Yes, through personal contacts.Jay wrote:Do you have a source for this?Kati wrote:
Unkil haa been receuiring desis within its borders to go to Ukr, not necessarilt foe fighti g, but to gathee intel posing aa int'al students. Others are being recruited as mercenaries
Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
- With the death of Maj. Gen. Vladimir Frolov, Ukrainian troops have now killed eight Russian generals in 51 days of war.
Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
to put into perspective eq to brigadier IAAmber G. wrote:- With the death of Maj. Gen. Vladimir Frolov, Ukrainian troops have now killed eight Russian generals in 51 days of war.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Army_rank ... Federation
Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
The countries of Europe have literally become hunting dogs for the Americans.
Iran and Venezuala are evil, go after them woof woof.
We need oil from Iran and Venezuala now, everything is forgiven, woof woof.
Iran and Venezuala are evil, go after them woof woof.
We need oil from Iran and Venezuala now, everything is forgiven, woof woof.
Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
So are you saying you have family/friends in the US, who are just civilians, and US agencies have approached them and asked them if they can go to UKR to fight against Russia?Kati wrote:Yes, through personal contacts.Jay wrote:
Do you have a source for this?
Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
Zelensky in meltdown mode, doing Kejriwal type nautanki while asking Azov trapped fighters to die , this video is a keeper https://twitter.com/abunin/status/15154 ... 070VeZ1e8A
Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... mailonline
Another ex British soldier captured by Russia in Mariopol, paraded in Moscow
Another ex British soldier captured by Russia in Mariopol, paraded in Moscow
Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
first thought that came to mind.. exactly noted in comments .. is he high ? must be getting some really good stuff wherever he isIndraD wrote:Zelensky in meltdown mode, doing Kejriwal type nautanki while asking Azov trapped fighters to die , this video is a keeper https://twitter.com/abunin/status/15154 ... 070VeZ1e8A
Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
skumar wrote:The countries of Europe have literally become hunting dogs for the Americans.
Iran and Venezuala are evil, go after them woof woof.
We need oil from Iran and Venezuala now, everything is forgiven, woof woof.
Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
https://theconversation.com/russia-ukra ... ces-181173
Russia-Ukraine crisis highlights Africa’s need to diversify its wheat sources
Mandira Bagwandeen, Noncedo Vutula, April 13, 2022
The war between Russia and Ukraine has highlighted just how much of the world’s wheat supply relies on these two countries. For instance, a recently released UN report shows a sample of 25 African countries that rely on wheat imports from Russia or Ukraine. Of this group, 21 import most of their wheat from Russia.
Between 2018 and 2020, Africa imported US$3.7 billion in wheat (32% of the continent’s total wheat imports) from Russia and another US$1.4 billion from Ukraine (12% of the continent’s wheat imports).
It’s crucial that African countries diversify their wheat sources for two key reasons.
First, wheat forms an important component of diets. Not having enough brings the threat of hunger and political instability.
Second, Africa’s dependency on Russian wheat imports will influence key political and military decisions. Given some African countries’ dependence on Russian wheat, it could’ve influenced how they voted on the two United Nations General Assembly resolutions concerning Russia’s invasion of Ukraine. In both instances, a surprising number of countries either supported Russia or remained neutral. One reason for this could be because they wouldn’t want to upset relations with a good supplier.
Over the centuries, the sourcing of wheat has factored into the political and strategic decisions and security of many countries.
Consider the ancient Greek city-state of Athens: in the fifth century BC, Athens had to feed an ever-growing population. Officials turned towards parts of Egypt, Sicily, Syria and the Black Sea region to fill Athenian granaries – a pattern of expansion and trade which has often been repeated in world history.
Nazi Germany addressed food shortages via its Hunger Plan –- a policy for the seizure of food from the Soviet Union to feed German soldiers and civilians.
During the Cold War, the US used its advantage as a major wheat-producing nation to influence decision makers and cement support among states. Wheat exports accompanied American military deployments around the world.
In 2022, the geopolitics of wheat has once again come under the spotlight with Russia’s invasion of Ukraine.
As experts on foreign relations – with a focus on African political economy and trade and agriculture in Africa – we wanted to highlight the dependency of many African countries on wheat supplies from these two warring nations, and we wanted to stress the need for the region to diversify its wheat sources.
.....
Gautam
Russia-Ukraine crisis highlights Africa’s need to diversify its wheat sources
Mandira Bagwandeen, Noncedo Vutula, April 13, 2022
The war between Russia and Ukraine has highlighted just how much of the world’s wheat supply relies on these two countries. For instance, a recently released UN report shows a sample of 25 African countries that rely on wheat imports from Russia or Ukraine. Of this group, 21 import most of their wheat from Russia.
