Vayusena & Nausena Rafale: News & Discussion

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Vayutuvan
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Re: Vayusena & Nausena Rafale: News & Discussion

Post by Vayutuvan »

@drnayar ji, engines engines engines.
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Re: Vayusena & Nausena Rafale: News & Discussion

Post by Kartik »

Vayutuvan wrote: 02 Jun 2026 04:24
drnayar wrote: 02 Jun 2026 03:25 Source Code: The foundational, human-readable programming that dictates core aircraft logic. eg., controlling how an AESA radar processes tracking data, tracks targets, or how an electronic warfare suite handles threat libraries. Countries rarely share this

ICD: The technical blueprints that specify how different hardware and software subsystems communicate. An ICD provides the necessary protocols, data formats, and signal rules to achieve "plug and play" capabilities.

What india and france has agreed to is likely ICD-based integration layer
Oh. Once we know ICD, can we replace the source code with our own source code? IS this disallowed contractually or through hardware?
Why would India even want to attempt something like that? Source code implies the millions of lines of software that are written for integrating the various systems. How on earth will India even try to do something like that without having to REQUALIFY and RECERTIFY the entire Rafale??
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Re: Vayusena & Nausena Rafale: News & Discussion

Post by ritesh »

drnayar wrote: 02 Jun 2026 23:51
Vayutuvan wrote: 02 Jun 2026 04:24

Oh. Once we know ICD, can we replace the source code with our own source code? IS this disallowed contractually or through hardware?

The MK2 Tejas is definitely a better bet . Just spend a few billions fast tracking and upgrading below capabilities, you have a desi Rafale.

The Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO) is developing the Unified Electronic Warfare Suite (UEWS) for the Mk2. This includes an internal jammer and digital radar warning receivers to approximate SPECTRA's utility.

the indigenous Uttam Active Electronically Scanned Array (AESA) radar is being scaled up for the Mk2. It features more transmit-receive modules than the Mk1A version. This enhancement targets tracking ranges and multi-target capabilities comparable to the Rafale’s RBE2 radar.
How much time and monies will it take to re-engine Tejas?
I understand that it is not a straight forward thing but if GE continues to use delaying tactics, then how much more should we entertain them? It cant be indefinite, right?
What gives before a decision is taken for sake of saving the entire program?
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Re: Vayusena & Nausena Rafale: News & Discussion

Post by drnayar »

Vayutuvan wrote: 03 Jun 2026 06:42 @drnayar ji, engines engines engines.

Yes of course. But buy off shelf. If the GE engines are in focus ,it's due to delays. Too bad if they put all eggs in one basket.
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Re: Vayusena & Nausena Rafale: News & Discussion

Post by Manish_P »

drnayar wrote: 03 Jun 2026 16:54
Vayutuvan wrote: 03 Jun 2026 06:42 @drnayar ji, engines engines engines.
Yes of course. But buy off shelf. If the GE engines are in focus ,it's due to delays. Too bad if they put all eggs in one basket.
With engines, especially those as complicated as modern turbofans, there is nothing truly off-the-shelf. The user and supplier are pretty much tied up in a partnership for a lifetime of spares, maintenance etc
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Re: Vayusena & Nausena Rafale: News & Discussion

Post by VinodTK »



Inside the Rafale Fighter: The Ultimate Combat Machine - Full Documentary
This documentary unveils the remarkable story of the Rafale, the crown jewel of French military aviation, from its early design in 1986 to its global success today.

A true multi-role powerhouse, the Rafale can switch instantly between air combat, ground strike, reconnaissance, and nuclear deterrence a versatility achieved through decades of engineering breakthroughs.

How did this jet overcome every technological challenge to become a worldwide reference in combat aviation? What are its real-world performances? How is such a machine conceived, refined, and perfected?

Through immersive 3D sequences, rare archival footage, aerial images, and exclusive interviews with engineers, pilots, and military experts, discover the secrets behind its construction. Fly alongside the crews to witness its extreme agility, cutting-edge sensors, and mission capabilities powered by next-generation systems.

