Sunni Terrorist Fragments of Unstable Pakistan - 21 Apr 2014

A_Gupta · Post by **A_Gupta** » 26 Jun 2014 16:21

Hari Seldon wrote:BRF wisdom has often called for breaking up the artifical moth-eaten entity into its natural constituents. The 4 provinces should really be 4 sovereign nations, for a start. There are ways and there are ways of dealing with Pak if there's an ounce of imagination up unkil's rear end.

Yes, exactly as the Lahore Resolution of 1940 spelled it out : sovereign independent states (plural).

Cosmo_R · Post by **Cosmo_R** » 26 Jun 2014 16:44

Virendra wrote: Those shias will never get visas to fly out of India. That's an OIT we don't want.
Will suck us needlessly into the power struggle see-saw of the Islamic belt.

Right you are. Not a problem for us when they are in Iraq. It is when they return as blow back.

kancha · Post by **kancha** » 26 Jun 2014 16:48

Looks like a Cobra gunship has crashed near Multan, killing both pilots

ISPR statement:
“Two army aviation pilots embraced martyrdom when their helicopter crashed during a night flying training mission due to a technical fault at Multan tonight.”

Cosmo_R · Post by **Cosmo_R** » 26 Jun 2014 16:58

@Shiv^^^
Good summary of US accomplishments over the last 60 + years. Mind you the DoS stupidities were by no means limited to India-Pakistan. They did it on a global scale, One has only to look at Vietnam where the US fought the VC believing them to be PRC proxies (the domino theory) while at the same time under Nixon, they were making overtures to PRC. Now, they are trying to figure out a way to use Vietnam to counter PRC.

There are also similarities in the Iraq episode: Identify Saddam as an up and comer in 1968, enthrone him in 1978, get him to fight a war with Iran which until the Shah's fall, was ally numero uno, then turn against him in 1991 (Google April Glaspie), overthrow him in 2003, debaathize everything to free up the Shias, suddenly turn around and find Sunni friends in Anbar.

The AfPak thingie is even more weird: arm and coddle the PA so they can fight Americans in Afghanistan. Even after Bin Laden, they continue to arm and support the pakis.

One could surmise that these actions are truly evil Machiavellian feints and thrusts. Having seen these flailings as news rather than reading them as history, my take is that the DoS is like the Bourbons: they learned nothing and forgot nothing.

On a minor footnote, I assume you mean Oliver Hazard Perry class destroyer and not a 1" Kerry class missile destroyer". While Kerry's hair does resemble a floatation device, I doubt they have named a ship after him.

Brad Goodman · Post by **Brad Goodman** » 26 Jun 2014 17:18

take this ju kaffirs

Pakistan now part of cricket's 'Big Four': PCB

Pakistan now have the opportunity to have a major say in the affairs of international cricket after securing considerable concessions from the 'Big Three' India, Australia and England in the backdrop of the ICC's Annual Conference in Melbourne, Australia, DawnNews reported.

Pakistan will now receive the most in terms of percentage of revenue after the Big Three, from the ICC in the next eight years from broadcasting and other rights on ICC fixtures, effectively now making them part of a 'Big Four', the Pakistan Cricket Board (PCB) said in a press release.

According to the PCB, India has officially turned the MoUs signed earlier this year with regard to six series between the two nations, four of these to be hosted by the PCB in the UAE or Pakistan with mutual consent, into binding agreements straightaway. The six tours are now part of the Future Tours Programme and are to be played from 2015 to 2023.

Another major 'achievement', as the PCB puts it, is ICC confirming that the president of the global body will be from Pakistan with effect from June 2015.
Sources say the agreements have been made possible because of Pakistan's non-opposition to India's N Srinivasan being elected as the new chairman of the ICC.

Brad Goodman · Post by **Brad Goodman** » 26 Jun 2014 17:19

North Waziristan offensive exodus triggers polio spread fears

KJo · Post by **KJo** » 26 Jun 2014 17:23

H0rny Pakis now raping 90 year old women.

http://www.hindustantimes.com/world-new ... 33925.aspx
90-year-old woman raped in north England

The rape of a 90-year-old woman in Rochdale, north England, on Wednesday has sparked off a wave of revulsion as the Greater Manchester Police appealed for information from the public.

