India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

[A_Gupta]

I too heard Rajiv Malhotra talk about "in-kind-investment" rather than "cash investment" which India does not have. E.g., India could provide labor and share the labor costs in return for some equity in the Gulf projects mentioned below.

An AI summary:

Multiple Gulf states are pursuing major AI partnerships with the United States, including investments in AI centers within their own borders and reciprocal investments in U.S. AI infrastructure. Key players in these partnerships include the United Arab Emirates (UAE), Saudi Arabia, and Qatar, with involvement from U.S. tech giants such as Nvidia, Microsoft, OpenAI, and Oracle.
United Arab Emirates (UAE)

Massive AI campus: The UAE and the U.S. announced a joint initiative in May 2025 to build a 5-gigawatt AI campus in Abu Dhabi, which is planned to be the largest outside of the U.S..

This campus will be built by the Emirati state-linked tech firm G42 and operated in partnership with U.S. firms like OpenAI, Oracle, and Nvidia.

It will serve the Middle East, Africa, and South Asia markets.

Reciprocal investment: As part of the agreement, the UAE has committed to investing in U.S.-based AI infrastructure. In January 2025, G42 and other partners committed $500 billion to the U.S.-based Stargate project.

Strategic U.S. partnerships:

Microsoft and G42: In April 2024, Microsoft invested $1.5 billion in G42 to accelerate AI development and global expansion.
Qualcomm: The Abu Dhabi Investment Office and Qualcomm have partnered to establish an advanced engineering center in Abu Dhabi focused on AI and data center solutions.

Cerebras: G42 has a strategic partnership with California-based Cerebras Systems and has been co-developing the Condor Galaxy supercomputer network.

MGX: The Abu Dhabi investment company MGX has participated in funding rounds for OpenAI and xAI and is a founding partner in the AI Infrastructure Partnership with Microsoft and BlackRock.

Saudi Arabia

Vision 2030 and tech hub: Under its Vision 2030 plan, Saudi Arabia is heavily investing in AI to diversify its economy away from oil and transform into a tech and innovation hub.

Major U.S. tech collaborations:

Nvidia and HUMAIN: In May 2025, Nvidia announced a partnership with the new Saudi AI firm HUMAIN, providing 18,000 of its top-tier AI supercomputing chips to build foundational infrastructure in the kingdom.

Google Cloud: Google Cloud is cooperating with Saudi Arabia's Public Investment Fund (PIF) on an AI hub in Dammam.

Cisco and HUMAIN: Cisco is partnering with HUMAIN to build scalable and secure AI infrastructure from the ground up, including establishing an AI Institute at King Abdullah University of Science and Technology (KAUST).

Groq: U.S. AI chip startup Groq secured a $1.5 billion commitment from Saudi Arabia to build the world's largest AI inferencing data center in Dammam.

Amazon Web Services (AWS): AWS is working with local partners to create an "AI Zone" on its platforms.
Reciprocal investment: As part of a larger $600 billion economic package, the U.S. announced a deal where Saudi firms will invest tens of billions into U.S. data centers.

Qatar

Strategic investments: Qatar is using its sovereign wealth fund, the Qatar Investment Authority (QIA), to invest in AI and digital infrastructure globally, particularly in the U.S..

In September 2025, QIA partnered with U.S. asset manager Blue Owl to launch a $3 billion digital infrastructure platform focused on data centers.

QIA was also a key backer in a record-breaking $13 billion funding round for U.S. AI firm Anthropic.

Quantum technology: Qatari investment firm Al Rabban Capital has committed $1 billion to U.S.-based quantum firm Quantinuum to invest in U.S. quantum technology and workforce development.

[ShauryaT]

Think tanks & lobbying massa are usually for countries and entities that aggressively *want* something. India is basically a status-quo power that wants to be left alone to mind its own business and grow in its own way. Hard to push aggressively for massa to ... do nothing.

