Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby ramana » 09 Oct 2019 03:33

Vivek K after the S400 purchase, US wont sell F 35.
So lets not go strawman.

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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby Sumeet » 09 Oct 2019 05:14

ramana wrote:Vivek K after the S400 purchase, US wont sell F 35.
So lets not go strawman.


Will it be willing to sell Super Hornet Block 3 with latest bells and whistles ? What about Growler ?

Hi Vivek_k,

Once the trend is set by current air force chief it will be hard for other air force chief's to not follow on. Plus the next air chief will still come in while the current govt is in power. So they can press on adoption of more indigenous tech.

I personally feel IAF's CAPEx budget should be divided as to what they can buy from outside vs what they get from local industry.

IAF also understands that F-35 is out of question, F-22 is not available, Su-57 does not meet standard and there is no European aircraft available before 2040 so AMCA will be the way forward.

Plus understand given our neighborhood we have to tread a fine line balancing imports and indigenous content. Also newer tech available via systems like Rafale or Phalcon not only gives us tactical advantage in military technology over adversaries but gives IAF operational experience with cutting edge tech and fighting strategies involving these which will also go as feedback into new indigenous systems. Overall its a win win for everyone (IAF _ Indian MIC).

Also, don't forget if in next 10-12 years we can hit 8-10 trillion dollar mark as an economy a lot of countries will be at our doors offering JVs for next generation military tech.

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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby Vivek K » 09 Oct 2019 05:20

Ramana - 10 years from today F35 May not be the king it is thought to be now. At that time with changes in global geopolitics what will be possible, I’m not sure we can predict. But if you say so? F35 was used as a figure of speech.

If what Sumeet predicts will come about then everything we jingos want is granted. So back to sleep mode.

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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby Rakesh » 09 Oct 2019 05:55

Vivek, please read this. It should make you happy. The "conclusion of ongoing procurement " refers to the 114 MRCA contest.

And this is coming from none other than Air Chief Marshal RKS Bhaduria. I reiterate again....there are no more foreign fighters coming after the conclusion of the 114 MRCA fighters. It sink or swim time for all the seven OEMs.

So we can continue wailing about this on BRF or accept the reality that the contest for 114 fighters will go ahead. One of the seven will win, just like in the last MRCA contest. My guess will be either Boeing or Dassault. But that is just my guess. And the Air Chief has also squashed the idea of 36 additional Rafales. In the same article below. Now whether the economy picks up by the time the contract is to be inked is a different matter. No money, no fighters.

IAF CLOSES DOORS FOR FOREIGN 5TH GENERATION FIGHTER, COMMITS ITSELF TO INDIAN AMCA
http://www.sps-aviation.com/news/?id=89 ... ndian-AMCA

"AMCA will be given priority. We will give full support. No import (of a fifth generation fighter) has been planned in the foreseeable future. AMCA will take a lot of budgetary support..Technology and weapons are the underlying requirements," he elaborated. Russia, the US and Britain have pitched their Fifth and 'Sixth' generation fighters to India. The AMCA assertion fits in with the vision that all military platforms to be acquired after the conclusion of ongoing procurement will be designed, developed and produced in India.

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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby nachiket » 09 Oct 2019 05:59

I hate it whenever this 114 number comes up. There is no way we can afford 114 Rafales. And the thought of buying yet another type just makes me want to bang my head against a wall.

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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby Vivek K » 09 Oct 2019 06:00

Admiral Sahab - maybe jingos don’t know what to say!! All we ever wanted is seemingly accepted. Now if they would release the order for 83 Mk1As then I will need to go for diabetes checkup!!

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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby Rakesh » 09 Oct 2019 06:03

Vivek, I can live with Admiral (meant in jest onlee)...but not the Sahab :)

And the PBL for the 83 Mk1As is being negotiated as we speak. So that will get approved by 2019 end or no later than the end of the financial year (Mar 31, 2020). You will need to go for diabetes checkup onlee :)

And after the diabetes checkup, I hope you will be healthy enough to absorb the jingo shock of additional Mk1As once the 83 gets done. Stick around! :)

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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby Luxtor » 09 Oct 2019 06:44

nachiket wrote:I hate it whenever this 114 number comes up. There is no way we can afford 114 Rafales. And the thought of buying yet another type just makes me want to bang my head against a wall.


