CT & COIN Operations in India: News, Images and Discussion

Aditya G · Post by **Aditya G** » 06 Jan 2010 23:00

SRINAGAR, KASHMIR, INDIA - JANUARY 06: A policeman points as he takes position on a street behind a vehicle during a gun battle between police and suspected militants on January 6, 2010 on the outskirts in Srinagar, India. Reports state that at least one police officer has been killed and as many as three civilians wounded when as many as two suspected militants opened gun fire and lobbed grenades in the main market of Srinagar, the summer capital of Indian administered Kashmir. The militants had entered hotel and had taken position inside which is surrounded by Indian armed forces. A pro-Pakistan militant group, Jamiat-ul-Mujahedin, claims it was behind the assault.

SRINAGAR, KASHMIR, INDIA - JANUARY 06: Police look on during a gun battle between police and suspected militants on January 6, 2010 in Srinagar, India. Reports state that at least one police officer has been killed and as many as three civilians wounded when as many as two suspected militants opened gun fire and lobbed grenades in the main market of Srinagar, the summer capital of Indian administered Kashmir. The militants had entered hotel and had taken position inside which is surrounded by Indian armed forces. A pro-Pakistan militant group, Jamiat-ul-Mujahedin, claims it was behind the assault.

SRINAGAR, KASHMIR, INDIA - JANUARY 06: Police direct media back during a gun battle between police and suspected militants on January 6, 2010 in Srinagar, India. Reports state that at least one police officer has been killed and as many as three civilians wounded when as many as two suspected militants opened gun fire and lobbed grenades in the main market of Srinagar, the summer capital of Indian administered Kashmir. The militants had entered hotel and had taken position inside which is surrounded by Indian armed forces. A pro-Pakistan militant group, Jamiat-ul-Mujahedin, claims it was behind the assault.

SRINAGAR, KASHMIR, INDIA - JANUARY 06: Policemen take position on a street behind a vehicle during a gun battle between police and suspected militants on January 6, 2010 in Srinagar, India. Reports state that at least one police officer has been killed and as many as three civilians wounded when as many as two suspected militants opened gun fire and lobbed grenades in the main market of Srinagar, the summer capital of Indian administered Kashmir. The militants had entered hotel and had taken position inside which is surrounded by Indian armed forces. A pro-Pakistan militant group, Jamiat-ul-Mujahedin, claims it was behind the assault.

SRINAGAR, KASHMIR, INDIA - JANUARY 06: Policemen take position on a street behind a vehicle during a gun battle between police and suspected militants on January 6, 2010 on the outskirts in Srinagar, India. Reports state that at least one police officer has been killed and as many as three civilians wounded when as many as two suspected militants opened gun fire and lobbed grenades in the main market of Srinagar, the summer capital of Indian administered Kashmir. The militants had entered hotel and had taken position inside which is surrounded by Indian armed forces. A pro-Pakistan militant group, Jamiat-ul-Mujahedin, claims it was behind the assault.

The body of an Indian policeman lies on the road during a gun battle in Srinagar January 6, 2010. An Indian policeman was killed and eight were wounded on Wednesday in a gun battle between soldiers and separatists in the heart of Kashmir's main city, police and witnesses said. The fighting took place in Lal Chowk, the main business centre at the heart of Srinagar, Kashmir's summer capital, and fighting was continuing, police said.

An Indian policeman and a cameraman run during a gunbattle in Srinagar, India, Wednesday, Jan. 6, 2010. Two suspected insurgents hurled hand grenades and fired at a group of government forces in a crowded shopping district in the Indian-administered portion of Kashmir on Wednesday, killing at least one police officer and wounding three civilians, police said.

Indian policemen carry their weapons during a gunbattle between soldiers and separatists in Srinagar January 6, 2010. An Indian policeman was killed and eight were wounded on Wednesday during the clash in the heart of Kashmir's main city, police and witnesses said.

Aditya G · Post by **Aditya G** » 06 Jan 2010 23:13

It seems that the fallen policeman was dragged into safety by a hook ....

Also note the two stars on the helmet in the last pic

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 06 Jan 2010 23:29

Dont they have a sniper team here

Aditya G · Post by **Aditya G** » 06 Jan 2010 23:53

http://www.timesnow.tv/Terrorists-strik ... 335768.cms

According to Col Triphathi, PRO, CRPF operations are on between the militants and security forces. He added, “One militant is currently holed up in Punjab Hotel in Lal Chowk. Operations are on to flush out the militant from this hotel. There could be more number of militants hiding in the area. We are trying to ascertain their exact location. They could be heavily armed because they have hurled many numbers of grenades.”

