Not if you accept the G550 platform. It is already there.It was understandable in case of 6 tankers but doing the same with just 3 aircrafts is futile I believe!
I think what the good PAF commander was referring to is that they intend to swarm the skies with large numbers of BVR armed aircraft in the early hours of any war to make sure that the Indian AWACS is taken out. The price of the Phalcon is worth the price of couple dozen fighters to them.sum wrote:Pakis and their wierd logic....India buys AWAcs, so we will down them using AAMRAMs(while the AWACs and its escorts being hunted are sleeping to allow the Paki plane come within missile range)!!?
What ever happened to the Pakistani BVR that they inducted in 2003? Phhiisseelleed?sum wrote:
Thales Shrike TG can be combined with Rafael's X-guard FOTD that uses Solid State Active Array Transmitters to engage radar homing threats.The Thales Aerospace Division's Shrike TG is based on work that Thales has undertaken in collaboration with the UK's former Defence Evaluation and Research Agency on the Advanced Jamming System (AJS) technology demonstration programme. It is described by its manufacturer as being a 'third-generation' equipment that in the 'large aircraft' context, is in the 'same category' as the TG being installed aboard the US Air Force's next-generation F/A-22 combat aircraft. As applied to the Sentinel R Mk 1, the equipment is understood to be used to drive a Fibre-Optic Towed radar Decoy (FOTD) variant of the Raytheon AN/ALE-50(V) active radar decoy and is mounted in a standard 48 cm (19 in) rack, incorporates a digital radio frequency memory and is equipped with integral threat parameter and countermeasures technique software libraries. This particular application also sees the TG interfaced with and cued by a BAE Systems Electronics and Integrated Solutions AN/ALR-56M(V) radar warning system. Functionally, Shrike generates a coherent response and offers noise, deception and repeater jamming modes. Thales claims that when compared with existing towed decoy systems, the described combination of its TG and the Raytheon FOTD is able to 'triple' the number of simultaneous threats able to be countered in a single decoy deployment.
Publication date
Mar 04, 2009
Thales Defence Ltd has been contracted by Lockheed Martin Fairchild Systems to provide its Shrike DRFM TG for integration into the Nimrod MRA4 Defensive Aids SubSystem (DASS).System architecture provides for the Lockheed Martin Fairchild Systems AN/ALR-56M(V) RWR to cue the DRFM TG, which is then used to drive the Fibre-Optic Towed Decoy (FOTD) version of the Raytheon Systems Company AN/ALE-50 towed decoy system.The DRFM TG has been developed by Thales in its work on advanced jamming system technology in association with QuinetiQ (formerly the Defence and Evaluation Research Agency). It is understood that a twin-DRFM installation is to be used to meet the high data throughput specification for Nimrod MRA4 and ASTOR (see separate entry) systems.
I believe each AWACS will be escorted by 2 MMRCA or MiG-29 and 3 LCA. I find it hard to believe what Pakistani bull$hit as nothing in Pakistani Airforce has the capability to match Phalcon's abilities. Let's be realistic, what's the chance of ANY Pooki aircraft getting a radar lock on Phalcon. Phalcon will have already detected it long ago and with MMRCA and LCA networked wit it almost no chance of any attack is possible.
Two can play the game that the freshly powdered and diapered PAF commander was talking about - take an IL76, fit a fake radome, sat dish dome and those ventral stabilizers and we have 30+ Phalcons at Agra. Since the AESA radomes doesnt even rotate and the newer engines are the only other big differentiators, the smaller fighters with their less powerful emission locators cant even pick out which one is fake, if it comes down to cannons or asraams (expect the AMRAAMS to veer off target, unless those racks of equipment inside Phalcon is all from walmart).vivek_ahuja wrote:sum wrote: I think what the good PAF commander was referring to is that they intend to swarm the skies with large numbers of BVR armed aircraft in the early hours of any war to make sure that the Indian AWACS is taken out. The price of the Phalcon is worth the price of couple dozen fighters to them.
This overt threat should not be dismissed lightly. Just goes to show how much the Phalcon worries the PAF...
