Malaysian Airlines Flight MH-370 goes missing

A_Gupta · Post by **A_Gupta** » 09 Apr 2014 08:46

Can anyone explain why the pings are detected at locations upto 20 kilometers apart? And even more interesting if someone can explain how one would construct a probability distribution over this area for where the Underwater Locator Beacon might lie? What is the modeling of the ocean that is involved? Will they have some data of temperatures and salinity of ocean layers, or will they have to make a lot of assumptions?

(from http://www.jacc.gov.au)

A_Gupta · Post by **A_Gupta** » 09 Apr 2014 08:57

Anant, as far as conspiracy theories go, the truth is likely to be stranger than fiction. There is simply no reasonable explanation that anyone has presented that fits the presented facts. CNN just now acknowledged that the investigators are most likely working with information not released to the public, which again leads to the question, why is information concealed.

As far as latent racism towards the Chinese, it is not different than the explicit hostility towards Pakistan and Pakistanis on all of the Pakistan-related threads, not just "Bojitiv" news. I guess you should be protesting that, too. I agree it is unnecessary; but there are bigger problems around than for me to be worried about that.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 09 Apr 2014 09:10

CNN says four pings detected. Strange thing is they are quite far part. More than the 4km distance. Expert says thermal layers and refraction could be at play.

Anant · Post by **Anant** » 09 Apr 2014 09:18

A_Gupta, the truth may be stranger than fiction but mental illness is still mental illness. Let's not get into the argument of the absurd just because it's possible. And yes, the thing that differentiated this forum from the one that I won't name was to be civil and cultured. So regardless of their perfidy, there is no need to be racist, juvenile and to stoop to that level. Sane theories are always welcome. Posting from some idiot's blog that there are undersea ufo's or replicas of planes on some US base is asinine. Anyone with a blog can post whatever trash they want. Doesn't mean it adds to the body of knowledge and only makes winnowing good posts like yours from the pages of asinine psycho babble.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 09 Apr 2014 10:11

Trying to sift some real possibilities from the numerous CTs put out,the one where the captain allegedly put his crew and passengers "to sleep",and embarked upon his mission a suicide run,to DG wherever,needs to be looked at again.

I asked a Q earlier,if the crew was on a suicide/hijack mission,which most likely explains the change in course,meticulously orchestrated to avoid military radars,why was there no suicide note or Al Q style videoclip left explaining the motives? Supposing such a note/clip WAS actually found by the Malaysians at the home of the Capt. or co-pilot,which incriminated the state and it was deliberately hushed up for reasons best known to those involved in the cover-up? This may explain why we are given faint hints that there is evidence which has not been revealed,perhaps also pertaining to the cargo carried.

The tooth hasn't outed as yet.What is probably holding back the tooth from outing is the wait to find the black box then the spin can be given to the fable.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 09 Apr 2014 11:34

this latest aus map with a diameter of around 40km is potentially feasible...i have heard that submarines can detect pings sometimes from upto 60km away...so same pinger could have been responsible for all these pings for Aus.

still does not explain what the chinese ship found 600km away.

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 09 Apr 2014 12:05

let me summarise the most plausible theory

1. mh370 was carrying hazardous cargo, most likely Li batteries
2. sometime after take off, the Li batts caused a fire in the hold
3. around transition to Vietnamese airspace at low cycladic phase for crew and pax, the emergency became known
4. fumes from the fire incapacitated (and later killed) pax; fire possibly damaged comms equipment on board
5. pilots started dealing with emergency and immediately sought out nearest diversionary airfields (penang, phuket) - plane headed west ("deliberate action")
6. malaysian mil radar did not figure out the problem as it was happening ("no trace") (H&D issue #1)
7. crew either through disorientation or incapacitation missed the diversion, used flight director to turn aircraft around ("deliberate action") - whilst on a southerly heading, the crew passed out or died. lack of oxygen may also have put out the fire (once internal air got used up)
8. the flight director held the plane straight and level on constant heading - whatever the last heading the pilots entered
9. indonesian mil radar did not figure out what was going on, the plane overflew sumatra and carried on south (H&D issue #2)
10. for 6 hours she flew south with everyone on board dead - holding same heading, but blown by the winds
11. once the fuel ran out, she came down in the ocean

