Indian Missiles News & Discussions - 17 Dec 2018

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 14 Dec 2019 15:01

manjgu wrote:the enemies had full list of officers stationed across AF bases during 1971 ops...so what to talk abt radar installation in 2019.

Also, know that medical exams were done in many bases at the behest of local commanding officers and undesirables were temporarily sent on leave until hostilities subsided.

Cybaru · Post by **Cybaru** » 14 Dec 2019 15:21

Teetar reporting 200 mk1 astra missile orders- both agat and Indian seeker to be produced.

JTull · Post by **JTull** » 14 Dec 2019 18:49

Cybaru wrote:Teetar reporting 200 mk1 astra missile orders- both agat and Indian seeker to be produced.

Yes, it seems the desi seeker production capacity will take time to build up. Both seekers performed well in the Sept tests.

This order is over and above the 50 LSP one.

a_bharat · Post by **a_bharat** » 17 Dec 2019 18:01

Aditya_V · Post by **Aditya_V** » 17 Dec 2019 18:16

Per ANI most of the components of the Land based missile launched were indegenously manufactured. Hope this means Brahmos will be deployed in numbers in numbers along with Prahaar/Pralay.

Raghunathgb · Post by **Raghunathgb** » 17 Dec 2019 18:17

https://twitter.com/ANI/status/1206905616238698496?s=19

2 Brahmos Supersonic Cruise Missiles were successfully launched today from land&air platforms. The 1st missile launch was from a Land Based Mobile Launcher in Odisha, where most of the components were indigenous including Missile Air frame, Fuel Mgmt System&DRDO designed Seeker.

Parasu · Post by **Parasu** » 17 Dec 2019 19:24

I have a noob pooch.
Since the G2G version of Brahmos can take care of all of Pakistan, am I correct in my understanding that this air launched version of brahmos is for China and it's ships in the Indian Ocean Region (IOR)?

Aditya_V · Post by **Aditya_V** » 17 Dec 2019 19:40

It does not work like that, A2G missile brings a lot of advantages, launching aircraft can into a position very fast and hit a target at an unusual angle, say target PAF Kamra from Kargil. Ground based launchers cannot do that. Similarly there will be Chinese targets targeted by land based launchers by hiding behind mountains.

Parasu · Post by **Parasu** » 17 Dec 2019 22:59

Aditya_V wrote:It does not work like that, A2G missile brings a lot of advantages, launching aircraft can into a position very fast and hit a target at an unusual angle, say target PAF Kamra from Kargil. Ground based launchers cannot do that. Similarly there will be Chinese targets targeted by land based launchers by hiding behind mountains.

Thank you.

RKumar · Post by **RKumar** » 18 Dec 2019 02:42

My spider feeling is telling me something which can’t be disclosed just yet. I need to read more tea leaves. Till than let’s wait n watch!!

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 18 Dec 2019 03:09

RKumar wrote:My spider feeling is telling me something which can’t be disclosed just yet. I need to read more tea leaves. Till than let’s wait n watch!!

What are you talking about?

The IAF Brahmos test is the completion of development testing.
The ground based Brahmos test is confirmatory test of the seeker and other major sub-systems.

Basically Brahmos development is over.
On to hypersonic Brahmos.

One twitter handle tweeted some cryptic stuff and clammed up.

fanne · Post by **fanne** » 18 Dec 2019 03:54

why not do a actual test of A-G Brahmos (not A-S) and perhaps achieve off axis capability (maybe hit target -15 degrees off from the vertical with reasonable CEP) say at 300-500km distance, that would successfully cap Brahmos development -
It would demonstrate seeker ability to hone and lock a land target, it would demonstrate off axis capability to hit enemy hiding behind a mountain/hill (essentially 80% of our border), it would also act as a deterrent, the enemy can perhaps pre emptily strike nearby missile/brahmos position and destroy logistic node, but still SU30MKI can bring them from the hinterland in a moment notice, put terrorists target within say 400 KM from border on notice....the effects are endless. It is our trump card.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 18 Dec 2019 05:16

fanne, The IAF is happy with the tests and issued a press release.
Let them move on to mfg and induction.

Enough testing.
Once they have sufficient numbers can do incremental tweaks for what you suggest.
BTW TPp is in position to do any pre-emptive strike.
As for PRC they wont for it will be state of general war.
Teach the enemy type wars stage is over.

So lets not scare ourselves like US and jack up costs.

fanne · Post by **fanne** » 18 Dec 2019 05:25

oh I am all for quick production. A ship killer Bramos atop su30mki gives us tremendous power over all the three water bodies. But IN is perhaps 20 times more lethal than PN, making it 25 times is good, but I want a A/G Brahmos that can take out PAF bases like Sargodha (some 150 km from border), from well within our own border. All its bases in TSP Punjab and Sindh are then fair game, from within our boundary.

