India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

[Amber G.]

This ought to be a rude wake-up call for all those who are still going gaga over Trump..
<3nmin video worth watvhing> Weeks after 26 Indians were murdered by Pakistan, reports say Trump is set to host the Pak Army chief, while U.S Central Command General calls Pakistan a “phenomenal partner”.
American duplicity on terror has never been clearer.

[Cyrano]

Trump is just the clown face for the US establishment / DS or whatever you call it. They will be propping up Pak yet again to use them to go after Iran or take control of Bagram or whatever, fully knowing that sooner or later some of the aid will be used against India and they will look for deniability or life's like that attitude.

That's exactly why Op Sindoor is still active. Here on India will attack and take out anything supplied to Pak or rebuilt by them if they are used directly or indirectly against India, US interests be damned.

India-US relations have taken a big slide and will take decades to repair now. The culprit is the declining power that is the US and it's inability to see a rising India as anything but the next China.

NaMo going to G7 is perhaps to have a "clear and frank" conversation with the present crop of 7 clown leaders, especially Trump, with dubious mandates, tottering economies and a pile of internal issues.

I shudder at the enormity of the task and the high stakes battle which NaMo is going into. And he still finds time to laugh with school children on the train to Kashmir. There is more ice in his veins than in all of Himalayas. Pranaams to him.

[rajkumar]

Trump is just the clown face for the US establishment / DS or whatever you call it. They will be propping up Pak yet again to use them to go after Iran or take control of Bagram or whatever, fully knowing that sooner or later some of the aid will be used against India and they will look for deniability or life's like that attitude.

That's exactly why Op Sindoor is still active. Here on India will attack and take out anything supplied to Pak or rebuilt by them if they are used directly or indirectly against India, US interests be damned.

India-US relations have taken a big slide and will take decades to repair now. The culprit is the declining power that is the US and it's inability to see a rising India as anything but the next China.

NaMo going to G7 is perhaps to have a "clear and frank" conversation with the present crop of 7 clown leaders, especially Trump, with dubious mandates, tottering economies and a pile of internal issues.

I shudder at the enormity of the task and the high stakes battle which NaMo is going into. And he still finds time to laugh with school children on the train to Kashmir. There is more ice in his veins than in all of Himalayas. Pranaams to him.

[A_Gupta]

https://www.livemint.com/news/india/us- ... 18475.html
US presents take-it-or-leave-it trade offer, demand access to agriculture, dairy, pharma.

[Cyrano]

We should leave it. These are the very sectors in which hundreds of millions of people and families depend for their livelihoods.

They will be crushed by the GMO + pesticides+ fertilizer doped high yield crap that causes all kinds of food allergies, heavily subsidized by the US federal government and wants to dump into India to affect every consumer's health as well. And then pump our people who were made unhealthy thanks to American foods and dairy with American drugs.

Walk away, please.

[Mort Walker]

India will walk away. Any government agreeing to such a deal is a sure shot way to lose 70+ seats in parliament. Food security didn’t happen until 1972. Operation Flood for milk was launched in 1970 and made a huge impact. India is the world’s largest dairy producers.

[bala]

On the trade front, US wants to infiltrate India with their diary and agro GMO stuff to ruin Indian native animals, native seed crops of India and make India depend on Monsanto Inc. India has to ban GMO outright like Russia has done. The dream of deep state controlled monsanto is to get hold of all seed supply of the world so that they dictate terms for the rest of the world. You plant a GMO thing and you need to go back to them for the next crop.

On milk the Indian native cow (the one with the hump - surya ketu nadi) produces A2 milk versus Jersey Ameriki maal produces A1 milk. The A2 milk has different protein structure and those who are lactose intolerant can try A2 milk instead of A1 milk. Nations like australia, germany, austria are switching to A2 milk (which is expensive compared to A1 milk). BTW Buffalo milk is A2. All cheese manufacturured in the US uses rennet a cow intestinal product to curdle the milk. Those who are completely vegan would not want such cheeses.