post crash

1. major H&D issues for all involved
2. Malaysians and Indonesians in denial mode about radar surveillance - gives rise to almost all conspiracy theories
3. chinese eager to show they are top dog - start throwing their weight around - but make all sorts of mistakes and demonstrate limits of their technical capabilities
4. Aus eager to please China and goes all out to demonstrate that she can help
5. the inmarsat analysis of possible location is good work - we are now narrowing down the search box

finally

air accidents happen, they are rare, but they happen

member_28502 · Post by **member_28502** » 09 Apr 2014 12:06

That ping must be from the 52 Hz whale the loneliest Whale seeking Mate off the Oz shore?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/52-hertz_whale

The 52-hertz whale is a unique whale that calls at a characteristic frequency of 52 Hz, a higher frequency than the vocalizations of some whales.[1] It appears to be the only individual with this call, and has been described as the world's loneliest whale.

The sonic signature is that of a whale, albeit at a unique frequency. At 52 hertz, it is just higher than the lowest note on a tuba.[2] The call patterns resemble neither blue nor fin whales, being shorter, more frequent, and much higher in frequency.[3] Blue whales usually vocalize at 15–20 Hz, fin whales at 20 Hz.[1] The 52-hertz signals are highly variable in their pattern of repetition, duration, and sequence, although they are easily identifiable due to their frequency and characteristic clustering.[4]

****
Added later

Lalmohan wrote: once the fuel ran out, she came down in the ocean

Does it mean that there was fuel leak as well (that is in addition to lethal cargo)?

Shreeman · Post by **Shreeman** » 09 Apr 2014 13:08

Anant wrote:Moderators,

At one time, this forum prided itself on focusing on news sources that were established or at least validated. This was to differentiate this forum from the numerous other nutcase fora on the internet, which I won't mention. Nowadays, there are posts from users who are using sources that may originate from their mom's basement to expound conspiracy theories likes underwater bases in Diego Garcia and doppelganger aircraft on the same island. I realize many users here have a bent (mostly anti-American) and that's fine but then change the name of the thread to crackpot conspiracy theories. Also, I don't understand the repeated latent racism towards the Chinese, even in terms of satire or sarcasm; unless your goal is to reduce the level of discourse. Fact is Indians also died on that aircraft and if any of you have evidence that they are alive and all of you love having a laugh, all you are doing is ridiculing the dead and disrespecting their kin. This and the Ukraine thread have gone off the rails and at least you veteran users should have taken note of this and either renamed the thread or made it something sane and technical. Many of you are very bright; why not start functioning at that level?

Anant,

This is not MH370 related, so the strategic discussion or understanding threads are better for future response. I am bandwidth limited, so lack of replies is not a lack of motivation to engage.

A simple plane crash event would not have lasted as a thread in the "strategic" forum. This thread became satire against the hypocrisy that is the ongoing search pretty much page one. We sympathize with the relatives, but this is hardly about MH370 anymore. The relatives are making a fool of themselves without anyone's help too (e.g. Ms. Sarah Bajc). It is difficult to continue to sympathize with people demanding one Malaysian "assistant" per relative.

The course of events shows the kindergarten experience and intelligence that governs us now. And the utter helplessness of the individual in it all.

This forum houses and feeds some of the worst satire (there is a reason the TSP thread no longer appears on the BR front page!), and the discussion was bound to degenerate to bositive-neuj standards very early, given the horse manure we are being fed. Garbage in, horse manure out.

To equate the blog quality with news, let us count the numerous unimaginable events:

- The secret information. Daily news conferences and meetings with relatives telling them there is untold basis for all the actions that they took yesterday or will take tomorrow.

- The search area. Why search for days up north?

- The ridiculous inter-nation spats. Requests to search in Andaman waters. Malaysia and China fights. Philippines trying to feed its stranded soldiers in the middle.

