India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

[williams]

Good opportunity for India to capitalize and keep some talented folks home

Absolutely ! The current model of India(ns) paying for the education until graduation of their best and brightest only to see them moving to the west and settling there cannot continue for ever.

Young people and their parents don't understand all these, they will run where the opportunity exists. It is very important we create opportunities in terms of higher education, jobs and entrepreneurship right at home so that these young people contribute here at home. I am not saying that opportunities do not exist, but it is highly competitive and we could not meet the demand. Otherwise why would people wait for > 10 years to get a GC and be treated as second class citizens in another country?

[Amber G.]

Per some reports, India is preparing to take back around 18,000 of its citizens who are residing "illegally" in the US (Numbers can be higher).

The Indian government is reportedly working behind the scenes to identify and repatriate its citizens, citing concerns about potential sweeping tariffs imposed by the Trump administration.

[Amber G.]

Meanwhile:

US Secretary of State Marco Rubio is set to meet with India's External Affairs Minister S Jaishankar on Tuesday at the State Department in Washington. This bilateral meeting follows the inaugural QUAD ministerial. It is a significant start to the new administration's foreign engagements .

Normally first engagement choice is Canada. Mexico, or Nato ally. This choice of India for his first bilateral meeting highlights the importance the US places on strengthening ties with the world's largest democracy. As a senator, Rubio advocated for India's treatment on par with US allies like Japan and Israel in technology transfers and defense cooperation.

It's worth noting that Rubio was confirmed as Secretary of State by a unanimous 99-0 Senate vote, and his meeting with Jaishankar coincides with the inauguration of Donald Trump as the 47th US president!

[Amber G.]

I like very competent people coming into the country, says US President Donald Trump on H1B visa issue

-Trump

[Amber G.]

Meanwhile:

US Secretary of State Marco Rubio is set to meet with India's External Affairs Minister S Jaishankar on Tuesday at the State Department in Washington.

[chetak]

Meanwhile:

US Secretary of State Marco Rubio is set to meet with India's External Affairs Minister S Jaishankar on Tuesday at the State Department in Washington. This bilateral meeting follows the inaugural QUAD ministerial. It is a significant start to the new administration's foreign engagements .

Normally first engagement choice is Canada. Mexico, or Nato ally. This choice of India for his first bilateral meeting highlights the importance the US places on strengthening ties with the world's largest democracy. As a senator, Rubio advocated for India's treatment on par with US allies like Japan and Israel in technology transfers and defense cooperation.

It's worth noting that Rubio was confirmed as Secretary of State by a unanimous 99-0 Senate vote, and his meeting with Jaishankar coincides with the inauguration of Donald Trump as the 47th US president!

Amber G ji,


There is also the QUAD foreign ministers meeting with the Sec of state rubio to be held soon and the other QUAD FMs are already in town

[Amber G.]

^^^ Yes, as said, This bilateral meeting follows the inaugural QUAD ministerial. Bu the formal bilateral meeting with India is a significant start and is called 'historic'/ unprecedented (Normally first SOS meet is revered for closest ally's - eg Canada etc).

As one TV News remarked :

Historic: US Secretary of State Marco Rubio meets India’s External Affairs Minister Dr. S. Jaishankar at the Department of State. This is Marco Rubio’s first bilateral engagement after getting Senate confirmation and assuming office. India clearly is on top priority of Trump.

EAM Dr. S. Jaishankar also met newly appointed US NSA Waltz
sure signal to strengthening US-India friendship.

[Amber G.]

Security Breach - There are reports of Khalistani extremist Pannun spotted at Donald Trump's inauguration event. (some videos were released)
Link:<link>

[drnayar]

Security Breach - There are reports of Khalistani extremist Pannun spotted at Donald Trump's inauguration event. (some videos were released)
Link:<link>

some deep fake video ?

[Amber G.]

US Readout of EAM Dr S Jaishankar & SoS Marco Rubio meet:
("Discussed critical and emerging technologies, defense cooperation, energy, and on advancing a free and open Indo-Pacific region"

[Amber G.]

