West Asia News and Discussions

Shanmukh · Post by **Shanmukh** » 01 Jul 2014 19:50

Johann wrote: But I think what has emerged is the Sunni equivalent of Hezbollah in the Arab world - committed, organised and able to transition between urban terrorism and rural insurgency, between acting like a guerrilla movement and acting like a mini state whenever local conditions are favorable. The difference is that these guys are utterly fanatic in their sectarian and religious hatred.

What they lack so far is endorsement from leading clerics around the Muslim world. If they get it, they'll be even harder to beat down. Hezbollah had Khomeini's backing and that was a huge force multiplier.

Very interesting, Johann. Good to see you posting again on the `West Asia' thread. There is a problem for the clerical endorsement of the ISIS, though. Most of the clerics that live in Saudi, Jordan, etc are under the influence of their respective governments (correct me if I am wrong here). Can they openly defy their own governments, (which may well be fighting battles of survival against the ISIS) and support the enemy, so to speak? What is to prevent the whole thing from ending up as the next chapter of the Black September (you do remember the turmoil inside Jordan between 1967 and 1971, don't you?) Terrorist militias have always remained in power based on support from some states. (Hezbollah had Iranian support, PFLP had Egypt, Syria, etc, Black September itself had Iraq, Syria, etc). When state support ended, the terrorist movements also ended. Now, which state can be expected to back the ISIS? Also, private donations may be inadequate once the movement begins to stall and fight a war of attrition against its enemies. Can they organise enough `private donations' once the movement begins to incur the hostility of all established states in the region?

harbans · Post by **harbans** » 01 Jul 2014 19:54

Rather than see which cleric has endorsed the Caliph and his antics, it's important to see how many have condemned it as 'unislamic'. And i don't see many loftily telling their admirers on Friday sessions that what ISIS is doing is unislamic. And that is not happening in any sunni neighborhood of where the ISIS is gaining control for sure.

Virupaksha · Post by **Virupaksha** » 01 Jul 2014 20:16

Do people here really think ISIS came up without state support? Do they also believe in santa claus?

People might be forgetting this, but during syrian civil war - weopons were provided exclusively to only those which had western backing with soudi and qataris as intermediaries.

Just observe the borders where isis holds sway. Soudi Arabia and Jordan - both staunch US allies.

Forget what the Soudi Arabia or US is saying for satisfying gullible western sheep. Thats just nonsense.

Look at their actions or non-actions in sync with what the US and UK are doing.

Any terrorism or guerilla warfare only succeeds if there are grouping areas beyond where the state can attack - usually neighboring countries. US and its allies provide that to ISIS.

how long does it really take for twitter to shut down a terrorist attack - as long as they listen to US. Otherwise, they will be assanged.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 01 Jul 2014 20:34

Agnimitra wrote:Why would Netenyahu come out openly in support of the formation of a Kurdistan? Most Kurds are still Muslim, and has Israeli "support" for any Muslim state ever improved that state's chances of survival? Its the proverbial kiss of death.

Perhaps the Israel prefers to divert Sunni Muslim attention to Kurdistan (with its interlocking entanglements with Iran, Turkey and Arab lands) rather than have ISIS move towards its immediate environs (Jordan, Saudi) at this point in time.

Israel mistakenly thinks that the main opposition to them comes from Arabs and culitvates non-Arabs. they first culitvated Shah of Iran as a non-Arab Muslim power.
Then he fell.
They forget Saladin was a Kurd.

ISIS will go where there is political weakness. Its in Jordan and KSA now.

Paul · Post by **Paul** » 01 Jul 2014 20:42

and the Mameluke Sultan Baybars was a Turkic/caucasian slave. As I said earlier, the Islamic world in the middle east is getting its act together. By this what I mean is that the borders there are withering away leaving the people to move back and forth. Jordan or Kuwait will go at some time in the future once the the next strain of the ISIS emerges and is confident of breaking away from the saudis ( AQ - v1, ISIS - v2, v3 - ?) . The Muslim Brotherhood experiment in Egypt has ensured that no Islamist org will ever try to take power through elections again. In turn this will finally lead to a common thought process across the region with a common enemy, most likely Israel.

The westphalian construct earlier ensured that most of their energies were expended on bickering with each other like Syria and Iraq were not getting along even though both states were ruled by the Bathists. Now It will becoming a Disneyland of Islamism with one ticket to see all the shows.

If one thinks the current situation is bad, wait till Turkey drops the pretense and gets into the act.

arminius · Post by **arminius** » 01 Jul 2014 20:56

harbans wrote:Rather than see which cleric has endorsed the Caliph and his antics, it's important to see how many have condemned it as 'unislamic'. And i don't see many loftily telling their admirers on Friday sessions that what ISIS is doing is unislamic. And that is not happening in any sunni neighborhood of where the ISIS is gaining control for sure.

