Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Feb. 26, 2010

Aditya_V · Post by **Aditya_V** » 12 Mar 2010 11:38

SSRidhar-> do you have link to the news item posted by you.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 12 Mar 2010 12:17

http://thenews.jang.com.pk/daily_detail.asp?id=228545

Water: a pre-eminent political issue
At the moment, the types of voices that are filling the debate are unsettling. Over and above the clichéd upper and lower riparian antagonism, the debate is often fuelled by anti-Indian sentiment. One senior journalist has gone as far as offering himself as a human bomb against Indian dams. For once, I wish he would carry out his threat to prove to others who share his worldview: This is not how things are resolved.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 12 Mar 2010 12:37

Selected NUGGETS - TFT

India’s cultural invasion

Daily Pakistan took special note of the fact that Ms Shagufta Jamali minister of state for religious affairs used a Hindi word in parliament when she said that she was sehmat (in agreement with) with the opposition on some issue being discussed. The paper said it was proof that Pakistan was under India’s cultural invasion and that even India’s language was being used by Pakistani leaders.

Jihadi journalism is born

Weekly Zarb-e-Momin praised the effort made by daily Islam, a daily published by Jamia Rasheedia to teach journalism in Karachi. The venue attracted a large number of youths who were given training in column-writing. It was a six-week course and was deemed quite successful.

India poisoning Jhelum River

Reported in daily Jarrar of Jamaat Dawa that in Srinagar 29,000 kilo excrement (pakhana) and 7 hundred thousand litre of urine (peshab) were dumped into River Jhelum before it flowed down to Pakistan. Because of this pollution, diseases are expected to break out in Pakistan.

Back to Protocols of the Elders of Zion

Daily Jang featured columnist Anwar Ghazi as saying that in the Protocol of the Elders of Zion the Jews had long ago plotted to conquer the world and that this plot was now coming to fruition with the help of countries that are buying rulers in some countries to defeat the popular opinion.

Jews did 9/11

Daily Nawa-e-Waqt quoted Pakistani citizen Aafiya Siddiqi undergoing trial for terrorism in America as saying that 9/11 was actually organised and executed by the Jews. She requested the court that Jewish jurors in her case be removed. She also said that she could arrange peace between the Taliban and Pakistan in short order.

Give Kashmir, Junagadh and Manawadar!

Writing in Nawa-e-Waqt great reporter Chaudhry Asghar Ali Kausar Waraich stated that great journalist Majeed Nizami had told India that it should hand over Kashmir and the two states that had seceded to Pakistan, Junagadh and Manawadar, or be ready to face a terrible nuclear war with Pakistan.

Beware of foreign snakes

Writing in Jang Hamid Mir stated that he would like to tell Zardari that he should beware of the cunning (makr-o-faraib) international hunters (shikari) who were hunting in the region for their interests. (Since Zardari compared himself to baz or hawk, the hunters are connected as breeders of baz.) These hunters were actually worshippers of snakes and were interested in saving the big snakes by causing the institutions to go to war among themselves.

‘Amn ki Asha’ invitation to death

Ex-army chief Aslam Beg told Nawa-e-Waqt that the move by two media houses in India and Pakistan to start a campaign of peace between India and Pakistan was nothing but deception and an effort to kill by deception by India. He said peace was possible only by discussing Kashmir and ending Indian presence in Afghanistan. He said Pakistan was looking for amn ki asha while the Indian army chief was threatening Pakistan with war.

America did it!

Columnist Nazeer Naji wrote in Jang that the 1965 war between India and Pakistan was caused by the Americans in order to bury the dispute of Kashmir forever although on the face of it, it looked the opposite. Pakistan army thought it was going in the direction of solving the Kashmir problem but the Americans had intended the opposite.

Chief Justice should retract old verdict

Daily Express quoted Justice (Retd) Saeeduzzaman Siddiqi as saying that the 12 judges including Justice Iftikhar Chaudhry were guilty of treason under Article 6 when they sided with General Musharraf in the Zafar Ali Shah case and allowed the general to change the Constitution too. He said Justice Chaudhry should now reopen the case and amend his earlier opinion. He said November 3 verdict against Musharraf was invalid because one judge Bhagwan Das signed it on a different date.

