Military Flight Safety

Nihat · Post by **Nihat** » 21 Aug 2009 17:44

This is very very Sad , I recall seeing a documentry on our defence preparedness around the year 2000 where the focus was on the IN in that episode , the anchor signed off by saying that "we still send our harriers up in the air with fuel and a lot of hope" . The sum of everything today is that these air crafts are Old , way beyond their sell by date.

Had the Gorki been delivered as promised in 2008 , I'm sure Sauruv would be alive today.

Shameek · Post by **Shameek** » 21 Aug 2009 18:31

RIP.

Nihat wrote:Had the Gorki been delivered as promised in 2008 , I'm sure Sauruv would be alive today.

I'm not sure we would have stopped flying the Harriers, if thats what you mean.

pgbhat · Post by **pgbhat** » 21 Aug 2009 22:48

hmm RIP to Lt. Cmdr.

.
As per wiki only 12 Sea Harriers with IN are operational....that is less than half the fleet.

nikhil_p · Post by **nikhil_p** » 22 Aug 2009 00:24

The reasons for crash could vary. The fact is the airframes are old. Moreover at sea, the sheer forces of Nature are against the airframe life. Moreover the Harrier defies the basics of aerodynamics and are high maint aircraft.
The current upgrade involves putting in a new radar and making them derby compatible. This will make them more effective. We are due to retire these aircraft in the 2012-2014 range. To get a good offensive capability we need a lot more than the Mig-29K's on order.
Once again keeping with the current emotion, will not say more.

**cross posting from Naval thread as it was OT**

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 24 Aug 2009 22:19

nikhil_p wrote:The reasons for crash could vary. The fact is the airframes are old. Moreover at sea, the sheer forces of Nature are against the airframe life. Moreover the Harrier defies the basics of aerodynamics and are high maint aircraft.
The current upgrade involves putting in a new radar and making them derby compatible. This will make them more effective. We are due to retire these aircraft in the 2012-2014 range. To get a good offensive capability we need a lot more than the Mig-29K's on order.
Once again keeping with the current emotion, will not say more.

**cross posting from Naval thread as it was OT**

At this preliminary stage neither the engine nor airframe is being suspected.

Looks like a low level ejection that resulted in the fatality.

There was no mayday call either.

Funeral was yesterday. RIP.

Deepest condolences to the Family.

Shameek · Post by **Shameek** » 25 Aug 2009 02:48

Livefist: Harrier Crash

The Harrier was flying a mission in support of a Naval Veer-class guided missile corvette about 20 miles off the coast of Goa when it went down. Personnel on board the warship reported witnessing the aircraft impact the water. The crash did not happen during an exercise as has been reported by some agencies. It was very much an operational mission involving support of a corvette from a Mumbai squadron.

The depth of the sea at the point of impact is only about 40-meters, and therefore the Navy is hoping to rapidly complete a salvage operation. Some parts have already been salvaged. Investigations into the crash, like all previous inquiries involving the Sea Harrier, will be deeply difficult since the aircraft does not have a Flight Data Recorder (FDR) or even an accident-oriented Cockpit Voice Recorder (except for training purposes, with manual override available to the pilot).

arun · Post by **arun** » 25 Aug 2009 21:24

X Posted:

Navy grounds Sea Harrier fighter jet fleet

K_Rohit · Post by **K_Rohit** » 27 Aug 2009 17:21

shameekg wrote:Livefist: Harrier Crash

The Harrier was flying a mission in support of a Naval Veer-class guided missile corvette about 20 miles off the coast of Goa when it went down. Personnel on board the warship reported witnessing the aircraft impact the water. The crash did not happen during an exercise as has been reported by some agencies. It was very much an operational mission involving support of a corvette from a Mumbai squadron.

The depth of the sea at the point of impact is only about 40-meters, and therefore the Navy is hoping to rapidly complete a salvage operation. Some parts have already been salvaged. Investigations into the crash, like all previous inquiries involving the Sea Harrier, will be deeply difficult since the aircraft does not have a Flight Data Recorder (FDR) or even an accident-oriented Cockpit Voice Recorder (except for training purposes, with manual override available to the pilot).

Any speculation on what kind of "operational" mission the SHAR was on? Cant think of any peacetime "mission" requiring a corvette to work with a Harrier.....hmmm

PratikDas · Post by **PratikDas** » 31 Aug 2009 13:28

Belarusian fighter jet crashes in Poland

Two pilots were killed {R.I.P} when a Belarusian SU-27 fighter jet crashed at an air show in Poland, the Belarus Defense Ministry reports.

The crash is believed to have been caused when a bird flew into the engine.

