Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Marten · Post by **Marten** » 18 Dec 2016 23:24

Buzz in our area by small vendors who are daily visitors to the bank is that smaller denominations will finally come. Laundry chap, who we call Iron-man, has been the most sanguine despite being most affected. He has offered credit to everyone who has difficulty paying him. I gave him 400 extra to tide him over. Came back this evening and asked if i wanted change for 2/4k. That was because most folks were paying him now because of the rumor (which he may ave actually spread). hahaha

They need to push in more 50s and 500s. I'd be happy carrying 500 as backup kharcha and a couple of hundreds in change (to ensure anyone not accepting online payment is not inconvenienced). However, all said, no shop gave me change today. Everyone offered to give it tomorrow or Wed. Which is fine.
PS: Verma saab, every peaceful friend of mine has been against demo, without a single exception. Even the finest education is apparently not enough to wipe out these biases (some chaps from prev workplaces are ivy leaguers).

Akshay Kapoor · Post by **Akshay Kapoor** » 18 Dec 2016 23:55

^ and the couple of ex fauji peacefuls I know are all for Demo. Just shows the depth of the bias due to this religion and that one of the very few ways to combat it is the fauj.

OT - but we need military service for all IAS/IPS and a lot of politicos. If that happens (like in US where its part of the culture and several ex military presidents, Cabinet Ministers, NSA (almost all)) a large number of our problems will be solved.

disha · Post by **disha** » 19 Dec 2016 00:00

^There has been shortage of 100s and 50s because of hoarding. Lot of Habal types habal'ed the small denominations and came and talked about the takleef given to the "small man" because of Modi's Demo.

The thing with small notes is you cannot forever hold on to it., with even a slightest rumors of 'new notes' in the market., everybody on the fence starts putting the small notes back into circulation and the people who hold on to it become islands. In the meantime several would have moved on to e-cash and some of them will not go back to cash.

disha · Post by **disha** » 19 Dec 2016 00:29

KarthikSan wrote:Saars, what is the ground situation in Bengaluru, Kerala? An ex-classmate mohtarma has been screaming end of the world and how yeevil Modi is not allowing her to access her money in the bank. She is claiming that the 24K is not enough to pay maid, carwasher, milkman ityadi and no ATMs have money. Apparently, the poor kirana storewala in her apt complex is on the verge of soosai as no one is buying from him due to cash crunch.
Point to note: She is of the RoL kind.

Let her know that evil Modi has put '666' - the mark of the devil on Rs. 2000 and Rs. 500 notes and she should not be using them and use only e-cash using RuPay cards.

For example on Rs. 2000 notes: there are 6 bars on the left. The first 6. Second it was introduced in 2016 - the last digit is 6. Also 2+0+1+6 = 9 which is 3x3. And 3+3 is 6. There are several signs within the notes like the serial number is 6 digit long. Another 6. Also the number of times the metal strip is visible is 6. So many signs of 666 that only evil modi could come up with such a scheme.

Hence not just she should use cashless option., also let your know that only Hindus are superstitious and RoL are the rational kind and hence only they will be able to identify such signs.

Cain Marko · Post by **Cain Marko** » 19 Dec 2016 00:42

I'd put this in the achievement thread but I just love monkey bath! Watch the video.

http://www.aljazeera.com/programmes/lis ... 12393.html

negi · Post by **negi** » 19 Dec 2016 00:47

UP and Bihar are badly affected it's total cash based economy here even in Doon even hotels and restaurants insist on cash the radiology centre here did not even have a ATM machine , all this in middle of fat north wedding season meant banks were busy hoarding money for rich or their relatives, Bangalore is a first world in comparison I withdrew 25 k on 28th November from HDFC at beml gate. Here even today banks are not giving so much money they claim they don't have enough cash something is really ****** up here in north, people are unruly too .

disha · Post by **disha** » 19 Dec 2016 01:07

KarthikSan wrote:They are dealing in cash to the extent of 15L per month because they have "field workers" ... She got an earful from even the usual bystanders on how she is part of the black money and corruption and that she needs to go cashless

Brand that motor-ham

., she is the cog in the wheel that makes the BM and corruption in the society move around. On top of it she is racist anti-Hindu. She herself does not understand it., but has been since she birth she is growing up on a stable of suttee and child-marriage and trained to call everything Hindu as backward.

