INS Vikrant News and Discussion

The Military Issues & History Forum is a venue to discuss issues relating to the military aspects of the Indian Armed Forces, whether the past, present or future. We request members to kindly stay within the mandate of this forum and keep their exchanges of views, on a civilised level, however vehemently any disagreement may be felt. All feedback regarding forum usage may be sent to the moderators using the Feedback Form or by clicking the Report Post Icon in any objectionable post for proper action. Please note that the views expressed by the Members and Moderators on these discussion boards are that of the individuals only and do not reflect the official policy or view of the Bharat-Rakshak.com Website. Copyright Violation is strictly prohibited and may result in revocation of your posting rights - please read the FAQ for full details. Users must also abide by the Forum Guidelines at all times.
A Nandy
BR Mainsite Crew
Posts: 436
Joined: 06 Sep 2009 23:39

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby A Nandy » 12 Jul 2014 13:49

Are the planning stages for IAC 2 incorporating nuclear propulsion ? Maybe a naval reactor like the one in the Arihant can be used ?

Khalsa
BRFite
Posts: 1694
Joined: 12 Nov 2000 12:31
Location: NZL

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby Khalsa » 13 Jul 2014 09:21

Christopher Sidor wrote:
Singha wrote:Foch as catobar would only make sense if we wanted to use breguet alize and super etendard (reopen prod lines). really doubt it could hurl the Mig29K.

What about f35 or SU 33 or the naval variant of pak-fa?

Though 60k tonnes is small. We need 70k.


Chris
I too was an ardent supporter of the 33k but after seeing the rationale behind the 29K ( in regards to VikramAditya and Vikrant - II) I dont think the future of IN lies there.
Prediction: We will remain 29K centric air arm with perhaps a squadron of NLCA in the 2 decades or so.

However there is a fork in play right now ... in case IAF gets rafale then expect a little bit of confusion when making the decision around the mainstay of the IN Naval Fighter arm for Vik-II or Vishaal. There is merit but again the 29Ks are not really reaching end of life so why change horses midstream.

Lets say IAF does not buy the rafale then we should see a continuation of the current 29K + NLCA strategy its bonus time for the NLCA team.

I also do not seem to have come across any official word on design change for Vishaal so Vikrant and Vishaal IMHO will continue to be the heavy intermediate (ish) carriers before IN arrives in the Super Carrier age.
We all would love to see it become Nuclear powered plus up to 90 K tonnes, but to provide qualitative input to a 90K design we need to learn bitter lessons on the 60 to 80 K tonne class.

What lies beyond Vishaal will probably fly the naval variant of PAK-fa or naval variant of AMCA
Now what I really hope to know is ... how does the Mig-29K stack up against the Rafale-M (marine)


(Edited to fix spellings and added a sentence or two)

Leo.Davidson
BRFite
Posts: 119
Joined: 09 Aug 2011 05:34
Location: Boston, USA

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby Leo.Davidson » 21 Jul 2014 04:40

The Mig-29SMT are basically built using 1980's Mig-29 excess airframes. Why don't we standardize from the Mig-29 into the Mig-35 OVT with AESA & OLP. The Mig-35 is by default the evolution of the Mig-29K, so the main improvement will be the airframe.

Cosmo_R
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3407
Joined: 24 Apr 2010 01:24

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby Cosmo_R » 21 Jul 2014 04:54

Nikhil T wrote:
Total cost (not including air component) = Rs 23,500 crore (or $3.9BN)


This would bring it line with the QE Class @ ~$4 billion but which are 25K tonnes heavier.

DO the numbers make sense?

John
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2509
Joined: 03 Feb 2001 12:31

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby John » 21 Jul 2014 05:50

Nikhil T wrote:Total cost (not including air component) = Rs 23,500 crore (or $3.9BN)

Where you getting 23500 crore from? So far 3500 crore spent and they estimate the total might be 20,000 crore.

