Operation Sindoor - Post Conflict Analysis

[RCase]

Just like the Niazi surrender photo, this one is a keeper - boob shot !



The strike on Jamia Masjid Subhan Allah, Bahawalpur, HQ of Jaish e Mohammad.
Three precision hits at the center of the domes and a fourth one to rub it in! Fantastic targeting! Ghar mein ghus ke mara! Well into the interior of Pak Punjab, despite contested airspace, we were able to hit with pin-point accuracy and cause severe damage, meeting mission objectives.

These kinds of images are probably the best to set the narrative.
Subhan Allah! Boyz played well.

[bala]

I am x posting:

Saars, I have a feeling Bloombergah doctored the tape of the interview to make the CDS look bad. He may have said the part on tactics much later and they simply joined the two together to make him look like he agrees with the interviewer on the 6 BS shooting of Indian aircraft. The whole thing is staged managed by these cretins in western media.

[Baikul]

While it would be interesting to know if the General went
off script or was this a sanctioned release of information, it’s of little relevance.

What’s relevant is that halfway through the op we had already torn Pakistan multiple holes, and they were only getting wider by Palfauj asked for a ceasefire.

This we already know, and this is already becoming accepted wisdom globally.

[Deans]

To put losses in perspective - between Balakot and Pahalgam, we lost 21 fighter aircraft to peacetime crashes.
We lost 3 aircraft in Kargil, to tactical errors.

[ashthor]

Its not about the loss...its how you put it across to whom and the place....we just
cant shoot off to any tom dick harry.

[Ambar]

Let me put my 2 cents

In the opening battle, we send many drones (banshee and other drones) that mimicked fighter aircrafts. Their whole purpose was to expose themselves, take hit and map the paki ew and ad assets. Many were (6?) shot down. In the mix were also flying Indian fighters. Now why is DGMO and CDS saying in roundabout way that fighters may have been loss. Because they do not want TSP to refine their tactics.

I think what happened, IDRW first published (some inside leak) that India had used drones mimicking fighter signature and that were downed. After that cat was out of the bag, the PM statement came, that no asset was lost.

So then, why go back on that. Perhaps we have intel that TSP, imbecil that they are, are not buying that they were fooled, and they really think that Indian planes were downed and not drones, hence no need to change tactics (why change when it is successful). Maybe there is a small group there that thinks, guys we failed, let's do something different. How do you muddy that TSPAF brainstorming - perhaps a supposedly bumbling CDS again lets the cat out of the bag - India did loose planes.

Poor TSPAF, did they shoot the planes or the drones mimicking them? Did the ghazis succeed? Should they keep the successful tactics of air fight or they were had and change it? Did the Hindu morale break by taking few hits at the right time and right place and they agreed for ceasefire?

I think we are playing this psyops at a different level, so much so that our side is also confused (on purpose)

This seems contradictory. All along, we've maintained that Pakis were spreading misinformation to mislead both the Western media and their domestic audience, and that India had inflicted damage on Pakistani positions without incurring any losses. Now, after all this time, we're suddenly expected to reverse that narrative by acknowledging our own losses supposedly to prevent TSP from refining their strategy? That logic doesn’t make sense.Pakis, despite their motheaten economy, aren't Yemenis or Somalis, they have intelligence capabilities, both domestically developed and supported through data sharing with China. If we hadn't lost any aircraft, they would have figured out we were bluffing long ago.

Whether it's Balakot, Galwan, or now Pahalgam, our PR strategy feels amateurish. We make bold claims that aren’t followed up with credible evidence, deny incidents only to reverse our stance weeks later, scrape social media rumors and run it as "breaking news" and allow overly vocal generals to make statements when restraint would serve us better. The recent comments from the CDS have only reinforced Pakis claims "See, we told you so!" and handed ammo to domestic 0.5 front aka our Congi-Islamo-left ecosystem.

[RCase]

This is a must watch for those wondering about the air battle and the decision making. Gen Hari Mohan in discussion with Gen Ravi Shankar. I think the tactical error that the CDS was alluding to was not performing DEAD on day1. There might have been political compulsions to signal targeting of terror targets and not military targets. IAF is used to doing exercises along the LoC and IB. It might be that the Pakis fired in panic across the border and engaged the IAF aircraft, which were within Indian airspace. That might have been the tactical error that the corrected immediately to take out the AWACS and AD of the Pakis.