Rochdale has a large minority of Pakistan origin.

rsingh · Post by **rsingh** » 26 Jun 2014 17:42

VikasRaina wrote:
kmkraoind wrote:Shoaib Akhtar, 38, Ties Knot With 20-Year-Old

It seems to ward off criticism, Akhtar is now telling that the girl's age as 20, instead of 17. What a shameful creature. Wait for a decade, probably he might replicate Aisha moment (55-8).
Did they not claim when the news first broke out that no such thing was being planned. Anyways certain men have this fetish to marry very young girls. He is just following the foot steps.

IIRC this guy had a very nasty disease in unmentionable parts. It was in BRF. Now what he is going to do with girl? Polish her nails perhaps.

UlanBatori · Post by **UlanBatori** » 26 Jun 2014 18:08

U yindoos r all negative as always.
20-saal Pakistani wimmens = married at least 3 times. (yaaawn!!)
So much better than marrying a 20-year-old goat.

kmkraoind · Post by **kmkraoind** » 26 Jun 2014 18:40

rsingh wrote:IIRC this guy had a very nasty disease in unmentionable parts. It was in BRF. Now what he is going to do with girl? Polish her nails perhaps.

Its a 2009 article. Judging by its content, they are not just superficial, but deep warts. Moreover, recurrence of warts is very common.

Shoaib Akhtar's genital warts keep him out of Pakistan's World Twenty 20 squad

"The medical board has reported that Shoaib Akhtar was suffering from genital viral warts and the wound needs further care and treatment for a minimum 10 days for the purpose of healing and to achieve skin cover," the PCB said in a statement.

Paul · Post by **Paul** » 26 Jun 2014 19:08

I personally do not like Ahmed Patel but here he stomped Sheikh Paki Rashid all over the floor.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Yw-d4SCfls

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 26 Jun 2014 19:19

kancha wrote:Looks like a Cobra gunship has crashed near Multan, killing both pilots

ISPR statement:
“Two army aviation pilots embraced martyrdom when their helicopter crashed during a night flying training mission due to a technical fault at Multan tonight.”

TTP shot them down in Pakjab?

How can pilots get martyrdom while crashing their vehicle during a training flight due to technical fault?

Can mullahs decide on the ISPR chutzpah in granting suchstatus for such flimsy reasons?

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 26 Jun 2014 19:29

jash_p wrote: In my analysis after observing US thinking and behavior they are is giving Pakistan retainer fees and thinks those Pakis may be use full in future against Indi, China, Russia, Iran, etc.

The idea that the US is "keeping Pakistan loyal" assumes a client-master relationship where Pakistan is the client and the US is master. We are all eager to award US with the ability to be lord and master over everyone.

However there is no evidence that Pakistanis are either loyal to the US or are willing to serve them. Yes they are accepting money - but they are not delivering the goods. For too long we have assumed that Pakistanis are giving the US something - and we are willing to speculate as you have done.

I don't believe it any more. The US is getting nothing. Pakistanis are not loyal to the US and the US has little or no control over them. It hurts the sentiments of all US loyalists to hear this but I think it needs to be stressed because imagining that the US controls Pakistan only clouds our thinking both about the US and about Pakistan

About the US we simply love to believe that they have extraordinary power over anyone they deal with. And about Pakistan we end up believing that they are slaves who can be bought and that india can somehow emulate the US and buy up Pakistan. We have spent more than a decade on BRF believing this crap and it is high time we rid our minds of these insufferably stupid notions. This is a rut that we have fallen into so deep that BRF is not just behind the curve - we are at a dead end in analysis because of this mythology.

UlanBatori · Post by **UlanBatori** » 26 Jun 2014 19:56

Mullah Shivullah, b4 u push the soosai button on ur cellphone, consider that Pakistan IS giving "the US" a lot, which is why they have so many powerful supporters who hamstring US policy and keep forcing it into ever-deeper poo.

1. There is the Colonels Club. At least Air Force and Navy. In the US there are a gazillion retired Colonels (advancement past Colonel is based on political pull, so only a few get past this point as you know), and these guys immediately become Conslutants. And in about 2 years, become VPs at armament or Reconstruction companies. In TSPA and TSPAF there are corresponding Aphsars whose cousins and brothers in law run the big family bijnejes.
So these guys all benefit big-time from US taxpayer funds sent to "Pakistan": much of it comes back to the US either directly or via the Cayman islands etc.

