Exercise Indradhanush (Rainbow) '07 @ RAF Waddington, UK

amar_g · Post by **amar_g** » 29 Jun 2007 12:30

JaiS wrote:X-post

Photo Credit Â© Damien Burke

Love the pic..Mama Bear...N..her Cubs..

Shankar · Post by **Shankar** » 29 Jun 2007 13:03

only the cubs have very sharp claws

Shankar · Post by **Shankar** » 29 Jun 2007 13:06

So all the pictures show no aircraft armed. While I'm not sure if that depends on any policy or understanding with the host country, but would the MKI's been armed at any point during their journery across international airspace?

-usaly not even during ferry flight to UN missions .The weapons are carried in accompanying transports and armed during mission only

Shankar · Post by **Shankar** » 29 Jun 2007 13:07

Sigh...anyone trying to do this in any IAF military airport is liable to shot at or
chased by a pack of dogs. Yelehanka has a sandbagged tower near the
highway with a sentry who looks keen to try his gun out....its definitely a no
can do there.

-may be a bit more than that

HariC · Post by **HariC** » 29 Jun 2007 23:28

Incidentally - this photo http://lh5.google.com/desiphotog/RllT_Q ... mgmax=1280

- is that a Canberra?

Amitabh · Post by **Amitabh** » 30 Jun 2007 00:53

Sumeet wrote:
JCage wrote:Two things to note- unless the MKIs recieve E3D cues, they are at an automatic disadvantage. The other con is that they cannot let the true capabilities of the Bars be on display - wonder whether the RAF will similarly open up the Captor. They might not have to, since they will get the E3D cues.
I think AWACs will give support to both side, otherwise its not a fair contest. Not just that, if the scenario is EF + E3D v/s MKI then to bring it to something close to being equal contest IAF will have to use top end capabilities of BARs. Thats not a good idea. On flip side i feel its better to experience that for the first time in an excercise rather than in a real war. Since pukes have AWACs such scenario is possible.

What i am really interested in is outcome of Captor-M v/s DRFM based ECM suite. Being a mech. scanning radar its likely it won't be as immune to DRFM based deception jamming as a PESA or AESA.

- How deeply the use of the E3 is integrated into RAF operational philosophy, when it comes to BVR
Typhoon is excellent in speed, acceleration & agility [Must for top notch BVR platform]. Its equipped with AMRAAM C-5 & a cutting edge ECM suite. If its backed by E3D then this combo is one of the best for BVR combat out there in the world. Pukes or Chicoms can't throw such package for atleast a decade from today.

You guys are implicitly assuming that this primarily an RAF vs IAF exercise. But as we know from previous US exercises one of the important goals is to test interoperability and that there will likely be plenty of mixing and matching going on. Which implies that the Sukhois and Eurofighters will all have access to similar data and control.

JCage · Post by **JCage** » 30 Jun 2007 01:07

Interoperability is the buzzword used to hide deeper reasons namely to understand the pros and cons of the Opfor. If interoperability was all that was required the IAF wouldnt have sent its A team.

ksmahesh · Post by **ksmahesh** » 30 Jun 2007 02:28

JaiS wrote:X-post

Photo Credit Â© Damien Burke

Looks are definitely deceptive.

ldev · Post by **ldev** » 30 Jun 2007 05:20

JCage wrote:Interoperability is the buzzword used to hide deeper reasons namely to understand the pros and cons of the Opfor. If interoperability was all that was required the IAF wouldnt have sent its A team.

Would not Opfor be of greater value for the US against the IAF A team.? I mean is the RAF with its Typhoons or the USAF with its Raptors/Hornets more likely to go up against the other major global Flanker operator? Or will there be some quiet one on one engagements with Raptors done in the anonoymous environs of the common colonizer?

Or maybe its a Friday evening and I have had too much beer!