Eric Leiderman
BRFite
Posts: 364
Joined: 26 Nov 2010 08:56

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby Eric Leiderman » 21 Jul 2014 05:51

When you fund in dribs and drabs, Your time line stretches,Your cost esclates.You are using valuable real estate, manpower realisation, milatary inflation in India would be higher than domestic inflation, Steel availability, gear box saga etc, shake it all up and you have price esclation

Khalsa
BRFite
Posts: 1694
Joined: 12 Nov 2000 12:31
Location: NZL

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby Khalsa » 21 Jul 2014 14:13

Leo.Davidson wrote:The Mig-29SMT are basically built using 1980's Mig-29 excess airframes. Why don't we standardize from the Mig-29 into the Mig-35 OVT with AESA & OLP. The Mig-35 is by default the evolution of the Mig-29K, so the main improvement will be the airframe.


Honest to god .... that would have been one good hollistic decision to fill the gap till the PAK-FA came through as the IAF and IN versions.
Hell .... perhaps even consider F-35 Naval variant....

Today I find perhaps find the Rafale sticking out as a bit of sore thumb in the IAF road map into the future.

shaun
BRFite
Posts: 1177
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby shaun » 12 Nov 2014 11:57

image of Vikrant , the super structure and secondary runway yet to be fitted Image
is it possible that EL 2284 that will be installed on it will be having more than 4 arrays ?

sankum
BRFite
Posts: 946
Joined: 20 Dec 2004 21:45

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby sankum » 12 Nov 2014 13:27

This is a old jan 2014 image. Google earth is not updated with latest image.

Hanger dimensions from google earth images is estimated to be only 122m by 21m. (5x20m sections)

Hanger will normally carry 8 mig 29k +5 helos and deck 12 mig 29k+5 helo for total of 20mig 29+ 10 helos.

member_28722
BRFite
Posts: 333
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby member_28722 » 12 Nov 2014 22:13

Cosmo_R wrote:This would bring it line with the QE Class @ ~$4 billion but which are 25K tonnes heavier.
DO the numbers make sense?

First time for us vs nth time for them?

Will
BRFite
Posts: 637
Joined: 28 Apr 2011 11:27

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby Will » 12 Nov 2014 22:22

Would be great to have INS Vishal as a nuke powered carrier but nuclear carriers are damn expensive to operate, maintain and refuel. Dunno if the IN can afford that at the moment. Could probably get 2 conventional carriers for the same cost :(

member_28722
BRFite
Posts: 333
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby member_28722 » 13 Nov 2014 00:37

if we want to go beyond 60k+ tons, then we need nuclear. Its even more costly to afford such a huge ship with conventional stuff. We should have good number of nuclear boats operational before Vishal is commissioned, which should drive down cost and also give us valuable experience.

Nikhil T
BRFite
Posts: 1286
Joined: 09 Nov 2008 06:48
Location: RAW HQ, Lodhi Road

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby Nikhil T » 10 Dec 2014 00:42

X-post from Navy thread

IAC-1 latest picture

Image
click image upload

Philip
BRF Oldie
Posts: 21061
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30
Location: India

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby Philip » 10 Dec 2014 10:28

Pl. ck naval td. for news of the Sea Gripen possibility/offer to the IN for the IN's carriers as SAAB is being identified as a poss. collaborator in co-development of LCA MK-2/NLCA.

Daedalus
BRFite -Trainee
Posts: 42
Joined: 29 Aug 2008 00:57

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby Daedalus » 09 Apr 2015 22:27

It looks like INS Vikrant does not have a Bulbous Bow.

Anyone know why?

arun
BRF Oldie
Posts: 10248
Joined: 28 Nov 2002 12:31

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby arun » 12 Apr 2015 09:09

Nikhil T wrote:Cabinet set to approve Rs 19,000 crore for INS Vikrant

NEW DELHI: After Prime Minister Narendra Modi himself witnessed the raw combat power exuded by an aircraft carrier sailing on the high seas last month, his government is now all set to approve the much-delayed infusion of funds to finish the ongoing construction of INS Vikrant at Cochin Shipyard.

Defence ministry sources say the Cabinet Committee on Security (CCS) is slated to meet this week, probably on Wednesday itself, to approve the allocation of around Rs 19,000 crore for the Phase-II and III building of the 40,000-tonne indigenous aircraft carrier (IAC).

