Pathankot AirForce base under attack

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SSundar
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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby SSundar » 06 Jan 2016 11:25

chetak wrote:the fog over the shady SP is slowly beginning to clear and the truth may be emerging.

more revelations may be forthcoming soon


Sanjay Dixit, IAS @Sanjay_Dixit

My sources saying SP had gone there to finalise a drug deal. Smugglers turned out to be terrorists n hitched a hike https://twitter.com/YRDeshmukh/status/6 ... 7175505920

10 retweets 2 likes


All doubts have been removed completely once Burkha broadcast an interview to "cleanse" the guy.

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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby Philip » 06 Jan 2016 11:28

There should be a thorough review of mil bases.def. establishments.One problem is creeping urban sprawl.many bases are now cheek by jowl to habitation.In the attack at the recent Karachi base,we saw that housing existed just after the boundary wall of the base.

There should be a cordon sanitaire of at least 1km surrounding a base which should be devoid of any civil structures of any kind. This zone should be a free fire zone without any vegetation where jihadis can hide. A double or triple layer of fencing after that.Between two layers of fencing/walls whatever,the width should be wide enough for an ICV to operate .At night dog patrols as well.Some parts electrified with watchtowers,plus the usual gamut of sensors,IR/cameras,etc. These are std. procedures worldwide and would make penetration of the base extremely difficult. Whjere housign has crept close to the base,the Govt. should buy out those properties and demolish them or modify/use them for security purposes.

The housing zone for families of the forces should have another cordon by itself,to prevent hostage taking in the event of penetration. As they do in Israel,when faced with rocket/missile attacks,UG/safe shelters are reqd. for the families to shelter in until the danger is over. These surely must already be in existence at our air bases.

Every year there is a sizeable number of armymen who retire,but are still very capable of combat. These well-trained jawans,etc., should not be left to rot in civvy street as babudom want them to,but must be used as an invaluable resource for lesser mil duties,where action does take place as we've just seen at P'kot. They would also giver us sizeable numbers of reserves to support reg troops when the balloon goes up. This would also alleviate the OROP problem.

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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby habal » 06 Jan 2016 11:55

Singha wrote:from a TSPA pov, given their huge manpower pool and training setups, why are they not sending 10 such teams across the border every quarter to create mayhem ? they know india is very unlikely to retaliate across the border.

this is what puzzles me.


pakjabis also have indic blood. I am sure most of them have enough smarts to not become scapegoat for the army in some chase for unobtainium, they are radicalized for sure but smart enough to see through any attempt to con them into suicide. Yet, there are few that fall for it. I am sure the numbers are very few and very small groups. That is why there are no 10 teams available with the pakis, if they had then all of them would have been here.

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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby shaun » 06 Jan 2016 11:56

Stationing NSG was not a bad decision at all , they were in standby for any hostage rescue situation as intel was there about terrorists moment in the town . They could have attacked other soft targets , like a police station etc.
What i feel is , combing operation could have been better handled by Army SF , they have done it in numerous such situations before. This is also true that the base is huge and have big vegetation cover in and around the base , idle for terrorist as well as for our Army SF / Para to operate . MHA poking its nose have diluted the C&C of these operation. One have to remember , during combing operation NSG suffered 8 injuries , the severity of those injuries are not reported.

And one poster have said earlier ," if NSG was not involved , people would have asked for NSG " , no , in other such attacks in the past on defense installations no one have ever asked for NSG.
Last edited by shaun on 06 Jan 2016 12:04, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby saje » 06 Jan 2016 12:03

All said and done, these jihadis are a beautiful weapon of the Pakis. The Pathankot AFB is an airbase close to the border with mainly CAS assets. In a war instead of firing costly (and non functional) missiles at such an airbase, all that the Pakis have to do is send a few of such jihadis and they'll shut down the airbase for 3 days -- so no CAS from the airbase for 3 days and the PA can safely send their armoured columns across the border.

It is not for any other reason that the ISI is trying to get info on airbases through the Airman who was caught recently. Once they know the disposition of the airbases/squadrons, all they need to do is station a few of such jihadi sleeper teams near the airbases of interest and in the event of a war these guys will shut down the airbase/s and super duper $ 20 Billion jets will remain sitting on the ground waiting for the base to be cleared. Brilliant!

