Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Anujan · Post by **Anujan** » 01 Jan 2010 03:51

This is bigger than first reported:

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/01/01/world ... an.html?hp

The C.I.A. operatives stationed where a suicide bombing occurred Wednesday - killing at least eight Americans - were responsible for collecting information about militant networks in Afghanistan and Pakistan, and plotting missions to kill the networks’ top leaders.

Seven of the victims at Forward Operating Base Chapman were C.I.A. officers, and one of the victims was the base chief

Gerard · Post by **Gerard** » 01 Jan 2010 04:24

CIA chief confirms seven officers killed by Afghan bomb

The unnamed official added that the bomber was being courted as an informant and was not frisked as he entered the base.

VikramS · Post by **VikramS** » 01 Jan 2010 05:50

jrjrao wrote:Uneven list some options for the US, should the Pakis become difficult and offer some resistance to GUBO:

US expert's options to bring Pak to toe its line to bring peace to region
Link

There is nothing new in that article. He says that either TSP should behave or the US should ask India to make TSP behave. Or the US decided to cut and run, and the 'dial a nuke war' will continue every few years.

There are clear signs of frustration within the US with the tactical brilliance of the TSP. TSP knows that it has 3.5 masters and if one master can not afford it, others will step in to fill the gap. The TSP elite has millions of willing Jehadis at its disposal so this game can go on for a long, long time. The only way to fix it is to give get rid of the TSP elite and rework the society in a different form.

The problem of course is the cost of retraining the society is going to be immense and no one is interesting in footing the bill. The masters are also accustomed to the army of canon fodder Abduls (and Ayeshas) available on demand at incredibly cheap rates; and old habits die hard.

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 01 Jan 2010 06:00

jrjrao wrote:Uneven list some options for the US, should the Pakis become difficult and offer some resistance to GUBO:

US expert's options to bring Pak to toe its line to bring peace to region
Link

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2009/images/12/31/nye.pdf

December 31, 2009
Poll: Americans less hopeful about future
Posted: December 31st, 2009 09:00 AM ET

(CNN) - Americans will usher in the new decade less hopeful than they were at the dawn of the millennium in 2000, says a new national poll.

In 1999, 85 percent of Americans surveyed said they were hopeful about their own future, and 68 percent said they were hopeful for what the New Year boded for the world.

A CNN/Opinion Research Corp. poll released Thursday found 69 percent of Americans hopeful for their future, and 51 percent hopeful for the world.

Full poll results [PDF]

The survey polled 1,160 Americans. The margin of error is plus or minus 4.5 percentage points.

The polls show that USA and its people will disengage from the world. This includes intervention inside Afpak.
They may take this option

Then the last option is to offshore the balancing act, cut and run, as the US has no real interests in South Asia, he said.

All we need to do is to tilt one way or another from time to time to maintain the regional balance and to step in to prevent a nuclear war every four or five years, Cohen added.

Muppalla · Post by **Muppalla** » 01 Jan 2010 06:11

Gerard wrote:CIA chief confirms seven officers killed by Afghan bomb
The unnamed official added that the bomber was being courted as an informant and was not frisked as he entered the base.

This is really serious and what that means is that suicide bombers entered into double-agent roles. This is a point to be noted for all the intel agencies. ISI is one step ahead of the curve. A new year thingy to watch.

ashish raval · Post by **ashish raval** » 01 Jan 2010 06:23

^^ nothing new. The stupid security did not search him before letting him inside the base.

csharma · Post by **csharma** » 01 Jan 2010 07:15

Do the Islamists in Pakistan look forward to a US invasion of the tribal lands? While such an invasion would weaken the Taliban to some extent, it will lead the public opinion in rest of Pakistan in favour of Islamists. That will strengthen them and possibly help them capture power in Pakistan?

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 01 Jan 2010 07:16

http://www.financialnewsusa.com/news/a- ... e-official

A

U.S. intelligence official vowed Thursday to avenge a suspected terrorist attack on a U.S. base in Afghanistan that resulted in the deaths of seven CIA employees.
City of Industry, CA --(http://www.FinancialNewsUSA.com)-- 12/31/2009 - Most Popular industry news provided by Financial News USA. A U.S. intelligence official vowed Thursday to avenge a suspected terrorist attack on a U.S. base in Afghanistan that resulted in the deaths of seven CIA employees.

Another six CIA employees were wounded, another official said.