Current estimates are that it will take around Rs 20,000 crore to construct the IAC, which is christened INS Vikrant after India's first carrier that was acquired from the UK in 1961 and later decommissioned in 1997.

The CCS will also approve the revised time-frame for commissioning of the 260-metre long INS Vikrant, whose keel was laid in 2009 after the project itself was approved way back in 2003. TOI was the first to report two years ago that the IAC would not be ready anytime before 2018, dashing the Navy's long-standing hopes of operating two powerful full-fledged "carrier battle groups" by 2014-2015.

Modi on June 14 had spent several hours on the 44,400-tonne INS Vikramaditya, the second-hand Russian carrier Admiral Gorshkov extensively refitted at a cost of $2.33 billion for India, in his first outstation visit after becoming the PM.

India is also acquiring 45 MiG-29K naval fighters worth over $2 billion from Russia, which are meant to operate both from INS Vikramaditya and INS Vikrant. India does also have the 28,000-tonne INS Viraat but it's over 55-years-old and is left with just 11 Sea Harrier jump-jets to operate from its deck.

INS Vikrant was a majestic-class aircraft carrier of the Indian Navy. (TOI file photo)

The CCS note for "approving INS Vikrant's cost and timeframe" was ready last year itself but the previous UPA regime failed to give it the formal go-ahead. Around 75% of the carrier's basic structure, including the hull and deck, has been completed till now at a cost of around Rs 3,500 crore.

"The underwater work is finished. The superstructure, the upper decks, the cabling, sensors, weapons etc have to be integrated now. Most of the equipment has already been ordered. It will be powered by four American LM2500 gas turbines," said a source.

India is among a select club of countries like the US, Russia, UK and France that are capable of building such large warships. There is also an over 60,000-tonne IAC-II in the planning stage, which may have nuclear propulsion like American carriers. The US has as many as 11 nuclear-powered Nimitz-class ``super-carriers'', each over 94,000-tonne and capable of carrying 80-90 fighters.


Total cost (not including air component) = Rs 23,500 crore (or $3.9BN)


X Posting from the "Indian Naval Discussion" thread.

Excerpt from the Fourth Report on Demands for Grants (2014-15) of the Ministry on Defence on Navy and Air Force (Demand No. 23 & 24) tabled by our Parliaments Standing Committee on Defence on December 22, 2014 dealing with Cost overrun issue facing IAC Project.

The revised cost now stands at INR 193.41 Billion against the originally envisaged cost of INR 32.61 Billion A cost overrun of 493 % :!: :

Revised Cost and Timeline Cases

1.10 The cases where timeline and cost have been revised are P 15A, P 28, IAC. The revised cost for the three projects is as follows:-

Ser - Asset - Original Cost - Revised Cost …………………………..

(c) - IAC - 3261 Crore - 19341 Crore

The details with respect to time and cost overruns for each of the three cases is indicated in succeeding paragraphs. ……………………………….

IAC – M/s CSL – Time overrun were mainly due to non-availability of Steel; Learning Curve for CSL; delay in Russian approvals for design & equipment supply and delay in critical/unique pre-launch Indigenous Equipment. Cost overrun was mainly due to reasons of cost estimation for CCS sanction in 2002 at a time when ‘form & fit’ was still emerging; limited information on many Aircraft Carrier specific equipment & material due to inadequate domain knowledge; Equipment costs, emerging technological advances and new generation equipments in IAC.


The Web link is here:

Fourth Report on Demands for Grants (2014-15) of the Ministry on Defence on Navy and Air Force (Demand No. 23 & 24)

svinayak
BRF Oldie
Posts: 14223
Joined: 09 Feb 1999 12:31

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby svinayak » 12 Apr 2015 21:57

Nikhil T wrote:Cabinet set to approve Rs 19,000 crore for INS Vikrant

NEW DELHI: After Prime Minister Narendra Modi himself witnessed the raw combat power exuded by an aircraft carrier sailing on the high seas last month, his government is now all set to approve the much-delayed infusion of funds to finish the ongoing construction of INS Vikrant at Cochin Shipyard.

