Geopolitical thread

The Strategic Issues & International Relations Forum is a venue to discuss issues pertaining to India's security environment, her strategic outlook on global affairs and as well as the effect of international relations in the Indian Subcontinent. We request members to kindly stay within the mandate of this forum and keep their exchanges of views, on a civilised level, however vehemently any disagreement may be felt. All feedback regarding forum usage may be sent to the moderators using the Feedback Form or by clicking the Report Post Icon in any objectionable post for proper action. Please note that the views expressed by the Members and Moderators on these discussion boards are that of the individuals only and do not reflect the official policy or view of the Bharat-Rakshak.com Website. Copyright Violation is strictly prohibited and may result in revocation of your posting rights - please read the FAQ for full details. Users must also abide by the Forum Guidelines at all times.
Paul
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3801
Joined: 25 Jun 1999 11:31

Re: Geopolitical thread

Post by Paul »

a. "Until US forces are there in Afghanistan a Taliban resurgence cannot happen and in a perverse way I think is not in India's interest. However can Pakistan make headway in Afghanistan's pashtun areas after 2014 remains to be seen. " -- I don't get it. If you have the time, could you pl elaborate: Are you saying its a good sign or a bad sign, from the Indian perspective.
As I said before, US presence in Afghanistan will also help sanctify the Durand line. That is not desirable for India as an unstable Durand line will bring Pakhtuns on both sides together. That will give more strength to the Tabilan to take on the Pakjabi establishment.

However if Pakistan gets access to Afghan real estate to base it's military hardware, that could be a problem for India (ironically US presence also thwarts this from happening).

b. Even if West-Russia hots up, why will China have to come hard against India in the near term? IMHO, I am thinking they are looking more at the seas - the SCS, ECS, Spratly, Zhongye, Ieodo, Diaoyo [Senkaku] are vastly more important currently as they are pushing for a naval presence and get into a dominance on the ECS, SCS and get a stranglehold on the regions in the 9-dash line. Is that not true and more important for them in terms of priority.
It is logistics, not tactics. No telling what PRC is thinking, some of their neighbours in the east have US umbrella protection whereas India does not have any such luxury. Their navy is not yet ready to take on expeditionary activities for the next decade even on their seaboard with US navy domination of the Pacific. A sane leader would never take that risk.

I think when the time comes, they will strike where they have max opportunity is. After 1950, in all the places they fought - Korea-USSR-Vietnam-India, they got the max returns with India...Hence they can try again here. Will keep India down for another 30 years and cow down their other neighbours. Japan has US protection, Taiwan is a golden goose, will get absorbed in due course of time...and the other side shows - ADIZ etc. on the high seas are good theatre for CNN.
vijaykarthik
BRFite
Posts: 1169
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: Geopolitical thread

Post by vijaykarthik »

Agreed. Chuckle.

Very interesting points. thanks

Update: just happened to see this link. Strengthens your thoughts / words:

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/04/ ... me=topNews
ramana
Forum Moderator
Posts: 60273
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30

Re: Geopolitical thread

Post by ramana »

Vijaykarthik, Ghani is another Pasthun and will divide the Pashtun vote. Rasool has better chance. Lets see in May when the results are announced. Might lead to run off.

In GDF we have started our own version of GJP. Still trying to figure out how to go about. Still in the forming stages. Maybe you might want to lend a hand.

BRF: GJP


Am going to x-post your comments on the median vs mean to bring more insight from a participant.
Philip
BRF Oldie
Posts: 21537
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30
Location: India

Re: Geopolitical thread

Post by Philip »

The Centenary of WW! is almost upon us.The UK Independent newspaper is doing a superb 100 days of special reports on how Europe blundered itself into a world war that killed millions upon millions.Here is evidence of what Gandhi called a "good idea",European civilisation in full form.

A History of the First World War in 100 Moments: Austro-Hungarian army executes civilians in Serbia

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world ... 44674.html
The shocking, black-and-white photograph, taken on the edge of a Serbian village just days after it was invaded by the massed forces of the Austro-Hungarian army in the late summer of 1914, is not the only one of its kind. In this one, a line of Serbian men in civilian clothes are attached to posts: possibly dead already, possibly awaiting execution by firing squad.

There are others. In one, three women in colourful peasant costumes and four men in dark suits are trussed up like helpless game birds on crucifix-shaped poles, their faces covered with white blindfolds, while soldiers stand nearby, rifles in hand. In a third, the civilians, also blindfolded, are kneeling in a semi-circle, each tied to a small post, while the firing squad takes aim.

These photographs were almost certainly taken by members of the Austro-Hungarian army. They allow only fleeting glimpses of the horror experienced by civilians almost immediately after the invasion of Serbia began on 12 August 1914.

The military justification for the massacre of civilians was that many were “partisans” engaged in a guerrilla war against the invading forces. As early as 17 August, the Austro-Hungarian general, Lothar vonHortstein, complained that it was impossible to send reconnaissance patrols into Serb territory because “all were killed by the rural people”. But it is also certain that popular anti-Serb sentiment gave the military the impression it had been given carte blanche to commit atrocities. A popular song in Vienna in August of that year was entitled “Alle Serben müssen sterben” (“All Serbs must die”).

Anti-Serb propaganda postcards on sale in the Austrian capital depicted Serbs as backward “Untermenschen” or “Sub humans” – a term later used by Adolf Hitler and the Nazis to describe Jews and Slavs. Some advocated that Serbs should be boiled alive in cauldrons or stuck on forks and eaten.


