Terror Attacks in Mumbai

Ranvijay · Post by **Ranvijay** » 27 Nov 2008 14:26

What gun is this? Not noticed before..

Nayak · Post by **Nayak** » 27 Nov 2008 14:28

Naval Marine commando out of danger
27 Nov 2008, 1347 hrs IST, ET Bureau

http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/Nav ... 764518.cms

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MUMBAI: Highly placed sources at the Western Naval Command, Mumbai have confirmed to the Economic Times that the injured Naval Marine Commando who was evacuated from the gunfight at the Taj Mahal Hotel is out of danger. According to these sources, the naval commando team has not yet suffered any fatalities.

The MARCOS as the Naval marine commandos are better known, were the first elite force to be called to the scene of the terror attack and two teams were assembled by midnight. Two 'prahaars' (a prahaar is a strike force of 8-9 marcos) entered the Taj Mahal hotel while another one and a half prahaara were sent to The Trident where they remained on standby and did not enter the hotel. The MARCOS were not challenged as they stormed the ground floor of the Taj but were met with heavy gunfire as they ascended onto the first and second floors.

Naval sources say they are unhappy with the chaotic situation at both hotels with civilian bystanders and television media crews severely impeding operations. According to these sources the state police was completely unprepared to provide even support functions in such a situation. For instance, people exiting the hotels were not properly screened thus making it likely that terrorists themselves may have abandoned their weapons and mingled with hostages who were using the various fire escapes.

Vice Admiral Jagjit Singh Bedi, C-in-C, Western Naval Command, refused to comment on the ongoing gun-battle except to say that "these terrorists are highly trained, heavily armed and have probably done a detailed recce of these locations in advance."

SandeepA · Post by **SandeepA** » 27 Nov 2008 14:28

Shivani wrote: About the ship being chased by Indian Navy: the Air Force should be jump in for some joint operations fun. Send two Sukhois and ask the ship to co-operate, strafe if they do not, and if the ship still doesn't comply bomb it well before it enters the territorial waters of any other country.

The ship probably contains a bunch of Jihadi scum not so willing for shahaadat just yet. So they can be captured alive if we are careful enuf.

harik · Post by **harik** » 27 Nov 2008 14:29

Amit, then also add IG also created Bhinderawale in the first place.

Two explosions at Oberai. Hand Grenades thrown.
Oberai top floor belching out smoke.

kit · Post by **kit** » 27 Nov 2008 14:29

I wont f****** care if that ship enters pak territorial waters ! Take it anyway and tell those PN to stay off !

p_saggu · Post by **p_saggu** » 27 Nov 2008 14:29

It is getting VERY difficult to post on this thread any more, when ever you hit the "Submit Button" it comes back with "there have been several new posts since you posted - would you like to revise your post"?
By the time you've read this and hit submit again, the message reappears. My last post had to be submitted thrice for it to appear online.

There is a serious possibility of rioting taking place if law and order breaks down. This could be easily be given a communal angle if vested forces are mobilized. Thus the army moving in.

Mumaikars, Be safe, Be Intelligent and Please keep the interests of the Nation above all.

Rishi · Post by **Rishi** » 27 Nov 2008 14:29

Ranvijay wrote:

What gun is this? Not noticed before..

Dragunov?

Aditya_V · Post by **Aditya_V** » 27 Nov 2008 14:30

kit wrote Posts: 138 I wont f****** care if that ship enters pak territorial waters ! Take it anyway and tell those PN to stay off !

Any inteference whether in Paki waters or other wise should be immediately declared as an act of war.....

Neela · Post by **Neela** » 27 Nov 2008 14:32

Aditya_V wrote:
kit wrote Posts: 138 I wont f****** care if that ship enters pak territorial waters ! Take it anyway and tell those PN to stay off !

Any inteference whether in Paki waters or other wise should be immediately declared as an act of war.....

Exactly. HUNT THEM DOWN. I

Ranvijay · Post by **Ranvijay** » 27 Nov 2008 14:33

Dragunov?

My bad, thought it had a black magazine that was hidden in the soldier's cloth. Could well be a dragunov.