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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby Raja Bose » 06 Jan 2016 12:04

Shaun wrote:One have to remember , during combing operation NSG suffered 8 injuries , the severity of those injuries are not reported.


As per the casualty admittance list, only 1 NSG (a K9 handler) suffered serious injury - splinters to the knee and one side. He was probably right next to the Lt. Col. and part of the bomb disposal squad. None of the other NSG wounded were admitted to hospital so most likely were minor injuries which required 1st aid onlee.

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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby shaun » 06 Jan 2016 12:11

If that is the case , than i am totally wrong with my assumption

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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby sum » 06 Jan 2016 12:12

habal wrote:
sum wrote:Weren't we cribbing till now that in the IA ( esp J&K), senior folks were incorrect to be leading operations from the front and getting KIA/injured instead of letting junior officers doing the work and seniors only coordinating from background? :-?


I have not cribbed about anything until now. this is my first, so kindly excuse.

Wasnt directed at you, saar!
I recalled people on BRF taking IA to task for letting senior officers in harms way in earlier encounters. So, i genuinely wonder which is the right approach to take?

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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby habal » 06 Jan 2016 12:24

sun, it was my wife who pointed this out and sent me thinking. Seniority in rank is not necessary but having lived in and lived through these operations for around a decade and survived these helps. You need to be in tune with the mindset of terrorists and also need to have studied them for some time to instinctually understand in any situation how they work.

the boys on the other hand are just used to mock drills, mess life, life in camps. They are still vulnerable and need to be protected a bit. Look at how the DSC chef successfully & instinctually finished off one of the terrorists. I am sure from hereon with this experience in mind, DSC chefs in border bases will cook with weapons near hand.

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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby Karan M » 06 Jan 2016 12:31

shiv wrote:

Need to call their mummies and tell them where they can see their sons' wedding photos


Actually yes. Let them see how the last meal went. After all, aren't their folks in Pakistan bragging about sending their kids to martyrdom, bla bla, how the houries will visit them, smell of jannat will be red roses bla bla.. let them see the houries 9mm and 7.62mm kisses.

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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby Singha » 06 Jan 2016 12:32

hopefully the SP will rat on his ring for a lighter sentence and the ring can be rolled up. be interesting to see if political, business and police elites are involved...they usually are in every big 100x scam of this type. IB/CBI from center will have to take charge of this.

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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby BharadwajV » 06 Jan 2016 12:35

Aditya G wrote:With a minimum 700m target distance, using heptr based firepower is basically infeasible as you are circling the site and there is very little margin for pointing your machine and directing fire on to a target. This is compounded by bullet dispersal and weight which will probably take down a small building instead of a man.

I am repeating this for each of us to recall when the next attack happens "why did we not send in gunships to support our troops etc". CRPF in naxalite areas also needs to know as they think that air support is their birth right and air force is unnecessarily reticent.

We could use Apache Gunships and Hellfire AGMs for accurate Jehadi head-hunting, no?
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=50d_1357758569
And the 30mm Cannon on the Apache sits on a stabilized turret for crazy accuracy.
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=07a_1345651221
I also remember seeing a video with the Apache engaging moving targets on the ground(Iraq?) with very good accuracy. Unable to find it now...

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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby Singha » 06 Jan 2016 12:41

its very unlikely such heavy firepower will be used inside our own facility. all that infra destroyed by carpet bombing the base will be another goal achieved for the rats.

the huge amirkhan bases like bagram and kandahar tend to have some QRT units with apaches , A10 and blackhawks incase a patrol gets ambushed and in trouble, but thats about it....they dont go around shooting the place up.

the whole world except Afghanistan and india is lucky not to have TSP as a neighbour. imagine what would happen to the millions of acres size khan homeland mil bases with rats on their perimeter.