The Austrian empire was bent on avenging the Serb nationalist assassination of its heir to throne, Archduke Franz Ferdinand, with brutality on a scale so far unprecedented in modern war. Much has been written about the German massacre of Belgian civilians during the opening stages of the Great War. Far less has been told about Austro-Hungary’s treatment of Serbia’s civilian population.

The anti-civilian offensive has been described as the beginning of a type of warfare dubbed “Vernichtungskrieg”, or “war of destruction”, ruthlessly practised by Nazi Germany on civilian populations across Europe just over a quarter of a century later.
Anton Holzer, an Austrian historian and expert on the Austro-Hungarian invasion of Serbia in 1914, wrote: “There were countless and systematic massacres carried out against the Serbian population.

“The soldiers invaded villages and rounded up unarmed men, women and children. They were either shot dead, bayoneted to death or hanged. The victims were locked into barns and burned alive. Women were sent up to the front lines and mass-raped. The inhabitants of whole villages were taken as hostages and humiliated and tortured. The perpetrators were the soldiers of the Austro-Hungarian army.”


Austria's Atrocities. Blindfolded and in a kneeling position, patriotic Jugo-Slavs in Serbia near the Austrian lines were arranged in a semi-circle and ruthlessly shot at a command Austria's Atrocities. Blindfolded and in a kneeling position, patriotic Jugo-Slavs in Serbia near the Austrian lines were arranged in a semi-circle and ruthlessly shot at a command
Much of the evidence of Austro-Hungarian war crimes against Serbia’s civilian population was collected by the Swiss criminology professor, Rodolphe Archibald Reiss, who as a neutral observer was asked by the Serbian government to investigate. Reiss reported in 1916 that countless Austro-Hungarian troops confirmed having received orders to attack and massacre the Serbian civilian population and that “everything was permissible”.
PS:Following up on the Nazi atrocities of WW2,the West has kept up the traditions in post WW2 conflicts from Korea,Vietnam,the Middle East,Af-Pak to this day.
vijaykarthik
BRFite
Posts: 1169
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: Geopolitical thread

Post by vijaykarthik »

early poll results seem to suggest Rassoul is kinda out of contention. A potential game changer? WOW.

Might be a runoff between Ghani and Abdullah. Now I wonder how much did US play its hands discreetly? [Karzai's hand has been underplayed or what?] What will this outcome mean for India now?

PS: Final election results will take an enormous time. Not available till mid of May. However, a quick peek after a few rounds of counting seem to suggest what I mentioned above.

Both Ghani / Abdullah will mean lesser Karzai influence or so I think... makes it very interesting s Abdullah gets the Tajik block and Ghani can garner Pashtun support? Lets wait and see the first round results. Mostly it will be a runoff.
pankajs
BRF Oldie
Posts: 14746
Joined: 13 Aug 2009 20:56

Re: Geopolitical thread

Post by pankajs »

Paul Lewis ‏@PaulLewis 1h

Venezuelan President Nicolás Maduro tells the Guardian the US is behind a Ukraine-style intervention in his country: http://gu.com/p/3z99b/tw
Guardian news ‏@guardiannews 1h

Venezuela protests are sign that US wants our oil, says Nicolás Maduro http://gu.com/p/3z99b/tf
Its oil reserves make it a big prize, perhaps one of the biggest as far as US supply situation is concerned.
Prem
BRF Oldie
Posts: 21234
Joined: 01 Jul 1999 11:31
Location: Weighing and Waiting 8T Yconomy

Re: Geopolitical thread

Post by Prem »

I have this gut feeling that mess up in Ukraine is Monkey Trap made to divert Russia's attention toward WEST for long time and not look EAST. It is becoming clear now that Russia now sense the eventual opportunity to finish the Great Game under Putin by getting access to warm water via Iran. China is the only holding power not letting Asia to decide its own destiny. Once the wisdom dawn on them, they will automatically sit on Asian leadreship seat without firing any shot. Obama have lost so much trust and credibilty that Asian Pivot Panga will remain only Khaanapuri by all sides. IMHO, this will most probably go on for next decade and half and time for India to consolidate under godsend Modi leadership.
ramana
Forum Moderator
Posts: 60273
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30

Re: Geopolitical thread

Post by ramana »

If its runoff between Ghani and Abdullah then Pashtun vote consolidation will occur and Ghani wins. Based on historical factors of Afghanistan.
How much will US support him after that is to be seen.
svinayak
BRF Oldie
Posts: 14222
Joined: 09 Feb 1999 12:31

Re: Geopolitical thread

Post by svinayak »

GodSend leadership
Samudragupta
BRFite
Posts: 625
Joined: 12 Nov 2010 23:49
Location: Some place in the sphere

Re: Geopolitical thread

Post by Samudragupta »

ramana wrote:If its runoff between Ghani and Abdullah then Pashtun vote consolidation will occur and Ghani wins. Based on historical factors of Afghanistan.
How much will US support him after that is to be seen.
Ramana Ji ,

My point is that Abdullah is seen as Tajik and Ghani will be seen as American Governor....Ghani may not be seen as Pustun...hence pustun consolidation may not happen behind him....interestingly Taliban may also doesnt want Ghani in the helm....a Tajik at the helm will always further the Taliban(read Tribal Pustun) cause....
ramana
Forum Moderator
Posts: 60273
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30

Re: Geopolitical thread

Post by ramana »

SG, have you talked to expat Afghans? They all seem to converge on Pasthun leadership as the legitimate Afghan leadership. So they will rally behind Ghani.

Is Ghani, a Durrani or Ghilzai?


