Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion - June'14

member_23370 · Post by **member_23370** » 01 May 2016 09:24

Thanks Karan. Hadn't seen the BRwiki article on IAF modernization

Gyan · Post by **Gyan** » 01 May 2016 09:57

I think that Astra-2, QRSAM missiles will be similar to Barak-8 ie MRSAM=SRSAM along with TCR or MMSR. That is somewhat similar missile with faster, perhaps single phase missile with shorter range radar based on mobile platform.

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 01 May 2016 20:38

brar_w wrote:^ That will be a good aggressive technology development effort once the NGARM is operationalized especially if they can get the SAT link up as well like the AARGM (2-way). The USN and Italy (soon RAAF as well) intend to use it for all strike as a higher speed strike weapon and they've tested it out against ships (both as an ARM and regular air-ground-missile using GPS/INS and MMW) as well given the load outs possible...

http://www.dtic.mil/ndia/2009gunmissile/AARGM.pdf

The next block in the spiral will be one of these solutions (current version is block 1) since now they don't need to rely on onboard systems to the targeting for the Growler.

Not sure whether DRDO has the plans or ready tech to make a 2-way sat (or is it LOS datalink )link for point of impact damage assessment.. heck, IAF should just be happy they get a terminal seeker + passive seeker equipped missile than waiting for unobtainium or compromised imports (which will always be tier-2 or somewhat degraded).
If NGARM can do what Kh-31 did, but it actually works (unlike Kh-31), the IAF should just take the darn thing as versus asking for space lasers.

JTull · Post by **JTull** » 01 May 2016 20:56

Karan M wrote:heck, IAF should just be happy they get a terminal seeker + passive seeker equipped missile than waiting for unobtainium or compromised imports (which will always be tier-2 or somewhat degraded).

Lot of the imported maal also has a tendency to show up dud when needed as in the recent exercises - either due to corruption, poor quality, or improper integration with the launch platforms. Desi maal on the other hand goes thru so many development iterations and (as we've seen with Akash, Prithvi, Agni) samples from every manufacturing batch are user-tested, that becomes unlikely. We don't need to stock these longer than their shelf-lives by ramping up production when needed and can regularly service them as we've all knowledge in-house.

vishvak · Post by **vishvak** » 01 May 2016 21:03

Local manufacturing has added advantage of trying out permutations & combinations which is priceless.

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 01 May 2016 21:07

The new QRSAM means Maitri was canceled? may be I didn't follow up earlier

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 01 May 2016 21:24

JTull and Vishwak - yes!

I am waiting eagerly for all of these desi PGMs to be mass manufactured so IAF finally gets some hard local muscle as versus relying on imported stocks of 2-3 things which often don't do anything.

John · Post by **John** » 01 May 2016 23:31

Gyan wrote:I think that Astra-2, QRSAM missiles will be similar to Barak-8 ie MRSAM=SRSAM along with TCR or MMSR. That is somewhat similar missile with faster, perhaps single phase missile with shorter range radar based on mobile platform.

Not likely to be in same class as Barak-8, more likely to be similar to CAMM or Aster 15. Which would mean around 15-25 km range.

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 02 May 2016 03:18

Ok DRDO did exactly what Saurav Jha noted in his interview with Shri Avinash Chander.
My points are in blue

Saurav Jha: So in that context what are some of the new tactical missile systems being developed under DRDO's recently unveiled 'missile autonomy mission'?

Avinash Chander: Our aim via the 'missile autonomy mission' is to cover a wider space as it were. Let me outline some of the new systems being progressed. A new (1)man portable anti-tank guided missile (ATGM) for which design is over and hardware is getting developed. A (2)Longer ranged SAM with a range of 200-250 km is on the drawing board. A (3)quick reaction SAM which can track on move is well-advanced in the design stage. An (4)anti-radiation missile and a (5)long range anti-ship missile which can prevent aircraft carriers from coming within 1500-2000 km of our shores are also being pursued.

So, DRDO has formally signed MoUs with BDL for both MPATGM and QRSAM indicating high degree of design maturity. NGARM is now slated for trials this year. This also indicates the LRSAM and AShM will likely be progressed.

Quote:
Saurav Jha: What is the status of the anti-radiation missile and the long range anti-ship missile?

Avinash Chander: For the anti-radiation missile design is in progress, in fact hardware is being readied for the first trials. We expect successful trials of this ARM from an aircraft in about the next three years.