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 12 Mar 2010 12:38

X-posted

Pakistan Tests Missiles in Arabian Sea

http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2010/03 ... istan.html

ISLAMABAD (AP) -- Pakistan's navy successfully test-fired a series of missiles and torpedoes Friday in what it called a message to ''nefarious'' forces -- an apparent reference to longtime rival India.

While the two nuclear-armed neighbors have taken slow steps toward restarting peace talks, they also have a history of using weapons tests as a form of diplomatic saber-rattling.

...

But Friday's launches were followed by a navy statement saying: ''These successful tests are a clear message to forces having nefarious designs.''

Such statements have been rare in recent years, as the two nations have struggled to keep their peace process limping along.

sum · Post by **sum** » 12 Mar 2010 12:43

Reported in daily Jarrar of Jamaat Dawa that in Srinagar 29,000 kilo excrement (pakhana) and 7 hundred thousand litre of urine (peshab) were dumped into River Jhelum before it flowed down to Pakistan. Because of this pollution, diseases are expected to break out in Pakistan.

Hope this is true...

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 12 Mar 2010 12:53

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 675235.cms

Home Minister P Chidambaram and Pakistan high commissioner Shahid Malik were engaged in an unusual exchange of words on Friday with the minister stating that all militant outfits across the border are supported by ISI and the envoy rebutting any involvement of state actors in terror acts against India.

Chidambaram, who chose not to make any mention of Pakistan in his opening remarks at a conclave here, voiced New Delhi's concerns over Pakistan-sponsored terrorism during the question and answer session.

"It is no secret that every militant organisation in Pakistan is supported by the ISI," he said while taking the names of Lashkar-e-Taiba, Jaish-e-Mohammad and some other groups operating in that country.

In a bid to counter the charge, the Pakistan envoy raised the issue of alleged Indian involvement in Balochistan and about the activities of Indian consulates in Afghanistan. Islamabad has alleged that the Indian consulates were stirring up trouble for Pakistan, a charge denied by India.

"There are no state actors involved in any act detrimental to the interests of India," he said.

Chidambaram said he had hoped not to enter into a public debate with the envoy who was only stating his government's position but wanted to put their assertion to test.

He said Pakistan should give voice samples of the list suspects given by India to match them with the voice transcripts of the 26/11 handlers in a neutral country to know whether they are state actors.

Chidambaram was asked how India would respond if there was another terror attack on the lines of 26/11.

He said if it was established with a reasonable degree of certainty that the attacks originated from Pakistani soil, "then we will respond swiftly and decisively".

The minister made it clear that "war is not an option" so the two countries, both nuclear powers, "must talk when we can" and, at other times, "we have to be vigilant".

"We cannot change our neighbour", he said adding Pakistan has been a "very difficult neighbour from 1947".

He indicated that there may be another around of talks between foreign secretary Nirupama Rao and her Pakistani counterpart Salman Bashir. There is speculation that this may take place later this month.

...

Airavat · Post by **Airavat** » 12 Mar 2010 13:00

shiv wrote:But "huge landholdings" all over the Indian subcontinent essentially meant the feudal "zamindari" system which we inherited from the Brits and which we promptly abolished. It has not been abolished in Pakistan.

The zamindari system is a glorified protection racket. The head honcho (The Brit overlord or the Paki army) recognizes the right of a zamindar over huge tracts of land and provides the forces and policing necessary for the zamindar to hold on to his land.

British Punjab followed the mahalwari system, while zamindari prevailed in Bengal, Bihar, Eastern UP. In other areas: ryotwari system.

The big landowners in Pakistan have their own private armies to hold on to the land. Most cases these soldiers belong to the same clan/caste/biradari as the landowner. The poor people also have loyalties towards religious sects, terror groups, and the Pakistani army, with different members of the same family serving in each.

RamaP · Post by **RamaP** » 12 Mar 2010 13:41

Blast in Lahore

Airavat · Post by **Airavat** » 12 Mar 2010 13:49

A curious letter exchange in NYT from twenty years ago:

We don't have caste in Pakistan

We do have caste in Pakistan

hulaku · Post by **hulaku** » 12 Mar 2010 14:10

20 killed, 40 injured in Lahore blasts

http://thenews.jang.com.pk/updates.asp?id=100550

rkirankr · Post by **rkirankr** » 12 Mar 2010 14:17

IED mubaraks have started again after a brief interlude of a couple of months.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 12 Mar 2010 14:20

hulaku wrote:20 killed, 40 injured in Lahore blasts

http://thenews.jang.com.pk/updates.asp?id=100550

Aha . . . Pakistan, Friday afternoon prayers, the More Faithful attacking the Less Faithful . . . there can be no better combination. AoA .

