The Red Menace

Kavu · Post by **Kavu** » 06 Apr 2010 20:37

Gagan wrote:Come come now,

The maobadis don't have any realistic strategic goals except to destabilize India. Period fullstop.

They and their chinese masters and leftist political over ground workers realize that creating a revolution like in Nepal and in China in the early 20th century is not possible in 21st century India.

The aim seems to be to expand the political base of the left parties, by creating a ground level movement based on fear and violence, much the same that has been achieved in west bengal, and allowed the left parties to come to power and hold on to it for all these decades.

True, and a very intelligent observation. If that is indeed the case. What is the Congress/BJP and other political party's reaction? Why isnt it communicated, Why is non-democratic entity like CPI and CPM allowed in India?

AjayKK · Post by **AjayKK** » 06 Apr 2010 21:00

The Issue number 14 of CPI(Maoist) released in February contains a warning to the Home Minister and vows to take revenge "reactionary forces" in Dantewada. It also contains various open and veiled threats of launching and further scaling up the operations in Chhatisgarh, Maharashtra, Orissa and AP.

Since it is openly available for reading at bannedthought, perhaps to score psyops against the powers that be, one hopes that the CPI(M) threat of launching further strikes at the places stated has been taken into consideration.

Why Naxals can easily set up deadly ambushes -

The CRPF and local police on anti-Naxal operations perform a thankless job but a few basic counter-insurgency measures could have prevented the deadly Dantewada attack, writes B Raman

http://news.rediff.com/column/2010/apr/ ... bushes.htm

Klaus · Post by **Klaus** » 06 Apr 2010 21:02

This whole-sale slaughter of dumbstruck paramilitary troops at short range (approx 150 metres) bears the imprints of Northern Vietnamese army type training. Perhaps, this type of training could have been imparted by select factions of the PLA who have witnessed and have good knowledge of such warfare (to have studied it in depth in post-Vietnam war era) and possibly even applied it to jungle warfare in Indian scenario.

It is evident that the Maoists have provided feedback to their masters/trainers in order that the offense mechanism be perfected, this just goes to show flawless execution of their war-strategy. The Maoists chain of command is working flawlessly, I am pretty sure that the weapons used will have no manufacturer's label on it (just goes to show the level of planning which has gone into this). The very fact that 300-400 armed gunmen were moving around and no one raised the alarm is proof enough that a lot of mouths have been silenced and a lot of hands been soiled prior to this massacre.

Added Later: I propose that the title of this thread be changed to reflect the drastically altered reality that has hit us all in the face today. Possible title could be: "Maoist insurgency post 6/4 Dantewada attack and possible repurcussions & course of retaliation".

D Roy · Post by **D Roy** » 06 Apr 2010 21:06

The centre is talking about "taking back" territory!. Apparently Dantewada was not supposed to be "liberated" before 2011!

I wonder how long will this shit be peddled and an incident of this magnitude glossed over.

Hullo! Dear Government they are killing OUR ( since you obviously see them as cannon fodder) troops now , in 2010.

So the fat cats in delhi merrily attend the film launch/book launch of various maoist sympathizers ( Buddhi jeevis) while outsourcing this war to economically poor guys recruited from across the country.

On the other side, you have yamrikis slaughtering innocents in push button warfare and then lecturing us on human rights.

when will this tamasha stop?

Altair · Post by **Altair** » 06 Apr 2010 21:09

This was an ambush. There were nearly 1000 Maoists who surrounded the combing party. They had specific intelligence of their location and their trail. Someone sold these soldiers off.Obviously for money but also for political fallout. PC has only one logical option now. He cannot invite them for talks anymore. If he does he will invite spit on his face(a major upgrade from shoe throw I guess). This threat needs to be dealt with realtime satellite intel with support from UAV's. Just get the latest damn coordinates and transfer them to Base command. They will do the rest.
PS:I guess Arundhati Roy will have a grand gala party tonight. Let her celebrate for its short lived.

chaanakya · Post by **chaanakya** » 06 Apr 2010 21:11

RIP to the brave jawans who risk their lives and serve under most grueling conditions with a pittance as salary.