Wanting to be left alone is not a realistic or at least not a profitable option in the world of hard nosed international relations, is it? There are only two options. Either be in axis with BRICS/global south type of powers (IOW: China camp) and do a NAM 2.0 redux or make a conscious and hard to swallow but a profitable and realistic choice recognizing India's relatively weak economic, technological, military and strategic positions as of today and strike a faustian bargain in order to build its capacities (similar to the Meiji era bargain by Imperial Japan) and if and when these capacities are built - only then strike out an independent path --- when and if India can truly claim great power status. A great power is one who can dominate its neighborhood, and chosen areas of Interests and does not rely on any other power for its core interests. One thing we should not indulge in - again - is moralistic rhetoric no one cares about to the detriment of India and Indians. Is the current view of EAM, one of "multi-alignment" is in need of a relook?

[Vayutuvan]

... Shashi Tharoor is absurd.

As a MoS of EAM, what were Dr. Tharoor's achievements? Also, as an MP then and now, did he come up with any new policy initiatives or any new bills crafted by him which were tabled in the Parliament?

[A_Gupta]

One thing we should not indulge in - again - is moralistic rhetoric no one cares about to the detriment of India and Indians.

India is not being moralistic on two things that are very easy to be moralistic about - Ukraine/Russia and Israel/Gaza.

I do see so far no compromise on Indian independence and sovereignty even at significant economic cost; but I don't see this stance as moralistic. Rather it is protecting the core value from which all other values emerge.

Trump is treating the states allied with the US as vassals; as the British Raj dealt with the princely states in British India. I trust India's leaders will not bow down to this, there is no going back to pre-1947; and not yielding is not "moralistic".

[ShauryaT]

Trump is treating the states allied with the US as vassals; as the British Raj dealt with the princely states in British India. I trust India's leaders will not bow down to this, there is no going back to pre-1947; and not yielding is not "moralistic".

Not yielding is not enough to win. It is winning that matters. What is a win for India and Indian interests - given realities of power disparities current and emerging? That is the question leadership has to answer. We know what we ultimately want but how do we get there is the question? Cannot get there by just stating we do not want to be aligned, ignoring realities of the state of affairs. I personally feel, this moment is like Commodore Perry's arrival in Japan in 1853. Japan was helpless and its desires to be "left alone" did not have any mettle to stand on.

[A_Gupta]

What outcome do you want? More precisely, what constitutes winning?

[A_Gupta]

https://www.opindia.com/2025/09/anti-in ... lot-trial/

Anti-India academic Nitasha Kaul, whose OCI card was revoked by India, enlisted by the US as an expert witness in the Pannun assassination plot trial

[chetak]

... Shashi Tharoor is absurd.

As a MoS of EAM, what were Dr. Tharoor's achievements? Also, as an MP then and now, did he come up with any new policy initiatives or any new bills crafted by him which were tabled in the Parliament?

Vayutuvan ji,

tharoor is window dressing and eye candy. One half of the population drools over him

He has an outstanding way with words and is extremely personable, intimidating friends and foes alike, by the sheer force of presence

He is a high maintenance rolls royce, when India needs a sturdy maruti that gets the work done without any fuss or flamboyance and when needed, can be easily fixed in any tiny workshop that dot the landscape in their thousands, everywhere in the country.

tharoor (politically speaking, of course) does not realize what every pretty girl already knows, that you have to kiss a lot of frogs before you find your prince.

Indian politics needs draught horses, not arabian racehorses

to expect anything more from him is foolhardy

I like the guy, one needs a respite from the daily drudge and motivated self aggrandization of the papooze genre of politicking

As Milton said, "They also serve who only stand and wait" ................................(for good fortune of high office to fall into their laps)

[chetak]

There’s a clear divide between the pre-2020 Rajiv Malhotra and the post-2020 version. He remains razor-sharp, erudite, and highly articulate, but too often his conversations now drift into personal gripes and grievances. I agree with him that the whole “My frand Dunaald” and “ab ki baar Trump sarkar” routine was cringe-worthy, unnecessary, and shortsighted. Where I differ is in his belief that simply buying a seat at a think tank would have significantly changed our prospects.