The RA Bazaar is a residential and commercial neighborhood where several army and security agencies have facilities.

vishal · Post by **vishal** » 12 Mar 2010 14:23

Looks like the 'dehshatgard' types have finally understood what BRF has known all along. To hurt Pakistan you have to hit Punjab and/or the PA only. Nothing else matters or counts.

sum · Post by **sum** » 12 Mar 2010 14:42

AoA...The faithfuls do not disappoint on Fridays.

Sanku · Post by **Sanku** » 12 Mar 2010 14:45

Shivji; you are placing a lot of hope and trust in the disaffection of common Abdul somehow rocking the apple cart of Pakistani state and making the life miserable, I personally think that while all the data points you have are fine, their interpretation into future leaves something be desired

Let me outline the chief difficulties with your scenarios (pointed before this post too)
1) Despite all the "peoples will" and "popular disaffection" type of rehotric, the fact remains that a "peoples movement" is usually nothing but a regime change by one set of elite by another set of elite. The people themselves remain at best a tool, with the tool being powered by the disaffection energy. The control of the tool is in other hands. Usually always in class of some other section of elite looking for a change in system (for whatever reasons) This has been beautifully expalined and illustrated by Brihaspati in multiple posts over multiple threads in multiple scenarios.

So the question is -- who in Pakistan has the potential to provide "alternate leadership from the elite" -- clearly as you have yourself demonstrated there is no middle class in Pakistan, and if there is any its a full subset of the RAPE class. So the typical set of people who have led the peoples movement all over, the psuedo-intellectual elite are conspicuously missing in Pakistan.

The only alterante leadership is provided by ? You guessed it, the Mullahs, usually of the fanatic persuasion.

In fact we already see the civil war in Pakistan being conducted by the two groups with common Abdul as the cannon fodder.

So the best case of dissolution of RAPE (not Pakistan) can come about by theological clergy.

2) The second point is SO WHAT? Fine we will have Pakistan led by a theological clergy instead of a RAPE class, what will it really change?

Are you hoping that its 3 and 1/2 firends will find themselves unable to use the psuedo-state of Pakistan any more? I wonder what that hope is based on since a very similar dispensation in Afganistan was supported earlier and seems to be all set for a return with the 3 1/2 support in a short time once more.

So instead of Pakistani state being comprised of Poor teeming Abduls with nothing to lose and a hypocrite Leadership -- we will have a Pakistan with a truly messianic leader (again not totally new, Zia was one) and leadership class who by and large practice what they preach -- AND a even poorer and even more teeming mass of sub-humanity that exists.

So yes Pakistan will truly be screwed as per our principles, I agree -- but so what from our perspective?

Notes
1) I think that 2 will happen and its a matter of when and not if
b) The above scenario will ensure that terror is fully unleashed from Pakistan on us in fits and starts.
c) The above may be GOOD for India in a way Bji means, we will be forced to retaliate (I have my own views)

But other than that I cant see how the current inaction of GoI allowing Pakistan to live its destiny of being a true basket case around our necks and keep hurting is periodically is good for us.

Pakistan is doing what it was designed to do -- be our Sisphuys stone and the continuting terror attacks are a part of that.

Just how do you find the status quo GOOD is what I cant figure out -- considering you dont share Bjis POV about (C) above

shravan · Post by **shravan** » 12 Mar 2010 15:00

Half Century.

---

Twin blasts kill 50 in Lahore cantt area

LAHORE: Twin blasts at bus stop of AR Bazaar in cantonment area of Lahore killed at least 50 people whereas more than 120 have been injured, informed sources in Rescue department.

Hari Seldon · Post by **Hari Seldon** » 12 Mar 2010 15:04

India poisoning Jhelum River

Reported in daily Jarrar of Jamaat Dawa that in Srinagar 29,000 kilo excrement (pakhana) and 7 hundred thousand litre of urine (peshab) were dumped into River Jhelum before it flowed down to Pakistan. Because of this pollution, diseases are expected to break out in Pakistan.

jai ho jai ho

krishnan · Post by **krishnan** » 12 Mar 2010 15:18

How did they figure out the amount? Ana-lyzed the water by drinking it?