At least 'em Shias can do it or can't they? What about those sarkari maulanas? Ist tiime for them to find some hadith which says you can go so much green and no more. Or I am expecting too much? Contraditions aren't that hard to find in Islamic theology.

harbans · Post by **harbans** » 01 Jul 2014 21:04

At least 'em Shias can do it or can't they? What about those sarkari maulanas? Ist tiime for them to find some hadith which says you can go so much green and no more. Or I am expecting too much?

Shia Imams have for obvious reasons condemned ISIS and pledged support for the Iraqi forces so we can leave them out here. So condemnation coming from Wahabbi/ Salafist Imams is to be as yet seen. But then as we have pointed there is nothing outrageous that ISIS has done so far that has not been done by even the most peaceful Islamic rulers even in India. Tipu, Akbar, Khiljis, Timur despite not having the advantage of automatic weapons in those days slaughtered at a much faster clip. Heck even the Paki Army conducted genocide in 1971 was much more efficient and faster than these ISIS types, you just need to calculate 3 million in 9 months to get the clip the Paki Army worked. So key is they've done nothing that is not a precedent. And all precedents of the predecessors have legitimacy somewhere or the other in the doctrine.

Shanmukh · Post by **Shanmukh** » 01 Jul 2014 23:19

Virupaksha wrote:Do people here really think ISIS came up without state support? Do they also believe in santa claus?

People might be forgetting this, but during syrian civil war - weopons were provided exclusively to only those which had western backing with soudi and qataris as intermediaries.

Yes, Virupaksha-ji. But the support for the ISIS (or that bit of ISIS that creates trouble in Saudi, or maybe even Jordan) will be cut off from the gulf. Al Jazeera will run hatchet jobs on the disobedient ones, and good propaganda from Qatar will be turned off. As long as ISIS is creating trouble in Iraq/Iran/Lebanon/Syria, it will have staunch support from the Gulf. As it begins to threaten to bite the hand that feeds it, it will find its support cut off.

Just observe the borders where isis holds sway. Soudi Arabia and Jordan - both staunch US allies.

Forget what the Soudi Arabia or US is saying for satisfying gullible western sheep. Thats just nonsense.

Look at their actions or non-actions in sync with what the US and UK are doing.

Any terrorism or guerilla warfare only succeeds if there are grouping areas beyond where the state can attack - usually neighboring countries. US and its allies provide that to ISIS.

how long does it really take for twitter to shut down a terrorist attack - as long as they listen to US. Otherwise, they will be assanged.

This is the point. As long as they listen to the US/Saudi, the ISIS will have Gulf/US/UK support. But if the ISIS begins to grow too big for its boots, it might find less sympathy from the Gulf (and the US). And the ISIS, as they find the going beginning to get tough in Shia/Kurdish parts of Iraq, and Druze/Alawite parts of Syria, may turn on a softer, easier prize - Saudi and Jordan. At which point the chickens will have come home to roost.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 01 Jul 2014 23:31

nageshks, By declaring Caliphate the ISIS has already negated Kingdom of SA.

KSA should have been a Sultanate but was called Kingdom to show its modern Islamic State.
KSA was the monarchy and Pakis were the republic. Sort of two role models for the Islamic world.
Both are now haram with Caliphate declaration.

Most likely there will be jihadi coup in TSP and declare alleigence to new Caliph.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 01 Jul 2014 23:51

Will the "crore commanders" give up their fleshpots and debauched lifestyle? However,the dear Lord forbid such an eventuality as a Paki caliphate entity would possess N-weapons.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 02 Jul 2014 06:38

Iraqis fiddle and piddle while ISIS does a diddle.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/j ... -toll-isis

Iraqi parliament session collapses amid political standoff
Shia, Sunni and Kurd politicians fail to begin process of electing new leaders, as UN reveals death toll since Isis insurgency

muraliravi · Post by **muraliravi** » 02 Jul 2014 06:54

So it looks like the Shia Sunni divide is the only thing that will stop this movement from engulfing the entire geography from saudi to india's western frontier.

I am optimistic, even if this movement reaches india's border, we will be able to give a befitting response if they try and enter India.

Singha sir, gun ownership per capita is lower than india in myanmar, vietnam, cambodia, poland and some eastern european nations as well. Thailand is an exception. Even russia has just 8 guns per 100 while India is at 4.2

uddu · Post by **uddu** » 02 Jul 2014 06:57

The latest Newz from the pious Islamic Caliphate
http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/iraq-isis-rama ... me-1454924
The leader of the Islamic State in Iraq and the Levant (Isis) has urged Muslims around the world to embrace jihad, claiming Islamist fighters will one day conquer Rome, the capital of Christianity.

In his first statement since Isis renamed itself the Islamic State and declared an Islamic "caliphate", Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi told Muslims around the world to take up arms and join his extremist group.