He is absolutely right that Pakistan punches above its weight, pouring millions into lobbying, embedding its people across governments, and securing influence on both sides of the Western political spectrum. But India’s challenge today goes beyond policy confusion in Washington. What we are facing is a deeply rooted ideological and nativist movement, one that think tanks like the Heritage Foundation have successfully channeled into policy. Buying more “seats at the table” won’t fundamentally shift that reality. In this context, India turning inward and strengthening ties with its immediate neighbors including China, actually makes sense.

Yes, we do need a consistent line, and yes, our lobbying and PR game needs serious improvement. But let’s not kid ourselves that lobbying alone will solve our problems. And Malhotra’s suggestion that India should “invest” in the U.S. by sending more workers here is tone-deaf and almost laughable, especially when the MAGA political platform is explicitly anti-immigration!

Maybe Malhotra-ji feels under-valued at the end of a long & distinguished career.

Think tanks & lobbying massa are usually for countries and entities that aggressively *want* something. India is basically a status-quo power that wants to be left alone to mind its own business and grow in its own way. Hard to push aggressively for massa to ... do nothing.

KLNMurthy ji,

That is the crux of the matter

The man is a tireless warrior for our civilizational culture and all that it stands for and he has continually faced brickbats, threats, and abuse from the academic commies and abrahamics in amrika and elsewhere in the world

Honors have been given to some really horrendous schitts by this govt.

The least that they can do, and even now it's not too late, is to recognize his work by award of the padma

This govt, and indeed the party itself, is gun shy when it comes to supporting its own.............

The countless hundreds of party workers that were sacrificed in bengal to mumtaz begum's marauding party workers and jihadi murderers, is a bitter point to note

[SRajesh]

What's rolling out :
1. Immediate neighbourhood
2. Wider regional Conflicts
3. Worldwide
I feel that our insistence on strategic independence has to be root cause of all the angst!
And if you look at US moves they seem to be working to curtail this strategic independence.
Immediate. neighbourhood : look at various fires being lit either simultaneously or in a series of moves Sri Lanka, Maldives, Beediland, Myanmar, Nepal and now Taliban being threatened by Trump. We are getting encircled by a ring of fire.
Regional : Iran: Chabhar waiver removed, IMEC probably being sidelined with KSA/Paki pact, Gulf investment in AI which wlll have impact (They dont have the trained manpower and will need from India and therein will be Control tap on visas etc), Energy security
Geopolitical : Pukraine war and Russia and our energy deal, EU and the trade deal, US . And in the wider world an image of Dirty Indian being pushed around ( though had been there for a while but is being slowly mainlined).
I wonder if the Deep State have realised that China is a bigger Fish to fry currently and will need a step wise approach.
And I feel the first indicator was the No Show at UN General Assembly. Will there be a QUAD summit I doubt whether we will be hosting it.
And the next meet in Australia will definitely show the future grouping (at least for next 5-10 years all dependent on the future US President and Indian PM)
Vaccine Maitri of the global South has not gone down well with the white folks, showing them up as what they really are a bunch of marauding pirates.
It will be tense three year period with a 3-D Chess all around!!

[Rudradev]

Trump announces 100% tariffs on Indian pharmaceutical exports.

[Y. Kanan]

Again relax folks. Nothing earth shattering has happened. 85 thousand engineers world wide and probably half that number in India go for this visa category. Most of these people work as consultants/contractors. It is a small number compared to the disruption that happened during Covid. When Covid happened all travel came to an halt, and most of the work is pushed remote during that time itself. That was much bigger disruption and yet nothing happened to Indian IT industry. Many IT US master degree holders also did not get any OJT opportunities. Offshoring in Mexico is already well established. So if there are H1b holders who are stranded, they will probably go to Mexico and manage their work from there. Doctors/researchers etc will find opportunities in other countries and will happily move to greener pasturers. There will be higher demand for US IT workers and their salaries will automatically go up. That will make this a more expensive affair. Silently the IT big wigs in the US will lobby to dilute this law and things will be back to square one.

