Tejas Mk.2: News & Discussions - 25 February 2018

anupmisra · Post by **anupmisra** » 03 Mar 2018 23:15

Indranil wrote:Great day!

Vivek K wrote:BRADMINS please add Lungi dance emoticon!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I can feel your happiness. You have fought tirelessly and have many scars and lash marks to show for it. Yes, we need a lungi icon!

pralay · Post by **pralay** » 04 Mar 2018 00:10

Cybaru · Post by **Cybaru** » 04 Mar 2018 00:44

Whoa good news!!!

Now order 1000s of artillery with both bf and l&t and 1000 mk2 Arjun.. rid of us imports for ever!!!

. In February, sources within the Defence Ministry had indicated that India was no longer interested in a class of single-engine fighter other than the Tejas and had asked the Indian Air Force to revise its requirements to also include multi-engine fighters. There is, presently, no clarity on the shape of this acquisition and whether a deal for another multi-role fighter jet will at all progress.

ManuJ · Post by **ManuJ** » 04 Mar 2018 01:01

Confirmation of the production rate being targeted:

Currently, the HAL is producing around eight Tejas, a single engine multi-role aircraft, annually and the defence ministry wants it to increase the number to 18 planes per year.

The HAL is investing Rs 1,300 crore to augment the existing infrastructure so that production of Tejas can be increased to 24 aircraft per year by 2021.

https://www.indiatoday.in/pti-feed/stor ... 2018-03-03

Bart S · Post by **Bart S** » 04 Mar 2018 01:12

Singha wrote:cash rich deep state players like mota bhai should actually be encouraged to buy up or buy into small aerospace parts makers all over the world and open their indian ops too for tejas type projects to absorb technology and build scale. it gives euro govts too some skin in the success of our game.
Embraer sources things from all over...

Plus govt should encourage/underwrite credit from PSU banks for such purposes. Better that than lending to Nirav Modi and his uncle.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 04 Mar 2018 01:35

SaiK wrote:Multiple theaters... let's focus on functional deployments.

1. We have refueling probes (good to have retractable)
2. Brahmos advanced lite version
--- deep strike /sead
3. Astra ready to strike aerial blips
---air superiority
4. Uttam or 2052s integrate well for cuing from MKIs
---net-centric
5. LPI/low RCS signature - Comparable with Rafale or even JSF.
--- BVR

EW suite, passive sensors like in raptors , IRST like in OLS 50, hopefully retractable-towed decoys/jammers like in EF2K, ... even it spells nightmare to Rafale, JSF and PAKFA.

We got work!

Would you like sliced bread to go with it?

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 04 Mar 2018 01:42

Vivek K wrote:BRADMINS please add Lungi dance emoticon!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Vivek K it's has been a long journey to get here.
Thanks for not losing faith and putting up with the twists and turns.
In the end turned out to be all right. If not it's not the end.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 04 Mar 2018 01:46

Guys ADA persevered with low risk to get Tejas to this stage.
The only thing was the relaxed stability bit that gives the agility for close in dog fights.

PratikDas · Post by **PratikDas** » 04 Mar 2018 01:58

Manish_P wrote:
PratikDas wrote: Let it be so.
Nice graphic this!

Thanks. Here's a larger version if you like.

PratikDas · Post by **PratikDas** » 04 Mar 2018 02:00

Rakesh wrote:Pratik Saar, they will be deployed everywhere the F-16 and F-18 were supposed to be

Given the latest news, I can now celebrate this

Rakesh · Post by **Rakesh** » 04 Mar 2018 02:30

SaiK wrote:Pratik ji, T Shirts with this meme is highly possible. Please patent it.

Pratik / SaiK: if you are going to make t-shirts of this, I will pay for two. I want to send one each - in a red bow tie - to the two leaders of BRF’s import lobby.

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 04 Mar 2018 02:56

Notes

LCA Tejas Absolutely On Right Trajectory And Getting Better

https://defenceaviationpost.com/lca-tej ... ng-better/

Tejas Mk.2 will be a 4++ gen aircraft with tactical strike, air reconnaissance, air defense, and maritime roles which is enough for a light fighter and it can continue upto 2055 till it becomes obsolete.

This means India need not pour billions of dollars for other 4++ gen aircraft, instead can utilize MK.2 until 2055.

Comparing to its competitor GRIPEN-E, F-16, Tejas Mk-2 will be equally potent or even better and can definitely be the backbone of light category aircrafts of the IAF.