The Taliban have claimed responsibility for the attack, which occurred Wednesday. A senior U.S. official said information suggested that a bomber walked into a gym facility at Forward Operating Base Chapman -- in Khost Province, near the border of Pakistan -- and detonated bombs in a suicide vest.

It is not known how the bomber got past security.

"This attack will be avenged through successful, aggressive counterterrorism operations," the intelligence official vowed.

Former CIA official Robert Richer called it "the greatest loss of life for the Central Intelligence Agency since the Beirut Embassy bombing" in 1983, which killed eight agents.
"These brave Americans were part of a long line of patriots who have made great sacrifices for their fellow citizens, and for our way of life," President Obama said in a written statement Thursday.

Rangudu · Post by **Rangudu** » 01 Jan 2010 07:36

This bombing of the CIA facility is almost surely a Haqqani network operation. This in turn means that there is an ISI hand for sure.

pgbhat · Post by **pgbhat** » 01 Jan 2010 07:48

India-Pakistan: military angle ---- Dr Farrukh Saleem

To be certain, time -- and money -- is on India's side. Composite dialogue among civilians means little -- if anything at all. What is needed is a strategic dialogue. How can India be persuaded to pull back its offensive formations? What would Pakistan give in return? Pakistan cannot continue to race a race that it cannot win.

pgbhat · Post by **pgbhat** » 01 Jan 2010 08:01

WKK Alert

Peace now with Aman ki Asha ---- Shafqat Mahmood

It is the people of the region and particularly of India and Pakistan that have suffered because our already meagre resources were diverted towards warfare at the cost of human development. Lack of mutual trade and commerce also put a lid on a huge potential of common good between the countries. While Pakistan has lost more because it has not been able to benefit from a vast and growing economy next door, India also has been denied a large and ready market in Pakistan.

The time has come to leave this legacy of hate and suspicion behind. While there are issues that will continue to divide us, there is much in common. There is a commonality of culture, cuisine and language, particularly between Pakistan and North India. There is a shared history that is not all of communal conflict. And, there are common challenges of poverty that call for a total focus on improving the human condition.

It is in this context that the initiative for peace, jointly undertaken by two leading media groups in Pakistan and India, is so welcome. The Jang group in Pakistan and the Times of India group in India have joined hands to promote peace between both countries.

This initiative is focused on mobilising popular pressure for peace on the establishment of both countries. The campaign for ‘Aman ki Asha’ is the first time in the chequered history of the subcontinent that major media groups in the two countries have decided to launch a concerted push for peace. The intention is not to suggest solutions. That is for the governments of the two countries to work out. This initiative seeks to create conducive environment and enabling conditions for a peace dialogue to succeed.

This is not a small breakthrough. Given the hardening of positions after the Mumbai massacre and particularly the anti-Pakistan tone of the Indian media, a call for peace by the largest Indian media group is in itself a significant development. This group has the largest circulation English newspaper in India, a widely watched television channel and a host of other publications. Its access to the Indian establishment and its ability to mobilise popular support gives it a unique ability to create the right atmosphere for peace.

The Jang group is also the largest media group in Pakistan and its ability to contribute to peace between India and Pakistan cannot be underestimated. Getting a major Indian group to partner it in this endeavour is a tremendous success for this group.

As a first step a major trade and industry conference is being organised in Karachi in February, in which the largest business houses of India and Pakistan are participating. The concerned ministries from both countries will also be represented, opening a possible door for more interactions in the future. This raises the possibility of a major breakthrough in trade negotiations between the two countries. On the Indian side, a week-long literary and cultural activity is planned in January which will include participants from Pakistan.

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 01 Jan 2010 08:16

Prem wrote:http://www.financialnewsusa.com/news/a- ... e-official

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2m85mQ144mo
A suicide bomber struck inside a U.S. base in Afghanistan, killing at least eight Americans. As David Martin reports, investigators are trying to determine how the bomber got onto the base.

Afghan Bombing Inside Job?

Christina Fair

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 01 Jan 2010 08:16

="pgbhat"]India-Pakistan: military angle ---- Dr Farrukh Saleem
quote]To be certain, time -- and money -- is on India's side. Composite dialogue among civilians means little -- if anything at all. What is needed is a strategic dialogue. How can India be persuaded to pull back its offensive formations? What would Pakistan give in return? Pakistan cannot continue to race a race that it cannot win.