- The flight simulator nonsense.

- The northern and southern tracks, their estimation, and daily changes.

Need I go on, about the pings and more? Clearly, you are not reading this thread for MH370 related news. Pass on the thread, not every thread is everyone's cup of tea. I can't read it everyday either anymore (even when I have the time).

This is NOT a serious discourse. And it goes on and on and on in all "serious" media. If you feel that a blog is presenting any less credible information than that is being fed via the new agencies then you have made some wrong inferences.

There is little anti-American bent here. But hypocrisy always generates a reaction. Always has, people get kicked out for protesting too loudly routinely.

But lets be clear, there is no one representative of "America". America is a banana republic, just like every other. Its not a sacred cow. It was not intended to be above criticism even when first created, even misplaced criticism. If a perceived "anti-American" bent is leaving a bad taste in an Indian emigrant then I conjecture it is just as likely to be due to the perceived failure to escape to a "promised land" as it is about any arguments being made against lady liberty here.

We find it foul to protest the absurd even in satire now, that should say something.

JMAT.

habal · Post by **habal** » 09 Apr 2014 14:18

Lalmohan wrote:let me summarise the most plausible theory

1. mh370 was carrying hazardous cargo, most likely Li batteries
2. sometime after take off, the Li batts caused a fire in the hold
3. around transition to Vietnamese airspace at low cycladic phase for crew and pax, the emergency became known
4. fumes from the fire incapacitated (and later killed) pax; fire possibly damaged comms equipment on board
5. pilots started dealing with emergency and immediately sought out nearest diversionary airfields (penang, phuket) - plane headed west ("deliberate action")
6. malaysian mil radar did not figure out the problem as it was happening ("no trace") (H&D issue #1)
7. crew either through disorientation or incapacitation missed the diversion, used flight director to turn aircraft around ("deliberate action") - whilst on a southerly heading, the crew passed out or died. lack of oxygen may also have put out the fire (once internal air got used up)
8. the flight director held the plane straight and level on constant heading - whatever the last heading the pilots entered
9. indonesian mil radar did not figure out what was going on, the plane overflew sumatra and carried on south (H&D issue #2)
10. for 6 hours she flew south with everyone on board dead - holding same heading, but blown by the winds
11. once the fuel ran out, she came down in the ocean

12. Transponder switched off by itself due to fire.
13. ACARS switched off due to fire
14. Suddenness of it all prevented pilot from even issuing mayday code.
15. Plane was avoiding radar because fire knew that radar was dangerous for it's survival.
16. Batteries of the pinger are far beyond expiry date, but they are still searching for ping.
17. Malaysians are not bothered about any ping, only the NZ and Aussies seem concerned, Chinese always go ping pong.

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 09 Apr 2014 15:14

12., 13., fire in equipment racks or power feeds into that rack will have that effect
14., if radios are out and crew are busy then yes
15. did not avoid radar, but radar operators did not spot/realise/react
16. nominal 30 days, actual longer as per other reports on this thread
17. malaysians have no technical ability to do so, aussies have a specialist asset

A_Gupta · Post by **A_Gupta** » 09 Apr 2014 15:53

Lalmohan wrote:12., 13., fire in equipment racks or power feeds into that rack will have that effect
14., if radios are out and crew are busy then yes
15. did not avoid radar, but radar operators did not spot/realise/react
16. nominal 30 days, actual longer as per other reports on this thread
17. malaysians have no technical ability to do so, aussies have a specialist asset

Even if they did not avoid radar, and even if the radar operators did not spot/realise/react, the radar logs/recording would show the plane after the fact. Yes, the aviation radar has to be recording otherwise how will you do a post-accident analysis?

Therefore the Indonesian government has to be lying for this theory to be true; and to claim that is a conspiracy theory too. Why should they lie?

PS: government officials lying out of habit, because information they withhold and lie about represents their power over everyone else, is certainly a possibility; but given the international dimensions of the MH370 crash, this reason for lying is extremely unlikely.