Between 2018 and 2020, Africa imported US$3.7 billion in wheat (32% of the continent’s total wheat imports) from Russia and another US$1.4 billion from Ukraine (12% of the continent’s wheat imports).
It’s crucial that African countries diversify their wheat sources for two key reasons.
First, wheat forms an important component of diets. Not having enough brings the threat of hunger and political instability.
Second, Africa’s dependency on Russian wheat imports will influence key political and military decisions. Given some African countries’ dependence on Russian wheat, it could’ve influenced how they voted on the two United Nations General Assembly resolutions concerning Russia’s invasion of Ukraine. In both instances, a surprising number of countries either supported Russia or remained neutral. One reason for this could be because they wouldn’t want to upset relations with a good supplier.
Over the centuries, the sourcing of wheat has factored into the political and strategic decisions and security of many countries.
Consider the ancient Greek city-state of Athens: in the fifth century BC, Athens had to feed an ever-growing population. Officials turned towards parts of Egypt, Sicily, Syria and the Black Sea region to fill Athenian granaries – a pattern of expansion and trade which has often been repeated in world history.
Nazi Germany addressed food shortages via its Hunger Plan –- a policy for the seizure of food from the Soviet Union to feed German soldiers and civilians.
During the Cold War, the US used its advantage as a major wheat-producing nation to influence decision makers and cement support among states. Wheat exports accompanied American military deployments around the world.
In 2022, the geopolitics of wheat has once again come under the spotlight with Russia’s invasion of Ukraine.
As experts on foreign relations – with a focus on African political economy and trade and agriculture in Africa – we wanted to highlight the dependency of many African countries on wheat supplies from these two warring nations, and we wanted to stress the need for the region to diversify its wheat sources.
.....
Gautam
Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
Same apply for oil. Why to buy oil from US,Arabs only? We have to diversify.g.sarkar wrote:https://theconversation.com/russia-ukra ... ces-181173
Russia-Ukraine crisis highlights Africa’s need to diversify its wheat sources
Mandira Bagwandeen, Noncedo Vutula, April 13, 2022
The war between Russia and Ukraine has highlighted just how much of the world’s wheat supply relies on these two countries. For instance, a recently released UN report shows a sample of 25 African countries that rely on wheat imports from Russia or Ukraine. Of this group, 21 import most of their wheat from Russia.
Between 2018 and 2020, Africa imported US$3.7 billion in wheat (32% of the continent’s total wheat imports) from Russia and another US$1.4 billion from Ukraine (12% of the continent’s wheat imports).
It’s crucial that African countries diversify their wheat sources for two key reasons.
First, wheat forms an important component of diets. Not having enough brings the threat of hunger and political instability.
Second, Africa’s dependency on Russian wheat imports will influence key political and military decisions. Given some African countries’ dependence on Russian wheat, it could’ve influenced how they voted on the two United Nations General Assembly resolutions concerning Russia’s invasion of Ukraine. In both instances, a surprising number of countries either supported Russia or remained neutral. One reason for this could be because they wouldn’t want to upset relations with a good supplier.
Over the centuries, the sourcing of wheat has factored into the political and strategic decisions and security of many countries.
Consider the ancient Greek city-state of Athens: in the fifth century BC, Athens had to feed an ever-growing population. Officials turned towards parts of Egypt, Sicily, Syria and the Black Sea region to fill Athenian granaries – a pattern of expansion and trade which has often been repeated in world history.
Nazi Germany addressed food shortages via its Hunger Plan –- a policy for the seizure of food from the Soviet Union to feed German soldiers and civilians.
During the Cold War, the US used its advantage as a major wheat-producing nation to influence decision makers and cement support among states. Wheat exports accompanied American military deployments around the world.
In 2022, the geopolitics of wheat has once again come under the spotlight with Russia’s invasion of Ukraine.
As experts on foreign relations – with a focus on African political economy and trade and agriculture in Africa – we wanted to highlight the dependency of many African countries on wheat supplies from these two warring nations, and we wanted to stress the need for the region to diversify its wheat sources.
.....
Gautam
Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
https://www.rt.com/russia/554029-foreig ... -mariupol/
Russia publishes data on foreign mercenaries in Ukraine
An estimated 6,824 foreign mercenaries from 63 countries have come to Ukraine to fight for Volodymyr Zelensky’s government, the Russian Defense Ministry stated on Sunday. Of these, 1,035 have been “destroyed,” while several thousand remain. Four hundred foreign fighters are holed up in Mariupol, where nationalist forces, including the neo-Nazi fighters, have refused to surrender.
The most numerous group of foreign fighters (1,717) arrived from Poland, while around 1,500 came from the US, Canada and Romania. Up to 300 people each came from the UK and Georgia, while 193 arrived from the Turkish-controlled areas of Syria.