Discussion about the future of war being more technology oriented. Need for rethink of doctrines. Also, new personnel need to be more technology savvy. Investment in MIC will boost economy. Future wars will be short kinetic engagements. War by other means will be played out.

Both Gen. acknowledge that Info War was something that needs improvement.

Interesting discussion about nuclear weapons and the thought process during Kargil vs. Op Sindoor. Gen Hari Mohan is not convinced that Pakis can design and manufacture a nuclear weapon and Gen Ravi Shankar's smile almost belies that they know the real deal about Pak nukes! During Op Sindoor the Pakis didn't have any way that they could climb the escalation ladder. Gen. Mohan also feels that it was a good call to stop kinetic action and not get sucked into a Russia-Ukraine kind of situation.

OP SINDOOR: BEGINNING OF A NEW MODE OF WARFARE

[Hriday]

https://x.com/avs_IND/status/1929069976 ... 9CaJQ&s=19

The below photo is from the above link. So if photo is real then officially we hadn't done any surgical strike before the year 2016. The context is Congress claiming six surgical strike during their rule.

[gakakkad]

I am x posting:

Saars, I have a feeling Bloombergah doctored the tape of the interview to make the CDS look bad. He may have said the part on tactics much later and they simply joined the two together to make him look like he agrees with the interviewer on the 6 BS shooting of Indian aircraft. The whole thing is staged managed by these cretins in western media.

There seems to be some evidence of a cut paste job as the questions asked and answers differ. May well be the case .

[A_Gupta]

why is the media fixated on whether india lost planes?

Bing CoPilot, think deeper option:

The media’s focus on whether India lost planes taps into several intertwined elements that make for compelling—and often politically charged—storytelling. Here are some key reasons why this issue attracts so much attention:

1. **Symbol of National Military Capability:**
Fighter jets are among the most visible symbols of a country’s defense strength. When losses occur, they become a proxy for questions about military effectiveness, strategy, and preparedness. A plane going down isn’t just a mechanical failure—it can signal possible tactical missteps or vulnerabilities in national defense, which naturally intrigues both the public and political commentators .

2. **Contrasting Narratives and Political Tension:**
In the recent conflict with Pakistan, conflicting claims emerged about the number and nature of aircraft losses. One side’s assertion that six jets were shot down versus India's more subdued acknowledgment—emphasizing that "numbers are not important" but rather the reasons behind the losses—creates a narrative tension that the media finds irresistible. This back-and-forth offers a dramatic storyline where every detail is scrutinized for deeper meaning, making the uncertainty as newsworthy as the conflict itself .

3. **Accountability and Public Scrutiny:**
In any military conflict, especially one involving advanced weaponry like fighter jets, there’s a strong public interest in accountability. The media often frames these losses as a call for transparency from the defense establishment. When a top military official like General Anil Chauhan points to “tactical mistakes” without providing hard details, it triggers further questions about operational competence and the decision-making process—a subject that resonates widely with a public eager for accountability in matters concerning national security .

4. **Impact on National Pride and Policy Debate:**
Aircraft losses are not merely statistics—they can affect national morale and become rallying points for debate over military spending, strategic decisions, and leadership competence. By fixating on such measurable outcomes, the media can influence public discourse, sometimes fueling criticism or demands for policy changes. In this way, the story transcends the immediate conflict and touches on broader issues of national identity and security .

Overall, the media’s fascination with whether India lost planes is part of a larger pattern in war reporting where concrete, emotionally charged metrics—like the loss of high-value military hardware—serve as windows into the inner workings of national security, strategy, and even politics. This focus offers a blend of hard facts, strategic analysis, and dramatic storytelling that appeals to a diverse audience.

Moving forward, you might also be interested in exploring how conflicting narratives during military conflicts affect international perceptions and policy decisions. The role of independent verification, media bias, and the challenges of information management in wartime are equally fascinating topics that provide deeper insights into how we understand and respond to conflict in today’s hyper-connected world.

[gakakkad]

^ why aren't American airframe loses considered loss of face .only sdre hain ji ?

[Aditya_V]

And anyone including lurkers here interacting with Pakis with 6-0 ,7-0 flamebait, how are funerals happening for PAF pilots if they didn't go down in thier Aircraft. This miracle needs to be explained?

