Global Economy

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Shivani
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Trying to prevent a Sept. 1945

Post by Shivani »

Ever Closer to 1982
The New York Times wrote:
Image

"So it’s still too early to call this the worst recession since the Great Depression. But it’s bad, and it’s still getting worse at a rapid rate."


Putting a Month’s Job Losses in Perspective
The New York Times wrote:Image
Worst month-over-month declines in nonfarm payrolls, with vertical access showing the number of jobs lost.


Image
Steepest month-over-month declines in nonfarm payrolls, in percentage terms.
Arya Sumantra
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Re: GLOBAL ECONOMY

Post by Arya Sumantra »

Silicon Valley may feel more pain this time
Tech Mecca could take harder hit than during dot-com bust, analysts say

Samuel Wilson, an analyst with JMP Securities who lives in the Valley and covers the industry, said the region's economic agony is evident in the growing number of vacant offices and unemployed tech workers. He notes that so many people are leaving the Valley, it has even gotten more expensive to rent U-Haul trucks to get out of town, and much easier to drive on the Bay Area's once notoriously-clogged freeways.

"There's no traffic -- what's the deal with that?" he quipped early Friday morning in a cell phone interview from his car as he was driving through Silicon Valley.

The region's office space vacancy rate has nearly reached the 2003 high of roughly 18% and that its unemployment rate is now worse than during the peak of the tech bust.

According to data released Thursday by the California Employment Development Department, the unemployment rate in the San Jose-Sunnyvale-Santa Clara area -- the area known as Silicon Valley -- reached 9.4% in January, surpassing the January 2003 peak of 9.2%.

So many people are getting pink slips and forced to leave town that one-way rental rates for moving vans have jumped two to three times more compared to rates for coming to the region, Wilson said. For example, it costs roughly $1,058 to rent a U-Haul in Silicon Valley on a trip to Denver, and only $353 for the reverse route, Wilson wrote.
Arya Sumantra
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Re: GLOBAL ECONOMY

Post by Arya Sumantra »

And now its the turn of Hotel industry

More hotels are facing foreclosure, bankruptcy
Singha
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Re: GLOBAL ECONOMY

Post by Singha »

MGM which owns multiple properties in vegas strip has 'issues'

http://www.pokernewsdaily.com/mgm-mirag ... ptcy-1405/

MGM Mirage Inc., which has not filed an earnings statement since last September, said on Tuesday that it is in the position of possibly defaulting on loans that were made for its latest project, the $8.6 billion CityCenter in Las Vegas. The company, owned by 91-year-old billionaire investor Kirk Kerkorian, stated in an unscheduled filing with the Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC) that, unless the economic situation turned around quickly and traffic returns to its casinos, MGM Mirage would break many of its loan agreements this year.
.......
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Re: GLOBAL ECONOMY

Post by Singha »

I feel they way Cancun and mexican gulf coast was created for the college vacation crowds, Vegas served that role for salaried workers in usa, esp those in marketing and sales. numerous conventions all round the year and ample opportunities away from wife(if desired) to horse around with the "boys" and drink, seek paid services, eat thick steaks and generally have a gala time.
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Re: GLOBAL ECONOMY

Post by Singha »

svinayak
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Re: GLOBAL ECONOMY

Post by svinayak »

Bank of America pulls job offers to foreign MBAs
By Steve Goldstein
Last update: 4:04 a.m. EDT March 9, 2009
LONDON (MarketWatch) -- Bank of America has withdrawn job offers to foreign MBA students, the Financial Times reported, citing a spokesman. The passed $787 billion stimulus bill in effect prevents financial institutions that have received money from the government's troubled asset relief program from applying for H1-B visas for highly skilled immigrants if they have made U.S. workers redundant, the report said. End of Story
ramana
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Re: GLOBAL ECONOMY

Post by ramana »

Ameet wrote:Median price of home in Detroit now $7,500

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nati ... 5392.story
Umrao jaan, You should think of setting up a fund to invest in Detroit real estate. Give it thought.
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Re: GLOBAL ECONOMY

Post by Singha »

:(( why would he want to become a 'slumlord' in a black cadillac and a coupla goons with baseball bats to collect rent from the cowering subjects?

BR members are far too decent for that line of work.
ramana
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Re: GLOBAL ECONOMY

Post by ramana »

Its turning opportunity from chaos. All those people need homes and if the homes are purchased at low prices the rents can also be adjusted downwards. Detroit will make transportation goods. So there will be workforce that needs housing.

We need to plan and implement at individual and national level and not just nukkad all the time.
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Re: GLOBAL ECONOMY

Post by Arya Sumantra »

Even the employed suffering during economic crunch
More than 4.5 million workers last year depended at least partly on variable pay, which includes tips and commissions, according to Labor Department figures. Meanwhile, the number of workers forced into part-time instead of full-time work soared 65% in the past year.

The average number of hours all employees work each week has also dropped. The commission-heavy sectors of retail and auto sales have been especially hammered.

As the recession cuts demand for goods and services, companies that don't shed workers outright must squeeze savings from the work force that remains. They typically do so by cutting hours. And as a recession persists, rising competition for jobs tends to shave wages and benefits. Companies lose any incentive to boost pay.

When companies cut or freeze wages for salaried or hourly employees, the workers tends to feel the effect gradually. By contrast, for waitresses, car salesmen, retail clerks and others whose variable pay hinges on economic cycles, a pay drop tends to be as steep as it is quick, said Sylvia Allegretto, an economist at the University of California, Berkeley. That's because sales-based compensation is more sensitive to swings in consumer spending.
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Re: GLOBAL ECONOMY

Post by svinayak »

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/03/09/busin ... ss&emc=rss

A Rising Dollar Lifts the U.S. but Adds to the Crisis Abroad
A Rising Dollar Lifts the U.S. but Adds to the Crisis Abroad
Image


By PETER S. GOODMAN
Published: March 8, 2009

As the world is seized with anxiety in the face of a spreading financial crisis, the one place having a considerably easier time attracting money is, perversely enough, the same place that started much of the trouble: the United States.