These figures were announced on Sunday by Defense Ministry spokesman Major General Igor Konashenkov. According to the general, 1,035 foreign mercenaries have been killed by Russian forces and 912 fled Ukraine, leaving 4,877 active in the cities of Kiev, Kharkov, Odessa, Nikolaev and Mariupol.
Roughly 400 of these foreign fighters remain embedded with Ukrainian nationalist battalions in the besieged port city of Mariupol, Konashenkov stated. With most of the city under Russian control, these forces have dug in at the sprawling Azovstal metallurgical plant, a gargantuan Soviet-built factory complex spread over 11 square kilometers.
British captive who fought in Mariupol describes ‘reality’READ MORE: British captive who fought in Mariupol describes ‘reality’
“Most of them are citizens of European countries, as well as Canada,” Konashenkov stated, adding that Russian forces have intercepted radio communications from the plant in six foreign languages. After the surrender of more than 1,000 members of Ukraine’s 36th Marines Brigade at the Ilyich Steel and Iron Works in Mariupol earlier this week, which Ukraine denies, the Russian military offered the defenders at Azovstal a final chance to lay down their arms and surrender on Sunday morning, promising that “all who lay down their weapons are guaranteed the preservation of life.”
No such surrender took place, and the pounding of heavy guns could be heard near the plant on Sunday afternoon. “In case of further resistance, all of them will be destroyed,” Konashenkov said.
“Let me remind you that foreign mercenaries do not have the status of ‘combatants’ under International Humanitarian Law,” Konashenkov said. “They came to Ukraine to earn money by killing Slavs. Therefore, the best that awaits them is criminal liability and long prison terms.”
Within days of Russia’s military assault on Ukraine, the government in Kiev promised visa-free entry for foreigners willing to take up arms against Moscow’s forces. Potential recruits visited Ukrainian embassies across the West and signed up to fight – often with the blessing of their own governments – and made their way to the battlefield.
Russia says it’s struck another mercenary base in UkraineREAD MORE: Russia says it’s struck another mercenary base in Ukraine
However, recruitment was narrowed in March to those with military experience, and paused entirely at the beginning of April. A spokesman for Ukraine’s so-called “International Legion” told Canadian media that sending untrained volunteers to the front was becoming more of a hindrance than a help, and supplies of firearms and ammunition were running low.
Some of those who made the journey shared horror stories online of being sent to the front lines with inadequate weapons and ammo, while recruitment suffered after a Russian missile strike leveled a training center for these foreigners near the Western Ukrainian city of Lvov. “Up to 180 foreign mercenaries and a large quantity of foreign weapons were destroyed,” Konashenkov said at the time.
Russia publishes data on foreign mercenaries in Ukraine
An estimated 6,824 foreign mercenaries from 63 countries have come to Ukraine to fight for Volodymyr Zelensky’s government, the Russian Defense Ministry stated on Sunday. Of these, 1,035 have been “destroyed,” while several thousand remain. Four hundred foreign fighters are holed up in Mariupol, where nationalist forces, including the neo-Nazi fighters, have refused to surrender.
The most numerous group of foreign fighters (1,717) arrived from Poland, while around 1,500 came from the US, Canada and Romania. Up to 300 people each came from the UK and Georgia, while 193 arrived from the Turkish-controlled areas of Syria.
These figures were announced on Sunday by Defense Ministry spokesman Major General Igor Konashenkov. According to the general, 1,035 foreign mercenaries have been killed by Russian forces and 912 fled Ukraine, leaving 4,877 active in the cities of Kiev, Kharkov, Odessa, Nikolaev and Mariupol.
Roughly 400 of these foreign fighters remain embedded with Ukrainian nationalist battalions in the besieged port city of Mariupol, Konashenkov stated. With most of the city under Russian control, these forces have dug in at the sprawling Azovstal metallurgical plant, a gargantuan Soviet-built factory complex spread over 11 square kilometers.
British captive who fought in Mariupol describes ‘reality’READ MORE: British captive who fought in Mariupol describes ‘reality’
“Most of them are citizens of European countries, as well as Canada,” Konashenkov stated, adding that Russian forces have intercepted radio communications from the plant in six foreign languages. After the surrender of more than 1,000 members of Ukraine’s 36th Marines Brigade at the Ilyich Steel and Iron Works in Mariupol earlier this week, which Ukraine denies, the Russian military offered the defenders at Azovstal a final chance to lay down their arms and surrender on Sunday morning, promising that “all who lay down their weapons are guaranteed the preservation of life.”