So a 'Hindu Nationalist' leader tries to clean up the system and your classmate motor-ham has to go hammer and tongs against it because a. She is racist anti-Hindu and b. she is corrupt and let her know that because of a.) and b.) she is on the wrong side of the history supporting corruption and black money. Let her not live this down.

^^Note one of the hallmark of being liberal is to challenge current assumptions., and in this sense you are being liberal and open-minded objective.

Dasari · Post by **Dasari** » 19 Dec 2016 02:11

Surprisingly not many cases of cash seize in UP where I expect lot of black money. Is ED/IT afraid to touch SP assets? Since UP would be the last state to adopt cashless transactions, we expect lot of cash transactions. The eerie silence indicates something seriously wrong.

Rishi Verma · Post by **Rishi Verma** » 19 Dec 2016 04:42

Summary of this Week's Raids Across the Country

Includes 12L in new currency along with 1kg of drugs from Amritsar....hope more such nexii will be identified and persued.

I guess the GPS chip is working.

sum · Post by **sum** » 19 Dec 2016 05:55

I met an old classmate of SHQ and her husband a few weeks ago, visiting from India. He was furious at the 'poor implementation' of the DeMo scheme, gradually shifted to saying 'Modi talks great while abroad but while in India he talks shit'.

Seems to be a standard template which is programmed every week with the new "thing to talk about" theme.

Heard the exact same story from many in my group who are "neutral" ( but we know whom they support going by their frequent FB posts/Watsapp messages etc). Seems all these guys are programmed with the same thing every weekend so that they can syncronise for the next week

kapilrdave · Post by **kapilrdave** » 19 Dec 2016 11:51

I know so many people around me who never stood in lines in the banks in last 40 days and yet doing absolutely fine. Many of them are poors who are 'supposed to be' suffering.

Yagnasri · Post by **Yagnasri** » 19 Dec 2016 12:05

In respect of UP, Punjab and Haryana BM cash is not being there, the politicos there have already invested properties, Sahara types. At least one of such entities is under investigation. It is having assets worth 1.5 Lac Cr. So no cash all properties there. It is not Sahara of course. Another one. I had a misfortune of representing them for my company.

Hari Seldon · Post by **Hari Seldon** » 19 Dec 2016 12:23

What is the outrage of the day, folks?

wig · Post by **wig** » 19 Dec 2016 12:30

http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/new ... 060026.cms

Old note deposits in banks to be allowed only once till December 30 if it exceeds Rs 5,000

Deposits of old Rs 500 and Rs 1,000 notes worth more than Rs 5,000 into bank accounts can be made only once till December 30.

The government has announced fresh restrictions on deposits to check laundering of unaccounted cash using bank accounts.

"Large deposits cannot be made multiple times in bank accounts. People can deposit up to Rs 5,000 on which there is no restriction," a senior finance ministry official told ET.

habal · Post by **habal** » 19 Dec 2016 12:33

disha wrote:^There has been shortage of 100s and 50s because of hoarding. Lot of Habal types habal'ed the small denominations and came and talked about the takleef given to the "small man" because of Modi's Demo.

past week this habal type has spent cash like anything. My main problem with ₹500 note is that often I confuse it for ₹10 note. As I have often said, for non-veggies an avg restaurant bill comes to 350-500. Last week I gave brand new 10X50 notes to a nepali boy at a kabab shop, should have seen the excitement on his face. I ran out of 500s last week & am using cards for petrol, diesel, shopping. Last time I paid by card to shopperstop for ₹2750, I got a msg in my mobile after half an hour.

"Shunu Kumar has got 75 reward points for your purchase at *****" ? Looks like some counter clerk encashed points with my purchase. This never happened earlier. When everyone starts using card, the crooks just get cleverer.

Neela · Post by **Neela** » 19 Dec 2016 12:44

sum wrote: Seems to be a standard template which is programmed every week with the new "thing to talk about" theme.