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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby member_29247 » 06 Jan 2016 12:44

Benghazi moment from r India

There Clinton failed my n her games
Here ISI won the battle that's the difference

Our problems are our own making all the way

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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby Karan M » 06 Jan 2016 12:58

So ISI won the battle, despite Indian troops battling the folks and protecting the technical area. Your constant cynicism and running down of any Indian op and event is tiresome.

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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby Karan M » 06 Jan 2016 13:01

Raja Bose wrote:
Shaun wrote:One have to remember , during combing operation NSG suffered 8 injuries , the severity of those injuries are not reported.


As per the casualty admittance list, only 1 NSG (a K9 handler) suffered serious injury - splinters to the knee and one side. He was probably right next to the Lt. Col. and part of the bomb disposal squad. None of the other NSG wounded were admitted to hospital so most likely were minor injuries which required 1st aid onlee.


The same point made by Gokhale.

The 1st lapse of allowing armed terrorists into Punjab has cost heavily but thereafter the anti-terror Ops have been deliberate & effective

Also no civilian casualties; vital air assets fully protected. Inter-agency coordination could have been done much better of course
Nitin A. Gokhale ‏@nitingokhale Jan 4

A calmer look will show only 2 soldiers--One Garud, 1 DSC man--died in direct contact with terrorists. 5 other DSC men died in cookhouse

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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby Karan M » 06 Jan 2016 13:03

And the poorly armed, underprepared NSG who don't have BPJs, lack TFTA wutever

Image

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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby deejay » 06 Jan 2016 13:05

Aditya G wrote:...

Our last know use of fighter air power was in 2002:
http://vayu-sena.tripod.com/other-loonda-kargil-ii.html

...


Thank you for correcting me. I had forgotten about it.

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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby Karan M » 06 Jan 2016 13:09

^^ Thanks for your posts on heptrs and IA personnel Deejay. Interesting as always.

Meanwhile Shishir Gupta
The pathankot terrorists were so heavily armed that 21 explosions were triggered after their death. All kills by N S G.
59 retweets 14 likes


So looks like they came equipped for the aircraft. Instead they were used for their own cremations. Looks like they'll reach jannat with missing parts

JeM terrorists had no GPS devices/ mob or sat phones as it was a suicide mission. Used SP & Verma cell to call Pak.


So this bunch was trained better than the 26/11 group and didn't need constant advice and buck up messages.

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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby shiv » 06 Jan 2016 13:12

Singha wrote:from a TSPA pov, given their huge manpower pool and training setups, why are they not sending 10 such teams across the border every quarter to create mayhem ? they know india is very unlikely to retaliate across the border.

this is what puzzles me.

it could be they are trying and our counter-intel is quietly killing them off under cover of encounters or unclaimed body thing. in recent few months CI has got very active and some 14 armed forces people are reported arrested for spying...could be a lot more in civilian sector.

Gen Ata Hasnain answered that several weeks ago. Most are unable to enter or killed off in Kashmir. So they are now trying to move down south into Punjab. The Kashmir route was giving them a fog leaf of Kashmir struggle. They need fig leaf of Khalistan for Punjab.

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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby Karan M » 06 Jan 2016 14:09

^^ Above was predicted on BR a long time back. I remember reading a debate saying that since we had succeeded in locking down Kashmir. These Pakistani terrorist state would seek to expand its roaches elsewhere.

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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby Lalmohan » 06 Jan 2016 14:15

all of the dead pigs seem to be wearing the same type of black inner thermal vest - mil issue?

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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby Prasad » 06 Jan 2016 14:30

So Vishnu reports that command and control aspect of the ops were bad and also that NSG might've been better off held in reserve if HR was needed and para sf might've been more apt. Given that the terrorists had not hit and infantry was being called up for perimeter security and technical area security, why use nsg? They aren't better equipped or experienced at hunting these rats in open areas than the sf guys no?

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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby habal » 06 Jan 2016 14:41

My guess is NSA had guessed that Marcos, AF were activated to protect the airbase assets. And for rest was living quarters, administrative block, medical care facilities etc which would have required NSG. Nobody thought at first that most of the fight would happen in open areas.