Back home if we solve basic civic problems, provide batter services and opportunities for the aspirational youth, no one would want to go to other countries. As some one said let us use this opportunity to incentivize building our own platform stack and fuel our own economic growth. We could provide soft loans to those who want to return back and start their own MSMEs in India. Work life balance issues is mostly for IT workers who need to get work done in the day time and discuss issues in US timing from India. Those can be resolved and IT companies are usually in the forefront to improve things as they see more people working in this mode. Our youth is resilient and will grab opportunities as they come. They have been challenged in much more ways than we can all imagine. They will move on to do greater things in life.

Ultimately Amercans will be the losers. They have not improved their education system and are producing fewer STEM students. If the international students don't show up in numbers due to lack of opportunities all the innovation we see in the US will tank.

I keep thinking this turn of events could be a blessing in disguise for us. If we play our cards right, we could virtually end the brain drain that has always plagued us. But this would require Indian governments at every level (municipal, state govs, centre) to focus on fixing all the domestic issues that caused this brain drain in the first place. And I have no faith that will happen at all.

[Tanaji]

Trump announces 100% tariffs on Indian pharmaceutical exports.

The tariff is actually on branded and patented drugs. Its not clear what happens with generic drugs.

The orange one had promised to reduce costs by 1500%(?). Clearly this is a part of the strategy.

Realistically this is another shakedown, this time of the pharma industry. You pay bribes, you will get an exemption. The press conference linking tylenol with autism was a shot across the bow - look what I can do if you don’t pay. Not to mention he and his cronies must have already made money by shorting stock and more to be made.

The guy is just running a protection racket now.

[chetak]

VI@WA


sometimes garrulous goyal can be an idiot.

loquacious trade negotiators went out with the dinosaurs

He needs to watch his tongue carefully

Talking about H1B and "people access" is the worst strategy to negotiate a trade deal with this selfish and rent seeking, anti immigrant administration, whose true intent in imposing such high punitive tariffs, specifically on India, is yet to be revealed

[S_Madhukar]

Someone like Rajivji needs his own think tank. And yes a Parma award is due. But NaMo is very careful of avoiding loose cannons. In that sometimes rewarding a SRK and ignoring Rajivji hurts a lot. But then at this moment the Indian American lobby may be just biding their time waiting for the storm to be over.
I would like to think GoI too is willing to ride this over by wooing Wall St and ignoring St dept as they are filled with villains that no amount of bribing will help. NaMo doesn’t tolerate failures, softies and bribe seekers. That hurts a lot of people.
My main worry is the regime change ops and border issues. We need a firm handle on that. I don’t like US troops in the neighbourhood in disguise or openly. We can’t allow a foothold for these guys.
Also why hasn’t India issued a travel advisory on US universities yet? If not banning at least discourage Indian students and ideally banks should be raising student loan risks. PGurus were advising that only scholarship students should take the risk going forwards and avoid 2nd tier universities which I think is sound advice

[chetak]

Someone like Rajivji needs his own think tank. And yes a Parma award is due. But NaMo is very careful of avoiding loose cannons. In that sometimes rewarding a SRK and ignoring Rajivji hurts a lot. But then at this moment the Indian American lobby may be just biding their time waiting for the storm to be over.
I would like to think GoI too is willing to ride this over by wooing Wall St and ignoring St dept as they are filled with villains that no amount of bribing will help. NaMo doesn’t tolerate failures, softies and bribe seekers. That hurts a lot of people.
My main worry is the regime change ops and border issues. We need a firm handle on that. I don’t like US troops in the neighbourhood in disguise or openly. We can’t allow a foothold for these guys.
Also why hasn’t India issued a travel advisory on US universities yet? If not banning at least discourage Indian students and ideally banks should be raising student loan risks. PGurus were advising that only scholarship students should take the risk going forwards and avoid 2nd tier universities which I think is sound advice

S_Madhukar ji,

what was this govt doing since 2014.