[Deans]

Russia just lost a bunch of nuclear bombers, their most heavily guarded assets, to cheap drones.
The country isn't wallowing in self pity, like some in India are.

[fanne]

and that means exposed hangers for Sukhois in deep is no good either, nor the bases housing transport, we need hardened shelter + defense against drones at all bases.

[fanne]

if nothing pronto put anti done nets around, should be done double quick, in few weeks. Of course, it will need some harness to cover and remove (so that planes can ingress etc.) followed by some soft cover (like tin roof that you see now), till we develop hardened shelters (which may take time).

[Manish_P]

Russia just lost a bunch of nuclear bombers, their most heavily guarded assets, to cheap drones.
The country isn't wallowing in self pity, like some in India are.

Dean sir, it's not entirely pity. A whole lot of them are seeing the opportunity to push their agenda..

If a Su-30 MKI/MiG29 was downed the 'Import Rafale' lobby gets it's chance to demand more Rafales
If a Rafale was downed the 'F-35/Su 57' crowd gets to say 'we-told-you-we-need-5th-gen'
If all of the above were downed the 'at least the Tejas would have been cheaper' bunch gets to have it's say

[Aditya_V]

I don't think so Manish, you forgot the Eurofighter lobby also, there is no lobby for Tejas

[Aditya_V]

I still perplexed of 6-0,7-0 nonsense, if there are soo many funerals of PAF personal, how come all Aircraft are safe. do thier planes dump thier pilots dead when they Land?

I think it's clear some of those victims of our AAMs and SAMs

[Deans]

I still perplexed of 6-0,7-0 nonsense, if there are soo many funerals of PAF personal, how come all Aircraft are safe. do thier planes dump thier pilots dead when they Land?

I think it's clear some of those victims of our AAMs and SAMs

Score since the beginning of Op Sindoor:
A. 150 dead or seriously wounded (in airstrikes) + 10 (trying to cross LOC) + 13 in Kashmir = 173 terrorists vs 2 of ours (IA)

B. 35-40 KIA (lower estimate) Pak army + 10 PAF = 50 vs 8 of ours ( IA + BSF)

C. Value of all Hardware lost: Pak is 3x higher.

[Aditya_V]

Or much higher, considering hangers , underground storage, SAms, radars, losses in the air, we don't even know what our losses are, what fighter jets, I suspect there losses are 20-30x and much higher personal wise, plus getting educated trained men in Pakistan to be replaced will take years

[ShauryaT]

Is it likely true/plausible that part of the reason for the air losses is the lack of authority to engage military targets? IOW: Did the IAF not have authority to shoot when fired upon or more optimal nullify likely potential threats on May 7?

Gen Sharma seems to allude to such in here after 12 mins into this interview.

Top Military Officer Speaks On Op Sindoor, Sparks Political Firestorm

[ramana]

Operation Sindoor showed that India has been at the forefront of developing and deploying weaponry, unlike the popular perception.

The Integrated air defence environment that stopped the multiple Pakistan air attacks is one testament to GOI silent activity.
All the airbases were hit, with the majority of Brahmos-A missiles launched from Su-30MKI aircraft only.
And superb tactical and strategic intelligence. The Indian military knew what to hit for maximum efficacy.
Proof is the Pakistan request to cease hostility soon after the 23-minute strike. It took them hours to assess their incapacity.

Yes, communications can be improved, but that is all water.
The Pakistanis and their backers know what got hit and how effective it was. The quick surrender and acceptance disappointed folks wanting more.
More would mean regime collapse and ensuring disorder, which India has to manage. Now US has to make good all that damage which is not accounted for in Trump's balance sheet.
I do only refer to Dubya's crusade after 911, and it took twenty years to get out of that mess and ten years after the financial collapse of 2008.

It's not just winning the war, but has to be done economically.

[bala]

The bigger issue for Pak land besides damage and fluffing before media is IWT. Water is a major problem. What are they going to do when their farmers rise up and complain about bad crops, no water, etc. Failed maar saala and Sharif will be reduced to running Allah-u-hambra (a take of on Alahambra water suppliers in the US) service for their denizens. India is on a plan to tame all the rivers and use them for its own purpose. Only the Indus river that runs through the himalayas is the challenge, since it is difficult to tame. Most rivers have their sources in Tibet and the brahmaputra has parallel run north of Nepal and Bhutan. Taking this territory away from the Chinese should be the next military goal of India. With AkashTeer deployed it should be a short quick war to take out these lands permanently from China. This would effectively cut off CPEC, shaksgam valley and make PoK useless.