I think the former.
ashish raval
BRFite
Posts: 1389
Joined: 10 Aug 2006 00:49
Location: London
Contact:

Re: Geopolitical thread

Post by ashish raval »

Jhujar wrote:I have this gut feeling that mess up in Ukraine is Monkey Trap made to divert Russia's attention toward WEST for long time and not look EAST. It is becoming clear now that Russia now sense the eventual opportunity to finish the Great Game under Putin by getting access to warm water via Iran. China is the only holding power not letting Asia to decide its own destiny. Once the wisdom dawn on them, they will automatically sit on Asian leadreship seat without firing any shot. Obama have lost so much trust and credibilty that Asian Pivot Panga will remain only Khaanapuri by all sides. IMHO, this will most probably go on for next decade and half and time for India to consolidate under godsend Modi leadership.
World does not accept a super power who had not fired a shot on ground that is the ultimate truth. At best it is soft power and this is the reason China is doing khujli all around in China sea to prove that they are out there to crush non nuclear small states and prove their might.
Paul
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3801
Joined: 25 Jun 1999 11:31

Re: Geopolitical thread

Post by Paul »

Paul wrote:One of the key reasons for confrontation between Russia and the west over Ukraine is that the west (neo-cons ) see their victory in the Cold war as incomplete. Altgough they have gained access to Oil in Baku region but they have still not been able to gain hold of the vast Oil, metal, timber and other natural resources of Siberia and Arctic region yet. They made some progress when Russia was ruled by Yeltsin. They humiliated Russia in the Balkans too but this was not enough. This is why they were mad with the Clintons as Bill Clinton in their view did not press home the advantage of the Russian retreat in eastern Europe.
Lest We Forget: Neo-conservatives and Republican Foreign Policy, 1976-2000
Most of the super-hawks that populated Reagan's cabinet were culled from the ranks of the advocacy group Committee on the Present Danger. The Committee, formed in 1976, was organized by fanatically anti-communist neo-conservatives with little patience for the give-and-take of Nixon/Carter diplomacy. Once viewed as extremists with minimal influence on policy debates, Reagan's victory brought the Committee to the center of power, the reigns of policy delivered into its lap. The arms control process was hijacked, beheaded and left to rot besides the discarded corpse of d�tente.

Once in power, these men geared US policy toward forcing the Soviets to accept US strategic superiority, if not humiliating defeat. Outraged by the fact of Soviet nuclear parity as enshrined in the ABM accord of 1972, they sought to move beyond the stabilizing strictures of Mutual Assured Destruction into a brave new world of effective first-strikes and laser defenses.
Obama is a lone wolf. SD neo cons are driving US policy on Ukraine.
Johann
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2075
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30

Re: Geopolitical thread

Post by Johann »

Carter turned from a proponent of detente to a confrontation between Brezhnev's decision to deploy SS-20s to the Warsaw Pact and the invasion of Afghanistan.

Obama is undergoing a similar transformation over Crimea after having pushed an agenda of 'reset'.

Both of them were domestically and internationally embarrassed by the fact that Moscow chose shows of strength when Washington was trying to look conciliatory, and tried to compensate by looking tough as well.

The difference from the Neo-Cons is that they've always been clear on the Russia policy, which is that Russia is to be treated as irrelevant and its concerns are to be ignored, or if it is difficult then it is to be pressured.

The Neocons never liked Yeltsin. Western businesses didn't do particularly well in Russia because of the violence and corruption, which could be traced straight back to the Kremlin. They also really didn't like whom Russia was selling high technology to - particularly Iran and China. In a state where everything was for sale, there was a lot of worry about how far things were going. They also really took exception to its diplomatic support for Saddam's Iraq, which was always a particular NeoCon obsession after 1990.
ShauryaT
BRF Oldie
Posts: 5405
Joined: 31 Oct 2005 06:06

Re: Geopolitical thread

Post by ShauryaT »

>>Obama is undergoing a similar transformation over Crimea after having pushed an agenda of 'reset'.

Obama has sent only one message so far. I am not interested in the affairs of the world. He is fully living up to the democratic party's FP adage. No Spine.
svinayak
BRF Oldie
Posts: 14222
Joined: 09 Feb 1999 12:31

Re: Geopolitical thread

Post by svinayak »

A good example of the thesis is the way how Germans dealt with the Games in Sotchi. Hardly anyone watched the opening ceremony, despite ballet and acrobats. It was not praised by the media, too. Reporters persistently tried to keep a distance, eager to avoid uttering a word of which could be concluded that they like it. Very strange behaviour. The authors gives the impression that Germany is still a country of culture. That is wrong.
Johann
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2075
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30

Re: Geopolitical thread

Post by Johann »

ShauryaT wrote:>>Obama is undergoing a similar transformation over Crimea after having pushed an agenda of 'reset'.

Obama has sent only one message so far. I am not interested in the affairs of the world. He is fully living up to the democratic party's FP adage. No Spine.
There's no question that is the impression that many have formed.

My impression is different, and its based in part on the accounts of the many people who have served in the administration and have now left.

Obama unlike Bush likes hearing a lot of detail about problems, and a lot of contradictory advice. That's very healthy.

He keeps his own counsel. That's also healthy.

Unlike Bush he struggles to make decisions and remain committed to them. That's very unhealthy.

In other words he loves complexity, but isn't actually very good at dealing with it. He really needed a couple of decades dealing with foreign policy questions before he became president, but he chose not to do that.

But I really couldn't and wouldn't call him spineless. When he does achieve clarity on something, he's a very powerful and effective leader. The decision to hit Bin Laden was on a 50-50 intelligence assessment, with *huge* potential risks, and it doesn't seem to have been driven by anyone else around him. He was clear about this as far back as the election debates with McCain back in 2008.