This is certainly not a "today" problem

[chetak]

GoI does not seem to be blinking.

[Cyrano]

Rajiv Malhotra Ji doesn't hesitate to call a spade. For years he has been screaming for desi tech stack, os, data storage and better digital policies in Govt and our forces. Some of these have been achieved and some not. I haven't seen his analysis on op Sindoor from this perspective, I don't know if he did one, but in our own way we have taken on certain challenges and did very well. But Tech is a moving target that doesn't allow for a chai break.

While strategic autonomy is a core principle of India even when we had weak and malleable coalition govts which sometimes squealed about"phoren hand", the new dimension is tech and social media that can foment and trigger unrest with warp speed, combined with limitless dollar printing which allows the US to use these means to pressure and topple nearly any democratic Govt in the world with impunity bordering on glee. It's another form of Dubya's "you are with us or against us".

BTW have you noticed that no one talks about "rules based order"? Because now there are no rules, except "might is right".

If Trump is piling on so much pressure on India it's because India matters. And perhaps there in lie some clues to the way forward. If we are comparing ourselves to pakis then we are hyphenating ourselves.

India is the only other country apart from China that has the potential to become tech and manufacturing independent (to a large extent) and one day rival China and US. It is also the only country that can become a giant consumption driven economy for decades to come, and therefore can play a vital role in challenging the $ hegemony.

Tech dominance - current US, China, future India
Mfg dominance - current China, future India, US uncertain
Consumption market - current US, future India, China uncertain
Currency dominance - current US, future China and India

IMO only India has the potential to become a global leader in all 4 domains.

We cannot achieve this or secure our interests by wanting to be left alone. A rising power will be seen as a threat by many. So we have to engage with all actors big and small, and there will be some failures along with many successes.

If anything Trump is a wake up call to India reminding us to not slumber into complacency and sharpen our arsenal of Saama, Daana, Bheda and danDa. And play evermore actively in friend and enemy territory.

And yes, Rajiv Ji deserves a Padma.

[Cyrano]

Trump tariffs on medicines doesn't seem to apply for generics, which by definition are patent free and not "branded".

These days all buttons for our keyboard warriors and yootooburrs seem to be "PANIC"

[gakakkad]

Ultimately Amercans will be the losers. They have not improved their education system and are producing fewer STEM students. If the international students don't show up in numbers due to lack of opportunities all the innovation we see in the US will tank.

He is doing a big favor to India in the long run provided India is willing to capitalize . Invest in people ,allow them to invent and innovate and build institutions that are world class in stem . We need our weizmann ,Caltech ,max planck etc at even bigger scales .

[A_Gupta]

BTW have you noticed that no one talks about "rules based order"? Because now there are no rules, except "might is right".

The EU said that India is a necessary partner to keep a rules-based order.
China keeps blathering about rules-based order too.

Brussels, 17.9.2025
JOIN(2025) 50 final
JOINT COMMUNICATION TO THE EUROPEAN PARLIAMENT AND THE
COUNCIL
on a New Strategic EU-India Agenda

https://www.eeas.europa.eu/sites/defaul ... rt1_v9.pdf

The EU and India are pluralistic democracies committed to strategic autonomy, economic resilience, and international stability. Like-minded and trusted partners, both support a rules- based international order anchored in respect for sovereignty, effective multilateralism, and open, predictable cooperation. As major trading partners, both have an interest in working together to address global trade distortions, reduce overdependence on any single partner, and promote trade diversification.

China's main gripe with the rules-based order is who made the rules.
https://www.globaltimes.cn/page/202509/1343655.shtml

In this pivotal year of 2025 - commemorating both the 80th anniversary of the victory in the World Anti-Fascist War and the founding of the UN - Chinese President Xi Jinping put forward the Global Governance Initiative (GGI), offering China's wisdom and solutions to further strengthen and improve global governance.....The GGI's core vision is to adapt global rules and institutions to the 21st century, where developing countries have a more important role in global affairs.