Sumeet · Post by **Sumeet** » 30 Jun 2007 05:38

Check out pics over here, amazing photography:

http://www.eurofighter-typhoon.co.uk/fo ... f=1&t=1575

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 30 Jun 2007 06:44

Sumeet wrote:Check out pics over here, amazing photography:

http://www.eurofighter-typhoon.co.uk/fo ... f=1&t=1575

Looks like the Tornado uses thrust reversers - see the current bottom pic on that page - the Tornado's tailfin has a black soot-stain corresponding to what I would expect is the blast of a thrust reverser.

Rahul Shukla · Post by **Rahul Shukla** » 30 Jun 2007 07:49

shiv wrote:
Sumeet wrote:Check out pics over here, amazing photography: http://www.eurofighter-typhoon.co.uk/fo ... f=1&t=1575

Looks like the Tornado uses thrust reversers - see the current bottom pic on that page - the Tornado's tailfin has a black soot-stain corresponding to what I would expect is the blast of a thrust reverser.

Shiv ji,

You are right Sir. Take a look at this url to see Tornado's thrust reversers in action ---> Clicky

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 30 Jun 2007 08:44

There used to be a "We Indians must be apologetic" psyche that still appears once in a while on this forum. That thought process often manifested as scathing criticism of any dirt/scratches or stains on Indian aircraft and equipment to be contrasted with the squeaky clean mental picture of firangi maal.

Dirt, stains and scratches of course are part of normal wear and tear. How one reacts to seeing them depends on one's state of mind.

Sorry - that was just a private joke inside my head.

JCage · Post by **JCage** » 30 Jun 2007 12:24

ldev wrote:
JCage wrote:Interoperability is the buzzword used to hide deeper reasons namely to understand the pros and cons of the Opfor. If interoperability was all that was required the IAF wouldnt have sent its A team.
Would not Opfor be of greater value for the US against the IAF A team.? I mean is the RAF with its Typhoons or the USAF with its Raptors/Hornets more likely to go up against the other major global Flanker operator? Or will there be some quiet one on one engagements with Raptors done in the anonoymous environs of the common colonizer? Or maybe its a Friday evening and I have had too much beer!

Ldev, its not the RAF we would be gaming against; theres somebody who has recently signed up to acquire EF's. Now the chances of those EFs getting into TSPs grubby paws are less than nil according to most people, but it never hurts to be aware of the capabilities of the jet. Also, the RAF used Typhoons will be more capable than that particular nation in terms of deployment, tactics- that doesnt hurt as well. When the IAF gets something like the PAK-FA or the MRCA - we might see the MKIs hotfoot it to Red Flag vs Raptors as well...who knows.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 30 Jun 2007 13:05

interesting to know the OTAN E3 use probe refueling, the USAF ones use the drogue.
the ASTOR thing looks good...inshallah we shall have similar soon.

Jcage I believe IAF is invited to red flag next year or late this yr ? EF and Rafale have already visited. germans seem to have a permanent contingent there to avoid airspace limitations in EU.

Jagan · Post by **Jagan** » 01 Jul 2007 03:40

http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/IAF/Image ... New+Images from greece

JaiS · Post by **JaiS** » 01 Jul 2007 22:37

Image credits Tony Lowther

RAF Waddington Exersise 'Indra Danush-07'
http://tonylowther.fotopic.net/c1314353.html

RAF Waddington Airshow
http://tonylowther.fotopic.net/c1315421.html

JaiS · Post by **JaiS** » 01 Jul 2007 22:59

X-posting : LOG WADDINGTON 29/06.07
Posted by: paul(.)jenky(@)btopenworld(.)com

RAF WADDINGTON Fri 29th June
//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
08:55 - 17:57hrs
///////////////////////////
Noted today at the excellant arrivals day today at Waddington in mainly sunny weather after lunch.
Hard to pick a few highlights as it was a good day however the sight of a Indian IL76 departing in the rain was worth the trip in itself !
Also a cracking display by the Typhoon and at the other 'end' of the scale 'heavy metal' wise was the approach and arrival of the Isaacs Fury II - very hairaising 'landing' then subsequent 'go around' due to major windshear, demonstrated the trouble and effort some people put in for our benefit.