A_Gupta · Post by **A_Gupta** » 09 Apr 2014 16:01

Lalmohan wrote:let me summarise the most plausible theory

1. mh370 was carrying hazardous cargo, most likely Li batteries
2. sometime after take off, the Li batts caused a fire in the hold
3. around transition to Vietnamese airspace at low cycladic phase for crew and pax, the emergency became known
4. fumes from the fire incapacitated (and later killed) pax; fire possibly damaged comms equipment on board
5. pilots started dealing with emergency and immediately sought out nearest diversionary airfields (penang, phuket) - plane headed west ("deliberate action")
6. malaysian mil radar did not figure out the problem as it was happening ("no trace") (H&D issue #1)
7. crew either through disorientation or incapacitation missed the diversion, used flight director to turn aircraft around ("deliberate action") - whilst on a southerly heading, the crew passed out or died. lack of oxygen may also have put out the fire (once internal air got used up)
8. the flight director held the plane straight and level on constant heading - whatever the last heading the pilots entered
9. indonesian mil radar did not figure out what was going on, the plane overflew sumatra and carried on south (H&D issue #2)
10. for 6 hours she flew south with everyone on board dead - holding same heading, but blown by the winds
11. once the fuel ran out, she came down in the ocean

Regarding 5., the plane did not head to the nearest airports where it could land. Its path - VAMPI-GIVAL-headed towards IGREX, as reported by Malaysian military radar, does not make 5. or 7. plausible at all.

It is possible that your theory is true anyway, and the Malaysians are lying about the course they observed for the aircraft. The question comes again though - why lie?

Bade · Post by **Bade** » 09 Apr 2014 16:04

Why lie ?

Because everyone thought from the get go that it was a terrorist act or a deliberate suicidal act. With that assumption info is tightly held and lies are the consequence. Very simple only, no ?

A_Gupta · Post by **A_Gupta** » 09 Apr 2014 16:09

Anant wrote:A_Gupta, the truth may be stranger than fiction but mental illness is still mental illness. Let's not get into the argument of the absurd just because it's possible.

a. Mental illness can "explain" any sequence of actions that is not physically or logically impossible. As such, it is an "explanation" of the last resort.

b. There has to some independent sign of mental illness other than what happened on the plane - which there is none. You are in the position of simultaneously asserting that "the strange path of the plane is due to mental illness" and "the mental illness is proven by the strange path of the plane". This is some form of the fallacy of begging the question.

A_Gupta · Post by **A_Gupta** » 09 Apr 2014 16:17

Bade wrote:Why lie ?

Because everyone thought from the get go that it was a terrorist act or a deliberate suicidal act. With that assumption info is tightly held and lies are the consequence. Very simple only, no ?

No, very incredible.

a. Why would Indonesia want to cover up for Malaysia in either case of terrorism or suicide? What conceivable value does it have for Indonesia to withhold the fact that their radar did not see the plane?

b. If the Aussies have indeed found the plane, it is based on a much better knowledge of how the plane flew - its speed and path. After all, they were looking many hundreds of kilometers to the south of the current search area just a few days ago.

Part of the reason the airplane's path may be abbreviated is because it spent fuel not heading south, but circumnavigating the north end of Indonesia, avoiding Indonesian radar. We are told that this is also what some senior Malaysian officer says.

c. The plane skirting Indonesian radar relieves us from a conspiracy theory about Indonesia - they were not lying. But then the simple "crew overcome by hypoxia due to cabin fire" theory goes kaput.

d. Anyway the "crew overcome by hypoxia due to cabin fire" theory to me seems dubious, given the reported VAMPI-GIVAL-IGREX sequence. Or else the Malaysians are lying about that. Either way, it is hard to avoid a conspiracy theory. Why with closely held info. about terrorism/suicide would they ever reveal the VAMPI-GIVAL-IGREX info. - the fact about waypoint-based navigation and the fact about the specific path? They did not have to release either of those, only the info. that the plane had headed west to the Strait of Malacca and was last seen headed north-west. Or else, why mislead with the VAMPI-GIVAL-IGREX sequence if it is false?