On top of ze bodyguards the aggressors will also have to deal with ze sam networks (pechora, akash, barak ng...ityaadi) given the amraams range they'll need to enter Indian territory making them legitimate targets for the above....HariC wrote:we could actually wargame the situation and see that its pretty difficult to ambush a phalcon.
i mean how do you mug someone when the target has eyes on the back of his head and also has night vision and half a dozen body guards stationed beside him and another bunch forming a cordon 50 feet from him. how do you get close enough to mug that person?
Thus time and again the "we'll counter Indian AWACS with 500 amrikhan missiles" is Lawhori logic at its best....Jai Ho!!! 
and after that, 300 kilometres area of India would be monitored. [/quote]They have a new plane. Our CAS was right, India does not have a total picture of our neighbors capabilities.He said F-7, F-16 and Miraj aircraft are being used in the operation against militants in Swat.
You are right. All is 'maya'NRao wrote: He said F-7, F-16 and Miraj aircraft are being used in the operation against militants in Swat.
Does it needs a dedicated ECM when a small portion the Big AESA can be delegated the task of ECM/Jamming ?Sumeet wrote:NRao & Austin,
There is no mention of ECM, meaning our Phalcon will need escort aircraft to do all work against Radar guided missles like AMRAAM, MICA-RF, Meteor etc..
Austin AESA radar of Phalcon can only act as a transmitter. But you still need technique generator. Otherwise there is no ECM at all. All ECM systems have TG. The modern ones are based on latest DRFMs and have most up to date threat library available with them.Austin wrote:Does it needs a dedicated ECM when a small portion the Big AESA can be delegated the task of ECM/Jamming ?Sumeet wrote:NRao & Austin,
There is no mention of ECM, meaning our Phalcon will need escort aircraft to do all work against Radar guided missles like AMRAAM, MICA-RF, Meteor etc..
Himanshu,Himanshu wrote:Sumeet.. our PHALCON chapati has way more capabilities than what's known out in open about it.. IAF and IAI(?) have spent real time in developing, integrating the systems that they felt were most appropriate based on their experiences.. We would come to know of it's near actual capabilities when new systems that we are working on start entering the service..
Yes, Thales has developed Airborne Electronic Attack pod that uses AESA for transmission.p_saggu wrote:Further,
Can a really big AESA be used as an offensive weapon? There are prelim reports about its useage in a high speed data transfer role.
[/quote]Dmurphy wrote:http://www.nation.com.pk/pakistan-news- ... S[quote]He said acquisition of AWACS technology by India from Israel would lead to arms race in the region and Pakistan would also get 15 such planes by end of October
hey all of youp_saggu wrote:Further,
Can a really big AESA be used as an offensive weapon? There are prelim reports about its useage in a high speed data transfer role.
I am no expert but I think the AWACS operates on full power to analyse all threats and non-threats in all directions. Signals that reach an AWACS can be those that are generated by the target (passive snooping) or reflected signals generated by the AWACS itself or some other source (active snooping). Each has its advantages.andy B wrote:A yumble question to the gurus that be:
If a phalcon is say fling in a racetrack patern say somewhere in the Indian territory and doing surveilance on pak now in doing this it would always be looking west right? I understand that there are there phased arrays in the chapati but while doing this we wont need to look east bcoz we are concentrating west so my question is would it be possible to say shutdown the array towards the east and even the one that looks towards the back so it would be looking north or south depending on the direction of the aircraft...the point is that if we do this then will the guys be able to divert the power that the other two arrays were using to the one that is looking west and thus increase the detection range...???
Apologies if this sounds silly--dilly...havent had much sleep and I have been working with numbers for the past 2 days...
Ok fine let me understand this the so called TG is a combination of DSP and Software Algorithm . An AESA radar of Phalcon can act as Transmitter and Receiver , DRFM is again a combination of DSP and Signal Generator.Sumeet wrote:Austin AESA radar of Phalcon can only act as a transmitter. But you still need technique generator. Otherwise there is no ECM at all. All ECM systems have TG. The modern ones are based on latest DRFMs and have most up to date threat library available with them.
If USAF can fire vanilla-AMRAAM's to a 100km range.. PAF can sure fire the Inshallah-AMRAAM's to 300km range.. So.. IAF Phalcons better be ready to run..shiv wrote:
I hope these AMRAAMs have a 300 km range so they can reach the AWACS. The idea of an AWACS is to stay out of reach of AAAMs while passing information to fighters who shoot first and kill the AMRAAM armed enemy jets even as they are taking off from their airfields.
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