Defence ministry sources say the Cabinet Committee on Security (CCS) is slated to meet this week, probably on Wednesday itself, to approve the allocation of around Rs 19,000 crore for the Phase-II and III building of the 40,000-tonne indigenous aircraft carrier (IAC).

Current estimates are that it will take around Rs 20,000 crore to construct the IAC, which is christened INS Vikrant after India's first carrier that was acquired from the UK in 1961 and later decommissioned in 1997.

The CCS will also approve the revised time-frame for commissioning of the 260-metre long INS Vikrant, whose keel was laid in 2009 after the project itself was approved way back in 2003. TOI was the first to report two years ago that the IAC would not be ready anytime before 2018, dashing the Navy's long-standing hopes of operating two powerful full-fledged "carrier battle groups" by 2014-2015.

Modi on June 14 had spent several hours on the 44,400-tonne INS Vikramaditya, the second-hand Russian carrier Admiral Gorshkov extensively refitted at a cost of $2.33 billion for India, in his first outstation visit after becoming the PM.

India is also acquiring 45 MiG-29K naval fighters worth over $2 billion from Russia, which are meant to operate both from INS Vikramaditya and INS Vikrant. India does also have the 28,000-tonne INS Viraat but it's over 55-years-old and is left with just 11 Sea Harrier jump-jets to operate from its deck.

INS Vikrant was a majestic-class aircraft carrier of the Indian Navy. (TOI file photo)

The CCS note for "approving INS Vikrant's cost and timeframe" was ready last year itself but the previous UPA regime failed to give it the formal go-ahead. Around 75% of the carrier's basic structure, including the hull and deck, has been completed till now at a cost of around Rs 3,500 crore.

"The underwater work is finished. The superstructure, the upper decks, the cabling, sensors, weapons etc have to be integrated now. Most of the equipment has already been ordered. It will be powered by four American LM2500 gas turbines," said a source.

India is among a select club of countries like the US, Russia, UK and France that are capable of building such large warships. There is also an over 60,000-tonne IAC-II in the planning stage, which may have nuclear propulsion like American carriers. The US has as many as 11 nuclear-powered Nimitz-class ``super-carriers'', each over 94,000-tonne and capable of carrying 80-90 fighters.


Total cost (not including air component) = Rs 23,500 crore (or $3.9BN)


The US has as many as 11 nuclear-powered Nimitz-class ``super-carriers'', each over 94,000-tonne and capable of carrying 80-90 fighters.

It seems US has built extra super-carriers since the designers are going to retire and no avialble talent with the skills

Shreeman
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3762
Joined: 17 Jan 2007 15:31
Location: bositiveneuj.blogspot.com
Contact:

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby Shreeman » 18 Apr 2015 16:06

Image

Image

Philip
BRF Oldie
Posts: 21061
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30
Location: India

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby Philip » 18 Apr 2015 16:33

An interesting point to make.The location of the aircraft lifts,one shown in one of the excellent pics.One can see how much space it eats into the hull of the carrier,upto the hangar deck.IN many USN carriers,the lifts are cantilevered outside the hull line so that it does not intrude into hangar space thereby reducing the number of aircraft that can be carried. In some deisgns,the hull is sloped outwards substantially ,so that only part of the lift intrudes into the hull. One cannot make out if the flight-deck extension for the landing path has been built as yet or not. Excellent width of the flight deck though,much superior to the Vik-A,which couldn't be widened further as it was a conversion from an existing hull.

Singha
BRF Oldie
Posts: 66601
Joined: 13 Aug 2004 19:42
Location: the grasshopper lies heavy

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby Singha » 18 Apr 2015 16:43

where are you seeing the lift? the red verandah thing between the two parts of the island is not a lift.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/c ... nt_CGI.png

the island is very long compared to cvns imo.
http://www.navsource.org/archives/02/026846.jpg

Singha
BRF Oldie
Posts: 66601
Joined: 13 Aug 2004 19:42
Location: the grasshopper lies heavy

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby Singha » 18 Apr 2015 16:50

our next carrier will certainly have 3 lifts, extra one on the port side. the overall wider beam of the ship might permit adding more overhanging deck space and pushing the lifts out more.