American investors are ditching foreign ventures and bringing their dollars home, entrusting them to the supposed bedrock safety of United States government bonds. And China continues to buy staggering quantities of American debt.

These actions are lifting the value of the dollar and providing the Obama administration with a crucial infusion of financing as it directs trillions of dollars toward rescuing banks and stimulating the economy, enabling the government to pay for these efforts without lifting interest rates.

And yet in a global economy crippled by a lack of confidence and capital, with lending and investment mechanisms dysfunctional from Milan to Manila, the tilt of money toward the United States appears to be exacerbating the crisis elsewhere.

The pursuit of capital suddenly seems like a zero sum game. A dollar invested by foreign central banks and investors in American government bonds is a dollar that is not available to Eastern European countries desperately seeking to refinance debt. It is a dollar that cannot reach Africa, where many countries are struggling with the loss of aid and foreign investment.

“Virtually all of the low-income countries are in very serious trouble,” said Eswar Prasad, a former official at the International Monetary Fund and a senior fellow at the Brookings Institution, the liberal-leaning research organization in Washington.

He went on: “This is the third wave of the financial crisis. Low-income countries are getting hit very hard. The flow of private capital to the emerging market has dried up.”

Private money invested in so-called emerging countries plunged from $928 billion in 2007 to $466 billion last year and is likely to fall to $165 billion this year, according to the Institute of International Finance.
ramana
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Re: GLOBAL ECONOMY

Post by ramana »

But isnt eh whole problem due to the imbalance in US and China thats driving the crisis. The US consumes too much with its strong Dollar and the PRC consumes too little. So how will this even out? War?
Ameet
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Re: GLOBAL ECONOMY

Post by Ameet »

JP Morgan to increase India outsourcing by 25% - comments section is filled with killer comments

http://www.businessweek.com/globalbiz/c ... ia_related

The second-biggest bank of the US, JP Morgan Chase, which acquired Washington Mutual and Bear Stearns recently, will increase its outsourcing to India by 25% this year to nearly $400 million. It will also manage the integration of the acquired companies from India to bring down the cost of integrating different information technology (IT) systems.

Right now, JP Morgan outsources $250-300 million worth of IT and back-office projects every year to Cognizant, TCS and Accenture, apart from to its own captive centre in Mumbai.
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Re: GLOBAL ECONOMY

Post by Najunamar »

Here's a thought I had about the Global recession. If you look at world's steel production it was around 1.3 Billion Metric tons in 2008; The price went from around $500 in Dec. 2007 to roughly $1150 in Summer 2008 and got back down to $550 range end of 2008. Assuming $550 to be the equilibrium price per ton of steel (here I am aggregating many grades of steel I realize) - there was roughly around 1.3x550 Billion= $715 Billion that was transferred/mis-allocated to steel manufacturing from other sectors. Similarly, oil went from $100 to $147 and dropped to $40 by end of 2008. Assuming equilibrium price of say $50-60 this means around $50/barrel for 84 Million bpd = $50*84*366 Million = $1.5 Trillion. So together these 2 commodities accounted for over $2.2 Trillion in misallocated resources. This is huge since World GDP is around $60 Trillion and this accounts for roughly 3.7%; Hence, the entire growth that was possible was wiped out - ofcourse both bubbles were accentuated by the cowboy administration in Massaland.

Any thoughts/gyaan on this topic?
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Re: GLOBAL ECONOMY

Post by vina »

Yaawnn.. For smart aleck Fyzzicists like Bade Saar and other stat /math/ science types. Atleast now folks know whom to throw mud at. It is not the Milan & Sangam and boor YumBeeYeas, but the Fyzzicists and Science types.
The New York Times
March 10, 2009
They Tried to Outsmart Wall Street
By DENNIS OVERBYE

Emanuel Derman expected to feel a letdown when he left particle physics for a job on Wall Street in 1985.

After all, for almost 20 years, as a graduate student at Columbia and a postdoctoral fellow at institutions like Oxford and the University of Colorado, he had been a spear carrier in the quest to unify the forces of nature and establish the elusive and Einsteinian “theory of everything,” hobnobbing with Nobel laureates and other distinguished thinkers. How could managing money compare?

But the letdown never happened. Instead he fell in love with a corner of finance that dealt with stock options.

“Options theory is kind of deep in some way. It was very elegant; it had the quality of physics,” :rotfl: :rotfl: Dr. Derman explained recently with a tinge of wistfulness, sitting in his office at Columbia, where he is now a professor of finance and a risk management consultant with Prisma Capital Partners.

Dr. Derman, who spent 17 years at Goldman Sachs and became managing director, was a forerunner of the many physicists and other scientists who have flooded Wall Street in recent years, moving from a world in which a discrepancy of a few percentage points in a measurement can mean a Nobel Prize or unending mockery to a world in which a few percent one way can land you in jail and a few percent the other way can win you your own private Caribbean island.

They are known as “quants” because they do quantitative finance. Seduced by a vision of mathematical elegance underlying some of the messiest of human activities, they apply skills they once hoped to use to untangle string theory or the nervous system to making money.

This flood seems to be continuing, unabated by the ongoing economic collapse in this country and abroad. Last fall students filled a giant classroom at M.I.T. to overflowing for an evening workshop called “So You Want to Be a Quant.” Some quants analyze the stock market. Others churn out the computer models that analyze otherwise unmeasurable risks and profits of arcane deals, or run their own hedge funds and sift through vast universes of data for the slight disparities that can give them an edge.