The Latest updates of Tejas MK2 is in good mode and on speed track ::

– Avionics architecture has been finalized.
– New cockpit with bigger size (6”x8”) displays designs completed.
– Configuration of Active Phased Array based Unified Electronic Warfare Suite (UEWS) finalized
– The number of elements that can be incorporated with the existing geometry for the Antenna Array unit of AESA Radar has been finalized and performance parameters like range and Effective Radiated Power (ERP) computed.
– Night Vision Goggle (NVG) compatible L E D lights for Navigation lights and Taxi / Landing Lights are being developed. –
Engineering models have been developed. Performance is being evaluated.
– Conformal antenna developed for V/UHF
– Unified Pylon Interface Computer (UPIC) fixed in place of individual Pylon Interface Boxes
– GE-F414 engine for LCA AF Mk2 and a contract was signed with GE, USA in September 2012 and due for delivery by 2019.
– Canopy reshaping, outer cowl modification, actuator fairing extension and supersonic pylons have resulted in approx 20 counts (8%) drag reduction in supersonic regimes.

Trials to offload one hydraulic system to reduce the load on JFS during starting completed. This will help in cold weather high altitude operations.

Liquid Cooling System configurations, separate for Uttam AESA and UEWS have been finalized. However not sure if Mk.2 still will have Uttam radar or will got with Israel.

The closest competitors of LCA Tejas Mk.2 are J-10C , JF-17 Bk.3 and F-16 Block 70 along with Saab Gripen-E in single engine category. Tejas Mk.2 in its features will be far more superior to JF-17 Bk.3 as Bk.3 will host those technologies which are already available with Mk.1 and Mk.1A like HMD/S or AESA Radar among others. Bk.3 is not going to offer significant stealth features like Mk.2

Cybaru · Post by **Cybaru** » 04 Mar 2018 03:05

IR/Kartik and others,

What are the odds that Mk2 will cross 3200 kgs of internal fuel? If it crosses that threshold, it will have a longer legs than the M2Ks.

Cybaru · Post by **Cybaru** » 04 Mar 2018 03:50

I also hope there is also one version of Mk2 for both NAVY and IAF. No more 1.2 meter plug for navy and .7 meter plug for IAF. Just do one and only one.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 04 Mar 2018 04:24

Long long ago V.S. Arunachalam created the grand challenge to create the LCA and got alignment among political leaders, engineers and IAF.

Finally the quest is complete. Along the way many great persons contributed and are still contributing.

Our vanadanams to these many mahanubhavulu as Tyagaraja sang.

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 04 Mar 2018 04:32

Rakesh wrote:
SaiK wrote:Pratik ji, T Shirts with this meme is highly possible. Please patent it.
Pratik / SaiK: if you are going to make t-shirts of this, I will pay for two. I want to send one each - in a red bow tie - to the two leaders of BRF’s import lobby.

Pratik ji, need better graphics.. that background matrix grid might not come out well on prints.

srai · Post by **srai** » 04 Mar 2018 06:10

Good use of MoD’s “power”

Cain Marko · Post by **Cain Marko** » 04 Mar 2018 06:24

Any chance of IRST, towed decoys on the new mk2?

srai · Post by **srai** » 04 Mar 2018 06:32

^^^
Litening Pods provide some IRST functionality even on Mk.1.

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 04 Mar 2018 06:40

we bought 164 rafael flir pods (for mki). /delivered/status?

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 04 Mar 2018 06:45

mayavi includes TRD. right?

deejay · Post by **deejay** » 04 Mar 2018 09:51

Vivek K wrote:BRADMINS please add Lungi dance emoticon!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It’s great to see you happy Vivek ji.

PratikDas · Post by **PratikDas** » 04 Mar 2018 11:55

SaiK wrote: Pratik ji, need better graphics.. that background matrix grid might not come out well on prints.

The checkers are added by the viewing program to depict a transparency. The transparency blends well on forums like this which have a color scheme and then the image renders without checkers.

In any case, here are 3 versions with solid backgrounds, depending on your taste. Click for higher-resolution.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 04 Mar 2018 12:36

All kinds of journos are claiming ahead of curve in predicting Tejas decisicon by GOI. All after reading the forum.

jpremnath · Post by **jpremnath** » 04 Mar 2018 12:39

Nirmala Sitharaman has turned out to be the Dark Saree Knight (forgive my horrible pun) India deserves and needs right now...she has showed more grit and determination against the powerful import lobby which no doubt will pull out all stops to discredit her...But this is no moment to despair and worry...I am so overwhelmed with happiness and all of the members of BRF needs to cherish this moment which we thought might never come but still persevered against all odds..cheers

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 04 Mar 2018 13:15

Indian Defence Review 32.4 (Oct-Dec 2017)
Air Marshal Anil Chopra, Air Marshal Dhiraj Kukreja, Lt Gen VK Saxena, Lt Gen Prakash Katoch, Lt Gen BS Pawar, RSN Singh, Prof SN Misra, Col Danvir Singh, Col Anil Athale

@copyrighted material - del it after an exposure/or I will little later.