the Cavour design on which vikrant is based has barely any overhang at all on starboard and in that sense looks more like a LHD ship
http://media.moddb.com/images/members/1 ... Cavour.jpg

we have added the angled landing strip to left side of cavour and that will have some overhang

there are huge overhangs on cvns such that the entire island is rooted within the overhang and not within the real beam of the ship..even about 30% of a/c length is hanging outside the ship on the right :shock:
http://www.israelandstuff.com/wp-conten ... urtesy.png

ravip
BRFite
Posts: 270
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby ravip » 18 Apr 2015 17:23

Image

This DND pic shows more than 20% of the island, lift and port side deck is protruded outside and is not built on the hull.

ravip
BRFite
Posts: 270
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby ravip » 18 Apr 2015 17:29

This video might have been posted earlier but gives clear view of protruded deck out side hull.

corrected link has been posted below.
Last edited by ravip on 18 Apr 2015 21:25, edited 1 time in total.

Singha
BRF Oldie
Posts: 66601
Joined: 13 Aug 2004 19:42
Location: the grasshopper lies heavy

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby Singha » 18 Apr 2015 17:50

Good. So we modified original Cavour design..and I think it will have barak8 and MFSTAR also?

abhik
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3090
Joined: 02 Feb 2009 17:42

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby abhik » 18 Apr 2015 20:46

ravip wrote:This video might have been posted earlier but gives clear view of protruded deck out side hull. [youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K3JdEPuMBgs[/youtube]

Corrected Youtube link.

ravip
BRFite
Posts: 270
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby ravip » 18 Apr 2015 21:28

Singha wrote:Good. So we modified original Cavour design..and I think it will have barak8 and MFSTAR also?


yes it will have Barak 8 as well as MFSTAR. Image

Singha
BRF Oldie
Posts: 66601
Joined: 13 Aug 2004 19:42
Location: the grasshopper lies heavy

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby Singha » 18 Apr 2015 22:34

Like those meaty srgm over the ak630. Nothing like a heavy stick to beat up inbounds at long range.

With supersonic asm proliferation the Gatling ciws is too weak and short range. Combo of missile and meaty guns needed now

Philip
BRF Oldie
Posts: 21061
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30
Location: India

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby Philip » 19 Apr 2015 20:09

The lifts do penetrate into the hull but from the drgs,video clip,excellent one,only as much as the island.though.The pic of the carrier under construction seems to show the lift well/lift as it looks identical to that on the v-clip. But one can see that a substantial space is the equiv. of a cut-out.

Interesting that heavier guns are being used instead of gatlings,greater range no doubt,but will they have the "wall of steel" capability that gatlings come with? Is there also any scope for MANPADs sized SR SAMs? Unless there are adequate number of B-2s,defeating massed attacks of missiles could quickly exhaust SAM inventories. A layered anti-missile defence is always preferable,as they say,"there's safety in numbers". One wonders whether there are specialized MIG-29K variants in the works planned like Growlers,etc. The IAC-1 design can easily be scaled up to a 65,000t carrier ,which could operate larger and heavier carrier aircraft,perhaps even the hinted at naval version of the PAK-FA/FGFA. If we can afford it,we should plump for N-propulsion for at least 2 65,000t carriers,or if we can't affor a scond N-powered carrier,for the interim,the 4 proposed 35/40,000t amphibs should have a ski-jump and significant hangar space available for a mix of helos and strike aircraft.They would be approx. the same size as the IAC-1 ,in fact the flight deck could be identically sized for commonality,making air ops a cinch. The Japanese are doing just that with their new 25,000t light carriers,being passed off as amphib vessels.

ravip
BRFite
Posts: 270
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby ravip » 19 Apr 2015 20:22

Philip wrote:The lifts do penetrate into the hull but from the drgs,video clip,excellent one,only as much as the island.though.The pic of the carrier under construction seems to show the lift well/lift as it looks identical to that on the v-clip. But one can see that a substantial space is the equiv. of a cut-out.

