Indian Navy News & Discussion - 15 Dec 2016

Rakesh · Post by **Rakesh** » 15 Jan 2017 00:00

shaun wrote:i never new these "Transition .." series of books are available online !! here https://www.indiannavy.nic.in/content/books

dude...you just found hidden treasure. I have been itching to get my hands on these books. Great find! Thanks.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 15 Jan 2017 07:37

shaun wrote:i never new these "Transition .." series of books are available online !! here https://www.indiannavy.nic.in/content/books

Many many thanks. If we could have a "Page 1" ref for Navy threads like the shitistan threads - this should go on there

Khalsa · Post by **Khalsa** » 15 Jan 2017 12:34

chola wrote:
Rakesh wrote: That is so SICK chola. Sorry Khalsa!
This is really sick!

Agreed !!

Rakesh · Post by **Rakesh** » 15 Jan 2017 21:31

Khalsa Saar, come over to the dark side and say it is sick

Peregrine · Post by **Peregrine** » 15 Jan 2017 22:33

X Posted on the STFUP Thread

China gives Pakistan two ships for security of CPEC sea route

NEW DELHI: China yesterday handed over two maritime patrol vessels to the Pakistan Navy for joint security along the sea route of the China-Pakistan Economic Corridor+ (CPEC), Dawn reported.

Cheers

Indranil · Post by **Indranil** » 15 Jan 2017 22:34

Please stop this "sick" business.

Bala Vignesh · Post by **Bala Vignesh** » 16 Jan 2017 00:15

Peregrine wrote:X Posted on the STFUP Thread

China gives Pakistan two ships for security of CPEC sea route
NEW DELHI: China yesterday handed over two maritime patrol vessels to the Pakistan Navy for joint security along the sea route of the China-Pakistan Economic Corridor+ (CPEC), Dawn reported.
Cheers

Wow!! Chinese patrol boats for CPEC security!! Why am I getting a feeling that these vessels will be carrying out false flag operations more often than not...

chola · Post by **chola** » 16 Jan 2017 03:35

Khalsa wrote:
chola wrote:
This is really sick!

Agreed !!

We'll see a version of that for the IN. Even the aircraft. The F-18 line ends around 2019. The IN is looking for a new twin engine carrier fighter. OMG, Hornets catapaulting off the IAC2 -- it'll be so sick!

Khalsa · Post by **Khalsa** » 16 Jan 2017 03:43

Indranil has said Stop so we stop.
But yes that image is a beaut.

Y I Patel · Post by **Y I Patel** » 16 Jan 2017 04:22

tsarkar wrote:I put this together on Keel Blocks and Keel Block Failure

Keel Block is a simple thing. A reinforced concrete block lined with wood on which a ship rests.

...

snip

...

As per the earlier posted ToI report, the CoI is examining both probable causes.

tsarkar

I really enjoyed going through this compilation of images - it adds to my understanding of this simple but vital mechanism. You posts in general are tremendously educative, and I have benefited greatly from them. Thanks, and keep on truckin!

Khalsa · Post by **Khalsa** » 16 Jan 2017 07:46

Rakesh wrote:Khalsa Saar, come over to the dark side and say it is sick

Never

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 16 Jan 2017 16:26

you can say 'sickish'

Rakesh · Post by **Rakesh** » 16 Jan 2017 20:59

let us stop as per admin request. I started it, so I am sorry. Moving on...

Navy inks Rs 20 crore contract with global firm to lift INS Betwa
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 541215.cms

At that time, the dock also had missile boat INS Pralay, a tug and a Caisson lock-gate (large floating iron) in close vicinity of INS Betwa.

INS Pralay was the Veer Class missile boat that suffered a minor fire on Jan 10th.

Rakesh · Post by **Rakesh** » 16 Jan 2017 21:19

Vice Adm S V Bhokare first officer from submarine arm to take over reins as Commandant of Indian Naval Academy, Ezhimala.
https://twitter.com/writetake/status/789293126661705728

titash · Post by **titash** » 16 Jan 2017 22:44

Looks like the Dhruv is being embarked on smaller ships...does anyone recall if the folding blades issue was resolved? Or can they use only the helipad but not the hangar?

Rakesh · Post by **Rakesh** » 16 Jan 2017 22:49

Titash...very nice picture of INS Sunayna. As per the links below, it appears that the folding blade issues have been resolved...

http://idrw.org/naval-dhruv-to-get-new- ... mechanism/

http://www.defenseworld.net/news/14062/ ... Hz_O1MrKM8

JTull · Post by **JTull** » 17 Jan 2017 03:04

There's a lot of soot on the equipment next to the exhausts!

Rakesh · Post by **Rakesh** » 17 Jan 2017 03:16

Rakesh wrote:Navy inks Rs 20 crore contract with global firm to lift INS Betwa
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 541215.cms

At that time, the dock also had missile boat INS Pralay, a tug and a Caisson lock-gate (large floating iron) in close vicinity of INS Betwa.
INS Pralay was the Veer Class missile boat that suffered a minor fire on Jan 10th.