ASPuar · Post by **ASPuar** » 27 Nov 2008 14:33

*** TV NEWS UPDATE ***

News channels reporting security sources saying "Deccan Mujaheddin" is a complete red herring, designed to throw off responsibility on Indian Muslims. All indications are Pakistan based terror.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 27 Nov 2008 14:34

Harik,I meant the roof of the hotel,easier now that daylight is with us and that the tower block is where the ungodly are hiding.One can get access to the Souk restaurant and then below.Those atop the Gateway were probably the snipers.Another blast just now at the Taj.More reportedly bombs defused.More blasts at Nariman House.

"Soniaji" just spoke.Is the PM speechless or have his guardians told him that it is too dangerous for him to speak or appear on TV? More explosions at all three seiges.Why no helos still as daylight has broken?

Intelligence chiefs were expecting Al-Qaeda spectacularMichael Evans, Defence Editor
Bombay: a history of violence

Western intelligence services have been expecting an al-Qaeda spectacular terrorist attack in this crucial period between the end of President George Bush’s administration and the succession of Barack Obama.

Signals intelligence “chatter” in recent weeks indicated that Osama bin Laden’s terrorist organisation might be plotting an attack “to grab the headlines” before Mr Obama takes over in the White House on January 20.

British security and intelligence sources said there had been increasing concern, particularly in the United States, that a “terrorist spectacular” was on the cards.

Related Links
IN DEPTH: 'They were very young, like boys really'
ANALYSIS: a new tactic by Islamist militants
Intelligence chiefs expected Al-Qaeda spectacular
Multimedia
In Pictures: Bombay terror
The multiple attacks on Westerners in Bombay last night showed all the signs of an al-Qaeda strategy — picking on vulnerable Western “soft targets” but not in a country where there would be maximum security. The attacks on Western targets in Bali in 2002 when al-Qaeda-linked terrorists planted bombs in tourist-favoured restaurants and clubs was another example where the group switched its resources to achieve maximum impact.

Counter-terrorist experts last night said that India would have been selected for the latest spectacular “probably because that’s where al-Qaeda has sufficient resources to carry out an attack on this scale. They don’t choose for the sake of it, they look to see where they have the greatest capability and then order an attack,” a counter-terror expert told The Times.

The key to this latest attack was the search by the armed terrorists for American and British passport holders. With a reported 40 Britons held hostage, the terrorists have the upper hand. The counter-terrorist sources said targeting Bombay’s most luxurious hotels and a crowded railway station had all the hallmarks of an al-Qaeda operation.

Bombay has been targeted before when 180 people died during a bomb attack on the railway station in 2006, but that incident was put down to militants, not al-Qaeda, and the Indian government suspected that the attackers had links to Pakistan’s intelligence service, the ISI.

This attack, however, involving the taking of Western hostages made it more likely that the operation’s masterminds were from the core leadership of al-Qaeda, which is based in the lawless tribal regions close to the Pakistan/Afghanistan border.

The Americans have been expecting an atrocity partly because of the recent CIA success in eliminating figures in al-Qaeda, using Predator unmanned drones, firing Hellfire missiles at hideouts in the tribal regions of Pakistan. About a dozen al-Qaeda figures have been killed this year.

Although an unknown group claimed responsibility last night, the taking of Western hostages and the deliberate seeking out of American and British citizens indicated a “typical al-Qaeda-style activity”, according to security sources.

Other sources said India was the home of a complicated network of terrorists and it might be too early to jump to the conclusion that it was an al-Qaeda operation. “It seems to be a highly opportunistic attack,” one source said.

However, this is traditionally the way al-Qaeda works. The leadership decides an attack should take place and leaves its franchise operators to decide how best to carry it out. Many of the gunmen appeared to be young but they also seemed confident, suggesting that they were well trained.

As the unprecedented scale of the attacks became clear last night, it looked to be the most co-ordinated terrorist operation since the targeting of the Twin Towers in New York in 2001.

Dozens of gunmen were involved in up to 19 different attacks, although the main focus seemed to be the taking of foreign hostages and detaining them in two of Bombay’s most prestigious hotels.