The long range anti-ship missile is on the drawing board, and we are confident that in about six years we would be able to get it ready. The long range anti-ship missile is going to be a ballistic missile with a seeker which can hit ships at long range.

Quote:
Saurav Jha: Moving onto the Astra, when can we expect Initial Operational Clearance (IOC) for it?

Avinash Chander: After the first air-launched trials against an actual target which will take place in October-November this year, we will continue to extend its total engagement envelope and by 2015 end we should be looking at induction clearance.

PDC is December 2016

Quote:
Saurav Jha: Why was the LRSAM beset with delays? What would your perspective be on this?

Avinash Chander: LRSAM is a state of the art system. The Armed forces had actually tried to buy such a system from abroad, but nothing was really available that would come with satisfactory terms. And that is how we got into a joint venture with Israel, the system had to be developed ab initio. So there were issues with respect to radar development, issues with respect to the actuation system as well which was initially supposed to be pneumatic but then had to be changed to electromechanical. Then there was the two pulse motor which was being done for the first time and that got into certain combustion stability problems. But the good news is that all those problems have now been overcome. We launched a massive program on the rocket motor and today we have a motor which is stable and will be tested shortly.

Quote:
Saurav Jha: Many of the new missiles being developed under the missile autonomy mission will require an on board seeker given their functions. For true autonomy India will have to be sufficient in that domain at some level. So in that context has a new detector fabrication facility for seeker heads been approved?

Avinash Chander: We are committed to setting up a detector production facility. Normal process of dialogue and tendering, taking approvals etc is currently underway. We are going to have a detector production facility for focal point arrays.

On the radio frequency (RF) seeker front also there is a major thrust. Right from the device i.e source of RF to the stabilization system, to the processing, we are starting a national mission kind of thing. Like we did when it came to developing control laws for the LCA. We have also set up a national mission for engines, for the 1500 HP engine. Now we are setting up a national mission for seekers by involving multiple agencies.

We are starting a national mission for seeker and we are confident in the next three years we'll have our own seekers in multiple spectral domains - X band, Ka-band etc.

One of the first thing Modi govt did was clear the FPA project per reports.

Quote:
Saurav Jha: Coming to strategic missile systems. Missile ejection tests for the Agni-V's canister were carried out recently. How successful were these and when will see an actual canisterized launch of the Agni-V?

Avinash Chander: We had two tests and both were quite successful. Prime requirement is that there should be full repeatability matching with the projections. Both requirements have been met and the missile has been cleared to be launched from the canister. It should happen after the monsoon sometime.

Quote:
Saurav Jha: Has the program for a domestic turbofan for the Nirbhay taken off? What is the rating of this engine?

Avinash Chander: We have taken up the development of this engine and it has come to the bench test level. It is currently undergoing tests and evaluation and we are confident that we can do it. It has 400 kg thrust engine . But once we have the capability we can achieve varied thrust ratings for engines of this class. Incidentally, Nirbhay is coming up in a big way.

http://ibnlive.in.com/blogs/sauravjha/2 ... ister.html

srai · Post by **srai** » 02 May 2016 07:14

Kakarat wrote:Picture of DRDO Glide Bomb from MOD Annual Report 2016 (sorry for the delayed post)

X-posting:

1000 Glide Bombs per year!!! Now we are talking

Kakkaji wrote:Defence ministry lists out 23 projects for private industry

...

Among the projects that have been listed out are 125mm smooth bore gun barrel for battle tanks, targets for torpedo firing, advance pilotless target aircraft, mine layers and diesel engines for naval boats. Besides technical specifications of the equipment, the ministry has also specified quantities to make it easier for the industry to plan investments into technology. For example, the IAF has listed its requirement of long-range glide bombs thousand per year and it wants to acquire them at the earliest. Similarly, the Army wants to annually acquire 5 pilotless target aircraft starting next 2-3 years.

"Interested Indian companies are requested to carry out preliminary assessment regarding their technical capability to undertake these projects and economic viability of the project," a ministry of defence concept note reads.

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 02 May 2016 07:50

looks like these are all technologies available. Bharat forge just displayed its 125mm t72 barrel.

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 02 May 2016 08:02

BDL, DRDO to produce missile

http://www.thehindu.com/news/cities/Hyd ... 543127.ece

Bharat Dynamics Limited (BDL) and Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO) have signed a memorandum of understanding (MoU) for joint development and production of the indigenous Quick Reaction Surface-to-Air Missile (QRSAM).