A Deshmukh · Post by **A Deshmukh** » 04 Mar 2018 13:49

What is Tejas Mk III ? first time hearing of this.

Neshant · Post by **Neshant** » 04 Mar 2018 14:02

Mayavi sounds a lot like that Swedish missile detection system for the Gripen which incorporates AI for identification of oncoming threats in various optical wavelengths.

They better be planning for AI based sub-systems on board MK III.
AI for autonomous flight controls, threat identification, decision making.. etc
Bonus points for using AI in the aircraft design process itself.

AI will become more and more prevalent in combat aircraft and more so UCAVs.
Now is the time to start building up that capability and experimenting.

Manish_P · Post by **Manish_P** » 04 Mar 2018 14:09

PratikDas wrote:
Manish_P wrote:
Nice graphic this!
Thanks. Here's a larger version if you like.

Dhanyavaad!

Anshuman.Kumar · Post by **Anshuman.Kumar** » 04 Mar 2018 14:16

If all goes well ..the proposed 24 crafts per year capacity by 2021,should be atleast doubled by 2026,with equal participation by Pvt sector.

All the recent news that have been coming show that Govt has brought all stakeholders on the same page,so funds,ramping up production will get a boost due to clear decision making.

Cybaru · Post by **Cybaru** » 04 Mar 2018 14:39

SaiK,

Tejas Mk III is planned to.....???? WHat?? Next page pleaze.

Khalsa · Post by **Khalsa** » 04 Mar 2018 15:22

Oh my god I am late to the party thread
LUNGI DANCE INDEED

well done
mera bharat ..... I love you
well done BRaves for all what we did to add to the momentum.

kit · Post by **kit** » 04 Mar 2018 16:01

SaiK wrote:Indian Defence Review 32.4 (Oct-Dec 2017)
Air Marshal Anil Chopra, Air Marshal Dhiraj Kukreja, Lt Gen VK Saxena, Lt Gen Prakash Katoch, Lt Gen BS Pawar, RSN Singh, Prof SN Misra, Col Danvir Singh, Col Anil Athale

@copyrighted material - del it after an exposure/or I will little later.

What is Tejas Mark 3 ??!

Interesting and cool !!! .. probably the 4.75 gen ?

next page please .. you could delete this one

kit · Post by **kit** » 04 Mar 2018 16:05

wonder if the mark 3 would be single engined ?!

Rakesh · Post by **Rakesh** » 04 Mar 2018 18:28

jpremnath wrote:Nirmala Sitharaman has turned out to be the Dark Saree Knight (forgive my horrible pun) India deserves and needs right now...she has showed more grit and determination against the powerful import lobby which no doubt will pull out all stops to discredit her...But this is no moment to despair and worry...I am so overwhelmed with happiness and all of the members of BRF needs to cherish this moment which we thought might never come but still persevered against all odds..cheers

As per the Risk Predictor on BRF, Defence Minister Sitharaman was supposed to be a rubber stamp for the Make in India policy. Basically to have continuity with the policy of Chief Minister (then Defence Minister) Manohar Parrikar. After Make in India SEF was Parrikar's idea.

I was reading through the old posts on the Single Engine thread and it was claimed (again via the Risk Predictor himself) that SEF was supposed to move many needles and BRF was being myopic and narrow-minded in not being able to see the the value of the SEF deal. The many needles being Joint Working Groups, Strategic Alignment with America vis-a-viv China among a whole host of other issues. Predictions were also made that cancellation of those deals would result in the US shutting down all those needles and India will be on her own vis-a-viv China. All nonsense onlee designed to scare monger India from the threat of Dragon Fire.

That theory has now come crashing down like a house of cards with the SEF deal being cancelled, the MRCA process restarted (an open invitation to order more Rafales), the Mk2 being sanctioned for development and 201 Mk2s being ordered for the Indian Air Force. This was said a million times - but they were so busy assessing risk - that the IAF would never accept the F-16, Block 70. The IAF is the *REAL* customer. Among the policy influencers in the US, the realization is now setting in (although the real myopia and narrow minded lies with them) ----> the IAF will never accept the F-16 or the F-18 into her stables.

kit · Post by **kit** » 04 Mar 2018 18:31

ManuJ wrote:Confirmation of the production rate being targeted:

Currently, the HAL is producing around eight Tejas, a single engine multi-role aircraft, annually and the defence ministry wants it to increase the number to 18 planes per year.

