Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby Sicanta » 10 Nov 2016 02:23

Contempt liberals show for anyone who does not agree with their ideology is disgusting

https://twitter.com/ask0704/status/796447298612056065

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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby brar_w » 10 Nov 2016 02:25

I think the entire electoral college vs popular vote debate is actually normal given given that one party lost just a few hours ago. I've seen the same on the other side when it comes how the EV are weighed among states from republicans. In the long run it helps bring the president closer to the political leanings of most of the states in a union of states. The mere fact that a Democrat or a Republican has to win swing states that by their very definition swing over every now and then points to the fact that you won't ever get as liberal a president as someone that only has to drive votes out in CA, WA, NY, MD, VE etc nor as conservative as someone that only has to drive votes out in AL, TX, MS etc. This is a good thing. It keeps the policy closer to the median of the states. In the long run, once emotions are overcome most will agree to this. We don't elect president's we let the Electoral college do it.

Now to this election. As someone who voted for neither of the two candidates, and clearly and still openly has a greater dislike for one of them (Trump), I must say that the way things have turned out is actually amongst the top few scenarios that could have played out last night if Trump was to win. This shard power between the GOP and its nominee is actually going to propel us out of the 6 years of gridlock where the two branches of government have done absolutely nothing together. Patch work legislation kept the wheels turning over the last 6 years and this will most definitely change and hopefully give the people a taste of what not having gridlock looks like so that they seek it in the future. This is a good thing even if you support a progressive agenda sine it gives you something to reference and fight against as opposed to elitist controlled gridlock where only a small subset of the population that could game the system benefited.

Broader systemic issues remain with both the parties and they have largely been broken and won't look the same in the near future. The Democratic party has to introspect and learn to become an opposition party. They need to resist their natural tendency to go extreme left when confronted with massive losses. The Republicans now don't have a punching bag that they were great at hammering for 8 years. Now they actually have to work together and get things done since its a clear mandate across the two houses and WH. They must overcome internal divide to push their conservative agenda or perish. The tea party in a matter of weeks will loose their target and Ryan must manage them from derailing whatever agenda he and Trump work out. Trump isn't going to be a roadblock anymore and he can't get elected unless he pushes the GOP agenda with the help of the senate and congress and vice-versa.

The type of folks that get screwed are those that bought into Trump's populist portion of rhetoric, both economic and concerning foreign policy. The GOP's position on entitlement reform is crystal clear and now they have the mandate to put into action. If you wanted to preserve the social-net a status quo or rather expand it, Bernie was your candidate since even HRC was more pragmatic even though Sanders/Warren camp pulled her to the left of the position she would have otherwise adopted. What you get with a GOP dominant government is low-tax rate, lower-business tax rate, entitlement reform, higher defense spending and lower regulations. If you are in business or plan to start one it will be of great help. I personally know of folks that passed on entrepreneurship opportunities due to regulations and what they would have to spend to meet each and every one of the one's that Obama created.

I also don't understand why folks always have an urge to move to Canada. Just move to California..the weather is better and now you have marijuana to keep you busy :)
Last edited by brar_w on 10 Nov 2016 02:42, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby IndraD » 10 Nov 2016 02:41

Baffling to see left liberals wailing and whining on twitter because their candidate did not win. If you want to see intolerance visit #TrumpPresident !

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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby IndraD » 10 Nov 2016 02:42

SputnikVerified account
‏@SputnikInt
US establishment to restrain @realDonaldTrump from enforcing radical proposals - lawmaker http://sptnkne.ws/cDWK

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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby brar_w » 10 Nov 2016 02:44

IndraD wrote:SputnikVerified account
‏@SputnikInt
US establishment to restrain @realDonaldTrump from enforcing radical proposals - lawmaker http://sptnkne.ws/cDWK


They're called checks and balances. His team along with the RNC forged a common party platform and the various branches will be a check on either side attempting to run towards a different direction. Unless you want to find yourself in a place of getting into a political gird lock within your own party, you better hit the shared agenda from day-1..So don't be too quick to expect a government/President that combines the policies of a Bernie Sanders and a Ted Cruz as you'd expect if you heard what he was promising.
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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby IndraD » 10 Nov 2016 02:48

https://twitter.com/madelineele/status/ ... 5610095617

US flag burnt in protest against Trump

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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby Atmavik » 10 Nov 2016 02:49

first the disclosure : I voted for Chillary in our poll.

The Bile and vitriol one heard from hillary supporters the moment someone said trump can only be matched by the stupidity of their arguments. CNN led the way. this serves them right.