@ricky_v made a very valid criticism, IMO, somewhere upthread, which I would rephrase as "we are unhealthily obsessed with the US and really need to develop a broader view".

[A_Gupta]

July 1st, 2025 seems like a long, long time ago.

https://www.state.gov/releases/office-o ... -the-press

In a joint press conference with Marco Rubio, US Secy of State, and Japanese and Australian counterparts, EAM Jaishankar said:

EXTERNAL AFFAIRS MINISTER JAISHANKAR: Thank you. I’m very pleased to be back in D.C. for the second time this year for a Quad foreign ministers meeting. And let me begin by saying that we’re all committed to ensure a free and open Indo-Pacific. To that end, our endeavors are devoted to promoting a rules-based international order. It is essential that nations of the Indo-Pacific have the freedom of choice so essential to make right decisions on development and security.

Trump is like a feather in a hurricane, shifting his position by the second. I don't think India's policies are that unstable. If no one is talking of a rules-based order, it is the US; and the US is small compared to the rest of the world. (Part of the upset in the US is that its people don't want to accept this fact.)

[A_Gupta]

Trump tariffs on medicines doesn't seem to apply for generics, which by definition are patent free and not "branded".

These days all buttons for our keyboard warriors and yootooburrs seem to be "PANIC"

Surely these tariffs cannot be new? Trump claims to have several trade agreements, and surely these tariffs are mentioned in those trade agreements?

Or are trade agreements with Trump subject to unilateral amendment by Trump, rendering less valuable than the paper they are written on?

What does "India must win" amount to? Nothing, if people think that a trade agreement actually means something to Trump and his administration.

This is not the first time Trump has done this. Soon after the agreement with the UK, without any notice or consultation with the British, Trump raised the tariffs on the import of various metals, including from the UK.

We also have the instances of Trump asking which idiot signed this agreement for agreements he made in his first term.

So what is it that India hopes to achieve? What is "winning"? How will India hold Trump to an agreement, if any, that is negotiated? What is so special about India that Trump will honor agreements with India where he hasn't honored agreements with his long-time allies?

Do tell.

[Tanaji]

Trump had a habit of reneging agreements that he himself had signed. There is zero guarantee that he won’t come up with tariffs on random items even after a treaty is in place. He is running a hafta vasooli racket essentially. The sooner we treat him that way, the better- imagine he is a warlord is Somalia that you need to payoff to get from A to B. The same morals, the same greed and the same capriciousness.

Except this one has nukes.

[Deans]

Trump announces 100% tariffs on Indian pharmaceutical exports.

The tariff is actually on branded and patented drugs. Its not clear what happens with generic drugs.

The orange one had promised to reduce costs by 1500%(?). Clearly this is a part of the strategy.

We should nominate him for the Nobel in medicine - showing that vaccines are not necessary and reducing the price of drugs by
1500% while simultaneously imposing a 100% tariff. Or maybe an Economics Nobel.

[Deans]

Trump tariffs on medicines doesn't seem to apply for generics, which by definition are patent free and not "branded".

These days all buttons for our keyboard warriors and yootooburrs seem to be "PANIC"

Surely these tariffs cannot be new? Trump claims to have several trade agreements, and surely these tariffs are mentioned in those trade agreements?

Or are trade agreements with Trump subject to unilateral amendment by Trump, rendering less valuable than the paper they are written on?

What does "India must win" amount to? Nothing, if people think that a trade agreement actually means something to Trump and his administration.

This is not the first time Trump has done this. Soon after the agreement with the UK, without any notice or consultation with the British, Trump raised the tariffs on the import of various metals, including from the UK.

Apart from the UK, which agreed with Trump's version of the trade deal - which Trump then reneged on, none of the other `Yuge deal' countries
(EU, Japan, China, Korea) have agreed to Trump's version - no one, not even Vietnam, is going to invest a zillion dollars at Trump's direction, or buy more energy than US exports. There is no point in making anything more than temporary concessions on imports, if the US rolls back their punitive tariffs.