This is the story of a fighter jet built not just to fly but to dominate.
Need to watch with subtitles
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Re: Vayusena & Nausena Rafale: News & Discussion

Post by Rakesh »

Rakesh wrote: 11 Feb 2026 02:57 Thank Pakistan and Op Sindoor for the 114 deal moving forward. Air HQ would likely still be stuck in RFP stage of the MRFA contract, if no Op Sindoor had occurred. The Rafale performed really well during Op Sindoor.
How Operation Sindoor sealed 114 Rafale’s mega-contract between India and Dassault Aviation
https://opexnews-fr.translate.goog/oper ... r_pto=wapp
29 May 2026

Please use google translate to read the article ^^^ above ^^^ in English.
https://translate.google.com/?sl=fr&tl=en&op=websites
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Re: Vayusena & Nausena Rafale: News & Discussion

Post by Rakesh »

France assures tech transfer, weapon integration for 114 Rafale jets ahead of PM Modi’s visit
https://www.tribuneindia.com/news/defen ... dis-visit/
11 June 2026
France does not see its military ties with India as a ‘customer-provider’ relationship, a source added, saying 'very substantive discussions are on at the moment'
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Re: Vayusena & Nausena Rafale: News & Discussion

Post by Cybaru »

WTF! If it's not in the agreement, it's not happening. It's not an handshake item. sigh...
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Re: Vayusena & Nausena Rafale: News & Discussion

Post by Rakesh »

Rakesh wrote: 11 Jun 2026 22:35 France assures tech transfer, weapon integration for 114 Rafale jets ahead of PM Modi’s visit
https://www.tribuneindia.com/news/defen ... dis-visit/
11 June 2026
https://x.com/wartrophy_414/status/2065 ... 20114?s=20 ---> A Mirage can't fire an Astra is the greatest testament of French ToT. That is despite staying in service for 40yrs & paying more per airframe of mirage upgrade than brand new Tejas Mk1As.
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Re: Vayusena & Nausena Rafale: News & Discussion

Post by drnayar »

Rakesh wrote: 11 Jun 2026 22:35 France assures tech transfer, weapon integration for 114 Rafale jets ahead of PM Modi’s visit
https://www.tribuneindia.com/news/defen ... dis-visit/
11 June 2026
France does not see its military ties with India as a ‘customer-provider’ relationship, a source added, saying 'very substantive discussions are on at the moment'
i do see a big problem here ., deals are in written agreements not assurances ., the french are more than likely to take the money and do zilch

Naval Group charges rival ThyssenKrupp with selling out submarine tech
https://www.yahoo.com/news/naval-group- ... 08110.html
20 Feb 2025

France's Naval Group has criticized Germany's ThyssenKrupp Marine Systems for hurting European submarine vendors by transferring technology to countries that later managed to build their own boats for export.

TKMS "are champions at creating new competitors," Guillaume Rochard, Naval Group's head of strategy, partnerships and mergers, said at a round table in Paris to discuss France's defense-industrial base earlier this month. "They've made extremely significant technology transfers to Turkey and Korea, two nations that are now in the submarine export market."

France's armaments directorate DGA will intervene on export deals to keep critical skills in the country, said Alexandre Lahousse, head of the defense industry directorate within DGA, during the round table talk in Paris. The official said export clients are demanding increasingly large offsets and greater degrees of program sharing in exchange for contracts.

"How do we ensure that what was a few percent before and now becomes large chunks, does not go against our defense industrial policy?" Lahousse said. "That's a matter of dialogue with industry, but we also have flexible and lively discussions with international directorate colleagues to find a balance, which is that all critical skills, we will try to keep, those will be more like red lines."
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Re: Vayusena & Nausena Rafale: News & Discussion

Post by Rakesh »

France assures on tech for Rafale

Ahead of Prime Minister Narendra Modi’s visit, France has assured it is comfortable sharing technology for the Rafale fighter jets and integrating India-made weapons onto the jet is part of the deal. India has sent a formal letter of request (LoR) to France for procuring 114 more Rafale jets. An LoR is a formal government-to-government communication used to initiate defence procurement under and Intergovernmental Agreement (IGA) framework. Modi will be on visit to France and Slovakia from June 13th - 18th. French sources confirmed that a bilateral meeting between Modi and French President Emanuel Macron would include discussions on pending order of three more Scorpene submarines. French company Safran and Public sector Hindustan Aeronautics Limited have a JV to develop engines for the next generation, 13-tonne capacity, Indian Multi Role Helicopter. The same company is partnering with Gas Turbine Research Establishment (GTRE) to make a new 120 kilo newton thrust engine for India’s 5th-generation Advanced Medium Combat Aircraft (AMCA).