No such surrender took place, and the pounding of heavy guns could be heard near the plant on Sunday afternoon. “In case of further resistance, all of them will be destroyed,” Konashenkov said.
“Let me remind you that foreign mercenaries do not have the status of ‘combatants’ under International Humanitarian Law,” Konashenkov said. “They came to Ukraine to earn money by killing Slavs. Therefore, the best that awaits them is criminal liability and long prison terms.”
Within days of Russia’s military assault on Ukraine, the government in Kiev promised visa-free entry for foreigners willing to take up arms against Moscow’s forces. Potential recruits visited Ukrainian embassies across the West and signed up to fight – often with the blessing of their own governments – and made their way to the battlefield.
Russia says it’s struck another mercenary base in UkraineREAD MORE: Russia says it’s struck another mercenary base in Ukraine
However, recruitment was narrowed in March to those with military experience, and paused entirely at the beginning of April. A spokesman for Ukraine’s so-called “International Legion” told Canadian media that sending untrained volunteers to the front was becoming more of a hindrance than a help, and supplies of firearms and ammunition were running low.
Some of those who made the journey shared horror stories online of being sent to the front lines with inadequate weapons and ammo, while recruitment suffered after a Russian missile strike leveled a training center for these foreigners near the Western Ukrainian city of Lvov. “Up to 180 foreign mercenaries and a large quantity of foreign weapons were destroyed,” Konashenkov said at the time.
Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
Now Russia is being forced into a corner where they have to use tactical nukes. This new wave of offensive weapons being supplied to Ukraine means that Russia has two choices now:
1) Allow the new arms to flow in, and face military defeat. Essentially this option = "surrender" with regime change in Moscow soon to follow. This would probably lead to civil war and the permanent dismemberment of Russia, the US's longstanding goal. Can Putin surrender? Is that even possible?
2) Use tactical nukes to stop further arms deliveries. Tactical nukes are the only option as Russia lacks sufficient conventional strike capability to interdict these shipments. This is the "escalate to de-escalate" strategy and in my opinion, it's Putin's only real option. The alternative for Putin is accepting military defeat, getting overthrown and handed over to the Hague as a war criminal, or more likely just being executed along with his family. The ensuing civil war will kill millions of Russians. Since option 1 (surrender) is basically a death sentence for Putin himself, and for Russia as a nation, it's not really much of a choice.
I'm guessing Putin would go with option 2.
1) Allow the new arms to flow in, and face military defeat. Essentially this option = "surrender" with regime change in Moscow soon to follow. This would probably lead to civil war and the permanent dismemberment of Russia, the US's longstanding goal. Can Putin surrender? Is that even possible?
2) Use tactical nukes to stop further arms deliveries. Tactical nukes are the only option as Russia lacks sufficient conventional strike capability to interdict these shipments. This is the "escalate to de-escalate" strategy and in my opinion, it's Putin's only real option. The alternative for Putin is accepting military defeat, getting overthrown and handed over to the Hague as a war criminal, or more likely just being executed along with his family. The ensuing civil war will kill millions of Russians. Since option 1 (surrender) is basically a death sentence for Putin himself, and for Russia as a nation, it's not really much of a choice.
I'm guessing Putin would go with option 2.
Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
X posting from mil thread:
Seems RuA has slowed down the operations for a few days. The number of people who fled westwards to Eastern European countries as refugees is much lesser from east and south Ukraine where Russian forces are in control. RuA has started running bread factories, hospitals, hoping to restart schools where possible etc. Pro-Russian people have been appointed as city mayors and given the massive destruction that has happened, RuA is at least in part mobilised in helping the population. Good to see them doing that, shows they consider a country as people, not just territory.
RuA might also be taking this time to interrogate and collect information from PoWS to better organise the next wave of offensive operations while at the same time, give a breather to frontline troops, keep softening UkrA positions using Arty & air raids, hit supply lines coming from the west - all of which they continued to do, even as fuel, ammo, rations and water run out for Ukr troops in the east.
As I see it, this slowing down is a sign that RuA is in control of this war, and have earned the luxury to launch further operations at places and times of their choosing.
Once Azovstahl is completely cleaned out or cratered, I suspect the wind to go out of NATO and whoever is elensly's puppeteers in Ukraine. What exactly to continue fighting for will become a question that must be answered. At its own pace, Russia will take most of what is east of Dneipr river, west of it will be a buffer state with a figurehead under Russian control and may not even be called Ukraine - too much neo-nazi and defeat evoked by that name.
From European NATO countries perspective, ruling leaders will justify "but for our collective action things could have turned far worse" and start bickering over cost of 4 million refugees, battling inflation, energy crisis and of course about replenishing their dwindled military stocks.