Still others have opened an academic front, using complexity theory or artificial intelligence to better understand the behavior of humans in markets. In December the physics Web site arXiv.org, where physicists post their papers, added a section for papers on finance. Submissions on subjects like “the superstatistics of labor productivity” and “stochastic volatility models” have been streaming in.

Quants occupy a revealing niche in modern capitalism. They make a lot of money but not as much as the traders who tease them and treat them like geeks (that part is very true). Until recently they rarely made partner at places like Goldman Sachs. In some quarters they get blamed for the current breakdown — “All I can say is, beware of geeks bearing formulas,” Warren Buffett said on “The Charlie Rose Show” last fall. Even the quants tend to agree that what they do is not quite science.

As Dr. Derman put it in his book “My Life as a Quant: Reflections on Physics and Finance,” “In physics there may one day be a Theory of Everything; in finance and the social sciences, you’re lucky if there is a useable theory of anything.”

Asked to compare her work to physics, one quant, who requested anonymity because her company had not given her permission to talk to reporters, termed the market “a wild beast” that cannot be controlled, and then added: “It’s not like building a bridge. If you’re right more than half the time you’re winning the game.” There are a thousand physicists on Wall Street, she estimated, and many, she said, talk nostalgically about science. “They sold their souls to the devil,” she said, adding, “I haven’t met many quants who said they were in finance because they were in love with finance.”

The Physics of Money

Physicists began to follow the jobs from academia to Wall Street in the late 1970s, when the post-Sputnik boom in science spending had tapered off and the college teaching ranks had been filled with graduates from the 1960s. The result, as Dr. Derman said, was a pipeline with no jobs at the end. Things got even worse after the cold war ended and Congress canceled the Superconducting Supercollider, which would have been the world’s biggest particle accelerator, in 1993.

They arrived on Wall Street in the midst of a financial revolution. Among other things, galloping inflation had made finances more complicated and risky, and it required increasingly sophisticated mathematical expertise to parse even simple investments like bonds. Enter the quant.

“Bonds have a price and a stream of payments — a lot of numbers,” said Dr. Derman, whose first job was to write a computer program to calculate the prices of bond options. The first time he tried to show it off, the screen froze, but his boss was fascinated anyway by the graphical user interface, a novelty on Wall Street at the time.

Stock options, however, were where this revolution was to have its greatest, and paradigmatic, success. In the 1970s the late Fischer Black of Goldman Sachs, Myron S. Scholes of Stanford and Robert C. Merton of Harvard had figured out how to price and hedge these options in a way that seemed to guarantee profits. The so-called Black-Scholes model has been the quants’ gold standard ever since.
(the Black Scholes has a whole list of assumptions behind it, that would make even a JNU /DSE/ISI ding dong blush)
In the old days, Dr. Derman explained, if you thought a stock was going to go up, an option was a good deal. But with Black-Scholes, it doesn’t matter where the stock is going. Assuming that the price of the stock fluctuates randomly from day to day, the model provides a prescription for you to still win by buying and selling the underlying stock and its bonds.

“If you’re a trading desk,” Dr. Derman explained, “you don’t care if it goes up or down; you still have a recipe.”

The Black-Scholes equation resembles the kinds of differential equations physicists use to represent heat diffusion and other random processes in nature. Except, instead of molecules or atoms bouncing around randomly, it is the price of the underlying stock. (I had already slammed this rubbish in BR. Of course it will resemble the heat equation idiots, because you assumed at a molecular level that stock prices have exactly the same properties as Brownian motion, which is the mathematical model for heat )

The price of a stock option, Dr. Derman explained, can be interpreted as a prediction by the market about how much bounce, or volatility, stock prices will have in the future.

But it gets more complicated than that. For example, markets are not perfectly efficient — prices do not always adjust to right level and people are not perfectly rational. Indeed, Dr. Derman said, the idea of a “right level” is “a bit of a fiction.” As a result, prices do not fluctuate according to Brownian motion. Rather, he said: “Markets tend to drift upward or cascade down. You get slow rises and dramatic falls.” (ah, after trillions of losses, Fyzzicists realize this , not much diff between ISI/JNU ding dongs and Ivy league Fyzzicists aye ?)

One consequence of this is something called the “volatility smile,” in which options that benefit from market drops cost more than options that benefit from market rises.

Another consequence is that when you need financial models the most — on days like Black Monday in 1987 when the Dow dropped 20 percent — they might break down :rotfl: :rotfl: . The risks of relying on simple models are heightened by investors’ desire to increase their leverage by playing with borrowed money. In that case one bad bet can doom a hedge fund. Dr. Merton and Dr. Scholes won the Nobel in economic science in 1997 for the stock options model. Only a year later Long Term Capital Management, a highly leveraged hedge fund whose directors included the two Nobelists, collapsed and had to be bailed out to the tune of $3.65 billion by a group of banks.

Afterward, a Merrill Lynch memorandum noted that the financial models “may provide a greater sense of security than warranted; therefore reliance on these models should be limited.”

That was a lesson apparently not learned.

Respect for Nerds

Given the state of the world, you might ask whether quants have any idea at all what they are doing.

Comparing quants to the scientists who had built the atomic bomb and therefore had a duty to warn the world of its dangers, a group of Wall Streeters and academics, led by Mike Brown, a former chairman of Nasdaq and chief financial officer of Microsoft, published a critique of modern finance on the Web site Edge.org last fall calling on scientists to reinvent economics. (most of 'em two left legged critters cant find their asses with their two hands beyond their narrow fields of expertise. Talk about "reinventing" anything !)