The missile will be designed and developed by DRDO and will be manufactured by BDL, the Ministry of Defence nominated production agency, for supply to the Indian Army.

The MoU was signed by V. Udaya Bhaskar, BDL Chairman and Managing Director, and K. Jayaraman, Director of DRDL, on Friday at DRDL.

QRSAM has an advanced RF seeker with multiple target handling capability. It is canister launched and has a range up to 30 km, according to a DRDL press release.

srai · Post by **srai** » 02 May 2016 08:03

Kakarat wrote:Picture of DRDO Glide Bomb from MOD Annual Report 2016 (sorry for the delayed post)

So the kit is for 450kg HSLD bomb.

DRDO: A Glimpse

...

GPS/INS Guidance and Control Kit and Glide Fin Kit for 450 kg HSLD Bomb

Ground mechanical adaptation trials of the kit with Jaguar Darin-II were conducted successfully.
Using avionics and seeker for PG kit for 450 kg High Speed Low Drag (HSLD) aircraft bomb, captive
trials have been successfully completed at ITR. The seeker locked-on and tracked the target during the
captive flight.

...

Cain Marko · Post by **Cain Marko** » 02 May 2016 08:36

Karan M wrote:Ok DRDO did exactly what Saurav Jha noted in his interview with Shri Avinash Chander.
My points are in blue

Saurav Jha: So in that context what are some of the new tactical missile systems being developed under DRDO's recently unveiled 'missile autonomy mission'?

Avinash Chander: Our aim via the 'missile autonomy mission' is to cover a wider space as it were. Let me outline some of the new systems being progressed. A new (1)man portable anti-tank guided missile (ATGM) for which design is over and hardware is getting developed. A (2)Longer ranged SAM with a range of 200-250 km is on the drawing board. A (3)quick reaction SAM which can track on move is well-advanced in the design stage. An (4)anti-radiation missile and a (5)long range anti-ship missile which can prevent aircraft carriers from coming within 1500-2000 km of our shores are also being pursued.

So, DRDO has formally signed MoUs with BDL for both MPATGM and QRSAM indicating high degree of design maturity. NGARM is now slated for trials this year. This also indicates the LRSAM and AShM will likely be progressed.

Quote:
Saurav Jha: What is the status of the anti-radiation missile and the long range anti-ship missile?

Avinash Chander: For the anti-radiation missile design is in progress, in fact hardware is being readied for the first trials. We expect successful trials of this ARM from an aircraft in about the next three years.

The long range anti-ship missile is on the drawing board, and we are confident that in about six years we would be able to get it ready. The long range anti-ship missile is going to be a ballistic missile with a seeker which can hit ships at long range.

Quote:
Saurav Jha: Moving onto the Astra, when can we expect Initial Operational Clearance (IOC) for it?

Avinash Chander: After the first air-launched trials against an actual target which will take place in October-November this year, we will continue to extend its total engagement envelope and by 2015 end we should be looking at induction clearance.

PDC is December 2016

Quote:
Saurav Jha: Why was the LRSAM beset with delays? What would your perspective be on this?

Avinash Chander: LRSAM is a state of the art system. The Armed forces had actually tried to buy such a system from abroad, but nothing was really available that would come with satisfactory terms. And that is how we got into a joint venture with Israel, the system had to be developed ab initio. So there were issues with respect to radar development, issues with respect to the actuation system as well which was initially supposed to be pneumatic but then had to be changed to electromechanical. Then there was the two pulse motor which was being done for the first time and that got into certain combustion stability problems. But the good news is that all those problems have now been overcome. We launched a massive program on the rocket motor and today we have a motor which is stable and will be tested shortly.

Quote:
Saurav Jha: Many of the new missiles being developed under the missile autonomy mission will require an on board seeker given their functions. For true autonomy India will have to be sufficient in that domain at some level. So in that context has a new detector fabrication facility for seeker heads been approved?

Avinash Chander: We are committed to setting up a detector production facility. Normal process of dialogue and tendering, taking approvals etc is currently underway. We are going to have a detector production facility for focal point arrays.

On the radio frequency (RF) seeker front also there is a major thrust. Right from the device i.e source of RF to the stabilization system, to the processing, we are starting a national mission kind of thing. Like we did when it came to developing control laws for the LCA. We have also set up a national mission for engines, for the 1500 HP engine. Now we are setting up a national mission for seekers by involving multiple agencies.