A series of developments in the military-aviation sector have meant India-France ties, on technology, now match New Delhi’s historic cooperation with Moscow. France is not challenging Russia’s pole-position as supplier of military equipment to India. Moscow’s cooperation remains unparalleled:
Historic ties and latest collaborations position France as India’s ‘all weather friend’ offering high-tech weaponry with localized production for military aviation. India’s first private sector helicopter unit got inaugurated with European giant Airbus and India’s Tata Advanced Systems Limited (TASL) agreeing to build the Airbus H-125 helicopters. France is one of four partners in Airbus. French avionics maker Thales opened its ‘research and technology’ unit at its Engineering Competence Centre in Bengaluru. Thales has a Euro 4 billion spend on R&D every year.


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Re: Vayusena & Nausena Rafale: News & Discussion

Post by drnayar »

^^ still sceptical Admiral. France cannot "make" Dassault share technology much like the Naval Group ..pretty sure this deal will be mired in some legal loop holes around tech sharing after deal is signed.
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Re: Vayusena & Nausena Rafale: News & Discussion

Post by Rakesh »

drnayar wrote: 12 Jun 2026 20:15 ^^ still sceptical Admiral. France cannot "make" Dassault share technology much like the Naval Group ..pretty sure this deal will be mired in some legal loop holes around tech sharing after deal is signed.
Dr Saab, those are not my words :) That is the title of the YouTube video.

I am just posting the news.
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Re: Vayusena & Nausena Rafale: News & Discussion

Post by Rakesh »

India’s Rafale Deal: Co-Development and Local Manufacturing with France
https://www.bharatfreepress.com/indias- ... 16901.html
15 June 2026
In its talks with France over the Rafale, India is making a case for local manufacturing, with an eye on co-development and co-production. It's in step with the Make in India drive to put our defences in order and get a foot in the door of the world's aerospace supply lines.
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Re: Vayusena & Nausena Rafale: News & Discussion

Post by Manish_Sharma »

Bharat Karnad is usually pro-russian anyway, so don't know if any truth in it? But...

https://bharatkarnad.com/2026/06/15/onl ... fa-su-57e/
Only 40-50 Rafales will be bought, if at all; rest MRFA Su-57E
Posted on June 15, 2026
by Bharat Karnad

Earlier today, the meeting between Prime Minister Narendra Modi and the French President Emannuel Macron in Nice in southern France did not result in the usual giveaway deal — a characteristic of Indian foreign policy in the new millennium. That there was no mention of Delhi plonking $43 billion for the useless Rafale, came as a relief.

May be, Modi finally understands that using arms buys as a foreign policy means of winning small consideration from the US and states in Europe, exacts really high costs, beggars the country, and in no way helps India technologically in any meaningful way.

But old habits of mind die hard and Rafale may still be bought but not in the numbers the IAF wishes. Indeed, it seems the advice from the highest levels of the joint military was heeded by the PM, and it is that if Rafale must be bought then only 40-60 more of the 4.5 generation Rafale combat aircraft — the same generation as the indigenous Tejas, be purchased. The argument ostensibly made was that if the full complement of 114 aircraft is obtained from Dassault, it’d mean buying more platforms than equally exorbitantly priced weapons such as the Meteor air-to-air missile, each of which costs Rs 60 crore! A fully loaded Rafale’d cost a head-turning Rs 1,000 crores!!! And given the Indian Air Force’s dubious record to-date of losing aircraft on the very first day of any operation, several thousands of crores of rupees could be lost in the first half hour of any conflict! It’d appear a case made this way is not easy to refute. How many Rafale will actually be bought depends on whether France relents on “source codes”, which are software instructions for the design know why. In the case, of the avionics suite, for instance, the source codes are contained in the Interface Control Document (ICD).