Lee Smolin, a physicist at the Perimeter Institute for Theoretical Physics in Waterloo, Ontario, who was one of the authors, said, “What is amazing to me as I learn about this is how flimsy was the theoretical basis of the claims that derivatives and other complex financial instruments reduced risk, when their use in fact brought on instabilities.”

But it is not so easy to get new ideas into the economic literature, many quants complain. J. Doyne Farmer, a physicist and professor at the Santa Fe Institute, and the founder and former chief scientist of the Prediction Company, said he was shocked when he started reading finance literature at how backward it was, comparing it to Middle-Ages theories of fire. “They were talking about phlogiston — not the right metaphor,” Dr. Farmer said.

One of the most outspoken critics is Nassim Nicholas Taleb, a former trader and now a professor at New York University. He got a rock-star reception at the World Economic Forum in Davos this winter. In his best-selling book “The Black Swan” (Random House, 2007), Dr. Taleb, who made a fortune trading currency on Black Monday, argues that finance and history are dominated by rare and unpredictable events.

“Every trader will tell you that every risk manager is a fraud,” he said, and options traders used to get along fine before Black-Scholes. “We never had any respect for nerds.”

Dr. Taleb has waged war against one element of modern economics in particular: the assumption that price fluctuations follow the familiar bell curve that describes, say, IQ scores or heights in a population, with a mean change and increasingly rare chances of larger or smaller ones, according to so-called Gaussian statistics named for the German mathematician Friedrich Gauss. (oops.. dont tell that to the social "sciences" monkeys in JNU , ISI and other ding dong places, you could get lynched)

But many systems in nature, and finance, appear to be better described by the fractal statistics popularized by Benoit Mandelbrot of IBM, which look the same at every scale. An example is the 80-20 rule that 20 percent of the people do 80 percent of the work, or have 80 percent of the money. Within the blessed 20 percent the same rule applies, and so on. As a result the odds of game-changing outliers like Bill Gates’s fortune or a Black Monday are actually much greater than the quant models predict, rendering quants useless or even dangerous, Dr. Taleb said.

“I think physicists should go back to the physics department and leave Wall Street alone,” he said.
:rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: . Perfect

When Dr. Taleb asked someone to come up and debate him at a meeting of risk managers in Boston not too long ago, all he got was silence. Recalling the moment, Dr. Taleb grumbled, “Nobody will argue with me.”

Dr. Derman, who likes to say it is the models that are simple, not the world, maintains they can be a useful guide to thinking as long as you do not confuse them with real science — an approach Dr. Taleb scorned as “schizophrenic.”

Dr. Derman said, “Nobody ever took these models as playing chess with God.”

Do some people take the models too seriously? “Not the smart people,” he said.
(the lyin sonofabitch . In India , "experts"/ statisticicans, "economists" and other charlatans sold the modeling rubbish for 40 years and ruined everyone's happiness. And oh, they did play god with the command economy rubbish)

Quants say that they should not be blamed for the actions of traders. :rotfl: :rotfl: They say they have been in the forefront of pointing out the models’ shortcomings.

“I regard quants to be the good guys,” said Eric R. Weinstein, a mathematical physicist (oh, yeah. being so objective aren't we , when we cover the ass*s of our own kind)who helps run the Natron Group, a hedge fund in Manhattan. “We did try to warn people,” he said. “This is a crisis caused by business decisions. This isn’t the result of pointy-headed guys from fancy schools who didn’t understand volatility or correlation.” (of course it was you lyin sack sh*t)

Nigel Goldenfeld, a physics professor at the University of Illinois and founder of NumeriX, which sells investment software, compared the financial meltdown to the Challenger space shuttle explosion, saying it was a failure of management and communication. (now that is seriously friggin funny and fundamentally retarded)

Prisoners of Wall Street

By their activities, quants admit that despite their misgivings they have at least given cover to some of the wilder schemes of their bosses, allowing traders to conduct business in a quasi-scientific language and take risks they did not understand.

Dr. Goldenfeld of Illinois said that when he posted scholarly articles, some of which were critical of financial models, on his company’s Web site, salespeople told him to take them down. The argument, he explained, was that “it made our company look bad to be associating with Jeremiahs saying that the models were all wrong.”

Dr. Goldenfeld took them down. In business, he explained, unlike in science, the customers are always right.

Quants, in short, are part of the system. “They get paid, a Faustian bargain everybody makes,” said Satyajit Das, a former trader and financial consultant in Australia, who likes to refer to them as “prisoners of Wall Street.”

“What do we use models for?” Mr. Das asked rhetorically. “Making money,” he answered. “That’s not what science is about.”

The recent debacle has only increased the hunger for scientists on Wall Street, according to Andrew Lo, an M.I.T. professor of financial engineering who organized the workshop there, with a panel of veteran quants.

The problem is not that there are too many physicists on Wall Street, he said, but that there are not enough :rotfl: :rotfl: . A graduate, he told the young recruits, can make $75,000 to $250,000 a year as a quant but can also be fired if things go sour. He said an investment banker had told him that Wall Street was not looking for Ph.D.’s, but what he called “P.S.D.s — poor, smart and a deep desire to get rich.”

He ended his presentation with a joke that has been told around M.I.T. for a long time, but seemed newly relevant; “What do you call a nerd in 10 years? Boss.”