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 09 Apr 2014 16:33

the sequence could be preset in the FMS, routes and diversions normally are
the pilots select the sequence from the FMC interface
if they are busy sorting problems, better if the plane flies itself to the next point of safety, no?

habal · Post by **habal** » 09 Apr 2014 17:32

Lalmohan wrote: 16. nominal 30 days, actual longer as per other reports on this thread

batteries to be changed in 2012, as per Malaysian govt they would have been changed by June, 2014. So basically if battery life is 30 days, now what we have is a life of 15 days in it's state of disrepair when the plane disappeared.

Ahmad Jauhari said this in respond to a question from the floor whether the pinger batteries were due for replacement in 2012, as claimed by its US based manufacturer Dukane Seacom Inc.

On Friday, Dukane Seacom Inc president Anish Patel told CNN that the recorders were scheduled for battery replacements in 2012, but they were never returned for the overhaul.

http://www.nst.com.my/latest/font-color ... o-1.551620

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 09 Apr 2014 18:06

Just a general observation from my side on the geo-politics.

From the look of it, Aussies are doing a superb job in the salvaging effort. They come across as thoroughly professional, they seem credible and trustworthy. Those press conferences by Agnus Houston, except for his book-keeping ramble, are very informative and to the point.

What is interesting to me is the manner in which Aussies have hi-jacked the central role (perhaps natural because of their location relative to where the plane is presumed to have gone down) with its big brother US's blessing of course. And how the newly arrived super duper Chincoms have been sidelined.

I notices the not so subtle mocking by the see-en-en experts on Chinese claims on hearing the ping, They show a bunch of Chinese on a rickety boat lowering a hydrophone like a fishing rod and the experts ask, how credible can the Chinese claim can be with a primitive apparatus like that (it only takes someone with some brains to point out that the Chinese did not mention how they heard the ping

).

Bottom line: Aussies are indeed making a mark, Chinese, like India, only potential super duper

.

Theo_Fidel · Post by **Theo_Fidel** » 09 Apr 2014 19:00

Philip wrote:Trying to sift some real possibilities from the numerous CTs put out,the one where the captain allegedly put his crew and passengers "to sleep",and embarked upon his mission a suicide run,to DG wherever,needs to be looked at again.

The only reason this is brought up is because it has happened multiple times earlier. Look up Helios or the Payne Stewart incident.

Just pointing out it is not the same thing.

On the other hand underwater bases and Government hijack to DG type incident of commercial aircraft has never happened. Certainly not in secrecy. Only on the Incredibles and James Bond, etc.
Even DG missile shoot down can be taken seriously as it has happened before. But then how to explain the direction change, etc.
Hijack is credible as it has happened before but as you yourself point out where is the ransom demand and proud proclamation of credit or motive?
Pilot suicide is still credible, but no evidence for it yet.

UlanBatori · Post by **UlanBatori** » 09 Apr 2014 19:56

Those press conferences by Agnus Houston, except for his book-keeping ramble, are very informative and to the point.

Confucius say:

Professional Power Point and Angreji Presentation on BS is still BS

This whole tamasha started with the Most Credible Australian Presentation of Satellite Data, then moved to Most Credible Australian Search of Most Credible Search Area and now to Most Credible Australian Search of Even-More Most Credible Search Area.

Yielding a total of 0 credible results. How exactly is this a victory for Australian Professionalism I wonder. Anyone with the slightest professionalism in thinking would have seen on Day 1 that UCNews had the only workable theory on where the plane went.

UlanBatori · Post by **UlanBatori** » 09 Apr 2014 20:13

Australian announces new Gong-Ping!!

The Australian ship Ocean Shield had first picked up two sets of underwater pulses Saturday. It heard nothing more until Tuesday, when it reacquired the signals twice. The four signals were within 17 miles of one another.

"I believe we are searching in the right area, but we need to visually identify wreckage before we can confirm with certainty that this is the final resting place of MH370," said (very professionally) Air Chief Marshal Angus Houston, who's coordinating the Australian operation. "I'm now optimistic that we will find the aircraft or what's left of the aircraft in the not too distant future."