But Pakistan is a ideological and security state . The small economic and social cost of becoming International begger is nothing for the great Arab,Irani, Afghani and half Britani descendent Pakistinian extra-martial race . Then what about Jaguar vein J&K=Joking and Kidding.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 01 Jan 2010 08:20

Rangudu wrote:This bombing of the CIA facility is almost surely a Haqqani network operation. This in turn means that there is an ISI hand for sure.

Absolutely. There can be no doubt at all. The Khost province is a Haqqani stronghold. When the Haqqanis are involved in as daring an operation as penetrating the US base and targetting a bunch of CIA operatives, the ISID could not have been far behind.

The Bear Trap, after many years, has become the Eagle Trap and with what vengeance !

pgbhat · Post by **pgbhat** » 01 Jan 2010 08:23

^ The woman base chief died. It is a huge blow to unkil. 400% Haqqani network.

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 01 Jan 2010 08:27

January 1, 2010
CIA caught in dirty and secretive war against al-Qaeda on Afghan border
Tom Coghlan: analysis
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/w ... 972940.ece

The deaths of seven CIA agents in Khost province have brought into the limelight the secretive and dirty war being fought by America’s intelligence agencies — and the Taleban and al-Qaeda — in the border regions of Afghanistan and Pakistan.

Forward Operating Base Chapman, and others like it along the border, are the forward edge of American military and intelligence counter-terrorism operations, aimed principally at hunting down senior figures in al-Qaeda and their allies in the Taleban hiding in the lawless tribal belt.

The CIA’s main strike weapons are the drones that loiter over the border areas 24 hours a day, watching and listening to telephone networks. While the drones provide surveillance and electronic intelligence and carry out strikes, human intelligence is far harder to acquire among remote communities suspicious of any outsider.

Then there are the night raids against suspected insurgent and al-Qaeda linked leaders. It was an operation by what are euphemistically called “other government agencies” that was alleged to have killed a number of students in Kunar province on Saturday, causing widespread anger in Afghanistan.

RELATED LINKS
Darkest day of the Afghan war for CIA
CIA-led night raids such as this have proved controversial before. A UN-commissioned report last year from Philip Alston, director of the New York Centre for Human Rights, claimed that such raids raised issues under humanitarian and international law.

The report criticised the “opaque” use of ultra-secretive CIA units operating alongside irregular Afghan militias such as the Pashai.

Professor Alston complained that many raids were “composed of Afghans but with a handful, at most, of international people directing it” and were “not accountable to any international military authority”.

Such units answer directly to the Pentagon rather than to the Nato command structure, and their operations are often so secretive that even other US forces operating nearby are sometimesmay be unaware of them.

Such has been the effectiveness of strikes on the terrorist command structure that there are persistent reports of al-Qaeda leadership figures relocating to urban areas in Pakistan and shifting the focus of their operations towards Yemen, Somalia and other areas of the Horn of Africa.

The Taleban have infinitely smaller resources. But their successful strike within a CIA base indicates that their own intelligence operation can also hit its mark.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 01 Jan 2010 08:31

I wonder how this is any different that that favourite whipping boy of western govts and their media - russian SF untethered units and their associated pro-moscow chechen militias.

I suspect a audit will reveal all sorts of illegalities like torture chambers, unmarked graves and such.

"rendition" to torture cells in astonishing places like lithuania has been exposed.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 01 Jan 2010 08:33

pgbhat wrote:India-Pakistan: military angle ---- Dr Farrukh Saleem
What would Pakistan give in return?

Dr. Farrukh Saleem is a rare breed of more reasonable guys in Pakistan. But, the question he asks cannot be answered by any Pakistani because that would cut at the very root of the existence of Pakistan.

RamaP · Post by **RamaP** » 01 Jan 2010 08:37

The CIA base bombing does indeed looks like a ISI+Haqqani job. It is a huge blow for Uncle as assets like base chief would have had a very good intelligence gathering about the region and the Afghan Taliban as well. Perhaps the increasing frequency of National Bird attacks in North Waziristan would have forced the Haqqani brothers to attack this CIA base and thereby put Uncle on the backfoot. This might also have been a message by the ISI to Uncle to behave himself by curbing the activities of Xe guys inside TSPA. An aftermath of this CIA base attack would be depleted HumInt on the ground.