An earlier version of this article misspelled the given name of Satyajit Das.
Singha
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Re: GLOBAL ECONOMY

Post by Singha »

but you have to admire the flexibility and chutzpah of the american system in
which people from such diverse fields tend to intermingle and find new avenues of work. even if it fails, atleast you learn something - and maths will never go out of utility as long as humanity lasts.

the 'system' in india much more degree and resume driven - if you havent graduated in so-and-so years in so-and-so fields they dont even let you in through the door. in my pov, the best in my field are not those who took degrees in my field but those from other branches who wandered in through their own abilities and interests!

there is also discrimination based on 'gaps' in resume. its considered not ok if someone drops out for a year to study a side hobby or just write and ruminate on life.

its a system that breeds conformism to a unhealthy degree and rapidly kills the 'outliers/scofflaws' who seed major breakthroughs.
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Re: GLOBAL ECONOMY

Post by Skanda »

Singha wrote: its a system that breeds conformism to a unhealthy degree and rapidly kills the 'outliers/scofflaws' who seed major breakthroughs.
Excellent point. In my company "R&D" division, we had a candidate who had a year gap in his resume. So when they interviewed him, they asked him about his missing year. He was frank in indicating that he took a year off in evaluating his life and career prospects.

Our boss and his boss viewed it as being untruthful and made a lot of noise about it during his presentation. Essentially asking, if he is still "clueless".
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Re: GLOBAL ECONOMY

Post by Bade »

Vina-saar is going on an evangelical rampage with this 'Quants are to blame' business for Global meltdown theory. Saar read more carefully the propaganda, and will see that decision makers are not the ones who get the lamp-post treatment. It is the ones who have little say in matters. :rotfl:

The fact that Pee-Ech-Dees are wanted is a sign that no one knows what is happening and is equally clueless. We all know that, so what is knew. Taleb ji is just shouting from the roof-tops to gain some recognition his way.

BTW, fizzicists also know of non-gaussian tails and distributions which are gaussian in log-normal space. Lots of biological measurements have this feature. Anyway fizzicists did not invent economics...I can bet that more people on the street understand Newton's laws if they had a high school education, than any of the rubbish propaganda found in economics theories. of all colours. :mrgreen:
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Re: GLOBAL ECONOMY

Post by vina »

Bade wrote:BTW, fizzicists also know of non-gaussian tails and distributions which are gaussian in log-normal space.
Bade Saar, that lognormal thing is the fundamental assumption of the Black Scholes Model! It assumes the natural logarithm of holding one plus the return from holding a stock for a time delta t , is normally distributed , with a given mean and standard deviation! .. :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:

Lots of biological measurements have this feature. Anyway fizzicists did not invent economics...
What works in biological measurements (invariant over time and repeatable anywhere) doesn't hold true in something as crazy in a world populated with Abduls, thinking and unthinking and driven more by emotions and instincts and not some "commie"/robot like "rationality" . :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

Fizzycists didnt invent economix for sure. But they made it a poor copy of "bad physics " or doggerel Physics when they put Fizzyics based stochastic calculus into Econo mix! Ergo --> Fizzycists /Maths/Stats types need to be put on lamb bost. :P :P
Bade
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Re: GLOBAL ECONOMY

Post by Bade »

What works in biological measurements (invariant over time and repeatable anywhere) doesn't hold true in something as crazy in a world populated with Abduls, thinking and unthinking and driven more by emotions and instincts and not some "commie"/robot like "rationality" . :mrgreen: :mrgreen:
So the world gets what is wants...more witch doctors...aka Yum-BEE-yays...whose theories of economics works also half the time (50% probabilty) onlee...like a good toss of the coin. :rotfl: :rotfl:
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Re: GLOBAL ECONOMY

Post by vsudhir »

FWIW, its incorrect to suggest all or even most conomists do their thing making distributional assumptions.

Quite the contrary. Since the advent of semi- and non-parametric estimators (and these went retail with the microcomputer revolution) and particularly so in this decade, parametric methods (those that assume particular distributions for states of nature, ex ante) are generally looked down upon aajkal.

The highbrow high-priests of applied economics nowadays wont even look at parametrics based papers. And the reason is eggsactly that - how do I know so-and-so is distributed normal/lognormal/gamma a priori?

Problem with the alternative methods is that in semi-parametrics you still endup making assumptions on functional form and in the 'safest' method - nonparametrics - you end up losing all power to extrapolate i.e. make any predictions at all. Also, conducting counter-factuals become complicated.

Bottomline, tradeoffs involved everywhere. sab maya hai.
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Re: GLOBAL ECONOMY

Post by John Snow »

Spinster Uvacha

"Analogue models cannot be linearly extrapolated for econometrics"

"Past performance data does not guarantee or present future outcomes'


Remember that Economics/Finance is neither Liberal Arts nor Science, it is bast#$dization of both and some math thrown in to gain respectability.
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Re: GLOBAL ECONOMY

Post by shyamd »

Nationalism may impoverish us
* Robert Peston
* 10 Mar 09, 07:58 AM

Many would say it's the thin end of a peculiarly ugly wedge.

I'm talking about a report in yesterday's Financial Times that Bank of America has withdrawn job offers from foreign graduates of US business schools.

What's the cause?

A Bank of America spokesman cites a stipulation by Congress on banks and businesses rescued with taxpayers' money that - if they're laying off US workers - they mustn't employ highly skilled immigrants.

Fair dos, you might say. What's wrong with "US jobs for US workers", to re-work an aphorism coined by our Prime Minister, at a time when jobs are scarce?

Well, financial globalisation was associated with a nation-blind and race-blind, meritocratic approach to recruitment that many would have described as making the world a more tolerant place, and therefore a more stable place.

Say what you will about the way that some big global banks, hedge funds and private equity firms have blown up our prosperity by their blind pursuit of short-term rewards.

But they were more culturally and racially eclectic than most other businesses.

What mattered to get to the top of one of these firms was brains and ruthless determination (oh, and it helped to be motivated by the prospect of making money beyond anyone's wildest dreams).