[V_Raman]

super powers fighting over agricultural products access shows what matters ultimately. The real prize is to enmesh India agriculturally to the global supply chain - we should never give up our food security! Bos Indicus reigns supreme and god's gift to India!

[Vayutuvan]

https://www.livemint.com/news/india/us- ... 18475.html
US presents take-it-or-leave-it trade offer, demand access to agriculture, dairy, pharma.

Out of question. India will "leave it". 100% guaranteed.

[Vayutuvan]

https://www.livemint.com/news/india/us- ... 18475.html
US presents take-it-or-leave-it trade offer, demand access to agriculture, dairy, pharma.

viewtopic.php?p=2651513#p2651513

Saru vaaru, follow your guru's advice.

[williams]

https://www.livemint.com/news/india/us- ... 18475.html
US presents take-it-or-leave-it trade offer, demand access to agriculture, dairy, pharma.

Out of question. India will "leave it". 100% guaranteed.

Yeah no compromise on agriculture, dairy or Pharma. We have a huge domestic market, if they want to use tariffs to kill themselves we should say GOH. Other things we can do but with reciprocity.

[Vayutuvan]

https://www.livemint.com/news/india/us- ... 18475.html
US presents take-it-or-leave-it trade offer, demand access to agriculture, dairy, pharma.

One of the people who launched Mint (AKA livemint) is Melissa Bell (Georgetown and Northwestern journalism school grad) is the VP of Vox.

This is what Wikipedia says about Vox

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vox_(website)#Reception

In March 2014, before it had officially launched, Vox was criticized by conservative media commentators, including Erick Erickson, for a video[48] it had published arguing the U.S. public debt "isn't a problem right now".[49] (ed: Obviously since Obama was the POTUS then)
...
Pascal-Emmanuel Gobry at The Week argued that the website produced "partisan commentary in question-and-answer disguise" and criticized the site for having a "starting lineup [that] was mostly made up of ideological liberals".[53] The Week's Ryu Spaeth described the site's operations as "...essentially tak[ing] the news (in other words, what is happening in the world at any given moment in time) and fram[ing] it in a way that appeals to its young, liberal audience."[54] Damon Linker also criticized them, calling them "a parody of liberal faux-neutrality," and that "partisanship is so obvious," in an Obama interview they conducted, "that it's hard to imagine anyone being fooled."[55]
...
In an opinion piece in The Washington Times, Christopher J. Harper criticized the site for numerous reporting mistakes.[56]

The co-founder of Vox, Matthew Yglesias, after leaving the company, stated in an interview for The Atlantic that he was at odds not just with those at Vox, but mainstream media as a whole, saying "'The people making the media are young college graduates in big cities, and that kind of politics makes a lot of sense to them,' he said. 'And we keep seeing that older people, and working-class people of all races and ethnicities, just don't share that entire worldview.'"[57]

My guess is that livemint has the same DNA.

Looks like Mother Jones has gone out of favor with the Cambridge,MA/Caltech/Princeton/UChicago educated "scientist" set.

[gakakkad]

I don't think it'll make much difference in dairy and pharma .but can make a lot of difference in some agriculture

[Vayutuvan]

Dairy could be competition in the powdered milk sector, and cheese. Amul is the market leader in India in both sectors aren't they? That could be a problem for the coop dairies in India. In combined AP, Vijaya was the leader, MH it is AREY.

[Amber G.]

Says US President Donald Trump ...One more time again..

I stopped a war between India, Pakistan with phone calls & trade,never seen a story written on it..'

[Vayutuvan]

Trump is engaging in araNyarOdanam. He is being ignored by GoI.

[Vayutuvan]

Why so much rudaligiri going on here on this single point? TDS, I suppose.

[Cyrano]

India's position on Agri, Dairy and Pharma sectors is decades old and everyone knows this, and any level headed person can see why.

If they are asking for stuff they know we will not and cannot accept, it shows that the US does not want the deal to go through. They will use this as a stick to extract some other carrot from us.