Judging by the apparent cockiness of at least one of the gunmen caught looking into television cameras, these terrorists were clearly prepared to die for their cause.

Related Links
IN DEPTH: 'They were very young, like boys really'
ANALYSIS: a new tactic by Islamist militants
Intelligence chiefs expected Al-Qaeda spectacular
Multimedia
In Pictures: Bombay terror
Al-Qaeda as an organisation has proved in the past that it has the capability to coordinate multiple attacks. Last night an organisation calling itself Deecan Mujahideen claimed responsibility but, as in the past when unknown groups came forward to admit involvement, the name was neither recognizable nor relevant.The sheer audacity of the terrorists are all familiar elements of al-Qaeda’.

Worst attacks

1979 Militant Islamic students in Iran stormed the US embassy in Tehran, taking 90 hostages. They demanded the extradition of the Shah of Iran from the US, to stand trial in Iran. The hostages were freed in 1981, after 444 days

1993 A car bomb exploded under the World Trade Centre, killing six and injuring more than 1,000. The mastermind, Ramzi Yousef, had been trained in Afghanistan

1995 Sarin nerve gas attack in Tokyo subway kills 12 and injures about 6,000. Shoko Asahara, founder of Aum cult responsible, sentenced to death in 2004

2001 Two aeroplanes hit the Twin Towers of the World Trade Centre, a third crashed into the Pentagon and a fourth crashed into a field in Pennsylvania. Excluding the 19 hijackers, 2,974 people died in the attacks by al-Qaeda

2002 A terrorist attack on the island of Bali killed 202 people. Two bombs ripped through a nightclub area in Kuta district

2004 Ten bombs exploded on four commuter trains in Madrid, killing 191 and leaving 1,800 injured. A group affiliated with al-Qaeda claimed responsibility

2005 Explosions on London’s transport system killed 52 and injured 700

(Source: Times archives)

kmkraoind · Post by **kmkraoind** » 27 Nov 2008 14:37

darshan wrote:Why are people here calling them pigs?
Pigs feed people and actually contribute something to the society.
I think they should be called what they are.

I totally agree with you, call them cockroach, infests all over.

harik · Post by **harik** » 27 Nov 2008 14:39

Ex-PM VP Singh Dead! AjTak

akumar · Post by **akumar** » 27 Nov 2008 14:39

Sympathetic dorkette at IBN lamenting the “militants” are “holding on” against the NSG at Trident with their “hands tied behind there back”

amit · Post by **amit** » 27 Nov 2008 14:40

harik wrote:Amit, then also add IG also created Bhinderawale in the first place.

Don't you think that's completely off topic? Come on there's a time and place for everything. Please don't trivialize what's happening in Mumbai.

V_Raman · Post by **V_Raman** » 27 Nov 2008 14:41

PM is addressing the nation at 7pm. it is one thing for maino, HM, Advani, and MOS types talking. it is a completely different ballgame when the PM talks.

my wishful thinking -- he declares war with TSP and our cold start is put to real use. if IN chases this rogue vessel into TSP waters, then it is a sign of things to come.

Nayak · Post by **Nayak** » 27 Nov 2008 14:42

Nice, everything is televised, the public is charged up, somebody's head has to be delivered on a plate. What is the strategy here ? Who is in command ? Guys, who is being interviewed in the media ? Who is calling the shots ?

harik · Post by **harik** » 27 Nov 2008 14:42

MV Alpha surrounded by IN . Congratulations!

Adding, Search operation on - MV Alpha, some documents related to Karachi found!

milindc · Post by **milindc** » 27 Nov 2008 14:43

Based on watching coverage for 18 hours, sorry to state the obvious, Mumbai Police has turned out to be truly incompetent to handle this. No coordinated response and no fire power to fight these guys. Initially I could just see them pulling out pistols and going after the scums donning AK-47 and Grenades. Yes, it is courageous but foolhardy.

It took Army to take total control and start mobbing ops.

amit · Post by **amit** » 27 Nov 2008 14:43

vramanx wrote:my wishful thinking -- he declares war with TSP and our cold start is put to real use. if IN chases this rogue vessel into TSP waters, then it is a sign of things to come.