So their upper ranks were and still are filled with Indians, Chinese, African-Americans and a perhaps surprising number of French men (surprising because much of France's establishment took a rather sneering attitude to the Anglo-American approach to finance).

But for how much longer?

The global recession has prompted a rise in nationalism and protectionism.

For example, a Congressional committee is also this week expected to criticise US banks in receipt of state support for continuing to invest or lend in Asia and the Middle East.

This is dangerous stuff - because the less capital that flows across borders, the less money there will ultimately be for all of us.

The point is that when loans are withdrawn in a systematic way, there's a domino effect and a feedback effect, which ultimately cause the total contraction of credit to be much greater.

And although it was perhaps understandable that politicians were unaware of the poisonous impact of financial chauvinism in the 1930s, there's little excuse today (which is not to argue that protectionism caused the Great Depression - but simply to say that it didn't help).

Which brings me back to China - and the role that many would want it to play in reducing the severity of the global recession and in making the world a permanently safer place.

Our government, the US government and most of the developed world would like to see China consuming more of what it earns from exports.

In the short term, this should helpfully increase demand for our goods and services.

And in the longer term it would gradually reduce China's $2 trillion stockpile of foreign exchange - which many see as one of the main sources of the cheap capital that pumped up the credit bubble, whose bursting has done us so much harm.

But China, understandably, wants a tit for its tat.

China's Commerce Minister, Chen Deming, recently said this to me: "Our hope is that we can gradually reduce our financial surplus...The right way to do so is to consume our surplus abroad through our tourists or through our outbound investment activities".

This desire by China to own more of our productive capacity raises great alarm, especially in the US.

But if China is to consume more and save less, is it unreasonable for it to want to safeguard its future prosperity by acquiring businesses and real assets overseas, which will remit valuable dividends to it over the longer term?

Isn't this what the "imperialist" UK and US did at comparable periods of their economic development?

And is there a cost to us or a benefit if China were to provide our capital-starved businesses with the financial resources they need?

There's an argument that if we're to get through this recession in reasonable shape, we've got to become more relaxed - not less - about who owns what.
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Re: GLOBAL ECONOMY

Post by vina »

Bade wrote:So the world gets what is wants...more witch doctors...aka Yum-BEE-yays...whose theories of economics works also half the time (50% probabilty) onlee...like a good toss of the coin. :rotfl: :rotfl:
Ah Bade Saar . When you are dealing with all "Maya", what you might actually need is the Voodoo Witch Doctor , who does Mantra/Tantra/Black Magic than a "rational" science type who deals with "hard facts" . Consider this. Money is Wampum and then you creating more Wampum called bonds/stocks etc ut of an underlying Wampum called cash, and on this stock /bond Wampum, you create more Wampum called "Derivatives" , and on top of derivative Wampum, you create more Wampum called CDO, CDS, MBS and and More Wampum on that Wampum alphabet soup!. Basically you have created layers upon layers of Wampum, infact an entire pyramid of Wampum. And no, this Wampu pyramid /mountain was created by the Fyzzicists and poor fellows, already out of depth in the Wampum/Maya world, far removed from the real world of their training , simply lost it. The Voodoo Witch Doctors would have been more comfortable with Maya and atleast they would't have lost sight of the fact that it was all Maya onree.

Bade Saar. Truth be said, Yum Bee Yays are actually pretty well equipped to handle this kind of uncertainty . The "traditional" MBAs , who do sales, marketing, corporate planning etc actually know that this sort of thing is "art" and go for a lot of times with gut feel, experience, the look in the other guys eyes, their reading of the scene, the dynamics of the situation etc. That is what makes the successful guys different from the also-rans . This kind of thing is firmly in the "behavioral /human" side of things. Look at a field like Marketing. A good marketing guys uses gut feel and his "art" to a far greater degree than the "science" . No other field than Marketing has had such a role in creating the vast increase in demand for all kinds of things (the Yogic Yindoo would call it junk/maya, but that is a different story). Look at a case like starbucks. The canny marketing guys have created a need for you to to go and sip at a coffee for around $6 or so , something that actually costs maybe around 10c to make in direct material costs!. Traditional practitioners of business have always been totally contemptuous of geeks peddling theoretical stuff and they geeks dont climb the corporate ladder. The practitioners do. The geeks and their models are just another "data point" in the whole list of things not present in the geek's model like what I talked about that a good sales and marketing guy uses.

And you might ask what has this got to do with Finance . Well the secret is Inbeshtment banking is really more sales and marketing that Finance. The front end Eye Bee types whether in Milan& Sangam , or Bechna & Vyapar or Karoporate Wrun Dena, Karporate Salaah Dena are all first rate marketing and sales types, who are rewarded and rise more on what they can sell and their record in doing that, rather than how competent they are with spread sheets. For eg, it is very rare indeed for a pure dorky C.A / CPA to rise in an I Bank.