2. The Generals Club. These guys become Experts at the Think Tanks and War Colleges, and are in a position to directly influence policy. Again, they benefit big-time through direct or indirect means, from US "aid" to Pakistan. General Chuck Yeager comes to mind. I think Colin Bin Powell also had some deep paki link, I just don't know what it is.

3. The Foggy Bottom Club. In the DK affair we saw the close link between Foggy Bottom and various commercial scams. In Military Aid and Foreign Policy the money involved is hajaar times any Ayah Settlement.

4. The See Aiyyeh Club: Again, retired "operatives" become Experts. Like Charlie Wilson who took credit for the Taliban... until he stopped taking credit in public. There are many, many more.

5. The straight MIL-Ind Complex Club. Rumsfeld, Cheney et al. Old they may be, but they are still hugely feared, and have huge connections that must be fed.

So BRF thinking does need to be somewhat refined, but only in going deeper and finding who influences the so-called "policies" coming out of WHOTUS/SD/COTUS/Pentagon. The victims are not just India, they are also the American soldiers and their families, and most of all the American taxpayer.

Like you, I don't believe either that there is some Master Planner Team sitting in the basement of Foggy Bottom with clear-non-foggy infinite wisdom and control over the Duniya. There is just the consistent assurance that the various power centers will keep influencing and driving short-term policy, with almost assured long-term catastrophe. The motivation, both in Pakistan and US, is $$$$ to the "right" pockets. The decision process ultimately comes down to Hu knows Hu.

So why is there not more noise from the last-named victim group? The answer is something like the answer to the question "why did Indian voters elect SoniaG's brood so many times?"

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 26 Jun 2014 20:11

Cosmo_R wrote:
Virendra wrote: Those shias will never get visas to fly out of India. That's an OIT we don't want.
Will suck us needlessly into the power struggle see-saw of the Islamic belt.
Right you are. Not a problem for us when they are in Iraq. It is when they return as blow back.

They have very cleverly asked the GOI for permission/approval to go.

knowing full well that such permission/approval can/will never come.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 26 Jun 2014 20:19

shiv is right. The Pakis are not under US control. They are like free lance dacoit/goonda in the civilized/ village outskirts hired to terrorize the villagers by the current zamindar/iqtadar.

The dacoit is available for hire by other competing iqtadars (PRC) against the villagers.

The dacoit is smart enough to pin-prick the zamindars of his existence and availability. So 9/11, sucide vests in Af-pak, nuke pistol to head, TTP, Uighers and other nautanki.

The big fear of the dacoit is the villagers and zamindar will make an accomodation there won't be a need for him.

The villagers are even more smart and keep tempting the zamindar and iqtadar with their prosperity and to cut out the dacoit.

What is needed is Bakasura vadha that makes the relationship normal between the zamindars and viallagers.

What this will do is allow the village to grow to a town and even a city and who knows bring in land reforms where the zamindar and iqtadar become banias and not rely on old order imposed with dhimmin psecualr leaders in the village.

nandakumar · Post by **nandakumar** » 26 Jun 2014 20:31

Right you are. Not a problem for us when they are in Iraq. It is when they return as blow back.[/quote]

They have very cleverly asked the GOI for permission/approval to go.

knowing full well that such permission/approval can/will never come.[/quote]
Actually you only need a visa signed by an official from the Iraqi embassyin Delhi. You buy an air ticket to Baghdad if there isa direct flight from out of Delhi or else there must be connecting flights out of Dubai, Kuwait and so on. Of course the only catch is you wont be able to check in your AK 47 or carry it as your hand luggage.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 26 Jun 2014 21:16

ramana wrote:shiv is right. The Pakis are not under US control. They are like free lance dacoit/goonda in the civilized/ village outskirts hired to terrorize the villagers by the current zamindar/iqtadar.

The dacoit is available for hire by other competing iqtadars (PRC) against the villagers.

Even in Zia's time it was not a client master relationship but it seemed that way because the Americans got Pakistani cooperation cheap - they just helped Pakistan against India and there was no blowback for the US. Pakistan gained a lot there and the US looked ever so Chankian in winning the cold war.

But with Musharraf post 9-11 it was all pretence and either the US did not catch on or simply went ahead with established policy that could not be changed after Pakistan had been co-opted. And by 2006 enough of the Pakistan army had turned jihadi to ensure that there will never be cooperation.