And US be like "t'was fun while it lasted, let a battered Russia lick its wounds and bankrupt itself rebuilding what used to be Ukraine, its no longer a worthy opponent. Lets quickly get our MIC to hard sell all kinds of equipment to these naiwoke EU buggers and sign B$$$ of contracts before they realise their economy is down the drain. Burp! Ayy craumba ! Howdy Taiwan, here I come to save you from the evil Panda ..."
Seems RuA has slowed down the operations for a few days. The number of people who fled westwards to Eastern European countries as refugees is much lesser from east and south Ukraine where Russian forces are in control. RuA has started running bread factories, hospitals, hoping to restart schools where possible etc. Pro-Russian people have been appointed as city mayors and given the massive destruction that has happened, RuA is at least in part mobilised in helping the population. Good to see them doing that, shows they consider a country as people, not just territory.
RuA might also be taking this time to interrogate and collect information from PoWS to better organise the next wave of offensive operations while at the same time, give a breather to frontline troops, keep softening UkrA positions using Arty & air raids, hit supply lines coming from the west - all of which they continued to do, even as fuel, ammo, rations and water run out for Ukr troops in the east.
As I see it, this slowing down is a sign that RuA is in control of this war, and have earned the luxury to launch further operations at places and times of their choosing.
Once Azovstahl is completely cleaned out or cratered, I suspect the wind to go out of NATO and whoever is elensly's puppeteers in Ukraine. What exactly to continue fighting for will become a question that must be answered. At its own pace, Russia will take most of what is east of Dneipr river, west of it will be a buffer state with a figurehead under Russian control and may not even be called Ukraine - too much neo-nazi and defeat evoked by that name.
From European NATO countries perspective, ruling leaders will justify "but for our collective action things could have turned far worse" and start bickering over cost of 4 million refugees, battling inflation, energy crisis and of course about replenishing their dwindled military stocks.
And US be like "t'was fun while it lasted, let a battered Russia lick its wounds and bankrupt itself rebuilding what used to be Ukraine, its no longer a worthy opponent. Lets quickly get our MIC to hard sell all kinds of equipment to these naiwoke EU buggers and sign B$$$ of contracts before they realise their economy is down the drain. Burp! Ayy craumba ! Howdy Taiwan, here I come to save you from the evil Panda ..."
Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
There is no way Russia will use Tacts on its own people. not going to happen. This still has ways to go...
Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
I'm thinking a tactical nuke targeted at a NATO arms shipment. This would be more a warning than just an attempt at supply interdiction. Putin would first give his generals a chance to take Donbas and secure the land link / water supply to Crimea, but failing that, he would resort to a tacnuke strike, followed by immediate calls for a cease fire with NATO.V_Raman wrote:There is no way Russia will use Tacts on its own people. not going to happen. This still has ways to go...
Since the alternative is defeat followed by regime change and his own death or imprisonment, the real question is why not do this?
Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
I see no indications that Russia is losing this war. Au contraire...
Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
Because that would be a barbaric act and is reserved for mad situation. If he simply wants a truce with NATO, he can stop this war right now and still be in a position which he will be even after detonating a Nuke. I want Russia to prevail, but not at the cost of recklessly detonating a nuke.Y. Kanan wrote:the real question is why not do this?
Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
Former head of Russian Foreign Intelligence Service dies.
Vyacheslav Trubnikov, ex-head of the Russian Foreign Intelligence Service and ambassador to India, died on April 18 ...the Russian state-run TASS news agency reported. The cause of death is unknown
Vyacheslav Trubnikov, ex-head of the Russian Foreign Intelligence Service and ambassador to India, died on April 18 ...the Russian state-run TASS news agency reported. The cause of death is unknown
Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
Nukes will be used only when Russia is sure that they are going to lose. They are having troubles but no where near losing ie. Lose crimea and donbas.Y. Kanan wrote: the real question is why not do this?
Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
British mercenary now Russian pow interview: FWIW
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Cain Marko
- BRF Oldie
- Posts: 5360
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Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
The Russians seem to be going about their business without much fanfare in Russian standard time. It's another matter that most coverage shows them losing badly. We'll know soon enough...doodh ka doodh ityadi.Cyrano wrote:I see no indications that Russia is losing this war. Au contraire...
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sohamn
- BRFite
- Posts: 462
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- Contact:
Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
Cyrano wrote:British mercenary now Russian pow interview: FWIW
If I would be Boris Johnson I won't do anything to get these guys out. Although both of them are British citizens, they are also Ukrainian citizens and residing in Ukraine for many years and married to Ukranian's as well. They are anything but foreign mercenaries. They very well knew what they were getting into, why ask for British help - especially when you are an Ukranian citizen as well.