Would be interesting to see as to how Uncle hits back at TSPA for revenge. Will Uncle use Xe/CIA black Ops or will Uncle usher in B 52s? We must remember what happened in Fallujah in 2004 when 4 American "Contractors" were brutally murdered. In retaliation, Uncle literally turned Fallujah into a glass parking lot.

pgbhat · Post by **pgbhat** » 01 Jan 2010 08:44

^
Bakis have nooks and elites have no fear of retribution, they have millions of abduls ready to don soosai vest. Interesting how unkil will step up actions now.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 01 Jan 2010 09:51

TOI has started its tiresome "Aman" campaign again with a full 3 pages in todays issue in collab with Jang group.

rhetorical questions like why do we hate pakistan? why we dont close the chapter (whatever that means)? big-B getting ready for the ad .... loathesome lying crap of a campaign.

the wine and kababs must have been good at the WKK IHC/IIC annual soiree in Dilli for this to emerge so fast.

archan · Post by **archan** » 01 Jan 2010 09:53

Singha wrote:TOI has started its tiresome "Aman" campaign again with a full 3 pages in todays issue in collab with Jang group.

rhetorical questions like why do we hate pakistan? why we dont close the chapter (whatever that means)? big-B getting ready for the ad .... loathesome lying crap of a campaign.

the wine and kababs must have been good at the WKK IHC/IIC annual soiree in Dilli for this to emerge so fast.

Could it be all just a commercial venture? I mean people who need to sell stuff will sell it no matter what.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 01 Jan 2010 09:55

Zardari speaks his mind

He said political forces wanted civilian control over the Inter-Services Intelligence (ISI), but the premier intelligence agency would remain under military control for the time being. {which is a tacit declaration that political forces are powerless against the military}

Zardari said the establishment was a mindset that worked in different ways, and it was a name given to perception. “The establishment sometimes appears in the shape of [former president Farooq Ahmad Khan] Leghari … on other [occasions] as [retired bureaucrat] Roedad Khan,” he elaborated.

The president said he possessed “political weapons” – which he would use when he felt necessary. {One of those weapons is 'Sind'}

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 01 Jan 2010 10:03

That ToI campaign 'Aman ki Asha' is a very dangerous attempt. Yes, some naivety and mostly commercial interests could be behind this. But, it will be certainly a tool used by the ISI to infiltrate and shape the already soft Indian mindset into even softer, absorbing blows after blows.

pgbhat · Post by **pgbhat** » 01 Jan 2010 10:10

^
So basically ISI will invest unkil's money in shaping Indian elite minds to be sympathetic to Pakistan's cause and keep sending soosai bombers. Create a whole new generation of WKKs

sum · Post by **sum** » 01 Jan 2010 10:18

RamaP wrote:The CIA base bombing does indeed looks like a ISI+Haqqani job. It is a huge blow for Uncle as assets like base chief would have had a very good intelligence gathering about the region and the Afghan Taliban as well. Perhaps the increasing frequency of National Bird attacks in North Waziristan would have forced the Haqqani brothers to attack this CIA base and thereby put Uncle on the backfoot. This might also have been a message by the ISI to Uncle to behave himself by curbing the activities of Xe guys inside TSPA. An aftermath of this CIA base attack would be depleted HumInt on the ground.

Would be interesting to see as to how Uncle hits back at TSPA for revenge. Will Uncle use Xe/CIA black Ops or will Uncle usher in B 52s? We must remember what happened in Fallujah in 2004 when 4 American "Contractors" were brutally murdered. In retaliation, Uncle literally turned Fallujah into a glass parking lot.

But, would the ISID dare to support such a high profile attack since there is no greater danger than Unkil scorned?

After all, Unkil isnt India which would just grin and bear loss of countless security forces and just mouth some inane dialogues and forget the thing ( like in Kabul embassy bombing case)

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 01 Jan 2010 10:28

This op-ed in Jang sets the context for 'Aman ki Asha'

It was also natural that arbitrary lines drawn on a hitherto undivided landscape would leave many issues unresolved. Kashmir is one such festering sore that has deeply coloured relations between the two countries. In Pakistan, it led to narratives of being wronged, of bias and injustice.

India’s involvement in the separation of East Pakistan further embittered an already sour atmosphere. In Kashmir the path of war in 1948, 65, and 99 did not get any of the countries nearer to its objective. India continues to have an uneasy, tenuous hold on the territory and Pakistan is nowhere close to realizing what it considers is its rightful claim.