[ShauryaT]

What outcome do you want? More precisely, what constitutes winning?

Sticking to IR and India-US only.

India Objectives

• Be the China+1 of US supply chain - especially as it relates to mass manufacturing
• Be the trusted destination for high tech manufacturing and build capacities
• Engage and make the give and take required to get trade deals going - these are not permanent only interests are
• Shed the institutional fears and unleash the energies of India, even if it feels like we are doing this at gun point - as long as Indian security and economic needs are served.
• Firmly be on a trajectory to receive military and technology supplies against China to meet our defense needs for next 20 years

US Objectives

• Align with US Defense platforms
• Align with US led global order based on common principles of democracy, capitalism - even if flawed and/or not adhered to by its promoters
• Take leadership to take up responsibility - means blood and sweat in the IOR. USN AOR shifts east - if india - US ties are on a firm trajectory - may even mean co-opting Pakistan

Painful for me to say and I am sure painful for many but drop the charade of being an independent power, we are not there. How we use these economic, technology and defense engagements to build capacities and create the option to be an independent power in the future is up to us. But without building of capacities, Indian leaders would just waste the opportunities of one more generation in hopes of a future without a plan.

Having said the above, fixing the indo-US impasse for strategic leverage is only ONE aspect of issues India needs to work on, where 90%+ are really local issues to be managed. The proof of the pudding is in the eating and in India's case, it is when people stop voting with their feet.

There is a an interesting observation based on K. Subramanyam's life, the current EAM's father that I have kind of accepted with some regret. He was the original "lion" of Indian policy hawks but always had questions on some changes to his views from the 70's to the 90's (Others here know more about him). Experience teaches one a thing or two that I did not have in the 90's. Maybe I am wrong, age can be a liability too!

[A_Gupta]

Hosted by Barkha Dutt, yes, but two important points:
1. India should not take up H1-B diplomacy - leave it as an American tech company vs American issue.
2. Understand why the influential people of Indian origin are deafeningly silent. Are Indian NRI interests aligned with India’s interests?

https://youtu.be/374UYkccxos?si=4NfSPLuzAfI2NxJj

To address one of the points - a returned from US Indian startup entrepreneur points out many things - which would lead to the conclusion that becoming China+1 is almost entirely up to internal Indian actions. The US, EU, etc., have very little to do with it.

Listen and see if you agree. Nuance is necessary is one thing I see.

[A_Gupta]

I wii add if India is competitive (which is almost entirely in India’s control) the business will come to India, one way or the other, in spite of Trump’s efforts to the contrary.

[S_Madhukar]

Interesting view from a conservative commentor.

Since India’s fertility is declining this is the last cheaper cohort of H1B guys that rest of the world can lay their hands on. Hence in his words there is a scramble for Indian talented youngsters across the world. After this cohort Indian growth will make them expensive and he feels not much youngsters from other regions can be available at this scale after 5-10 years

https://youtu.be/3hXo7JUGsCY?si=CBhD8Eanqi0_BFGV

[ricky_v]

Tech dominance - current US, China, future India

Cyrano ji, i believe that this statement is more of an optimistic hail mary rather then an actual forecast, india, as is, is unable to compete in technologies of "yesterday" and today, why should it then be a dominant leader in the future? technology is an iterative process, everything builds back from a starting point to add onto the previous state, i do not believe that you can hack to a comfy superior level without ever having the industrial base / technological know-how / institutional knowledge cum memory like india ideally and traditionally likes to do

in many ways, india is still in the medieval era, atleast so far as the mentality of the mercenary groups / modern day industries go: the firepower and weapon initiation, refinement and improvement are undertaken in the west which comes onto our shores to be aped by mercantilistic mercenaries, in this scenario, our industries very neatly offshore the onerous and burdensome labour of r&d onto external entities, while they focus on the real matter of minting monies; if it were otherwise, where is the current day version of the indian gunpowder?

the government, beset by a large hungry population since inception, adopted a scarcity and utilitiarian approach and has its priority in its outlook always and cannot spare resources to midwife every high falutin innovation

i believe that saying that india will dominate tech in the future lulls us into a false sense of comfort that may and in all possibility will never come into existence, far better to realise and accept our areas of strengths and weaknesses and align with the other backbencher nations to collectively guard against the technological onslaught that us / israel and china will unleash

[eklavya]

Painful for me to say and I am sure painful for many but drop the charade of being an independent power, we are not there.