Interesting that heavier guns are being used instead of gatlings,greater range no doubt,but will they have the "wall of steel" capability that gatlings come with? Is there also any scope for MANPADs sized SR SAMs? Unless there are adequate number of B-2s,defeating massed attacks of missiles could quickly exhaust SAM inventories. A layered anti-missile defence is always preferable,as they say,"there's safety in numbers". One wonders whether there are specialized MIG-29K variants in the works planned like Growlers,etc. The IAC-1 design can easily be scaled up to a 65,000t carrier ,which could operate larger and heavier carrier aircraft,perhaps even the hinted at naval version of the PAK-FA/FGFA. If we can afford it,we should plump for N-propulsion for at least 2 65,000t carriers,or if we can't affor a scond N-powered carrier,for the interim,the 4 proposed 35/40,000t amphibs should have a ski-jump and significant hangar space available for a mix of helos and strike aircraft.They would be approx. the same size as the IAC-1 ,in fact the flight deck could be identically sized for commonality,making air ops a cinch. The Japanese are doing just that with their new 25,000t light carriers,being passed off as amphib vessels.


[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BnrA4VfjgPI[/youtube]
Last edited by ravip on 19 Apr 2015 20:27, edited 1 time in total.

Singha
BRF Oldie
Posts: 66601
Joined: 13 Aug 2004 19:42
Location: the grasshopper lies heavy

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby Singha » 19 Apr 2015 20:27

> but will they have the "wall of steel" capability that gatlings come with?

I do agree a 2nd layer of Agile SRSAM is needed. could be the maitri or barak1 or astra naval variant.

I think the idea is radar guided guns firing sensor fused heavy shells at inbounds. the 30/20mm gattling types can put up a lot of ammo in the air but I think too light and will disperse or fall off quickly.

http://www.navweaps.com/Weapons/WNUS_3-62_mk75.htm

The "Super Rapid" (SR) is an improved, faster-firing version designed specifically for anti-ship missile defense. Accuracy was improved compared to the Compact, partly by reducing the weight of the moving parts which reduced the vibration problems. OTO-Melara claims that these changes have reduced the standard deviation values to less than 0.3 milrads (0.017 degrees) at 1,000 m (1,100 yards) per burst of 10 rounds when fired at the maximum ROF.

The Italian Navy considers the SR to be an effective anti-missile weapon and new ships are being built with this weapon in place of the twin "Fast 40" used on earlier ships in that role. OTO-Melara estimates that, combined with the Dardo FCS, the SR can begin engaging attacking missiles at about 6,600 yards (6,000 m), with the first rounds arriving on target at 6,000 yards (5,500 m). With these ranges, a single gun can deal with up to four subsonic sea-skimmer missiles, arriving simultaneously on courses 90 degrees apart, before any reaches 1,100 yards (1,000 m).

SR: 120 rounds per minute (139 achieved on trials)

DART stands for "Driven Ammunition Reduced Time of flight." This is a sub-caliber, guided projectile with canard control, intended to improve the performance of these guns in the antimissile role. OTO-Melara claims that an average of only three of these projectiles are needed per engagement. The proximity fuzes for this munition are said to be effective within 6 feet (2 m) of the water surface and are designed to trigger when within 30 feet (10 m) of the target. A November 2005 OTO-Melara Press Release stated that firing trials with DART had been performed at PISQ (Poligono Interforze Salto di Quirra), an Italian interservice firing range located in Sardinia. During the firing trials, the DART projectiles correctly entered and followed the guidance beam and maneuvered within the accuracy requirements for distances over 5,500 yards (5,000 m). This is seen as a crucial milestone, as these tests showed that DART can be successfully guided over the expected engagement ranges.

OTO-Melara now plans a 76 mm version of their Vulcano Extended Range munition. This will be essentially a scaled-down version of the 127 mm version and plans are for evaluation rounds for flight testing to be available starting in 2013.