Curious, would "Colonel" Tripathi be considered retired or deputed from the Army?

Raja Bose · Post by **Raja Bose** » 07 Jan 2010 01:26

Aditya G wrote:It seems that the fallen policeman was dragged into safety by a hook ....

Also note the two stars on the helmet in the last pic

Are those badges of rank on the helmet? During a encounter?!

I wonder why the fallen policeman is getting dragged with a grapnel hook - must have been in a zone of heavy fire.

Surya · Post by **Surya** » 07 Jan 2010 02:20

To this day and age there are those who still like to have their flashing batti and stars etc.

As my friend (with years in the valley) says - if a person who does that gets shot or blown - he deserves it

Dmurphy · Post by **Dmurphy** » 07 Jan 2010 09:19

That pic showing a van dragging the body of a dead jawan is disturbing. And what the hell is sticking to the tyres of the same van

Shameek · Post by **Shameek** » 07 Jan 2010 09:28

Dmurphy wrote:And what the hell is sticking to the tyres of the same van

Looks like a fire hydrant. Don't know why the van would be over it though.

K_Rohit · Post by **K_Rohit** » 07 Jan 2010 16:49

[quote="Aditya G

[/quote]

Is that a NSG/Marco I see in the far background? You can make out the black PASGT helmet and black uniform.

NehraA · Post by **NehraA** » 07 Jan 2010 17:19

Is that a NSG/Marco I see in the far background? You can make out the black PASGT helmet and black uniform.

he is a reporter for times now,

K_Rohit · Post by **K_Rohit** » 07 Jan 2010 17:51

AbhinavNehra wrote:
Is that a NSG/Marco I see in the far background? You can make out the black PASGT helmet and black uniform.
he is a reporter for times now,

my bad

atreya · Post by **atreya** » 07 Jan 2010 18:23

Dmurphy wrote:That pic showing a van dragging the body of a dead jawan is disturbing. And what the hell is sticking to the tyres of the same van

Observe the pic closely. I THINK that they are not dragging the body. The hook is not "entangled" or "attached" to any part of the body, is it? You may see it, if u observe it carefully. It may seem so, from this angle, but it is not so, IMO.
OR
If it is, as it seems, then I have another explanation (*guess alert!!*). Maybe, the truck is standstill, and there is someone inside the truck, who is pulling the body with the help of the hook. It would be unsafe, getting down, lifting the body, and taking it inside (the truck) in the midst of a gunbattle, right?

Aditya G · Post by **Aditya G** » 07 Jan 2010 23:06

SRINAGAR, INDIA - JANUARY 07: Indian policemen storm a hotel during a gun battle between Indian police and suspected militants on January 7, 2010 in Srinagar, Jammu and Kashmir, India. Two Pakistani trained militants were killed when Indian troops stormed a hotel on Thursday morning in Kashmir. Militants opened fire and lobbed grenades from inside the hotel where they took refuge on Wednesday for nearly 22 hours, police said.

Dmurphy · Post by **Dmurphy** » 07 Jan 2010 23:40

Here's a question. When terrorists get holed up for as long as 22 hours, are the Paras called for if they happen to be stationed in a near by town?

Craig Alpert · Post by **Craig Alpert** » 08 Jan 2010 00:11

PAGING RAYC...

Do the forces in Kashmir lack NVG?? Is there a reason why they always wait out till darkness disappears?? It seems MANY CT and COIN operations do not take off during the night time to which I'm inclined to think are due to the lack of Night vision goggles, and night scopes on board the fire arms.. After 26/11 wasn't there a plan to acquire these in sufficent quantity to make sure it does not hamper our effectivness?? They could have used the Rovers that you had posted a picture of couple of weeks earlier. It seems to me that they had the equpiment, but lack the numbers?? Appreciate the de-classified insight!

pgbhat · Post by **pgbhat** » 08 Jan 2010 00:56

Kashmir Gun Battle.