Things got into trouble when the geeks landed up with the rocket science models and that became a very big part of the business that started creating outsized profits based on products which are difficult even for the geeks to understand and had IED /land mine kind of hidden risks that went Kaboom with huge IED Mubarak! After this blow ,up, the geeks will lose power and will be sent to the dog pound ( they will exist, but the healthy skepticism about the geeky stuff that existed earlier, but was eclipsed will return with a vengeance). The LTCM fiasco was a severe warning which the system ignored because that bailout was so successful and it was just a fly in the windscreen. But guess what the LTCM kind of risks always existed and it just did a bigger IED Mubarak at an unexpected time.
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Re: GLOBAL ECONOMY

Post by derkonig »

errm..this is just Kufr.
Ask any good MBA & (s)he will tell you that marketing is not about 'creating' needs, but about 'catering' to needs. Those needs always existed & a good marketing strategy is all about getting people to express those needs & thus consume those products/services.
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Re: GLOBAL ECONOMY

Post by Raja Bose »

It is about making people realize that they have some urgent needs which they previously didn't even know existed! (case in pt. *bucks and their expensive cheap coffee) :mrgreen:
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Re: GLOBAL ECONOMY

Post by ldev »

Taleb talks of Grey Swans which he describes as "known unknowns" as opposed to Black Swans which are "unknown unknowns". He is a huge proponent of fractal statistics popularized by Benoit Mandelbrot precisely because outliers in financial data which give rise to Grey Swans have a far more frequent occurence in real life relative to to how often they are supposed to occur according to the Bell curve distribution. Taleb claims that what the physicists have done via bell curve based modelling is turn Grey Swans into Black Swans such as the current meltdown. He himself saw it as a Grey Swan and protected himself and the hedge fund he advises precisely against such a market move. Since his background is in options trading, he is able to figure out whether out of the money put and calls (which he buys as insurance) are priced cheaply, relative to fractal based probabilities whereas the sellers of puts and calls would have typically priced these outliers based on Bell curve based models and hence priced them much cheaper than the real underlying risk would actually warrant.

Nice little business he has going there!
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Re: GLOBAL ECONOMY

Post by vina »

pandyan wrote:and not to mention pristine water from fuji for $2/lt onlee and btw..there are 0 calorie flavored waters too; I saw a lady buy a dozen of 0 cal water and wondered if onlee I had loyal customers like this...
Why Pandyan saar?. Havent you heard of 1 cal colored water onree which is advertised as Diet Pepsi, Diet Coke, Diet This, Diet That ithyadi and having sales of a couple of billion dollahs each ?.

In Yankee land, the mohtarmas were always very partial to this 1 calorie diet thing. They cant seem to drink normal water and drink onree 1cal soda (they dont want to get fat). Somehow, Cola as a substitute for water has seemed to do within 3 generations what millions of years of human evolution couldn't do. Classic case of marketing creating new wants (ok, Marketing Mullahs and say that in all the millions of years, humans always wanted sodas, it is just that the now "express" it :mrgreen: :mrgreen: ). I was dating one such blonde Mohtarma long ago and there was a lil kerfluffle between Pepsi and our esteemed babus once. Pepsi had introduced the Diet Cola in Yindia , but Babus's wouldn't give the all important "No Objection Certificate" :(( . Why ?. Babu logic was, with 1 cal, it has no "nutritional value" and hence is not a "food", so I cant give you NOC to launch it as an "approved" food :rotfl: :rotfl: . Perfect, impeccable logic from the Yindu Babu, but Mohtarma was scandalized !..

Tchah. Fuji and that too at $2/lt onree? .Well, when I was a PIG (Poor Indian Grad Student), I flew in once to Bombay airport in those old days and in the ramshackle shack that passed off as "food outlet", poor thirsty moi asked for bottled water (lily livered me didnt want to get Delhi Belly the moment I landed) and was given a small tiny plastic bottle (250ml onree) of very bure "Evian" onree and was demanded Rs 90, I nearly passed out in shock , you do the math with even current exchange rate of $52 odd and you will find you lowly and SDRE Fuji is , compared to Phrench TFTA Evian!. Of course there was no other water available. All very kosher in Socialist Rupubric of Yindia back then. So I just made sure next time before landing in any flight in India to ask for water to tank up, use the loo in the aircraft (somehow running around with a lota in Bombay airport at 3:00 am didn't appeal to me) .. Once bitten twice shy kind of learning
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Re: GLOBAL ECONOMY

Post by KarthikSan »

Whole Foods/Organic Foods are the 2nd greatest scam in God's world after Wall St. onlee :lol:
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Re: GLOBAL ECONOMY

Post by John Snow »

On wall street
Doctor of science == Doctor of signs
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Re: GLOBAL ECONOMY

Post by putnanja »

vina wrote: In Yankee land, the mohtarmas were always very partial to this 1 calorie diet thing. They cant seem to drink normal water and drink onree 1cal soda (they dont want to get fat). Somehow, Cola as a substitute for water has seemed to do within 3 generations what millions of years of human evolution couldn't do.
Totally OT but ... :D
Its not limited to mohtarmas anymore! Though not just the diet thing, it appears that americans just don't want to drink water with their food. Whenever I go out to lunch with my co-workers, many of whom are khans, they always grab a cola with their food. Very rare to see them get water. And it is the same in proper american restaurants, like Denny's, Applebees etc. They ask you what you want to drink, and you have to explicitly say water. If you say nothing ( like I used to do when I first got here, assuming they will get water instead since you don't have to order it), they don't bring you anything! Indian and Thai restaurants on the other hand always serve water first, just like in India. Used to be quite surprised when I first landed here and when I mentioned that to couple of americans, they too would wonder like "is it so?" :).
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Re: GLOBAL ECONOMY

Post by Sagar »

RaviBg wrote: Its not limited to mohtarmas anymore! Though not just the diet thing, it appears that americans just don't want to drink water with their food. Whenever I go out to lunch with my co-workers, many of whom are khans, they always grab a cola with their food. Very rare to see them get water. And it is the same in proper american restaurants, like Denny's, Applebees etc. They ask you what you want to drink, and you have to explicitly say water.

Chlorination has made water "yucky" in many areas. Cheap, sweet, colored sugar water has walked in and taken over.

The amazing thing is that NYC and Philadelphia, among others have very tasty city water. But fear of lead poisoning, and "Uncoolness" has made some "water" and "sugar water" sellers multi-millionaires.