"So take up arms, take up arms, O soldiers of the Islamic State! And fight, fight," the self-appointed caliph of the Muslim world said in a Ramadan message.

"Muslims' rights are forcibly seized in China, India, Palestine, Somalia, the Arabian Peninsula, the Caucasus, the Levant, Egypt, Iraq, Indonesia, Afghanistan, the Philippines, Ahvaz, Iran, Pakistan, Tunisia, Libya, Algeria and Morocco, in the East and in the West," he said according to an English translation of his speech posted online by Isis.

"So raise your ambitions, O soldiers of the Islamic State! For your brothers all over the world are waiting for your rescue, and are anticipating your brigades."

Baghdadi claimed that the world is entangled in a new cold war, divided in "two trenches": "the camp of Islam and faith, and the camp of disbelief and hypocrisy".

"The time has come for you to free yourself from the shackles of weakness, and stand in the face of tyranny, against the treacherous rulers – the agents of the crusaders and the atheists, and the guards of the Jews," he said.

He made a special call to scholars, judges, doctors, engineers and people with military and administrative expertise to come and "answer the dire need of the Muslims for them."

The militants have called upon Muslims everywhere to pledge allegiance to "Caliph Ibrahim" - Baghdadi.

"Rush O Muslims to your state. Yes, it is your state. Rush, because Syria is not for the Syrians, and Iraq is not for the Iraqis. The earth is Allah's," he said.

"This is my advice to you. If you hold to it, you will conquer Rome and own the world, if Allah wills."

JE Menon · Post by **JE Menon** » 02 Jul 2014 08:18

After all that bombast: "if Allah wills"

Allah does not will. But drones will.

vic · Post by **vic** » 02 Jul 2014 08:27

When Iraq starts crushing ISIS, where will these Jihadis go to push their ideology? My guess is Saudi Arabia. I frankly don't understand the support of Saudis to extreme hardline very heavily armed Jihadis on their OWN borders.

Y. Kanan · Post by **Y. Kanan** » 02 Jul 2014 08:41

vic wrote:When Iraq starts crushing ISIS, where will these Jihadis go to push their ideology? My guess is Saudi Arabia. I frankly don't understand the support of Saudis to extreme hardline very heavily armed Jihadis on their OWN borders.

Why would they turn on their Saudi benefactors? Don't believe all this hype about ISIS wanting to overthrow the gulf monarchs. They have no intention of biting the hand that feeds them. I think the Saudis\Qataris\CIA are deliberately stoking those rumors to maintain their facade of deniability.

If ISIS finds itself losing the battle in Shiite-dominated part of Iraq, they'll just turn on Lebanon instead. Plenty of Shiites to kill there, and the country is already very divided. It's an easy target, and more chaos in Lebanon would suit the Saudis just fine.

I'm surprised no one has predicted this already.

Johann · Post by **Johann** » 02 Jul 2014 09:12

ISIL has only done well in areas that are demographically favorable to it - i.e. overwhelmingly Sunni Arab.

There's only one place in Lebanon that suits them - the northern bit around Tripoli. To be able to reach Tripoli, they must have Homs, but the rebels of all sorts evacuated Homs earlier. That area is a priority to the Asad government because it links the coastal and Alawi areas to the Damascus area. Without overland support a Salafi pocket in Tripoli will be crushed, something the Lebanese army did back in 2006.

ISIL is far from done in Syria. It still has rivals to crush or subordinate - the FSA (the Western preference), and the Islamic Front (the Saudi preference), Jabhat al-Nusra (the official AQ affiliate).

There's an argument in Syrian circles that the Asad government would prefer to see ISIL actually beat the FSA and and Islamic Front - ISIL has the least state backing and the most state opposition and generates the most global opposition.

But assuming it is able to expand in Sunni Syria, Jordan is the most logical next target, although its also a challenge.

Again, all of this assumes it will have breathing room. I'd be very surprised if it did.

Cain Marko · Post by **Cain Marko** » 02 Jul 2014 09:19

They will probly crawl back to the hole they came from, somewhere in Syria would be my guess. The sauds, western nations and gulf emirate s would be more than happy with such a tactical retreat. @ Use them whenever convenient to cause trouble for Iran, Syria and Russia.

Shankk · Post by **Shankk** » 02 Jul 2014 10:11

deleted

Rony · Post by **Rony** » 02 Jul 2014 17:07

India among jihad targets of ISIS

Ibrahim Awwad al-Badri, commander of the insurgent group Islamic State of Iraq and al-Sham (ISIS), has vowed war against several countries, including India, in a Ramzan speech released online late on Tuesday.

The reference to India, the first in an ISIS manifesto, raises new concerns for the safety of the almost hundreds of its nationals trapped in Iraqi cities controlled by the Islamist group, which is battling the governments of Iraq and Syria.