Aditya G · Post by **Aditya G** » 08 Jan 2010 08:14

ndian paramilitary soldiers look on as their colleagues unseen, enter a building where suspected rebels had taken shelter after an initial attack Wednesday during a gun battle in Srinagar, India, Thursday, Jan. 7, 2010. Government forces in Indian-controlled Kashmir on Thursday ended a more than 20-hour-long gun battle with suspected rebels by killing the two attackers, police said.

An Indian paramilitary soldier asks for help as he prepares to try to move the body of an Indian police officer after he was shot during a gun battle with militants in Srinagar, India, Wednesday, Jan. 6, 2010. Two suspected insurgents hurled hand grenades and fired at a group of government forces in a crowded shopping district in the Indian-administered portion of Kashmir on Wednesday, killing at least one police officer and wounding three civilians, police said. (AP Photo) ** INDIA OUT.

Indian paramilitary soldiers enter the building where suspected rebels had taken shelter after an initial attack Wednesday during a gun battle in Srinagar, India, Thursday, Jan. 7, 2010. Government forces in Indian-controlled Kashmir on Thursday ended a more than 20-hour-long gun battle with suspected rebels by killing the two attackers, police said.

An Indian paramilitary soldier enters the building where suspected rebels had taken shelter after an initial attack Wednesday during a gun battle in Srinagar, India, Thursday, Jan. 7, 2010. Government forces in Indian-controlled Kashmir on Thursday ended a more than 20-hour-long gun battle with suspected rebels by killing the two attackers, police said.

Indian paramilitary soldiers enter the building where suspected rebels had taken shelter after an initial attack Wednesday during a gun battle in Srinagar, India, Thursday, Jan. 7, 2010. Government forces in Indian-controlled Kashmir on Thursday ended a more than 20-hour-long gun battle with suspected rebels by killing the two attackers, police said.

An Indian paramilitary soldier runs during a gun battle with militants in Srinagar, India, Wednesday, Jan. 6, 2010. Two suspected insurgents hurled hand grenades and fired at a group of government forces in a crowded shopping district in the Indian-administered portion of Kashmir on Wednesday, killing at least one police officer and wounding three civilians, police said. (AP Photo) ** INDIA OUT.

An Indian police man looks on from inside a bullet ridden building where suspected rebels had taken shelter after an initial attack Wednesday during a gun battle in Srinagar, India, Thursday, Jan. 7, 2010. Government forces in Indian-controlled Kashmir on Thursday ended a more than 20-hour-long gun battle with suspected rebels by killing the two attackers, police said.

An Indian policeman looks through a pair of binoculars during a gun battle in Srinagar January 7, 2010. Separatist militants holed up in a hotel lobbed grenades and opened fire on security forces for a second straight day on Thursday in Indian Kashmir's main city of Srinagar, prompting a mass rescue operation of residents. The armed militants forced their way into the hotel on Wednesday, killing a policeman in their first attack in a year in Kashmir's summer capital. A second man died of injuries in hospital and nine people have been injured.

An Indian policeman carries a rocket propelled grenade launcher during a gun battle with militants holing up in a hotel in Srinagar January 7, 2010. Separatist militants holed up in a hotel lobbed grenades and opened fire on security forces for a second straight day on Thursday in Indian Kashmir's main city of Srinagar, prompting a mass rescue operation of residents. The armed militants forced their way into the hotel on Wednesday, killing a policeman in their first attack in a year in Kashmir's summer capital. A second man died of injuries in hospital and nine people have been injured.

Indian policemen look out from the window of the hotel where suspected militants had holed up in Srinagar January 7, 2010. Separatist militants holed up in a hotel lobbed grenades and opened fire on security forces for a second straight day on Thursday in Indian Kashmir's main city of Srinagar, prompting a mass rescue operation of residents. The armed militants forced their way into the hotel on Wednesday, killing a policeman in their first attack in a year in Kashmir's summer capital. A second man died of injuries in hospital and nine people have been injured.

SRINAGAR, INDIA - JANUARY 07: Firefighters extinguish a hotel fire after Indian policemen after a gun battle between Indian police and suspected militants on January 7, 2010 in Srinagar, Jammu and Kashmir, India. Two Pakistani trained militants were killed when Indian troops stormed a hotel on Thursday morning in Kashmir. Militants opened fire and lobbed grenades from inside the hotel where they took refuge on Wednesday for nearly 22 hours, police said.

