West Asia News and Discussions (YEMEN, gulf)

UlanBatori · Post by **UlanBatori** » 28 Aug 2014 01:57

If u didn't believe the part about the Israeli connections of ISIS:

Jolani said some fighters were able to reach the crossing despite bombardment by Syrian warplanes. Because of agreements with Israel, Syrian forces could not bomb the forces at the crossing, he said.
During the fighting, three mortar rounds and some small-arms fire crossed into Israeli-controlled territory, IDF spokesman Lt. Col. Peter Lerner said.
An Israeli military officer was moderately injured, the IDF said on Twitter, and Israeli forces responded by striking two Syrian military positions.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 28 Aug 2014 02:10

The US CW strategy as Ramana mentioned to unite Islamist nations against the US's perceived enemies at that time was the Soviets.One witnessed it during the Afghan War when the Soviets intervened to save the then regime which was being terrorised by US/Western covert ops operating out of Pak.That led to blowback OBL and Al Q.The Gulf Wars then saw the rise of Shiite and Sunni militias and the Arab Spring opened the lid of Pandora's box even wider,leading now to ISIS et al. The US policy now is "a plague upon all your huses,we aren't sh*t cleaners,our privilege,since God is a white man is to defecate upon on your lands ,again anjd again and let you clean up the mess,since you live there and we don't!"

The only silver lining in the region is the long term truce between Israel and Hamas.Why could it not have happened before this latest round of warring,where over 2000 have died and for what?
One sincerely hopes that this will be the last war between the Palestinians and Israelis,that better judgement on both sides will prevail and that they learn to live in peace with each other.In that we wish them well.It is time for the international community to now come forth with both humanitarian assistance to the people of Gaza and persuasive diplomacy to get both sides to progress across the table instead of fighting on the ground.Coincidentally,the ceasefire took place at the same time as the re-opening of Chabad House in Bombay,6 years after the Paki terror attacks on 26/11.Let's hope that this was a positive omen.

Hamas and Israel agree 'long-term' truce as Cairo talks mark end of seven-week war
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/
Terms include an Israeli agreement to ease its Gaza blockade to allow in relief supplies

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 28 Aug 2014 02:59

Philip all those acronyms/gang names are all bokwas. Hamas, Hezbollah ISIS/PISIS PAT/PTI/TTP what not.
Look at it thru three filters to understand Muddle East:
Muslim vs. Non-Muslim : Israelis, Christians, Yezdis etc.
Arab vs. non Arab: Iranian, Israelis, Kurds, etc..
Sunni vs. Others: Shia, Ahmediayas, etc.

--
Everything should be made as simple as possible. But no simpler. Albert Einstein

chanakyaa · Post by **chanakyaa** » 28 Aug 2014 04:28

How about making it a little more simpler for the region,

1. Countries who have oil and natural gas; and willing to sell it a price dictated by others to a someone who know how to convert commodity into economic activity

2. Countries who have oil and gas; and are not willing to sell to at a price and in currency dictated by others

3. Countries who do not have oil and gas; and the region is not in the way, physically, to obstruct installation of a pipeline to oil and gas from place where it is abundance to where is needed. These countries generally get used the way TSP is being used as chronic disease for India, and then

4. Countries who do not have oil and gas, but they are kebab me haddi if decision is made to transport oil and gas from point A to point B, and the country is in the way, and it's regime unfriendly

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 28 Aug 2014 08:37

oil is imo orthogonal to the fights. these fights have raged for millenia long before anyone found a use for oil.

oil has the effect of bringing in powerful outside powers as playas to the region to add spice to the sizzling soup.

brihaspati · Post by **brihaspati** » 29 Aug 2014 01:32

I want to spoil the fun: I think Israel-Hamas is very soon going to war. This time Hamas will be joined by other jihadis - regional and from outside. Time frame, next 6 moths?

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 29 Aug 2014 01:55

brihaspati wrote:I want to spoil the fun: I think Israel-Hamas is very soon going to war. This time Hamas will be joined by other jihadis - regional and from outside. Time frame, next 6 months?

Intuition or projections?

I think ISIS will shift there to show their importance.

brihaspati · Post by **brihaspati** » 29 Aug 2014 03:53

Both.
If the speculation of ISIS being Israeli front has any basis, it will mean that the purpose of Israel will only be served after ISIS bites Israel to create the conditions Israel planned for while "creating ISIS"(!!! and these are not examples of CT madness).

Realistically, applying Occam's razor - islamism/jihad is enough to predict what ISIS will do, without going for Zionist conspiracy/Rothschilds/templars/illuminati ityadi. Also enough to predict what Hamas will do.

Both sides are preparing for a wider war. Its just a breather for both. Israel had to contend with the same enemy anti-jihad forces in non-Muslim nations have to face: their own militant "liberals". and of course bleeding heart sympathizers of Palestinian jihadis globally. US needed Israel to back off.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 29 Aug 2014 04:13

Ramana yes,and we are seeing a microcosm of that in Pukeistan! The Jordananians are sh*tting camel dung trembling for the day when ISIS casts its beady eye on the Hashemites and the kingdoms,sheikdoms and oily-garchies are running around in circles like headless camels not knowing how to control the monster that they created,which threatens to devour them at some point in the future.As long as ISIS feasts upon its own kind,Israel is safe for the moment,but if and when it reaches Israel's borders,we will be heading for another kind of conflict.Why Israel needs a buffer zone of docile Palestinians and Lebanese around it. Will Israel shift towards the Shiites and Iran in future,rather than the Saudis and Sunnis?