Security Breach - There are reports of Khalistani extremist Pannun spotted at Donald Trump's inauguration event. (some videos were released)
Link:<link>

some deep fake video ?

It seems that he wasn't invited to the mega event, but he attended after purchasing a ticket..
<link> or this <video>

[KL Dubey]

Would be interesting if SC passes it. Because if it goes through without any associated Green card reforms it might be the single biggest deterrent to Indians moving (or staying) in the US in a long long time.

A lot of folks rn were okay with the H1 renewal drama and endless green card line because their kids were guaranteed citizenship and being "American"

All that changes if the kid is just another dependent and the whole family. This combined with slowdown in Canada and Aus PR processes means it's probably the worst time to emigrate to the "West" in many decades

Good opportunity for India to capitalize and keep some talented folks home

The federal courts will almost certainly cancel the executive order, the main point of interest is whether Trump will take a chance and appeal to the SC which currently has a 6-3 "conservative" majority. Even then, I doubt the SC will support the executive order since the US samvidhan is clear on this.

The only other route is to pursue an amendment, which is highly unlikely/impossible since it requires 2/3rds majority in both Congress and Senate, and then ratification by at least 38 states.

That said, the 20-100 years wait for employment-based GC is pathetic. This has been going on since 2016. As I said before, bharat sarkar should encourage folks to return, and/or start controlling "brain drain" by requiring people to return once a long period (say 10 years?) of pending residency application in other countries. If those countries don't really want them as permanent residents/citizens, they should return to Bharat and help the country rise faster.

PS: Update - a federal judge in Seattle will hear one of the lawsuits tomorrow morning and will consider a restraining order.

https://www.scrippsnews.com/politics/im ... itizenship

[Amber G.]

>>>"Sometimes the Constitution’s text is plain as day and bars what politicians seek to do. That’s the case with President Trump’s proposal to end “birthright citizenship” through an executive order. Such a move would be unconstitutional and would certainly be challenged. And the challengers would undoubtedly win."

Nice article by Neal Katyal & George T. Conway: (Gift article):
Trump’s proposal to end birthright citizenship is unconstitutional

"

[Amber G.]

Trump Administration Prioritising India Ties": S Jaishankar On US Visit

--J S Jaishankar, highlighted a "very high degree of trust" between India and the US.
- Jaishankar was treated to a front-row seat at the inauguration, which he described as a "great honour."

- He met with senior Trump administration officials, including US Secretary of State Marco Rubio and National Security Adviser Mike Walz (and FBI's Kash Patel etc..)
- Jaishankar expressed concerns about the delay in the visa process for Indian citizens, which he believes hampers work, business, travel, and tourism, as well as people-to-people ties.
- The Trump administration is prioritizing its bilateral relationship with India, aiming to build on the "strong foundation" laid by the previous administration.
- The US is keen to expand and intensify the Quad, a diplomatic and security partnership between the US, India, Japan, and Australia.
- Jaishankar's visit included bilateral meetings with counterparts from the US, Japan, and Australia, as well as a multilateral Quad ministers' meeting.
- He also interacted with top Trump administration officials and attended presidential inauguration events.

[saip]

As long as the father or the mother is either US Citizen or Green Card holder the executive order does not apply. But for students, tourists and H1 visa holders no such luck.

[saip]

.

[Roop]

As long as the father or the mother is either US Citizen or Green Card holder the executive order does not apply. But for students, tourists and H1 visa holders no such luck.

I think your assessment is correct (but I am not a lawyer).

IMO this EO has very low chances of surviving legal challenge because the current interpretation of the birthright citizenship clause of the 14th Amendment is such a long-standing legal precedent (almost 150 years) that no court (including the SCOTUS) would want to upset it. It is considered "settled law" by most segments of the US body politic. Already, a US federal judge in Seattle has sustained the legal challenge and put a stop to the implementation of the EO. This thing is ultimately headed to the SCOTUS for sure. And they are unlikely to render a final judgement till at least the end of this year. Maybe even later.