SRINAGAR, INDIA - JANUARY 07: A fire engulfs a hotel following a gun battle between Indian police suspected militants on January 7, 2010 in Srinagar, Jammu and Kashmir, India. Two Pakistani trained militants were killed when Indian troops stormed a hotel on Thursday morning in Kashmir. Militants opened fire and lobbed grenades from inside the hotel where they took refuge on Wednesday for nearly 22 hours, police said.

Aditya G · Post by **Aditya G** » 08 Jan 2010 08:26

Dmurphy wrote:Here's a question. When terrorists get holed up for as long as 22 hours, are the Paras called for if they happen to be stationed in a near by town?

A question in reply should be - why do we need the paras for this operation? The city is a responsibility of the CRPF and JKP. As you can see they have the methods and firearms to take care of the terrorists. Army/RR have their hands full with their own AOR ...

However, a valid question could be as to what can be done to improve the 'performance' of the CRPF QRT station in Srinagar?

I have suggested before that the QRT in Srinagar for such incidents be replaced by a NSG contingent. his would lead to higher 'utilisation' of the NSG as the frequency of attacks (terrorist attacks, gets holed up in bdg, wants to die) is much higher in Srinagar than other cities.

------

There are some "numbers" that are relevant to the situation in J&K:

1. Number of terror incidents in a year
2. Number of terrorists inside J&K
3. Number of infiltration attempts
4. Number of successful infiltrators
5. Number of terrorists in camps in PoK

It would be nice if we could gather all periodic reports and arrive at a trend. Latest snapshot here:

http://www.dailyexcelsior.com/web1/10ja ... date.htm#1

LeT terrorists in Srinagar were in touch with Pak handlers

NEW DELHI : The Lashker-e-Taiba terrorists, who were killed by security forces during the siege at Lal Chawk in Srinagar, were in constant touch with their handlers in Pakistan when they were holed up inside a hotel there.

According to highly-placed sources in the Union Home Ministry, nearly 700 terrorists, half of them foreign mercenaries, are active in Jammu and Kashmir.

They said some more attacks were expected to take place as the holed up militants at the hotel in Lal Chowk area had communicated the same to their handlers in Pakistan, the sources said.

According to the official data available with the Home Ministry, 413 infiltration attempts were made from across the border during which 93 terrorists were killed while 110 managed to sneak in.

Out of the 110 who had infiltrated, 70 per cent were foreign militants while the remaining locals.

The attacks in Srinagar was a result of shifting of focus of the police forces towards Jammu, which is the winter capital of the state, a senior official of the Home Ministry said. (PTI)

Shameek · Post by **Shameek** » 08 Jan 2010 09:32

J&K Police women trained in COIN operations.

sum · Post by **sum** » 08 Jan 2010 09:45

According to the official data available with the Home Ministry, 413 infiltration attempts were made from across the border during which 93 terrorists were killed while 110 managed to sneak in.

Out of the 110 who had infiltrated, 70 per cent were foreign militants while the remaining locals.

Amazingly precise info!!!

Prabu · Post by **Prabu** » 08 Jan 2010 17:08

Aditya G wrote:
Dmurphy wrote:Here's a question. When terrorists get holed up for as long as 22 hours, are the Paras called for if they happen to be stationed in a near by town?
I have suggested before that the QRT in Srinagar for such incidents be replaced by a NSG contingent. his would lead to higher 'utilisation' of the NSG as the frequency of attacks (terrorist attacks, gets holed up in bdg, wants to die) is much higher in Srinagar than other cities.

[/quote]

Yes very relevant question !!
1) why 22 hours to nuteralise TWO terorists ??
2) Why not engage NSG in J&K so that they can quickly nuteralise in just few hours ?
3) And also snippers ! In all english movies the very first (Quick action team!) response in case of a terrorist attack or a hostage situation is to deply SNIPERS in all the sorrounding buildings and outside the building in question !

Nihat · Post by **Nihat** » 08 Jan 2010 17:40

Pulwama encounter ends, 2 LeT men killed
8 Jan 2010, 1420 hrs IST

The second encounter in as many days has ended in valley on Friday (January , with forces gunning down two LeT militants in Pulwama after a four-hour-long encounter. The terrorists were holed up in a house in Pulwama's Andrusa village which falls under Pampore, and refused to lay down their arms and began firing at the Border Security Forces. The two were gunned down and have been identified as Altaf and Zafoor, both from the LeT according to Awantipura SP Basheer Khan.