Heard the exact same story from many in my group who are "neutral" ( but we know whom they support going by their frequent FB posts/Watsapp messages etc). Seems all these guys are programmed with the same thing every weekend so that they can syncronise for the next week

Interesting thing you say here. Just 2 days back, was thinking there is a weekly pattern here. From 2 diff whatsapp groups, Ive noticed particularly RoL-ers passing on the same messages especially on Saturdays and Sundays.
MOstly memes . But some of them are borderline nasty.
Seems to be some organised stuff from their "Praise The Lord" whatsapp group.

And one neednt search far anyway. Our own Russkie-maal peddler and a poster called Chacko ( banned now but from FB he is gone positively obnoxious) - gone down the cuckoo road.

habal · Post by **habal** » 19 Dec 2016 13:03

facebook, twitter & whatsapp have mostly RoL and RoP and some AAPiya or commie type bashing demonitisation. So effectively this move has for sure divided the country along religious lines. It is something that shouldn't have happened, but it has.

the reason for that is not really demonitisation but fear of loss of political leverage. With cash bank of old UPA/JD/SP mostly invalidated, political playing field is now scary for the 'old-guard' in these parties. It is so difficult for them to make a comeback because this 'old guard' does not enjoy unbridled following in their own party. Most followers loyalty is conditional to top gun's ability to dispense cash and favors.

this fear has now percolated down to RoL & RoP. Though RoP types knew from very first moment that this move was aimed against their cash-based economy, rest woke up a bit later onto various implications. In Cong, Sonia & Rahul & acolytes have strangulated genuine leadership like Scindia, Pilot, PVNR, Seetaram Kesri et al and have manufactured consensus via HC and they are now deathly afraid that old gremlins will come home. Mismanaging party democracy by foisting RG at top will destroy their message at election time. It is too late for them to change course now. So there is panic amongst their apologists, it is genuine panic because they are not winning.

jamwal · Post by **jamwal** » 19 Dec 2016 13:32

Expecting RoPers to be supportive of anything done by non-sickular govt is stupidity. We have completely different ideologies and interests. Followers of RoP don't care about India, it is at best a random non-rop place to live for them and non-ropers are sub-human heathens worthy of scorn and massacre as soon as conditions are favourable. RoL is not as idiotic, but close. Sooner we realise that the secularism, equality of religions and respect for ALL faiths is just stupidity, better are the chances of our survival. Some ideologies like this one just don't belong in a multi-cultural, tolerant society. Before anyone tries to point out the irony, Intolerance like the one displayed by RoP is not tolerable in an true secular and liberal society.

I have a few non-rop secular, dhimmi people in my social circles, a bit of Monkey Asha, Dargah, sajda, shared biryani types who have absolutely lost their shit. One idiot is a kashmiri hindu with a Stockholm Complex. Keeps on broadcasting every single bit of anti-Demon news all the time, atleast 3-4 every single day. Many of those turn out to be wrong which he quietly removes later. Claims that he hates AAP, CONgress and voted for BJP. Now he has all rights to criticise BJP by quoting MS Aiyar, Sanjeev Bhatt kind of retards.

I try to avoid all RoP owned services and businesses even if they are cheaper or convenient. It's not just due to my distaste for this tribe. Majority of the time I have been scammed or cheated has happened by RoPers. Transport company in north-east, hotels in more places than I remember, food places in Delhi, taxi drivers in Delhi, Jammu, the list is long and has a very large RoP presence almost all over India.

habal · Post by **habal** » 19 Dec 2016 13:40

jamwal ji, RoPers in rest of India are not as gair guzre as RoPers in valley & jammu precincts, though there are bad apples everywhere. It is not a small community we are talking of here. I would prefer if we build alliances with everybody rather than look at it through black & white lens. Entire RoP is not on one page, but they need emotional support and stopped being constantly looked at as other. Let us take this to politics.

jamwal · Post by **jamwal** » 19 Dec 2016 13:52

habal wrote:jamwal ji, RoPers in rest of India are not as gair guzre as RoPers in valley & jammu precincts, though there are bad apples everywhere. It is not a small community we are talking of here. I would prefer if we build alliances with everybody rather than look at it through black & white lens. Entire RoP is not on one page, but they need emotional support and stopped being constantly looked at as other. Let us take this to politics.