Reg. ISIS being an Israeli creation,it appears to have been Saudi propaganda,perhaps because the brutality of ISIS has been unmatched since the last century.Even the Nazis and Pol Pot who murdered millions,dis so rather mechanistically,but ISIS have an inhuman "quality",if the word could ever be used in their context,that require going back to the Middle Ages.150 Syrian troops are supposed to have been their latest victims of butchery.The reluctance of the US/West to destroy ISIS (while tilting at Ukranian and Russsian windmills) only increases the suspicion that there is a covert sub-plot,where ISIS is meant to do the dirty work and ensure regime change in Syria,elsewhere,before it can be defanged/destroyed and weaker puppets placed to obey orders.This may however go spectacularly wrong as we saw with the Afghan blowback with Al Q.

Another act of barbarism from ISIS.
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/a ... [b]Islamic State kills 150 captured troops in Syria, say activists[/b]
UN says 43 peacekeepers also detained during fighting in the Golan Heights
Associated Press in Beirut
The Guardian, Thursday 28 August 2014

Shreeman · Post by **Shreeman** » 29 Aug 2014 08:20

All this hooha about EUkraine while the IS is butchering non-combatants by the 1000s. Several hundred turkmen joined the 150 syrians. Quid, hyuoooman rights organisations? The UN is busy lecturing russia, but there isnt a peep in the media re. IS supporters.

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 29 Aug 2014 12:52

Islamic State Uses CIA Torture Techniques on Captured Americans - Reports

MOSCOW, August 29 (RIA Novosti) - The Islamic State (IS) is using CIA torture methods on US citizens taken hostage by the militant group, The Washington Post reported, citing people familiar with the hostages’ treatment.

“At least four hostages held in Syria by the Islamic State, including an American journalist who was recently executed by the group, were waterboarded in the early part of their captivity,” the newspaper reported. “James Foley was among the four who were waterboarded several times by Islamic State militants who appeared to model the technique on the CIA’s use of waterboarding to interrogate suspected terrorists after the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks.”

Waterboarding, a technique that simulates drowning, involves pouring cold water over a person’s face covered with a cloth, and has been used since 9/11.

In a 2008 statement, former CIA chief Michael Hayden said the agency’s “decision to employ waterboarding in the wake of 9/11 was not only lawful, it reflected the circumstances of the time.”

“CIA’s terrorist interrogation program, lawful and effective, was born of necessity,” he said in 2008.

The CIA’s harsh interrogation and torture techniques were banned after President Barack Obama took office in 2009.

The Washington Post cited several people who witnessed the captivity of an American journalist James Foley and said he was tortured, including by waterboarding. Foley, who was taken prisoner in Syria in November 2012, was beheaded last week by IS militants.

On August 19, the IS released a YouTube video showing a masked man executing Foley. The group explained that the journalist was killed in revenge for US airstrikes against IS positions in northern Iraq.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 29 Aug 2014 19:37

"Spitting against the wind"! What sh*t you throw at others comes back to you.

Wiser after the events,but has the West,US and UK in particular learnt anything from their disasters? The manner in which they are thrashing at the UKR/Russian "windmills",a la Don Quixote,O'Bumbler and his Sancho Panza, CaMoron,instead of going after ISIS with extreme prejudice,shows that history is repeating itself ad nauseum.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/defenc ... or-britain
Iraq, Syria, Libya, UK – Intelligence failures all
• Lack of intelligence as well as Intelligence
• Intelligence begins at home, but should be deployed away

An Iraqi Shia fighter fires his weapon during clashes with militants from the Islamic State group in
An Iraqi Shia fighter fires his weapon during clashes with militants from the Islamic State group on 18 August 2014. Photograph: Hadi Mizban/AP

Given the resources available to US – and British – intelligence agencies, it seems strange that the attraction, influence, finance, and military strength, of the extremist group which calls itself Islamic State (Isis) came as such a surprise.

As Patrick Cockburn observes in his excellent new book, The Jihadis Return, "though the swiftly growing power of Isis was obvious to those who followed its fortunes, the significance of what was happening was taken on board by few foreign governments, hence the widespread shock that greeted the fall of Mosul".

It was evident, says Cockburn, that western governments entirely misread the situation in Iraq and Syria.

For more than a decade, the US – backed by successive British governments, to the horror of many in Whitehall, notably the Foreign Office and some MI6 officers – adopted a simplistic, easy, and entirely misguided, approach towards a most complex and unstable part of the world.

Whether it was bombing (Iraq, Libya, and Afghanistan), or demonising dictators (Saddam in Iraq, Gaddafi in Libya, Assad in Syria) it was as though the US and UK governments never contemplated the extraordinary dangerous consequences of a power vacuum.

It is even more dangerous when foreigners impose a deadline on the withdrawal of their forces (Iraq and Afghanistan).

Western governments should have worked more closely, and more humbly, with Turkey, Iran, countries throughout the Middle East, and with Russia (whose leaders have been deeply concerned about radical Islamist extremism for rather longer than the west). The task is to persuade them they do have some essential common interests.

It is not too late to pick up the pieces, and attack such drivers of extremism as poverty, alienation, and sectarianism.

In the short term, humanitarian aid, supplying those fighting Isis with appropiate weapons, and dealing with Assad.