Khan told TIMES NOW that, acting on specific information, police and the Army launched a combing operation in village Andrusa. As the security forces zeroed in, the militants, whose number could not be ascertained, opened fire at them prompting the security forces to retaliate.

"We laid out the cordon during the night and began our searches in the morning. During our searches the search parties came under fire and the search was stopped for some time while civilians were evacuated to safer places. Thereafter the terrorists were asked to lay down their arms and surrender but they continued to fire with their automatic weapons, which was retaliated against and in the melee the two terrorists got killed," he said, adding that Altaf had been known to be involved in several previous attacks including one car blast outside the central jail in Srinagar and an attack on a constable and an SPO in Pampore town in which the SPO was martyred.

"Likewise Zafoor was also involved in many past encounters and today we have been able to get rid of them," said Khan.

http://www.timesnow.tv/Pulwama-encounte ... 335901.cms

Someone mentioned in the posts above that when these pigs attack Security forces and manage to inflict casualties , usually the forces sniff them out within a week and ruthlessley slaughter them , how true was THAT !!!

Gaur · Post by **Gaur** » 08 Jan 2010 18:18

Prabu wrote: 1) why 22 hours to nuteralise TWO terorists ??
2) Why not engage NSG in J&K so that they can quickly nuteralise in just few hours ?
3) And also snippers ! In all english movies the very first (Quick action team!) response in case of a terrorist attack or a hostage situation is to deply SNIPERS in all the sorrounding buildings and outside the building in question !

1> I think the answer is only logical. When there is no hostage situation, it is only logical to elongate the operation. Unlike the CRPF and JKP, terrorists can have only very limited amount of supply and ammunition. So the longer the operation continues, the more advantage CRPF and JKP have. After 22 hrs, do you think the terrorists could have been able to take a nap? How much ammo and supplies would they have left? What would be their morale and mental state considering that for 22 hrs they know that sooner or later they are going to die?
Though a main reason is also that I doubt that CRPF and JKP have NVGs for night operations, I would think that even IA would have preferred to have a long drawn engagement.

2> Though it is a matter of opinion, I would rather not have an NSG base in J&K. Some have argued that their are more terrorist incidents in J&K than in other places. This is true. But it is also true that local security forces of J&k are "much" more capable in handling such situations than in other places. If NSG SAG personnel would have been from CPOs, I would have liked to have a NSG base in J&K. However, NSG SAG come from IA. So, setting up a new NSG base in J&K would only mean taking out the best of men already fighting in J&K and NE and shifting them to NSG. This would have further adverse effect on IA operations. If IA has men to spare, it could anyway be requested to send its men for operations in J&K cities. Why set up a new NSG base?

3> This is true. Though we do not know the layout of the operation area, it is safe to assume that in most such situations, snipers would be of great help. However, how can we be certain that snipers were not used in this operation? Wherever the snipers would have been stationed, surely the media photographers would not have been allowed. Near all the security forces pics that we see of any operation are those who are covering the outer perimeter.
The only reason if the snipers were indeed not deployed can be that CRPF and JKF does not have any (another reason may be that operation area did was not conductive to sniper action. But we cannot talk about that). Considering the kind of operations they engage in, I doubt that. But if it so, then it is a serious flaw and should be immediately rectified.

atreya · Post by **atreya** » 08 Jan 2010 18:45

1) why 22 hours to nuteralise TWO terorists ??

What would you say about the 26/11 Taj operations then?

Remember, the "two" terrorists aren't armed with lathis, and sitting like innocent children in an open park. They are "holed up" in a hotel, intent to kill and maybe die. Anyways, if there should be a ratio of no. of terrorists to time taken to eliminate them, then tackling infiltration bids by terrorists (numbering upto 5-6 at time) should take more than 7-8 days, right? Whereas, these operations are finished off in less than a day (usually, but not always) . Don't go by the numbers. Go by the terrain, weapons, operating conditions, etc.

