Indian Military Helicopters

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Philip
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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby Philip » 25 Aug 2019 19:40

A Q.Was the helo based at Srinagar? If so the base's defences would've/ should've taken cognisance of its departure and approx. expected return.
Secondly, the helo's speed is far slower than a fighter at low level, even with a payload and around half the speed of high- subsonic cruise missiles.On radar, it could only have been mistaken for an enemy UAV.Q is are the UAVs operated by Pak have the same signature as a med. helo and approx. same speed?

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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby Aditya_V » 25 Aug 2019 21:09

There was a Paki UAV shot down that morning near Naliya airbase in Gujarat

vasu raya
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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby vasu raya » 25 Aug 2019 22:00

Aditya_V, so while mistaking it with a drone might be a possibility, these drones aren't armed. I would like to hear if the Mi-17 pilots violated an order or protocol of explicitly turning on the IFF while flying inland.

Any terror strike, we expect that choppers are used by Special Forces to close in ...

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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby sankum » 29 Aug 2019 00:11

https://mobile.twitter.com/ReviewVayu/status/1166639546248773632
. HAL's LCH Completes Sea Level Trials with IRSS: System performance trials of Light Combat Helicopter (TD-4) integrated with an Infra Red Suppression System (IRSS) have been carried out. Based on the feedback of these trials, certain modifications were made on the helicopter.....

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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby tsarkar » 29 Aug 2019 10:51

Philip wrote:A Q.Was the helo based at Srinagar? If so the base's defences would've/ should've taken cognisance of its departure and approx. expected return.
Secondly, the helo's speed is far slower than a fighter at low level, even with a payload and around half the speed of high- subsonic cruise missiles.On radar, it could only have been mistaken for an enemy UAV.Q is are the UAVs operated by Pak have the same signature as a med. helo and approx. same speed?

SOP exist for such contingencies that were not followed by the officers under investigation, including giving contradictory orders to the Helicopter pilot putting them in harm's way.

tsarkar
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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby tsarkar » 29 Aug 2019 11:02

sankum wrote:https://mobile.twitter.com/ReviewVayu/status/1166639546248773632
. HAL's LCH Completes Sea Level Trials with IRSS: System performance trials of Light Combat Helicopter (TD-4) integrated with an Infra Red Suppression System (IRSS) have been carried out. Based on the feedback of these trials, certain modifications were made on the helicopter.....

I wasnt aware of IRSS in any HAL Helicopter since the exhaust was anyways directed upwards to be washed away by the rotors. But good development anyways unless the added weight affects high altitude performance.

Indranil
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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby Indranil » 30 Aug 2019 00:16

On the other hand, I am actually surprised that this took so long. TD3 flew with the scoops in 2014!

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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby ashthor » 30 Aug 2019 17:44

Harsh Vardhan Thakur

LUH scales DBO and beyond, landing at J Top at >18000feet at ISA+25°C

https://twitter.com/hvtiaf/status/1167399983663857664

Image

ramana
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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby ramana » 30 Aug 2019 20:22

Looks great.

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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby abhik » 30 Aug 2019 20:45

Indranil wrote:On the other hand, I am actually surprised that this took so long. TD3 flew with the scoops in 2014!

A tangential question for those who frequent chaiwallas, do we know how the fund crunch is affecting the HAL development projects (LCH, LUH, HTT-40, the two GT engines etc)? AKAIK HAL is not getting any money from the MoD for these.

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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby Bharadwaj » 30 Aug 2019 21:04

ashthor wrote:Harsh Vardhan Thakur

LUH scales DBO and beyond, landing at J Top at >18000feet at ISA+25°C

https://twitter.com/hvtiaf/status/1167399983663857664


The 226 is a waste of money. This bird will fly rings around it. We can use our Russian purchase obligations for things which we do not have a domestic option.

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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby Bharadwaj » 02 Sep 2019 13:49

The import lobby will be sh**ing bricks looking at these photos.

Image
https://twitter.com/hvtiaf

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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby ArjunPandit » 03 Sep 2019 15:05

Apache Indians inducted at pathankot..which sits right on front of shakargarh bulge..i think IA would want to break in from this to retake PoK

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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby Khalsa » 03 Sep 2019 15:57

The one image that answers the questions about the LoooongBow Radar.
yes we did get but not all have it nor do all need it.

Would love a word about this from Vivek_Ahuja about right now.

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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby Khalsa » 03 Sep 2019 17:24

Negative .... the Apache will be there to stop the cream of the Pakistani Armoured and Mechanised forces that remain poised to take the chicken neck and threaten Jammu with an overall objective to choke the valley and Ladakh. Its a defensive stand at north of Punjab and South of J&K for us. Their side is advantageous for defense as well as attacks. I am talking about natural features. And they have always oriented their forces for gettings us at the narrowest point.

This would be the worst place to begin your PoK campaign if there was to be one. You are probably better off starting at the North side, threaten Skardu and Gilgit and come down from Siachen Glacier on top of their heads.