"Sometimes you have to develop relationships with people who are extremely nasty in order to get rid of people who are even nastier", Sir Malcolm Rifkind, former Conservative defence and foreign secretary, now chair of the parliamentary intelligence and security committee, told the Financial Times last week. Richard Dannatt, former head of the army, took a similar line.

Philip Hammond, former defence secretary, now foreign secretary, distanced himself from such talk. Britain would not supply "lethal suppport" to the "moderate Syrian opposition", he added.

David Cameron and Hammond talk about Britain's "military prowess". That seems to mean intelligence-gathering equipment and (deniable) special forces.

Those used to dealing with unsavoury customers are officers of the foreign intelligence service, MI6. They were among the first to talk to the IRA, taking the long view. They have been frustrated in their early, sensible, attempts to talk to the Taliban.

Now they are warning the government not to overreact to Britons' joining Isis and returning home.

The fundamental tenet of British justice – innocent until proved guilty – should not be changed even in a minor way for this "unproven threat – and it is an unproven threat at the moment," Richard Barrett, MI6's former counter terrorism chief, has told the Guardian. "I don't think we should change the laws without a very much more thorough assessment and understanding of the threat," he added.

Sir Richard Dearlove, Barrett's former boss, said last month that the government and media had blown the Islamist terrorism threat out of proportion, giving extremists publicity that was counter-productive.

The conflict, he said, was "essentially one of Muslim on Muslim".

It is the job of the domestic security service, MI5, to counter any threat they might pose here. Those jihadists who proudly tweet horrific statements and images are not the dangerous ones. The question is how many are quietly planning attacks.

Counter terrorist police appear to be encouraged that families of those who have gone to Syria and Iraq, or their friends and imams, appear to share the concern.

They should be embraced and sticks, rhetorical or otherwise, kept to a minimum

Rony · Post by **Rony** » 29 Aug 2014 23:57

The New Arab Cold War

The popular conception of the Middle East is one of a region divided along sectarian lines pitting Sunni against Shiite, but another simultaneous struggle is underway among predominantly Sunni powers. The recent Egyptian and Emirati airstrikes on Libyan Islamist militias is just one manifestation of this fight for leadership among Turkey, Qatar, Saudi Arabia, and the United Arab Emirates (UAE). All these countries have waded into conflicts in Iraq, Syria, Egypt, Bahrain, and now Libya in order to establish themselves as regional leaders.Yet these regional contenders for power have rarely achieved their goals. Instead, they have fueled violence, political conflict, and polarization, deepening the endemic problems in the countries they have sought to influence.

Followed by a arrogant and wrong solution

These conflicts have less to do with Iran and the Sunni-Shiite divide than widely believed. Rather, they represent a fracturing of Washington's Sunni allies in the Middle East. Left to their own devices, the proxy wars the Saudis, Emiratis, Qataris, and Turks are waging among themselves will continue to cause mayhem. After a month of U.S. airstrikes against the Islamic State and the potential for new military operations in Syria, this is clearly the lesson that the White House is learning.

It seems that by their own miscalculations and craven approach to regional problems, Washington's allies have succeeded in doing what the Obama administration was determined not to allow -- getting the United States sucked back into the Middle East. In the end, the United States is the indispensable nation after all.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 30 Aug 2014 04:39

The "Arabs",the term that Anthony Quinn as Auda Abu Tayi derisively used in that epic film,have never been united.I remember a certain PM in a discussion snorting in disbelief when someone mentioned "Arab unity"! These desert tribes are best at resolving disputes in their own fashion,observing the protocols of the desert ,sipping tea and eating dates under a tent in some cool oasis,or latter day palace,dividing the spoils of their oil wealth amongst their tribes and not so lucky oil-less "Arab" brethren, rather than aping the West,US in particular by going to war with their mostly Western toys,spreading destruction,death and desolation. This infuriates the "Arab street" and results in the call to jihad by the latter-day "Arabs" of the "Christian Crusader" variety!

The antics of the would be latter-day "caliphs" of the Islamic world,a better term,must be condemned for their chicanery and lack of vision.Dromedary egos puffed up with oil wealth (Gulfies/Saudis) and memories of ancient glories (E-gyp and the Ottomans),all competing for the sultan's turban is only staining the desert sands with more bloodshed than ever witnessed before in history and adding to the long list of ruins,ancient and modern for future tourist guides.

wig · Post by **wig** » 30 Aug 2014 14:19

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/08/ ... CO20140829

it appears qualified professionals are joining isis/isil, this might represent the beginning of the end for the sheikdoms - Islamic State's appeal presents Jordan with new test
excerpts

Handsome, courteous and highly regarded in his profession as a radiologist, the man, whose name has been withheld for security reasons, disappeared in early August after the Muslim Eid holiday. He did not tell his family where he was going

excerpts

"Their dream was setting up the caliphate, and now they see it being achieved. This made people consider very seriously joining, especially since the Islamic State had officially invited them," said Bassam Nasser, a Jordanian Islamist scholar.

The roots of Islamic State can, in one sense, be traced to Jordan. It was Abu Musab al Zarqawi, a Jordanian, who founded the Iraqi arm of al Qaeda that would eventually mutate into Islamic State. Al Qaeda has now disavowed the group.

In the impoverished Jordanian town of Zarqa, Zarqawi's birthplace and a traditional stronghold of Islamist fundamentalists, support for Islamic State was on full display during Eid prayers that marked the end of the holy fasting month of Ramadan in late July.