Did anyone notice that there has been no ground offensive in Waziristan? If that information is wrong - someone please correct me. If the Taliban attack the army and not vice versa it is because the ideology of the Taliban is accepted by many in the army, but the secular, US-friendly aspects of the army are not palatable to either the Taliban or many within the Pakistani army itself. The Pakistan army is not going to conduct a serious anti-Taliban ground offensive. The Taliban and the Pakistani army really are brothers. There are enough jihad pasand Paki army officers to ensure that all pretence of a "secular" Pakistani army has ended.

The nuclear button is already in jihadi hands. It makes little difference to India. We have had nuclear threats forever. But it makes a huge difference to the US. And when people all over the internet and media were predicting that the US would de-nuke Pakistan if nukes were thought to be in jihadi control - not one single person anticipated that the US would be in such severe denial of the Paki army's lack of loyalty to the US that they would fail to recognize that the Paki army is now a jihadi army with nukes getting funded by the US. The army no longer cares about the advance of islamists. They are the Islamists.

Everyone expected an Islamist revolution like Iran that could be resisted by putting in people like Benazir to shake up the political scene. But no. This revolution was quiet and without fanfare - leaving the US with its underwear around its ankles.

it is only a matter of time before Pakistanis realize that they live in a proper Islamic state. The single best idea to unite Pakistan is an Islamic alliance between the Taliban and the Pakistan army. All these things are easy to see from India. The problem is the US and the inertia of the US led media who will take years to figure this out.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 26 Jun 2014 21:36

Here is what the news says
http://www.pakistantoday.com.pk/2014/06 ... initiates/

Pakistan’s armed forces moved in to Miranshah on Thursday morning after the completion of the first phase of the military operation in the troubled North Waziristan Agency which has long been the hub of militant insurgency.

The troops began shelling in Miranshah, the main town of North Waziristan tribal district.

“The army has started using artillery since 6:00 am today and has bombarded Miranshah bazaar and Zafar town areas through cannon and tanks,” an intelligence official in Miranshah told a foreign news agency.

Another intelligence official and a senior military official confirmed the information to the agency.

According to a source talking to Pakistan Today, the ground troops are provided air cover.

The ground offensive has been launched after airstrikes in the first phase of Zarb-e-Azb targeted the basic infrastructure of the Tehreek-e-Taliban Pakistan (TTP).

“The training facilities, hideouts and other infrastructure used by the TTP terrorists were destroyed during the aerial bombing. Now the ground troops would go in to sweep the entire area in a bid to clean the NWA of terrorists,” the source said.

Satellite images of Miranshah show that it has an airfield which looks disused. The Paki army is shelling Miranshah and is going to enter.

Hmm - there were some reports of refugees pointing out that the Taliban had all left the area. Still it is interesting that the Paki army had vacated a town with an airfield.

More likely the troops and the Taliban were there together and this shelling news may be baloney.

Mihaylo · Post by **Mihaylo** » 26 Jun 2014 23:27

nandakumar wrote:Right you are. Not a problem for us when they are in Iraq. It is when they return as blow back.

They have very cleverly asked the GOI for permission/approval to go.

knowing full well that such permission/approval can/will never come.[/quote]
Actually you only need a visa signed by an official from the Iraqi embassyin Delhi. You buy an air ticket to Baghdad if there isa direct flight from out of Delhi or else there must be connecting flights out of Dubai, Kuwait and so on. Of course the only catch is you wont be able to check in your AK 47 or carry it as your hand luggage.[/quote]

^^^^

Let them renounce their Indian citizenship and leave. That way if they do survive the shit hole they can't come back.

-M

A_Gupta · Post by **A_Gupta** » 26 Jun 2014 23:41

http://www.cnn.com/2014/06/26/world/asi ... ee-crisis/
"Fleeing Pakistanis crowd border towns, asking 'why weren't we warned?'"

Why do Pakistani "anti-insurgency" operations create so many internal refugees?????