Again I am having a feeling about this attack in that there is somewhere a hint that Masood Azhar's card has been cut. he has not uttered a word about this attack, though JeM has claimed in it's facebook page on very first day that they were responsible. What does this mean ?? It means that in continuation of recent trends in Pakistan on 'Karachi Operation' (war against contract killing, kidnapping, ransom), dard-e-kabz, and talk about cleansing Punjab in preparation for CECP. This is a brainwave by Raheel & Nawaz to get the alibi to cleanse Punjab of extremist elements and the biggest and most influential amongst these elements in Punjab are Malik Ishaq, Masood Azhar & Hafiz Saeed. Out of this first has been bumped off, third is quivering and only second is effective. Rest you connect the dots.

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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby member_29190 » 06 Jan 2016 14:49

Prasad wrote:So Vishnu reports that command and control aspect of the ops were bad and also that NSG might've been better off held in reserve if HR was needed and para sf might've been more apt. Given that the terrorists had not hit and infantry was being called up for perimeter security and technical area security, why use nsg? They aren't better equipped or experienced at hunting these rats in open areas than the sf guys no?



This is what we are good at. Wasting time on excessive "introspection". It would be better off if GOI was questioned on why the fight is not been taken to PA/ISI.

Instead we spend time arguing about who would be good at ops command.

There was no NSG combat casualities.No civilian casualities, no asset destruction.

It took 2-3 days to finish the ops. Who cares? Let them take 10 days. There is no birthday to attend.

How much better Para Sf would have done? Are there better men than Lt Col Nirijan in SF for bomb deposal? Would they have saved the DSC who just happen to be at the wrong place at the wrong time?

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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby tsarkar » 06 Jan 2016 14:55

deejay wrote:Use of Air Assets in CI Ops, specifically helicopters:
> I have fired from MI 17s and not MI 25 / 35s so I will be accurate for Mi 17 but generic for the attack helos
> Helicopters have heavy vibrations because of Main Rotor and TR
> Firing distance is between 700 mtrs to 01 kms ideally
> I mm shake in the gun per sec will get a large area spray over targets - Rockets or Bullets
> This shake is circular.
> Therefore, point targets are not good targets for helicopters.
> I see videos of Hinds in Syria and see them go after only area targets while using rockets and front guns.
> Terrorists were blocked in a small area by keeping our troops in firing distance.
> Moving our troops back would be required for any aerial firing (even fighters) and this would ease the pressure on terrorists as they could move in a larger area. Remember, casualties were being measured by all. Terrorists just need to be lucky - we need to be sure. AKMs have an approx effective range of 400 mtrs but lucky shots at 500 mtrs are not unheard of. So, our troops would have to move back from maximum 400 mtrs (or closer upto ~100 mtrs depending on cover ) to wider approx 500 mtrs net.

I thought the Mi-25/35 had stabilized guns slaved to the Israeli EO sight. Is it not?

Mi-17 ofcourse has pylon mounted gun packs that are not stabilized.

Our Super Dvora XFAC pitch worse than horses, however, the stabilized gun slaved to the same EO sight and remote controlled from the bridge is extremely steady and accurate.

PS - Do Mi-25/35 transferred to Afghanistan retain those Israeli sights, or have they been removed?

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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby Karan M » 06 Jan 2016 15:10

Prasad wrote:So Vishnu reports that command and control aspect of the ops were bad and also that NSG might've been better off held in reserve if HR was needed and para sf might've been more apt. Given that the terrorists had not hit and infantry was being called up for perimeter security and technical area security, why use nsg? They aren't better equipped or experienced at hunting these rats in open areas than the sf guys no?


His years of combat experience and service with both Para SF and NSG no doubt helped him formulate this opinion as versus regurgitating what others tell him but remaining objective. Also, of course there was a crystal ball up in the sky which said - hey guys, only AFB would be attacked and not any other target so we can have one and not the other as the first choice of deployment.

The sarcasm is not directed at you but at all these chaps who create controversies out of nothing, all for a clear partisan agenda and to drive TRP.
Last edited by Karan M on 06 Jan 2016 15:14, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby Singha » 06 Jan 2016 15:11

ibn
Further leads into the investigation of the Pathankot terror attack are raising suspicions over Gurdaspur Superintendent of Police (SP) Salwinder Singh having alleged links with the terrorists who attacked Pathankot.