-
sohamn
- BRFite
- Posts: 462
- Joined: 27 Jul 2006 12:56
- Location: the Queen of the Angels of Porziuncola
- Contact:
Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
Cyrano wrote:I see no indications that Russia is losing this war. Au contraire...
They will get an tactical win here and there but will have strategic defeat here, much like Pakistan in 65.
They are into 55th day of the war and its not close to be over. The more the war drags on, the worse it becomes for Russia. The element of surprise is lost, morale is low and initiative is lacking. They were anything but decisive in the first phase of the war. More NATO weapons will continue to flow now, and it will become a guerilla war because a significant population base in the east is still loyal to Ukraine.
They have lost of a lot of assets and have shown the world that Russia is not as disciplined of an armed force.
Scandinavian countries may just well join NATO and will be a big loss for Putin.
Ukraine ( or whatever is left ) will join EU.
Global sanctions will make them vulnerable to China, very likely they will become subservient to China.
They might as well push Germany to wean its reliance on Russian energy.
The biggest blunder Putin committed was the slow and logistically inept war in the first phase. He thought he could change the regime. Had he just focussed on the south east via a Blitz type operation the war would have been over long back.
Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
I am not sure that a Russian defeat is bad for PRC. A defeated and sullen Russia will be anti west and will need PRC for financial sustainability.
PRC in return will be relieved of it's requirements of arranging energy supplies and vast amount of minirals required to fuel it's future economic growth. Form potentially unreliable sources such as Arabian peninsula and southern Americas.
This removes any and all ability of US to deny such supplies to PRC. Unless they take over Moscow and imposed a puppet regime on Russia. But that is not on the cards.
Why is USA so hell bent on creating such an outcome?
PRC in return will be relieved of it's requirements of arranging energy supplies and vast amount of minirals required to fuel it's future economic growth. Form potentially unreliable sources such as Arabian peninsula and southern Americas.
This removes any and all ability of US to deny such supplies to PRC. Unless they take over Moscow and imposed a puppet regime on Russia. But that is not on the cards.
Why is USA so hell bent on creating such an outcome?
Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
I would like the learned posters here to focus their thinking and post from a "what is bet for India" perspective, please....
Ultimately that is all that matters.
Ultimately that is all that matters.
Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
Simple, need to grow economic might in order to be able to turn the Indian rupee as a currency of foreign trade.
Build our own answer to SWIFT.
Make RU PAY a global payment processing gateway for Indian account holders.
Develop our own lithography machine building industry/ company/ ecosystem.
We need a Russia that is not totally dependent on PRC. So that PRC's strategic options are not multiplied many fold.
We need a US that is not psychotic or compromised by PRC. So that the possibility of US negotiated G2 can be avoided and completely eliminated.
Only, sun the moon and everything in between.
Build our own answer to SWIFT.
Make RU PAY a global payment processing gateway for Indian account holders.
Develop our own lithography machine building industry/ company/ ecosystem.
We need a Russia that is not totally dependent on PRC. So that PRC's strategic options are not multiplied many fold.
We need a US that is not psychotic or compromised by PRC. So that the possibility of US negotiated G2 can be avoided and completely eliminated.
Only, sun the moon and everything in between.
Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
A regime change in Russia is what the west (US ) wants. Another land rich in resource for their ( now their is in context., the military MNC and their owning Funds rather ( read Soros for example ) ; the west is saturated, people are docile, and lands utilised to their limits., they need virgin lands to conquer and plunder ., like Russia and the east european countries, and looking at India in the longer term.Pratyush wrote:I am not sure that a Russian defeat is bad for PRC. A defeated and sullen Russia will be anti west and will need PRC for financial sustainability.
PRC in return will be relieved of it's requirements of arranging energy supplies and vast amount of minirals required to fuel it's future economic growth. Form potentially unreliable sources such as Arabian peninsula and southern Americas.
Why is USA so hell bent on creating such an outcome?
One only must remind oneself why in a bygone era why kings sought out new lands to conquer., only that in the "new" world the kings are the western oligarch multinationals built with immense wealth plundered from other countries including India..
Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
unfortunately India cannot and maybe should not insulate itself from the world , we still have not been proactive enough focusing more on our weaknesses .. but then..ks_sachin wrote:I would like the learned posters here to focus their thinking and post from a "what is bet for India" perspective, please....
Ultimately that is all that matters.
Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
But make no mistake, i think they WILL use nukes if it comes to that.vinod wrote:Nukes will be used only when Russia is sure that they are going to lose. They are having troubles but no where near losing ie. Lose crimea and donbas.Y. Kanan wrote: the real question is why not do this?
And i think THAT is something Britain and US need to seriously consider before
Just like some idiotic "intelligence agency" people in Russia who thought they could siphon money off Uke ops., there are similar gents in UK and Wash who think they can militarily defeat Russia and force a regime change, and advising their masters on those
War never ends well., and this is right at oiropes door step .