We are starting a national mission for seeker and we are confident in the next three years we'll have our own seekers in multiple spectral domains - X band, Ka-band etc.

One of the first thing Modi govt did was clear the FPA project per reports.

Quote:
Saurav Jha: Coming to strategic missile systems. Missile ejection tests for the Agni-V's canister were carried out recently. How successful were these and when will see an actual canisterized launch of the Agni-V?

Avinash Chander: We had two tests and both were quite successful. Prime requirement is that there should be full repeatability matching with the projections. Both requirements have been met and the missile has been cleared to be launched from the canister. It should happen after the monsoon sometime.

Quote:
Saurav Jha: Has the program for a domestic turbofan for the Nirbhay taken off? What is the rating of this engine?

Avinash Chander: We have taken up the development of this engine and it has come to the bench test level. It is currently undergoing tests and evaluation and we are confident that we can do it. It has 400 kg thrust engine . But once we have the capability we can achieve varied thrust ratings for engines of this class. Incidentally, Nirbhay is coming up in a big way.

http://ibnlive.in.com/blogs/sauravjha/2 ... ister.html

So, will the long ranged carrier killer missile be a shourya derivative...is the navic system related to this 1500km range being talked about. Iirc navic too supports navigation up to 1500km from indian land mass.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 02 May 2016 09:39

Cain Marko wrote: . . .is the navic system related to this 1500km range being talked about. Iirc navic too supports navigation up to 1500km from indian land mass.

Apart from its primary service area which is 1500Kms radius from our Land Mass, the NavIC also has an extended service area enclosed by the rectangle from Lat 30 deg south to 50 deg north, long 30 deg east to 130 deg east. Roughly, it covers the bulk of IOR, entire Arabian Sea, Bay of Bengal, the entire Indo-China Sea (some mistakenly call it as South China Sea), the entire East China, Yellow Seas and partly Sea of Japan.

Kartik · Post by **Kartik** » 05 May 2016 01:36

NEW DELHI — India’s Defense Research and Development Organization (DRDO) will work with state-run Bharat Dynamics Ltd. (BDL) to build a Quick Reaction Surface-to-Air Missile (QR-SAM) to secure the country’s skies from enemy aircraft and cruise missiles.

DRDO and BDL have signed a memorandum of understanding (MoU) on joint development and production of the indigenous QR-SAM. The missile will be designed and developed by DRDO and manufactured by BDL for the Indian military forces, according to the agreement.

The QR-SAM, with an expected range of 30 km (19 mi.), will have an advanced radio frequency seeker with multiple-target handling capability, a defense ministry official says. “It can be canister-launched,” the official adds.

The all-weather, tracked-chassis QR-SAM is needed by the armed forces for targets including aircraft at altitudes up to 9 km, missiles flying at up to 800 meters per second and low-flying targets that appear suddenly at close range.

The Indian army had placed orders for Rafael Spyder QR-SAMs from Israel, but the DRDO said they did not meet the army’s mobility requirements. India’s defense ministry officials granted permission for a global tender in September 2007.

The Indian army currently uses outdated Russian Soviet-era OSA-AK, Kvadrat, Shilka and Tunguska air-defense systems.

India already has developed the Akash medium-range SAM, which can be launched from static or mobile platforms to destroy multiple maneuvering targets such as UAVs, fighter aircraft, cruise missiles and missiles launched from helicopters. But while the Akash met the air defense requirements of the Indian army and air force, it can’t be installed on naval warships.

More recently, the army has been looking for a SAM capable of being launched within 6 sec.. It wants the new systems to have the ability to fire two missiles at a time and simultaneously guide them to their targets.

“The army wants its new systems to be highly mobile and capable of being moved on rail-based platforms, besides being mobile in desert and semi-desert terrain,” the defense ministry official says.

Subscription article from AW&ST.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 05 May 2016 08:17

the shourya is the readymade platform for the ASBM....but the details and technology of the mid course guidance, satellite based targeting sensors , terminal seeker, decoys and whether a hypersonic dart should separate from missile (Klub) or entire missile goes in (brahmos) all have to be worked out and fine tuned.

China has put up trios of naval hunter sats in close parallel orbits over the eastern oceans whose job seems to be radar and passive EM triangulation of naval assets. these are expected to provide the initial target co-ordinates even if all manned/unmanned surveillance assets are driven off station. any attack on these sats will attract retaliatory attacks from LEO upto GTO orbits on american military sats.

big dragon will show its full wrath in such a case.