No state has ever conducted an overt direct action mission on the soil of another nuclear power before. He had to be willing to shoot down half the PAF to get the teams out, and then risk having the supply lines to an entire expeditionary army in Afghanistan shut down. No wonder his own Secretary of Defence initially recommended a drone strike instead of an SF raid, but Obama wanted the certainty of IDing and killing OBL if he was there.

Its just a pity that there are so few things he is this clear on. For the rest his 'team of rivals' approach to governance just produces muddled policy that he sort of floats above.
abhishek_sharma
BRF Oldie
Posts: 9664
Joined: 19 Nov 2009 03:27

Re: Geopolitical thread

Post by abhishek_sharma »

Paul
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3801
Joined: 25 Jun 1999 11:31

Re: Geopolitical thread

Post by Paul »

http://www.sunday-guardian.com/news/oba ... F8.twitter
According to a senior official, "President Obama does not share Hillary Clinton's confrontational approach and her preference for Sonia Gandhi, and is looking to establish a pragmatic partnership with India should Modi become the Prime Minister". Hence the search "for a US envoy who would be different from (former ambassador) Nancy Powell's Clinton-style hostile approach to Modi, and to find an individual who could be expected to bond with the new PM and his team". According to these sources, President Obama "is alarmed at the steep downslide in India-US ties caused by Hillary-style crusades, and wants the relationship to be even better than what it was under the Bush presidency".

Recent remarks by Narendra Modi indicate that the BJP's standard bearer is ready to reciprocate the hand of amity proffered by Team Obama to the BJP's PM nomine
If true, another data point to support my argument that Obama's policies are helping Indian interests - directly/indirectly. Looks like the NGO infiltration policy is Hillary's brainchild.

Her SIL whose name I forget is a supporter of the NSCN and provides funding to the organization.
vijaykarthik
BRFite
Posts: 1169
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: Geopolitical thread

Post by vijaykarthik »

^^^ she is a pretty poor leader with an even poorer track record. About the only foreign pol success she could talk about , was in Burma [Myanmar]. And Myanmar just got into trouble reverting to its old ways. [So in effect, a pretty big 0 as far as implementation of for pol is concerned]

Interestingly, she wants to become president and supposedly a front runner too. Ouch. When the US so seriously looks at regime change everywhere else, does anyone work actively towards regime change in the great country too?
member_28352
BRFite
Posts: 1205
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: Geopolitical thread

Post by member_28352 »

So did HillBilly Clintoon take money from Sant Singh Chatwal or not? What are her funding sources? What's her relationship with Charles Schumer like? Heard that Schumer is an even bigger retard with respect to India than HillyBilly. Apparently sarkari wakil Bharara is a Schumer chamcha.
Lilo
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4080
Joined: 23 Jun 2007 09:08

Re: Geopolitical thread

Post by Lilo »

Graphic on China petro linkages (2011)

Image
vijaykarthik
BRFite
Posts: 1169
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: Geopolitical thread

Post by vijaykarthik »

I used to like preet Bharara earlier when he took on the Wall Street honchos and brought them down. It needs character, courage and gumption to bring guys like Rajat Gupta under the law and put them behind bars.

However, I don't know why he was so stuck up over the Devyani incident when all the odds were stacked against him. Was it a case of the subject acting more loyal to the empire than the king?
Philip
BRF Oldie
Posts: 21537
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30
Location: India

Re: Geopolitical thread

Post by Philip »

It was the US and West which armed Saddam with his arsenal of conventional weaponry,chem weapons and WMD tech.,which he used to good effect to gas thousands of Kurds,with the West's blessings and they launched him into the Iran-Iraq War with their backing.

It was only after he refused to obey orders from Washington and started getting bolshie with Israel that the alarm bells started ringing.His Kuwait "take-away" with the then reported acquiescence of the then US ambassador,and stubbornness to leave Kuwait after the lesson, (he could've asked for a multi-national UN force and interim administration to sort out the issue of slant-drilling into Iraq's oilfield by Kuwait and saved himself from invasion) was used to mobilise a UN force to boot him out.

With the West in full retreat from the Asian/Middle East region,upsetting its monarchist "oily" bum-chums sprinkled around the Persian Gulf,new alliances are beign negotiated and born,which will involve closer coordination and interaction between the nations of the region eschewing the influence of the Euro-Peons and the Yanquis.Their selfish neo-imperialist agenda has suffered a great fall by the licking they've received at the hands of camel drivers and poppy farmers in recent times!

Here's lovely ditty from WW1 ,the war whose centenary we are commemorating, written by a soldier of the British 63rd Div.
I do not wish to hurt you

But (Bang!) I feel I must.

It is a Christian virtue

To lay you in the dust.

You – (Zip! That bullet got you)

You’re really better dead.

I’m sorry that I shot you –

Pray, let me hold your head.
pankajs
BRF Oldie
Posts: 14746
Joined: 13 Aug 2009 20:56

Re: Geopolitical thread

Post by pankajs »

Disarmament is for wimps. Go get your nukes if you can

http://blogs.timesofindia.indiatimes.co ... if-you-can
All my life I have opposed nuclear bombs. I have argued that such bombs are basically unusable; that, instead of ensuring security, they risk escalation of small conflicts into disasters; and that they lead to undesirable macho foreign policies. Most Indians exulted after India’s nuclear tests of 1998, claiming India was now a great power on par with the US. I cautioned that India was merely on par with Pakistan and North Korea. However, after seeing Ukraine bullied by Russia, I have to revise my views. Nukes are not useless, and may be essential deterrents.