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 26 Jun 2014 23:46

Link & News Both Harami

Haqqani network also target of N Waziristan operation: ISPR

PISS HOUR/PISSLAMABAD: The Pakistan army for the first time announced that the Haqqani network in North Waziristan is also a target of the current military operation."For the military, there will be no discrimination among Tehreek-i-Taliban Pakistan (TTP) groups or Haqqani network, all terror groups are going to be eliminated," DG ISPR Major General Asim Bajwa told a briefing at GHQ.He said so far 327 terrorists and 10 security personnel have been killed.The DG ISPR confirmed the presence of a large number of Uzbeks and other foreign militants in North Waziristan, saying that they will all be wiped out."The Pakistan Army has requested the Afghan military to take action against terrorist hideouts in Kunar and Nooristan, but so far there has been no action taken," General Bajwa said.The chief military spokesman said it is solely a Pakistan Army operation and not a joint Pak-US military offensive, adding that Pakistani security forces are capable of doing such an operation."North Waziristan has become a hub of terror and suicide attacks in the country because planning of such attacks was taking place here," Bajwa remarked.He dispelled the impression that the operation was launched without political approval and said, "The operation was launched after a decision was made at the political level."On Wednesday Prime Minister’s Adviser on National Security and Foreign Affairs Sartaj Aziz said security forces were conducting the operation against militants without discrimination

Anujan · Post by **Anujan** » 26 Jun 2014 23:55

A_Gupta wrote:http://www.cnn.com/2014/06/26/world/asi ... ee-crisis/
"Fleeing Pakistanis crowd border towns, asking 'why weren't we warned?'"

Why do Pakistani "anti-insurgency" operations create so many internal refugees?????

Because Pakistan army method of fighting terrorism is artillery, airstrikes, depopulating the area followed by reconstruction and resettlement with foreign aid after suitably brainwashed by sarkari pasand Jihadi groups. They fear infantry ops and contact with the enemy

Rudradev · Post by **Rudradev** » 27 Jun 2014 00:03

shiv wrote:
rudradev wrote: C-aid) Money that the US, through opaque mechanisms, uses to basically buy Jernails at the corpse-commando level. This is basically cash in pocket tendered to gain political influence, though it moves through all kinds of GOAT-related channels. In the big scheme of things it is not a lot of money, but the US trusts that it keeps certain key jernails as loyal to them as possible. This kind of aid also includes student visas, US college admissions for kids, shopping trips for begums during "consultancy" junkets, etc.
C-aid: Now this is the thing that I think needs updating from the traditional BRF viewpoint. Time was when the US could buy off most jernails for the candy of perks and visas. Newer information now suggests that about half the Paki army including officer cadre cannot be bought by this - or even if they accept the money, they are not giving the US the desired results. Half the Paki army has turned jihadi. They are no longer the "secular army" that the US and we on BRF believe it to be. In other words it is a myth that the US is actually managing to buy off jernails and a myth that things are getting done. They are not getting done as the US wants, but the US is continuing to mollycoddle the generals.

Oh sure there are some jernails who cooperate - but a huge percentage of the Paki army oficer cadre are now "converted/Talibanized" enough for them to be anti US.

.

Oh, I agree completely. The self-made American myth that "giving jernails money/whisky/foreign-trip keeps them loyal to us" comes from Yahya Khan days, and it was hardly true even then. This "candy-aid" bought favours like facilitating Kissinger's secret trip from Islamabad to Beijing, but covering for a diplomat's weekend in China isn't the same thing as a strategic partnership. It is the TSPA and ISI who have sold the Americans on the idea that it is, in fact, strategic partnership they are getting in return for pouring C-aid money into the TSPA brass.

It was definitely not true in the Afghan-Soviet war. As C Fair says, ISI was ALREADY sponsoring Haqqani and others against Daoud Khan in Kabul long before the Soviets invaded; the US bankrolling of jihad was only adding funds and conveniences to a PAKI-LED, PAKI-DIRECTED project that was ongoing even before Afghanistan became a Cold-War staging area.

But of course the Americans cannot afford to believe that they were suckered into paying for a Paki geopolitical project. Their self-mythology and hubris demand a rationalizing narrative in which they are the global protagonist onlee... in which THE US inspired and convened Jihad against the Soviet Union, the TSPA/ISI helped them, and the Paki jernails had to be kept happy with joyful infusions of A, B and C-aid which was a "price well worth paying to win the Cold War".

Ironically, the Americans like to think of Indian and Pakistani govt people as overblown little brown-saheb despots who can be controlled by flattery and pandering to their vanity. In the US/TSPA equation the Pakistan Army has got HUGELY rich by using exactly the same tactic on Americans.