Dr SJ already commented few days ago that us will negotiate with its self interest and we will also do the same.

We are a huge consumption economy just like the US and we produce most of that at home and import the rest from china or others. We are not that dependent on imports from the US and we can take our exports elsewhere. There will be some pain but it is eminently doable.

ICETS vicets gaya tel lene

[Vayutuvan]

One dependency we have to get around on the double, i.e. engines for Tejas.

[gakakkad]

most articles are very speculative. lets wait for things to unfold.

[Sumeet]

Saw news flash that Israel conducted air strikes against Iran

Rubio clarified that they are unilateral without any US involvement

[Manish_P]

If desperate Iran could do the typical Arab thing of flying it's AF aircraft to Pakistan for safe keeping.

But recent Indian action would make them think twice.

Come to think of it, India can help US and Iran go for a peace deal by bombing both US supplied fighters and Iran fighters on PAF bases.

[arshyam]

Out of question. India will "leave it". 100% guaranteed.

Yeah no compromise on agriculture, dairy or Pharma. We have a huge domestic market, if they want to use tariffs to kill themselves we should say GOH. Other things we can do but with reciprocity.

India's position on Agri, Dairy and Pharma sectors is decades old and everyone knows this, and any level headed person can see why.

If they are asking for stuff they know we will not and cannot accept, it shows that the US does not want the deal to go through. They will use this as a stick to extract some other carrot from us.

Dr SJ already commented few days ago that us will negotiate with its self interest and we will also do the same.

Looks like we're "leaving it"

India Shuts Down US 'Take-It-Or-Leave-It' Demands on Trade Access - Times via MSN

As the world watches two economic giants negotiate a critical trade pact, India has drawn a hard line — and with good reason. The United States, in recent high-level talks, has been accused of using "take-it-or-leave-it" tactics to push through a deal that disproportionately serves its interests. But India isn’t budging.

According to reports by Mint, the trade talks held in New Delhi from June 4 to 10, led by US Trade Representative Brendan Lynch, quickly turned tense. Washington is pressuring New Delhi to open up its most sensitive economic sectors — including dairy, agriculture, digital trade, and pharmaceuticals — but India is pushing back, demanding fairness, respect, and reciprocity. <snip>

[A Deshmukh]

All Govt offices should mandate only Indian origin SW.
Get Windows, MS Office, Browsers out of our computers first.
Then the servers - all Govt data should remain on Indian servers.
Govt IT security should restrict any SW that is not certified by Govt.
We need to start taking these steps and start pinching MS, Google, AWS and other players.

[bala]

There are some efforts already at play in India to address many of the US stuff in hardware and software. IIT-M is building a RISC based chip which can run a version of Unix. Apple MacOS runs on Unix actually MACH of CMU the multi-threaded kernel of Unix. Standardize on unix which is much better OS than windoze. For MS Office, local indian company Zoho has a decent substitute for the entire suite of products. India has created ONDC to challenge the commerce platform of AWS. Browsers should not be that hard to create. Search of Google is perhaps a larger task. India can perhaps collaborate with Yandex of Russia. I wish the IT powerhouses like infosys, wipro, tata, hcl, etc pitch in and create enterprise class systems to take on behemoths like Oracle, Salesforce, SAP, ServiceNow and so on.

India is currently strong in finance tech area with UPI.

[Mukesh.Kumar]

El Presidente claims to have reached a satisfactory trade deal with China.

Wool have serious implications on India, EU now.

[Amber G.]

xpot:

Interesting item, I noticed .. Netanyahu has talked to Modi but not (yet) to Donald..

Links:https://x.com/narendramodi/status/1933524955934634271
The tweets from Netanyahu also cofirms ' He has talked to Modi, and *will* be talking soon Trump and Putin later..

More interesting news - per reports - 5–7 Iranian missiles have landed on Israeli territory, I(Israeli media)
- Tump says he *did NOT invite' Paki Fraud Marshal.. (White House Source)

BIG(IMO) : India and Canada Reach Deal to Share Intelligence on Terrorism, Crime

[Amber G.]