Ukraine was one of a dozen new states created when the Soviet Union broke up in 1991. It emerged independent with a massive 1,190 nuclear warheads, more than the arsenals of Britain, France and China combined.

But it mistakenly thought that the Soviet collapse heralded the end of Moscow’s domination. So, it agreed to give up all its nukes and send them to Russia for destruction. In return, the US, Russia, and Britain signed the 1994 Budapest Memorandum on Security Assurances, pledging to safeguard Ukraine’s territorial sovereignty. This was greeted with universal applause.

Today, Ukraine knows it made a terrible mistake: it can no longer deter its powerful neighbour. Last month, Russia sent troops to annex Ukraine’s Crimea province. Now Russia threatens to split the rest of Ukraine, converting Eastern Ukraine (where a quarter of the population is ethnic Russian) into a puppet state, just as it earlier used armed muscle to convert the Russian-ethnic regions of South Ossetia and Abkhazia in Georgia into puppet states. Armed Russian infiltrators have teamed up with local ethnic Russians to seize major cities in eastern Ukraine. Ukrainian troops and police are too fearful of Russian firepower to offer much resistance. How they regret giving up nukes!

Last week’s Geneva talks proposed peace, but with no teeth at all. Neither the US nor the UK, both Budapest Memorandum guarantors, is willing to stop Russia militarily. They are reluctant to even impose stiff economic sanctions, since Putin could retaliate by slashing gas supplies to Europe and nationalizing Western investments in oil and gas.

Western security guarantees to Ukraine have proved as empty as those given to Czechoslovakia before World War II. When Hitler demanded the right to expand into Czechoslovakia to “protect” ethnic Germans there — the same excuse used by Putin to move into Eastern Ukraine — the Western powers gave in.

Putin’s words in a TV interview were straight out of Hitler’s book. “We definitely knowthat we should do everything to help these people (ethnic Russians) defend their rights and define their destiny . We will fight for this. The Federation Council (of Russia) gave the president the right to use military force in Ukraine. I hope very much that I don’t have to use this right.”

Most Indians are uninterested in a far-away country like Ukraine. Anti-US Indians are happy to see Putin bash the West. Yet the Putin principle is monstrous. How would readers react to Pakistan wanting to take over Muslim-inhabited areas in India to protect Muslims there? Or to Bangladesh taking over Assam to protect Bangladeshi migrants there?

India is militarily strong and so can resist any such threats. Ukraine, Georgia and most states cannot. The USSR once posed an existentialist threat to the West, which therefore took security guarantees seriously. But no more. The West will honour military commitments only when this is costless, or affects its core interests. Ukraine has taught the world not to depend on the promises of the mighty.

One consequence will be more nuclear proliferation. Japan and Korea have long avoided nukes, and depended on a US security umbrella. After Ukraine, they will think again. I predict both will go nuclear in a decade.
Saudi Arabia, fearful of Iran and Iraq, has long depended on US security guarantees, including steps to prevent Iran from getting an N-bomb . After the Ukraine fiasco, Saudi Arabia knows how hollow US assurances are, and will embark quietly on a nuclear plan. The US invaded Iraq and Afghanistan, and bombed Libya. Would it have done so if those countries had nuclear bombs? For an answer, look at North Korea. This country has violated the UN charter repeatedly, attacked South Korean ships, and poses a security threat to East Asia. But the US does not intervene because North Korea has nukes.

Lesson for non-nuclear states: don’t depend for security on the big powers who will dump you when convenient. Disarmament is for wimps. Go get your own nukes if you can. More nuclearization will deter some invasions, but also increases chances of a nuclear clash or accident. It is not a panacea. But it is now inevitable.
gunjur
BRFite
Posts: 602
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: Geopolitical thread

Post by gunjur »

Apologies if already posted.

Is an Asian NATO Possible?
In the new concluding chapter to his classic The Tragedy of Great Power Politics, John Mearsheimer argues: “There is already substantial evidence that countries like India, Japan, and Russia, as well as smaller powers like Singapore, South Korea, and Vietnam, are worried about China’s ascendancy and are looking for ways to contain it. In the end, they will join an American-led balancing coalition to check China’s rise, much the way Britain, France, Germany, Italy, Japan, and eventually China, joined forces with the United States during the Cold War to contain the Soviet Union.”

This is at odds with most analyses which postulate that Asia is not ripe for a NATO style containment block against China. For instance, in summing up the conventional wisdom on the subject, the Council on Foreign Relations’ Stewart Patrick opined last summer that: “Despite its strategic ‘rebalancing’ toward Asia, the United States is unlikely to sponsor a collective defense organization for the Asia-Pacific, for at least three reasons: insufficient solidarity among diverse regional partners, fear of alienating China, and the perceived advantages of bilateral and ad-hoc security arrangements.”

When placed in their historical perspective, these reasons seem insufficient to me. Let’s review them each in turn.

First, one of the main reasons many argue that a NATO-like organization could never work in Asia is because “the countries of the region retain diverse interests and regional priorities and (in the case of ROK-Japanese relations) insufficient levels of trust to band together.” The implication is that in the early Cold War Western Europeans had similar interests and high levels of trust, which allowed them to form the NATO alliance.

Nothing could be further from the truth. Although there is a considerable level of distrust between Japan and South Korea today, as well as between nations like Singapore, Malaysia, and Indonesia, this pales in comparison to the level of distrust France had for Germany, the U.K., and the United States in the early Cold War. Indeed, Germany had invaded France twice in the preceding decades and Paris was far more worried about a security threat emanating from West Germany than from the Soviet Union. That is why France adamantly opposed allowing West Germany to rearm and, when it failed to prevent this outcome, it built nuclear weapons.