Nayak · Post by **Nayak** » 12 Mar 2010 15:22

abhishek_sharma wrote:
Chidambaram was asked how India would respond if there was another terror attack on the lines of 26/11.

He said if it was established with a reasonable degree of certainty that the attacks originated from Pakistani soil, "then we will respond swiftly and decisively".

Yes this time we already have the template of the dossiers, all the MEA and HM twits have to do is 'ctrl-f' the previous incident dates and names and replace it with the next terrorist act's dates and names.

Also we have a high speed printer and copier and will use Fed Ex High Priority to send it to ISI HQ.

ack-thoo !!!

Hari Seldon · Post by **Hari Seldon** » 12 Mar 2010 15:26

krishnan wrote:How did they figure out the amount? Ana-lyzed the water by drinking it?

saar, kindly don't under-estimate the investigative abilities of the world famous paki police. Rumor has it that the paki agencies can distinguish pasta from macaroni, just by sniffing at flatulence. Investigating Yindian mischief relating to the latest core issue of water is a piece of cake only.

rkirankr · Post by **rkirankr** » 12 Mar 2010 15:43

Hari Seldon wrote:saar, kindly don't under-estimate the investigative abilities of the world famous paki police. Rumor has it that the paki agencies can distinguish pasta from macaroni, just by sniffing at flatulence. Investigating Yindian mischief relating to the latest core issue of water is a piece of cake only.

Especially if the cake is made of pakhana

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 12 Mar 2010 16:18

Ms. BB's assassination saved Pakistani government Paki Rs. 150 Million !!

The Foreign Ministry officials who will appear before the Public Accounts Committee (PAC) here on Friday have claimed in official documents that Benazir Bhutto’s assassination saved Rs150 million, which would have been spent by the then President Pervez Musharraf on his foreign trips but he had to cancel those trips after she was killed.

Apart from Benazir Bhutto’s assassination, the bombing in the rally of Benazir Bhutto on October 18, 2007 in which 150 workers had died has also been cited to justify the saving of Rs16 million meant for civil works.

Really, I have not heard of a better or more forceful argument.

Foreign Secretary Salman Bashir has been directed to appear before the committee and explain all these objections against his ministry and officials. This is the only ministry, which has claimed that millions were saved because of Benazir Bhutto’s assassination otherwise some ministries and departments like Railways, National Highway Authority etc, had claimed soon after her assassination that they had suffered heavy losses after violence broke out in Sindh and other parts of the country following her assassination on December 27, 2007.

But one thing is missing from the auditor general’s report: how General Pervez Musharraf spent Rs1.4 billion on his 80 foreign trips during two years (2005-2007). His foreign trip to USA to launch his book “In the Line of Fire” in 2006 cost Rs270 million alone. But, ironically, the AGP report is silent over the spending of such a heavy amount by the then president on the publicity of his autobiography in the US

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 12 Mar 2010 16:32

More sectarian violence

A couple of days back, the Amir of Jama'at Ahl-e-Sunnat and his four followers were eliminated. Then it was reported that Khatam-e-Nabbuwat's chief was killed yesterday. Now, SSP leader is targetted.

Earlier in the day, an attempt was also made on Maulana Abdul Ghafoor Nadeem, a leader of the banned outfit, Sipah-e-Sahaba Pakistan (SSP), in which he was injured, while his son lost his life. . . Armed men, riding on four motorcycles and a car, apprehended Maulana Nadeem’s car, and opened indiscriminate fire. Eyewitnesses told the police that the criminals seemed to be well-trained, and the entire episode took place within four to five minutes.

Following the incident, New Karachi, Nagan Chowrangi, Shah Faisal Colony, Malir, Quaidabad, Surjani and other parts of Karachi were reportedly tense, with unidentified men resorting to indiscriminate aerial firing and forcing shops to close down.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 12 Mar 2010 17:20

Sanku wrote:
So the question is -- who in Pakistan has the potential to provide "alternate leadership from the elite" -- clearly as you have yourself demonstrated there is no middle class in Pakistan, and if there is any its a full subset of the RAPE class. So the typical set of people who have led the peoples movement all over, the psuedo-intellectual elite are conspicuously missing in Pakistan.

The only alterante leadership is provided by ? You guessed it, the Mullahs, usually of the fanatic persuasion.

