India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

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hanumadu
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Post by hanumadu »

ramana wrote: 16 Aug 2025 02:38 A couple of questions for the members?
1) What is driving Trump against India? Give listed reasons like a) ...b), c)...
a) As for the 25% additional tariff for buying Russian oil, Trump and US are desperate for a cease fire. Trump promised end to the Ukranian war on the first day itself yet there is no end in sight. Of all the poll promised the only thing he succeeded in was stopping fresh immigration. He needs a win. The US needs a ceasefire. They went to war with Russia expecting a win but now lost 20% of Ukraine with Russia threatening to take what it wants. If Russia achieves its goals in Ukraine and then announces a cease fire, the US will lose its face big time, more than it already has. No one will trust the west anymore.

b) For not signing the deal yet and imposing 25% tariffs, Trump wants to dump his agri and diary products in India.

c) He wants to browbeat India into falling into the western camp, though realistically it's not possible. Even they should know it.

d) He is an idiot and he is being led by idiots.
ramana
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Post by ramana »

Yes MUTUwani is Neo Shalab Kumar.
VT is right Logan Act wont apply to her as she is not representing India.
There are a group of individuals in DC and Silicon Valley who think they can browbeat India for their success.
And they are well connected in India and in US.
hanumadu
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Post by hanumadu »

Asha Jadeja Motwani 🇮🇳🇺🇸
@ashajadeja325
The only Indian American megadonor to the Republican Party is me. I strongly recommend that the Indian side reach out to me for my opinion on what’s going on in Trump’s mind. I may not be accurate, but I will be close. Please look at the federal election commission website to see who is donating what. It’s all out there for the world to see.
Looks like Modi is not answering Trump's calls and Trump is trying to go through a mediator.
hanumadu
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Post by hanumadu »

Putin was cheerful while Trump was subdued and looked like going through the motions.

At this point of time, Trump seems to be happy he got Putin to the talking table albeit by threatening India with secondary sanctions. Let us see how long this will last, but Trump's only play now seems to be threatening India.

I have a feeling Putin is happy with what he got of Ukraine for now and may make a deal. He can always revisit the issue later.
williams
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Post by williams »

ramana wrote: 16 Aug 2025 02:38 A couple of questions for the members?
1) What is driving Trump against India? Give listed reasons like a) ...b), c)...

2) What do members think of people like Asha Motwani (specifically) who are interjecting themselves into Indian foreign policy?
Again give answer a).. b)... c)....

Note with respect to 2) US has a law that which requires registering as a foreign agent.
a) As I mentioned before this is an ambiguous relationship from the beginning. On the Indian side we signed the 3/4 letter agreements thinking key American technology will arrive for the benefit of India assent. Nothing substantial came. On the US side they were thinking some major defense purchases will happen and yet they denied their crown jewels for sale. India never brought anything that will get major offensive teeth to her armed forces. Same goes with trade and geopolitics. Tell me in which forum Indian interests were defended against China or Pakistan. The whole Taliban Afgan deal was done without even giving India a seat in the negotiation. There were constant attempts to deny furthering of Indian interests and constant signs of internal interference and sabotage on any India ambitions.

b) However there was an appearance of a relationship with a bit of neutrality. All that changed post May 10, 2025. American's saw Indian hard power in play without any strategic restrain and they definitely were shocked. A combination of local innovation, Russian and French weapon systems destroyed Paki assets that included some American Radar and fixed wing systems. American built nuclear C3I systems were destroyed beyond repair. If India continued there is no Pakistan and that should have alerted some of the old guard in CIA and State department. Suddenly they are seeing a major power in Asia that is a real potential threat to their dominance in IOR.

c) Combine that with Modi reading the riot act to Trump about his casual approach to the Paki terrorist posture against India from Canada. Indian negotiators were not ready to compromise on any Indian agricultural interests in the trade negotiations. Trump does not have a sense how much India has grown in economic and strategic size today. He does not have any understanding that with the current heft, India is not looking for any subservient relationship with the Americans.

d) Finally unlike China which has developed real leverage against and American action, India seems like not having any leverage. This may not be true if deeper analysis is done, but at the surface level Trump admin thinks they can beat India and get away with it.