France was also highly distrustful of the United Kingdom and the United States, albeit in different ways. Unlike with West Germany, France did not feel its security was directly threatened by the Anglo-American powers but Paris did not trust them to come to its aid in the event it was attacked. At the same time, it feared becoming entrapped by the budding U.S.-Soviet conflict.

Most—though not all—of this distrust was gradually overcome in time because of strong U.S. and British leadership as well as because of the threat posed by the Soviet Union. In this regard, it’s worth noting that Moscow’s threat to Western Europe following WWII was much greater than the military threat China poses to Eastern Asia now. Should the latter threat grow over the years, the squabbles between its neighbors are likely to fade over time.

Another supposed obstacle to a NATO-like organization in Asia is “the perceived advantages of bilateral and ad-hoc security arrangements.” As Patrick elaborates on the subject: “the United States is increasingly attracted to cooperation within flexible coalitions that can coalesce temporarily, as mechanisms for addressing regional as well as global security challenges.”

This again needs to be placed in its historical context. Following WWII, the U.S. rapidly demobilized its forces and began withdrawing them from Europe. It fought tooth and nail against being involved in a collective security organization like NATO as one might expect a regional hegemon to do. As such, the U.S. initially pursued bilateral and ad-hoc security arrangements. For example, some members of Congress proposed unilaterally extending the Monroe Doctrine to cover Western Europe, rather than sign a collective security treaty.

Most notably, however, the U.S. pushed the Western European nations to form a tighter collective security organization from which Washington would be excluded. The hope was that these states would be able to defend Western Europe from the Soviet threat without the assistance of the United States. Thus, in March 1948 the major Western European powers signed the Treaty of Brussels, which later that year they used to create the Western Union Defense Organization.

It was only when this proved insufficient, and the Soviet threat seemed to be growing (as evidenced by the Berlin blockade), that the U.S. reluctantly agreed to form NATO. Even so, the collective self-defense article in the NATO treaty is far less binding than the one in the Treaty of Brussels. Whereas Article IV of the Treaty of Brussels compelled the other states to respond to an attack on one of its members with military force, Article V of the NATO treaty merely compels members to take “such action as it deems necessary, including the use of armed force.”

Therefore, if a NATO member is attacked its allies are only obliged to provide some kind of assistance to it. This was hardly an oversight by the negotiators of the NATO Treaty, who spent the bulk of their time trying to find the best wording for Article V. As Secretary of State Dean Acheson—who was the lead U.S. negotiator following Harry Truman’s reelection in 1948—explained it to the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, Article V “does not mean that the United States would automatically be at war if one of the other signatory nations were the victim of an armed attack. Under our Constitution, the Congress alone has the power to declare war.”

Unconvinced, the Chairman of the Senate Foreign Relations at the time, Tom Connally, followed up by asking Acheson: “t is up to each country to determine for itself, is it not, what action it deems necessary to restore the security of the Atlantic Pact area?” to which Acheson responded: “There is no question about that, Senator. That is true.” Furthermore, while NATO came into being in 1949—the same year Mao conquered China and the Soviet Union tested its first nuclear weapon—it did not really become a potent military force until the Korean War. That’s because the U.S. and Western Europe viewed Kim Il-sung’s invasion of South Korea as a trial run for a Soviet invasion of the rest of the European continent.

In short, the U.S. preferring to rely on ad-hoc security arrangements is not surprising. However, this should not be taken to mean that it won’t reluctantly be pulled into a more formal region-wide security alliance should the threat posed by China grow.

The final obstacle Patrick and others see to a NATO-like organization in Asia is America and regional states’ fears of alienating China. This is probably the biggest obstacle to a collective security agreement in Asia because, unlike in post-WWII Europe, China has strong economic ties with most its neighbors. For most of these neighbors, this is not a case of interdependency with China—rather, China’s neighbors remain far more dependent on Beijing economically than vice-versa.

Still, this alone is unlikely to be enough to prevent the formation of a stronger collective security agreement. To begin with, when states’ economic and security interests are at complete odds, security interests usually win out if the state is under a large enough threat. This is true because a state must survive before it can prosper. Furthermore, if enough of China’s neighbors enter into a collective security arrangement together, China cannot go after them all economically without greatly hurting itself. While any one of the states may be more reliant on China economically than China is on any single neighbor, China is likely to be just as reliant on all of them as any single one of them is on China. (This is the same dynamic as in the security realm. While no single Asian state will be as powerful as China militarily, an alliance of a bunch of the major Asian states is likely to remain more powerful than China.)

Overcoming the fear of alienating China, then, is likely to be dependent on how large a threat China poses to the region. As noted above, China is not currently as menacing as the Soviet Union was to Europe in the late 1940s. Furthermore, it took a number of strong catalysts from the Soviet Union and its allies (Berlin, nuclear weapon testing, Communists winning in China and the Korean War) to compel the U.S. and its Atlantic allies to form a collective security arrangement. The same is likely to prove true in Asia. While no immediate Asian NATO is likely to be forthcoming, this could change very quickly if China takes a brazen action such as invading Taiwan or the Senkaku Islands.
Philip
BRF Oldie
Posts: 21537
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30
Location: India

Re: Geopolitical thread

Post by Philip »

Given the fragile relationships that exist in this period of Post-colonial history of Asia,and it is not even a century ago,the "divide and rule" fissures that were created by the West,US and UK in particular,Kashmir a "cancer that was planted" says veteran US analyst Friedman,bringing together the various smaller states of Asia into a NATO like institution is most unlikely .Europe and the EU on the other hand,with states all Christian and most former parts of the Roman empire,bonded together with the "treaty of Rome"-no accident as to its naming and place of signing,as a 20th century latter-day Roman Empire.NATO represents the former legions of Rome which had many soldiers from the Roman colonies.In like manner has NATO assembled a menagerie of mercenary forces,from Ottoman Turks,to Balkan Muslims,to do their throat-cutting across the globe.