[bala]

The Nuclear threat of Pak land has been discussed here in Operation Sindoor. Maj Gen Rajiv Narayanan contends that their nuke program has been set back 10 yrs. He talks about Cook-off and also earthquakes happening in Pak. Drawing from open-source satellite imagery and strategic insights, the retired Indian Army general uncovers how multiple key tactical and strategic nuclear sites, including Kirana Hills, Chagai, and Murid, were severely compromised. He explains the structure of Pakistan's nuclear storage, deployment strategies, and the impact of targeted strikes that may have destroyed vital warhead reserves and delivery systems. Maj Gen Narayanan’s historical references,insights and comparisons is crucial to understanding this complex topic.

Ops Sindoor Set Pakistan's Nuke Program Back by 10 Years

[Leonard]

Here are some details about the damage inflicted at JUST --2 of the HDBT's -- Chaklala (Nur Khan) and Murid Airbases ...

Precision, Perfection and Accuracy have been Hallmarks of IAF Golden Strikes in Pakistan: Targets Obliterated from the Face of Earth

https://capsindia.org/precision-perfect ... -of-earth/

>>
Most VIPs visiting Islamabad were given a tour of this HDBT and shown the technological advances Pakistan’s air force had achieved.
The US and Chinese generals, after visiting this facility, were always praising it and how the PAF has achieved its integration with other systems indigenously.
The Pakistan Strategic Plans Division’s own Special Works Department (SWD) took over the task of constructing at least 21 more of these underground facilities (UGFs), with the first one starting at Karachi’s Masroor airbase.
The C2 AD Centre, as seen on satellite imagery, had been expanded/renovated twice in 2005 and 2015 after its construction by the GE.
The satellite images from the last fifteen years suggest that this facility was also used as a research and simulation data collection centre for all new radars. It has been observed over the last decade that all aircraft collecting intelligence have been downloading data at this centre for integration with both old and new systems.
The IAF attacked the facility with extreme precision through an HVAC shaft directly leading to the main chamber of the UGF or HDBT. The internal size of the shaft was 45 cm, which is very small, even for measuring on an open-source image, as its single pixel measures 30 cm at the best resolution.
Hence, there was no margin for error, and the task must have been given to the best pilot with all data fed to the missile beforehand, including high-resolution (HiRes) images and pictures of the facility, especially the HVAC shaft.
This is probably the first of its kind, the most unique, and the smallest target hit by any air force in the entire world.
The after-strike imagery, which was released during the DGMO press conference, showed a large chunk of concrete which had risen above the surface, possibly with the explosion below the surface of a penetrating bomb.
The explosion must have been so large as to pulverise everything and everybody inside the HDBT instantly. The effect of the explosion was so significant that the multilayered concrete rebar roof was broken from below and thrown up.
Unlike at other locations, PAF was not in a hurry to remove the debris from this site as it would have confirmed the size and immensity of damage caused by a perfect IAF attack.
However, after a period of four days, a decision must have been made, in consultation with the families of dead PAF soldiers and officers, to bury them in situ as not even shreds of them would have been available to be put in a coffin.
Nobody inside the C2 AD centre available at the time of the strike would have been left alive to tell the story of how the devastation occurred.

....