The current order for 36 Rafales is not enough. We need to double that order to 72. We need a high performance fighter to keep the pukies and chinkis at bay on both fronts. Having just 36 Rafales is just like when we had 30 some odd M2Ks. IAF loved the aircraft but never put in a follow up order for it until the M2K production was closing down and we scrambled to get more from the French who turned us down. Same with C17. We again loved the aircraft but then the scramble began when that line was closing down. Why not be proactive and forward thinking and get a reasonable number of these aircraft when they are available? Military and weapons are expensive, very expensive but a necessary evil. I know it takes away from the development of the country in other areas but we have no choice as we have very hostile neighbors. We also need to invest lots of ....and lots of money into developing technology for weapons and other uses indigenously. We have no choice. We can't keep saying we can't afford it and keep doing half way jobs again and again. We are never proactive...always reactive when our enemies try something on us.

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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby Manish_Sharma » 09 Oct 2019 07:05

Ganesh_S wrote:
Vivek K wrote:Did you factor in all the welfare schemes, tax evasion and other revenue losses through brazen embezzlement? Add on top of that Global warming induced emergencies/disasters etc.

And like already stated - a fool and his money are easily parted. If you donate the money to pricey equipment that will not pull their weight in battle then are you better off with or without them?

IAF should have bought the Qatari Mirages and upgraded to current standards.


I would still be skeptical on the 40 billion mark provided there is significant tot or offsets on the deal. There is always a better deal by virtue of economies of scale. By brazen embezzlement do you mean financial irregularities in the current g2g deal?


Saurav Jha
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You entire late-1980s force structure, which allowed Sunderji to feel confident enough to take on both China and Pakistan simultaneously was built on Soviet Largesse. And now you are struggling to modernize the same force structure with multi-billion dollar imports.
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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby Aditya_V » 09 Oct 2019 08:31

That way the reason we could win in 1971 is the quick induction of large no. of Mig 21 with cannon and SU7B. We can only do that with a local industry. Considering local purchases have future benefits and money and technological base. Imports should only be considered if they are 40% cheaper than local manufactured products

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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby SidSoma » 09 Oct 2019 11:16

Has the CO of 45 Sqn changed to GC Manish Tiwari ?

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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby sajaym » 09 Oct 2019 11:22

nachiket wrote:I hate it whenever this 114 number comes up. There is no way we can afford 114 Rafales.

Luxtor wrote:The current order for 36 Rafales is not enough. We need to double that order to 72.

Rakesh wrote:I hope you will be healthy enough to absorb the jingo shock of additional Mk1As once the 83 gets done. Stick around! :)


If the comments on this thread can be taken as representation of the general public sentiment on this topic, I won't be surprised if the IAF is finally forced to settle with a mixed 114 nos (36 Rafale + 78 MK1As).

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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby Karan M » 09 Oct 2019 11:31

Which would also mean the IAF will add more to the Mk1A like the Gripen C, including long range AAMs such as the Meteor, multi-weapon racks.. perhaps even fuel tank mods.

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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby nam » 09 Oct 2019 12:46

18 sqd of MK1 & MWF is planned to be produced. To meet these, HAL has to set up a 24 per year production line.

If IAF complains about "falling sqd numbers", GoI will point towards HAL's 24 prod line and say "pick as much you want"!

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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby Atmavik » 09 Oct 2019 14:37

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R6mGuPu8G1k

Tejas flight @ 22:30. looks like Tejas has the strongest backing it ever had in IAF.

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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby kit » 09 Oct 2019 15:43

OT but i think there is a very similar pattern for sub acquisition as well, the new project 75I is the last foreign sub procurement.
Rakesh wrote:Vivek, please read this. It should make you happy. The "conclusion of ongoing procurement " refers to the 114 MRCA contest.