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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby IndraD » 10 Nov 2016 02:59

Thousands of students at Berkeley High School in CA walked out of class with their teachers, to say that he is not their president.

Image

narcissist https://twitter.com/HillaryClinton/stat ... 9015376902

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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby anupmisra » 10 Nov 2016 03:02

IndraD wrote:https://twitter.com/madelineele/status/796433555610095617

US flag burnt in protest against Trump


Millennials. Steeped in the ideals of liberty, freedom of thought/speech, and justice until they have to conform to those very ideals. Then, its my way or the...wait...where's the highway?

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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby brar_w » 10 Nov 2016 03:05

Millennial are fully capable of burning the US flag if Whole foods runs out of Organic bananas..

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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby Rudradev » 10 Nov 2016 03:09

hnair wrote:That said, where those peeps who said "Trump was planted by Bill-Hill, she wins for sure"?

That would be me! Major glass of gau mutra over here, pliss :(( :mrgreen: :rotfl:

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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby IndraD » 10 Nov 2016 03:12

Sob stories of 'I am a muslim , I am being harassed' being circulated https://twitter.com/snobers/status/796456606624006144
this is classic Brexit redux when left liberals went bonkers.

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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby Sicanta » 10 Nov 2016 03:14

It is like we are watching a movie re-run. These chaps are the same everywhere. One strike against their high palace and suddenly it's end of the world. It was London seceding then and now we have talks about California.
Last edited by Sicanta on 10 Nov 2016 03:16, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby ramana » 10 Nov 2016 03:15

LokeshC wrote:I think I have also come to believe that there is indeed a "deep state", not such a tin-foil thing anymore.

I think the true wild-card in this election was Bernie, he was a deep-state outsider and the deep-state could not game him properly and had to get him eliminated from the race. If the deep-state was not ok with Trump, they would have figured out a way to take care of him as well.

Now for the tin-foil hat (CT):
HRC was the real winner deep state wanted, they roped in DT to eliminate the Republican wild-cards and misfortunately the whole thing backfired. But they must have a plan B for the case where DT becomes brezident.

The only issue with that CT is this:
DTs policies (as someone noted above) are very similar to those of Bernie and that would only serve to divide away HRC votes. Someone did miscalculate somewhere, that person maybe getting his or her 72/retirement package now.


Foisted on own petard.

Some think Bill Clinton was the author of this strategy.

They say he was in tears today at HRC concession speech.

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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby ramana » 10 Nov 2016 03:21

People asked about Indian American voters.

There are ~4.5M Indian Americans. About 1 M will vote for various reasons.
Per PEW of these 93 % are for Democratic Party.
Rest are for Republicans

In my limited knowledge these 93% are
- old time baby boomers who immigrated in the 60s-80s and have fond memories of JFK, LBJ etc.
- Lefties and Commies who made it acorss the seven seas and proclaim how they will change society back in India
- And a few fat cat rich/I bankers are also Democrats to get influence.

(BTW all these above hate/don't support NaMo)

And idealistic young people who have been indoctrinated in liberal colleges.

In 80s a miniscule(7%) turned Republican during Reagan years.

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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby IndraD » 10 Nov 2016 03:25

Out of curiosity do the elected candidate gets hi fi security straight way with special agents, drones over, gizmos, bulldozer type car etc..?

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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby UlanBatori » 10 Nov 2016 03:28

IndraD wrote:Thousands of students at Berkeley High School in CA walked out of class with their teachers, to say that he is not their president.

Duh! Everyone knows that "their" President is located a bit far away.

Wasn't it HiC that made so much noise about Trump not declaring that he would accept the election result no matter how obviously fraudulent? Now that the shoe is up their musharrafs the same rule does not apply to the HiCfans.

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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby brar_w » 10 Nov 2016 03:30

Ramana interestingly I know a few very recent immigrants that you could easily put in the Bernie Sanders camp but that are die hard NaMo supporters. I've always assumed it was because they grew up in Congress dominant states in India and generally hated the party or that they thought being a liberal progressive was just fashionable with the type of people they hang out with.

Out of curiosity do the elected candidate gets hi fi security straight way with special agents, drones over, gizmos, bulldozer type car etc..?


Both major party nominees receive secret service protection as soon as it becomes clear that they are going to be their party nominees. Both have had it for a while.

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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby UlanBatori » 10 Nov 2016 03:33

IndraD wrote:Out of curiosity do the elected candidate gets hi fi security straight way with special agents, drones over, gizmos, bulldozer type car etc..?