“Muslims’ rights”, Mr. al-Badri states in his speech, “are forcibly seized in China, India, Palestine, Somalia, the Arabian Peninsula, the Caucasus, Sham (the Levant), Egypt, Iraq, Indonesia, Afghanistan, the Philippines, Ahvaz, Iran (by the rafidah (shia)), Pakistan, Tunisia, Libya, Algeria and Morocco, in the East and in the West” [all text as in original released by ISIS].

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 02 Jul 2014 17:18

Iranian Su-25K arrives in Iraq , Apparently these are the 13 which defected from Iraq to Iran so possibly piloted by the same pilot.

Pictures ---> http://bmpd.livejournal.com/905807.html

harbans · Post by **harbans** » 03 Jul 2014 00:29

Track this story. It's developing, may test the Govt.

July 3: The 46 Indian nurses stranded in Iraq's Tikrit town that has been overrun by militants have been told to board a bus by unknown men and proceed to Mosul, Kerala Chief Minister Oommen Chandy told IANS. The Indian embassy in Baghdad has advised the nurses to "try and hold on till Thursday morning". The nurses had Tuesday refused to board two buses brought by "some English-speaking men" to the hospital compound in Tikrit where they have been stranded for more than two weeks. But Wednesday, they were being forced to board the buses and were told they would be taken to Mosul, another stronghold of the Islamic State in Iraq and Syria (ISIS).

46 Indian Nurses being taken to Mosul

Rudradev · Post by **Rudradev** » 03 Jul 2014 01:13

One piece of (relatively) good news for the Nurses. In conflict zones, trained medical professionals are a very valuable commodity. Especially for a non-state force like ISIS, with very limited access to supplies and facilities, they can make the difference between injured Abduls meeting their 72 or becoming AK-phyrr capable again. Like blacksmiths in medieval European war zones, they are key force-multipliers, and hence likely to be treated well by their captors... not starved, tortured or raped. This is even more true for medical professionals from India, who are kufr and have no dog in the Shia-Sunni fight, but also aren't Westerners.

Of course this also means ISIS will never let these nurses go, even if they release all the other Indians in their custody

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 03 Jul 2014 01:36

Supposedly the world's Middle East "peacemaker",notorious warmonger Tony B Liar is reaping rich rewards promoting personal interests of pelf rather than promoting peace in the region.Instead of rushing to Jerusalem to defuse the kidnapping and murder of Israelis by Palestinian terrorists and an apparent revenge killing in return by suspected Israelis,not to mention the utter collapse of peace talks between the Israelis and Palestinians,Bliar is instead rushing to Cairo as the economic adviser to Gen.Fat-Sissy,the latest Egyptian dictator to fix "mouthwatering business opportunities".

BLiar is nothing better than a pimp for western MNCs ,waiting to greedily consume the "mouthwatering business opportunities" that his deal-fixing will ensure,while he remains a pernicious global parasite pretending to be peacemaker,the job entrusted to him for which he has forsaken and abandoned for his pieces of silver,kickbacks for spearheading the illegal war against Iraq.

Meet Egyptian president's new economics adviser - Tony Blair
Published time: July 02, 2014

Tony Blair has reportedly agreed to advise Egyptian President Abdel Fattah el-Sisi as part of a United Arab Emirates-funded program that promises lucrative “business opportunities” to those involved.

The former British prime minister is set to give Sisi advice on economic reform in tandem with a UAE-financed task force in Cairo, the Guardian reported Wednesday.

According to the daily, the task force is being run by the management consultancy Strategy&, formerly Booz and Co, now part of PriceWaterhouseCoopers. The group hopes to attract foreign direct investment to Egypt’s crisis-racked economy at an upcoming Egypt donors' conference, which is being sponsored by oil-rich UAE, Kuwait and Saudi Arabia.

Blair, who has worked since he left the British government in 2007 as a Middle East envoy, supported the coup against Egypt’s democratically elected president Mohamed Morsi last July and continues to generate controversy with his complicated dealings in the region. Last month, for example, Blair advocated a new Western-led military intervention in Iraq to fight against the jihadist ISIS group.

A spokeswoman for Blair told the Guardian that his attempts to garner support for Egypt from the international community was not being done "for any personal gain whatsoever."

"He is giving advice, he will have meetings, that's all," she said, stressing that neither Blair nor any organizations associated with him would make money out of Egypt.

She added that he believe the Sisi government “should be supported in its reform agenda and he will help in any way he can, but not as part of a team."

When pressed on the lucrative “business opportunities” the Egypt project and its Gulf backers promised, she said: "We are not looking at any business opportunities in Egypt."

A former close political associate, however, told the Guardian that Blair’s role in advising the Egyptian regime would cause "terrible damage to him, the rest of us and New Labour's legacy."

The associate said that Blair was able to kill two birds with one stone in Egypt, battling the threat of Islamism while sinking his teeth into “mouth-watering business opportunities” in return for Bush-era advocacy.