For the SCOTUS to overturn the challenge and allow the EO to prevail, IMO they would have to be convinced of serious social harm caused by the current status quo (the "settled law") and no reasonable workaround. I find it hard to imagine them doing that.

[Roop]

The only other route is to pursue an amendment, which is highly unlikely/impossible since it requires 2/3rds majority in both Congress and Senate, and then ratification by at least 38 states.

I agree. Because of the divided / polarized nature of US society today, to successfully amend the constitution is such a (procedurally / legally) difficult thing that it is reasonable to call it "impossible".

[Vayutuvan]

@Roop ji, Trump is asking for the maximum. this will force oppo to come back with a minimum. Start of an iterated game for immigration reforms and public discussion of the same. The real targets are folks who want to have anchor babies for starting chain immigration under family reunion PRs. Those numbers are taken out of quotas for each country. While educated in the US H1Bs wait, barely high school pass are coming and doing menial jobs.

[Vayutuvan]

Because of the divided / polarized nature of US society today always, to successfully amend the constitution is such a (procedurally / legally) difficult thing that it is reasonable to call it "impossible".

@roop ji, FTFY sirjee.

Two party system always has a divided/polarized society. But as I said in the previous post, looking at this issue through procedural/legal lenses will give one, at best, an impression that it is a "go/no go" binary issue.

Think of this as the public debates that have happened in Bharat re. 370, Ram mandir, and the ongoing debates re. CAA and UCC.

Difference between Bharat and US is that here everything moves fast - judiciary, babudom, and especially MIC.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time_is_money_(aphorism)

"Time is money" is an aphorism that is claimed to have originated[1] in "Advice to a Young Tradesman", an essay by Benjamin Franklin that appeared in George Fisher's 1748 book, The American Instructor: or Young Man's Best Companion, in which Franklin wrote, "Remember that time is money."[2]

"Remember that time is money. He that can earn ten shillings a day by his labour, and goes abroad, or sits idle one half of that day, though he spends but sixpence during his diversion or idleness, it ought not to be reckoned the only expence; [sic] he hath really spent or thrown away five shillings besides."[2]

[Leonard]

Folks,

Lot's of BRites - think this "illegal birth" law will be used to target Legal H1/F1 students / employees unfairly .. It's possible no doubt -- But it is MEANT to curb this BIG issue -

Watch this Video -- Happened 10 Miles from Seattle -- Biggest hub of H1B after CA ..

Seattle CCP Birth Tourism https://www.usatoday.com/videos/news/wo ... /72646342/

California CCP Birth Tourism
https://apnews.com/article/california-b ... 35c35fbf47

This is the tip of iceberg ... How many are on-going and for How many years ? How many have caught ?

Seattle in 3 years was supposed to 100+ births in 3 years -- A work colleague (korean) lives 1/2 mile from the same house

Go to ANY - Ivy League Schools -- Massive hordes from PRC - Even Winnie the Pooh gave a 10 Mil Donation to Harvard ..

Almost impossible for Desis even with 4.0 GPA and top SAT scores to get admission to Ivy League Schools because of DEI stuff ...

[KL Dubey]

The only other route is to pursue an amendment, which is highly unlikely/impossible since it requires 2/3rds majority in both Congress and Senate, and then ratification by at least 38 states.

I agree. Because of the divided / polarized nature of US society today, to successfully amend the constitution is such a (procedurally / legally) difficult thing that it is reasonable to call it "impossible".

Birthright citizenship (jus soli) is nearly universal in the countries of the "New World", i.e. the Americas. The original idea behind this was to make it easier to populate the two sparsely populated continents with a European labor class, while displacing/genociding the native populations. Now that white immigration has turned into non-white immigration (and whites are themselves being relegated to a minority), they are trying to change it - but the US constitution is very clear.