Murid

Pakistan’s Special Works Department understood very well the technology either shared or stolen from GE of the USA. And they further improved upon it with minor innovations.
In all the underground facilities, the HVAC ducts have been enlarged in size and pulled away from the facility by at least 10m to a maximum of 100m. This does not permit any penetrating bomb to be effectively dropped on the HVAC ducts/ shaft to destroy the HDBT.
In the case of the Murid C2 AD Centre, too, similar extensions of shafts precluded their use for dropping a penetrating bomb.
Thus, it was possibly decided by the IAF to attack directly at the central section of the HDBT without any pillars resisting the penetration of the missile.
The afterimage of Murid C2 AD Center vividly displays a small rectangular crater of approximately 1.16m X 0.98m size, indicating a deeper penetration. The top layer of the HDBT is composed of compressed earth; a deeper study of satellite images reveals very little compressed earth scattered around. This indicates a deeper penetration of the weapon before it explodes.
The external colour of the crater seen in the satellite image, being very light, is clear evidence that it is only an impact crater and not an explosion crater. This strongly suggests that the penetrating weapon has penetrated the subsurface facility and exploded rather than exploding at the surface.
A possible ten-ton (8m long) truck is observed in the after-satellite image, stationary at the entrance with its rear end partially inside the larger entrance of the underground facility. This suggests that the truck is trying to salvage any material that may be suggestive of the remains of dead officers and airmen.
Pakistan has already cemented the crater, trying to shield any proof of the attack by the IAF against overhead imagery.
Only one single possible ambulance has been observed near the entrance of the facility in after-strike imagery, strongly suggesting possibly a lone survivor, indicating considerable casualties of personnel.


<<

Looks like a Few Folks of the PAF - will NOT be in a position to Enjoy the 72 Hoors after-all ...

[vera_k]

India is too dependent on Hollywood for ideas
SkyNet => Akashteer
Maverick Uranium Enrichment Plant Attack => Chaklala HDBT attack

[Jarita]

Please be patient with me as I try and pen my thoughts around how the aftermath of #operationsindoor is very related to what happened between Russia and Ukraine. I have to give credit to our leaders and even some members of opposition who understood the wider game and put differences aside to save the civilization.
Later I will embellish this with pictures which will clearly tell the story.
1) Operation Sindoor would have been used to draw India into a long term conflict with Pakistan. Pakistan is just a proxy of the deep state and in this case the foolish country of China is also supporting them. You can already see how Pakistan is being fortified to provide a counter to India. This country exists as a sore for all of the geopolitical goals of the deep state in Asia.
2) The Indian government instead of making it about ego and pride terminated the operation instead of getting deeper into the trap as Putin did.
3) More than that, the Indian government offered face saving for Pakistan to prevent a brotherhood/ deep state led escalation. Everyone on the Indian side has taken a hit just so that Pakistan can pacify its masses and have a semblance of some victory. To that end, I believe there might be 1-2 sensible people on the Pakistani side as well.
4) If the Indian government and members of opposition had let ego and ability to pulverize Pakistan play, they would have walked into the same trap Putin walked into.
5) this speaks to the shocking maturity of Indian polity. And kudos

To that end I believe the last few months were a lot of theater and fakery to culminate into this outcome of the Cold War which still continues.

The biggest loser in this game will be China.

Pictures come later

[vinod]

I hope india deploys the anti drone systems to all vital systems and infrastructure. Given how Ukraine destroyed the bombers, I can see a terrorist state like Pakistan having wet dreams of such an operation

[ramana]

Leonard or anyone,
Can you make a transparency of the before and after pictures of the Murid strike and superimpose them?
ramana

[Manish_P]

.....there is no lobby for Tejas

Oh but there is Aditya ji, just that it is not as shrill or as influential as the others

[Aditya_V]

Now I think May 9-10 is slowly becoming clearer, why even Shahbaz Sharif has been screaming on Nur Khan, looks like Command and Control underground Bunker headquarters, have we taken out some high leadership ? That along Murid, Kirana Hills, Bholari, Jacocadbad, PAF Rafqui, Phew.

We intercepted what they threw at us, shot some of thier fighters and did a Long range AWACS SAM kill.

[Deans]

and that means exposed hangers for Sukhois in deep is no good either, nor the bases housing transport, we need hardened shelter + defense against drones at all bases.

Under the START agreement both US and Russia had to keep nuclear bombers in the open for monitoring.
However, after the US withdrew, Russia withdrew from the treaty in 2023 and I would have thought by now they should have had at least some
protection for the bombers - nets or hangars, considering they have been targeted before.

If you fly to Goa, you will see our P8-I aircraft parked together, protected by a thin metal roof.

[RCase]

I am curious what would have happened if India said it needed more time to agree to a cessation of firing since it's operation was still underway to meet its objectives. Using that time for a day or two to pound all of TSP assets, including using Naval assets and bring them to their knees. Could India have insisted that Pakistan formally surrender or cede POK for cease fire to happen? Given the speed of the strikes, a couple of more days could have set back TSP significantly.