However, no civilian casualties were reported at the air show being held near the town of Radom in central Poland.

chiru · Post by **chiru** » 02 Sep 2009 21:56

su-30 pressed into search and rescue of YSR reddy

MKI is going to or is presently doing a thermal imaging scan of the suspected crash site ..... i think its using the litening pod ...for me its the first time when a fighter is used for search and rescue operation in india ....hope rambha is sucessul

Sriman · Post by **Sriman** » 02 Sep 2009 22:30

chiru wrote:su-30 pressed into search and rescue of YSR reddy

MKI is going to or is presently doing a thermal imaging scan of the suspected crash site ..... i think its using the litening pod ...for me its the first time when a fighter is used for search and rescue operation in india ....hope rambha is sucessul

They're using the SAR on the MKI..

Surya · Post by **Surya** » 02 Sep 2009 23:07

chiru

Its not the first time. It was previously done in pouring rain for another helo crash and the success of that probably prompted this

And yes it could be the Litening pod

karan_mc · Post by **karan_mc** » 03 Sep 2009 08:10

chiru wrote:su-30 pressed into search and rescue of YSR reddy

MKI is going to or is presently doing a thermal imaging scan of the suspected crash site ..... i think its using the litening pod ...for me its the first time when a fighter is used for search and rescue operation in india ....hope rambha is sucessul

4 or 5 years ago when a naval chopper crashed in Arabian sea Rambha was used and it did find the chopper

Sanku · Post by **Sanku** » 03 Sep 2009 11:24

Su found the the crashed chopper.

Dmurphy · Post by **Dmurphy** » 03 Sep 2009 11:37

Sanku wrote:Su found the the crashed chopper.

Any link supporting the above claim? I heard the NRSC aircraft found the chopper.

VijayKumarSinha · Post by **VijayKumarSinha** » 03 Sep 2009 11:44

Dmurphy wrote:
Sanku wrote:Su found the the crashed chopper.
Any link supporting the above claim? I heard the NRSC aircraft found the chopper.

http://navbharattimes.indiatimes.com/ar ... 966496.cms

This doesn't exactly say it, but it says that Su-30 was sent along with a ISRO pilotless aircraft.

Doesn't say who found it though.

R.I.P Mr. YSR

I guess nobody is immune from such accidents.

Sanku · Post by **Sanku** » 03 Sep 2009 12:03

Dmurphy wrote:
Sanku wrote:Su found the the crashed chopper.
Any link supporting the above claim? I heard the NRSC aircraft found the chopper.

TV news.

chiru · Post by **chiru** » 03 Sep 2009 12:59

karan_mc wrote:
chiru wrote:su-30 pressed into search and rescue of YSR reddy

MKI is going to or is presently doing a thermal imaging scan of the suspected crash site ..... i think its using the litening pod ...for me its the first time when a fighter is used for search and rescue operation in india ....hope rambha is sucessul
4 or 5 years ago when a naval chopper crashed in Arabian sea Rambha was used and it did find the chopper

thanks mate didnt know that

Vishnu · Post by **Vishnu** » 03 Sep 2009 14:52

Hi ... I am told .. the wreckage was detected by Wing Commander Rawat in a Mi-17 at 8:42 am ... The Su sorties and the ISRO aircraft were unable to detect ..

Thanks

Shankar · Post by **Shankar** » 03 Sep 2009 16:38

the wreckage was detected by Wing Commander Rawat in a Mi-17 at 8:42 am ... The Su sorties and the ISRO aircraft were unable to detect

likely .. the suhoi reached the site much later and the thermal imaging is quite useless on a cold crash site ..,the only way is visual at slow speed/hover

rakall · Post by **rakall** » 03 Sep 2009 17:03

Shankar wrote:
the wreckage was detected by Wing Commander Rawat in a Mi-17 at 8:42 am ... The Su sorties and the ISRO aircraft were unable to detect
likely .. the suhoi reached the site much later and the thermal imaging is quite useless on a cold crash site ..,the only way is visual at slow speed/hover

Su30MKI was using thermal imaging & SAR during the night, much before the Mi-17's flew this morning.. Su30MKI took over the night operations after the Mi17's, Dhruvs etc stopped opration at nightfall yesterday...

Mi17's & (atleast one) Dhruv in Sarang colours from Yelahanka started operations on first light today and one of the Mi17's likely made visual detection today after they started fresh operations in the morning..

Kakarat · Post by **Kakarat** » 03 Sep 2009 17:22

I saw 2 Dhruvs in Sarang colours & Mi17's in TV

Vishnu · Post by **Vishnu** » 03 Sep 2009 17:55

Now being told that Chetak was first to spot today. Cell phone triangulation narrowed search area to 4 sq kms.

Jagan · Post by **Jagan** » 03 Sep 2009 18:04

Those are all Mi-8s. Z News is showing pictures of the crash site. I am sure there would have been no doubt when the wreckage was spotted that survival chances are slim

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 03 Sep 2009 18:25

Those are all Mi-8s

how do you visually differentiate between the two ?