7quid to get in for a carload was excellant value IMO (with a arrivals list chucked in).

Straight from the logbook so willing to corrections etc,
Movements (Arrivals unless shown)
///////////////////////////////////////////////////////

09:00 Dep - K2878 /G IL76 Indian AF

11:34 LX-N90442 E3 Nato

13:15 ZJ916 / QOU Typhoon RAF

14:53 ZJ801 /BJ Typhoon RAF

15:03 (ZJ920) /BX Typhoon RAF

16:13 ZJ811 /AZ Typhoon RAF

In and didn't depart
//////////////////////////////
K-2663 IL76 Indian AF
RK3451 IL78 Indian AF
RK-3452 IL78 Indian AF
(SB041) SU30 Indian AF
(SB042) SU30 Indian AF
SB043 SU30 Indian AF
SB044 SU30 Indian AF
(SB103) SU30 Indian AF
SB107 SU30 Indian AF

(ZJ690) Astor RAF

Cheers Jenky
http://jenkystransportaircraft.fpic.co.uk/

JaiS · Post by **JaiS** » 01 Jul 2007 23:20

Image Credits : Steve Gardner
Date : 28 June, 2007

RAF Waddington
http://stevegardnersaviationpage.fotopi ... 14292.html

JaiS · Post by **JaiS** » 01 Jul 2007 23:59

The deluge continues.

From : http://www.airfighters.com/

In order to view all pictures of RAF Waddington from that site click here

Jagan · Post by **Jagan** » 02 Jul 2007 00:15

to filter out only the Indian pics at waddington

http://www.airfighters.com/plug.php?e=p ... ormat=full

JaiS · Post by **JaiS** » 02 Jul 2007 00:22

Thanks Jagan.

Air show cancelled after flooding

The second day of the RAF Waddington International Air Show has been cancelled, organisers have confirmed.

They said the decision was taken because of flooding of the site - and has nothing to do with the heightened security situation across the country.

The show is the largest staged by the RAF and tens of thousands of people were expected to attend.

Officials at the airfield said they knew people would be disappointed but public safety was the priority.

JaiS · Post by **JaiS** » 02 Jul 2007 19:25

IAF WIN HEARTS AND STEALS THUNDER AT UK AIRSHOW

DECLARED THE â€˜BEST STATIC DISPLAYâ€™ AT THE EVENT

The two-day Royal Air Force (RAF) Waddington International Air Show 2007, that began over the weekend on Saturday, June 30, had an eclectic mix of flying machines â€“ military and civil, both vintage and modern. Yet none could take the sheen and glory away from the formidable Sukhoi-30 MKIs of the Indian Air Force (IAF) that pronounced their thunderous presence at this annual pilgrimage of aircraft in UK. And as if maintaining a studied silence at the ongoing, an IL-78 MKI fuel-tanker of the IAF stood majestic, towering over all the other aircraft put together at the static display.

The visitors just could not have enough of the two Su-30 MKIs of the IAFâ€™s No. 30 Squadron (â€˜Rhinosâ€™) and the giant IL-78 MKI that were put-up for display. Aircrew and aviation enthusiasts were seen busy, persuading IAF air warriors to part with their squadron and aircraft badges for keepsake, and most willingly obliged. Clearly IAF was winning hearts all the way.

Lieutenants Elden and Nordtun, F-16 pilots from the No. 331 â€˜Sniperâ€™ Squadron, based in Bodoe, Norway who were here at the air show with their jets, interacting with IAF pilots queried if the IAF Su-30 MKIs could also visit Norway. â€œWish you could come to Norway. They (Su-30 MKIs) are big and intimidating! Never seen them beforeâ€

PaulJI · Post by **PaulJI** » 02 Jul 2007 22:11

Singha wrote:interesting to know the OTAN E3 use probe refueling, the USAF ones use the drogue.
....