The above are hard facts, the rest of the things like some noise from the Indian diaspora and media is just that -- noise. In the next few weeks and months, we will see how Modi is going to deal with this. They will first prove that 50% tariff is small fry and India is not going to budge an inch by bully tactics. Next they will start pressing the right buttons for the Americans to understand that they are not going to gain anything from pushing India out of their circle of influence. We have the precedence of how China and Canada was dealt with when they try to fool around. Modi admin is not the one who is going to back off from such bully tactics, period.
KL Dubey
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Post by KL Dubey »

^^"williams" - powerful post, panthah :mrgreen:
sanjaykumar
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Post by sanjaykumar »

Putin was given an opportunity to show who is boss.

Very poor preparation on the Americans’ part. It is advertised as essentially an announcement of major progress. And Putin gets into his Illuyshin and flies out of a major airbase. After taking on NATO and winning.

Note that all other leaders fly Boeing or airbus.

These are not good optics.
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Post by KL Dubey »

hanumadu wrote: 16 Aug 2025 08:02 Putin was cheerful while Trump was subdued and looked like going through the motions.
Thats perhaps because he literally is. He has worn diapers since the 1990s due to fecal incontinence. However, his doctor certified him as supremely fit.

Obamudu: https://youtube.com/shorts/Y5EoI09wTVw? ... AYdXFzM3Cm
sanjaykumar
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Post by sanjaykumar »

Trump generally looks pretty good for his age-orange make up and all.

Putin looks 20 years younger than his age. Trump comparatively looked bloated. I think when we examine Americans and also Canadians in relation to Europeans (except British) we notice how different from the usual body habitus people are here.
hanumadu
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Post by hanumadu »

Indian channels are reporting that Trump said there will not be any secondary tariffs for now but if there is no progress in 2-3 weeks, there might be which is as good as having them now. No body will make any purchases with such uncertainity. Also, fatigue sets in for India and Russia and won't care anymore. Putin laid some conditions and Trump agreed. If progress isn't made means Ukraine and NATO are playing truant.

Putin pointed out in the press conference that since Trump tool over, US-Russia trade grew by 20%. Trolling of the best kind. Imposing sanctions on India for doing what they themselves are doing is absolute brazenness. I hope nothing comes out of the talks and let's see what Trump can do.
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Post by drnayar »

sanjaykumar wrote: 16 Aug 2025 09:29 Putin was given an opportunity to show who is boss.

Very poor preparation on the Americans’ part. It is advertised as essentially an announcement of major progress. And Putin gets into his Illuyshin and flies out of a major airbase. After taking on NATO and winning.

Note that all other leaders fly Boeing or airbus.

These are not good optics.
Putin's jet escorted by 4 F22 fighters in the American airspace.
B2 stealth bomber flying overhead.
Trump waiting at the red carpet
Trump letting Putin speak..first . unusually subdued
Both of them getting into the Beast !! :shock:

As NY Times .. every thing was not protocol but these days it is what trump says. !
drnayar
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Post by drnayar »

hanumadu wrote: 16 Aug 2025 07:06
Asha Jadeja Motwani
@ashajadeja325
The only Indian American megadonor to the Republican Party is me. I strongly recommend that the Indian side reach out to me for my opinion on what’s going on in Trump’s mind. I may not be accurate, but I will be close. Please look at the federal election commission website to see who is donating what. It’s all out there for the world to see.
Looks like Modi is not answering Trump's calls and Trump is trying to go through a mediator.
Possible.

Modi is the last leader who Trump should have messed with.
drnayar
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Post by drnayar »

sanjaykumar wrote: 16 Aug 2025 09:48 Trump generally looks pretty good for his age-orange make up and all.

Putin looks 20 years younger than his age. Trump comparatively looked bloated. I think when we examine Americans and also Canadians in relation to Europeans (except British) we notice how different from the usual body habitus people are here.
for conspiracy theorists ..was it really Putin :((
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Post by uddu »

India Gives a Huge Shock to USA on Russian Oil India USA Tariff Modi vs Trump I Aadi Pathikrit Show

India Gives a Huge Shock to USA on Russian Oil, India USA Tariff Modi vs Trump I Aadi Pathikrit Show
Manish_P
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Post by Manish_P »

drnayar wrote: 16 Aug 2025 12:39
sanjaykumar wrote: 16 Aug 2025 09:48 Trump generally looks pretty good for his age-orange make up and all.

Putin looks 20 years younger than his age. Trump comparatively looked bloated. I think when we examine Americans and also Canadians in relation to Europeans (except British) we notice how different from the usual body habitus people are here.
for conspiracy theorists ..was it really Putin :((
How can it be?

Over the past decade they have given him Cancer, Heart attacks, Kidney failure, Strokes, Parkinson's, ...