Indranil · Post by **Indranil** » 05 May 2016 11:14

DRDL has floated a tender for Forgings for Rocket Motor for MP-ATGM.

The diameter of the thing is going to be 130mm (a little higher than CLGM's 120mm). They have asked for a hundred forgings each of the main motor and the launch motor.

Gyan · Post by **Gyan** » 05 May 2016 11:42

It seems that MP-ATGM may be more advanced then it is being let out. I think that Javelin also has 130mm diameter.

Gyan · Post by **Gyan** » 05 May 2016 12:41

Karan M wrote:
Avinash Chander: We are committed to setting up a detector production facility. Normal process of dialogue and tendering, taking approvals etc is currently underway. We are going to have a detector production facility for focal point arrays.

On the radio frequency (RF) seeker front also there is a major thrust. Right from the device i.e source of RF to the stabilization system, to the processing, we are starting a national mission kind of thing. Like we did when it came to developing control laws for the LCA. We have also set up a national mission for engines, for the 1500 HP engine. Now we are setting up a national mission for seekers by involving multiple agencies.

We are starting a national mission for seeker and we are confident in the next three years we'll have our own seekers in multiple spectral domains - X band, Ka-band etc.

One of the first thing Modi govt did was clear the FPA project per reports.

Can you share this report of India setting up FPA production line? As personally I think that FPA's for seekers and Thermal imagers are very very important and bureaucracy has been (intentionally??) hampering the effort to set up a manufacturing plant since 30 years on one pretext or another. Our limitation in night fighting capability has cost us dearly on numerous occasions.

jayasimha · Post by **jayasimha** » 06 May 2016 19:15

Hi All, I doubt this was posted here... ( may be deleted if it is re-post )

http://www.ibtimes.co.in/final-agni-v-c ... ial-669487

Indian defence research and development labs are gearing up for the canister test launch of
Agni-V missile, a nuclear-tipped surface-to-surface Inter-continental range Ballistic Missile
(ICBM) with a possible operational range of over 5,000 km, on March 15.
This could most likely be the last of the developmental trials for the most powerful Agni
series missile before being operationalised in 2017, the New Indian Express reported, citing
sources.
Moreover, the test launch could be witnessed by Prime Minister Narendra Modi and Defence
Minister Manohar Parrikar, following an invitation from the Defence Research and
Development Organisation (DRDO).
The test will be conducted from the missile testing facility in the Abdul Kalam Island (earlier
known as Wheeler Island).
India joined the U.S., Russia, the U.K., France and China, who boast ICBM
capabilities, when it tested its first Agni-V missile in 2012.
It is a three stage solid fuel missile that is capable of carrying 1.5 tonnes of nuclear warhead.
The report noted that Agni-V showcases advanced technologies such as ring laser gyroscope
and accelerometer for navigation and guidance.
It has a greater accuracy than its predecessors and the canister version brings flexibility to the
weapon system.
Agni-V is billed as India's answer to the Chinese DF-26 Intermediate Range Ballistic Missile
(IRBM).
Moreover, it can be equipped with multiple independently targetable re-entry vehicles
(MIRV), which can carry multiple warheads for different targets.
The report claimed that DRDO is also working on the integration of long-range missiles with
MIRV with six to ten warheads. Previously, a DRDO scientist was quoted as saying by the
New Indian Express that MIRVs are the "next focus."

http://www.newindianexpress.com/states/ ... 311245.ece

Agni-V Canister Version Ready to Roar into Sky
BALASORE: The Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO) is gearing up
for the canister version test of most potent surface-to-surface Inter-continental range Ballistic
Missile (ICBM) Agni-V. The longest range nuclear capable missile is likely to be test-fired
from a defence test facility off the Odisha coast on March 15.
Pre-launch preparations are on at Abdul Kalam Island (formerly Wheeler Island). The test
could be the missile’s last developmental trial and the outcome assumes significance as the
weapon system is likely to be operationalised next year.
Sources said the DRDO has invited Prime Minister Narendra Modi and Defence Minister
Manohar Parrikar to witness the missile launch.
While Agni-V is a complex system, its test from a canister makes it even more complicated
given the involvement of a variety of sophisticated and high-end tracking systems to capture
data for the full operational range. Since the first test of the missile in 2012, the missile has
undergone several upgradation. It has become more stable, fast reacting and agile with quick
response time.
A defence scientist associated with the missile development said the new canister-launcher
has been built uniquely so that the missile can respond within minutes of command. A gas
generator at the bottom of the canister pushes off the missile before its first stage is ignited
and missile roars into the sky.
The canister version makes any weapon system more flexible and fastens the mobility of a
huge system like Agni-V. The missile also can be launched from a truck-mounted canister.
The three-stage, 17-metre tall, two-metre wide Agni-V, weighing around 50 tonnes, is
capable of carrying a nuclear warhead of about 1.5 tonnes to a distance of more than 5,000
km. As it incorporates advanced technologies involving ring laser gyroscope and
accelerometer for navigation and guidance, its accuracy level is far higher than its three
earlier variants - Agni-I, Agni-II and Agni-III.
What makes the missile more effective and stealth is that it can be equipped with Multiple
Independently Targetable Re-entry Vehicles (MITRV) capable of delivering multiple
warheads at different targets at long distances. The DRDO is now working on integrating the
long range missiles with MITRV capable of incorporating six to 10 warheads.