I really hope - in fact fervently wish - that the ship is apprehended within TSP waters. And I also hope the Paki coastal Navy tries to intervene. That will force everybody's hand, including our politically correct political netas.

Aditya_V · Post by **Aditya_V** » 27 Nov 2008 14:44

HariK wrote MV Alpha surrounded by IN . Congratulations!

Not soo fast we need to inspect, ascertain whether the terrorists threw us offcourse while the real ship escaped

Prasad · Post by **Prasad** » 27 Nov 2008 14:45

Nayak wrote:Nice, everything is televised, the public is charged up, somebody's head has to be delivered on a plate. What is the strategy here ? Who is in command ? Guys, who is being interviewed in the media ? Who is calling the shots ?

We've had comments so far from RR Patil, the HM, the DGP b'bay police and iirc the canadian consul and army and navy officers early today on their way back to possibly the base.

Nayak · Post by **Nayak** » 27 Nov 2008 14:46

Btw, good decision for the MARCOS and NSG to show up. No negotiations tamasha.
Better than the stupidity of the Kandahar hijack episode.

Kudos to whoever took the call on getting the commandos in asap.

bart · Post by **bart** » 27 Nov 2008 14:47

40 dead have been recovered from the floors of Taj...casualties are about to go up.

Neela · Post by **Neela** » 27 Nov 2008 14:47

LK ADVANI:

“So far as tackling terrorism is concerned, both the Central and state governments have a lot to answer for. But today is not the occasion for me to dwell on that.”

Go Advani-JI. Nation first!

milindc · Post by **milindc** » 27 Nov 2008 14:48

I still can't comprehend on why the scums chose Trident. There is Hilton close by and other better hotels. Trident is not great compared to other hotels in vicinity.

Taj is a landmark, but I think there is a more sinister motive behind Trident.

kmkraoind · Post by **kmkraoind** » 27 Nov 2008 14:49

I think its time to correct Gujral doctrine, which did not benefit India at all, but caused more pains than ever in assymetrical fashion.

Let provide RAW unlimited financial, manpower and operational freedom, so that they should go out on mastermind, financiers, and local logisitcal chain and eleminate them (in Mossad style), and establish vast network in Bakistan, so that they could give fitting reply, which will be more odoriferous and x4-5 more bleeding.

Rishi · Post by **Rishi** » 27 Nov 2008 14:50

milindc wrote:I still can't comprehend on why the scums chose Trident. There is Hilton close by and other better hotels. Trident is not great compared to other hotels in vicinity.

Taj is a landmark, but I think there is a more sinister motive behind Trident.

There are 2 Oberoi buildings, next to each other. The New one used to be the Hilton. Now it is called trident. It is as big as the Air India building, and right next to it. The older Oberoi is 1/3 the height, but also pretty huge.

The Trident and Taj will have the max business junta from outside (not counting on the hotels next to the airport)

ASPuar · Post by **ASPuar** » 27 Nov 2008 14:51

Where is the military command? Who is in charge of this situation in Mumbai? Who is the coordinating authority? Is AN Roy in charge of the ops?

harik · Post by **harik** » 27 Nov 2008 14:52

Army is taking over from NSG at Oberai Trident & Nariman House.

Prasad · Post by **Prasad** » 27 Nov 2008 14:53

TimesNow reported a Major-General level officer taking over command at Nariman house for final ops - "Could be GoC Western Command"

KLNMurthy · Post by **KLNMurthy** » 27 Nov 2008 14:55

darshan wrote:I give you one example Indira Gandhi. She did not care about her life and took action.
And, I seriously do not like this guy to begin with so I do not need to get any grip.

One way to be patriotic in the face of challenges to the country is to put our own likes and dislikes and egos in second place, like what the soldiers and cops do on a routine basis.