Gaur · Post by **Gaur** » 08 Jan 2010 19:15

^^
Though you are correct in your assessment, it may not be fair to compare this situation to 26/11.
26/11 was a different scenario all together. Being a hostage rescue operation, it was crucial to nullify the situation ASAP. Though it took a long time, it was not by choice of NSG, but because of terrain and other factors.
However, the J&K operation that we are discussing is another matter. It was to the advantage of the security forces to drawn out the operation.

atreya · Post by **atreya** » 08 Jan 2010 19:39

You are right there, Gaur. I was just comparing Taj to illustrate that time taken to complete an operation is not directly affected by no. of enemies ONLY. As you pointed out, though, 26/11 operations were in another class altogether

Gaur · Post by **Gaur** » 08 Jan 2010 20:10

atreya wrote:......time taken to complete an operation is not directly affected by no. of enemies ONLY.........

So true. This is a fact that people do not seem to understand. People are fed with Hollywood movies where dozens(if not hundreds) of hostiles are downed by super duper TFTAs in a matter of minutes. People do not seem to appreciate the difference b/n fiction and reality. For an operation, it might be possible to neutralize dozens of hostiles using a handful of commandos in record time. But unlike Hollywood TFTA heroes, the men in reality have to consider the possibility of them dying. So their priority is hardly to show off but to "successfully" finish the operation while suffering "minimum possible causalities". If this takes 10 times more men and time, then so be it. So, in real life, the operations never go as per Hollywood movies. Hence the general public's disappointment.
People also fail to understand that in most cases it is to the advantage of the force doing the siege to have a drawn out operation.

atreya · Post by **atreya** » 08 Jan 2010 20:58

Yes. I remember, I was in college, with a couple of friends, on 28th November. I overheard someone saying "why is it taking so long for our forces to kill these ********"?, "they should blast away the whole hotel", etc. General public still feels that our armed forces are full of Rambos, when in reality, they are not.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 08 Jan 2010 21:15

Prabu wrote: 1) why 22 hours to nuteralise TWO terorists ??

Did you read the news items? The delay was to get all civilians out of the way into safety.

KiranM · Post by **KiranM** » 08 Jan 2010 22:15

My 2 cents on the Sniper issue. Given the built up areas, the max range with positive identification to shoot to kill is <300m. In such a scenario an ordinary Abdul with an Insas or Ak-47 would do. Assuming the CRPF and JKP have sufficient marksmanship training with their weapons.

Raja Bose · Post by **Raja Bose** » 09 Jan 2010 00:31

Prabu wrote:3) And also snippers ! In all english movies the very first (Quick action team!) response in case of a terrorist attack or a hostage situation is to deply SNIPERS in all the sorrounding buildings and outside the building in question !

Because beta, life is not a Hollywood movie. If you want to appreciate what goes into these ops - for a start go and read the NSG DG Ops.'s brieifing...it was posted in BR (possibly in this thread).

Marut · Post by **Marut** » 09 Jan 2010 02:01

edited.

hnair · Post by **hnair** » 09 Jan 2010 02:34

I saw with my very own eyes a Hollywood movie, where the current governor of California was fearlessly looking down a balcony during a siege, and shoots everyone that had a gun. Then he had this amazing wearable scanner that does a bio-scan to see if their asses are busted....

Why cant our Governors do that?

All they do is give competition to Ron Jeremy in grossing out the public

Anyways, back to COIN, one Mr Carl Gustav the Second is a Scandinavian without any holier-than-thou attitude and I like his grassroots level hard work in bringing peace to Cashmere. An icon in his own time.

Raja Bose · Post by **Raja Bose** » 09 Jan 2010 02:51

^^ Why are you forgetting Mr.Kalashnikov, hain?

Aditya G · Post by **Aditya G** » 09 Jan 2010 12:30

hnair wrote:Anyways, back to COIN, one Mr Carl Gustav the Second is a Scandinavian without any holier-than-thou attitude and I like his grassroots level hard work in bringing peace to Cashmere. An icon in his own time.

Shameek · Post by **Shameek** » 11 Jan 2010 19:57

http://beta.thehindu.com/news/national/ ... epage=true
Srinagar Hotel Siege Lessons
Some exerpts...

In the wake of November’s Lashkar-e-Taiba assault on Mumbai, police forces have begun raising special weapons and tactics units. For the most part, the units are being trained by officers with military backgrounds or foreign corporations. Not a single force in India, though, has deputed personnel to learn from success in Jammu and Kashmir -- or requested the services of instructors from the State.