He added that it would be a very lucrative business model, but one Blair should not be involving himself with.

“He’s putting himself in hock to a regime that imprisons journalists. He's digging a deeper and deeper hole for himself and everyone associated with him."

Alastair Campbell, Blair's former press secretary who resigned in 2003 over the Iraq Dossier scandal, is also a paid adviser consulting the Sisi government on its public image. When asked by the Guardian on Wednesday if he had been working with Strategy&, Campbell refused to say who he had been working with. Like Blair, Campbell also visited Cairo earlier this year as part of the Gulf-funded program to prop up the regime. Another former Blair employee, Darren Murphy, a so-called special adviser in the Blair government who has traded off the former PM’s name for years, has also been working on the program.

In June, Sisi, Egypt’s former army chief, won 96.9 percent of the votes in a presidential poll that had all the hallmarks of a dictatorial election.

Saudi Arabia's King Abdullah bin Abdulaziz was the first international leader to congratulate Sisi on his election victory.

King Abdullah hailed Sisi's ’win as a “historic day” for Egypt, calling for a donors conference to help Egypt through its economic troubles.

“To the brothers and friends of Egypt... I invite all to a donors conference... to help it overcome its economic crisis,” he said.

Since the Morsi government was toppled, hundreds of alleged supporters of the ex-president and his Muslim Brotherhood movement have been sentenced to death. The persecution of political opponents and crackdown on journalists has pushed US congressional leaders to consider withholding $1.3 billion in military support to Cairo.

Since stepping down as prime minister in 2007, Blair and consulting companies he has been associated with have worked with a variety of repressive and dictatorial regimes across the world. Blair’s Middle East interests appear to be expanding, with aides confirming last month he was considering opening an office in the UAE capital, Abu Dhabi. His work in Egypt could be viewed as even more contentious, due to the bloody nature of the coup and his work as a mediator in the region.

In June, retired diplomats and political enemies came together to demand that Blair be fired as the envoy to the Quartet on the Middle East – the UN, US, Russia and EU – after failing to bring Israel and Palestine closer to a peace deal.

Y. Kanan · Post by **Y. Kanan** » 03 Jul 2014 03:55

Johann wrote:ISIL has only done well in areas that are demographically favorable to it - i.e. overwhelmingly Sunni Arab.

There's only one place in Lebanon that suits them - the northern bit around Tripoli. To be able to reach Tripoli, they must have Homs, but the rebels of all sorts evacuated Homs earlier. That area is a priority to the Asad government because it links the coastal and Alawi areas to the Damascus area. Without overland support a Salafi pocket in Tripoli will be crushed, something the Lebanese army did back in 2006.

Good point about the geography; I stand corrected. Looks like ISIS won't be bothering Lebanon anytime soon.

In any case we're all making out ISIS to be much more than it is. They're not even the strongest militant group operating in the Middle East (Hezbollah is far more capable in terms of combat power). ISIS is just yet another outfit organized by the CIA and funded with Wahhabi oil money, like so many before them. They were created as a weapon against Assad and are now somewhat out of control, at least from the American point of view. From the Saudi\Qatari point of view, they're secretly happy to have ISIS wreaking havoc on the Iraqi Shias and keeping Iran occupied.

Anyway the US has always been cozy with the Sunnis and Wahhabis in particular, even after they killed 3000 of its citizens on 9/11. This is hard to understand from the Indian point of view, as it seems incredibly cold-blooded and evil to sacrifice thousands of your citizens to advance business and strategic interests, but we forget that the US is not really run by elected politicians. It's corporations and the military that actually control US policies.

This is why the US is without a doubt the most dangerous threat to world peace, far surpassing even China in its willingness to partner with the most murderous, evil people and wreak chaos for strategic or political gain. And keep in mind, often these "gains" only benefit a small group of people, not the US populace as a whole. This is one reason why the US is so hard to figure out; unlike most other countries, it does not pursue policies in its own national interest. Often US policies hurt the country and its population overall, but benefit a select group of special interests and companies that exert influence on the government far in excess of their true importance. Much of US behavior since 9/11 seems insane and self-defeating until you look at it from the POV of the military industrial complex, the Jew lobby, or the oil\natural companies.

muraliravi · Post by **muraliravi** » 03 Jul 2014 04:21

^^^ The founding fathers of America were true libertarians and would have never done what the current USA is doing. USA today is just a jewish colony with 3 core objectives: protect israeli interest at all cost, enable the global jew to mint his money and control the world, destroy or enslave the white race as much as possible.

uddu · Post by **uddu** » 03 Jul 2014 04:27

The hatred for the Jews from Mohammed's time is adopted by the Leftists and can be seen in India's Leftists and Liberal's. Only poor Jews knows what and all they have to do to keep their tiny nation being gobbled up by Islam. If they are smart enough to do that to keep at bay all those morons who hate them for being a Jew, then kudos to them.