Indira Gandhi, in a sense brought on her own demise by interfering with her security officials' choices in reassigning suspect bodyguards. It was a bit of vanity and self-indulgence on her part which ended up in her getting killed. That was a tragedy, but the country paid a much bigger price due to the massacre of Sikhs that followed, and the protracted war against Khalistani terrorism for many years to come. She may have proved she was a hero or a martyr but a true leader would have focused on the welfare on the nation instead of her own glory. But the point is not to debate Indira Gandhi's leadership, but to note that there is a clear distinction between a leader's 'greatness' and that leader's actual service to the country.

Vasu · Post by **Vasu** » 27 Nov 2008 14:56

MMS and Advani have already had a high level meeting, the details of which aren't being disclosed to the press. If not mentioned here already, many countries have issued travel warnings already.

from cnn-ibn:

"National Security Guard (NSG) Director General Jyoti Krishan Dutt said the commandos are clearing the Taj floor by floor."

"We can't move in fast in both the hotels because we are not sure that how many terrorist are hiding on the top floors. We don't want to be caught by their sniper bullets. We suspect that in both the hotels that there at least six terrorist but there is no confirmation on the exact figure," he added while ruling out any negotiations with terrorists.

meanwhile, the compensations have come out.

"He [RR Patil] also announced Rs 5 lakh compensation to the kin of those killed in the terror attacks and Rs 50,000 to the seriously injured."

SandeepA · Post by **SandeepA** » 27 Nov 2008 14:57

All this talk about hostages and foreign nationals makes it sound as if the primary targets were Americans and British. Lets not forget that the biggest attack was in CST where the people gunned down and grenaded were all Indians waiting for trains going to Indian places.

bart · Post by **bart** » 27 Nov 2008 14:58

Any idea if the 'arrested suspects' are the terorrists or some other local people?

Purush · Post by **Purush** » 27 Nov 2008 14:59

milindc wrote:Based on watching coverage for 18 hours, sorry to state the obvious, Mumbai Police has turned out to be truly incompetent to handle this. No coordinated response and no fire power to fight these guys.

Agreed. Complete lack of crisis management, complete lack of media/crowd control, and generally no clue as to what is going on. And these are supposed to be the 'premier' cops in india's largest metro.

First to be rounded up, given a fair trial, lined up against the wall, and shot, should be the treacherous media scum and terrorist sympathizers who were providing live feeds of the SF/Army ops.
The rest can be rounded up later.

Hats off to the brave SF guys who did a spectacular job despite being surrounded by morons.

ASPuar · Post by **ASPuar** » 27 Nov 2008 15:02

tsriram wrote:TimesNow reported a Major-General level officer taking over command at Nariman house for final ops - "Could be GoC Western Command"

GOC WestCom is an army commander. Might possibly be GoC Maharashtra and Guajrat area. So is he in overall charge of the ops?

manjgu · Post by **manjgu** » 27 Nov 2008 15:04

i am very skeptic if the ship chase will yield anything.... are we expecting to see sand models , detailed briefings, notes...!! though i will be only to be happy to be proven wrong.

it is also a possibitlity that just the arms/bombs ( couriers) came on the ship and executioners were already on ground??

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 27 Nov 2008 15:04

amit wrote:
vramanx wrote:my wishful thinking -- he declares war with TSP and our cold start is put to real use. if IN chases this rogue vessel into TSP waters, then it is a sign of things to come.

I really hope - in fact fervently wish - that the ship is apprehended within TSP waters. And I also hope the Paki coastal Navy tries to intervene. That will force everybody's hand, including our politically correct political netas.

they won't intervene, these resources are expendable and deniable

there seem to be four different types of attack going on

1. random mass killings of Indians
2. hostage taking of Westerners
3. attacks against Jewish people
4. hits against key police figures

traditionally these types of attacks have been done by different but affiliated groups - this time seems to be a free for all. the al-q style is to issue general orders and let the local branch get on with it. there seems to be some of that, but also a anything goes boys type of order. the terrorists seem to be well trained. a ship landing is interesting but not sure its so practical - perhaps they were infiltrated into the city earlier - D company would have a role to play for sure

i can't help feeling that the recent turmoil in maharashtra with one thing after another was perhaps orchestrated or encouraged in some way ahead of this spectacular

anyway - we need to capture some of these scumbags alive - and they will need to sing