Lack of intelligence seems to be their undoing. But there are some Intel input of Maoists strike being planned, yet this has happened. Now with sickening regularity.

Maoists have the advantage of terrain , familiarity with locals, easy blending in the surrounding , tight command and control , innovating ambush in myriad ways .

Purulia arms drop case rings a tone when we talk of Maoists having better firepower. Govt had released main accused Peter Bleach ultimately. So arms finally get more arms to Maoists by attacking armory/police convoys etc. SO govt has to improve on its own dismal record on security front.

Forces need to have better preparedness while going into such operations rather than simply pumping para military forces. Better to prepare state forces by giving them specialised training and inch by inch extend the writ of state in the areas controlled by Maoists.
Army deployment and its tactics may not be so desirable in internal fight.

vera_k · Post by **vera_k** » 06 Apr 2010 21:26

Klaus wrote:If that is indeed the case. What is the Congress/BJP and other political party's reaction? Why isnt it communicated, Why is non-democratic entity like CPI and CPM allowed in India?

The Congress thinks the BJP is the bigger threat, and is thus willing to ally with the CPI(M). The BJP to date has not demonnstrated that it has what it takes to be cunning and ruthless. But of these two the BJP is likely to be the more implacable foe of the Maoists since they are in direct competition in the states with the Left for the same political space.

Altair · Post by **Altair** » 06 Apr 2010 21:28

This thread title can be changed for better.Perhaps "Naxalites threaten Indian security fabric"

derkonig · Post by **derkonig** » 06 Apr 2010 21:50

MMS must be sleeping well tonite.

sum · Post by **sum** » 06 Apr 2010 21:53

Truely a surreal day. Still cant imagine even in a dream that i would see headlines like 75 CRPF jawans massacred given that things have not been so grim even in the worst times of J&K and Naga insurgency.

Hoping and praying that it isnt too late and $hit still hasnt hit the fan.

Klaus · Post by **Klaus** » 06 Apr 2010 21:57

Chinese spy rings which are in the news from last 2 days for having allegedly hacked Indian security networks and compromised loads of data. It is possible that the info of the doomed paramilitary deployment could have been remotely passed on to a Maoist strike group just a few hours before the strike took place, it must have been a very juicy target to let go and then they might have decided to strike.

The news with regard to Chinese spy rings and their covert activities can be found on the 'Chinese incursions into Indian territory' thread.

@ vera_k, I did not make that post.

Kavu · Post by **Kavu** » 06 Apr 2010 21:59

derkonig wrote:MMS must be sleeping well tonite.

Quite Unnecessary and let me remind you he is the Prime Minister of India.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 06 Apr 2010 22:01

various buddhi jeevis are doing the demands on TV channels tonight mostly thundering about a strong response and "wipe them out now". Pillai sir our home secy phoned in to most english channels giving his pov that various things were on track.
a activist type elite lady from delhi/mumbai took strong exception to chandan mitra and singhvi sir demanding action saying that india had to answer the same way as american for american indians and australians to aborigines. for each point of these gents, she was more vehemently ready with three.

must be a champion debater and extempore speaker of JNU/St Stephens.

MMS met PC and three service chiefs and went back to his books.

ok so nobody expects dramatic responses on day1 after pearl harbour, but lets hope things
like beefing up local intel, dedicated UAVs and a QRT helicopter outfits are authorized and
funded from PMO level asap.

sum · Post by **sum** » 06 Apr 2010 22:04

ok so nobody expects dramatic responses on day1 after pearl harbour, but lets hope things
like beefing up local intel, dedicated UAVs and a QRT helicopter outfits are authorized and
funded from PMO level asap.

Honestly, given that a event like the Parliament attack and 26/11 ( where even the Dilli/Mumbai billis) were openly targeted didnt evoke a response from us, fat chance of anything happening in this case too. A couple of days and people will even forget a bloodbath had taken place.

Now, enough of wasting time : Which was the channel where the Shoaib- Sania special show is being aired?