Unlike countries such as Bharat with an established and distinct cultural identity, USA is not at all a civilizational state equipped with a long history and culture. It is essentially a melting pot of people and ideas from the "Old World".

Yeah, there will be people that somehow "abuse" the jus soli law. Have to take the bad with the good. Back in the day when all sorts of people from places like Ireland, Italy, Germany, Poland etc were immigrating with basically no questions asked, they weren't all docile potato farmers and olive oil squeezers. Many of these people had an ingrained criminal mentality (especially the Irish and the Italians) and created violent mafias/organized crime - extortion, drugs, prostitution, you name it - in USA on a scale never seen anywhere else.

The established UK-origin Europeans in the USA also complained back then, but jus soli stayed - as it has in almost all countries in the Americas.

What's funny though, is the "brown Uncle Tom" inmates on BRF who are also complaining.

[KL Dubey]

Demographics of USA: https://www.brookings.edu/articles/amer ... g-keep-up/

2040s is the decade in which non-whites become a national majority in USA. This is already the case in several states.

Furthermore, the age groups of <10, <20, and <30 years are already majority non-white, i.e. the future face of USA.

Bharat should be doing outreach not only to the Indian diaspora in USA but also engaging the other demographic groups.

[Amber G.]

Birthright citizenship (jus soli) is nearly universal in the countries of the "New World", i.e. the Americas...

For perspective:
Countries with Birthright Citizenship:
United States
Canada
Mexico
Brazil
Argentina
Chile
Uruguay
Panama
Costa Rica
Dominica

Countries without Birthright Citizenship:

Germany
France
Japan
China
India
Saudi Arabia
United Arab Emirates
Qatar
Kuwait
Bahrain

[Vayutuvan]

Bharat should be doing outreach not only to the Indian diaspora in USA but also engaging the other demographic groups.

As long as this mentality that PIOs owe something to Bharat but the reverse doesn't hold, Bharat will be used by the PIOs as a emerging economy and they will try to ride the coats of rising Bharat. When the growth stalls, they will pull out the moneys from the stock market.

Bharat hasn't done any serious outreach to PIOs. How will they do outreach to other demographics? What does Bharat has to offer to them? Hindu PIOs, the first generation at least, have some hamdardi because of the emotional and dharma connection.

Only babus who have no original ideas engage in this kind of simplistic methods. Real world is lot more messy, me thinks.

[KL Dubey]

Jus soli map from Wikipedia:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jus_soli# ... _world.svg

In the neighborhood of Bharat, the Packees have adopted jus soli

[Amber G.]

Security Breach - There are reports of Khalistani extremist Pannun spotted at Donald Trump's inauguration event. (some videos were released)
Link:<link>

From New Delhi MEA Press Brief : India raises STRONG concern over Pannun presence in Trump inaugural ceremony

[KL Dubey]

^^Like I said before, there is not much difference between Rep and Dem goremints. All these are rapacious negotiation tactics of goras. After 4 years of wokeism pressure on Bharat, now expect Abrahamic cretinism for next 4 years.

If BRF is truly about "Bharat raksha", ban all Brown Uncle Tom Trolls (BUTTs) existing in USA and providing fake info to Indians. Get lost from here and endure racist abuse on mainstream USA channels. Also get rid of non-Indian forum moderators pretending to be "bharat rakshaks".

[drnayar]

https://on.ft.com/40ys2qy

Pay wall

US secretary of state Marco Rubio has ordered an immediate halt to work on virtually all existing foreign aid programmes pending a review into whether they are consistent with President Donald Trump’s policies, according to an internal cable seen by the Financial Times.

[drnayar]

https://on.ft.com/4gZt1Hr

Donald Trump insisted he was serious in his determination to take over Greenland in a fiery telephone call with Denmark’s prime minister, according to senior European officials.

was horrendous,” said one of the people. Another added: “He was very firm. It was a cold shower. Before, it was hard to take it seriously. But I do think it is serious, and potentially very dangerous.”

Trump has truly upended American policies !