Contrast that when the US went with is GWOT nobody called for ceasefire, despite US invading Iraq and Afghanistan and bombing the hell out of these places and untold civilian misery.

[Leonard]

Ramanna,

This image is from @detresfa - Damien



India Today URL

https://www.indiatoday.in/world/story/n ... 2025-05-26

[Leonard]

Nur Khan -- Same story ...



Looks like MANY -- Underground C2D were hit --

Assuming 100-200 PAF personnel -- on Full Alert and Fully manned stations with 24 x 7 backup replacement crews on standby as well - have to be available as well ...

Wonder HOW many PAF personnel are getting 72 hoors -- there's must be a massive backup like a slash line after a World-cup match

[drnayar]

I am curious what would have happened if India said it needed more time to agree to a cessation of firing since it's operation was still underway to meet its objectives. Using that time for a day or two to pound all of TSP assets, including using Naval assets and bring them to their knees. Could India have insisted that Pakistan formally surrender or cede POK for cease fire to happen? Given the speed of the strikes, a couple of more days could have set back TSP significantly.

Contrast that when the US went with is GWOT nobody called for ceasefire, despite US invading Iraq and Afghanistan and bombing the hell out of these places and untold civilian misery.

I think it's not just military objectives. A lot of political and economic considerations go on in the background. If India wanted both Paki airfarce and navy would have disappeared in a couple of days.

But there are more ways to skin a cat

Win the real fight without getting the military involved

[Aditya_V]

Operation Sindoor is taking me back to 1999 Kargil days, even when hostilities finished Pakistan- Mujahedeen had won , this was the narrative till about July 30(In Paki Foreign media circles), slowly but surely as news came out and things became desperate and finally Musharaf kicked out Badmash and took over, I feel this time Asim Munir will be one to take the hit.

I hope the Pakis have another Atlantique type loss this time also

[RCase]

Here are some details about the damage inflicted at JUST --2 of the HDBT's -- Chaklala (Nur Khan) and Murid Airbases ...
The IAF attacked the facility with extreme precision through an HVAC shaft directly leading to the main chamber of the UGF or HDBT. The internal size of the shaft was 45 cm, which is very small, even for measuring on an open-source image, as its single pixel measures 30 cm at the best resolution.
Hence, there was no margin for error, and the task must have been given to the best pilot with all data fed to the missile beforehand, including high-resolution (HiRes) images and pictures of the facility, especially the HVAC shaft.
This is probably the first of its kind, the most unique, and the smallest target hit by any air force in the entire world.
The after-strike imagery, which was released during the DGMO press conference, showed a large chunk of concrete which had risen above the surface, possibly with the explosion below the surface of a penetrating bomb.
...
Looks like a Few Folks of the PAF - will NOT be in a position to Enjoy the 72 Hoors after-all ...

Here is a video from Alpha Defense that has some different video angles about this strike. Gives a pretty good explanation with a schematic.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NvmxAB47T34

[RCase]

Operation Sindoor is taking me back to 1999 Kargil days, even when hostilities finished Pakistan- Mujahedeen had won , this was the narrative till about July 30(In Paki Foreign media circles), slowly but surely as news came out and things became desperate and finally Musharaf kicked out Badmash and took over, I feel this time Asim Munir will be one to take the hit.

I hope the Pakis have another Atlantique type loss this time also

Isn't it mango season in 'South Asia'? Hope Mullah Munir likes mangoes or in his case should it be a crate of dates?

[Prem Kumar]

Score since the beginning of Op Sindoor:
A. 150 dead or seriously wounded (in airstrikes) + 10 (trying to cross LOC) + 13 in Kashmir = 173 terrorists vs 2 of ours (IA)

B. 35-40 KIA (lower estimate) Pak army + 10 PAF = 50 vs 8 of ours ( IA + BSF)

C. Value of all Hardware lost: Pak is 3x higher.

Its emerging that the PAF personnel losses are likely in the 100 - 200 range, going by the newer reports about us hitting their C4I centers at Nur Khan & Murid

Not only is it a massive blow to their C4I infrastructure, these would be highly trained personnel with decades of experience. That's very hard to replace

Total body-count would be 150 uniformed jihadis + 175 uninformed jihadis