ASPuar · Post by **ASPuar** » 06 Apr 2010 22:07

X-Posted from COIN thread:

Note: This is my (perhaps simplistic) brief comment on what I suspect is the cause of Naxalisms increasing spread and aggresiveness. I havent spent much time on this thread, and I will do my research in the coming days. Please let me know what you think, and whether you agree/disagree, etc.

The question of Maoism is indeed one that will be settled by winning hearts and minds, as well as of armed resolve of the Union. There is an anger amongst the people, which needs to be quelled, and not allowed to be exploited by the Maoist intellectuals, for their own perverse purposes.

Why is there anger? IMHO because for the vast Indian population that is not resident in one of the metros, life in a democracy does not exist at all. They are ruled by an army of zamindars, minor politicians, lumbardars, inspectors, havildars, constables, tehsildars, naib tehsildars, land tax commissioners, Deputy Collectors (Direct Recruit), peons, Sub Divisional Magistrates, Irrigation engineers, SDPOs, DSP's, Superintendents of Police, and ultimately, of course, at the apex, District Magistrates, all of whom want their pound of flesh from the people.

Think of the last time you had contact with any governmental form in India. Was it pleasant? Im willing to bet, if you lived in any of the places where naxalism today flourishes, and were there 20 years ago, the smallest govt official was A) High handed, and B ) corrupt. How long will the people put up with that sort of thing? And when these leftist-maoist scum came along and said "Dont you just hate those guys? We should get ride of them".... Well, Im not surprised that people who were fed up, just went along with it!

A start towards curing the root cause of Naxalism, IMHO, is to bring democracy, real democracy, into the day to day governance of the districts, and marginalising the colonial era overimportance which we have given to the petty bureaucracy.

Thoughts, anyone?

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 06 Apr 2010 22:09

I don't know if such a big intel transmit by the chinese has taken place. Possibility of the chinese using satellites to give updates on CRPF camps / deployments etc is there.

The maobadis surely benefit from good ground level intel.

The security forces in this case just did not have intel about the presence of such a huge group of armed men and women. Serious intel failure, collusion of local level politicos, policemen can't be denied. But such is the network of fear the maobadis have built up in those areas, that cooperation and reliable intel won't be forthcoming unless GoI through the security forces demonstrates its willingness to stay the course and demonstrate its presence in the area.

Iron fist in a velvet glove needed big time here.

And oh time for India to upgrade the tech level. UAVs with SAR, thermal imagers, innovation in terms of locating the movement of people through thick foilage. A mechanism to detect and monitor the movement of people across villages, any new group of people coming in need to be intercepted and antecedents inquired into etc.

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 06 Apr 2010 22:18

ASPuar wrote:Thoughts, anyone?

You are hitting on the basics of the problem.

But I have not yet seen our countrymen and women love their fellow countrymen and women in true spirit. That culture just doesn't exist in India in any major level to make a difference.

I don't want to start making comparisions with other societies, but the media's behaviour is a case in point. Mango people have probabaly heard that 73 people have died, but before they could even know more and start to care, the news has moved on.

There will never be an outrage, even if the mango janta was made to be disturbed enough to care.

At some level this takes the heat off the government which has so many things on its hands, but the lack of constant pressure on the government is also not good. At this point I must point out that all the news media that we see only targets the central government. If the media directs even a fraction of its activism towards the workings of the various state governments, India will be a much better place. But no, the local media is completely overawed by the power that the state governments and local netas bring to bear.

The center is just the soft target that the media goes after.

munna · Post by **munna** » 06 Apr 2010 22:19

ASPuar wrote:Thoughts, anyone?

Aspuar I have and continue to champion the cause of Governance Reforms in India. Infact I consider that to be the only way out of the current rut that we find ourselves in. Bureaucracy especially the current cadre based set up needs to be "destroyed" (I use this term specifically) in favour of an accountable political bureaucracy that sinks and swims together with their political chiefs. The Mai Baaps as of now are a class unto themselves and rule like imperial overlords. There is a need to make the babudom accountable by making it easier to fire them. If even the PM of India has to renew his/her mandate every five years then why do we continue to have these fellows around for lifetime?