Y. Kanan · Post by **Y. Kanan** » 03 Jul 2014 04:36

muraliravi wrote:^^^ The founding fathers of America were true libertarians and would have never done what the current USA is doing. USA today is just a jewish colony with 3 core objectives: protect israeli interest at all cost, enable the global jew to mint his money and control the world, destroy or enslave the white race as much as possible.

I wouldn't go that far; the Jews are just one powerful lobby among several that dictate US policy. The military industrial complex (and all the myriad companies who fortunes are tied to them) is just as potent a lobby when it comes to influencing US policy. And of course the big oil & natural gas producers are also a very powerful group. And don't forget the banks, possibly the most powerful lobby of them all.

It's when the interests of all four big lobbies (MID, Jews, Oil, Banks) align on some particular issue... well that's when you know you're going to have big trouble. When the big US lobbies agree on something, it's going to happen regardless of how badly it affects the American citizenry. Often we see the US doing apparently idiotic and self-defeating things, and we wonder what the hell are they thinking? Look to the interests of the four big lobbies and then decide if the latest policy disaster is really that stupid after all.

muraliravi · Post by **muraliravi** » 03 Jul 2014 05:08

uddu wrote: The hatred for the Jews from Mohammed's time is adopted by the Leftists and can be seen in India's Leftists and Liberal's. Only poor Jews knows what and all they have to do to keep their tiny nation being gobbled up by Islam. If they are smart enough to do that to keep at bay all those morons who hate them for being a Jew, then kudos to them.

I guess you should add india's right wing also to your list. I am a hard core pro-right pro-hindu guy and stand by what I posted.

muraliravi · Post by **muraliravi** » 03 Jul 2014 05:09

Y. Kanan wrote:
muraliravi wrote:^^^ The founding fathers of America were true libertarians and would have never done what the current USA is doing. USA today is just a jewish colony with 3 core objectives: protect israeli interest at all cost, enable the global jew to mint his money and control the world, destroy or enslave the white race as much as possible.
I wouldn't go that far; the Jews are just one powerful lobby among several that dictate US policy. The military industrial complex (and all the myriad companies who fortunes are tied to them) is just as potent a lobby when it comes to influencing US policy. And of course the big oil & natural gas producers are also a very powerful group. And don't forget the banks, possibly the most powerful lobby of them all.

It's when the interests of all four big lobbies (MID, Jews, Oil, Banks) align on some particular issue... well that's when you know you're going to have big trouble. When the big US lobbies agree on something, it's going to happen regardless of how badly it affects the American citizenry. Often we see the US doing apparently idiotic and self-defeating things, and we wonder what the hell are they thinking? Look to the interests of the four big lobbies and then decide if the latest policy disaster is really that stupid after all.

Jews and Banks are synonymous, why keep them separate.

uddu · Post by **uddu** » 03 Jul 2014 06:03

muraliravi wrote:
uddu wrote: The hatred for the Jews from Mohammed's time is adopted by the Leftists and can be seen in India's Leftists and Liberal's. Only poor Jews knows what and all they have to do to keep their tiny nation being gobbled up by Islam. If they are smart enough to do that to keep at bay all those morons who hate them for being a Jew, then kudos to them.
I guess you should add india's right wing also to your list. I am a hard core pro-right pro-hindu guy and stand by what I posted.

Agree, I have seen many who claim to be Hindus but is more fundamentalist and support Islamic ways of living than most of the Islamists. Dont know whether this is the hangover from Islamic times imposed on Hindus during Islamic rules still having an affect even today.

muraliravi · Post by **muraliravi** » 03 Jul 2014 06:55

uddu wrote:
Agree, I have seen many who claim to be Hindus but is more fundamentalist and support Islamic ways of living than most of the Islamists. Dont know whether this is the hangover from Islamic times imposed on Hindus during Islamic rules still having an affect even today.

Hmm, it has nothing to do with what you have stated. Maybe you should dig more into jewish history and see that after all they are not so innocent. Maybe you will see that they are the brains behind ww1 & 2, maybe you will see how they forced the balfour declaration. Isn't it wild that a race so miniscule that has hardly contributed to even 1% of the science and tech inventions in the last 400 years has so much monopoly on the money generated by some of the most innovative countries and people on earth. It may even interest you that the 1st director of the east india company was a jew.

Is it just a coincidence that bollywood which is controlled by mullahs has only one objective: Brainwash hindus and subject them to guilt complex with movies like "my name is khan" and keep trolling the same hindu=muslim crap and Hollywood which is royally owned by Jews has already already done the same to white americans with spielberg types and their schindler's lists. Maybe just like many of us in India feel how the MSM owned by x-tians, muslims and lefties have erased chapters of hindu genocide, it is right for american whites to feel how their cnn's and msnbc's (run by jews like wold blitzer of course) have built up this whole concept of multi cultural america, when in reality america was made a super power by white americans.