The reason Delhi has stiffened its stance and is pushing Paris on this issue is because two other offers are on the table — Russia’s complete with tech-transfer, including source codes, for its 5th generation fighter — Su-57E, and Sweden’s for its Saab 4.5 gen Gripen E. The Gripen is being peddled as a cost-effective and cost-efficient alternative and, in utility terms, as falling somewhere between the Rafale and the Tejas. Indeed, the differences in the figures provided by Saab regarding the comparative unit price and the operating cost are staggering. According to the Swedes, a single Gripen may cost anything from $85 million to $140 million compared to $300 million for a Rafale, and while the Gripen costs between $4,000-$10,000 per hour to operate, the counterpart expenditure for Rafale is $14,000 per hour! Do your arithmetic and you find the lifetime cost of having Rafales in the fleet, could well send the country into the poor house.

Not sure what the operating cost of the Su-57 is, but it is nowhere near Rafale’s. Besides, India can purchase as many as three Sukhoi-57 multi-role fighters for the price of one Rafale. But none of these foreign aircraft can beat the Tejas on any metric were its production to be scaled up and, as recommended by this analyst over some 15 years now, the private sector given a parallel contract for its production to rival the one given the defence public sector unit, the hopeless HAL, which can’t produce a thing on time or at cost.

Combat aircraft are pricey items and, in this age of drones, an unaffordable luxury. But the Indian government which is otherwise fiscally responsible, apparently gets into a brain freeze when confronted by the hardware demands of the IAF in particular — or why else would it approve previous payouts for Rafale?

Here’s the secret why, gleaned after soundings at the highest levels of the military. Modi believes France and Israel are the countries India should tap for military goods, that this will help “diversify” the sources of military supply, and as alternative to the US and Russia. In our system, what the PM wants the country gets, even if it is manifestly the worst option!

And further, it also matters what Modi’s two ministers with some say in such purchases believe. The Defence Minister Rajnath Singh is the “old time politician” who thinks Russia is a reliable supplier and the country should stay with it. Hence, we have the Su-57 in the running. And external affairs minister S. Jaishankar — surprise! surprise! pleading for US-sourced stuff — the F-35 (?) and for endless buys of P-8Is, and the C-130Js and C-17s transporters.

Then there’s the fact of Rajnath Singh beginning to command respect in the military also for his siding with and supporting the armed services in their endless tussles with the Defence Ministry bureaucrats. No small thing! A senior officer reflecting the prevailing sentiment, said this: Rajnath may not be a Parrikar, but he has our back. The late Manohar Parrikar, an IIT engineer with a problem-solving mindset and forensic skills in evaluating comparative offers of expensive foreign armaments leaned, incidentally, towards augmenting the numbers of the Su-30MKI (that I had advocated and still do) rather than going in for the Rafale. Parrikar was by far the best defence minister India has had and, for his cost-saving efforts, was shifted back to Goa as chief minister!
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Re: Vayusena & Nausena Rafale: News & Discussion

Post by Rakesh »

Manish_Sharma wrote: 19 Jun 2026 11:01 Bharat Karnad is usually pro-russian anyway, so don't know if any truth in it? But...
Someone needs to show this to Bharat Karnad (and all others) who question the wisdom of inducting 4th generation fighters in the decades ahead. So yes, the USAF has the largest 5th generation fighter fleet in the world. But will still be inducting 4th generation fighters in the 2030s. The RCS of the F-15 is quite high. 5th and 6th gen fighters are certainly the future, but that does not discount 4th generation fighters. The former will be the door breakers, while the latter will be doing the bomb truck role.

In India's context, everything is on the menu - Rafale, Su-57, Tejas, AMCA and 6th gen as well. Bharat Karnad likes to tickle his fantasy and hope that Su-57 will surpass the Rafale in numbers, but that will not happen. When the ICD issue is resolved, it will be a triple digit Rafale order. There are also 170 Mk1As in the pipeline, another 100+ Mk2s (at minimum) as well. There are 260+ Su-30MKIs that will be upgraded along with this. Everything will be spectacularly delayed, but that is par for the course in India.

https://x.com/RealAirPower1/status/2067 ... 61753?s=20 ---> Boeing's F-15EX just won the lottery. As we all know, the Trump administration is pitching a massive $1.5 trillion defense budget for 2027. The craziest pivot? After slashing its F-15EX buy down to just 80 jets last year, the USAF is now asking for a staggering 268 aircraft! Talk about a fiscal deluge for the missile truck.
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Re: Vayusena & Nausena Rafale: News & Discussion