[Mort Walker]

>>>"Sometimes the Constitution’s text is plain as day and bars what politicians seek to do. That’s the case with President Trump’s proposal to end “birthright citizenship” through an executive order. Such a move would be unconstitutional and would certainly be challenged. And the challengers would undoubtedly win."

Nice article by Neal Katyal & George T. Conway: (Gift article):
Trump’s proposal to end birthright citizenship is unconstitutional

"

That's correct. The 1898 case before SCOTUS of Wong Kim Ark would have to be nullified, which is unlikely as it again raises the case of which persons are under US jurisdiction.
https://constitutioncenter.org/the-cons ... m-ark-1898

Even worse is the Trump admin trying to cite a 1884 U.S. Supreme Court case Elk v. Wilkins stating Native American tribes are not subject to birthright citzenship.
https://www.juneauempire.com/news/birth ... istration/

What these clowns don't realize is that if the 14th Amendment can be re-interpreted, then a future administration can force the re-interpretation of the 2nd Amendment. They're playing with fire.

The Trump admin will lose in lower courts and SCOTUS may kick it back to the government saying fix the laws in US congress before the case can be heard. This whole thing was designed to fail to placate the MAGA racists.

[Amber G.]

From US to India and Indian communities across the world, Happy 76th Republic Day!

[chetak]

https://on.ft.com/40ys2qy

Pay wall

US secretary of state Marco Rubio has ordered an immediate halt to work on virtually all existing foreign aid programmes pending a review into whether they are consistent with President Donald Trump’s policies, according to an internal cable seen by the Financial Times.

drnayar ji,

The cable provides a waiver only for emergency food assistance and foreign military financing for Israel and Egypt. The cable does not specifically mention any other countries that receive foreign military financing, like Ukraine or Taiwan, as being exempt from the freeze.

[drnayar]

https://on.ft.com/40ys2qy

Pay wall

US secretary of state Marco Rubio has ordered an immediate halt to work on virtually all existing foreign aid programmes pending a review into whether they are consistent with President Donald Trump’s policies, according to an internal cable seen by the Financial Times.

drnayar ji,

The cable provides a waiver only for emergency food assistance and foreign military financing for Israel and Egypt. The cable does not specifically mention any other countries that receive foreign military financing, like Ukraine or Taiwan, as being exempt from the freeze.

There are interesting videos of NATO honchos in the Internet advocating Ukraine to go all in ...the tone and rhetoric looks like their very lives [ livelihood more likely!] Depend on it ! ...

Does anyone have a calculation on how long the war can go on without us aid ?

[Tanaji]

I believe Biden had front loaded all aid in anticipation of this, so they probably have a good stockpile now.

[Amber G.]

PM Modi and President Trump Discuss "Mutually Beneficial" Partnership"
PM Narendra Modi and US President Donald Trump held a phone call, where Modi congratulated Trump on his second term and reiterated India's commitment to a "mutually beneficial and trusted partnership" with the US. The two leaders aim to work together for global peace, prosperity, and security. Their conversation comes as the US and India seek to strengthen ties on economic and strategic issues, including trade, immigration, and defense cooperation"

Delighted to speak with my dear friend President @realDonaldTrump @POTUS
. Congratulated him on his historic second term. We are committed to a mutually beneficial and trusted partnership. We will work together for the welfare of our people and towards global peace, prosperity, and security.

[Amber G.]

^^^From White House: President Donald J. Trump and Indian PM Narendra Modi discuss strengthening US-India ties in a productive call. Topics included regional security, trade, and a potential White House visit

[Rakesh]

What U.S. Weapon Is Trump Pushing This Time?
https://www.livefistdefence.com/what-u- ... this-time/
29 January 2025

[williams]

Yeah we can simply say first send us over the engines and approve the sale of the Sentinel drones that we already requested. We can talk more once that is done. .

[Manish_P]

What U.S. Weapon Is Trump Pushing This Time?
https://www.livefistdefence.com/what-u- ... this-time/
29 January 2025

Which ones did he push for the last time he was president?