He already had Black Cats/Z Security for many months, at least since the Convention. Most likely assassins are the fans of losing candidates, so post-Convention is the really hi-risk time (Robert Kennedy).
Next high-risk time is start of second term (Lincoln, Garfield, McKinley, John Kennedy and attempt on Ronald Reagan).

You missed the biggest security: snipers on all rooftops and highway overpasses. Probably armed with Stingers as well.

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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby UlanBatori » 10 Nov 2016 03:51

All you ppl writing long :(( starting with "I didn't vote for Trump because...." I have just one thing to say: :rotfl:

U have to do ur homework BEFORE you vote, if u want to be "In Tune With the HeartBeat of America" and strut around feeling so. My 6th coujin thrice removed did. EV'ed DT and the local KKK/Hitler Jugend candidates 2 weeks b4 the election. All won. Q.E.D.
Only remaining issue is whether all the taxes that he voted down, crashed. TSPLOST, PSPLORET, all scams.

But hey! It was great fun reading all the long rants of the HiCFans. Sorree onlee, I really feel 4 u (4 a microsecond b4 I go back to :rotfl: ) You choose a biss-boor candidate. In the end it was sheer "By The Grace of ATM" that DT won despite being 0.2% behind in the total popular vote.

Satyam Eva Jayate. Not that the Hitler Jugend would recognize Satyam, but the hyena HiC thoroughly deserved that LossDespite0.2%Win result, after what she did to poor Bernie Sanders. Now she has all the rest of her life to relive every moment of that. So close, yet sooooooo far. She should have been more honest during the Debates.

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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby pankajs » 10 Nov 2016 03:54

Entitlement of the liberals!

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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby A_Gupta » 10 Nov 2016 03:58

Good article, a little old.
http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2016/ ... ist-revolt

Today, Frisbie is part of the “white working class.” At first, the term sounds more neutral than its predecessors—a category suitable for pollsters and economists (who generally define “working class” as lacking a college degree). But the phrase is vexing. The blunt racial modifier, buried or implied in earlier versions, declares itself up front. Without the adjective “white,” the term is meaningless as a predictor of group thinking and behavior; but without the noun “working class” it misses the other key demographic. “White working class” mixes race and class into a volatile compound, privilege and disadvantage crammed into a single phrase.

“Working class,” meanwhile, has become a euphemism. It once suggested productivity and sturdiness. Now it means downwardly mobile, poor, even pathological. A significant part of the W.W.C. has succumbed to the ills that used to be associated with the black urban “underclass”: intergenerational poverty, welfare, debt, bankruptcy, out-of-wedlock births, trash entertainment, addiction, jail, social distrust, political cynicism, bad health, unhappiness, early death. The heartland towns that abandoned the Democrats in the eighties to bask in Ronald Reagan’s morning sunlight; the communities that Sarah Palin, on a 2008 campaign stop in Greensboro, North Carolina, called “the best of America . . . the real America”—those places were hollowing out, and politicians didn’t seem to notice. A great inversion occurred. The dangerous, depraved cities gradually became safe for clean-living professional families who happily paid thousands of dollars to prep their kids for the gifted-and-talented test, while the region surrounding Greensboro lost tobacco, textiles, and furniture-making, in a rapid collapse around the turn of the millennium, so that Oxycontin and disability and home invasions had taken root by the time Palin saluted those towns, in remarks that were a generation out of date.


Americans like Mark Frisbie have no foundation to stand on; they’re unorganized, unheard, unspoken for. They sink alone. The institutions of a healthy democracy—government, corporation, school, bank, union, church, civic group, media organization—feel remote and false, geared for the benefit of those who run them. And no institution is guiltier of this abandonment than the political parties.

So it shouldn’t have come as a complete surprise when millions of Americans were suddenly drawn to a crass strongman who tossed out fraudulent promises and gave institutions and élites the middle finger. The fact that so many informed, sophisticated Americans failed to see Donald Trump coming, and then kept writing him off, is itself a sign of a democracy in which no center holds. Most of his critics are too reasonable to fathom his fury-driven campaign. Many don’t know a single Trump supporter. But to fight Trump you have to understand his appeal.

Trump’s core voters are revealed by poll after poll to be members of the W.W.C. His campaign has made them a self-conscious identity group. They’re one among many factions in the country today—their mutual suspicions flaring, the boundaries between them hardening. A disaster on this scale belongs to no single set of Americans, and it will play out long after the November election, regardless of the outcome. Trump represents the whole country’s failure.

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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby A_Gupta » 10 Nov 2016 04:01

^^^
Instead of speaking for the working class, the Clintons spoke about equipping workers to rise into the professional class. Their presumption was that all Americans could be like them.