Is it just a coincidence that the whole immigration restriction act was repealed in 1965 due to lobbying by Emanuel Celler (a jew of course), is it just a coincidence that in almost all states where the US is considering giving out drivers licenses to illegal aliens, the move is 1st proposed by a jewish senator (illinois and washington state examples are staring at your face)

Even though I would love hindus in India to take it again to its zenith, lets give credit where it is due, the white race has done great service to science and tech in the last 400 years that no one else has and jews are nothing in this game barring a few exceptions like einstein here and there

UlanBatori · Post by **UlanBatori** » 03 Jul 2014 07:46

Colorado Woman Accused Of Wanting To Work On POTUS-SDOTUS Pet Project

(CNN) -- A Colorado woman was arrested at the Denver airport in April and charged with conspiracy to provide material support to terrorists, according to court documents that were unsealed Wednesday.

Shannon Maureen Conley, 19, allegedly told FBI agents before her arrest that she was going to be with a member of the Islamic State in Iraq and Syria, or ISIS, that she had met through the Internet.

"It's a difficult time for us," her mother, Ana Conley, told CNN on Wednesday.

Conley's attorney, Robert William Pepin, said he had no comment.
His client was arrested on a jetway while trying to board a flight to Germany on April 8, according to a criminal complaint. She told investigators she was going to Turkey to await word from her suitor.
Conley, a certified nurse aide, had told FBI agents she was going to be the man's wife and a nurse in a ISIS camp near the Turkish border, documents showed.
Conley first came to the attention of authorities after the pastor and the security director at a church in Arvada, Colorado, called police and said she was acting suspiciously. Authorities interviewed her seven times over the course of five months before arresting her at the airport.
Jeff Dorschner, a Department of Justice spokesman, said there was a June 26 status hearing at which the judge ordered the documents in the case to be unsealed.
Conley's next court date has not been scheduled. She is in the custody of U.S. Marshals.
Conley faces up to 15 years in prison if convicted.

CNN's Sara Weisfeldt contributed to this story.

Virupaksha · Post by **Virupaksha** » 03 Jul 2014 08:43

muraliravi wrote:^^^ The founding fathers of America were true libertarians and would have never done what the current USA is doing. USA today is just a jewish colony with 3 core objectives: protect israeli interest at all cost, enable the global jew to mint his money and control the world, destroy or enslave the white race as much as possible.

All the above post shows is that you have not read and taken in by the propaganda. Most of those "founding fathers" were power hungry bible thumping violent racist slave owners.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 03 Jul 2014 08:48

The Jewish struggle for survival has made them over the centuries develop extraordinary skills to remain alive.Financial expertise and networking,plus ingratiating themselves to ruling elites ,bankrolling their extravagances and idiosyncracies has kept them alive.Jews were scattered all over the world .I have a close relative whose family were originally from Jericho who migrated to France over a thousand years ago.Holistically,the Jews have been persecuted for centuries by the so-called Christian nations of Europe.Read Shylock's lament in the Merchant of Venice,about the treatment of Jews.

I am a Jew. Hath not a Jew eyes? Hath not a Jew hands, organs, dimensions, senses, affections, passions? Fed with the same food, hurt with the same weapons, subject to the same diseases, healed by the same means, warmed and cooled by the same winter and summer as a Christian is? If you prick us, do we not bleed? If you tickle us, do we not laugh? If you poison us, do we not die? And if you wrong us, shall we not revenge? If we are like you in the rest, we will resemble you in that. If a Jew wrong a Christian, what is his humility? Revenge. If a Christian wrong a Jew, what should his sufferance be by Christian example? Why, revenge. The villainy you teach me I will execute—and it shall go hard but I will better the instruction.

One must not however confuse Jews and the Jewish state of Israel.The conflict there is all about land.Israeli expansionism into traditional Arab/Palestinian land based upon promises made to the Hebrews by their God.Within Israel there is stiff opposition to some of the expansionist policies of the Netanhyahu govt.,but it is in charge now and pursuing its settlement policies to the full,now most controversial in E.Jerusalem.The awful tit-for tat killings just keep on prolonging the ancient Mosaic lawlessness of an "eye for an eye,tooth for a tooth",leading Gandhiji to make his famous remark about the number of "toothless and blind" people it would result in. He was truly prophetic. Years ago when the intifada was at its peak and kids legs were being broken by Israelis security forces outraging the world,Woody Allen wrote an open letter of criticism in the NYT,saying "Guys what are we doing.." or words to that effect.