I doubt it. The RAPE are not so weak that they will give up thousands of acres of lands to Paki abduls and let the mullahs take over, and yes there is no "alternate" leadership in Pakistan.

That is what makes Pakistan such a fun country.

Who will lead Pakistan (and, consequently, Pakistanis) is not a question that bothers me at all as long as some Indian does not think he should take his compatriots in and somehow rule or "bring order" or worse - "reclaim" the place. At best these thoughts can be dreams only for some distant future.

Short of genocide there is no way you can reduce Pakistan's population at short notice - or even slow its growth. The number of unhappy people is bound to increase. If 3.5 are going to pay for them I welcome that and invite them to do that. Pakistan is their baby after all and if they want to look at "human development" of an extra 100 million Pakis they are welcome to have them. I only hope no Indian will want to do that. Let the Pak army and their 3.5 control that mass of people and care for them, If genocide must occur - I would rather see the Pakistani army do it. But then again - as long as India is not caught up in a genocidal war in Pakistan, I really don't care if there is genocide or not. If there is genocide - it may set the stage for some breakaway parts of Pakstan. If not we still have the best possible short to mid term scenario - a Pakistan that is in such a mess that it can neither govern itself nor serve the interests of its 3.5.

If Pakistan remains "whole" as it has done since 1971 with the blessings of its 3.5 -the last thing we should do is to try and make it easier for the landlords and their protection racket to survive by removing some problems that they face. In fact both secularism and Hindutva are great ideals to threaten Pakistan with the prospect of "birth control" and "secular education" so that Abduls remain terrified of India and continue to have 6-8 kids per woman. "Family Planning" is a Hindu plot - don't you know?

I honestly believe that apart from Pakis who don't like India, neither the US nor China can ever care for India. That means that all three must have their games defeated even as India gets stronger. The only "fortunate" circumstance for India is that Pakistan is ruled by a corrupt oligarchy and the same corrupt oligarchy are allies of the US and China. Looking after the interests of a corrupt oligarchy is easier than actually "caring" for several hundred million people. Naturally the US and China are interested only in their own populations and will use any available condom to have their work done. If we make ourselves effete fighting that condom, the US and China remain alive and happy to help the condom to be usable again. That condom must become ineffective as it will (and is already showing sign of overuse). Let Pakistan be a chronically failing/failed state. These states don't just collapse or break up. Such catastrophic events will only create two or more sates - some of which may actually do well and survive (remember Bangladesh?). Why aid such an outcome. Let Pakistan be in chronic turmoil, searching for Allah. What happens after that - I don't know and don't care as long as India ends up being an economic/military power that the US and China have to reckon with -rather than a power that can be held in check by fighting periodic wars with an angry two bit jihadi condom state.

JMT

Pranav · Post by **Pranav** » 12 Mar 2010 17:53

shiv wrote: These states don't just collapse or break up. Such catastrophic events will only create two or more sates - some of which may actually do well and survive (remember Bangladesh?). Why aid such an outcome.

Why not aid such an outcome? What's wrong with Balochistan, Sindh and Paktunkhwa emerging as stable and relatively prosperous countries.

Let Pakistan be in chronic turmoil, searching for Allah. What happens after that - I don't know and don't care as long as India ends up being an economic/military power that the US and China have to reckon with -rather than a power that can be held in check by fighting periodic wars with an angry two bit jihadi condom state.

JMT

As long as TSP is united, it will look for an identity. There is no legitimate identity to be found. Only mindless hatred of India. Better to let legitimate ethnic nations emerge, instead of letting the Pakjabis fatten up on looted resources. Eventually Pakjabi Abduls need to throw the RAPEs out, redistribute the land, make Punjabi their national language, and learn to dance Bhangra.

Ultimately, for peace one needs legitimate ethnic identities to prevail over illegitimate jihadist identities, and also social justice.

Hari Seldon · Post by **Hari Seldon** » 12 Mar 2010 18:15

Kanchan gupta, Dy editor pioneer tweets:
http://twitter.com/KanchanGupta

Trivia - Lahore SSP: "We've found heads of both suicide bombers,aged 17 - 20 years." Mullahs: Bombers currently frolicking with houris.

Kati · Post by **Kati** » 12 Mar 2010 19:07

It's FRIDAY. Twin IED Mubaraak.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 12 Mar 2010 19:40

Russia understands India's concerns about Pak terror groups, but Pakistan has initiated action: Putin

Russian Prime Minister Vladimir Putin on Friday expressed concern over terror groups operating from within Afghanistan and Pakistan, saying it was a threat to the entire world.