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 18 Dec 2019 06:01

fanne wrote:why not do a actual test of A-G Brahmos (not A-S) and perhaps achieve off axis capability (maybe hit target -15 degrees off from the vertical with reasonable CEP) say at 300-500km distance, that would successfully cap Brahmos development -
It would demonstrate seeker ability to hone and lock a land target, it would demonstrate off axis capability to hit enemy hiding behind a mountain/hill (essentially 80% of our border), it would also act as a deterrent, the enemy can perhaps pre emptily strike nearby missile/brahmos position and destroy logistic node, but still SU30MKI can bring them from the hinterland in a moment notice, put terrorists target within say 400 KM from border on notice....the effects are endless. It is our trump card.

Steep dive version of Brahmos has already been developed for hitting targets behind mountains and naval carriers.
It is the Block 3 variant.

Army variant
https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/ne ... s?from=mdr
Navy
https://swarajyamag.com/insta/brahmos-m ... lly-tested

Brahmos range has also been extended to 450 + km.
https://www.thenewsminute.com/article/i ... ange-58474

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 18 Dec 2019 06:07

And as for taking out PAF bases its already there.
and demoed many times in the tests.

fanne · Post by **fanne** » 18 Dec 2019 07:41

Not to be obstinate(and yes the surface to surface version has been ready to do the above). I fact 3 ‘units’ have been raised against northern neighbor (and was in news).
The next big stop is of course a to g version and a to s version. A to s version have been demoed few times successfully and I gather ready for induction.
The a to g is really a game changer, a spice on steroids. With 300-600 km range (for a to g per many insinuations), and precision, they can be a big deterrent in a short war or teach a lesson war like Balakot).
Next time we have to take out Mudrik, I would think between a SS version of Brahmos and a to g version of Brahmos, a to g will be much more preferred and less escalatory ( essentially using a 2 g Brahmos in place of spice).

Prem Kumar · Post by **Prem Kumar** » 18 Dec 2019 09:33

Enough tests already. What's critical is induction in significant numbers & usage in real war or Surgical Strike 3.0.

Onwards to Brahmos-Mini (carried on Tejas, Mig-29K, Torpedo tubes) & Brahmos-Hypersonic

Hypersonic is probably a decade away. Hopefully Mini materializes within the next 5 years. The ability to equip our SSK subs with Mini will be a real force-multiplier

sajaym · Post by **sajaym** » 18 Dec 2019 10:49

And since Brahmos is the best thing since sliced cheese, I now demand a Brahmos-based supercavitation torpedo with a 300km range...POOF! There goes the Paki/Chini submarine edge.

JayS · Post by **JayS** » 18 Dec 2019 11:05

Parasu wrote:I have a noob pooch.
Since the G2G version of Brahmos can take care of all of Pakistan, am I correct in my understanding that this air launched version of brahmos is for China and it's ships in the Indian Ocean Region (IOR)?

It will be a part of our A2AD capability in IOR.

My pet wish is a hypersonic 1000km range carrier killer missile. I am not sure whats the status on Shourya.

Karthik S · Post by **Karthik S** » 18 Dec 2019 11:13

sajaym wrote:And since Brahmos is the best thing since sliced cheese, I now demand a Brahmos-based supercavitation torpedo with a 300km range...POOF! There goes the Paki/Chini submarine edge.

what paki/chini submarine edge?

tsarkar · Post by **tsarkar** » 18 Dec 2019 13:13

Brahmos development is completed and these are all exercise firings.

There are four IA regiments, 11 IN Ships + 14 on order, 2 IAF Ground Squadrons previously equipped with Prithvi and 42 Su-30MKI with strengthened airframe. Slightly less than 1000 missiles have already been built. There is more than one BrahMos factory for final assembly for redundancy and to fulfill the large number of orders.

DRDO does development flights for substitution of Russian components as well as range extension. Those are enhancements and also bring the cost down.

tsarkar · Post by **tsarkar** » 18 Dec 2019 13:21

sajaym wrote:And since Brahmos is the best thing since sliced cheese, I now demand a Brahmos-based supercavitation torpedo with a 300km range...POOF! There goes the Paki/Chini submarine edge.

Tathastu!

SMART - Supersonic Missile Assisted Release of Torpedo - project was sanctioned in 2016.

But such weapons also need long range detection via low frequency towed array sonar or seabed sonar arrays. Unless both these systems are developed, SMART will not be useful.

tsarkar · Post by **tsarkar** » 18 Dec 2019 13:30

https://www.drdo.gov.in/sites/default/f ... ssiles.pdf

Those interested can please purchase and read this very interesting book. Its immensely knowledgeable.

Sumeet · Post by **Sumeet** » 18 Dec 2019 15:43

tsarkar wrote:
sajaym wrote:And since Brahmos is the best thing since sliced cheese, I now demand a Brahmos-based supercavitation torpedo with a 300km range...POOF! There goes the Paki/Chini submarine edge.
Tathastu!

SMART - Supersonic Missile Assisted Release of Torpedo - project was sanctioned in 2016.

But such weapons also need long range detection via low frequency towed array sonar or seabed sonar arrays. Unless both these systems are developed, SMART will not be useful.