I have added a few lines in my original post before I read yours. I am talking about my experience of college, personal life, jobs, business as well as general life in a number of places, not limited to J&K. Admittedly, I may not be as wise as many other people here, but my experiences tell me to avoid dealing with them as much as possible. Every single one of them in my circles and those who call them friends are virulently anti-demon even though nothing that has happened to them is any worse than what any other person is facing.

This is the same section which jumps on manufactured issues like Dadri, criticises India on hanging islamic terrorists or at best stays quiet and is more concerned about western intervention in middle-east than plight of non-ropers in rop hellholes like Bakistan, Kangladesh, West Bengal, J&K, Kerala, UP etc.. I can overcome my dislike for their POV to some extent. But for things that matter, doing what they want will lead to death of our own civilisation. I chose survival of my way of life than a label of peace loving secular liberal.

Anyhow, a bit OT for this thread.

darshhan · Post by **darshhan** » 19 Dec 2016 14:00

habal wrote:jamwal ji, RoPers in rest of India are not as gair guzre as RoPers in valley & jammu precincts, though there are bad apples everywhere. It is not a small community we are talking of here. I would prefer if we build alliances with everybody rather than look at it through black & white lens. Entire RoP is not on one page, but they need emotional support and stopped being constantly looked at as other. Let us take this to politics.

Habal ji, Islam is very clear in its view of the world. i.e the world is divided between believers and non believers. And it is incumbent upon every believer to kill/subjugate/convert the non believer(kafir). This is actually the basis of islam. My question to you is how can we build permanent alliances that you are talking about ?

Tactical and temporary alliances are a different matter and needs to taken up on a case to case basis.

sum · Post by **sum** » 19 Dec 2016 14:03

facebook, twitter & whatsapp have mostly RoL and RoP and some AAPiya or commie type bashing demonitisation. So effectively this move has for sure divided the country along religious lines. It is something that shouldn't have happened, but it has.

Honestly, dont think it has anything to do with the current DeMo thing. The break has happened a long time back

Any and every topic where evil BJP/<communal Hindu>/<insert whatever> can be dissed ( even if it is outright BS) will be faithfully forwarded/shared/liked without comment and all the good things will be met with stony silence/indifference.

Rishi Verma · Post by **Rishi Verma** » 19 Dec 2016 14:08

Deposit Rs5000+ only Once Per Week

Love the rule being changed in the middle of an over, it's the right medicine for the patient.

The RBI is expected to issue more guidelines later this evening towards maintaining strict scrutiny of deposits of more than Rs 5000.

Whatever happened to no questions up-to 2.5L

On the other hand, much software must have been added at Central Bank branches all over the country to try and flag large deposits.

I wonder how much back dating and removal of zeroes is possible to bypass the system knowing that some big amounts have already been transferred to ghost accounts. And no big fish has been netted so far. Pawars, Mulayams, Didis, Buas, ~~Ammas~~, Chinnammas ... must be waiting for a knock on the door...

Sachin · Post by **Sachin** » 19 Dec 2016 14:23

First thing first at Bengaluru side, SHQ mentioned that things have improved for the last 7-10 days. They have started giving out Rs.24,000 to who ever comes asking for it; but with some rules. Any body who insists on Rs.24,000 (for no apparent reason) would be given Rs.2000 notes and perhaps one or two 500s. But for others who are willing to withdraw smaller amounts, they also get a better share of Rs.500s & Rs.100s. Even more farer share of small denomination notes to people who come with some emergency (kids hospitalised etc. etc.). People depositing old invalidated notes also seems to have come down drastically.SHQ mentioned about some "top secret" circular landing up at each office, with very detailed instructions on how certain accounts have to be verified & handled etc.

A pretty busy week end, as I also had to make a trip to the socialist heaven, Kerala. It was a very short trip by train. Pretty much all catering contractors/waiters on the train had short change (Rs.100s & Rs. 50). In Kerala, did not see very large queues in front of ATMs. Now that could be because those ATMs did not have money, or people have enough cash with them. Had met a few old pals in the evening, and the first thing they asked me was did I notice any queue shortages in the Beverages Co. outlets selling liquor. Did not notice a very huge dip, and they told me that pretty much every one who has some honest money with him are okay with this. Co-Operative banks are now scared and trying to stop account holders from going else where. A friend of mine had an account in one such bank and he wanted to close the account. Lot of pleading and cajoling from the "bank president" himself and so he retained around 50% there.