---
there is another cheaper anti-missile round with tungsten cubes that get released

Singha
BRF Oldie
Posts: 66601
Joined: 13 Aug 2004 19:42
Location: the grasshopper lies heavy

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby Singha » 19 Apr 2015 20:36

great simulation showing the SRGM in action. it has a sliding door which pops a small radar and tracks/guides shells.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n6_Swig2J2E

note how neatly the radar is packaged within the typical turret shape. this packaging and neatness is where the west scores heavily over russian designs :D

DART ammo should be far more effective against the manned suicide boat threat than a gunner standing on the side trying to use a 50cal HMG on a speeding heaving ship.

arun
BRF Oldie
Posts: 10248
Joined: 28 Nov 2002 12:31

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby arun » 19 Apr 2015 22:16

One more picture of the Vikrant from Sitanshu Kar’s Twitter feed:

Image

arun
BRF Oldie
Posts: 10248
Joined: 28 Nov 2002 12:31

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby arun » 20 Apr 2015 11:39

News of IAC II, not Vikrant, X Posted from Indian Naval Discussion thread.

Question dealing with EMALS during interview of CNS Adm. Robin Dhowan by Rahul Singh for Hindustan Times discloses the successor carrier to Vikrant, ie: IAC-II, is a long way off as study phase is yet to be completed:

Will the navy deploy the electromagnetic aircraft launch system (EMALS) offered by the US on the second indigenous aircraft carrier (IAC-II)?

The IAC-II is only in a phase of study where the approach paper is being evaluated to look at possible contours of the carrier – size, equipment and machinery. It’s in a preliminary phase and will later be taken up by the defence ministry. The setting up of a joint working group on sharing technology isn’t any signal that we will go for EMALS. This will follow a protracted decision-making process by the government on aspects related to what the form and fit of the carrier will be. It’s too early to say what technology we will go for but all options are being evaluated.


From here:

Priority is to ensure we are combat-ready: Navy chief

Gagan
BRF Oldie
Posts: 11209
Joined: 16 Apr 2008 22:25

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby Gagan » 20 Apr 2015 15:13

:((
1. Small, thin SDRE lifts
2. No blast deflectors
:(( :((

Singha
BRF Oldie
Posts: 66601
Joined: 13 Aug 2004 19:42
Location: the grasshopper lies heavy

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby Singha » 20 Apr 2015 15:32

CVN lifts can bring up 2 F-18 with folded wings. but given our relatively 30% airwing, the 1-unit lifts should not be a concern.

Karan M
Forum Moderator
Posts: 19841
Joined: 19 Mar 2010 00:58

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby Karan M » 20 Apr 2015 15:36

arun wrote:News of IAC II, not Vikrant, X Posted from Indian Naval Discussion thread.

Question dealing with EMALS during interview of CNS Adm. Robin Dhowan by Rahul Singh for Hindustan Times discloses the successor carrier to Vikrant, ie: IAC-II, is a long way off as study phase is yet to be completed:

Will the navy deploy the electromagnetic aircraft launch system (EMALS) offered by the US on the second indigenous aircraft carrier (IAC-II)?

The IAC-II is only in a phase of study where the approach paper is being evaluated to look at possible contours of the carrier – size, equipment and machinery. It’s in a preliminary phase and will later be taken up by the defence ministry. The setting up of a joint working group on sharing technology isn’t any signal that we will go for EMALS. This will follow a protracted decision-making process by the government on aspects related to what the form and fit of the carrier will be. It’s too early to say what technology we will go for but all options are being evaluated.


From here:

Priority is to ensure we are combat-ready: Navy chief


I think this is the present emphasis of the current GOI - take existing assets to combat capability. Finally, a Govt that gets it!

You took over as chief a year ago when the navy was going through a tumultuous phase and was labelled an accident-prone force. What have been your toughest fights?

I think the biggest priority has been to make sure various dimensions of the navy are combat ready at all times. For that, we had to ensure ships, submarines and aircraft were in their highest state of combat readiness. Several issues addressed include quality of training, safety audits and high-level of maintenance for our platforms. You have to fight today’s war with today’s assets. What will come after five or 10 years will come. It’s very important to be doing what we need to do with our existing force levels.


Read this in line with PM meeting service chiefs, DM saying Su-30 serviceability will be up to 70% , reports of WWR being replenished and so forth.