Humanity might just lose their home as they know it because of some blundering idiots.
Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
Over the last 25 years, the western regime change interventions have almost never succeeded in the targeted country. What makes the western world leaders think that they can succeed with Russia. When they have failed with Iraq, Syria, Libya, Iran, Cuba, North Korea.kit wrote:A regime change in Russia is what the west (US ) wants. Another land rich in resource for their ( now their is in context., the military MNC and their owning Funds rather ( read Soros for example ) ; the west is saturated, people are docile, and lands utilised to their limits., they need virgin lands to conquer and plunder ., like Russia and the east european countries, and looking at India in the longer term.
Snip...
What happens if Putin is replaced by a new western puppet. How will the emergence of a nationalist leader be controlled in a post Putin Russia 10 -15 years time?
Like Putin emerged after Yeltsin.
How deep and broad-based the purge has to be in order to prevent such an outcome?
Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
Good question., but i think the west themselves won't be able to predict or control such an outcome., they could try a "maidan" from their embassy but Moscow and Russia is a different kettle of fish.,Pratyush wrote:How deep and broad-based the purge has to be in order to prevent such an outcome?kit wrote:A regime change in Russia is what the west (US ) wants. Another land rich in resource for their ( now their is in context., the military MNC and their owning Funds rather ( read Soros for example ) ; the west is saturated, people are docile, and lands utilised to their limits., they need virgin lands to conquer and plunder ., like Russia and the east european countries, and looking at India in the longer term.
Snip...
So likely interest is keep the kettle boiling and catch the fish popping out and soon at some point move in
keep in mind they are playing the long game not immediate outcome
Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
Why do we think US wants regime change in Russia?
Beat down Russia. Make Russia beholden to PRC; PRC has access to Russian oil & minerals at fire sale prices. What does PRC do with these minerals? Build stuff and export at low prices to the US and rest of the world. US continues to get low cost goods. Who is winning here?
Beat down Russia. Make Russia beholden to PRC; PRC has access to Russian oil & minerals at fire sale prices. What does PRC do with these minerals? Build stuff and export at low prices to the US and rest of the world. US continues to get low cost goods. Who is winning here?
Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
US getting low cost goods is ultimately exporting it's wealth to PRC. It will eventually loose it's ability to be a good market for PRC.
Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
Russia has bombed Azovstahl plant in Mauriopol for 2 straight days, special forces are moving in today to mop up.
The pincer offensive on AFU units dug in opposite Donbass has started as well.
For those who complain that this offensive has taken 50 days etc. Why are you surprised? Both sides have been engaged in a low intensity conflict since 2014 and had ample time to prepare before Russia took the bait and started this extensive offensive. RA is not fighting AFU but NATO under US' hands-on remote C&C. Isn't that obvious after 129 pages of this thread? Then why do you expect a decisive victory for RA i.e. decisive defeat for NATO in a matter of few weeks?
Neither side wants to go nuclear on Ukrainian soil due to a ton of good reasons, especially Russia since it would cause radiation fallout on its territory as well. This talk only happens if one has bought into "Putin is a madman" narrative. Recent events have disproved that beyond any doubt.
Ditto for Russia attacking Baltic republics or Finland, Sweden etc. The way things are, there is simply no benefit not to speak of no capacity in Russia to open other fronts. However, if Russia is repeatedly provoked in those regions as well, then the wish will be granted by Russia out of sheer necessity to defend its own interests.
The current US govt, especially Biden is obsessed with displacing Putin and pulling Russia down. I don't see them having a well laid out plan beyond that. A weakened Russia opens so many possibilities in so many domains...
The pincer offensive on AFU units dug in opposite Donbass has started as well.
For those who complain that this offensive has taken 50 days etc. Why are you surprised? Both sides have been engaged in a low intensity conflict since 2014 and had ample time to prepare before Russia took the bait and started this extensive offensive. RA is not fighting AFU but NATO under US' hands-on remote C&C. Isn't that obvious after 129 pages of this thread? Then why do you expect a decisive victory for RA i.e. decisive defeat for NATO in a matter of few weeks?
Neither side wants to go nuclear on Ukrainian soil due to a ton of good reasons, especially Russia since it would cause radiation fallout on its territory as well. This talk only happens if one has bought into "Putin is a madman" narrative. Recent events have disproved that beyond any doubt.
Ditto for Russia attacking Baltic republics or Finland, Sweden etc. The way things are, there is simply no benefit not to speak of no capacity in Russia to open other fronts. However, if Russia is repeatedly provoked in those regions as well, then the wish will be granted by Russia out of sheer necessity to defend its own interests.