And this is coming from none other than Air Chief Marshal RKS Bhaduria. I reiterate again....there are no more foreign fighters coming after the conclusion of the 114 MRCA fighters. It sink or swim time for all the seven OEMs.

So we can continue wailing about this on BRF or accept the reality that the contest for 114 fighters will go ahead. One of the seven will win, just like in the last MRCA contest. My guess will be either Boeing or Dassault. But that is just my guess. And the Air Chief has also squashed the idea of 36 additional Rafales. In the same article below. Now whether the economy picks up by the time the contract is to be inked is a different matter. No money, no fighters.

IAF CLOSES DOORS FOR FOREIGN 5TH GENERATION FIGHTER, COMMITS ITSELF TO INDIAN AMCA
http://www.sps-aviation.com/news/?id=89 ... ndian-AMCA

"AMCA will be given priority. We will give full support. No import (of a fifth generation fighter) has been planned in the foreseeable future. AMCA will take a lot of budgetary support..Technology and weapons are the underlying requirements," he elaborated. Russia, the US and Britain have pitched their Fifth and 'Sixth' generation fighters to India. The AMCA assertion fits in with the vision that all military platforms to be acquired after the conclusion of ongoing procurement will be designed, developed and produced in India.

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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby JTull » 09 Oct 2019 15:49

SidSoma wrote:Has the CO of 45 Sqn changed to GC Manish Tiwari ?


Flight Commander!

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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby nachiket » 09 Oct 2019 23:19

I think people misunderstood what I meant. When I said I hate to hear the number 114 that is because since we cannot afford 114 Rafales unless we start printing Euros it increases the chances of a seemingly cheaper type like the F-16 or Gripen being acquired which would be disastrous for the Tejas as well as adding to the zoo of aircraft types in the IAF and increasing costs.

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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby darshhan » 10 Oct 2019 00:27

nachiket wrote:I think people misunderstood what I meant. When I said I hate to hear the number 114 that is because since we cannot afford 114 Rafales unless we start printing Euros it increases the chances of a seemingly cheaper type like the F-16 or Gripen being acquired which would be disastrous for the Tejas as well as adding to the zoo of aircraft types in the IAF and increasing costs.


I have a feeling that somehow IAF will manage the upcoming mmrca tender in favour of rafale. IAF's obsession with Rafale is hard to believe.

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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby Cybaru » 10 Oct 2019 00:42

Oh yeah - seems like a dog and pony show to ensure we get the price hopefully that we want.

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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby nachiket » 10 Oct 2019 00:42

darshhan wrote:I have a feeling that somehow IAF will manage the upcoming mmrca tender in favour of rafale. IAF's obsession with Rafale is hard to believe.

Seeking to acquire more numbers of a type which is already being inducted in limited numbers and which has already passed a rigorous technical evaluation instead of buying yet another completely new type is obsession according to you?

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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby ramana » 10 Oct 2019 00:54

^^^ Endorse that. Do we want yet another plane while we are trying to bring about a improvement in IAF logistics?

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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby ArjunPandit » 10 Oct 2019 01:55

is this modi ji''s patrakar rozgar yojna -PRY?? or america ulloo banao yojna

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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby nachiket » 10 Oct 2019 02:11

ArjunPandit wrote:is this modi ji''s patrakar rozgar yojna -PRY?? or america ulloo banao yojna

The only ones being hurt by wasting time on this new MRCA nonsense is ourselves.

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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby ArjunPandit » 10 Oct 2019 02:18

no i think we are buying time till MWF and Tejas come in no.s ..i am hoping pakis will give us a chance to prove tejas

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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby nachiket » 10 Oct 2019 02:33

ArjunPandit wrote:no i think we are buying time till MWF and Tejas come in no.s ..i am hoping pakis will give us a chance to prove tejas

Buying time is certainly something we are good at. At the end of the original MMRCA program we successfully bought 15+ years and no aircraft. Now, the earlier suggestion of buying limited quantities (2 extra squadrons of Rafales along with a mix of existing types) is done away with and the new MRCA process not even having an AON yet, we are embarking on doing the same yet again.