Today the C-aid has been going through under the GOAT aegis for nearly 13 years (let alone the A-aid and B-aid which at least Musharraf had to negotiate for a little bit, the C-aid started flowing on Sept 13th 2001 onlee and never stopped). It has not bought the Americans ONE bit of loyalty.

In exchange for all that aid, the TSPA has given only the bare minimum of optics needed for the "Aid To Pakistan Industry" in Washington DC (See Ulan Batori's post above) to convince its GOTUS funders that they were not being played for complete fools all the time. Even the Aid To Pakistan Industry people know exactly what's going on; they just have too much to gain on a personal level by letting it go on. They are as much a party to conning the US taxpayers, armed forces and government as the Paki jernails themselves.

***

On the B-aid, I agree with you that some of it is definitely going towards jihad as well as nuke arsenal infrastructure (which I didn't address in my previous post). Yet, from India's point of view this is probably irrelevant as well. Ajit Doval in his presentation mentioned (correct me if I'm wrong) that maintaining the entire jihadi apparatus against India costs TSPA/ISI about as much or less than maintaining one single brigade costs the IA in a year. So the Pakis could probably continue to carry on their proxy-war jihad quite well without any A-aid or B-aid from America. The advantage conferred by A/B-aid to the Pakistan's anti-India jihad project is probably similar to the advantage conferred by A-aid hardware items to Pakistan's conventional capabilities ... incremental, but not definitive.

So I am not sure about the validity of your conclusion here:

If the answer is "No, the US should not aid the Paki army at all. The US should neither give the Paki army anti India F-6s nor anti-Taliban gunships" - I think that is a much more sensible solution. This way both the army and the Taliban will starve. They will continue to be partially allies and partially adversaries - but with less money and lower tech AKphyrr alone. They will be more easily defeated/kept in check by either the US or India.

The worst period of Punjab terrorism was 1983-1990, the worst period of J&K jihad was 1992-2002, and for a large chunk of that time there was little or no A-aid/B-aid going to Pakistan from the US (compared to 2002-present). Jihad was sustained against India by ISI with less money and low tech AK phyrr backed up by Paki nuke blackmail. I don't think we can necessarily argue that India found it easier to defeat or keep the Pakistani subconventional campaign in check because they weren't getting A-aid or B-aid from the US.

Peregrine · Post by **Peregrine** » 27 Jun 2014 00:10

Zarb-e-Azb updates: Operation will target all militants, including Haqqani network, says DG ISPR

Latest Updates :June 26, 6:19pm

In a press briefing to a select group of journalist, DG ISPR said the registration and evacuation process of IDPs has by and large been completed, our correspondent Kamran Yousaf reports.

At present, 466,00 IDPs have been registered, the DG ISPR said, adding that any civilians, who are still in the agency, can still be evacuated.

DG ISPR said the operation in N Waziristan is against all terrorist, including Haqqani network. He said there is a misconception that the army is facilitating certain militant groups, adding that there will be no discrimination in the operation and anyone who challenges the writ of the state will be taken to task.

“This is the beginning of the end of terrorism in Pakistan,” the DG ISPR added. Does it mean that now the Terrorist attacks in India will be intensified?

So far 327 terrorists have been killed and 45 hideouts have been destroyed in Operation Zarb-e-Azb. Ten soldiers have also been killed in the operation.

Cheers

Paul · Post by **Paul** » 27 Jun 2014 01:04

Peter Bergen trying to sell snake oil incompetence theory about ISI not knowing OBL in Abottabad and questioning Carlotta Gall's assertion as a mere theory. Watch 25:40. This is what we are u against on trying to understanding why there is a complete absence of outrage at Pakistan for harboring OBL.

I get the feeling Bergen is not very happy that Gall came out with this explosive book, is making money and he is made to look stupid in front of the MSM where he is supposed to be the pundit on OBL/AQ based on the supposed interview/meeting he had some years ago.

Anujan · Post by **Anujan** » 27 Jun 2014 01:21

We will fight Haqqanis is pure hogwash. Haqqani Jr was bull cattled in Isloo, they didn't need to go to Waziristan to find him. He was liaising with ISI and fundraising. Pakistan shut down NATO routes when helicopters fired on Siraj Haqqani and he had a miraculous escape. The negotiations for freeing the US soldier was through Taliban representatives in Qatar, their messengers traveling to Pakistan to meet mullah Omar and he was held by the Haqqani network.