Minutes after the fighting broke out, Inspector-General of Police Farooq Ahmed cut through red tape and reached out to two officers he felt were best qualified to lead the operation.
The Punjab Hotel was technically outside the jurisdiction of Mohammad Irshad, the Superintendent of Police for Srinagar’s southern region. But Mr. Irshad’s past experience as head of the crack counter-Special Operations Group in Srinagar, was drawn.
CRPF’s South Kashmir Deputy Inspector-General of Police Nalin Prabhat also had no official role in Srinagar. Like Mr. Irshad, though, Mr. Prabhat, is a battle-hardened veteran of counter-terrorism operations in Andhra Pradesh. He has served for over five years in Jammu and Kashmir. He brought in men from some of the CRPF’s best fighting units, the Tral-based 180 and 185 Battalions.
Improvisation played a key role in the success of the operation. As commandos began occupying the upper stories of the hotel, the terrorists opened fire through the wooden floor. Bullet-proof sheets were then unscrewed from CRPF patrol vehicles parked on the street and placed on the floor.

atreya · Post by **atreya** » 11 Jan 2010 20:09

Minutes after the fighting broke out, Inspector-General of Police Farooq Ahmed cut through red tape and reached out to two officers he felt were best qualified to lead the operation

Truly heartening, I must say

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 11 Jan 2010 20:18

some of the demands in this thread are funny, perhaps GOI should commission Sly stallion into the NSG and fly him out in a plane to wherever the action is.

most of these establishments in kashmiri towns seem to be built atleast partially of wood and house lot of flammable materials like clothing, food materials, false ceilings, LPG, firewood etc.

if heavy weapons like Shipons, demolition "schoolbag sized" charges and Carl gustavs were used, its likely the entire block of buildings would go up in flames and suffer severe damage.

only if some isolated hamlet type situation presents itself with less chance of collateral damage,
we see pix of IA bringing in heavy weapons.

I dont think the cannons of BMP2 have ever been used in urban areas in J&K or god forbid the
ZSU-23-4...that would chew up and spit out wooden structures like they didnt exist (and kill hundreds of innocent people trying to hide presumably)...a truly "Han/Hollywood solution"

would look very impressive on IBNlive.

Aditya G · Post by **Aditya G** » 11 Jan 2010 20:28

This article by Praveen Swami must be posted in full:

Experts who spoke to The Hindu said the Punjab Hotel operation was characterised by three features often lacking in Mumbai: leadership, experience and innovation.

Last week, Union Home Minister had generous words of praise for the police in Jammu and Kashmir.

In the wake of the killing of two terrorists who had occupied the Punjab Hotel in downtown Srinagar, P. Chidambaram applauded the Jammu and Kashmir Police (JKP) and the Central Reserve Police Force (CRPF) for a “brilliant operation, executed with great skill and patience.”

Mr. Chidambaram’s praise has been seen as a long overdue acknowledgment of the successes of the JKP and the CRPF -- but raises questions about the ongoing police modernisation programmes in several States.

In the wake of November’s Lashkar-e-Taiba assault on Mumbai, police forces have begun raising special weapons and tactics units. For the most part, the units are being trained by officers with military backgrounds or foreign corporations. Not a single force in India, though, has deputed personnel to learn from success in Jammu and Kashmir -- or requested the services of instructors from the State.

Getting it right

Like the five fidayeen units which participated in the attack on Mumbai, the Punjab Hotel team was made up of just two men. Having seized a building in a built-up urban area, the attackers were guided by handlers in Pakistan who used five cell phones -- two of them previously known to have been used to communicate with Lashkar field units in Jammu and Kashmir.

How is it that the Jammu and Kashmir Police succeeded in an environment where the Mumbai Police, military commandos, and the crack NSG struggled? (A myth being propagated on Black Tornado)

Experts who spoke to The Hindu said the Punjab Hotel operation was characterised by three features often lacking in Mumbai: leadership, experience and innovation.

Minutes after the fighting broke out, Inspector-General of Police Farooq Ahmed cut through red tape and reached out to two officers he felt were best qualified to lead the operation.

The Punjab Hotel was technically outside the jurisdiction of Mohammad Irshad, the Superintendent of Police for Srinagar’s southern region. But Mr. Irshad’s past experience as head of the crack counter-Special Operations Group in Srinagar, was drawn.