Scores of men dressed in the kind of Afghan-style clothing often worn by radical Islamists waved Islamic State's black flag as they gathered in an open field to listen to Jordanian Islamist Sheikh Amer Khalalyeh praise the group.

"Oh Baghdadi, you who has spread terror in the hearts of our enemies, enlist me as a martyr," chanted the sheikh over a microphone.

thrashings meted out to those who criticise isil

that has triggered an avalanche of attacks by Islamic State supporters who have shown none of the deference usually reserved for senior scholars such as Maqdisi. They say he was released not because he had served out his five-year jail term, but with a specific remit to attack Islamic State.

The row has sparked verbal and physical conflict. Two radical Islamists who spoke out against Islamic State's decapitations and indiscriminate killings of Shi'ite Muslims were recently physically beaten by the group's supporters.

Rony · Post by **Rony** » 30 Aug 2014 18:47

Why are the Yankees going after Qatar now ? Its not as if they did not know before that Qatar is janus faced like Pakistan. Saudi and Israeli pressure ?

Qatar's role as US ally at odds with claims it sponsors terror

If the Middle East were one big room, Qatar would be the elephant, according to a growing number of regional experts who believe the oil rich emirate is propping up violent jihadists around the globe..

Israel has long complained of Qatar's alleged duplicity, accusing it of meddling, bankrolling Hamas in Gaza, exporting radical Islamic terrorism through its tight links to the Muslim Brotherhood and Al Nusra. And a German official recently suggested that Qatar may also play a role in funding Islamic State..

Qatar is a U.S. “frenemy,” according to Jonathan Schanzer, of the Foundation for Defense of Democracies. On one hand, it hosts the biggest U.S. military base in the Middle East at Al Udeid; invests tens of billions of dollars in the U.S and across the globe in a bid to make itself indispensable and acts as the ‘white knight’ intermediary in hostage negotiations.

On the other hand, Qatar is arming and funding Hamas in Gaza, brazenly fueling violent Arab uprisings including the brief and bloody reign in Egypt of the Muslim Brotherhood and is long alleged to be arming vicious rebel groups in Libya, Mali, Syria, Iraq, and Tunisia.

“Qatar is trying to cozy up to everyone," Meir Dagan, former head of Israel’s Mossad intelligence agency, warned the U.S. in a 2010 cable revealed by Wikileaks. "I think that you should remove your bases from [Qatar]. [The Qataris] owe their security to the presence of the Americans.”

Noting that Saudi Arabia, Bahrain and the United Arab Emirates have all recalled their ambassadors from Qatar, Mort Klein, president of the Zionist Organization of America, called for Qatar to be designated a state sponsor of terrorism.

Qatar’s policy of involving itself in so many different spheres on the world stage might finally be catching up with the tiny Gulf state that has a native population of just 250,000. The more Qatar seeks the limelight, the more scrutiny it attracts, and a growing number of informed observers around the world appear to increasingly believe that Qatar's two-faced foreign policy posture is being exposed.

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 30 Aug 2014 20:38

Saudi King: Islamic terror comes to Europe in a month

MOSCOW, Aug. 30 - RIA Novosti. Saudi Arabia's King Abdullah has warned that the Middle East terror soon engulf Europe and the United States, unless urgent action is taken to counter the Islamists. It is reported by Reuters with reference to the Saudi news agency.

King Abdullah bin Abdul Aziz Al Saud turned this statement to the foreign ambassadors, meeting with them on the eve of Friday.

"I ask you to convey this message to your leaders ... At the moment, terrorism is an evil force against which must be tackled quickly and wisely - said the king. - If this is neglected, I am convinced that in a month comes to terrorism in Europe, and more a month later - to America. "

On the eve of the UK terrorist threat level was raised from "substantial" to "severe." This decision is due to the development of the situation in Syria and Iraq, where terrorist groups are planning terrorist attacks against the West.

Samudragupta · Post by **Samudragupta** » 30 Aug 2014 23:03

Growth of ISIS seems to be a positive development from the Indian POV.....

arminius · Post by **arminius** » 30 Aug 2014 23:50

Samudragupta wrote:Growth of ISIS seems to be a positive development from the Indian POV.....

Although the western elite always knew how barbaric the followers of Mohammed typically are, what ISIS has done is, that
it has brought the brutality in the drawing rooms of the western middle class. The "liberals" will still try to wriggle out by saying that
these guys are salafist, nevertheless some of them will surely be disabused of the notion of peaceful Islam.

vishvak · Post by **vishvak** » 31 Aug 2014 00:10

Per link, about half of Syrians are displaced.

The host governments of these countries estimate that thousands more Syrians live within their borders, but haven’t formally registered. “The Syrian crisis has become the biggest humanitarian emergency of our era, yet the world is failing to meet the needs of refugees and the countries hosting them,” said U.N. High Commissioner for Refugees Antonio Guterres.

The total number of Syrian refugees is about 3 millions or more.
==
Added:
Finding new friends
Also notice this part

“Muhammad al-Aser, the sheikh of [a neighbouring Arab] Hasawij village, led Daish to our homes to kill us,” rasps an elderly carpenter. “We feel utterly betrayed..."

Arabs betrayed neighbors and led barbarians straight to homes of minorities.

Neshant · Post by **Neshant** » 31 Aug 2014 02:40

Libya is firmly under the control of European countries who invaded it in 2012/3 and now control its resources & national treasury. Mercenaries were shipped in to over-throw the govt.