On our Kamorta-class anti-submarine corvettes we will be putting LF towed array sonar procured from Germany, can't these vessels be data linked to air assets carrying SMART ? After all NCW and System of Systems concept is future.

tsarkar · Post by **tsarkar** » 18 Dec 2019 16:51

^^ SMART will use ships with L&T UVLS and Atlas Elektronik ACTAS. 16 ordered for 3 Talwar 3 Delhi 3 4 Kamorta 3 Shivalik 3 Kolkata class.

JayS · Post by **JayS** » 18 Dec 2019 22:23

tsarkar wrote:https://www.drdo.gov.in/sites/default/f ... ssiles.pdf

Those interested can please purchase and read this very interesting book. Its immensely knowledgeable.

I have been trying to buy these monographs for a while now. DESIDOC is a real shitty organisation. They don't respond to emails, they don't answer their phones, there is no way to buy them from DRDO site. Funny some of the Monographs are available abroad easily but not in India.

Prem Kumar · Post by **Prem Kumar** » 18 Dec 2019 23:33

If SMART becomes reality, we can decouple sensor & shooter.

ASW helos or P8I's can use dunking sonars to detect a sub & a ship equipped with SMART, from miles away, can drop a torpedo in the target area

Jay · Post by **Jay** » 18 Dec 2019 23:44

I still remember the early years of Brahmos development and R&D days in DRDO labs and the two camps of thought that were heard in the mess hall. On one side were people who thought this will lead to nothing and all we will get to do is re branding of p800. Other side was more practical in its approach with the realization that yes, we may not get everything on day 1, but who can say where we will be on day 100. Towards the end, like most things in "imarat" the practical, pragmatist side just rolled up the sleeves and took the challenge and look where we are now. Its been a decade and half since and every time I see this baby nail another round of trials it still makes my chest proud.

Prem Kumar · Post by **Prem Kumar** » 18 Dec 2019 23:50

I hope, somewhere, we are experimenting/reverse-engineering our own LFRJ engine. Contractually, we cannot put it on Brahmos, but we can launch our own series of missiles

Nikhil T · Post by **Nikhil T** » 19 Dec 2019 04:26

Meanwhile Philippines Defense Ministry confirms it will sign contract for BrahMos in Q1/Q2

https://gulfnews.com/world/asia/india/p ... 1.68535123

"Signing of the contract will be in 2020. Possibly on the first or second quarter," Department of National Defense Secretary Delfin Lorenzana was quoted as saying by Philippine News Agency.

When asked on how many BrahMos units the Philippines will be acquiring, Lorenzana said "two batteries".

A missile battery is equivalent to three mobile autonomous launchers with two or three missile tubes each.

In October, ranking Philippines Army officials visited the Shivalik-class guided missile frigate INS Sahyadri (F-49) to learn more about its missile capabilities which include the BrahMos missile.

tsarkar · Post by **tsarkar** » 19 Dec 2019 09:01

Bad idea. Philippines is one of those countries that have fluid foreign policies and quite pally with China.

Similar to proposing Tejas for Malaysia that has a vociferous Ummah supporting policy.

JTull · Post by **JTull** » 19 Dec 2019 15:00

Sale should be tied to other equipment such as the frigate purchase which didn't materialise!

No one gives their crown jewels before the other low-value but high employment generating stuff.

RKumar · Post by **RKumar** » 19 Dec 2019 15:47

ramana wrote:What are you talking about?

The IAF Brahmos test is the completion of development testing.
The ground based Brahmos test is confirmatory test of the seeker and other major sub-systems.

Basically Brahmos development is over.
On to hypersonic Brahmos.

One twitter handle tweeted some cryptic stuff and clammed up.

Sir, I don't want to speculate at this moment. Just to clarify, my comments were not concerning any specific program.

BTW, big congratulations to MoD, and DRDO for providing new advanced capabilities to the IAF.

ashishvikas · Post by **ashishvikas** » 19 Dec 2019 18:29

#DRDO test fires Quick Reaction Surface-to-Air #Missile (#QRSAM) from Integrated Test Range off #Odisha coast.

https://twitter.com/TheHemantRout/statu ... 83009?s=19

Prem Kumar · Post by **Prem Kumar** » 19 Dec 2019 23:25

Tests galore today

Pinaka-MKII also test fired. 75Km range. The surprising element was the mention that its IRNSS guided, in addition to inertial guidance!

https://twitter.com/livefist/status/1207629550785646593

fanne · Post by **fanne** » 20 Dec 2019 00:14

are there any Pinka 2 launchers already ordered/in service?

sivab · Post by **sivab** » 20 Dec 2019 12:39

https://twitter.com/ANI/status/1207902952159154176

ANI
‏@ANI
51m51 minutes ago

Pinaka Missile System developed by Defence Research & Development Organisation (DRDO) was again successfully tested today off the Odisha coast. The extended range version of the missile can hit targets at 90 kms.

One more test today.

Vips · Post by **Vips** » 20 Dec 2019 17:34

Extension of range from 75 Kms to 90 Kms. Super. Not long before we have the new Pinaka at range of 120 Kms being tested.

chetonzz · Post by **chetonzz** » 20 Dec 2019 17:47

the ITR tests are jumped up many many times from last few months...what exactly does that indicate? intimidation tactics or "something huge"?