Jagan · Post by **Jagan** » 03 Sep 2009 18:37

Tail Rotor (Mi-17 if its on port. Mi-8 if on starboard). The latest Mi-17 1Vs have ramp doors in the rear instead of clamshell.

Surya · Post by **Surya** » 03 Sep 2009 19:06

Naval helo crash was not in the ocean but in the hills in Karnataka.

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 03 Sep 2009 19:13

Jagan wrote:Tail Rotor (Mi-17 if its on port. Mi-8 if on starboard). The latest Mi-17 1Vs have ramp doors in the rear instead of clamshell.

ah, thanks ! an IAF aphsar told me there's no way to do it visually !

Jagan · Post by **Jagan** » 03 Sep 2009 19:21

The TV Channels have broadcast lots of footage on how the recovery mission was done. shots of the Mi-8s hovering overhead and winching down and up stuff, army soldiers on the ground and heck lot of civilians too helping out. there is no dearth of photos and videos now coming up onthe news circuits of the crash zone. a couple of photos of army 'commandos' (no way to tell) being winched down into the area have also been shown

Jagan · Post by **Jagan** » 03 Sep 2009 19:22

Rahul M wrote:
Jagan wrote:Tail Rotor (Mi-17 if its on port. Mi-8 if on starboard). The latest Mi-17 1Vs have ramp doors in the rear instead of clamshell.
ah, thanks ! an IAF aphsar told me there's no way to do it visually !

There are other ways too, but I will have to do that with my excel spreadsheet

Ajay K · Post by **Ajay K** » 03 Sep 2009 20:04

The Dorniers were also used in the search. But it took visual clue using chetak to spot?

Shameek · Post by **Shameek** » 04 Sep 2009 23:49

Bahadurgarh Mourns Pilot Bhatia

RIP Group Capt Sunil Kumar Bhatia.

Ajit.C · Post by **Ajit.C** » 05 Sep 2009 00:07

Heartfelt condolenses to all the dead..

However have one question, the article says he had joined IAF recently. Thought it would take at least 15-20 years service for someone to become a Group Captain.

Dmurphy · Post by **Dmurphy** » 10 Sep 2009 17:07

Indian Air Force MiG-21 crashes, pilot killed

NEW DELHI: An Indian Air Force (IAF) MiG-21 fighter crashed at Bathinda air base in Punjab Thursday, killing its pilot, an official
said.

The aircraft apparently lost power while taking off from Bathinda air base but the pilot could not eject in time, the official added.

The pilot's identity is being withheld till his family is first notified, the official said.

The crash is the seventh accident suffered by the IAF this year.

The IAF had lost a Kiran MK-II trainer aircraft of the Surya Kiran aerobatic team in January, a Sukhoi SU-30MKI in April, a MiG-27 and a MiG-21 Bison in May, and an AN-32 transport and a MiG-21 trainer in June.

RIP Shaheed pilot

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 10 Sep 2009 19:34

Dmurphy wrote:Indian Air Force MiG-21 crashes, pilot killed
NEW DELHI: An Indian Air Force (IAF) MiG-21 fighter crashed at Bathinda air base in Punjab Thursday, killing its pilot, an official
said.

The aircraft apparently lost power while taking off from Bathinda air base but the pilot could not eject in time, the official added.

The pilot's identity is being withheld till his family is first notified, the official said.

The crash is the seventh accident suffered by the IAF this year.

The IAF had lost a Kiran MK-II trainer aircraft of the Surya Kiran aerobatic team in January, a Sukhoi SU-30MKI in April, a MiG-27 and a MiG-21 Bison in May, and an AN-32 transport and a MiG-21 trainer in June.
RIP Shaheed pilot

RIP

. The HPT 32 accident is not mentioned in the report.

My heart always skips a beat when this thread is near the top of the forum thread list.

pgbhat · Post by **pgbhat** » 10 Sep 2009 20:10

rohitvats · Post by **rohitvats** » 10 Sep 2009 20:37

The pilot was known to my brother...young chap...left engineering to join NDA...brother has been inconsolable since he heard the news...marriage plan was under discussion......RIP brother...

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 10 Sep 2009 20:45

condolences to the family.

Surya · Post by **Surya** » 10 Sep 2009 20:56

So right Shiv

Thought "oh no" as soon as I saw this thread up there. Was hoping the pilot survived.

Hope his family can cope with the pain.

abhijitm · Post by **abhijitm** » 10 Sep 2009 21:02

what kind of crashes are these? reports dont elaborate nature of the accident.
Is it an explosion in the air due to which our precious pilots cant survive, cant even trigger ejection seat?

Frustration....

RIP.