Bit of a misunderstanding here, I think. The drogue is the thing on the end of a hose that a probe fits into. The alternative to a drogue isn't a probe, it's a boom.

USAF - tanker has a boom that fits into a receptacle on receiving aircraft. The boom is steered into the receptacle by someone in the tanker.

Everyone else (unless they use aircraft designed for the USAF) - a hose reels out of the tanker with a drogue on the end to stabilise it. The receiving aircraft has a probe. The probe is flown into the drogue by the pilot of the receiving aircraft.

Here's a document discussing their relative merits, which has pictures & explanations of both. http://www.fas.org/sgp/crs/weapons/RL32910.pdf

Babui · Post by **Babui** » 03 Jul 2007 01:43

What's 'RIAT'? And in which country?

Rakesh · Post by **Rakesh** » 03 Jul 2007 01:46

RIAT - Royal International Air Tattoo

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RIAT

Jagan · Post by **Jagan** » 03 Jul 2007 04:55

http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/IAF/Image ... New+Images

Pics from Simon Watson

Anurag · Post by **Anurag** » 03 Jul 2007 05:10

Any news from Day 1 of the exercise?

Rahul Shukla · Post by **Rahul Shukla** » 03 Jul 2007 06:30

From link provided by Paul...

A single flying boom can transfer fuel at approximately 6,000 lbs per minute. A single hose-and-drogue can transfer between 1,500 and 2,000 lbs of fuel per minute. Unlike bombers and other large aircraft, however, fighter aircraft cannot accept fuel at the boomâ€™s maximum rate. Todayâ€™s fighter aircraft can accept fuel at 1,000 to 3,000 lbs per minute whether from the boom or from the hose-and-drogue.

Thus, the flying boomâ€™s primary advantage over the hose-and-drogue system is lost when refueling fighter aircraft.

pradeepe · Post by **pradeepe** » 03 Jul 2007 06:56

Jagan wrote:http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/IAF/Image ... New+Images

Pics from Simon Watson

Jagan, for some reason, the link doesnt work. I only see code.
Same thing for a previous link you posted. Is it just me?

thanks.

Tilak · Post by **Tilak** » 03 Jul 2007 07:00

pradeepe wrote:
Jagan, for some reason, the link doesnt work. I only see code.
Same thing for a previous link you posted. Is it just me?

thanks.

He provided a link to the RSS Feed.. Possibly, to avoid posting updates on this thread ?.

> Here's the link to the gallery.

JaiS · Post by **JaiS** » 03 Jul 2007 07:18

Interesting to note here the various C/N's which have been noted by the photographers.

IL-76MD 'K2878'

K2878 / G (cn 0063465970)

Ilyushin Il-76MD 'K2663'

K2663 (cn 0053458731)

IL-78MKI 'RK-3541'

RK-3541 (cn 20*3425855)

Thanks to the individual photographers.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

X-post
Posted by: "Marijn van der Burgt" mvdburgt(@)dse(.)nl

Who noted the Indian Su-30MKI c/n's at Waddington airshow?

The cn is painted on the fuselage near the left main landing gear.
(at least for the 4 Russian built Su-30MKI SB-0xx)

Marijn

A Sharma · Post by **A Sharma** » 03 Jul 2007 07:38

IAF's Sukhois attract attention at RAF airshow

The Indian Air Force's frontline Sukhoi-30 MKI fighters, which are away in England to test their mettle against the fourth generation Euro fighters, stole the show at the two-day Royal Air Force (RAF) Waddington International Air Show 2007.

In the show, which had an electric mix of flying machines - military and civil, vintage and modern - the Indian Sukhois stole the thunder.

The visitors at the static part of the air-show were an instant draw with both air crew and aviation enthusiasts were seen persuading the IAF air warriors to part with their squadron and aircraft badges for keepsakes, an IAF spokesman said.