Mr. Putin, who is in India on a two-day visit, said Russia understood well the concerns of India regarding banned terror outfits operating against it from within Pakistan’s soil.

He added in equal measure that Islamabad had in the recent months initiated action against those groups.

However, “lets be realistic... Pakistan has taken action against those outfits in the last few months,” he added.

“We hope addressing the problem (of terror groups) will be in the best interest of Pakistan. We need to support those efforts,” he said.

It should be a matter of concern for India that Pakistan is being able to convince other nations that it is indeed taking action against terrorists. The jihadi rhetoric is reaching higher pitches recently, the JuD terrorists are conducting open meetings in central Lahore and gun-displaying and heavily armed terrorists are seen protecting LeT/JuD leaders and controlling crowds and yet the US and now Russia feel that Pakistan is taking action against terrorists ? India must realize that so long as it is squeamish about hitting Pakistan back hard for every act of its terror, it will not get anything beyond vacuous words of sympathy from others. Why should they do anything else when the affected dhimmi is itself willing to absorb blow after blow like a piece of sponge ?

rajpa · Post by **rajpa** » 12 Mar 2010 19:40

it is believed that the real reason why tsp is against ipl maybe this:

http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/new ... 601276.cms

in a few years, ipl may be worth more than the gnp of tsp!

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 12 Mar 2010 19:42

Pakistan has solid evidence of India's Balochistan terror involvement: Rehman Malik

"We are not levelling mere allegations against India but we have solid evidence of Indian involvement in Balochistan. The weapons recovered from various areas were Indian-made," he alleged.

"Afghanistan's soil is being used to destabilise Balochistan and President Hamid Karzai, who visited Pakistan this week, has given a commitment that Afghan soil will not be used against Pakistan," he said.

Kamboja · Post by **Kamboja** » 12 Mar 2010 19:51

shiv wrote: Let Pakistan be in chronic turmoil, searching for Allah. What happens after that - I don't know and don't care as long as India ends up being an economic/military power that the US and China have to reckon with -rather than a power that can be held in check by fighting periodic wars with an angry two bit jihadi condom state.

JMT

Shiv, that sounds fine but when one lives next to an open sewer, you are bound to be splashed by the muck sooner or later. No doubt seeing Pakistan crash and burn in a fire of it's own making would remove an obvious obstacle in our way, but in the process do you foresee India suffering collateral damage as Pakistan thrashes and flails?

I think history shows that turmoil in one polity inevitably spills over into its neighbors (exceptions like natural barriers aside). Look at the US-Mexico border - by 2050 or thereabouts White Anglo-Saxon Protestants, i.e. your typical Yank, will already be less than 50% of the population. Why? Because of massive immigration and much larger families from Mexico and other Latin American countries. This despite the massive expenditure and effort the US makes in fencing the border, arresting and deporting illegals, and so on.

In the scenario you draw out, how will India handle the inevitable influx of hundreds of thousands, potentially millions, of Pakistani civilians seeking to escape the sinking ship? Not to mention the inevitable spillover of organized crime, smuggling (drugs could become big business as disposable incomes rise in India), and the assorted nastiness that comes with a failing state?

Hari Seldon · Post by **Hari Seldon** » 12 Mar 2010 20:15

IMHO, Sri kamboja raises very thoughful and pertinent points. TSP jiye ya mare, humein chain se nahin jeene degaa....

Only mass infertility for the next 30 yrs could solve the problem.

svenkat · Post by **svenkat** » 12 Mar 2010 20:15

A_Gupta wrote:
Addressing a joint press conference here with Prime Minister Syed Yousuf Raza Gilani after signing the MoU, he said India has gone out of the way to help Afghanistan; but Pakistan is twin brother of Afghanistan, adding without cooperation from Pakistan, there could be no stability.
Siamese twin, I suppose.

Geo TV.

He did say that.
Times of India

"India is a close friend of Afghanistan but Pakistan is a twin brother of Afghanistan. We are more than twins, we are conjoined twins. There is no separation, there cannot be a separation," he said in response to a question during a joint news conference with Prime Minister Yousuf Raza Gilani.
Conjoined twins would like to be separated, but often cannot be, because it proves fatal to one or both of them.