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 06 May 2016 19:28

MOD PRess

Anti-Ballistic Missile System

The Defence Acquisition Council has in its meeting held on 17th December, 2015, accorded approval for purchase of S-400 LRSAM system (Triumf Missile System) alongwith associated equipment and missiles from Russia.

This information was given by Defence Minister Shri Manohar Parrikar in a written reply to Shri Raghav Lakhanpal in Lok Sabha today.

DM/NAMPI/RAJ
(Release ID :144968)

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 06 May 2016 19:31

MOD Press

Missiles based on indigenous techniques

Friday, 06 May 2016 Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO) has recently test fired the following indigenously developed missiles.

• Long Range Surface to Air Missile (LRSAM) with range of 70 km.

• Beyond Visual Range (BVR) Air-to-Air Missile, Astra with a range of 75 km.

• Medium Range Surface to Air Missile, Akash with a range of 25 km and Multi target handling capability.

• Supersonic Cruise Missile, BrahMos with a range of 290 km.

This information was given by Defence Minister Shri Manohar Parrikar in a written reply to Dr. Manoj Rajoria in Lok Sabha today.

DM/NAMPI/RAJ
(Release ID :144965)

Will · Post by **Will** » 06 May 2016 20:46

LRSAM indigenous?

Ashokk · Post by **Ashokk** » 08 May 2016 23:36

ICBM Agni-V Test Put on 'Hold' For Modi's US Visit By Hemant Kumar Rout

BHUBANESWAR: The much awaited experimental test of the canisterised version of India's most potent and long range nuclear capable missile Agni-V has reportedly been put on hold for the scheduled visit of Prime Minister Narendra Modi to the US on June 6.

According to reliable sources in the Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO), the purported last developmental trial of the indigenously built surface-to-surface Inter-Continental range Ballistic Missile (ICBM) would be conducted after the PM returns from the foreign visit.

Besides the joint session of the US Congress, the PM is slated to address the 41st Annual Leadership Summit in Washington DC to be attended by business tycoons and government leaders who are likely to debate over the deepening US-India commercial and strategic ties on June 7.

Although the missile is ready to display its fire power, defence sources said, the test has been delayed for over past six months for strategic reasons. Earlier planned in December last year and then early January, the test was reportedly postponed due to the visit of US President Barack Obama and busy schedule of Modi who was slated to witness the launch along with Defence Minister Manohar Parrikar.

A source on the condition of anonymity said while the Ministry of Defence (MoD) and Ministry of External Affairs (MEA) have already given the green signal for the test, the DRDO is yet to get any communication from the Prime Minister's Office (PMO).

“While the DRDO is waiting for the PM’s confirmation to witness the launch, the PMO is yet to give confirmation on the visit of the PM to the test facility. The test now completely depends on the schedule of the PMO,” the source claimed.

Although India secretly conducted two tests of submarine launched ballistic missile K-4 in March from under water platform in depressed range of less than 1,000 km, as the Agni-V, is in a ready state of induction, it would be fired from a hermetically sealed canister to its full range of around 5,000, km which is a threat for the powerful nations.

The delay has however irked the defence and strategic experts. They believed the decision at the highest levels of government was owing to Washington’s supposed allergy to rising powers displaying their distant strike capabilities.

An eminent national security expert and professor at New Delhi based Centre for Policy Research (CPR) Bharat Karnad said the last year's test was postponed not to upset Washington as Obama was to tour Delhi.