I'm wondering if ISIS is a creation of the same for similar purposes.

I'm suspicious of any well armed group that seemingly springs out of thin air.

member_28705 · Post by **member_28705** » 31 Aug 2014 02:41

Brahma Chellaney's take on the genesis of IS.

U.S. President Barack Obama has labelled the jihadist juggernaut that calls itself the Islamic State a “cancer,” while his Defence Secretary, Chuck Hagel, has called it more dangerous than al-Qaeda ever was, claiming that its threat is “beyond anything we’ve seen.” No monster has ever been born on its own. So the question is: which forces helped create this new Frankenstein?

The Islamic State is a brutal, medieval organisation whose members take pride in carrying out beheadings and flaunting the severed heads of their victims as trophies. This cannot obscure an underlying reality: the Islamic State represents a Sunni Islamist insurrection against non-Sunni rulers in disintegrating Syria and Iraq.

Indeed, the ongoing fragmentation of states along primordial lines in the arc between Israel and India is spawning de facto new entities or blocks, including Shiastan, Wahhabistan, Kurdistan, ISstan and Talibanstan. Other than Iran, Egypt and Turkey, most of the important nations from the Maghreb to Pakistan (an internally torn state that could shrink to Punjabistan or, simply, ISIstan) are modern western concoctions, with no roots in history or pre-existing identity.

The West and agendas

It is beyond dispute that the Islamic State militia — formerly the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant — emerged from the Syrian civil war, which began indigenously as a localised revolt against state brutality under Syrian President Bashar al-Assad before being fuelled with externally supplied funds and weapons. From Central Intelligence Agency (CIA)-training centres in Turkey and Jordan, the rebels set up a Free Syrian Army (FSA), launching attacks on government forces, as a U.S.-backed information war demonised Mr. Assad and encouraged military officers and soldiers to switch sides.

But the members of the U.S.-led coalition were never on the same page because some allies had dual agendas. While the three spearheads of the anti-Assad crusade — the U.S., Britain and France — focussed on aiding the FSA, the radical Islamist sheikhdoms such as Saudi Arabia, Qatar, Kuwait and the United Arab Emirates as well as the Islamist-leaning government in Turkey channelled their weapons and funds to more overtly Islamist groups. This splintered the Syrian opposition, marginalising the FSA and paving the way for the Islamic State’s rise.

The anti-Assad coalition indeed started off on the wrong foot by trying to speciously distinguish between “moderate” and “radical” jihadists. The line separating the two is just too blurred. Indeed, the term “moderate jihadists” is an oxymoron: Those waging jihad by the gun can never be moderate.

Invoking jihad

The U.S. and its allies made a more fundamental mistake by infusing the spirit of jihad in their campaign against Mr. Assad so as to help trigger a popular uprising in Syria. The decision to instil the spirit of jihad through television and radio broadcasts beamed to Syrians was deliberate — to provoke Syria’s majority Sunni population to rise against their secular government.

This ignored the lesson from Afghanistan (where the CIA in the 1980s ran, via Pakistan, the largest covert operation in its history) — that inciting jihad and arming “holy warriors” creates a deadly cocktail, with far-reaching and long-lasting impacts on international security. The Reagan administration openly used Islam as an ideological tool to spur armed resistance to Soviet forces in Afghanistan.

In 1985, at a White House ceremony in honour of several Afghan mujahideen — the jihadists out of which al-Qaeda evolved — President Ronald Reagan declared, “These gentlemen are the moral equivalent of America’s Founding Fathers.” Earlier in 1982, Reagan dedicated the space shuttle ‘Columbia’ to the Afghan resistance. He declared, “Just as the Columbia, we think, represents man’s finest aspirations in the field of science and technology, so too does the struggle of the Afghan people represent man’s highest aspirations for freedom. I am dedicating, on behalf of the American people, the March 22 launch of the Columbia to the people of Afghanistan.”

The Afghan war veterans came to haunt the security of many countries. Less known is the fact that the Islamic State’s self-declared caliph, Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi — like Libyan militia leader Abdelhakim Belhadj (whom the CIA abducted and subjected to “extraordinary rendition”) and Chechen terrorist leader Airat Vakhitov — become radicalised while under U.S. detention. As torture chambers, U.S. detention centres have served as pressure cookers for extremism.

Mr. Obama’s Syria strategy took a page out of Reagan’s Afghan playbook. Not surprisingly, his strategy backfired. It took just two years for Syria to descend into a Somalia-style failed state under the weight of the international jihad against Mr. Assad. This helped the Islamic State not only to rise but also to use its control over northeastern Syria to stage a surprise blitzkrieg deep into Iraq this summer.

Had the U.S. and its allies refrained from arming jihadists to topple Mr. Assad, would the Islamic State have emerged as a lethal, marauding force? And would large swaths of upstream territory along the Euphrates and the Tigris rivers in Syria and Iraq have fallen into this monster’s control? The exigencies of the topple-Assad campaign also prompted the Obama administration to turn a blind eye to the flow of Gulf and Turkish aid to the Islamic State.

In fact, the Obama team, until recently, viewed the Islamic State as a “good” terrorist organisation in Syria but a “bad” one in Iraq, especially when it threatened to overrun the Kurdish regional capital, Erbil. In January, Mr. Obama famously dismissed the Islamic State as a local “JV team” trying to imitate al-Qaeda but without the capacity to be a threat to America. It was only after the public outrage in the U.S. over the video-recorded execution of American journalist James Foley and the flight of Iraqi Christians and Yazidis that the White House re-evaluated the threat posed by the Islamic State.