CRPF’s South Kashmir Deputy Inspector-General of Police Nalin Prabhat also had no official role in Srinagar. Like Mr. Irshad, though, Mr. Prabhat, is a battle-hardened veteran of counter-terrorism operations in Andhra Pradesh. He has served for over five years in Jammu and Kashmir. He brought in men from some of the CRPF’s best fighting units, the Tral-based 180 and 185 Battalions. (Why dont we have a ready QRT on standby in Srinagar?)

Improvisation played a key role in the success of the operation. As commandos began occupying the upper stories of the hotel, the terrorists opened fire through the wooden floor. Bullet-proof sheets were then unscrewed from CRPF patrol vehicles parked on the street and placed on the floor.

For the JKP, the Punjab Hotel operation was just one in a long series of largely successful urban operations.

In 2001, the Jaish-e-Mohammad staged another spectacular fidayeen attack at the Jammu and Kashmir Legislative Assembly -- a dry run, many experts believe, for the storming of Parliament House in New Delhi later that year. Thirty-nine people died when the Jaish set off a car-bomb outside the Legislative Assembly, and used the ensuing chaos to storm the building.

Despite the initial chaos, though, the JKP succeeded in rescuing the politicians inside the Assembly complex unhurt -- and in eliminating the terrorists.

Later attacks were also contained with minimal civilian casualties. In March, 2004, two Lashkar fidayeen attacked the offices of the Press Information Bureau and the Jammu and Kashmir Directorate of Information in Srinagar.

In April 2005, the Lashkar staged an attack on the Tourist Reception Centre in Srinagar, just a day before the facility was to see the first journey of the Srinagar-Muzaffarabad bus service. Just weeks later, in June, two fidayeen attacked the Dashnami Akhara Building. That November, four Lashkar fidayeen hit the Palladium Cinema complex, occupied by CRPF personnel.

Srinagar saw its last significant fidayeen-initiated siege in October, 2006, when terrorists targeted the New Standard Hotel in the city’s commercial hub. All three terrorists involved in the attack were shot dead in an overnight operation that began after the police evacuated all hostages.

None of these operations saw significant collateral casualties.

Military model

By contrast, military-led counter-fidayeen operations, whose tactical foundations and training methods are being emulated by police forces nationwide, have for a variety of reasons had a poor record.

In December, 1999, terrorists occupied the offices of the Special Operations Group in Srinagar. Worried commanders overrode their subordinates, and called in military special forces for assistance. The Army did indeed succeed in killing the terrorists -- but their use of heavy weapons and explosives also killed six police personnel.

Later, in 2002, the Lashkar staged a dramatic fidayeen attack on the Akshardham temple in Gandhinagar, killing at least 29 people -- the organisation’s first major attack outside Jammu and Kashmir. The National Security Guard was called in but arrived late because of a traffic jam in New Delhi. Fifty hostages were rescued -- but 29 people died, most before the force arrived.

Aditya G · Post by **Aditya G** » 11 Jan 2010 23:09

Indian paramilitary soldiers stand guard during a protest outside the office of the United Nations Military Observer Group in India and Pakistan, in Srinagar, India, Saturday, Jan. 9, 2010. Police used tear gas and batons on Saturday to disperse hundreds of angry people protesting the death of a teenage boy allegedly in firing by paramilitary

Kashmiri Muslim villagers stand near the bullet ridden wall after a gunbattle in Khrew village, some 20 Kilometers (12 miles) from Srinagar, India, Friday, Jan. 8, 2010. Government forces in Indian Kashmir killed two suspected rebels in a gunbattle Friday, a day after troops ended a 22-hour gunbattle with suspected insurgents that killed four people and paralyzed the region's main city.

Kashmiri Muslim villagers inspect the damage inside a bullet ridden shop after a gunbattle in Khrew village, some 20 Kilometers (12 miles) from Srinagar, India, Friday, Jan. 8, 2010. Government forces in Indian Kashmir killed two suspected rebels in a gunbattle Friday, a day after troops ended a 22-hour gunbattle with suspected insurgents that killed four people and paralyzed the region's main city

SRINAGAR, INDIA - JANUARY 07: Indian policemen stand guard during a gun battle between Indian police and suspected militants on January 7, 2010 in Srinagar, Jammu and Kashmir, India. Two Pakistani trained militants were killed when Indian troops stormed a hotel on Thursday morning in Kashmir. Militants opened fire and lobbed grenades from inside the hotel where they took refuge on Wednesday for nearly 22 hours, police said