Earlier this year, an economist named Branko Milanović published a book called “Global Inequality: A New Approach for the Age of Globalization.” It’s a progress report on the “system” that Friedman heralded. Milanović analyzes global economic data from the past quarter century and concludes that the world has become more equal—poor countries catching up with rich ones—but that Western democracies have become less equal. Globalization’s biggest winners are the new Asian middle and upper classes, and the one-per-centers of the West: these groups have almost doubled their real incomes since the late eighties. The biggest losers are the American and European working and middle classes—until very recently, their incomes hardly budged.

During these years, resistance to globalization has migrated from anarchists disrupting trade conferences to members of the vast middle classes of the West. Many of them have become Trump supporters, Brexit voters, constituents of Marine Le Pen and other European proto-fascists. After a generation of globalization, they’re trying to derail the train.


In July, I went to see Summers at his vacation home in Massachusetts. When I arrived, he had just pulled up—in a Lexus—after a morning of tennis. We sat on a terrace overlooking Cape Cod Bay. Summers described numerous trips that he had made during his years at Treasury to review antipoverty programs in Africa and Latin America, and in American inner cities. “I don’t think I ever went to Akron, or Flint, or Toledo, or Youngstown,” he admitted. To Democratic policymakers, poverty was foreign or it was black. As for displaced white workers in the Rust Belt, Summers said, “their problems weren’t heavily on our radar screen, and they were mad that their problems weren’t.”

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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby A_Gupta » 10 Nov 2016 04:24

^^^
Clinton, addressing a fund-raising dinner on Wall Street in September, placed “half” of Trump’s supporters in what she called “the basket of deplorables”—bigots of various types. The other half, she said, are struggling and deserve empathy. Under criticism, she half-apologized, saying that she had counted too many supporters as “deplorables.” Accurate or not, her remarks rivalled Obama’s “guns and religion” and Romney’s “forty-seven per cent” for unwise campaign condescension. All three politicians thought that they were speaking among friends—that is, in front of wealthy donors, the only setting on the campaign trail where truth comes out.

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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby Dipanker » 10 Nov 2016 04:34

UlanBatori wrote:
IndraD wrote:Out of curiosity do the elected candidate gets hi fi security straight way with special agents, drones over, gizmos, bulldozer type car etc..?

He already had Black Cats/Z Security for many months, at least since the Convention. Most likely assassins are the fans of losing candidates, so post-Convention is the really hi-risk time (Robert Kennedy).
Next high-risk time is start of second term (Lincoln, Garfield, McKinley, John Kennedy and attempt on Ronald Reagan).

You missed the biggest security: snipers on all rooftops and highway overpasses. Probably armed with Stingers as well.


Nitpick:

JFK was killed during his first term in 1963.
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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby Dipanker » 10 Nov 2016 04:50

anupmisra wrote:Several Indian Americans won their races. Lets celebrate them as well.

1. Kamala Harris
2. Ro Khanna


3. Raja Krishnamurthy to house from IL.

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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby vera_k » 10 Nov 2016 04:56

4. Pramila Jayapal

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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby ramana » 10 Nov 2016 05:30

One thing I am disappointed is the vituperative comments on this forum itself (also reflected in larger society) against Trump supporters. And very few admitted they were wrong to do this.

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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby MurthyB » 10 Nov 2016 05:30

Pramila Jayapal is a social justice warrior who founded "safe zones" for "people of color" (read Muslims) after 9/11, and fought the Bush administration on deporting Somalis.

Jayapal actually attended Modi’s speech to the US Congress this summer as the guest of US Senator Patty Murray. “I went to hear what he had to say and I thought he did a good job,” she says, of that experience. But, questions linger in her mind: “In his speech in Congress, which I attended, he said many of the right things, but it’s a question of when something happens, can we count on the government to really protect religious minorities and I think we’re going to have to continue to push and make sure that’s the case. :roll: At the same time, we have to do that here in the United States as well.”


A "blow-to-Modi" types:

https://twitter.com/pramilajayapal/stat ... 2449689600

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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby ramana » 10 Nov 2016 05:34

Another thing is in US classrooms today from high schools to Utys there is deep blue funk and lots o anxiety among students who had hoped for HRC win. Many classes were sent home and counseling is going on.
This is serious not a joke.

We saw on HRC campaign headquarters lots of crying and long faces in TV networks.

The reasons for why HR didn't come out and end it last night are not clear for it prolonged the agony for the true believers.