Post by Rakesh »

Rakesh wrote: 19 Jun 2026 16:09 https://x.com/RealAirPower1/status/2067 ... 61753?s=20 ---> Boeing's F-15EX just won the lottery. As we all know, the Trump administration is pitching a massive $1.5 trillion defense budget for 2027. The craziest pivot? After slashing its F-15EX buy down to just 80 jets last year, the USAF is now asking for a staggering 268 aircraft! Talk about a fiscal deluge for the missile truck.
https://x.com/RupakChatto/status/206775 ... 66497?s=20 ---> Maybe better sense will prevail on the IAF to order 200 upgraded Su-30s? @Ahlawat2012? The USAF has found the F-15EX 40% cheaper to operate, offers greater availability and much greater airframe life.

https://x.com/Ahlawat2012/status/206784 ... 00407?s=20 ---> Interesting point on the F-15EX: Su-30MKI parallel.

USAF is doubling down on a proven heavy hitter for payload, range, lower opex (~40% cheaper in some metrics), high flightline availability, and long airframe life. They need this aircraft in large numbers to replace legacy fleets, which they don’t wish to replace with far more expensive 5th gen aircraft. In their scheme of things - the 35/22/B2 are the door kickers. Once the IADS has been degraded, an aircraft like F 15, makes for a battering ram - with its combat radius of 1,300 km (without air to air refuel), and payload capacity of over 13 tons.

The Su-30MKI is similarly placed in IAF. With numbers exceeding 250, upgrading some of them made enormous sense. The proposal to upgrade 84 aircraft was conceptualized around 2006, sent to MoD in 2008 by IAF- but received Acceptance of Necessity (AoN) in November 2023. As on date the proposal is being ‘examined’ at MoD. Even after CCS approval, HAL projects 5 years for Initial Operational Clearance (IOC) and 7 years for Full Operational Clearance (FOC) on the first batch. The whole lot of 84 aircraft could take up to 12 years.

Considering the limited residual TTL and engine life after upgrades, it would make better sense to build new ones of upgraded standards. Moreover, upgrading the existing Su-30 are going to be far more challenging than most imagine. The Russian architecture's non-modular electrical/interfaces + source code restrictions make deep indigenous upgrades more complex and slower than on modular platforms. During Astra BVR trials, the MC and the radar was fooled into believing that the missile on station is R-77.

HAL has the lines and the expertise, and could be asked to produce Super Sukhoi from the ground up, with modular architecture- integrating Virupaksha AESA, indigenous EW and domestic weapons. If we order these today, the first full strength squadron could be available in 10 years’ time. We should be prepared to bear the burden of time and treasure.
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Re: Vayusena & Nausena Rafale: News & Discussion

Post by Rakesh »

^^^ I will say this much ---> If the IAF adopts the above plan highlighted in red (not going to happen unfortunately), that will spell the end of the 114 MRFA (Rafale) contract for the Indian Air Force.

Imagine if the Govt ordered 200+ upgraded Su-30UPGs in lieu of the mythical unicorn called Su-57. The Rambha is a known variable and manufacturing upgraded platforms with Indian sensors (Virupaksha radar, MAWS, RWR, etc) and Indian weapons (Astra Mk2, Mk3, Gandiva, Rudram 1, 2, 3, etc) will be a more viable & sustainable option than starting afresh on the Su-57.

The only problem with the above plan is that the Tejas Mk1A and Tejas Mk2 do not have an alternative turbofan. Everything rests on Unkil's goodwill and there is not much of it available in Washington DC. The lack of an Indian turbofan is the sole reason why the 114 Rafale contract even exists. Moving over to an alternate turbofan for the Mk1A and Mk2 opens the door to other roads for the Indian Air Force.
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Re: Vayusena & Nausena Rafale: News & Discussion

Post by ritesh »

Rakesh wrote: 19 Jun 2026 16:26 The only problem with the above plan is that the Tejas Mk1A and Tejas Mk2 do not have an alternative turbofan. Everything rests on Unkil's goodwill and there is not much of it available in Washington DC. The lack of an Indian turbofan is the sole reason why the 114 Rafale contract even exists. Moving over to an alternate turbofan for the Mk1A and Mk2 opens the door to other roads for the Indian Air Force.
Rakesh ji,