Singh has claimed that he has been a regular to the Panj Pir Dargah, shrine keeper Som has said that he had never seen him before at the place.

In a startling revelation, Som claimed that Singh made a phone call to him at around 8:30 on December 31 to keep the shrine open as he would be visiting. When he resisted claiming that it was already late and it was time to close the shrine, the SP allegedly forced and ordered Som to keep it open.

He also added that the SP's friend jeweller friend Rajesh Verma visited the shrine twice on the same day. He had never been to the shrine earlier, Som claimed.

What is even more astounding is the fact that the National Investigating Agency (NIA)has found footprints of Pakistan's Epcot brand shoes from Bamiyal area in Punjab. The area where the footprints were found is very close to this shrine. The shrine is just a few kilometres away from the border.

As per sources, Singh is likely to be taken into custody. The SP might have played a crucial role in the Pathankot attacks as it is believed that he could have also provided logistical support to the terrorists.
There is suspicion over his late night visit to the Panj Pir dargah as there was already a terror alert in the area and the SP went unarmed to such an isolated area.

Earlier speaking to media persons on Tuesday, DGP Punjab Police Suresh Arora said that they will investigate why SP Salwinder Singh's car was not stopped at the check points.

Gurdaspur SP has maintained that he, along with two others, was abducted and later released by heavily-armed terrorists while they were on their way back from the Panj Pir Dargah. Soon after the SP’s abduction, the terrorists had attacked the Pathankot air base in which seven men from the security forces died and six terrorists were gunned down.

Salwinder was posted as SP (Headquarters) Gurdaspur until December 31, 2015 when he was transferred to 75th battalion in Jalandhar.

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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby Karan M » 06 Jan 2016 15:15

LOL and before he is taken into custody, there is already a news report out on it.

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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby Karan M » 06 Jan 2016 15:16

Also shows BR estimate of this guy facilitating smuggling and getting caught up in something entirely different turned out to be accurate. Hope he gives up the entire ring.

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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby Karan M » 06 Jan 2016 15:20

FWIW, amongst everything else - IPS view on IA/IAF/NSG cooperation as versus cribbing outside.

http://indianexpress.com/article/india/ ... input-dgp/

Arora was all praise for security forces. “…I will just like to share that seeing is believing. What we saw was the highest standard of professionalism on the part of defence forces, their dedication and commitment and feeling of making sacrifice for the country we could see clearly. Not only that, the kind of coordination, synergy and cooperation that was there trust me gentlemen your life, our life and the life of our families of this country are in the safest hands,” Arora said. - Punjab Director General of Police Suresh Arora

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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby wig » 06 Jan 2016 15:21

http://www.tribuneindia.com/news/nation ... 79992.html
Why op command changed thrice-After Dinanagar, Pathankot anti-terror operation throws up nagging concerns
In what appears to be a serious lapse on the part of the security establishment, the command of the operation to flush out terrorists from the Air Force base at Pathankot was changed thrice.
It has emerged that at least three officers of the Army, IAF and the National Security Guard headed the operation at different stages. Sources said a review was being carried on this.
When the planning to counter the terrorists started in Delhi around 1 pm on January 1 —14 hours before the first shots were fired in Pathankot at 3:30 am on January 2 — two columns of the Army were rushed to Pathankot.
Around 1 am on January 2, two-and-a-half hours before the terrorists struck, an NSG team from Gurgaon landed at IAF base. Around mid-morning, the Western Air Command Chief, Air Marshal SB Deo, landed in Pathankot to “oversee” the operation.
The Director General of NSG, RC Tayal, arrived in the evening and “oversaw” the operation in coordination with the IG (Operations), NSG.
It was amid this confusion and rush to make claims that Union Home Minister Rajnath Singh was “wrongly informed” that the operations were over on January 2 evening. The minister tweeted so, only to delete the message a few hours later.
Among the questions being probed are whether the terrorists had a hideout in Punjab. Sources said since it has been established that the six terrorists were on Indian soil by 12:30 am on January 1 (when the first of the four calls were made to Pakistan), they could not have roamed around on the streets carrying over 40 kg of bullets, 30 kg of RDX, guns and grenades for 26 hours when they attacked the IAF base.
Another question is how the BSF “failed in securing an unfenced portion on the right bank of the Ujh near Bamyal village in Punjab and who owns this land.
Another unusual thing was why the NSG, and not the Army, was told to carry out the operation when the "black cat" commandos are largely trained for urban combat such as the Mumbai attacks.
300 NSG: commandos took part in the Pathankot operation
160 commandos: flew from Palam military airbase to the attack site on January 1
70 ‘black cats’: each of two more units reached the IAF base on January 2, 3
1commando: (bomb squad chief Lt Col EK Niranjan) was killed
21other: commandos suffered minor and major injuries