This is one of the pious "Pakistan has never supported terrorism" declations that come out regularly. You should consider it with the same seriousness as "Mujahedeen are fighting in Kargil"

Rudradev · Post by **Rudradev** » 27 Jun 2014 01:38

Who really killed Nasiruddin Haqqani?

He was the "urbane" (closest thing to suited-booted) member of the Haqqani clan. Unlike brother Siraj and papa Jalaluddin with the British dental hygiene and scraggly beards, Nasiruddin often jet-setted to the Gelf to hug wealthy emirs and sheiks. He still had to keep up his bious looks of course, especially when he set up donation tents in UAE, Qatar oroutside the venues of Haj pilgrimage sites... so he did not exactly wear Armani in public, but he had probably partaken of the RAPE lifestyle on occasion to say the least.

Possibilities:
(1) ISI was working to make him "their" man within the Haqqani network. Siraj found out and had him killed.
(2) Saudis or other Arabs, possibly with US encouragement, were trying to make him "their" man within the Haqqani network. Siraj and/or ISI found out and had him killed.
(3) He had agreed with either ISI, Saudis, Qataris or someone else to be "their" man in the Haqqani network, and had subsequently double-crossed his new masters, who found out and had him killed.
(4) He was becoming an alternative (to ISI) conduit for funding and other support, directly to the Taliban from the ME sources; ISI did not like this trend towards evolving financial independence, and had him killed.

All mere speculation, let me admit. Is there any theory that actually seems to be backed up by the available facts?

Shreeman · Post by **Shreeman** » 27 Jun 2014 02:02

pisshour is down for the count and cathay is out of all four. you are left with turkish, thai, and gulf carriers at lawhore and malsigood.

Anujan · Post by **Anujan** » 27 Jun 2014 02:08

Afghan intelligence had him bumped off with their proxies in TTP is a popular theory.

Also the funny part about piss hour. The police have thrown up their hands and said that they can't manage the shanty next to the airport. The army says managing airports during non coup times is not their responsibility. I think pisshour will be lost soon. They have reached a point of no return

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 27 Jun 2014 02:24

Xpost for Paki, children born out of the Armpit Sweat of West Assasinasian Ashrafs.

Islamic Parasitic Paradox: State of Equilibrium is also the State of Vaccuum (burst initiation)existing Simultanously Onlee! Humm Banne Tumm Banne Ik Dooje Ke Liye .

Wah Faithfooleh Wah,
Tainu Aaye Na Sukh Da Sah
Green, Greener, Greenest Waddha Shah
Terri Qismat Which, Rubb Ney likhya Ghaa (grass)
Galleh Cuttan Dhi Subh nu Chah
Jey Koye hai Tainu Sharam, Hayya
Indian Ocean which Dubb Ke Marr Jaa!

anupmisra · Post by **anupmisra** » 27 Jun 2014 04:42

Don't know if this is a promise or a threat. We’ll change country’s fate if allowed to complete term: Sharief-Badmash

anupmisra · Post by **anupmisra** » 27 Jun 2014 04:44

Shreeman wrote:pisshour is down for the count and cathay is out of all four. you are left with turkish, thai, and gulf carriers at lawhore and malsigood.

Not so fast kufr. Please add Qatar Airways to the esteemed list.

sudhan · Post by **sudhan** » 27 Jun 2014 04:49

Me thinks, If the Afghans bumped off Haqqani Jr, why was the place hosed down immediately after the incident? Like Bhutto Motorma's misphortunate tryst with a sunroof lever?

As per news reports of that time, the pulis cantered in lazily to the crime scene allowing sufficient time for the bullet casings to be removed and the entire place cleaned up..

Me also thinks, Had the Afghans been involved, the TFTA pulis would have whipped out their famed forensic techniques that enable pious extraction of finger prints even from ropes..

Cosmo_R · Post by **Cosmo_R** » 27 Jun 2014 05:38

@Chetak ^^^ "They have very cleverly asked the GOI for permission/approval to go.
knowing full well that such permission/approval can/will never come.

Hope so. I guess, when GoI turns down the exit, there will be collective sighs and secret rejoice: : " Oh well I really tried this Jihad thingie but......"