"Now it has been put on hold because Prime Minister does not want his upcoming visit to the US, the fourth in last two years since he took office, to be marred by the launch of a missile that President Obama may deem provocative. He seems more eager to please Washington than to strengthen India's strategic muscle vis a vis China," he observed.

member_23370 · Post by **member_23370** » 09 May 2016 00:21

Agni-5 is inducted because its canisterized? Then so is K-4 since ist already in the launch tubes. Personally I would have preferred if Modi did not accept the invitation to address the US congress especially in the lame duck period before the Nov elections.

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 09 May 2016 01:30

Will, the pulse motor and actuation are from India.

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 09 May 2016 01:49

Gyan
http://www.dailypioneer.com/todays-news ... ekers.html

Cosmo_R · Post by **Cosmo_R** » 09 May 2016 04:25

The HKR article ^^^. Why don't they just test and call it Agni III --show the same stock photos and be done with it. Later it can come out as all tested versions have.

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 09 May 2016 04:41

Cosmo_R, great idea. India is too legalistic and preachy preachy when it comes to sticking by some sort of fair play, truth onlee sort of stuff.
Idiocy.
If Modi had this tested before he visited, he would have come across a strong leader doing what is necessary and US would have taken him more seriously, than yet another chap visiting to Rome from the far provinces who need Rome.

ramdas · Post by **ramdas** » 09 May 2016 04:43

The HKR article ^^^: So much for Namo's nationalism. People voted overwhelmingly for a strong leadership with spine, and got a unkil stooge instead. After June, three months delay due to monsoon. Then another of Namo's western trips and so on...This is criminal negligence of national security. Maybe NaMo too intends a SoKo like status for Bharat so that private industries and Ambani like elements can make a monetary windfall servicing the masters. Shame on such backstabers. The BJP deserves to be utterly routed if it continues on this path.

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 09 May 2016 05:31

Ramdas, simple question.

I'd welcome Modi testing before he visited, but if he has a ton of economic items required to boost GOI funding, then I suspect he being the PM knows more than I do. That ties directly back to our economic and then military vulnerability.

If NaMo was an unkil stooge, he wouldn't be standing up to the tens of thousands of unkils NGOs and other shady orgs which were proliferating.

If he was a stooge and a backstabber, he would not be improving IA/IAF/IN serviceability by working out deals to get local production.

If he was a backstabber, why would DRDO's budget rise two times over two budgets?

All that has happened is a delay in tests so that khan's anti India elements can't do fear mongering and put NaMo on a spot while he goes and gets more FDI for Make in India, which reports indicate has boosted manufacturing and got more employment.

So, IMHO you are being unecessarily antagonistic towards a strong leader who is doing the best he can and by insisting BJP should be utterly routed, when they are playing a complex strategic game of iterative advancement, in a situation where the UPA left India literally heavily weakened on all fronts, conventional, strategic and economic.

Is Agni-5 BTW the make or break for our deterrence. The need of the hour should be to field more Agnis of any stripe and build up our conventional forces. Strengthening the economy is critical, because a happy populace will not fall prey to machinations or conversions which is what the EJ crowd want to break India.

We are clearly not SoKo and it would be great if we could be in terms of quality of living. The RSS/BJP are working to ensure the other aspect, of EJs and untrammelled conversion does not follow. Similarly, nothing the BJP Govt has done so far indicates they have agreed to any cap on strategic or conventional arms the way the SoKO guys have done.

In short, we are making our own path and doing so in steps, and unlike before the progress is viable in multiple areas because of which an occasional delay or trade off is acceptable.

China IMO will be more deterred by our conventional capabilities, strong economy, intereconomic linkages and finally enough strategic assets. Making a few Agni-5s and ignoring the rest will not work.

China can stand up to the world today, because it too worked with the US to do all the above, biding its time.

Did the Chinese call Deng-Xiaoping a stooge of the US? I doubt it.

In short, work with them on some things, push back on others, that's the nature of the game which Modi is playing, and I for one, am ok with a leader with the gall to do so.

Kashi · Post by **Kashi** » 09 May 2016 06:36

^^ Eloquently put Karan M.

ramdas · Post by **ramdas** » 09 May 2016 07:28

@karanM: Our conventional forces are not going to be deterrent to PRC in the foreseeable future. Nuclear deterrence along with a discrete jettisoning of NFU will alone cover up for our conventional weakness. Where I disagree is in the priority given to nuclear deterrence: you say it comes after the economy, conventional forces etc. Given our situation, credible nuke deterrence should be priority one. It is worth far more than any sovereignty eroding alliance with unkil. GDP growth etc come later. Even Deng had the luxury of going slow on military projects and focussing on the economy thanks to the thermonuclear arsenal and the DF-4/5 which were being tested in Mao's time and became operational in the early Deng years.