The HAL is investing Rs 1,300 crore to augment the existing infrastructure so that production of Tejas can be increased to 24 aircraft per year by 2021.
https://www.indiatoday.in/pti-feed/stor ... 2018-03-03

curious that a lady def min was able to do what many stalwarts were unable to !!

srai · Post by **srai** » 04 Mar 2018 18:42

^^^
She came from the private sector

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 04 Mar 2018 20:03

Mk III, might be the stealth version or might be the Canard version.
Perhaps the Mk2 might not come with Canards, that might be left to the MkIII. MKIII might be the Canard/Levcon+stealth version
I remember moi and Indranil ji putting double tailfins on a potential stealth model a few moons ago here.

jpremnath · Post by **jpremnath** » 04 Mar 2018 20:13

Rakesh wrote:
jpremnath wrote:Nirmala Sitharaman has turned out to be the Dark Saree Knight (forgive my horrible pun) India deserves and needs right now...she has showed more grit and determination against the powerful import lobby which no doubt will pull out all stops to discredit her...But this is no moment to despair and worry...I am so overwhelmed with happiness and all of the members of BRF needs to cherish this moment which we thought might never come but still persevered against all odds..cheers
As per the Risk Predictor on BRF, Defence Minister Sitharaman was supposed to be a rubber stamp for the Make in India policy. Basically to have continuity with the policy of Chief Minister (then Defence Minister) Manohar Parrikar. After Make in India SEF was Parrikar's idea.

I was reading through the old posts on the Single Engine thread and it was claimed (again via the Risk Predictor himself) that SEF was supposed to move many needles and BRF was being myopic and narrow-minded in not being able to see the the value of the SEF deal. The many needles being Joint Working Groups, Strategic Alignment with America vis-a-viv China among a whole host of other issues. Predictions were also made that cancellation of those deals would result in the US shutting down all those needles and India will be on her own vis-a-viv China. All nonsense onlee designed to scare monger India from the threat of Dragon Fire.

That theory has now come crashing down like a house of cards with the SEF deal being cancelled, the MRCA process restarted (an open invitation to order more Rafales), the Mk2 being sanctioned for development and 201 Mk2s being ordered for the Indian Air Force. This was said a million times - but they were so busy assessing risk - that the IAF would never accept the F-16, Block 70. The IAF is the *REAL* customer. Among the policy influencers in the US, the realization is now setting in (although the real myopia and narrow minded lies with them) ----> the IAF will never accept the F-16 or the F-18 into her stables.

You can imagine the horrors on the face of MoD babus when she pushed for this...anyone who has seen Yes Minister series and Sir Humphrey Appleby can imagine the creative ways in which they would have tried to slow her down and scuttle the LCA plans..the dalals and fireng salesman would have blown their lid when they heard it (leaked to them long before it reached us ofcourse..) Hopefully we are not celebrating too early...

Indranil · Post by **Indranil** » 04 Mar 2018 20:15

Rakesh wrote:
Indranil wrote:Great day!
There can be no Tejas thread on BRF without your inputs and inputs from your chaiwallahs. You and your chaiwallahs gave all of us hope, when SEF was going strong. So thank you IR.

I cannot take credit for this Admiral. It is a wonderful step taken by MoD and IAF. I just thank a few stars that aligned.
1. "The presentation" dissing Tejas for the virtues of F-16 and Gripen galvanized jingoes and reporters alike to call out the injustice.
2. Congress making an issue out of the Rafale-acquisition. Their cheap trick for political gains has helped the country indirectly.

There is a lot of work to do:
1. HAL to up production to 16 by middle of next year. I think they can do this.
2. MoD and IAF to go through the n-step procurement process and convert intent to orders. I think this can be done too.
3. HAL to finish definition of Mk1A. DRDO should get out of the way for this. Uttam should wait for Mk2. I am worried that HAL can't finish this in one year.HAL will finish producing the Mk1s in about 2 more years. To define, build, test and qualify Mk1a in 2 years is next to impossible.

The ball is firmly back in ADA/HAL's court and I hope they stop dilly-dallying.

Meanwhile, first flight of SP8 coming up soon.