Dude has survived Obama and Oumuamua
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Post by Rudradev »

My bet: EU will NOT impose sanctions or tariffs on India.

1) They want access to India's markets, and to fill an emerging space that America will be locked out of by India-imposed reciprocal tariffs.
2) They realise that such actions against India will have no effect at all on Putin's intentions regarding Ukraine. Resident Chump has shown that he himself can be played for a fool by the Russians. IF the US had a capable negotiator and Putin's back was almost to the wall, EU might believe that they and the Americans had come 90% of the way to a favourable deal... so MAYBE sanctioning India could help push Russia to concede the remaining 10%. But that is not the case at all, as Alaska demonstrated.
3) Finally, they know that they are major importers of Russian energy and resources themselves-- and logic that was applied to punish India (for not giving in to America's unreasonable demands on trade) can be used against them too. What if tomorrow, Resident Chump tells France or Germany that they will have to face 30% tariffs for purchasing Russian natural gas, and arm-twists other nations in the EU to go along with him?

Honestly, India should make a great show of lowering all import barriers to EU agricultural products (they are not all that much in quantity, after all) while slapping 100% additional tariffs on American agricultural products.

We know that Scott Bessent is personally invested to the tune of 600 million in soybean and corn farming in North Dakota. So kick him directly in the nuts by tariffing the hell out of those two American crops specifically.
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Post by Tanaji »

ramana wrote: 16 Aug 2025 07:03 Yes MUTUwani is Neo Shalab Kumar.
VT is right Logan Act wont apply to her as she is not representing India.
There are a group of individuals in DC and Silicon Valley who think they can browbeat India for their success.
And they are well connected in India and in US.
How is Motwani well connected in India? Not doubting you, but who is she connected with in India?
drnayar
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Post by drnayar »

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/uEcHHhAt ... ture=share

Which door do I leave from?
At Harvard, we don't end our sentences with prepositions.
Well, in that case, which door do I leave from?
What democratic eloquence?
You asked the question, sir. Let me answer it. The genius of the constitution is that it can always be changed. The genius of the constitution is that it makes no permanent rule other than its faith in the wisdom of ordinary people to govern themselves. Faith in the wisdom of the people is exactly what makes the Constitution incomplete and crude.
No, sir. Our founding parents were pompous, middle-aged white farmers, but they were also great men because they knew one thing that all great men should know, that they didn't know everything.
They knew they were going to make mistakes, but they made sure to leave a way to correct them. They didn't think of themselves as leaders. They wanted a government of citizens, not royalty. A government of listeners, not lecturers.
A government that could change, not stand still. The president isn't an elected king, no matter how many bombs he can drop, because the crude constitution doesn't trust him. He's a servant of the people. He's a bum. Okay, Mr. Pitan, he's just a bum. And the only bliss that he's searching for is freedom and justice.

powerful words
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Post by gakakkad »

Is she pushing for investments that would personally benefit her ?
eklavya
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Post by eklavya »

^^^^
It is up to the US government officials, Republican Party members, and US business people to figure out how to bring Trump to his senses. It says something (not good, in case you are wondering) about their system when foreign and economic policy becomes so whimsical, personalised and utterly corrupted. The wise move is to de-couple and de-risk from this failing system. I cannot think of anything more foolish than investing in it.
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Post by Deans »

sanjaykumar wrote: 16 Aug 2025 09:48 Trump generally looks pretty good for his age-orange make up and all.

Putin looks 20 years younger than his age. Trump comparatively looked bloated. I think when we examine Americans and also Canadians in relation to Europeans (except British) we notice how different from the usual body habitus people are here.
At the graves of Russian pilots who died in Alaska in WW2, Putin repeatedly knelt to place flowers. Even for someone 20 years younger like me,
doing the equivalent of 20 squats can be a strain.
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Post by hanumadu »

Great show with John Mearsheimer on Breaking Points.

Very interesting point he makes is that the Trump-Putin meeting was confirmed when Steve Witkoff visited Moscow. He imposed secondary sanctions on India knowing fully well he can back off from them claiming progress (whether there is or not) after yesterday's meeting with Putin. According to the prof, Ukraine's choices are between worse and worst.

KL Dubey
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Post by KL Dubey »

Rudradev wrote: 16 Aug 2025 15:01 My bet: EU will NOT impose sanctions or tariffs on India.
.....
I agree broadly with this prediction. However, I would like to see how the EU CBAMs will be handled in a mutually acceptable manner for exports of energy-intensive products from Bharat.