Moreover with PRC bulding up even on missile defences etc in the not too distant future, the old Agnis would not make the cut. Eventually, MIRVed ICBMs (operational in a 5-7 year timeframe from now) is what we would require. The Agni-V is a first step to that. The alternative is to be a U.S protectorate. To be turned into a bali ka bakra at the convenience of the U.S. If ``nationalist" (feeling let down to have to add such quotation marks) NaMo delays A-5 testing and induction for appeasing unkil not by a few weeks but by months (at least 6 at worst who knows ? with the monson being a ready excuse to postpone the test by some more months), where is the hope of getting a credibledeterrent vis a vis PRC ? All this strengthens the hand of the traitorous lobby out to turn us into a U.S ``ally". At this rate the A-5 will be inducted when it is obsolete, not because of DRDO's or the services' fault, but because ``nationalist NaMo" valued the west's goodwill and some FDI more than a credible deterrent. Someone more rooted in our past would never have let the nation down this way.

If this is the effect of Namo, it is just the UPA govt minus the scams. Even regarding the NGOs, he has slowly backtracked on the initial tough stance against Ford foundation. Now, if there is a dependence for security on the west rather than on our deterrent, it is but a matter of timebefore the NGOs get a free hand again. All this for some extra FDI...With MMS, it was clear that a corrupt extraconstitutional power called the shots. In this case, there is no spine or the priorities are simply wrong: a good business friendly chief minister may not have it in him to protect national interest at the prime ministerial level.

As of now, Namo's nationalist credentials are beginning to look like a joke.

uddu · Post by **uddu** » 09 May 2016 07:41

Similar joke was there few weeks before, stating that SLBM test was put on hold. Such news will come and go. Missiles will keep flying too.
What you said about India lacking in conventional strength is correct and is known and the solution is similar to what you mentioned. You can watch the video

ramdas · Post by **ramdas** » 09 May 2016 07:48

@uddu: The SLBM test was also conduced to minimum range or something close. That is some distance away from operationalization. The Agni-V is closer to being operationalized, but faces this kind of political red light. As for AD's answer, GoI must show its intention towalk the talk by showing commitment to a credible deterrent. This cannot be done if A-5 testing is delayed so that Ombaba gets a feelgood factor. Along with this the talk of LEMOA/CISMOA etc. The BJP has its hefty share of western stooges who are powerful.

uddu · Post by **uddu** » 09 May 2016 08:05

We are guessing on our part. Article, gossip etc can come in newspaper. What if the A5 test happen when PM Modi is giving his speech in the U.S?

durvasa · Post by **durvasa** » 09 May 2016 08:07

Assuming that Namo is not doing anything else as "This is the effect of Namo, it is just the UPA govt minus the scams." does this mean it deserves to be utterly routed and brought back UPA-3? So Namo's nationalist credentials have become a joke .....as against .. Rahul, Nitishwa, Kejriwal, Sonya, MMS...??? You only have that many real options, unless you want to add Kanhaiyya Kumar and other Azadi gangs!

Forget what else Namo does or not, just what you said about 'minus the scam' is enough proof of his nationalism for him to be a deserving PM for decades.

ramdas · Post by **ramdas** » 09 May 2016 08:18

@uddu: If the A5 test happens in the next six weeks, and it becomes clear that there shall be no LEMOA/CISMOA, I would happily eat my words.

@durvasa: the Maino crowd is worse than the BJP. Regional parties ? depends. The sad thing is that there is nothing like the 1990s BJP to haul a govt on the coals for things like A-5 slowdown etc. Today's BJP is like the pre-maino Cong. Today's Cong is on the verge of becoming a full fledged antinational outfit....

If the best option neglects the strategic deterrent, desperately seeks an alliance with the west (none of the allies that are in Khan's harem have the ability to defend themselves) etc, it is a matter of time before the state findsits sovereignty severely constricted.

vera_k · Post by **vera_k** » 09 May 2016 09:26

I say the research establishment and users should be able to test when they feel like it. Waiting for the strongman to give the okay and all is so much like North Korea.

But perhaps the scientists want the PM to pay attention as there would be career rewards associated with it?