NATO was meant to defend Europe against Soviet invasion,but that was part of its mission.The secret protocol was to wage war anywhere on the globe protecting Western interests,especially those of the Anglo-Saxon "5 eyes" white nations (US,UK,Canada,Oz and NZ) dubbed by some as Atlanticists.From time to time a common enemy was produced out of a hat,villified for true or false misdemeanours,his land invaded,scorched,raped,plundered looted with all manner of war crimes committed,equal too or even worse than Hitler and his Nazis.Sometimes these victims were erstwhile allies who were betrayed for their stirrings of independent thought and action. Today NATO in full retreat from Asia wants to "repivot" to Europe in a faceoff with Russia! I salute its courageous actions.If one remembers what happened to the armies of Napoleon and Hitler,Western Europe's two greatest invaders,clearly the old adage,"fools step in where angels fear to tread" comes immediately to mind!

In fact the Crimea-in the hotspots today comes to mind for that most famous or infamous military debacle,the "Charge of the Light Brigade",where in the face of overwhelming Russian odds situated on three sides of a valley with cannon all around them,thanks to a spectacular communication lapse,the Light Brigade rode to their doom.Historians today are still debating who was to blame and a new book is coming out with new-found letters from those who took part in the charge.NATO contemplating pushing its troops into Poland,the doormat of Europe,is yet another example of history that might repeat itself as farce.

So what about Asia then? What is most likely in the face of US and NATO mischief,is that the independent states will bond together in various forums like the NAM,and may even end up in an Asia version of that Roman triumvirate that grasped power in the aftermath of Caesar's assassination,but this time principally between Russia ,China and India,to ward off another 500 years of European domination..
JwalaMukhi
BRFite
Posts: 1635
Joined: 28 Mar 2007 18:27

Re: Geopolitical thread

Post by JwalaMukhi »

Johann wrote:No state has ever conducted an overt direct action mission on the soil of another nuclear power before. He had to be willing to shoot down half the PAF to get the teams out, and then risk having the supply lines to an entire expeditionary army in Afghanistan shut down. No wonder his own Secretary of Defence initially recommended a drone strike instead of an SF raid, but Obama wanted the certainty of IDing and killing OBL if he was there.
These statements take the cake on not one, but many levels.

Firstly, it discredits the capability of US -- for all its red blooded misadventures, US is not a mere pushover, especially by pakis.

Secondly, taking half the PAF is like talking about "friendly fire" incident. Remember, paki army -- inclusive of its nuclear(sic) capability is an extension and outpost of US on other side of the world. Just paki army is wearing different uniforms and insignia, and pray to allah. Other than that paki army is conceived to be mercenary force by its 3.5 -- four fathers.
This constant reminder to pull up pakis as something as new-clear capable independent nation, is something the erstwhile parents of this joke called as pakistan, consistently has the necessity. Can't admit that such ill-conceived arrangement of hiring the sunni guns to do the dirty work of UK-US will backfire, is wrong and stop the madness. But the enticement to continue the same is the reason to prop up these "hired sunni guns" as pakistan, a respectable new-clear country, at every available opportunity, especially by UK, followed by US and Canada.
Gerard
Forum Moderator
Posts: 8012
Joined: 15 Nov 1999 12:31

Re: Geopolitical thread

Post by Gerard »

Chagos Islands dispute: court to rule on UK sovereignty claim
Britain's sovereignty over the Chagos Islands and America's lease for the Diego Garcia military base could be thrown into doubt by an international court hearing due to open in Istanbul on Tuesday.
svinayak
BRF Oldie
Posts: 14222
Joined: 09 Feb 1999 12:31

Re: Geopolitical thread

Post by svinayak »

Merger of the Century: Why Canada and America Should Become One Country
Diane Francis (Author)

No two nations in the world are as integrated, economically and socially, as are the United States and Canada. We share geography, values and the largest unprotected border in the world. Regardless of this close friendship, our two countries are on a slow-motion collision course—with each other and with the rest of the world. While we wrestle with internal political gridlock and fiscal challenges and clash over border problems, the economies of the larger world change and flourish. Emerging economies sailed through the financial meltdown of 2008.

The International Monetary Fund forecasts that by 2018, China’s economy will be bigger than that of the United States; when combined with India, Japan and the four Asian Tigers—South Korea, Taiwan, Singapore and Hong Kong—China’s economy will be bigger than that of the G8 (minus Japan).

Rather than continuing on this road to mutual decline, our two nations should chart a new course. Bestselling author Diane Francis proposes a simple and obvious solution: What if the United States and Canada merged into one country? The most audacious initiative since the Louisiana Purchase would solve the biggest problems each country expects to face: the U.S.’s national security threats and declining living standards; and Canada’s difficulty controlling and developing its huge landmass, stemming from a lack of capital, workers, technology and military might.

Merger of the Century builds both a strong political argument and a compelling business case, treating our two countries not only as sovereign entities but as merging companies. We stand on the cusp of a new world order. Together, by marshaling resources and combining efforts, Canada and America have a greater chance of succeeding. As separate nations, the future is in much greater doubt indeed.
They keep citing Asia and Asian economy getting bigger than G8
member_22733
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3786
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: Geopolitical thread

Post by member_22733 »

^^^ LOL, she can dream on. Canucks hate the US and will never agree to be united with the US.
pankajs
BRF Oldie
Posts: 14746
Joined: 13 Aug 2009 20:56

Re: Geopolitical thread

Post by pankajs »

Didn't the French-Canadians want to go the Scotland way?