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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby Aaryan » 06 Jan 2016 15:23

Prasad wrote:So Vishnu reports that command and control aspect of the ops were bad and also that NSG might've been better off held in reserve if HR was needed and para sf might've been more apt. Given that the terrorists had not hit and infantry was being called up for perimeter security and technical area security, why use nsg? They aren't better equipped or experienced at hunting these rats in open areas than the sf guys no?


Well I'm no fan of Vishnu or his TV but I feel he is partially correct this time. Now look at the timeline. ToI reports that NSG was flown on 1st Jan. Which means there were some indication of trouble in/around Pathankot. Now if the matter was so sensitive that NSG was flown what was the alertness level of base. Why was it not on high alert. Look at the DSC chaps.. Even after the 1st contact they were preparing breakfast, which means they no Warning or no information was shared with them to be extra alert. What will you call this? I can go on with the list but this is not the time. This is the time to stand united. But lets not forget " Constructive criticism and eternal vigilance is the price of freedom and development"..

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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby jagga » 06 Jan 2016 15:40

Colonel Shukla blabbering
The information we had was pure gold
It is quite obvious because Ajit Doval wanted the credit for himself. And this is how Ajit Doval functions. He is a credit-seeker. At the cost of national security, people seek credit all the time. It is the prime area where people seek credit.

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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby rohitvats » 06 Jan 2016 15:42

shiv wrote: Gen Ata Hasnain answered that several weeks ago. Most are unable to enter or killed off in Kashmir. So they are now trying to move down south into Punjab. The Kashmir route was giving them a fog leaf of Kashmir struggle. They need fig leaf of Khalistan for Punjab.


Even in case of Kashmir, Pakees have shifted tactics and are relying on similarly trained and equipped SF grade terrorists.

Look no further than the attack on Army in Uri - the piglets had trekked through a very harsh terrain in peak of winter to reach their target. And came equipped with best navigation equipment to ensure they reach their target. Further, even there they used the multiple team concept - the Lt. Col killed in that attack was leading the QRT which responded to the attack and was ambushed. The terrorists in case of Uri attack even carried a shot-gun which is a great weapon if you want to break open locked doors!

All this points to planning down to tactical level - where routes and maps have been studied in detail and strategy worked out in advance. Not your garden variety spray-and-pray piglets.

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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby vivek.rao » 06 Jan 2016 15:45

Image

#Pathankot attack: Jihadis made dry runs at Pakistani air base, intelligence sources say http://ow.ly/WH37d

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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby shiv » 06 Jan 2016 15:56

Aaryan wrote:
Well I'm no fan of Vishnu or his TV but I feel he is partially correct this time. Now look at the timeline. ToI reports that NSG was flown on 1st Jan. Which means there were some indication of trouble in/around Pathankot. Now if the matter was so sensitive that NSG was flown what was the alertness level of base. Why was it not on high alert. Look at the DSC chaps.. Even after the 1st contact they were preparing breakfast, which means they no Warning or no information was shared with them to be extra alert. What will you call this? I can go on with the list but this is not the time. This is the time to stand united. But lets not forget " Constructive criticism and eternal vigilance is the price of freedom and development"..