He seems pretty sure.
But then this?

Authorities analyzed the signals picked up over the weekend and concluded that they probably came from specific electronic equipment rather than from marine life, which can make similar sounds.

Do they mean "weekend" as in "Chinese Gong-Ping" or Saturday?

Theo_Fidel · Post by **Theo_Fidel** » 09 Apr 2014 20:14

So the Aussies have again picked up signals 17 miles apart apparently.

The yak herder would say movement is slowing down. Maybe the aircraft is finally running out of fuel.

UlanBatori · Post by **UlanBatori** » 09 Apr 2014 20:17

Better report
What are those 2 guys/gals doing in frogman costumes, that can't be done by hanging a camera down? (relocating gong-pingers?)

Another report: from Perth

“The detection yesterday afternoon was held for approximately five minutes and 32 seconds,” he said.
“The detection late last night was held for approximately 7 minutes.”

Accompanying TV news is good: they are trying to figure out where the debris field could have reached by now.

UBCNews comments:
Everything depends, you see, on the thermal patterns under the ocean, creating optic-fiber-type conditions occasionally for a ping from the Maldives to reach down near Perth.

Bade · Post by **Bade** » 09 Apr 2014 20:27

How Debris Can Point to Malaysian Plane's Point of Impact
Ocean search for missing jet depends on complex physics—and luck
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news ... ian-ocean/

Very interesting read.

Tracking the Buoys

Griffin's team has one thing going for it: research buoys that have been in use for more than 40 years. In the late 1970s, scientists from the National Oceanographic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA), working with scientists from Australia and other countries, began dropping drift buoys regularly into the Atlantic, Pacific, and Indian Oceans for oceanographic and climate research. Tracked by satellites, the buoy data provides a coherent picture of ocean currents.

"We are very fortunate that quite a few buoys were deployed last year close to where the projected crash site is," he says. "We already know quite a bit about the trajectories that buoys take in this corner of the world—not enough to tell us where the debris has gone, but they tell us that our methods of testing these things are correct."

The trajectories showed how unpredictable the Indian Ocean can be. Griffin tracked one buoy as it appeared to move south in a straight line from western Australia to the southern Indian Ocean. When the satellite took a closer look, it revealed that the buoy was trapped in the center of a clockwise-rotating eddy and that the eddy was moving along in a straight line.

"It stayed inside that eddy for 15 months," he says. "That was one of those oh-my-god moments."

Bade · Post by **Bade** » 09 Apr 2014 20:29

Looks like Oceansat-2 (from ISRO) has become silent right about the time of this event.

UlanBatori · Post by **UlanBatori** » 09 Apr 2014 20:30

Hmm! Same way, the problem becomes tracking where a recorder dropped into the ocean by a passing biz-jet might have reached, 1 month later..

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 09 Apr 2014 20:31

UlanBatori wrote:Hmm! Same way, the problem becomes tracking where a recorder dropped into the ocean by a passing biz-jet might have reached, 1 month later..

did it have a mid-air collision with a flying yak?

habal · Post by **habal** » 09 Apr 2014 20:54

CRamS wrote:Bottom line: Aussies are indeed making a mark, Chinese, like India, only potential super duper .

The bottom line is because bottom is unwashed and has left a skid mark. A pinger locater that costs about 747$ (pun intended) why is Malaysia so reluctant to tow it to a boat and scan the waters off Australia or wherever it pleases by itself. Why is it so disinterested in this entire exercise ? Why has the entire operation been outsourced to Australia.

Is it because Australia has similar anglo-saxon capability of making grandoise statements (akin to 'we shall make India a superpoer') which ultimately amount to nothing. & is it also because it is capable of a more professional cover up than the Malaysians can ever make happen.