If only it were possible to fight a war with time instead of aircraft we would be unbeatable.

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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby krishna_krishna » 10 Oct 2019 03:12

ramana wrote:^^^ Endorse that. Do we want yet another plane while we are trying to bring about a improvement in IAF logistics?

I agree with few other posters here, IAF obsession with rafale is at high level. It’s a beautiful aircraft no question but sad to see lack is support to indegnious content while trying to be best on borrowed power than your own (126 original mmrca number - 36 = 90 will be procured )

Navy also had said that Amca will be taken if it comes on time, everyone here knows what it means. Sad but true.

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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby ramana » 10 Oct 2019 06:44

Sorry its not obsession.
Firstly there is a need for squadron numbers.
They had 56 M2K that need replacement + large number of Migs 21, 23, 27

They wanted to add to the 56 M2Ks after Kargil performance.
Dassault said no can do as line is closed.
Then UPA said tell us how many you want?
Instead of saying 56 they were told to add the Mig replacements and that's how the 126 came.

Buried in this is the 36 planes need for special delivery.
So NaMo bought only those in first tranche as that's non -negotiable for triad.
What we see is the rest of the story.

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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby Rakesh » 10 Oct 2019 07:39

Please continue Rafale discussions here ----> viewtopic.php?f=3&t=7266&p=2386604#p2386604

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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby Mort Walker » 10 Oct 2019 11:02

Rakesh wrote:Please continue Rafale discussions here ----> viewtopic.php?f=3&t=7266&p=2386604#p2386604


Just say no. More LCA Tejas in all varieties. Mothball the Jags and Mig29s too.

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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby venkat_r » 10 Oct 2019 11:47

We have to get the LCA mk1 order and testing complete on time
Then ir is the integration of Astra1 and 2 with LCA and other fighter jets and then getting FOC on LCA MK2 in that order, if we can achieve this in the next 6 to 7 years, then that would bring in enough numbers to keep IAF potent along with MMRCA.

Big change in IAF saying no more foreign fighters. It is important to keep considerable edge over adversaries, cannot allow PAF to even think of doing what it did earlier this year, not only the numbers but the technical edge has to be significant.

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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby Karan M » 10 Oct 2019 20:42

Guys, Tejas thread. Rafale discussions in Rafale thread, General IAF discussion in IAF thread

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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby Mort Walker » 10 Oct 2019 21:19

Haridas wrote:
venkat_r wrote:.....Big change in IAF saying no more foreign fighters. It is important to keep considerable edge over adversaries, cannot allow PAF to even think of doing what it did earlier this year, not only the numbers but the technical edge has to be significant.

IAF told that India can't have the airforce that even rich countries now find difficult to flaunt.

Here is what our means are, and now live within the limit and make best use of what we can afford.

Flying above cloud nine, IAF crashed into ceiling of reality ... ouch !


I think we need to dispel the notion that the IAF will have to settle for less with the LCA Tejas. The Tejas has 90% availability and any downtime will be short as the logistics support chain is within India. Further, the Tejas performance is comparable to any 4th generation fighter on the market today. Imagine if there were 3 squadrons of LCA flying combat patrol on the northwest border on Feb. 27th. The PAF would not have even dare tried to enter Indian airspace.

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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby Aditya_V » 11 Oct 2019 15:03

ramana wrote:Sorry its not obsession.
Firstly there is a need for squadron numbers.
They had 56 M2K that need replacement + large number of Migs 21, 23, 27

They wanted to add to the 56 M2Ks after Kargil performance.
Dassault said no can do as line is closed.
Then UPA said tell us how many you want?
Instead of saying 56 they were told to add the Mig replacements and that's how the 126 came.

Buried in this is the 36 planes need for special delivery.
So NaMo bought only those in first tranche as that's non -negotiable for triad.
What we see is the rest of the story.