The current US govt, especially Biden is obsessed with displacing Putin and pulling Russia down. I don't see them having a well laid out plan beyond that. A weakened Russia opens so many possibilities in so many domains...
Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
Cyrano,
Just to set the record straight
- I don't favour one side over the other - they can both blast themselves to the stone ages for all I care
- I am not interested in the deep state or the floating state.
- I am not interested in the ideologies of the actors or of BR posters.
I am only interested in understanding combat planning and execution.
I am interested in how combat tactics and plans are shaped by strategic goals.
I am interested in how org structure / combact org structure aids / fails the meeting of tactical goals and ultimately strategic goals.
Above all, I am interested in what is in it for India.
Otherwise a lot of this stuff on this thread is for intelligent people. I am a simple infantry man’s son and grandson.
Regards
S
Just to set the record straight
- I don't favour one side over the other - they can both blast themselves to the stone ages for all I care
- I am not interested in the deep state or the floating state.
- I am not interested in the ideologies of the actors or of BR posters.
I am only interested in understanding combat planning and execution.
I am interested in how combat tactics and plans are shaped by strategic goals.
I am interested in how org structure / combact org structure aids / fails the meeting of tactical goals and ultimately strategic goals.
Above all, I am interested in what is in it for India.
Otherwise a lot of this stuff on this thread is for intelligent people. I am a simple infantry man’s son and grandson.
Regards
S
Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
Sachin ji,
I wasn't responding to you or anyone in particular.
The overall sentiment I see among some of our posters who are understandably conflicted since this SMO started on Feb24. At times, there is satisfaction that Unkil's getting a punch on the nose, there is curiosity on how a powerful military like Russia will conduct a large scale war in Europe and not some 3rd world country, some handwringing on India's position that came under serious attack by the West & western media, a broad desire to see Russia win at least partially, and some concern that this has not happened after 7 weeks, and as soon as some state dept idiot talks about N threat, tac nuks etc relay it here in anguish...
For a keen observer, there are already tons of pointers for Indian interests. For me, it was how the western system has reacted when you don't tow their line, the fault lines, the ultimate cost or Karma of committing atrocities on ones own citizen, the massive manipulation of "free media", the callous disregard for Ukr lives on the geo-politic chessboard, the importance of having a strong MIC at home and so on...
The current events are tragic but fascinating, we are all discovering and reacting to what we perceive as important event or cause of events. Some foolhardy ones like myself sometimes dare to predict whats coming next... but if it were so easy or I was so competent, I'd be doing something else and not sitting behind a keyboard.
I wasn't responding to you or anyone in particular.
The overall sentiment I see among some of our posters who are understandably conflicted since this SMO started on Feb24. At times, there is satisfaction that Unkil's getting a punch on the nose, there is curiosity on how a powerful military like Russia will conduct a large scale war in Europe and not some 3rd world country, some handwringing on India's position that came under serious attack by the West & western media, a broad desire to see Russia win at least partially, and some concern that this has not happened after 7 weeks, and as soon as some state dept idiot talks about N threat, tac nuks etc relay it here in anguish...
For a keen observer, there are already tons of pointers for Indian interests. For me, it was how the western system has reacted when you don't tow their line, the fault lines, the ultimate cost or Karma of committing atrocities on ones own citizen, the massive manipulation of "free media", the callous disregard for Ukr lives on the geo-politic chessboard, the importance of having a strong MIC at home and so on...
The current events are tragic but fascinating, we are all discovering and reacting to what we perceive as important event or cause of events. Some foolhardy ones like myself sometimes dare to predict whats coming next... but if it were so easy or I was so competent, I'd be doing something else and not sitting behind a keyboard.
Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
https://www.livemint.com/news/world/rus ... 97324.html
An opportunity for India to capture Russian FMCG market. I don't think a large part of this market will ever go back to Europe. Also white goods, automobile, furniture, luxury items are there for the taking.
An opportunity for India to capture Russian FMCG market. I don't think a large part of this market will ever go back to Europe. Also white goods, automobile, furniture, luxury items are there for the taking.
Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
Absolutely! Can't sit back and let the Chinese or SEAsia grab business all the time. Hope Indian business houses wean away from low risk licence Raj domestic screwdriver giti mindset.
May be Baba Ramdev will rise to the occassion better than HLL.
May be Baba Ramdev will rise to the occassion better than HLL.
Re: Eastern Europe/Ukraine [Feb 6th 2015]
Victory Day May 9 is a symbolic date for Russia and that may be the date by which Russia may want to declare victory by forcing Ukraine to an agreement. War will get more brutal in the coming week.
If this date passes, the urgency recedes.
If this date passes, the urgency recedes.