As per this article, the same company - Resolve Marine - that salvaged the Sindhurakshak, will be used to salvage Betwa...
http://m.economictimes.com/news/defence ... 601982.cms

Aditya_V · Post by **Aditya_V** » 17 Jan 2017 12:09

titash wrote:Looks like the Dhruv is being embarked on smaller ships...does anyone recall if the folding blades issue was resolved? Or can they use only the helipad but not the hangar?

I think no autofolding, has to be done manually where all the rotors will be brought together and then put in the Hanger, Blades will not fold but all will manually pushed in the same direction.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 17 Jan 2017 18:09

The size of our OPV platforms and large helo hangar,indicates that this class must be upgraded to possess a more powerful ASW package to augment the fleet's total ASWcapability esp. as the number of PN and PLAN subs are going to dramatically increase in number and operations Some anti-air/missile capability with a BPDMS system,plus ASW,ASW mortars and a med. sized multi-role ASW helo,could make this classa potent one.

Aditya G · Post by **Aditya G** » 18 Jan 2017 01:00

Philip wrote:The size of our OPV platforms and large helo hangar,indicates that this class must be upgraded to possess a more powerful ASW package to augment the fleet's total ASWcapability esp. as the number of PN and PLAN subs are going to dramatically increase in number and operations Some anti-air/missile capability with a BPDMS system,plus ASW,ASW mortars and a med. sized multi-role ASW helo,could make this classa potent one.

Do that and you have kamorta.

titash · Post by **titash** » 18 Jan 2017 01:30

Aditya G wrote:
Philip wrote:The size of our OPV platforms and large helo hangar,indicates that this class must be upgraded to possess a more powerful ASW package to augment the fleet's total ASWcapability esp. as the number of PN and PLAN subs are going to dramatically increase in number and operations Some anti-air/missile capability with a BPDMS system,plus ASW,ASW mortars and a med. sized multi-role ASW helo,could make this classa potent one.
Do that and you have kamorta.

Having said that, Philip-ji is right.

These OPVs are very spacious at 2000+ tons. The size of the helipad is disproportionately larger than the Chetak or the Dhruv. Not sure if the hangar can accommodate a SeaKing or SeaHawk, but the helipad definitely can.

As the number of PN and PLAN undersea platforms grows over the years in the Indian Ocean Region, these platforms will have to be upgraded to start assisting the frigate/destroyer fleet. To be fair, the navy appears to have designed these large OPVs with a far cheaper (than Kamorta) equipped-for-but-not-with philosophy. I don't see them having the on-deck space to mount AShMs or RBU-6000s or point air defence systems, but surely they can take the newly developed Abhay Sonar and support helicopter ops for a SeaKing/SeaHawk in calm weather. Given that the electronic outfit includes Rukmini SATCOM + ESM antennae (but no radar), and Stealth + Chaff/Decoys + 76mm/30mm CIWS for self defence, I expect these ships to remain passive emitters that leverage the IN's network centric "sensor" capabilities. The embarked helicopter will provide the "shooter" capabilities.

4 Saryu class + 5 Pipavav class will be welcome additions to the ASW force. With the SATCOM and embarked helicopter, they can prosecute submarines at much greater distances than our older frigates such as the Petyas and even the first 4 Niligiris.

titash · Post by **titash** » 18 Jan 2017 01:33

Check out the size of that helipad versus the helicopter.

Bheeshma · Post by **Bheeshma** » 18 Jan 2017 03:32

Indian navy was quiet clear that the Sukanya class can be upgraded to light frigates configuration if required.

https://www.indiannavy.nic.in/content/s ... rwar-class

Not sure what all was planned but I assume urans, point interceptor and triple 324 mm light torpedo tubes may be possible. Saryu class is even bigger so its not inconceivable.

Cain Marko · Post by **Cain Marko** » 18 Jan 2017 08:40

titash wrote:Check out the size of that helipad versus the helicopter.

that's an eye opener!

Pratyush · Post by **Pratyush** » 18 Jan 2017 09:09

It should easily be able to handle a 10 ton helo.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 18 Jan 2017 19:26

Our OPVs are Dhanush capable,where the missile/s are housed in the helo hangar.This may be one reason for the xtra large flight deck.Certainly a much heavier ASW helo can also be operated from the OPVs and must be a wartime plan by the IN,to have xtra in-expensive warships that can take ona secondary role during a conflict/crisis. The OPVs however need space on deck earmarked for the swift installation of ASW weaponry like torpedoes.If regularly fitted with MBUs,as these require below deck munition handling spaces,they would increase the fleet's ASWcapability from scartch.

Pratyush · Post by **Pratyush** » 18 Jan 2017 19:39

Philip,

The Dhanush was a one off test bed to give the DRDO a launch capability from a ship born platform for test purposes. As such it was a suboptimal solution. The Brahmos and K 14 & K 15 are much better solutions and are well optimized for shipborne applications.

Furthermore an OPV is not a ship for front line combat. It is mostly for policing and show of flag operations.

Foe having inexpensive ships for additional capabilities, you have corvettes.

