

Of these, Jindal is actually the best-credentialed (outstanding) and the most competent.

PB might be smart and embedded in political machinery (he has to be to get that job) but word is he is only a mediocre prosecutor and his behavior (public proclamations) has been quite unethical on many things.

He lied in several cases. I think he is highly political.

Zeya is a mediocrity from all accounts.

I don't think brown faces in very high places are therefore the most competent, either among the general population or even among their own.

A few are, but mostly they reach such positions because they have shown their willingness to be tools.

Truly smart and dedicated people with integrity work in different kinds of places (academic, business, self-employed) They don't covet power and glamorous positions nor are they given them by the elites as they would constitute obstacles there.

The elites need people who are ambitious, unscrupulous, not very bright, well-credentialed (to support "meritocracy" hogwash) rather than brilliant or original . They want people who are malleable not independent.

[UlanBatori]

(sigh! there go my last hopes of getting one of these appts - with au pair, "evacuated nanny", and guarantee of a Board Directorship with $$$B stock options when my Master is voted out .. No ambition (or would I b hiyar, I pooch u?) No talent for crooked-musharraf-osculating, No looks to be a WH Intern, nor the other kinds of credentials.) Time to go off to my 1923 Yak-kord and get back on the Slik Road.

[Vayutuvan]

Now as RD ji averred at the beginning of the DK issue the takleef due to disappointment in BD probably contributed to the collective khujli in SD as expressed in the humiliation meted to IFS symbolized in this case by DK.

Yes. That is quite prescient. Something to be followed through by GOI people with more insight and knowledge of current affairs than the general public. A benevolent view of GOI actions would be that a few pawns on either side got sacrificed to gain advantage elsewhere and a few plys down the tree.

[Vayutuvan]

(sigh! there go my last hopes of getting one of these appts -

I think lot of amriki BRFites fit that profile like hand-in-glove.
Just to clarify - your profile - not the ambitious ones' profile.

[Rony]

Just as i expected

Nadella makes no mention of his Indian background

With Indians in a swoon over one of their own making it to the top of the food chain at Microsoft, you would expect Satya Nadella to give a shout-out to his country of birth, his heritage.

There has been none so far. And not for the lack of opportunity — he has had plenty of chances to do that, starting with a rambling email to his employees.

The section on himself — sub-titled “Who am I? — makes no mention of Hyderabad, India, or Manipal Institute of Technology, together accounting for more than a third of his life.

The first and only nod to his past is a mention in his bio released by Microsoft. “Birthplace: Hyderabad, India”. And that he loves cricket, which he has compared to Russian novels.

There was no mention in his interaction with customers and partners on Tuesday shortly after the announcement, which was streamed live from the company’s Redmond, Washington HQs.

Nadella came to the US more than 25 years ago, and he is today an American citizen, much as Steve Ballmer and Bill Gates, whom he has succeeded.

But India is not just a part of his past. The company that he heads now is a market leader in India’s enterprise software market, with over 31% market share.

[Amber G.]

Wrt:

...
<snip> <....>

Amber,

IANAL. .

Shreeman - No need for tension sirji, TINLA.

(Link to "falsearrest dot com type websites were given more as a jest than anything else, but that was obvious)

***

Seriously, from my (some what limited) personal experience , and some case I know fairly well, and still others quite well publicized, civil suit remedy is nothing to sneeze at. In my case (or cases involving where we were involved) this kind of remedy happened to be VERY successful. Okay US justice system is bad, not perfect (which system is?) but in these cases (where authorities did not act properly) the success rate for us was virtual 100%. I won't go in details , as the cases I know are not exceptions and what happens normally in US can easily be looked at and one can form their own opinion.

***

Just one example, a data point, and something interested people should learn from. Those interested, if you don't know the details, please read -- KKK's (a racist group) downfall was primary due to bankrupting it through civil suits.

Let me just quote this from wiki's (please see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morris_Dees if you are unfamiliar with this ...
(Note that in many cases described below, the goons were not held accountable in criminal cases)

Dees was one of the principal architects of an innovative strategy of using civil lawsuits to secure a court judgment for money damages against an organization for a wrongful act and then use the courts to seize its assets (money, land, buildings, other property) to pay the judgment.

SPLC lawyers used this legal strategy to hold the Klan accountable for the acts of its members. In 1981, Dees successfully sued the Ku Klux Klan and won a $7 million judgment for the mother of Michael Donald, a black lynching victim in Alabama.[8][9] Payment of the judgment bankrupted the United Klans of America and resulted in its national headquarters being sold to help satisfy the judgment. All funds secured in this manner were paid to the family of the deceased.
A decade later, in 1991, Dees obtained a judgment of $12 million against Tom Metzger's White Aryan Resistance.[8] He was also instrumental in securing a $6.5 million judgment against Aryan Nations in 2001. Dees' most famous cases have involved landmark damage awards that have driven several prominent neo-Nazi groups into bankruptcy, effectively causing them to disband and re-organize under different names and different leaders.

[/quote]

(PB or some institutions are difficult to sue because the immunity they enjoy, but I believe DSS, NYPD, investigators and others ought to be worried..)