Full circle

Many had cautioned against the topple-Assad campaign, fearing that extremist forces would gain control in the vacuum. Those still wedded to overthrowing Mr. Assad’s rule, however, contend that Mr. Obama’s failure to provide greater aid, including surface-to-air missiles, to the Syrian rebels created a vacuum that produced the Islamic State. In truth, more CIA arms to the increasingly ineffectual FSA would have meant a stronger and more deadly Islamic State.

As part of his strategic calculus to oust Mr. Assad, Mr. Obama failed to capitalise on the Arab Spring, which was then in full bloom. By seeking to topple a secular autocracy in Syria while simultaneously working to shield jihad-bankrolling monarchies from the Arab Spring, he ended up strengthening Islamist forces — a development reinforced by the U.S.-led overthrow of another secular Arab dictator, Muammar Qadhafi, which has turned Libya into another failed state and created a lawless jihadist citadel at Europe’s southern doorstep.

In fact, no sooner had Qadhafi been killed than Libya’s new rulers established a theocracy, with no opposition from the western powers that brought about the regime change. Indeed, the cloak of Islam helps to protect the credibility of leaders who might otherwise be seen as foreign puppets. For the same reason, the U.S. has condoned the Arab monarchs for their long-standing alliance with Islamists. It has failed to stop these cloistered royals from continuing to fund Muslim extremist groups and madrasas in other countries. The American interest in maintaining pliant regimes in oil-rich countries has trumped all other considerations.

Today, Mr. Obama’s Syria policy is coming full circle. Having portrayed Mr. Assad as a bloodthirsty monster, Washington must now accept Mr. Assad as the lesser of the two evils and work with him to defeat the larger threat of the Islamic State.

The fact that the Islamic State’s heartland remains in northern Syria means that it cannot be stopped unless the U.S. extends air strikes into Syria. As the U.S. mulls that option — for which it would need at least tacit permission from Syria, which still maintains good air defences — it is fearful of being pulled into the middle of the horrendous civil war there. It is thus discreetly urging Mr. Assad to prioritise defeating the Islamic State.

Make no mistake: like al-Qaeda, the Islamic State is a monster inadvertently spawned by the policies of those now in the lead to combat it. The question is whether anything substantive will be learned from this experience, unlike the forgotten lessons of America’s anti-Soviet struggle in Afghanistan.

At a time when jihadist groups are gaining ground from Mali to Malaysia, Mr. Obama’s current effort to strike a Faustian bargain with the Afghan Taliban, for example, gives little hope that any lesson will be learned. U.S.-led policies toward the Islamic world have prevented a clash between civilisations by fostering a clash within a civilisation, but at serious cost to regional and international security.

http://chellaney.net/2014/08/26/who-cre ... nkenstein/

chanakyaa · Post by **chanakyaa** » 31 Aug 2014 03:24

Neshantji, kya baat kahi hai. Reading the tone of misinformation campaign in the mainstream media, it seems like a perfect time to increase short position in Shee Ree Yaah options, if there were any. Gotta go, my popcorns are ready. This time I'll add extra butter...

RoyG · Post by **RoyG** » 31 Aug 2014 03:34

Thank you Obama, Sheiks, etc. Hats off to dharmics who endured this treatment for 650 years. Pictures are heart wrenching. This time we'll be prepared for these mlecchas when they begin knocking on our door. Yazidis should be considered a dharmic branch. A lot of similarities in their rituals and beliefs.

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=d07_1409431020

member_28705 · Post by **member_28705** » 31 Aug 2014 03:47

RoyG wrote:Thank you Obama, Sheiks, etc. Hats off to dharmics who endured this treatment for 650 years. Pictures are heart wrenching. This time we'll be prepared for these mlecchas when they begin knocking on our door. Yazidis should be considered a dharmic branch. A lot of similarities in their rituals and beliefs.

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=d07_1409431020

Makes me very sad. All this serves as a grim reminder as to what could happen to us. We need to, as a nation, overcome our weaknesses, become economically, technologically and militarily strong. We WILL be alone, if our time comes, just like it has for the Yazidis.

For me, this picture will be quite hard to forget:

A_Gupta · Post by **A_Gupta** » 31 Aug 2014 04:33

I asked on the internal security thread, and I ask here -- does India have some arrangement that when a Westerner applies for an Indian visa, India can check with the western country whether said person is a ISIS jihadi or at-home sympathizer of ISIS?

I feel that India will be a target for ISIS as one of the kafir-lands that have to be terrorized; and these guys will use their western recruits to get to India, just like David Headley was used. If India has no intelligence sharing arrangement in this specific aspect with western countries, I hope that the Pradhan Mantriji takes it up as a high priority issue.

anmol · Post by **anmol** » 31 Aug 2014 05:00

former director of CIA James Woolsey:

In the Muslim world, the 22 Arab states have no democracies. Some reasonably well governed states are moderating and changing, such as Bahrain and Qatar. But still, there no democracies among them. There are another 16 Muslim-predominant non-Arab states. Half of these are democracies, including some of the poorest countries in the world: Bangladesh, & Mali. Well over 100 million Muslims live in a democracy in India. Outside of one province, they are generally at peace with their Hindu neighbors.