Bala Vignesh · Post by **Bala Vignesh** » 18 Jan 2017 19:41

I don't think the Dhanush launcher can be simply plugged in for it to be considered as a wartime contingency plan.. But I think they would look at removing the davits handling the RHIB's and installing 2*4 cells of Uran or something akin to it.

Bala Vignesh · Post by **Bala Vignesh** » 18 Jan 2017 19:46

Pratyushji,
The Saryu class OPV are corvettes under their skin, don't you think.. OPV in general are not this large based on what little I have read on this topic..

John · Post by **John** » 18 Jan 2017 19:47

Dhanush was not for test purpose but rather was to serve to give navy strategic deterrence till Arihant became operational. I do remember reading about plans to fit frontline ddg I believe they were scaled back due to cost and complexity.

Pratyush · Post by **Pratyush** » 18 Jan 2017 20:00

Bala Vignesh wrote:Pratyushji,
The Saryu class OPV are corvettes under their skin, don't you think.. OPV in general are not this large based on what little I have read on this topic..

I don't think that a ship can be classified by its tonnage. Rather what it is tasked by the operator and what it was designed to do. if the navy says that they are OPVs then they are OPV. If the navy calls a 3000 ton ship a corvette I will accept that designation as the operator is calling it that. As a chair born keyboard commando I will not go beyond that. Though I will try to understand the perspective of the navy as to why it is a corvette.

titash · Post by **titash** » 18 Jan 2017 20:20

Pratyush wrote:Philip,

The Dhanush was a one off test bed to give the DRDO a launch capability from a ship born platform for test purposes. As such it was a suboptimal solution. The Brahmos and K 14 & K 15 are much better solutions and are well optimized for shipborne applications.

Furthermore an OPV is not a ship for front line combat. It is mostly for policing and show of flag operations.

Foe having inexpensive ships for additional capabilities, you have corvettes.

Pratyush-ji, one thing stands out. No OPV for high endurance patrolling & piracy watch requires stealth shaping, or chaff/decoys, or stealth 76mm gunhouse, or 30 mm gatling guns. This ship is meant to face an incoming exocet/harpoon at some point.

Otherwise we'd simply have ordered the coast guard's "Samarth Class" version of this OPV...far cheaper and equally capable in the policing/show flag roles.

Rakesh · Post by **Rakesh** » 18 Jan 2017 21:42

Google Earth shot of INS Vikramaditya
https://twitter.com/ShivAroor/status/820977771622957056

Rakesh · Post by **Rakesh** » 18 Jan 2017 21:46

After successfully retrofitting INS Sindhukirti last year, state-owned Hindustan Shipyard begin retrofit of 2nd Kilo INS Sindhuvir in April.
https://twitter.com/livefist/status/821639599961346048

INS Sindhukirti undergoing full power trials in 2015 at Hindustan Shipyard post-refit b4 being delivered back to the Indian Navy.
https://twitter.com/livefist/status/821652569693061122

Indian Navy's biggest & most advanced hydrography/ocean studies vessel (VC 11184), floated out last April at Hindustan Shipyard.
https://twitter.com/livefist/status/821641586538905601

Secret Navy Ship That Could Save Dying Indian Shipyard
http://www.livefistdefence.com/2014/10/ ... -save.html

Rakesh · Post by **Rakesh** » 19 Jan 2017 01:42

Coastal surveillance: detecting threats key
http://www.deccanherald.com/content/591 ... s-key.html

Pratyush · Post by **Pratyush** » 19 Jan 2017 07:29

titash wrote:
Pratyush-ji, one thing stands out. No OPV for high endurance patrolling & piracy watch requires stealth shaping, or chaff/decoys, or stealth 76mm gunhouse, or 30 mm gatling guns. This ship is meant to face an incoming exocet/harpoon at some point.

Otherwise we'd simply have ordered the coast guard's "Samarth Class" version of this OPV...far cheaper and equally capable in

That may well be true but we are looking at 2 separate generation of designes. The coastguard ship is a generation behind when it comes to the saryu class. Taking into consideration the generational difference in design, the Navy ship is reflecting the size and shape.

The role is still OPV.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 19 Jan 2017 07:33

John wrote:Dhanush was not for test purpose but rather was to serve to give navy strategic deterrence till Arihant became operational. I do remember reading about plans to fit frontline ddg I believe they were scaled back due to cost and complexity.

I agree. Dhanush was part of naval strategic deterrence. In Op Parakram the ship was stationed off Karachi. And brought some sense to the Pakis.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 19 Jan 2017 07:39

that ship posted above is a 80s and 90s kind of design . the largest ships of the USCG are the national security cutters of 117m in length and 4500t weight.
they resemble the Saryu class and boast of 2 heli hangars, something most FFG do not

times have changed for the CG in deep ocean role

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 19 Jan 2017 07:40

once you add the FFG class sensors and weapons that ship above is a capable FFG....the low deck behind the hangar can have 8xtubes of harpoon.
a ESSM VLS system behind the main gun. LWT launchers on each beam. decoys and EW launchers.