This is from gemini, I know it's easier said than done, but what's the alternative for India?
The Eurojet EJ200 (which powers the Eurofighter Typhoon) is the only realistic, high-performance alternative to the GE F404/F414 family.During the initial engine selection process for the Tejas program, the EJ200 competed directly against General Electric's engines. Both GE and Eurojet confirmed that their engines could be fitted into the LCA's fuselage with the minimal amount of airframe modification.1. Eurojet EJ200 (The Closest Alternative)The Eurojet EJ200 provides a much better fit and aerodynamic match for the Tejas than the Safran M88.Superior Power: It delivers 60 kN dry and 90 kN with afterburner. This makes it more powerful than both the stock M88 (75 kN) and the GE F404 (85 kN).
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Re: Vayusena & Nausena Rafale: News & Discussion

Post by Manish_Sharma »

Rakesh wrote: 19 Jun 2026 16:26
Imagine if the Govt ordered 200+ upgraded Su-30UPGs in lieu of the mythical unicorn called Su-57....
also this twitter thread explains why 'Virupaksha' on Su57 is almost impossible (for many Su57 supporters that is a main highlight to have Virupaksha) :
viewtopic.php?p=2682928#p2682928
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Re: Vayusena & Nausena Rafale: News & Discussion

Post by Rakesh »

ritesh wrote: 19 Jun 2026 20:05 This is from gemini, I know it's easier said than done, but what's the alternative for India?
Alternatives exist, but that involves time, money and political will. None of those are present in India. The money issue is not a budgetary one, but rather one of priorities. The stakeholders have all the money in the world for 114 MRFA, entertain Su-57 and fantasize about FCAS. But not one single rupee exists for engine development. No vision, no roadmap, absolutely nothing.

Just license produce someone else's platform and call it Atmanirbharata in the annual MoD brochure!
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Re: Vayusena & Nausena Rafale: News & Discussion

Post by Rakesh »

Manish_Sharma wrote: 19 Jun 2026 21:05 also this twitter thread explains why 'Virupaksha' on Su57 is almost impossible (for many Su57 supporters that is a main highlight to have Virupaksha) :
viewtopic.php?p=2682928#p2682928
Yes, I did read that on Twitter. Thank You for posting the link in BRF.

If the Su-57 deal goes through, funds will be scarce for the Tejas Mk2 program...as the 114 MRFA deal is also in the works. If Mk2 is not inducted in triple digits (preferably close to 200 minimum), we are looking at the AMCA program being under developed. That will result in jumping onto FCAS. It is a never ending spiral of disaster. Unfortunately for the Tejas (and even) the AMCA program, the engine is the main Achilles' heel.

Either upgrade the entire Rambha fleet or do a new build program of Su-30UPGs (with Indian sensors + weapons) to replace the current Rambha fleet. The Su-30UPG + Tejas Mk2 can serve as test beds for Indian sensors + weapons, before AMCA enters serial production.

Something has to give somewhere, metaphorically speaking. There is no money for 114 MRFA + 'x' number of Su-57s + 'x' number of FCAS + upgrade the Rambha fleet + 180 Tejas Mk1As + 200 Tejas Mk2s and 120+ AMCAs. Either one or a number of programs will have to be set aside, to ensure the others survive. Unfortunately it appears that it will be the Indian platforms that will suffer. The lack of a viable Indian turbofan is *REALLY* frustrating, geopolitically and militarily speaking.

P.S. I know this is not kosher on BRF, but some Indian programs need to be cancelled altogether. One is TEDBF (in its current avatar) and the other is the mythical ORCA. Both need to go. If we are still struggling to sign the deal for licensed production of the GE F414 turbofan and the delayed deliveries of the GE F404 turbofan, good luck with TEDBF and ORCA going anywhere. With the arrival of the Rafale M, the TEDBF died anyway.
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Re: Vayusena & Nausena Rafale: News & Discussion

Post by Rakesh »

France’s big Rafale F5 push! UAE plan revealed – why India holds the key?
https://zeenews.india.com/india/france- ... 56728.html
21 June 2026
Instead of building a completely new stealth fighter, France is upgrading the Rafale into a “super Rafale” configuration with enhanced strike range, survivability and weapons capability.
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Re: Vayusena & Nausena Rafale: News & Discussion