Iran-Israel conflict is yet another example to showcase how nobody listens to Donald Trump globally.

Trump asks Iran to make a deal on its nuclear programme.

[Cyrano]

One dependency we have to get around on the double, i.e. engines for Tejas.

We only have ourselves to blame for the Kaveri situation. We have shown blind trust in the US after they confiscated LCA fbw s/w and despite this we went ahead to keep the design around F404. That was over 2 decades ago. IAF and HAL keep engaging in public spats Sigh.
Just look at how the US shafted AUKUS partner Aus on the subs deal. If a 5 eyes Anglo country can be jacked like that we still don't learn and celebrate ICETS vicets and carry on sniping each other over Dems/Reps and Biden/Trump, and puff up in victory when some forsaken town gives a holiday for Diwali.

In Telugu there is a saying: ignoring pumpkins falling out of one's mouth while chasing mustard grains escaping out of one's ass

[drnayar]

If desperate Iran could do the typical Arab thing of flying it's AF aircraft to Pakistan for safe keeping.

But recent Indian action would make them think twice.

Come to think of it, India can help US and Iran go for a peace deal by bombing both US supplied fighters and Iran fighters on PAF bases.

Indeed !

[Amber G.]

After embarrassing himself for taking credit for solving India-Pak ..Trump says Putin and he have spoken about Iran and agree that Israel-Iran war should end. Trump asks Putin to also end his war. Trump has been US President since almost 5 months now and yet no end in sight for any ongoing wars. Nobody listens to Trump globally.

[Amber G.]

NASA and ISRO are launching their joint satellite mission, NISAR, on June 18. NISAR uses synthetic aperture radar to capture high-resolution images of Earth, detecting changes down to the centimeter level, regardless of weather or time of day. The satellite will provide freely available global data, aiding disaster management, climate change understanding, and agricultural monitoring.

Its features include:

Monitoring land and ice surfaces twice every 12 days
Mapping flooded vegetation and wetlands
Estimating soil moisture levels for optimal irrigation
Tracking ice sheet flow, glaciers, coastal erosion, and oil spills

The $1.5 billion project aims to improve our understanding of Earth's ecosystems and climate change impacts.

I'm continue to choose not to engage with the transparent and juvenile attempts to trolling from the usual suspects

[A_Gupta]

@Amber G

I'm continue to choose not to engage with the transparent and juvenile attempts to trolling from the usual suspects.

I respectfully suggest to leave the trolls in a state of ambiguity. Let them not even know whether you have seen their stuff or not.

[Cyrano]

One man's troll is another man's truthsayer.

[drnayar]

After embarrassing himself for taking credit for solving India-Pak ..Trump says Putin and he have spoken about Iran and agree that Israel-Iran war should end. Trump asks Putin to also end his war. Trump has been US President since almost 5 months now and yet no end in sight for any ongoing wars. Nobody listens to Trump globally.

[img]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GtbTJX-boAA ... ame=medium[/img

One of friends who voted for Trump has apparently justified himself as choosing between the two worst options as presidente. Trump is just a megalomaniacal opportunistic business man with scant respect for statecraft or ideals.

[A_Gupta]

One man's troll is another man's truthsayer.

I'll give you what I consider to be a troll and then drop the subject.

Suppose someone, say X, writes here that they are worried by the 18% increase in Pakistan's defense budget.

A response could be to say - "Pakistan's budget is based on madrassa math and Sialkot statistics. Their revenue targets are unrealistic (<insert data of past goals and actuals here>) and so they will have to go more into debt to spend more on their military, etc. etc."

Another response could be: "X, your judgement is totally flawed, as I have pointed out 25 times before. You totally fell for Pakistani misinformation. You're being a BRF Oldie is utterly misplaced".

This latter is a troll. The troll may or may not address the main topic, may or may not be a truthsayer, but will inevitably include personal attacks, personal comments, etc., not directed at the topic, but at the BRF poster.