The problem is not Islam. There is a special situation in the Middle East attributable to historical and cultural factors. Outside of Israel and Turkey, the Middle East essentially consists of no democracies. It has, rather, two types of governments: pathological predators and vulnerable autocrats. This is a bad mix. Five of those states: Iran, Iraq, Syria, Sudan and Libya sponsor and assist terrorism in one way or another; and all five are working on weapons of mass destruction.

The Middle East thus presents a serious and massive complex of problems: all financed by the revenues of two-thirds of the world's oil. I don't believe this terror war is going to go away until we change the face of the Middle East the way we have changed the face of Europe.

I say to the terrorists and the pathological predators such as Saddam Hussein, as well as to the autocrats, the Mubaraks, and the Saudi Royal family:
“This is the fourth time this country and its democratic allies are on the march,” Woolsey said. “And we’re on the side of those that [America's enemies] most fear — their own people.”

ISIS = America's "democratic allies".

member_28705 · Post by **member_28705** » 31 Aug 2014 05:18

A_Gupta wrote:I asked on the internal security thread, and I ask here -- does India have some arrangement that when a Westerner applies for an Indian visa, India can check with the western country whether said person is a ISIS jihadi or at-home sympathizer of ISIS?

I feel that India will be a target for ISIS as one of the kafir-lands that have to be terrorized; and these guys will use their western recruits to get to India, just like David Headley was used. If India has no intelligence sharing arrangement in this specific aspect with western countries, I hope that the Pradhan Mantriji takes it up as a high priority issue.

I second this. How solid are our background check systems?

UlanBatori · Post by **UlanBatori** » 31 Aug 2014 06:33

OTOH, a lot of Indian-born sh1theads are heading out to join the ISIS. May Dronacharya and Guru B52 have good target practice with them, like on the Pakis at the Shomali Plain. If vast numbers could be persuaded to go out there... Wonder if General Dostum is selling some used, pre-perforated containers.

uddu · Post by **uddu** » 31 Aug 2014 08:14

The Sauds Arabia is the epicenter of all terrorist activities world over. The money and ideology flows from there. Eliminate it, it will be easier it deal with the threat elsewhere.
Returning paganism back to the Arabs and the pagans regaining their lost treasures will be a great way to go. Arabs were pagans and they did great during that time. Time that the Arabs regain their lost identity and go back to their Yezidi ways. The world must whole heatedly support Arabs regaining their lost identity to be Pagans and ensure that they are able to deal with the threats and also take care of their own. Its a great possibility that once Arabs regain their pagan identity everything else will return to their roots as well.

RoyG · Post by **RoyG** » 31 Aug 2014 08:51

The problem is ISIS recruits from India or anywhere else for that matter often live and are raised in an environment where it is easy for the propaganda to bring them across the red line. If we have 250 indians leaving this year expect 2500 to be ready to go next year. This is the problem. Eventually, a homegrown movement will start if they don't get lured to the ME to wage jihad.

vishvak · Post by **vishvak** » 31 Aug 2014 16:57

KrisP wrote:
RoyG wrote:Thank you Obama, Sheiks, etc. Hats off to dharmics who endured this treatment for 650 years. Pictures are heart wrenching. This time we'll be prepared for these mlecchas when they begin knocking on our door. Yazidis should be considered a dharmic branch. A lot of similarities in their rituals and beliefs.

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=d07_1409431020
Makes me very sad. All this serves as a grim reminder as to what could happen to us. We need to, as a nation, overcome our weaknesses, become economically, technologically and militarily strong. We WILL be alone, if our time comes, just like it has for the Yazidis.

For me, this picture will be quite hard to forget:
[img=>>]http://i.imgur.com/pU1dwza.jpg[<==/img]

From comments section

Army was betrayed by sunni commanders in central Iraq. America forced us to give key positions in army to sunnis for "reconciliation efforts".
..
but you actually can blame the Iraqis, withheld weapons from the kurds in 2008, won't allow the kurds import weapons, won't pay the kurds their constitutional salary, if they had done all of that this war would of been over with a long ass time ago
..
but you would think that an army with billions of dollars worth of weapons and about 600,000 members and training from the US would answer to their call of duty, but nah they were to busy running
..

This "reconciliation efforts" seemed to have finished any and all chances of response from Iraqi Army. The Sunni commanders sold out their soul to barbarians (money provided by rich and powerful who bankroll the barbarism). After "reconciliation efforts" were done, it was "all is well" feeling all around till sell out and subsequent genocide. Billions of dollars of weapons meant nothing and barbarians got hold of some of that hardware too.
More from comments

..Just look at what happened to the arms sent by the US to sunni militias during the surge.
..

TSJones · Post by **TSJones** » 31 Aug 2014 18:03

Eventually, we'll get to Mosul. We'll cut it off from any vehicular traffic, pick off any electrical sub stations and then we'll just let it sit and think for a while. No more mangoes for Mosul. We'll see how things progress from there.

Meanwhile there will be more death notices sent to families around the world that their beautiful man-child sons' full of peace and love got BBQed by a 500 lb laser guided bomb with the name "Big Abdul" scrawled in chalk on it while they were in service to a death cult. I relish the thought.

RoyG · Post by **RoyG** » 31 Aug 2014 18:26

TSJones wrote:Eventually, we'll get to Mosul. We'll cut it off from any vehicular traffic, pick off any electrical sub stations and then we'll just let it sit and think for a while. No more mangoes for Mosul. We'll see how things progress from there.