The resentment that this conflict and the saga of East Pakistan generated also had an impact on what are normal interactions between neighbouring countries. {So, it is all India's problem. That's the mindset with which Pakistan is launching the 'Aman ki Asha'}

The Jang group has held wide consultations with the government, with the second major party in the country, the PML N, and with the MQM and others. All have supported the initiative. More importantly in the Pakistani context, the Jang group has also interacted with the military establishment and received its support for the campaign. {Clear sign that the ISID will use the initiative}

I am informed that in India the Times of India group has also interacted with the ruling party and obtained the support of Prime Minister Manmohan Singh.

Given the hardening of positions after the Mumbai massacre and particularly the anti-Pakistan tone of the Indian media, a call for peace by the largest Indian media group is in itself a significant development. {So, Times Now and Arnab Goswami will sing different tunes now or Arnab Goswami will be removed to accommodate 'Aman ki Asha' ?}This group has the largest circulation English newspaper in India, a widely watched television channel and a host of other publications. Its access to the Indian establishment and its ability to mobilise popular support gives it a unique ability to create the right atmosphere for peace.

As a first step a major trade and industry conference is being organised in Karachi in February, in which the largest business houses of India and Pakistan are participating.

What this campaign aims to achieve is mobilising popular support for peace.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 01 Jan 2010 10:39

From SUCH GUP of TFT

Very interesting

The “Get Hubby” operation is in full swing, with a new petition about to make its way to the highest bench in the land. Our mole says it is to be filed by a larger-than-life legal eagle who is known for taking up causes dear to those who roam the corridors of power. The substance of the petition is likely to focus on Hubby’s ineligibility to hold high office, leading to disqualification. Our mole says the petitioner will probably rely on the late unlamented Tyrant Terry Thomas’ Islamic provisions, so conspicuously a part of the earlier judgment, which go on about the necessity of a holder of public office being “ameen”, righteous, of good character etc. The larger-than-life lawyer has confided to a friend that the petition has been drafted and is ready to be lodged at the wink of an important eye.

Been there, done that

Plans are afoot for the post-Hubby dispensation. Three names are doing the rounds – one is Mush’s former premier ye olde faithful Mr J (his greatest recommendation being he goes home quietly when asked to do so), the Mir of a Thousand Seed Queens and the Makedoom of Halleluja. The latter two are exalted Sindhis and Pipliyas of many years’ standing. Ideally, “they” want to keep parliament going and since Gill on the Hill has refused to play ball, the search is on for an alternative from within. Cleary, someone is trying to prevent the Sindh card from being played in the post-Hubby era. Will someone please tell “them” this is a tired old formula which never works? We’ve been there, done that sooooooo many times.

Exalted piece of furniture

The Charter of Democracy signed by the late Big Ben and The Man of Steel in London some years ago, says, amongst other good things, that the highest bench in the land will represent all provinces equally. This is all the more necessary given the present composition of that exalted piece of furniture on which presently sit 17 honourable adjudicators, not one of whom is an ethnic Sindhi or Baloch . The majority are of Punjabi ethnic origin, whatever their domiciles, with a sprinkling of Urdu speaking Mohajirs.

Who’s the author?

Mr BA has been saying that he’s the author of Hubby ’s defiant speech in Garhi Khuda Bukhsh. Insiders disagree; they hold that whoever wrote it has read Shakespeare for it was “vintage après Caeser by Mark Antony”.

RamaP · Post by **RamaP** » 01 Jan 2010 10:53

sum wrote:
RamaP wrote:The CIA base bombing does indeed looks like a ISI+Haqqani job. It is a huge blow for Uncle as assets like base chief would have had a very good intelligence gathering about the region and the Afghan Taliban as well. Perhaps the increasing frequency of National Bird attacks in North Waziristan would have forced the Haqqani brothers to attack this CIA base and thereby put Uncle on the backfoot. This might also have been a message by the ISI to Uncle to behave himself by curbing the activities of Xe guys inside TSPA. An aftermath of this CIA base attack would be depleted HumInt on the ground.

Would be interesting to see as to how Uncle hits back at TSPA for revenge. Will Uncle use Xe/CIA black Ops or will Uncle usher in B 52s? We must remember what happened in Fallujah in 2004 when 4 American "Contractors" were brutally murdered. In retaliation, Uncle literally turned Fallujah into a glass parking lot.
But, would the ISID dare to support such a high profile attack since there is no greater danger than Unkil scorned?