The apaches in Suratgarh are for the offensive ops.

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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby ArjunPandit » 03 Sep 2019 18:37

thanks for the correction khalsaji..is my understanding incorrect that in battle of shakargarh we not only broke through their lines and held their counter attacks to retake their positions..I was basing my hypothesis based on that..

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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby Rakesh » 03 Sep 2019 19:34

ArjunPandit wrote:Apache Indians inducted at pathankot..which sits right on front of shakargarh bulge..i think IA would want to break in from this to retake PoK

Apache Indian is a Reggae Artist ---> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apache_Indian

Please only use the term Indian Apaches and not Apache Indian :lol:

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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby ArjunPandit » 03 Sep 2019 19:36

Rakesh wrote:
ArjunPandit wrote:Apache Indians inducted at pathankot..which sits right on front of shakargarh bulge..i think IA would want to break in from this to retake PoK

Apache Indian is a Reggae Artist ---> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apache_Indian

Please only use the term Indian Apaches and not Apache Indian :lol:

rakesh ji pun was intented ..who can forget him along with baba sehgal and Style Bhai...and his fav song 'choke there'...very apt ..based on what khalsa ji said above...it will choke them there..
also indian apache is an american indian tribe ...IIRC the last one to fall ...random tidbit but...geronimo was an apache tribe leader..geronimo kia was the proclamation when OBL was 72ed

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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby Rakesh » 03 Sep 2019 19:40

https://twitter.com/17GoldenArrows/stat ... 4641114114 ---> New patch for pilots and crew of IAF's Apache attack helicopters.

Image

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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby sudeepj » 03 Sep 2019 22:19

Khalsa wrote:The one image that answers the questions about the LoooongBow Radar.
yes we did get but not all have it nor do all need it.

Would love a word about this from Vivek_Ahuja about right now.



The placement of the radar atop the main rotor must require blanking of the radar harmonized to the rotor RPM. Either blank it based on the detected return from the rotor or feed the rotor freq into the radar processor and have it blank out when the rotor is expected to be in front of the radar.. There are also the vibrational characteristics of the rotor to account for.. All in all, it looks like a hideously complex way to realize a radar on a chopper..

If the goal is for the radar equipped Apache and our LCH hunt in wolf packs, having a second version of the LCH equipped with a very large radar and thermal sensors, that hangs farther back and higher up from the tip of the battlefield may make sense as the battle controller for the armor hunting choppers.

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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby Kartik » 04 Sep 2019 03:43

Rakesh wrote:
ArjunPandit wrote:Apache Indians inducted at pathankot..which sits right on front of shakargarh bulge..i think IA would want to break in from this to retake PoK

Apache Indian is a Reggae Artist ---> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apache_Indian

Please only use the term Indian Apaches and not Apache Indian :lol:


:rotfl:

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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby SajeevJino » 04 Sep 2019 12:03

pointless rant deleted

-

Warning already issued to poster for other rants on another thread.

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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby manjgu » 04 Sep 2019 12:07

SajeevJIno...which history are u reading btw. chamb, longewal, kargil etc etc just a name a few.

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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby Philip » 04 Sep 2019 12:24

Just 24 Apaches aren't enough for both fronts. Existing and future types like MI-35s, Rudras, armed MI-17s and LCHs- of which we will have larger numbers of, must be synergised with the Apaches .If the IA is also acquiting Apaches then the sensible approach would be to transfer all attack helos to the IA and compensate the IAF with more strike fighters.Apaches cost a bomb.Large numbers of cheaper LCHs must be ordered also keeping attrition losses from ground air defences in mind.

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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby ArjunPandit » 04 Sep 2019 14:41

Welcome back sajeev after long..not the best return i must say..while coordination may be an issue but you might be better served by reading history of kargil and 1971 war...despite disagreement with IA, IAF went ahead with helicopter strikes and took initial losses..also there is a CDS post..and that is not for selling credit default swaps...

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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby Khalsa » 04 Sep 2019 16:25

ArjunPandit wrote:thanks for the correction khalsaji..is my understanding incorrect that in battle of shakargarh we not only broke through their lines and held their counter attacks to retake their positions..I was basing my hypothesis based on that..


no you were much bang on with all of that.
The reason we did that was to disarm the pointed dagger at us.
So multiple objectives here
1. Secure Pathankot from Ground attacks
2. Ensure pressure is relieved on Jammu.
3. Tie up the best over in the so called Shakargarh Bulge.

in 65 we were expecting the Pakistani 1st Armoured to show up and fight here instead it switched to near my village at Khem Karan and surprised us.
Only when the enough Pakistan meat had been ground inside this bulge and Pak 1st armoured repulsed at Khem Karan did an under strength Pak 1st Armoured Div switch to Shakargarh Bulge.

That's a lot of travelling inside your own territory at war time.

So whoever is going to play in the bulge, expect to pay a high cost and now massive World War II sweeps across the empty Ukrainian fields during Summer time.