Hamid Karzai is very chankian.He is referring to Pashtuns in Pak.Without the Pashtuns,Porkistan is a rump state.If they remain in Porkistan,Afghans cannot breathe easy.

munna · Post by **munna** » 12 Mar 2010 20:32

Kamboja wrote:In the scenario you draw out, how will India handle the inevitable influx of hundreds of thousands, potentially millions, of Pakistani civilians seeking to escape the sinking ship? Not to mention the inevitable spillover of organized crime, smuggling (drugs could become big business as disposable incomes rise in India), and the assorted nastiness that comes with a failing state?

Frankly this thought has bothered me too, but one of the saving graces is the inter-generational feud that has run for almost a millenia between all residents of western states and the Bakis. Gujarat, Rajasthan, Punjab, Haryana and Himachal will never let them in illegally leave alone welcome them. The enmity runs deeper than national disputes since 1947, even Gandhi was powerless in these regions during 1947. Unlike West Bengal and Assam these regions have a clear idea of what they want and will not give up their interests for some misplaced ideology. Remember Western board of India threw up challengers like Pratap, Shivaji and Guru Gobind Singh when Mughals were at their peak, they will do it again. This region of India is hard-wired and implacably opposed to compromises and rational submission.

Let me state the uncomfortable truth "Any illegal migration of bakis will lead to a 1947 redux and no GOI or provincial government will have the guts to do anything".

Fidel Guevara · Post by **Fidel Guevara** » 12 Mar 2010 20:43

Kati wrote:It's FRIDAY. Twin IED Mubaraak.

Yeah, boys, it's ILwIIR* time!!

*Inna Lillah wa Inna Ilayhi Rajioun

sanjaykumar · Post by **sanjaykumar** » 12 Mar 2010 20:49

Further, it may be that India should encourage the rabid Islamism in Pakistan-with the aim that it becomes convention that any Pakistani who crosses into India becomes irtidad (apostate).

Kamboja · Post by **Kamboja** » 12 Mar 2010 20:57

sanjaykumar wrote:Further, it may be that India should encourage the rabid Islamism in Pakistan-with the aim that it becomes convention that any Pakistani who crosses into India becomes irtidad (apostate).

See, I just find myself very uncomfortable with the encouragement of any rabid ideology like Wahhabism or Deobandism. Inevitably promoting this kind of madness will come back to bite you in the a**, as the US is finding out in A'stan. What British imperialist in the 19th/early 20th century imagined that some backwater mullah in Arabia would end up founding a fundamentalist ideology that, a hundred years later, actively hates and works to bring down the Western World and is funded by billions in petrodollars? The thinking at the time was 'Sure, these guys are crazy medievalists, but hey, they hate the Ottomans and that's all we care about'. A hundred years later Londonistan is overrun with Saudi-funded madrassas indoctrinating young British Muslims into hating and bombing their adopted homeland, and the Brits seem powerless to stop it. These kinds of network effects are hard to predict and impossible to control.

Encouraging radical Islam in Pakistan may serve our short term interests, but I am convinced that it will come back to haunt us in the long term. There must be some alternative, although I confess myself hard-pressed to find one...

Gerard · Post by **Gerard** » 12 Mar 2010 21:00

The weapons recovered from various areas were Indian-made," he alleged.

Didn't they have a display of "Indian made" mortars with calibers not manufactured by OFB and with Chinese lettering ?

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 12 Mar 2010 21:01

http://news.google.com/news/story?pz=1& ... olw3_2zBhM

Jihad Joe

saip · Post by **saip** » 12 Mar 2010 21:03

"We are not levelling mere allegations against India but we have solid evidence of Indian involvement in Balochistan. The weapons recovered from various areas were Indian-made," he alleged.

"Afghanistan's soil is being used to destabilise Balochistan and President Hamid Karzai, who visited Pakistan this week, has given a commitment that Afghan soil will not be used against Pakistan," he said.

If anyone is wondering where Rehman Malik found the solid evidence here is a clue:

India poisoning Jhelum River

Reported in daily Jarrar of Jamaat Dawa that in Srinagar 29,000 kilo excrement (pakhana) and 7 hundred thousand litre of urine (peshab) were dumped into River Jhelum before it flowed down to Pakistan. Because of this pollution, diseases are expected to break out in Pakistan.

Pakis being pigs, that is where they find the evidence