Nope Dassualt told M-2000 line in 2007. In 1999 IAF wanted M-2000-5, 126 aircraft. Then Tehlka and coffin gate struck and single vendor case was deemed as corrupt. So GF as DM asked for multiple RFP, before he conclude UPA-1 came, around 2007 Dassualt said M-2000 line was closing. IN 2011, IAF shortlisted Rafale and Eurofighter, in 2012 Rafale was selected.

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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby Karan M » 11 Oct 2019 18:41

I dont think this has been analyzed yet. For all the reportage the EL/L-8222 WB won the Mk1A deal, reports suggest it was Elisra instead. A podded version of their UEWS is likely.
https://s3.eu-west-2.amazonaws.com/esuk ... al-new-pdf
https://www.elbitsystems-uk.com/what-we ... irborne-ew
https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/ne ... s?from=mdr

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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby Rakesh » 11 Oct 2019 20:37

Mort Walker wrote:I think we need to dispel the notion that the IAF will have to settle for less with the LCA Tejas. The Tejas has 90% availability and any downtime will be short as the logistics support chain is within India. Further, the Tejas performance is comparable to any 4th generation fighter on the market today. Imagine if there were 3 squadrons of LCA flying combat patrol on the northwest border on Feb. 27th. The PAF would not have even dare tried to enter Indian airspace.

I do not believe the IAF thinks it will settle for less with the Tejas platform. Especially now that Air Chief Marshal Bhaduria is at the helm. He is supported by a good number of officers under him - Air Marshal Raghunath Nambiar - who have also flown on the Tejas and/or have been part of the Tejas program. That the aircraft is excellent is no issue.

The crux of the problem, IMVHO, is what powers the Tejas. It is not an Indian engine. It is not even *ANY* engine from a foreign manufacturer, i.e. France or Russia. It is an American engine and that causes significant concern at Air HQ. Even during the first MRCA contest, one of the IAF's chief concerns about the F-16 and F-18 is that they are sanction prone. And that is on record. If the Tejas had a working Kaveri engine, I doubt the MRCA contest would be alive today. The IAF would not be acquiring phoren fighters in triple digits (114 MRCA) and desi fighters in double digits (83 Mk1As). A phoren fighter would have been acquired as a silver bullet, instead of what is happening now.

The Safran proposal - that Defence Minister Rajnath Singh just sat through - will go the way of the Shakti engine. If successful, India will manufacture an engine with a French core. And that engine will likely power the Tejas Mk2, AMCA and possibly other aircraft. Just like how the Shakti engine currently powers the HAL Dhruv, the Light Combat Helicopter and the Light Utility Helicopter. What steps has the GOI taken to invest in a local helicopter engine? None. But it looks good in an annual MoD report to mention that India produces the Shakti engine in-house.

The IAF concerns - about the US - are still very much valid today. Donald Trump has proved that time and time again. Look what he is doing to the Kurds. His own party is lambasting him for it. The other party is no different either. One thing is certain, 114 phoren fighters are coming. If you look at all the seven contestants in the MRCA contest, this is what I believe the IAF is staring at;

MiG-29 and Su-35: Russian. Had enough of it.
Gripen E: American Engine.
Eurofighter Tyhpoon: American Poodle.
F-16 and F-18: American Engine.
Rafale: The only platform that is western and reliable, technically and politically.

In the absence of a viable Indian engine and falling numbers, what is the point of inducting a plane that does not have an Indian powerplant? Why open a third, fourth and fifth Tejas line if she is still flying with an American engine? Is there an Indian engine available today? Five years from now? Ten years from now? The answer is a definite NO. And the IAF knows it. There is no desire in the GOI to invest in a local engine and that is sad. So from the IAF''s standpoint....what other choice do you have?

And as for the affordability of the 114 fighters, they will spread out the cost over 10 years. For a $20 billion deal, the annual CAPEX will be $2 billion over 10 years. And the IAF thinks it is doable. And so does the present GOI. The economy is struggling, but not at the point where the services cannot afford to spend a few billion each year.