Vishnu's piece was entitled something like "Pathankot Operation worst planned in 30 years" and "unnamed army sources' were claimed

Frankly this is hype. You cannot analyse an operation that has barely ended and compare it with 30 years of operations, So there is a scramble in the media to get eyeballs using language that is always couched in the sanctimonious disclaimer that is constructive criticism. If someone calls this operation "the worst planned in 30 years" I cannot accept that it is "constructive criticism". The latter excuse is only the thin end of a wedge to start off a discussion with an attention grabbing white-lie which the media are good at.

Two days ago I had accused Barkha Dutt of attention seeking when she Tweeted "Casualties are feared to be much higher" when there was no official news. Not to be outdone Manu Pubby started quoting figures and then others picked up the chorus and the figure "10 dead so far" came up. I would say that we must balance the fact that the media are desperately trying to hold on to viewership in a scenario where Times Now and NewsX are getting higher ratings than NDTV and CNNIBN

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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby rohitvats » 06 Jan 2016 16:01

The presstitutes are all quoting the same set of experts and creating this nonsensical argument about use of NSG instead of Army SF. There is a desperate attempt to malign the NSA and somehow show the operation in bad light. This when it was a very successful operation by all yardsticks.

Someone needs to look at the chain of events to see what happened and why:

1. News clarifies that NSG landed at the base few hours before the attack. Another report also said that part of this contingent went to Army cantonment and another retained at the base. By all likelihood, NSG was brought in to deal with ANY contingency that was bound to arise given 6-10 terrorists on the loose.

2. NSG became the force to first react to the attack by default. Secondly, there seems to be a constant reference to NSG not suited for open areas and other BS. And why Infantry or Army SF was better suited. Well, hello? Did someone look up the base layout? By all accounts, it seems that terrorists attacked through the NW part of the base - which is all buildings and residential area!!! If this does not qualify as CQB and HRT, what does?

What was an infantry battalion going to do in this case? Even in Kashmir, when there are stand-offs in populated areas, IA brings in the SF boys. Even if infantry had made first contact, the firefight would've shifted to NSG chaps.

The more manpower intensive role of protecting fuel depot, technical area, radar, ATC and magazine complex was rightly given to 80 odd men from an infantry battalion.

3. When it came to combing operation in the open areas, more columns of the army were pulled in. But combing ops and 'render-safe' ops in the built-up area would have to be done by NSG.

And for God's sake - where do people think NSG boys come from? Most of the younger ones would've been 'Ghatak Platoon' commander in their infantry battalions! And most fit chaps form infantry battalions make it though the NSG training...these are hard core infantrymen to begin with. With more than enough experience in CI Ops in the valley.

The only complain I have is that more infantry should've been pulled in for perimeter defense.

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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby rohitvats » 06 Jan 2016 16:04

shiv wrote: <SNIP> Two days ago I had accused Barkha Dutt of attention seeking when she Tweeted "Casualties are feared to be much higher" when there was no official news. Not to be outdone Manu Pubby started quoting figures and then others picked up the chorus and the figure "10 dead so far" came up. I would say that we must balance the fact that the media are desperately trying to hold on to viewership in a scenario where Times Now and NewsX are getting higher ratings than NDTV and CNN-IBN


Interesting POV.

And if you think of it, we don't have much details about what the terrorists did or planned to do...for example, we still don't know which part of the base was hit first? Were there simultaneous assaults to disperse forces and so forth. Only The Hindu spoke about attack through SE corner of the base. We don't know whether it is correct or not.

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Re: Pathankot AirForce base under attack

Postby Karan M » 06 Jan 2016 16:15

Presstitutes is a good term I realize for this entire cabal of attention seekers who will gladly do anything to push their partisan agenda over national interests.

I hope MAD now pursue strict action against these chaps & ensure the media is taken to task for some of its questionable antics.

That apart, the next bunch of attacks will likely be at these bases.

In the last two months alone, 14 people linked to the armed forces have been arrested for spying for allegedly leaking information about the Army base in Gwalior, Air Force stations in Bathinda and Jaisalmer.

http://www.firstpost.com/india/pathanko ... 71700.html

The intel will be around layout above and beyond GE images, security shifts, access points etc. These bases need to be completely secured.


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