Meanwhile..

Legalising Black Money: Vigilance probe against Moovatupuzha K(erala) SRTC depot......
RBI to issue Rs 500 notes in new Series soon......
Over Rs 9000 crore deposited in district cooperative banks in 5 days after demonetisation
Officials have particularly expressed surprise about the deposits of over Rs 1,800 crore in Kerala, where agriculture is on the brink of collapse.

Rishi Verma · Post by **Rishi Verma** » 19 Dec 2016 14:31

Wow BM crimes using stolen identity now being identified!!

Slum-Dweller Office Boy Gets IT Notice

Investigation revealed that Jaiswal's PAN and Aadhaar cards were used to start four bogus companies—Shayansh Corporation, Gem Redtech, State Ford Textiles and Purvi Realty— post-demonetisation, said inspector Rajendra Kamble of Bhayander police station.

Jaiswal told police that when he joined the firm of Kandivli-based chartered accountant Rajesh Agrawal in 2008, he was asked to submit his PAN and Aadhaar cards to open a bank account, but he got his salary in cash. In 2012, he left Agrawal and joined another firm.

Following their probe, Bhayander police on Saturday arrested Agrawal (42), his former business partner Rajeev Gupta (30) and his two employees, Juglesh Gupta (25) and Santosh Singh (32), for allegedly starting four bogus companies in Jaiswal's name to launder money. They have been sent to police custody by a Thane court.

jamwal · Post by **jamwal** » 19 Dec 2016 14:41

Almost all thekas in Dilli are accpeting cards now. , so bewdas should not have any problem for new year celebrations.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 19 Dec 2016 14:51

is the famous theka in the bushes as one crossed the NH from delhi to gurgaon at kapashera post still there?
people used to drive off the highway into clearings in the bushes , park and drink up beer right there.

must be all built up and ggn expway now, so such simple pleasures are further afield.

Neela · Post by **Neela** » 19 Dec 2016 14:54

This is how your new income tax slabs may look after Budget of 2017

Reporter relies on "sources" . Pinch of salt advised.

Yagnasri · Post by **Yagnasri** » 19 Dec 2016 15:15

Neela wrote:This is how your new income tax slabs may look after Budget of 2017

Reporter relies on "sources". Pinch of salt advised.

Left to Jetlee, no changes will be made to the slabs, etc. Unfortunately, unless NM directly involves himself there will be no change in the views of Jetlee. He is just PC 2.0.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 19 Dec 2016 16:15

http://www.livemint.com/Politics/p9VrQT ... ng-in.html
Note ban breaks the backbone of Rs20 trillion trafficking industry

Says BRF favourite Kailash Satyarthi

“A 10-12 year old girl costs Rs5 lakh, while girls between the groups of 13 and 15 cost Rs4 lakh. These transactions are all done in cash, in black money. The brothel owners are now caught in a bind because they can’t convert this cash at the banks. Because the new currency is not readily available, clients have stopped going to brothels and the brothel owners have no money to pay the traffickers,” Nobel Peace Prize winner Kailash Satyarthi said.

Senior Delhi Police officers said, on condition of anonymity, random checks on trains bound for Delhi from Bengal, Assam and Bihar, failed to unearth trafficked girls.

“Black money is the backbone of the trafficking industry in India. At the moment that structure has been fractured by demonetisation. It is a matter of time before the new currency is back in the system and the trade picks up. We have approached the PM and informed him of this situation as well,” Satyarthi added.

jamwal · Post by **jamwal** » 19 Dec 2016 16:23

2 trillion is 2000 crores. That much money ??

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 19 Dec 2016 16:30

jamwal wrote:2 trillion is 2000 crores. That much money ??

Ironically this question only reveals the depth of your personal honesty and integrity. India would be a different country of 60% of people were like you

Dilbu · Post by **Dilbu** » 19 Dec 2016 17:28

Nano chip or not a lot of money hoarded in new 2000 rupee notes are getting caught. Might as well spread the rumour to scare more BM wallahs.