The power union will be US, Canada with Mexico with Mexico supplying cheap labor and the foot soldiers. This is only from the perspective of maintaining global hegemony. However it will lead to a fall in the living standards in US proper and non-whites becoming a majority earlier than projected.
pankajs
BRF Oldie
Posts: 14746
Joined: 13 Aug 2009 20:56

Re: Geopolitical thread

Post by pankajs »

International law under siege

http://www.livemint.com/Opinion/POUeQU9 ... siege.html
The powerful cite international law to weaker states but blithely ignore it when it comes in their way
The Russian-US proxy war over Ukraine, while threatening to unleash a new Cold War, serves as a reminder that power usually trumps international law. Russia’s muscular riposte, including annexing Crimea, to the US-supported putsch in Kiev that deposed Ukraine’s constitutional order highlights major powers’ unilateralist approach to international law.

The only mechanism to enforce international law is the UN Security Council (UNSC), whose permanent members are notorious for breaking international law. Is it thus any surprise that international law is applied only when it suits the interests of the strong states? The powerful cite international law to weaker states but blithely ignore it when it comes in their way.
Russian President Vladimir Putin’s action in annexing Crimea violated Ukraine’s territorial integrity, even though it followed a referendum in that historically Russian region, where the majority of residents are indisputably with Russia. The annexation represents a clear breach of international law.

This, however, cannot obscure the fact that the US and North Atlantic Treaty Organization (Nato) have repeatedly shown contempt for international law. The list is long just for the past 15 years—the bombing of Serbia, the separation of Kosovo from Serbia, the invasions of Afghanistan and Iraq without UNSC mandate, the overthrow of Muammar Gaddafi’s regime through aerial bombardment, the aiding of a still-raging bloody insurrection in Syria, and renditions and torture of terror suspects. The US National Security Agency’s Orwellian surveillance programme mocks international law.

In February, Washington openly backed the violent street protesters—some armed with guns and Molotov cocktails—who toppled Ukraine’s democratically elected president, Viktor Yanukovych. This has set a dangerous precedent. No democracy can be safe if armed provocateurs are allowed to spearhead street protests against the constitutional authority.

The Ukraine case indeed illustrates the international law of convenience. Putin, for example, has cynically justified his Crimea takeover in the name of responsibility to protect, the moral (not legal) principle US President Barack Obama invoked to rationalize Gaddafi’s overthrow.

The Ukraine crisis is actually a geopolitical windfall for another power that serves as a prime example of a unilateralist approach to international relations—China, still hewing to Mao Zedong’s belief that “power grows out of the barrel of a gun”. China’s growing geopolitical heft has emboldened its muscle-flexing and territorial nibbling in Asia. China rejects some of the same treaties the US declines to join, including the Convention on the Law of the Non-Navigational Uses of International Watercourses—the first law that lays down rules on the shared resources of transnational rivers, lakes and aquifers.
China has established a hydro-supremacy unparalleled in the world by annexing the starting places of Asia’s major international rivers—the Tibetan plateau and Xinjiang—and working to re-engineer their cross-border flows. Yet China—the source of transboundary-river flows to more countries than any other hydro-hegemon—rejects the very concept of water sharing and refuses to enter into water treaties with its neighbours.

With both Obama and Putin now wooing China, the likely big winner from the turn of events is the country that has been relentlessly expanding its borders ever since it came under Communist rule in 1949. That China continues to press steadily outward on its borders was illustrated by its 2012 capture of the Scarborough Shoal, located within the Philippines’ exclusive economic zone, and by its more recent establishment of an air-defence zone extending to islands controlled by Japan and South Korea.

China’s geopolitical gains will solidify if the US jettisons—as appears likely—its post-Cold War policy of seeking to influence Russia’s conduct through engagement and integration. The US is closing the door to Russian accession to the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development (OECD) and effectively ousting Russia from the G8 by making it the G7 again—an action that can only accelerate that institution’s creeping irrelevance in international relations.

India, by contrast, could be a loser in a second Cold War that re-divides states along a bipolar axis. India also lost out in the first Cold War because of its reluctance to take sides. Although India has progressed from doctrinaire non-alignment to geopolitical pragmatism, it sees itself as a bridge between East and West, not as a partisan.

Given the innately self-calculating and self-aggrandizing human nature, strong nations have always sought to gain dominance over the weak. The advent of new technologies and reduced transportation costs has made the world increasingly interdependent. Yet the world has remained the same in one aspect—the stronger still dominate the weaker.

When the US lost a 1984 International Court of Justice case filed by Nicaragua, it blocked the ruling’s implementation. But when Japan recently lost its Antarctic whaling case, it agreed to comply with the ruling. This illustrates the difference between a big and a not-so-big power.

Power respects strength, while the weak remain meek. Had Crimea been seized by a smaller power, the US by now would have assembled a “coalition of the willing” to launch a military attack on the occupier. But because the occupier in this case is a country armed with intercontinental-range nuclear weapons, Obama, despite his tough talk, quickly ruled out any US military involvement.
The major powers assert one set of rules for themselves and a different set for other states, as if international law were only for the weak.

Brahma Chellaney is a professor at the Centre for Policy Research.
member_28440
BRFite -Trainee
Posts: 52
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: Geopolitical thread

Post by member_28440 »

Post Reply