Bade · Post by **Bade** » 09 Apr 2014 21:01

Do the Malaysians know any better than the Aussies on where to search ? If they did then what you say applies. If they are truly clueless to what happened, then asking for help is what is left.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 09 Apr 2014 21:13

The CNN correspondent was very clear last night that Malaysia is the prime investigator as the plane belongs to them and the search is in international waters. Aussies are only helping out. Thats the international law position. If it had been traced to within 12 nm or 100 nm EEZ then the country adjacent would have jurisdiction.

Bade · Post by **Bade** » 09 Apr 2014 21:21

Though the current search location is north of this general area...things might be moving around very fast there undersea, at an average of 17 km per day.

The deep current along the Kerguelen Plateau is part of a global system of ocean currents called the overturning circulation, which determines how much heat and carbon the ocean can soak up."

While earlier expeditions had detected evidence of the current system, they were not able to determine how much water the current carried. The joint Japanese-Australian experiment deployed current-meter moorings anchored to the sea floor at depths of up to 4500m. Each mooring reached from the sea floor to a depth of 1000m and measured current speed, temperature and salinity for a two-year period.

"The continuous measurements provided by the moorings allow us, for the first time, to determine how much water the deep current carries to the north," Dr Rintoul said. The current was found to carry more than 12 million cubic metres per second of Antarctic water colder than 0 °C (because of the salt dissolved in sea water, the ocean does not freeze until the temperature gets close to -2 °C).

"It was a real surprise to see how strong the flow was at this location. With two-year average speeds of more than 20cm per second, these are the strongest mean currents ever measured at depths three kilometres below the sea surface.

"Mapping the deep current systems is an important step in understanding the global network of ocean currents that influence climate, now and in the future. Our results show that the deep currents near the Kerguelen Plateau make a large contribution to this global ocean circulation," Dr Rintoul said.

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/20 ... 101234.htm
Massive Southern Ocean current discovered

Bade · Post by **Bade** » 09 Apr 2014 21:27

Even at this majestic speed, one can rule out the Chinese claim as it was alleged to have been at ~ 600 km from the current search location and ping detection by the US-Auz team just a few days ago.

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 09 Apr 2014 21:29

i am inclined to think that the chinese story was managed. it came about because of a tweet from a chinese news agency
someone jumped the gun, or was told to jump the gun
this too is swept up in the current of geopolitics

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 09 Apr 2014 21:44

They should have watched Finding Nemo! to get an idea of the currents.

LM touche!

Rajiv Lather · Post by **Rajiv Lather** » 09 Apr 2014 23:07

Anant wrote:Moderators,

...I realize many users here have a bent (mostly anti-American)...

A country that disrobes and violates a female representative of our country... take your complaints elsewhere...

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 09 Apr 2014 23:14

Lalmohan wrote:
UlanBatori wrote:Hmm! Same way, the problem becomes tracking where a recorder dropped into the ocean by a passing biz-jet might have reached, 1 month later..did it have a mid-air collision with a flying yak?

More like hunt by Falcon which ripped open its belly and ate up all the body and nothing is left to gather.

member_28502 · Post by **member_28502** » 09 Apr 2014 23:31

question

when the fuel is over assuming its in auto pilot mode and every one is dead, will it nose dive like V1 buzz bumb or it will gently lose altitude and land into water?

Theo_Fidel · Post by **Theo_Fidel** » 10 Apr 2014 01:49

It will stall and fall like a rock. Look up what happened to Helios and Payne Stewart aircraft. Stewarts craft went into a descending spiral a la buzz bomb.

Theo_Fidel · Post by **Theo_Fidel** » 10 Apr 2014 01:54

Lalmohan wrote:i am inclined to think that the chinese story was managed. it came about because of a tweet from a chinese news agency
someone jumped the gun, or was told to jump the gun
this too is swept up in the current of geopolitics

It is much more likely the story Suraj posted is more accurate. The Chinese heard the Aussie pings report over the open radio comms. And immediately had their folks run out with some hydrophones on boats and pretend to hear something. The fact they did not record says everything that needs to be said about the episode.

I second Vina, the only bunch that has come out smelling worse than the Malaysians are the Chinese. Breath taking cynicism.