Always false izzat,

A_Gupta · Post by **A_Gupta** » 27 Jun 2014 05:51

Anujan wrote:
A_Gupta wrote:http://www.cnn.com/2014/06/26/world/asi ... ee-crisis/
"Fleeing Pakistanis crowd border towns, asking 'why weren't we warned?'"

Why do Pakistani "anti-insurgency" operations create so many internal refugees?????
Because Pakistan army method of fighting terrorism is artillery, airstrikes, depopulating the area followed by reconstruction and resettlement with foreign aid after suitably brainwashed by sarkari pasand Jihadi groups. They fear infantry ops and contact with the enemy

Thanks, Anujan, but I still have the question - why does the Pakistani army adopt such tactics, especially against their own people? Does counterinsurgency elsewhere follow these scorched earth tactics? Are these tactics really necessary, or is there a more humane way of tackling the militants?

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 27 Jun 2014 06:16

The fading memory of amity

Rudradev · Post by **Rudradev** » 27 Jun 2014 06:20

AGupta, because their entire military ethos and culture remain virtually unchanged from what they inherited from Her Majesty's Imperial Army, to this day. Particularly as regards those bloody troublesome Frontier natives, whom they see as a subject people, not their own fellow citizens. Underlying all the biratherly egalitarian claims of Islamic nationhood is a devotion to the thought process that ordained the Pakjabis as a Civilizing Martial Race with dominion over Moslem India in the first place. Any wonder that while we scrapped NEFA decades ago, they still persist with the concept of FATA, and had an NWFP until very recently?

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 27 Jun 2014 06:29

A_Gupta wrote:
Thanks, Anujan, but I still have the question - why does the Pakistani army adopt such tactics, especially against their own people? Does counterinsurgency elsewhere follow these scorched earth tactics? Are these tactics really necessary, or is there a more humane way of tackling the militants?

Arun I used to read in articles (western) that Pakistan adopts such tactics because
1. They are not equipped for fighting conflict in civilian areas - their only tools were designed to fight India
2. They have not had the training and time to develop the doctrines to do this

This sounded reasonable about 6-7 years ago and used to make me proud of the way the Indian army deals with similar issues - after all the Indian army dealt actually instructed the US army on how to do this in Afghanistan.

But now I increasingly feel that these explanations are a load of crap because the Pakistani army has no intention of making life easy for the civilians in WANA or FATA. To the Punjabi in Pakistan they are "barbarians" (as Riedel points out in his video). They don't give a rat's ass if villages are razed. As if to match such thoughts, the news has always pointed out that the Taliban and the civilians have lived side by side and the people get displaced only when the army comes in.

The people who are displaced are quoted as complaining about both conditions under the Talibn and about the entry of the army and are quoted as disliking both. But none of them has ever run away and become a refugee because the Taliban were there. Their refugee status starts the minute the Pakistan army chooses to enter.

The Pakistani army seems to employ scorched earth tactic which are typical of an army that seeks to deny territory to everyone including themselves. They are not intending to stay either and are trying to stop others from staying.

If all this is true it makes me happy for this sounds like the Paki army are busy scoring self goals and making things worse for themselves in the long term. But it also strikes me that their attacks may actually be very limited and they are creating refugees simply to make it appear that they are acting against the Taliban and for the money that will flow in if refugees are visible to the world media. That seems more likely.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 27 Jun 2014 06:37

Rudradev wrote:Particularly as regards those bloody troublesome Frontier natives, whom they see as a subject people, not their own fellow citizens. Underlying all the biratherly egalitarian claims of Islamic nationhood is a devotion to the thought process that ordained the Pakjabis as a Civilizing Martial Race with dominion over Moslem India in the first place.

LOL true.

But I had another thought in the last few days. Once again the Punjabi is accepting the dominance of the Pashtun. The Punjabi dominated army - while pretending to fight the Pashtun has actually converted itself to the very ideology that the Pashtun adopted. The Pashtuns became Talibanized and the Punjabi army of Pakistan has followed suit and become Talibanzed too.

They now pretend to fight each other. Note that the current "Waziristan operation" (Zarb-e-ass?) is a fake operation in a fake response to the Karachi attack. The Punjabi army is telling the Pashtuns "We are not really going to hit you. Please don't hit us and we can continue to coexist as pious brothers"

A someone had pointed out earlier - the Pashtuns themselves are no great shakes. They have capitulated to most invaders. The only people they dominated was the Punjabis and they are doing it again. They are all a bunch of fakers