I was not the least bit surprised when the "Chauhan's (?)" sold their Thums-Up bottling and distribution to Coke and plunged into selling water. I still remember how tasty Delhi water tasted after an exhausting two hours of playtime. And how the perception of Delhi water system was allowed to deteriorate to a point that my mother was boiling perfectly good water.

Ever drunk Kerala well water after eating "Amla"? Heavenly, I tell ya.
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Re: GLOBAL ECONOMY

Post by Arya Sumantra »

RaviBg wrote:
vina wrote: In Yankee land, the mohtarmas were always very partial to this 1 calorie diet thing. They cant seem to drink normal water and drink onree 1cal soda (they dont want to get fat). Somehow, Cola as a substitute for water has seemed to do within 3 generations what millions of years of human evolution couldn't do.
Totally OT but ... :D
Its not limited to mohtarmas anymore! Though not just the diet thing, it appears that americans just don't want to drink water with their food. Whenever I go out to lunch with my co-workers, many of whom are khans, they always grab a cola with their food. Very rare to see them get water. And it is the same in proper american restaurants, like Denny's, Applebees etc. They ask you what you want to drink, and you have to explicitly say water. If you say nothing ( like I used to do when I first got here, assuming they will get water instead since you don't have to order it), they don't bring you anything! Indian and Thai restaurants on the other hand always serve water first, just like in India. Used to be quite surprised when I first landed here and when I mentioned that to couple of americans, they too would wonder like "is it so?" :).
First they relocate/remove free water fountains from near the eating joints and food courts. Then the bottled water is priced the same as a Cola. So who wouldn't go for the cola? And guess who owns the bottled water brand(and thus controls relative price vis-a-vis cola)? Dasani or Aquafina anyone? No matter whether you drink a cola or consciously avoid it and go for bottled water the same amount of moolah to goes to same entity :mrgreen:
KarthikSan wrote:Whole Foods/Organic Foods are the 2nd greatest scam in God's world after Wall St. onlee :lol:
organic foods is khan populace's opportunity to taste real vegetable and fruits the way they are supposed to taste naturally. In the land of bland tasteless vegetables, it is their one opportunity to feel nature as it is. In yindia we pay the normal price for them, in massa they pay a premium.
Most of the vegetables and fruits in massa are genetically modified. While it gives them the rigidity to stand all the rough handling during transportation and distribution besides other benefits of gm foods, the vegetables and fruits hardly taste like natural ones. Look at the tomatoes in massa. They are tasteless but retain much of their hardness no matter what the stage of decay and decay starts with a fungus whereas a desi tomato loses firmness and gets soggy but tastes natural despite the shorter life. My friend was happy to once find onions that makes him cry like the desi ones and carrots that actually taste sweet.
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Re: GLOBAL ECONOMY

Post by Raja Bose »

Aha...it seems SDRE jingoes are familiar with these upper-crust TFTA Whole Foods stores. My GHQ has been mentioning it for a while...apparently they have some kind of Alphonso mango icecream that according to her tastes heavenly. Moi being a soiled dhoti SDRE abdul have only seen the Whole Foods store from outside. Naturally I am cowering and shaking in my dhoti thinking if I go in and see the prices, I might have a heart attack and visions of penury.

Can some jingo(s) clue me in if they have ever had this ice cream/cost/is it worth it ityadi?

Totally totally OT post but zindagi ka sawaal hai hence, bredators please hold your hellfires.
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Re: GLOBAL ECONOMY

Post by Paul »

Are you referring to the Wholefoods in UTC - San DIego???
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Re: GLOBAL ECONOMY

Post by Raja Bose »

No, further up north in same state.
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Re: GLOBAL ECONOMY

Post by Singha »

the real chi chi types buy organic goat cheese and exotic hand made sicilian pasta.
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Re: GLOBAL ECONOMY

Post by vina »

Yawn.. You Kaffir's simply dont have any understanding or taste for the good things in life. Live in Manhattan , walk down to Fairways and shop the best produce possible sourced from anywhere in the world, quality of fruits and veggies simply among the best, same with meat and milk.

NYC is full of such places. For eg, how many folks have tasted the "Sabra" (just google around for it and find out why the Native born Isrealis are called that) . One of my close pals who is Jewish took me to a real upmarket deli and we gorged on some. The best Proscuitto , where else except in NYC !. The best Camembert Cheese, the best possible imported directly from Phrance , and of course you will learn to turn your nose up as "pasteurized" as not the real thing, develop a liking for the smelly cheese and remark with a nice Phrench accent "Vat iz life wizzout Camembert Cheese" , learn how to be a true sommelier and turn your nose up at even half way decent things and say "Ziz iz nat vin, ziz is vineygah!" . Sigh. the culture, the diversity, the truly international character of that place, the food, the experiences.

All looking back in nostalgia of course. With SHQ keeping an eagle eye on diet and everything after the cholesterol and diabetes, stuff like cheese, wine, meat etc strictly rationed /banned onree :(( :(( :cry: . And like the old "Mahmud was it ? song, it is a classic case of ladki very Hindustani in taste and food and all else.. So Jodi Hamari , Kasie Banega Jaani, Mai ladka hoon Angrezi, Ladki Hindustauni! :P :P

But seriously, Manhattan, Bay Area, some parts of SF & LA, Londonistan etc are globalization at it's best. Shows the high points of the global economy in its highest notes.
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Re: GLOBAL ECONOMY

Post by ArmenT »

Sabra is that sweet cactus pear, right? I've had it before. Sabra is also a brand of hummus here, which isn't too bad tasting. However, since I live in a big Armenian area, I get better freshly made hummus at some of the eating establishments, where I'm seen as a regular. Gotta love Zankou Chicken's hummus as well as Raffi's
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