This is not the only obnoxious behavior from a troll. The troll may constantly go off-topic or post irrelevancies in a thread. What they write may be true, but it is misplaced. Further, they may scold anyone they feel is off-topic.

So on and so forth. My last word on trolls.

---
To add to the current topic, Trump, by constantly claiming he brokered a peace between Pakistan and India, and further by a trade/tariff carrot/stock, is a troll, disrespecting India; and also showing that my description above of trolls is really quite limited in scope.

[SRajesh]

Trolls Apart
What is happening in Kaneda??
Trump leaves end of first day.
He doesnt wait to sign the declaration but has time to sign a deal with Bratanistan!!
NaMo attends Tuesday in abscence of Trump
What is happening to Ab Ki Baar ..... Sarkar!!!
Is it to do with Indo-Pak Conflict of May or lack of progress on the trade deal hence nothing for Trump tp sign and Tom Tom about!!
I think its a combination and more importantly no deal on Agri products to sign the deal and hence he has left rather than face questions about his quote of : I made them to stop conflict and sign trade deals!!

[Mukesh.Kumar]

Trolls Apart
What is happening in Kaneda??
Trump leaves end of first day.
He doesnt wait to sign the declaration but has time to sign a deal with Bratanistan!!
NaMo attends Tuesday in abscence of Trump
What is happening to Ab Ki Baar ..... Sarkar!!!
Is it to do with Indo-Pak Conflict of May or lack of progress on the trade deal hence nothing for Trump tp sign and Tom Tom about!!
I think its a combination and more importantly no deal on Agri products to sign the deal and hence he has left rather than face questions about his quote of : I made them to stop conflict and sign trade deals!!

Sir not everything is about Indo US relations no?

Could be any number of reasons but whatever it is it's got to be significant. Maybe the fracas in the Middle East

[Rakesh]

Ashleeeeee is in full blown Randi Rona Dhona mode. Enjoy article with popcorn

Posting some gems below....

India’s Great-Power Delusions
https://www.foreignaffairs.com/india/in ... -delusions
17 June 2025

by Ashley J. Tellis

During President Donald Trump’s first term, the United States started sharing sensitive intelligence with India and made it eligible to receive advanced technologies previously reserved only for American allies; under President Joe Biden, Washington gave New Delhi sophisticated fighter jet engine technology.

Some remind him that the GE F414 engine deal is yet to be signed, two years since first announced. Another AUKUS in the making....

New Delhi does not want a world in which Washington is perpetually the sole superpower. Instead, it seeks a multipolar international system, in which India would rank as a genuine great power. It aims to restrain not just China—the near-term challenge—but also any country that would aspire to singular, hegemonic dominance, including the United States.

Thus the term - coined by him onlee - that India's Rise Must Be Managed

Meanwhile, at home, the country is shedding one of its main sources of strength—its liberal democracy—by embracing Hindu nationalism.

The age old conundrum for Western policy makers. A nationalist and resurgent "Hindu" India is a danger to the West. India is fine, as long as she does not embrace her Hinduism. Be our coolie and do our bidding, but don't aspire to be anything else. Leave your Hinduism at the door, before you enter into alliance with Amreeka.

But no matter how impressive India’s more recent performance has been, the country has fallen short of China’s reform-era achievements.

Have China-level reforms, but with liberal democracy. But what must not be done is reforms that go against the Western-led agenda.

If New Delhi wants to constrain Beijing, it will therefore need Washington.

Drop the multipolar agenda and join the US-led-scheme i.e. Amreeka Leads The World to Freedom & Prosperity.

Despite its weaknesses, India will not settle for any alliance with the United States, and there will be limits on their partnership. That is because India does not want to be part of any collective defense arrangements. Instead, it will zealously guard its nonallied status.

This is the main bone of contention for him. The lack of a defense agreement with the US, in which Amreeka can control who India can purchase military equipment from.

[gakakkad]

Ashley Tellis the Brown Sahib.