M_Joshi · Post by **M_Joshi** » 19 Dec 2016 19:21

Dilbu wrote:Nano chip or not a lot of money hoarded in new 2000 rupee notes are getting caught. Might as well spread the rumour to scare more BM wallahs.

There was rumour about new notes containing small traces of a particular radioactive isotope of Phosphorus. So a large chunk going around or hidden somewhere can be tracked by an appropriate detector. Theoretically it's possible but I doubt Givt will ever agree to this even if true due to the fear among people of radioactive radiation even if in miniscule quantity.

KarthikSan · Post by **KarthikSan** » 19 Dec 2016 20:21

Take it FWIW. I held a 2000 note to fluorescent light and there is a little square thing at the spot this guy pulled something from.

Keep the rumor alive to smoke out a few more rats

shravanp · Post by **shravanp** » 19 Dec 2016 22:31

Good talk by Niti Ayog CEO on demonetization.

https://play.ndtv.com/video/index/id/442878

Point to be noted (as stated by him): Rural, poor and lower middle class people more adaptable and faster to move on digital cashless economy than Lutyens

nash · Post by **nash** » 19 Dec 2016 23:24

jamwal wrote:2 trillion is 2000 crores. That much money ??

2 trillion = 2000 billion = 200000 crore

KLNMurthy · Post by **KLNMurthy** » 20 Dec 2016 01:02

Viv S wrote:
KLNMurthy wrote:Unfortunately I don't have a debit card, though I have an atm card. I am hoping to be able to use my US credit card for most sizable purchases, and maybe write cheques or something.
I suggest you get an account on PayTM before hand and use your credit card to top it up. It'll work on Ola, Uber, IRCTC et al.

Get a new SIM (I'd suggest Airtel) at the airport or borrow one from a relative if possible. (You can also get a cheap GSM phone there in case you don't have an unlocked one.) It'll be operational within 24 hrs, usually within 12 hrs, and thereafter you'll be fine in Metros and most Tier II cities.

Thank you Viv S garu. I have an Indian SIM card and will check if it is current. And I am planning to install paytm.

KLNMurthy · Post by **KLNMurthy** » 20 Dec 2016 01:03

Primus wrote:
KLNMurthy wrote:A personal query:

Am planning to travel from US to Hyderabad later this month. I'll have to exchange USD for rupees before I can pay for a cab, buy some breakfast etc.

Does anyone have any information on the state of the currency exchange at Hyderabad airport? Can i count on reliably being able to exchange even a small amount, e.g, USD 100 for rupees?

thanks for any info.
Murthy Ji, what a coincidence, I too am traveling to Hyd 1st week Jan, hopefully by then the troubles would be a bit less.

My strategy when traveling abroad (including poorer nations like Kenya, Botswana, Tanzania) is to simply use the local ATM and use my BankofAmerica ATM card to withdraw money. I can get the local equivalent of at least $500 at a time and I get the best exchange rate (much better than the cash exchange bureaus). It is also much safer than carrying a lot of USD.

My problem in Hyd will be if the ATMs do not put out much cash and what to do if it only comes out in 2000 notes. I will definitely need some kind of a Paytm or similar account. Not having a local phone is also going to be a bummer. Credit cards can of course work with larger establishments but may not be accepted everywhere.

It will be fun figuring all this out.

thank you Primus garu and everyone else who have kindly responded. I will try and post my experience after I reach Hyderabad, it may be helpful to others as well.

KLNMurthy · Post by **KLNMurthy** » 20 Dec 2016 01:05

SSharma wrote:If you get a relative to buy a new SIM for you, I know for a fact that jio and voda are activated within an hour if you buy using aadhar and fingerprint.

Ola has an offer, if you put 1k or above in their ola money thing, they give you prime sedan rides at mini prices, plus no peak pricing. Money well invested as far as I was concerned.

Best is paytm but I never used it, China and all that.

didn't know paytm has a china connection. Makes me have second thoughts about it. Are there any other reliable alternatives for paying by phone? What about RuPay?