Meanwhile there will be more death notices sent to families around the world that their beautiful man-child sons' full of peace and love got BBQed by a 500 lb laser guided bomb with the name "Big Abdul" scrawled in chalk on it while they were in service to a death cult. I relish the thought.

Yeah yeah, relish the dream. We all know where they lead.

TSJones · Post by **TSJones** » 31 Aug 2014 20:11

RoyG wrote:
TSJones wrote:Eventually, we'll get to Mosul. We'll cut it off from any vehicular traffic, pick off any electrical sub stations and then we'll just let it sit and think for a while. No more mangoes for Mosul. We'll see how things progress from there.

Meanwhile there will be more death notices sent to families around the world that their beautiful man-child sons' full of peace and love got BBQed by a 500 lb laser guided bomb with the name "Big Abdul" scrawled in chalk on it while they were in service to a death cult. I relish the thought.
Yeah yeah, relish the dream. We all know where they lead.

Everything that I have said will happen in the last few months has happened:

!. Maliki had to go. he went.
2. ISIL had no place to hide from US bombs. They couldn't hold up. No road blocks, no heavy equipment, no bunker/mortar emplacements where we have chosen to eliminate them.
3. Baghdad would not fall. It hasn't.

I'm sorry if the facts do not fit your ideology. Too bad.

Virupaksha · Post by **Virupaksha** » 31 Aug 2014 20:21

Did any one predict that the US was actually funding only and only the fundoos in Syria - now known as IS?

Oh yes, more than 10 people more than a year ago right on this thread and its various incarnations. Guess who took the opposite view.
Some also said that "assad fall" was within a week. Well that week is now 2 years ago. Guess who took the assad fall week stand.

US will put on a pomp and show (shock and awe) like the Pak army. It will use it to create a more powerful caliphate which it will try to control.

Oh yes, the pockets where US is trying to control IS and the pockets is promoting IS should be studied in detail. Ralph peters map gives a tremendous detail.

Regurgitating what a propaganda machinery says is simply what a brainwashed person does. Too bad actions and money show a countries inclinations rather than what its propaganda machinery publishes.

RoyG · Post by **RoyG** » 31 Aug 2014 20:58

Oh please, spare us the American bravado. These are the things that I and many others have said starting 2-3 years back which ran contrary to your "ideology".

1. Americans are whimps with NO STRATEGY in Afghanistan and will pullout. Result: They are pulling out and now India has to face an increasingly destabilized Pakistan along with a more focused jihadi movement.

2. Americans could kick the door down in Iraq but would eventually leave because they have NO LONG TERM STRATEGY besides maintaining short term oil for dollar invoicing. Result: Americans have left, the ME is even more f*cked up, and the SCO is now challenging the US invoicing system along with dollar trade decreasing at 1%/year.

3. Americans are covertly funding jihadists in Syria and Assad will NOT FALL. Result: Assad did not fall, and you yanks actually helped him consolidate and strengthen his rule.

So yeah, despite the TRILLIONS that you guys spent, you've managed to strengthen the jihadi movement GLOBALLY and at the same time bankrupted your own country. On top of that, the entire world is moving off the dollar. Please, drop another "500 lb laser guided bomb" on a few of them and watch many more take their place. We know how well this has been working in Afghanistan and everywhere else.

Oh and before I forget, after you're finished brown nosing Prejident Obamba who by the way a couple days ago said "WE DONT HAVE A STRATEGY TO FIGHT ISIS AND UKRAINE WASN'T INVADED" give him my sweet regards along with a pink tutu. Have a nice day.

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 31 Aug 2014 21:10

Libyan militia occupies US embassy in Tripoli to 'secure' it

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 31 Aug 2014 21:13

RoyG wrote:Oh please, spare us the American bravado. These are the things that I and many others have said starting 2-3 years back which ran contrary to your "ideology".

1. Americans are whimps with NO STRATEGY in Afghanistan and will pullout. Result: They are pulling out and now India has to face an increasingly destabilized Pakistan along with a more focused jihadi movement.

2. Americans could kick the door down in Iraq but would eventually leave because they have NO LONG TERM STRATEGY besides maintaining short term oil for dollar invoicing. Result: Americans have left, the ME is even more f*cked up, and the SCO is now challenging the US invoicing system along with dollar trade decreasing at 1%/year.

3. Americans are covertly funding jihadists in Syria and Assad will NOT FALL. Result: Assad did not fall, and you yanks actually helped him consolidate and strengthen his rule.

So yeah, despite the TRILLIONS that you guys spent, you've managed to strengthen the jihadi movement GLOBALLY and at the same time bankrupted your own country. On top of that, the entire world is moving off the dollar. Please, drop another "500 lb laser guided bomb" on a few of them and watch many more take their place. We know how well this has been working in Afghanistan and everywhere else.

Oh and before I forget, after you're finished brown nosing Prejident Obamba who by the way a couple days ago said "WE DONT HAVE A STRATEGY TO FIGHT ISIS AND UKRAINE WASN'T INVADED" give him my sweet regards along with a pink tutu. Have a nice day.

a yellow tutu would be more appropriate, don't you think??

The blow back from afghanistan and the ISIS will hit India squarely.

this, right after the termite queen f()c%@d over India for the past 10 years with her vatican fascist mafia ideology.

Great going.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 31 Aug 2014 21:17

Austin wrote:Libyan militia occupies US embassy in Tripoli to 'secure' it

The old sins seem to be coming home to roost.

Any testicular barbecuing happening??