Allen on Israel:

“I support Israel and I’ve supported it since the day it was founded. Israel’s neighbors have treated it badly, cruelly, instead of embracing it and making it part of the Middle East family of nations. Over the years Israel has responded to these attacks in various ways, some of which I approved of and some less so. I understand that Israelis have been through hard times, I don’t expect Israel to react perfectly every time and that doesn’t change the fact that it’s a wonderful, marvelous country. I’m just worried about the rise of fundamentalism in Israel, which I think damages its interests. I also have questions about your leadership, which doesn’t always act in Israel’s best interests. But even my criticism of Israel comes from a place of love, just like when I criticize the United States. It would be a mistake not to say something if you think a country you love makes a mistake and could hurt itself.”

There are many Jews like Allen who have revulsion at the pathetic state that the Palestinians are in,living in virtual ghettos while across a massive concrete wall,a rich and prosperous Israel exists.That state of inequality provokes resentment and outright hostility.sad because for centuries Jews and Muslims lived relatively peacefully before the Europeans got there! And that perhaps is the answer,for the Israelis to make the Palestinians at least a little prosperous and less aggressive.A hungry man is an angry man and the Palestinians are enraged. With Hamas and the PLO joining hands,an anathema to Israel,the only communication between the two is sadly gunfire.

PS:America's founding fathers were pilgrims from the Mayflower,soon replaced by white adventurers who decimated and destroyed the native American "Indians" who lived in complete harmony with nature,corralling them into "reservations,in reality open prisons where they could not roam the land as they did for thousands of years.The result today;the US is the world's largest polluter,mainly responsible for global warming and massive climatic change endangering humanity itself, and warmonger supreme.

Virupaksha · Post by **Virupaksha** » 03 Jul 2014 08:57

What the jews were up against is beyond compare.

This is what a papal edict which still stands today inspite of its so called reform states

Since it is completely senseless and inappropriate to be in a situation where Christian piety allows the Jews (whose guilt—all of their own doing—has condemned them to eternal slavery) access to our society and even to live among us

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cum_nimis_absurdum

Vayutuvan · Post by **Vayutuvan** » 03 Jul 2014 08:58

Isn't Jericho supposed to be the oldest city in the world, ca. 7000 BCE which is older than those in Mesapatomia.

Shanmukh · Post by **Shanmukh** » 03 Jul 2014 08:59

muraliravi wrote: Hmm, it has nothing to do with what you have stated. Maybe you should dig more into jewish history and see that after all they are not so innocent. Maybe you will see that they are the brains behind ww1 & 2, maybe you will see how they forced the balfour declaration. Isn't it wild that a race so miniscule that has hardly contributed to even 1% of the science and tech inventions in the last 400 years has so much monopoly on the money generated by some of the most innovative countries and people on earth. It may even interest you that the 1st director of the east india company was a jew.

Is it just a coincidence that bollywood which is controlled by mullahs has only one objective: Brainwash hindus and subject them to guilt complex with movies like "my name is khan" and keep trolling the same hindu=muslim crap and Hollywood which is royally owned by Jews has already already done the same to white americans with spielberg types and their schindler's lists. Maybe just like many of us in India feel how the MSM owned by x-tians, muslims and lefties have erased chapters of hindu genocide, it is right for american whites to feel how their cnn's and msnbc's (run by jews like wold blitzer of course) have built up this whole concept of multi cultural america, when in reality america was made a super power by white americans.

Is it just a coincidence that the whole immigration restriction act was repealed in 1965 due to lobbying by Emanuel Celler (a jew of course), is it just a coincidence that in almost all states where the US is considering giving out drivers licenses to illegal aliens, the move is 1st proposed by a jewish senator (illinois and washington state examples are staring at your face)

Even though I would love hindus in India to take it again to its zenith, lets give credit where it is due, the white race has done great service to science and tech in the last 400 years that no one else has and jews are nothing in this game barring a few exceptions like einstein here and there

All this post tells me is that antisemitic propaganda is hyper effective. Never thought I would see this kind of antisemitism from Indians, that too on BRF. I hope your account is not hacked, MuraliRavj-ji.

Dilbu · Post by **Dilbu** » 03 Jul 2014 10:02

I think ISIS was created to check the rising shia dominance aka Iran in the region. KSA-Uncle team already had the resources among Syrian rebels and they just had to pan out into Iraq, conveniently after US withdrawal. To maintain the farce of a new and rising balanced pan islamic jihadi group which is not targeting shais alone, they are giving out statements about hajj and Mecca while nothing will be done on the ground against sunni interests. US is leaving Iraq in the hands of Iran and regional sunni all-lies are unhappy about it.

The idea might be to put pressure on Maliki and overthrow him if necessary and put in place a sunni government with KSA in control.

JE Menon · Post by **JE Menon** » 03 Jul 2014 12:20

Shankk... Valid point.

I should have thought of it myself, effing idiot that I was there... That, and all related posts deleted. The problems of easy access via multiple devices is that you don't give yourself time to think through things sometimes.

Thanks for spotting that and pointing it out.