John
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2509
Joined: 03 Feb 2001 12:31

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby John » 20 Apr 2015 16:10

The radar on top looks too big to be EL/M 2238 like one on shivalik unless its scaled improperly could be RAN 40L or perhaps large variant of 2238.

Aditya G
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3483
Joined: 19 Feb 2002 12:31
Contact:

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby Aditya G » 20 Apr 2015 18:26

Singha wrote:great simulation showing the SRGM in action. it has a sliding door which pops a small radar and tracks/guides shells......


The sliding door is part of the Strales package.

Our SRGMs are SDRE onlee.

Nikhil T
BRFite
Posts: 1286
Joined: 09 Nov 2008 06:48
Location: RAW HQ, Lodhi Road

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby Nikhil T » 14 May 2015 18:55

INS Vikrant's structural work complete - to be undocked on May 28

India’s first indigenous aircraft carrier, INS Vikrant , will be undocked on completion of structural work at the Cochin Shipyard on May 28.

“All major equipment has gone into the vessel, which has now acquired the shape of an aircraft carrier, with a finished hull. Barring a bit of ongoing work on the super structure, structural work is all over and the internal compartments have all been welded in,” said a yard official.

Outfitting is steadily progressing at the moment, but a major part of it — including piping, electrical cabling, control system wiring — will be carried out after the vessel is launched, marking the culmination of the third stage of work in the second phase of carrier construction for which a contract was signed between Cochin Shipyard and the Navy in December last year.

The extended first phase of work on the carrier was completed in August 2013 when the carrier had its official launch, but there was a delay in the Cabinet Committee on Security (CCS) sanctioning money for the second phase, which as per a schedule prepared in 2010 should be over in 2016.

The CCS sanction for the first phase was Rs. 3,261 crore, while the allocation for the critical second phase is Rs. 2,840 crore. The equipment already fitted in will be set to work towards the end of the ongoing phase after which basin trials will commence in 2017 to be on time for delivery in end-2018. The aircraft carrier will displace over 40,000 tonnes at the time of its induction into the Navy.

Contract with Rosoboronexport

While some 14 contracts have been signed with the Russian Rosoboronexport for the carrier’s aviation complex, delivery of major aviation equipment has not begun yet.

The aviation complex is designed by the Nevskoye Design Bureau, as Vikrant will have a complement of Russian-origin MiG 29 K fighter planes operating from its flight deck alongside the indigenously developed Naval LCA (when it receives operational clearance).

Meanwhile, the yard is awaiting clearances from the Directorate of Naval Design (DND) to start installation of heating, ventilation and air conditioning systems.

“Ironically, obsolescence of equipment already delivered and stacked for sometime could pose a problem towards the end of the second phase when they are set to work,” said an official.

Equipment such as the massive gas turbines, for instance, would have outlived its guarantee period by the time the pre-delivery trials begin, he pointed out.


Austin
BRF Oldie
Posts: 23387
Joined: 23 Jul 2000 11:31

Re: INS Vikrant News and Discussion

Postby Austin » 20 May 2015 09:46

India is in talks with Russia on the modernization of helicopters Ka-28 aircraft carrier "Vikrant" - Indian Ambassador to Russia

Tomsk. May 18th. Interfax-AVN - India plans to use helicopters Ka-226 and modernized Ka-28 on an aircraft carrier Project 71 "Vikrant" along with MiG-29K / KUB, said the agency "Interfax" on Monday, Indian ambassador P Srinivasan Raghavan during his visit to Tomsk.

"On" Vikrant "plan to use the Ka-226 and Ka-28, which we already have, but we want to modernize the Ka-28. Negotiations on modernization (with the Russian side -" IF ") are already, they soon completed, "- said P.S.Raghavan.

He did not specify the number of helicopters that will be upgraded.

It was reported that Russia until the end of 2016 to complete the delivery of India 45 carrier-based aircraft MiG-29K / KUB, which will be based on aircraft carriers Project 11430 "Vikramaditya" Russian construction and design 71 "Vikrant" Indian-built.


Return to “Military Issues & History Forum”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: brar_w, pravula, Thakur_B and 82 guests