The latest I could find on the India-EU FTA talks, It seems things are still going well.
https://www.cnbctv18.com/economy/india ... 54290.htm

Also, India and Oman will sign a FTA soon. By now India has FTAs or PTAs with nearly 60 countries.

Finally, I don't think the existing CUSMA FTA between Kanadda, USA, and Mexico will stand much longer, with no alternative "deal" on the horizon. As a result, Kanadda will likely be more eager to get bilateral agreements with India and Mexico, and already has a FTA with the EU.

If all these arrangements are made, it seems US tariffs will be mostly irrelevant. It will be only a matter of time that countries start trading in their local currencies.
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Post by KL Dubey »

hanumadu wrote: 16 Aug 2025 22:51
Very interesting point he makes is that the Trump-Putin meeting was confirmed when Steve Witkoff visited Moscow. He imposed secondary sanctions on India knowing fully well he can back off from them claiming progress (whether there is or not) after yesterday's meeting with Putin. According to the prof, Ukraine's choices are between worse and worst.
I think Bharat should not continue any further trade talks no matter what new outlandish tariffs are proclaimed, and should move on.
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Post by williams »

KL Dubey wrote: 17 Aug 2025 03:53
Rudradev wrote: 16 Aug 2025 15:01 My bet: EU will NOT impose sanctions or tariffs on India.
.....
I agree broadly with this prediction. However, I would like to see how the EU CBAMs will be handled in a mutually acceptable manner for exports of energy-intensive products from Bharat.

The latest I could find on the India-EU FTA talks, It seems things are still going well.
https://www.cnbctv18.com/economy/india ... 54290.htm

Also, India and Oman will sign a FTA soon. By now India has FTAs or PTAs with nearly 60 countries.

Finally, I don't think the existing CUSMA FTA between Kanadda, USA, and Mexico will stand much longer, with no alternative "deal" on the horizon. As a result, Kanadda will likely be more eager to get bilateral agreements with India and Mexico, and already has a FTA with the EU.

If all these arrangements are made, it seems US tariffs will be mostly irrelevant. It will be only a matter of time that countries start trading in their local currencies.
100% agree. Goods and money will find its way through whatever market is available subject to the forces of supply and demand. Trade barriers can only create temporary disruption. American\s need to solve the problem of high labor and regulatory cost. Until then manufacturing jobs are not going to return back.
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Post by Vayutuvan »

williams wrote: 17 Aug 2025 04:48 American\s need to solve the problem of high labor and regulatory cost. Until then manufacturing jobs are not going to return back.
They can't solve the problem of high labor costs. Nobody is willing to downsize their lifestyle. Not a single one of them. Regulatory costs pale in front of labor costs. Unemployment numbers are going to go up real soon now. That means, Dems are going to win with promise of freebies, rent control, UBI (possibly), loan forgiveness, etc. America is open for business. They will sell off America piece by piece.
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Post by hanumadu »

KL Dubey wrote: 17 Aug 2025 04:40
hanumadu wrote: 16 Aug 2025 22:51
Very interesting point he makes is that the Trump-Putin meeting was confirmed when Steve Witkoff visited Moscow. He imposed secondary sanctions on India knowing fully well he can back off from them claiming progress (whether there is or not) after yesterday's meeting with Putin. According to the prof, Ukraine's choices are between worse and worst.
I think Bharat should not continue any further trade talks no matter what new outlandish tariffs are proclaimed, and should move on.
The US delegation cancelled their visit to India. They are going to go all out on India. India should not budge.
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Post by srin »

Not sure who cancelled. Since there was no point. Both sides know each other’s positions. US delegation was lame duck since all decisions are done by President TanTrump irrespective of the advice given by the delegation.
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Post by uddu »

There is great chance to have excellent deals with Canada as they are looking to diversify. We probably could import Wood, Aluminum, Copper and things that are much needed to keep the prices under check.
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Re: India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

Post by KL Dubey »

hanumadu wrote: 17 Aug 2025 08:27
KL Dubey wrote: 17 Aug 2025 04:40

I think Bharat should not continue any further trade talks no matter what new outlandish tariffs are proclaimed, and should move on.
The US delegation cancelled their visit to India. They are going to go all out on India. India should not budge.
As I understand, Bharat sarkar was not responding to calls from Trump/Lattu/Basant. The last Indian delegation that visited the US came back disgusted.
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