After all, Unkil isnt India which would just grin and bear loss of countless security forces and just mouth some inane dialogues and forget the thing ( like in Kabul embassy bombing case)

One cannot say as to how many people in the Paki elite establishment knew about this CIA base attack. It could be possible that a rogue ISI faction, in collusion with the TTP could have hatched this. If that is the case, then we might think about the possible aftermath of this attack. Uncle realizes that it has received a body blow on ground. Uncle is already suspicious about the Pakjabi double game on ground. This CIA base attack pushes uncle to the brink. So finally, either Uncle will hit back with Drones/B52s or would initiate a bloody secret war with CIA hired mercenaries(Xe black ops). Either way, the Pakjabi elite would be hit hard and the TTP would gain further ground (political support) in Punjabi heartlands/rural lands. And finally, Zardari's political weapons would turn out to be the last straw.

RamaP · Post by **RamaP** » 01 Jan 2010 10:57

As far as the Aman campaign by the TOI is concerned, it looks more like a brand building campaign rather than a genuine initiative at peace. Anyways, it looks like wine sipping elites from either side of border would meet and talk sweet nothings about peace, so that wouldn't change things a lot on the ground.

Anujan · Post by **Anujan** » 01 Jan 2010 11:25

SSridhar wrote:From SUCH GUP of TFT

Very interesting

Plans are afoot for the post-Hubby dispensation. Three names are doing the rounds – one is Mush’s former premier ye olde faithful Mr J, the Mir of a Thousand Seed Queens and the Makedoom of Halleluja.

Mr J = Jamali - thats easy.
Makedoom of Halleluja = Makhdoom Ameen Faheem (Makhdoom = Makhdoom; Ameen = Halleluja)
Mir of a Thousand Seed Queens = Mir Hazar Khan Bijarani (Bij = see, rani = queen, Hazar = thousand)

archan · Post by **archan** » 01 Jan 2010 11:31

wow, that is sharp, Anujan.

arun · Post by **arun** » 01 Jan 2010 11:34

The complete text of Nicholas Schmidle’s article that appeared in the New Republic on the “squat, middle-aged”, “Ann Coulter of Pakistan”, Dr. Shireen Mazari, is available here:

Pakistan Media Watch

amol.p · Post by **amol.p** » 01 Jan 2010 11:45

UN to withdraw staff from Pakistan

The United Nation is to withdraw a quarter of its international staff from Pakistan as the country descends further into violence.UN security managers are seeking a reduction f up to 30 percent of its 250 international staff working in Pakistan.

Since spring they have also handed out some $475 million in emergency humanitarian aid in northern Pakistan.....

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/w ... 973145.ece

ArmenT · Post by **ArmenT** » 01 Jan 2010 11:51

First national bird sighting for the new year.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/8436873.stm

Missiles fired from a US drone aircraft have killed at least three people in north-west Pakistan, reports say.

Pakistani security officials say the pilotless aircraft fired two missiles at a moving car in the tribal region of North Waziristan.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 01 Jan 2010 12:13

big-B is on TIMES NOW at present going on and on about "we are basically the same people, we are so alike, our language, the food we eat...."

arnab goswami's days are numbered as this has approval from the very top of Times group surely. its a neat trick to take out the only semi-hawkish tv channel - ek goli do shikar.

sanjaychoudhry · Post by **sanjaychoudhry** » 01 Jan 2010 12:21

Here is TOI's Aman ki Asha project. This message was printed on a full-page false cover of the paper on New Year day.

Love Pakistan

Feels odd to see those two words side by side doesn’t it?

Terror, hatred and fanaticism somehow sit more comfortably in our minds when we think of the other side of the border.

Words that we’ve been fed in daily doses over the last six decades/ And in greater doses over the last one year.

Shutting our minds to the undeniable truth that people across the border are above all, people. Like us.

So here’s the question. Is there any chance at all, that we could still raise a hand not in anger but greeting?

Depends on who raises the hand first, some of us would say. Also how, whisper a few others. But mostly, it boils down to one simple question.

Why?

Why must we do it? Why do we need them? Why don’t they first say sorrty for what they’ve done? And the answer is simple.

It is easier to say Hi than to say sorry. It’s shorter too.

Besides, there is no rule that says a book has to be closed before a new one is opened. Not even if it’s a history book.

So on the first day of this new year, we’re going make a start. Again.