It was not only the English, but also Norwegians who were awe-struck by the Sukhois. Lieutenants Elden and Nordtun, F-16 pilots from the sniper squadron of the Norwegian Air Force, asked the IAF pilots if the Sukhois could come for air-shows in their country.

The IAF was declared 'Best Static Display' among a hundred aircraft of various types on show.

The IAF Sukhois jet-fighters and their air-warrior pilots will match flying skill with the Euro-fighter Typhoon during the Indo-British joint air exercises 'Indradhanush 07' which began today.

JaiS · Post by **JaiS** » 03 Jul 2007 07:38

Jagan,

This is kind of OT and I will be glad is this can be removed later on, but I was wondering if we can contact the folks from Airfighters.com and the individual photographers and host some of the photos from the exercise at BRF. That is because, unlike other website, airfighters.com only hosts hand picked photos, i.e., only culled photographs make it to their site, and their quality control looks to be good.

Jagan · Post by **Jagan** » 03 Jul 2007 07:58

Tilak wrote:
pradeepe wrote:
Jagan, for some reason, the link doesnt work. I only see code.
Same thing for a previous link you posted. Is it just me?

thanks.
He provided a link to the RSS Feed.. Possibly, to avoid posting updates on this thread ?.

> Here's the link to the gallery.

My bad, I posted the RSS link because IE7 and Firefox render the XML into proper pages with previews etc. the link shows the latest first and is a better way of viewing the images. However on the older pages it will only show the XML.

Jagan · Post by **Jagan** » 03 Jul 2007 08:03

JaiS wrote:Jagan,

This is kind of OT and I will be glad is this can be removed later on, but I was wondering if we can contact the folks from Airfighters.com and the individual photographers and host some of the photos from the exercise at BRF. That is because, unlike other website, airfighters.com only hosts hand picked photos, i.e., only culled photographs make it to their site, and their quality control looks to be good.

Jai, The only problem (or rather the observation) about all the pictures is all the photographers have virtually the same type of photos - so there are not too many unique ones out there. So once we have 'one of every type', it really is not worth having multiple copies of them. Of all the photos, the one unique photo i liked was that by DAmien Burke that showed the gaggle of spotters below one of the landing sukhois.

We can do two things
1. Collect the links to all the photo sources - like youa re doing and link them from the IndraDhanush gallery.
2. AT the end of it all, select the best photos we would like to host on BR and go about asking the photographers for permission.
3. If by chance we miss some serial, we should have that photo as well, regardless whether it is good or bad.

JaiS · Post by **JaiS** » 03 Jul 2007 08:11

[End of OT]
Yes Jagan, agreed with on all counts. It sounds 400 % democratic onlee.

Let me know what should I do.
[/End of OT]

pradeepe · Post by **pradeepe** » 03 Jul 2007 09:23

Thanks Tilak, Jagan.

K Mehta · Post by **K Mehta** » 03 Jul 2007 11:43

Looks like IAF is taking with it Lots of Bisleris. Not trusting the drinking water availble there huh?

Even real fruit juice is there in the supplies.

JaiS · Post by **JaiS** » 04 Jul 2007 00:02

Some videos from 30th June 2007

Waddington Airshow 2007 - IL 76 Takeoff

Waddington Airshow 2007 - Tornado Ground Attack

EF-2000 at Waddington Airshow 2007

EF-2000 at Waddington Airshow 2007 - 2

RAF Waddington 2007 - 1

Waddington Airshow 2007 - 2

AWACS at Waddington

Bharat Rakshak

Exercise Indradhanush (Rainbow) '07 @ RAF Waddington, UK

Re: Arrival of Sukhois at Waddington

Re: Arrival of Sukhois at Waddington

New Gallery by Tony Lowther

Gallery by Steve Gardner

C/N's for the IL-76 and IL-78

Some videos from 30th June 2007