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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby Primus » 10 Nov 2016 05:44

MurthyB wrote:Pramila Jayapal is a social justice warrior who founded "safe zones" for "people of color" (read Muslims) after 9/11, and fought the Bush administration on deporting Somalis.


And the Somalis returned the favor by joining ISIS.

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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby anupmisra » 10 Nov 2016 05:55

Thanks all. Summarizing:

1. Senator Kamala Harris, California
2. Congressman Ro Khanna, California
3. Congressman Raja Krishnamurthi, Chicago
4. Congresswoman Pramila Jayapal, Washington
5. Congressman Ami Bera, California

Here are the ones who did not win:

Peter Jacob (New Jersey) and Anil Kumar (Michigan)

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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby ramana » 10 Nov 2016 06:04

Talking to friends and looking at election results map it was more a defeat of Democrats southern Democratic Leadership Council (DLC) strategy than DT win.
After the massive loss in 1988, Democrats under Bill Clinton created the Southern strategy which is they would run a governor from the Southern Democrat states and thus would capture the South along with the West and North East to win the White house. This worked till 2000 when the Republicans fielded Bush who was Governor of Texas. It failed so badly that Gore didn't even get Tennessee his own home state. The strategy should have been abandoned and reworked. However it was not as HRC became a Senator from New York and kept the strategy going. Obama came in 2008 and got the Southern votes due to historic reasons. And its rich to think that Democrats will again win the South without any real roots. Tim Kaine was more like just south of Mason Dixon line which runs through Maryland and thus didn't contribute much!

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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby ramana » 10 Nov 2016 06:07

WaPo article on Democrats day after

Democrats have no leader or direction

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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby Raja Bose » 10 Nov 2016 06:18

ramana wrote:One thing I am disappointed is the vituperative comments on this forum itself (also reflected in larger society) against Trump supporters. And very few admitted they were wrong to do this.


Where is hkumar? His behavior was especially malodorous.

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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby Raja Bose » 10 Nov 2016 06:21

Ulan Batori ji, I voted for the Trumpanzee despite knowing that my vote would have as much effect as a sparrow fart in people's republic of California.

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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby UlanBatori » 10 Nov 2016 06:31

All these should be viewed as rather lame excuses. Note that the Republicans had very obligingly shot themselves in the musharraf. 2 weeks b4 the General Election, the Elephant Party leadership had COMPLETELY abandoned their candidate, even the VP was going around with a grocery bag over his head. It looked like a total meltdown, the entire COTUS looked like turning blue. The only "turnaround" was that Ms. Conway confiscated the Zee's Twitter account, and forced him to read from a teleprompter and get Teacher's permission even to speak to reporters. And the old dictum came to the rescue: the voters' attention span is .ngt. 1 week. So I would say that the Democrats would have been swept completely off the map, if the Republican Party had stayed on message, and closed ranks behind their lawfully elected leadership team: TrumPenZ. Again, this was by the grace of ATM. Otherwise today we would be looking at a COTUS with 400 elephants in the House and 75 in the Senate - a Constituent Assembly, able to ban Abortion, enforce fundamentalist Prayer in Schools, etc etc.

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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby KJo » 10 Nov 2016 06:43

I was on text with my 2 Afghan Muslim friends. They are both angry and distressed. Sending me images and other things about how DT sucks and equating him to KKK. I think Muslims are now afraid.
Whatever it is, he got elected legally in a democracy. People voted for him. Muslims seem to expect people to welcome them in non-Muslim countries, but look the other way in demanding this in Islamic countries.

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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby UlanBatori » 10 Nov 2016 06:45

Raja Bose wrote:Ulan Batori ji, I voted for the Trumpanzee despite knowing that my vote would have as much effect as a sparrow fart in people's republic of California.

Hope that memory does not come back to haunt us as we line up for soup at the concentration camps for Undesirables. I think Adolf won the election on the promise of
Make Yankeestan Hun-istan Great(est) Again

IOW,
Deutschland Uber Alles!


Reading the Foreign Policy manifesto, it's clear that it was written by Victoria Neuland & Co. Little hope unless DT actually sweeps away the upper and mid levels of Foggy Bottom - and then whom is he going to bring in? The Miss Universe contestant pool plus the Mafia management of the Trump Taj Mahal Atlantic City?

(time to switch back to being 400% anti-Establishment - and right now the Establishment is DT&Co. )

vina
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Re: Understanding the United States of America (USA) - III

Postby vina » 10 Nov 2016 06:55

Cant believe it. SCHMUCK CHOOMER is now the top ranging Democratic Senator and the house minority leader ! The Dems have been decimated!


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