With Aman ki Asha. A brave, new people-to-people initiative by The Times of India and Pakistan’s Jang Group to bring the people of two fine nations closer together. Culturally, emotionally and peacefully.

Starting with a series of cross-border cultural interactions, business seminars, music and literary festivals and citizen meets that will give the bonds of humanity a chance to survive outside the battlefield of politics, terrorism and fundamentalism.

In the hope that one day, words like Pakistan, India and Love will not seem impossible in the same sentence.

Aman Ki Asha
An Indo-Pak Peace Project
The First Step

This is a pernicious attempt by rabidly anti-national Indian leftists, communists and jholawalas who have infiltrated into English media in droves. India has absolutely nothing to gain by this while Pakistan will benefit immensely. It is designed to defang the Indians and encourage them to recieve blows from Pakistan repeatedly with inertness.

Basically, Pakistani government and the Goras who back them and arm them know very well that the apple cart -- Pakistan hitting India repeatedly through terror -- can be upset once India makes up its mind to hit back and pay in the same coin. This "south Asian" business and "both are essentially the same people" campaigns are funded by the Goras in India to thwart exactly this possibility. They use TOI and Rediff for this purpose where they have made strategic investments to have editorial control.

It is stupid to think that peace between two countries depends on the goodwill of the two peoples, one of whom is on the recieving end of bomb blasts and shootings orchestrated by the other.

The people and their feelings do not matter at all in these things. It is the governments which drive these as a matter of strategy. The problem lies in the Pakistani ruling junta and its Islamic fanatacism, violence and terror as instruments of foriegn policy. The TOIlet's communist editors and deranged owner wants to hide this basic fact from ordinary Indians.

Only idiots can think that these kind of issues can be solved by westernised elites of two countries listening to ghazals together in five star hotels. This is a case where common people have more common sense than the "intellectuals" which have appointed themselves as thought leaders of the Indian society.

TOI is an American mouthpiece. Most of this pacifism business -- peace at all costs with Muslims and Pakistsan -- has been orchestrated by the Anglo Americans in India, right from their propping up of Gandhi and Nehru. Today, they are using Indian leftists -- the quintessential anti-nationals -- as useful idiots in this game. The idea is to demilitarize the Hindu society completely. This process started after 1857 war with propping up Gandhi to preach non-violence to the victims and the colonised. This TOI campaign is an extension of the same process by the same hostile race.

pgbhat · Post by **pgbhat** » 01 Jan 2010 12:27

Why must we do it? Why do we need them? Why don’t they first say sorry for what they’ve done? And the answer is simple.

It is easier to say Hi than to say sorry. It’s shorter too.

Besides, there is no rule that says a book has to be closed before a new one is opened. Not even if it’s a history book.

and this passes off as intellectual.

archan · Post by **archan** » 01 Jan 2010 12:28

Someone should ask them clearly, do they propose giving up Kashmir or do their friends in Pakistan do?

Inder Sharma · Post by **Inder Sharma** » 01 Jan 2010 12:31

RamaP wrote:As far as the Aman campaign by the TOI is concerned, it looks more like a brand building campaign rather than a genuine initiative at peace. Anyways, it looks like wine sipping elites from either side of border would meet and talk sweet nothings about peace, so that wouldn't change things a lot on the ground.

If I am not mistaken, the Chairman of Jang group is also a key member of the Nazariya-e-Pakistan council, a Zia promoted group to ensure that aam-abdul remains a rabid islamist and a potential suicide bomber through and through.

Also, this media house occupies the far-right islamist placement in the paki media, and provides employment to Ahmed Qureshi, Zahid Hamid and Jalebi types.

The chairman of this group had also vowed to visit Delhi on a Paki Tank, leading the ghazwa armor thrust.

All of these are indicators that this group is an extremist media extension of ISI-Paki Army thinking, and is known to do their bidding. (This media house is at the forefront of the current campaign against Zardari).

My hamid-hat tells me that this ‘Aman campaign’ is an ISI envisaged and proxied campaign aimed at duping the gullible Indians.

The resultant conclusion is that:

a) The Paki-army is seriously desirous of peace (however unlikely)
b) They want to prepare the desh for another 26/11 without being seen as the deliberate perpetrator.
c) They want to reduce the threat perception from the India, since they perceive the western border is about to turn hot.

Of course, all this is based on my premise that Jang-group chairman is part of Nazariya-e-Pakistan council, and the entire analogy may be incorrect if the premise is faulty.