India is an independent power, but even an independent power has inter-dependencies. The US may be the #1 power, for now, but that does not mean that India cannot be independent in our dealings with the US. That fear should have been laid to rest decades ago: when Indira Gandhi and the Indian armed forces created Bangladesh in 1971, and when AB Vajpayee did the Pokhran II tests in 1998. If that India could look the US in the eye, where is the need to fear now. Have we become so soft over these years. Quite the opposite.

India’s growth and development are not tied to the goodwill of the US, and more particularly of this US President, who has perverse notions of US interests, to say the least. There is a very large world outside of the US too, and India’s objectives can be met entirely through interaction with the non US world. The US is quite simply not indispensable.

[Vayutuvan]

... we could virtually end the brain drain that has always plagued us.

This brain drain thing keeps coming up. What brain drain?

Most IIT grads end up in IAS or various Civil Services babubdom or IIMs and are stuck in the trishanku swarga - middle managergiri in PLCs which are dead end jobs. They are in swarga because they live in cities in reasonably upscale (not top scale like Worli Seaface) neighborhoods. But they are close to bhoolokam because they have to keep on doing corporate drudgery of endless meetings, travel, and commutes to their places of work which are far off from where they live, all to keep earning to pay their mortgage/appliances/furniture/HOA EMIs.

[Vayutuvan]

The guy is just running a protection racket now.

America was always a protection racket and would be into the foreseeable future. They are the world police. Not much different from your nukkad police constable who collects hafta from shops. The only difference is that the are police as well as mafia dons to whom all the local goondas pay a cut so that they can collect protection money in their localities.

[Vayutuvan]

But then at this moment the Indian American lobby may be just biding their time waiting for the storm to be over.

There is no Indian-American lobby. Indian-Americans vote is split in 65% Dems vs 35% GOP. While all Indian-Americans support Modi, they do not seem to support Trump, especially the Silly-con dwellers with their votes. What is there for GOP if more H1Bs come in but as soon as they become citizens, they overwhelmingly support DNC rather than GOP?

What we need is a 33-33-33 split between dems, gop, and indeps. Then we can always put pressure on one party or the other depending on their policies. Rajiv Malhotra seems to arguing for that rather than the boosting of DNC that is going on here in BRF itself.

[Vayutuvan]

I wii add if India is competitive (which is almost entirely in India’s control) the business will come to India, one way or the other, in spite of Trump’s efforts to the contrary.

As of now, India is not competitive. Poor infra in spite of all the new highways being built, low quality of life for city dwellers, all the techies who were unable to emigrate going into IIMs and babugiri, or even retail politics, union favoring labor laws, high taxes, family-owned giant monopolies, and no safety net for entrepreneurs. On the last point, in the US one can establish a startup in their garage right out of school/college. The chances are that they would fail. They can still get over the failure or two and still can hope for gainful employment and recoup the losses. That is not so in India. Starting a business itself is a very big thing. Problems start right before registering a company. One needs an address for registration. One needs an accounting firm, a company secretary to file paperwork, so and so forth. Then deposit for renting office space, furnish the same, a mobile or two. One is talking about at least 1-5 lacs INR which is quite a bit. Parents/relations are risk averse and correctly so.

Everything is under the control of babooze who are used to paper pushing and empty boasting.

[ramana]

AmberG and vayutuan. Can you please ignore each other and stop bickering like lower KG kids.
You both are PhDs.
Time to move on.