Want to win and hold territory ?
Start with South Punjab or middle of Rajasthan and go for Rahim yar Khan.
Or way up top and aim for Skardu.

Punjab will stalemate on both sides.

The current owners of Shakargarh bulge have been planting minefields many fold deep. They know that we know that this area gives them depth of starting point therefore ... fireworks will light up here big and loud.

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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby VikramA » 04 Sep 2019 20:27

why enter Shakargarh at all?. why not cross ravi river near Dera Baba Nanak punjab, capture katurpur, capture road junction near narowal, bypass sailkot and link up near jammu border, in essence cutoff shakargarh from behind from rest of pakistan

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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby manjgu » 04 Sep 2019 21:41

with my limited understanding of wars between india pakistan : based on history, neither of the two sides has the kind of generalship , thoughts,vision, risk taking ability to conduct a offensive armoured operation of the magnitude being envisaged on the forum. so all that is likely to happen is some shallow action in the deserts during the first few days before intl interventikon will happen.

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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby Vips » 05 Sep 2019 02:28



India Today - Shiv Aroor's flight and report on LCH.

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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby Nikhil T » 05 Sep 2019 05:29

Sorry for the pooch, but given Pakis have significant air defence capabilities (both SAMs and MANPADS), will these costly Apache's not be very vulnerable during combat? I understand they have missile warning, flares and electronic counter measures, but since Apaches would be <5-10KM to the enemy's formations, they would not have a lot of time to take counter measures. Mi-17 loss at the hands of a Stinger missile in Kargil and the recent loss in Srinagar at hands of a Spyder come to mind.

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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby ashishvikas » 05 Sep 2019 13:53

For the records..

Light Utility Helicopter Clears High Weather Tests at Himalayas

https://twitter.com/HALHQBLR/status/116 ... 01280?s=19

#JustIn
HAL says its Light Utility Helicopter #LUH has successfully demonstrated high altitude capability in hot and high weather conditions in the Himalayas. Trials were carried out by the Test Pilots from HAL, IAF and the Army from August 24 to September 2, 2019. 1/2

#JustIn
#HAL claims that #LUH embarked on a 3000km flight from Bengaluru to Leh over a period of three days traversing many civil and military airfields. During the course of ferrying & trials, the chopper revealed high reliability without any service support. 2/2

https://twitter.com/writetake/status/11 ... 28929?s=19

What's left now for IOC & more importantly orders ?

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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby ashishvikas » 05 Sep 2019 14:40

HAL Hindustan Aeronautics Limited , Tumkur: Please see pictures of upcoming HAL Tumkur plant.

https://goo.gl/maps/jmJe51Kjx4CzZcbK8

Very slow progress. I don't think this is going to be ready in next 5 years with this pace. Disappointing.

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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby Bharadwaj » 05 Sep 2019 15:16

The LUH will be a true god send for our forces in the high altitude border areas. It will be far cheaper to operate than a twin engined heli but will have almost similar capabilities to the dhruv.

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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby Bharadwaj » 05 Sep 2019 17:05

And now the videos....

LUH on High Altitude trials in the Himalayas

Video #1 --> https://twitter.com/i/status/1169541193048281089

Video #2 --> https://twitter.com/i/status/1169541647270432768

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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby Rakesh » 06 Sep 2019 02:42

https://twitter.com/SJha1618/status/1169613889828339712 ---> BTW, HAL's Light Utility Helicopter (LUH) has cleared high-altitude trials in Ladakh. The LUH demonstrated its ability to fly hot & high, by operating from a helipad located at 5,500 m altitude at ISA+27°C. The test-pilot team was drawn from both the IAF and the IA.

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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby Rakesh » 06 Sep 2019 02:45

https://twitter.com/HALHQBLR/status/1169519371263201280 ---> Light Utility Helicopter Clears High Weather Tests at Himalayas.

Image

Image

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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby Picklu » 06 Sep 2019 03:12

Other than naval applications, I do not see any reason for any KA helo.

Okay, may be to remove single point dependency on french helo engines......

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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby Rakesh » 06 Sep 2019 03:32

Picklu, AFAIK only the Army and Air Force are acquiring the Ka-226.

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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby Picklu » 06 Sep 2019 05:53

Rakesh wrote:Picklu, AFAIK only the Army and Air Force are acquiring the Ka-226.


Exactly my point admiral, i do not see any reason why for IAF and IA other than not getting solely dependent on French Engine.

I could have understood if navy had argued in the favour of double engine for the sake of safety. But IA & IAF, really?????

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Re: Indian Military Helicopters

Postby Bharadwaj » 06 Sep 2019 06:51

Picklu wrote:
Rakesh wrote:Picklu, AFAIK only the Army and Air Force are acquiring the Ka-226.


Exactly my point admiral, i do not see any reason why for IAF and IA other than not getting solely dependent on French Engine.

I could have understood if navy had argued in the favour of double engine for the sake of safety. But IA & IAF, really?????


Is the 226 not powered by a french engine? Arrius from turbomeca?


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