Post by drnayar »

Manish_Sharma wrote: 19 Jun 2026 21:05 also this twitter thread explains why 'Virupaksha' on Su57 is almost impossible (for many Su57 supporters that is a main highlight to have Virupaksha) :
viewtopic.php?p=2682928#p2682928
Conceptually, a distributed GaN radar variant like the one for the AMCA would fit the Su-57.
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Re: Vayusena & Nausena Rafale: News & Discussion

Post by drnayar »

Rakesh wrote: 22 Jun 2026 23:41 France’s big Rafale F5 push! UAE plan revealed – why India holds the key?
https://zeenews.india.com/india/france- ... 56728.html
21 June 2026
Instead of building a completely new stealth fighter, France is upgrading the Rafale into a “super Rafale” configuration with enhanced strike range, survivability and weapons capability.
Nations strictly tailor their military acquisitions to regional threat perceptions and industrial capabilities, resulting in the distinctly different strategic postures., The Russians have yet to develop a truly stealth fighter. For France, Russia remains the main threat. India’s situation is different: its primary concern is China, which is rapidly developing and deploying fifth- and sixth-generation fighters in large numbers. Even the Rafale F5, in its most capable form, is still not a fifth-generation fighter.
V_Raman
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Re: Vayusena & Nausena Rafale: News & Discussion

Post by V_Raman »

IMO India should only invest in a foreign fighter that can be truly become 5th gen fighter.

If Rafale cannot be that - then NO. If Su-57 can be that - then yes. Domestic AMCA etc. should continue in parallel.

If we are thinking Rafale as gap filler for 4 to 4.5 gen - then truly shame on us - we have screwed up the domestic fighter programs and total na-layak doofuses at the helm.
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Re: Vayusena & Nausena Rafale: News & Discussion

Post by williams »

V_Raman wrote: 23 Jun 2026 01:25 IMO India should only invest in a foreign fighter that can be truly become 5th gen fighter.

If Rafale cannot be that - then NO. If Su-57 can be that - then yes. Domestic AMCA etc. should continue in parallel.

If we are thinking Rafale as gap filler for 4 to 4.5 gen - then truly shame on us - we have screwed up the domestic fighter programs and total na-layak doofuses at the helm.
Su-57 to start working with Indian systems is 5-7 or even 10 years away. Hopefully Rafale is 3 years away. Even if we get these it is not as simple as asking pilots to take a ride. It takes quite some more time to operationalize these platforms and add that into your tactical doctrine and war plans. IMO just get whatever you can get ASAP. Fighters in hand today is much more valuable than what we will get in the future. It is the same formula as Finances. We fought with the Mig 21s remember.
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Re: Vayusena & Nausena Rafale: News & Discussion

Post by V_Raman »

My criteria is - can this new fighter eventually be a true blue 5th gen fighter - if not it is a no go.

I guess that rules out Rafale - unless we are in such a bad situation that we need 4.5 gen fighters to fill the gap - and also su-57 evolution to true 5th gen - we acknowledge we have failed and we acquire i guess.
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Re: Vayusena & Nausena Rafale: News & Discussion

Post by Manish_Sharma »

So 36 Rafales are still there. So much for saying IAF lost Rafale fighter!
Read letter in this image : Image

or read letter image straightaway in the tweet itself:

https://x.com/alpha_defense/status/2069 ... 68172?s=20
For more than a week, I’ve been sitting on this because the same people have spent years branding anyone who asks questions for a better IAF as “anti-Rafale” and, at times, even “anti-Air Force.”

Yes, the Rafale engine PBL has expired. A bridge arrangement is being signed while a larger contract is negotiated and the entire PBL framework is renegotiated.

But now that this document is all over the place, there’s no point pretending otherwise.
Aditya_V
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Re: Vayusena & Nausena Rafale: News & Discussion

Post by Aditya_V »

It was pretty evident after a few days the PAF was gassing around regarding Rafale shootdown, The Pakis and Western Media had no choice after the IAF smashed those terror targets, the claim was just to distract attention, they probably fired those PL-15's in hope at extreme range.
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