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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby nam » 11 Oct 2019 21:15

If we can plan it properly, although F404 is an problem, in terms of sanctions, we can manage it.

Remember we flew the prototype with F404 engine, UNDER sanctions. I don't know what was the plan, if the engine sanctions were not lifted.

If we can get enough engines ordered before hand, it should cover some of the risks. One advantage of American engineering, ironically, is those F404 would have higher MTBF allowing us to run it longer, even if under sanctions.

On the other hand Russian engines would a massive problem, if sanctioned!

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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby Kartik » 11 Oct 2019 23:07

Karan M wrote:I dont think this has been analyzed yet. For all the reportage the EL/L-8222 WB won the Mk1A deal, reports suggest it was Elisra instead. A podded version of their UEWS is likely.
https://s3.eu-west-2.amazonaws.com/esuk ... al-new-pdf
https://www.elbitsystems-uk.com/what-we ... irborne-ew
https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/ne ... s?from=mdr


Interesting. But the links that you had here were all for LRUs that would need to be on the airframe itself. Didn't see a podded version of the Elisra EW suite..and this seems to include a RWR as well as jammer and CMDS..but didn't we have indigenous solutions for RWR and CMDS? or am I understanding it wrong, which could be, since I am no expert in this matter.

ArjunPandit
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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby ArjunPandit » 11 Oct 2019 23:24

nam wrote:If we can plan it properly, although F404 is an problem, in terms of sanctions, we can manage it.

Remember we flew the prototype with F404 engine, UNDER sanctions. I don't know what was the plan, if the engine sanctions were not lifted.

If we can get enough engines ordered before hand, it should cover some of the risks. One advantage of American engineering, ironically, is those F404 would have higher MTBF allowing us to run it longer, even if under sanctions.

On the other hand Russian engines would a massive problem, if sanctioned!

then why this saar, Nehruji style bharat ratna by HAL to HAL?
“The AL31FP engine powers Su30 MKI and is manufactured from raw material stage. All the components, including heavy forgings are manufactured at HAL”, said Mr. T. Suvarna Raju, CMD, HAL. He handed over the documents related to the 50th Raw Material Phase Engine of Su-30MKI to Air Marshal S.B. Deo, VCAS.


or does the raw material also come from mother russia?

nachiket
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Re: Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A: News & Discussions: 23 February 2019

Postby nachiket » 11 Oct 2019 23:40

Rakesh wrote:The crux of the problem, IMVHO, is what powers the Tejas. It is not an Indian engine. It is not even *ANY* engine from a foreign manufacturer, i.e. France or Russia. It is an American engine and that causes significant concern at Air HQ. Even during the first MRCA contest, one of the IAF's chief concerns about the F-16 and F-18 is that they are sanction prone. And that is on record. If the Tejas had a working Kaveri engine, I doubt the MRCA contest would be alive today. The IAF would not be acquiring phoren fighters in triple digits (114 MRCA) and desi fighters in double digits (83 Mk1As). A phoren fighter would have been acquired as a silver bullet, instead of what is happening now.

....

In the absence of a viable Indian engine and falling numbers, what is the point of inducting a plane that does not have an Indian powerplant? Why open a third, fourth and fifth Tejas line if she is still flying with an American engine? Is there an Indian engine available today? Five years from now? Ten years from now? The answer is a definite NO. And the IAF knows it. There is no desire in the GOI to invest in a local engine and that is sad. So from the IAF''s standpoint....what other choice do you have?

When has the IAF actually expressed this concern about the Tejas specifically? That their main problem is the American engine? If that was the case, wouldn't or shouldn't they have categorically said so when the engine for the Mk2 was being selected? Such a concern from the IAF would have surely tilted that competition in favor of the EJ200.

I am sorry Admiral, but I think you are imagining things here. All the concerns that IAF has expressed about the Tejas were in terms of performance and maintainability, many of which are being addressed in the Mk1A and Mk2 and some might have been unfounded altogether looking at what we have seen of the Mk1 till now.


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