However that said the key here is that you cannot usher in reforms without establishing the credibility of the state. The reconciliation bit can only come in once GOI manages to establishes presence in the area-given current circumstances it seems that even that is a tall order.

Yes we need to win hearts and minds but not without answering the red thugs in a language they understand.

Gerard · Post by **Gerard** » 06 Apr 2010 22:25

B Raman writes

The fact that only one member of the police was killed in the ambush makes one suspects possible collusion between the Maoists and some members of the district police.

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 06 Apr 2010 22:46

Of course the local policemen are scared shitless at the prospect of the maobadis.

I have spoken to one doyen politician, a tribal himself from the maosit affected areas. He says he's visited their training camps. He has his own goons and local macho men, but he humbly submitted to me that he was overawed, humbled and helpless at the maoists power and intentions.

All the local politicos in the area are in contact with the maobadis. The government SDOs, BDOs, Businessmen are paying the moabadis the "TAX" very routinely and honestly. The lawyers, police and local politicos serve and protect the maobadis.

All it takes is one bicycle riding tribal with a jhola delivering a letter on the letter head of the maobadis to bring the toughies to their knees. The maobadi letters are very polite and specific, at this point they don't need to be rude.

ramdas · Post by **ramdas** » 06 Apr 2010 22:53

Gaganji,

Which party is this politician from ? Do even BJp politicos support the maoists ?

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 06 Apr 2010 23:12

The gentleman in question shifts alliances every season, and yes he has flirted with the BJP also as well as the congress.

From his report, and other contacts, the maoists are deeply entrenched in the big cities bordering these forests. Their fundraising occurs from the officers and businessmen who deal with the big PSUs that invariably are located in the mineral rich belt. All the fundraising is extortion and 'tax' that is levied on the people.

Everyone knows about it. Even the local police pays the 'tax' !

There is also a significant industry dealing with targeted assassinations and kidnappings that spurts across the entire region from time to time.

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 06 Apr 2010 23:17

The maobadi foot soldiers are paid good money, and a couple of lakhs as compensation for the family if they get killed. Being a maobadi, gives then immunity from the local police and government, which is a big relief, and a huge status symbol apparently.

Local police is dismotivated, thus the states have to bring in central forces.

IMHO taking out the foot soldiers in the jungles is a fools' errand, but one that must be done nevertheless. The real bossess and planners sit comfortably in the big cities, state and national capital and hobnob with the biggies. These are the guys who need to be targetted.

A top down approach please, in addition to clamping down on the situation on the ground.

Kavu · Post by **Kavu** » 06 Apr 2010 23:27

150 + people died in Mumbai, the whole of India went bezerk for sometime, 70 Policemen perishes in 2 hours today morning, we wail till evening, and then IPL takes over? Where are the priorities in this country, heck where is the heart?

ASPuar · Post by **ASPuar** » 06 Apr 2010 23:31

Gagan wrote:The maobadi foot soldiers are paid good money, and a couple of lakhs as compensation for the family if they get killed. Being a maobadi, gives then immunity from the local police and government, which is a big relief, and a huge status symbol apparently.

There you go.

The government is the ultimate bully on the Indian landscape, and that is largely because district administration is largely unreconstructed from the British Raj, and is inimical to the interests of the people, and operates on a "master-slave" type power equation, rather than a public service model.

Of course people hate the cops who can never be prosecuted, no matter what crime they commit, the tehsildar, who threatens to take away your land, on the basis of some flimsy rule or the other unless you pay him, the irrigation board man, who declares your bore well illegal, and forfeit, unless you give him what he wants, the district SP, whose gleaming white ambassador takes him to work with 5 Gypsy's full of gun toting menace taking over the road, and signs of "overtaking prohibited" posted all over them, the DM who can declare your crop forfeit under a variety of archaic laws.... these are the dusty remains of the British Raj, and a gargantuan self serving edifice they are too.

Any wonder that the innocent landsman wants to consign these petty tyrants to the dustbin? The state has for decades committed violence against the ordinary, helpless Indian, with impunity and shamelessness.

And now, a vicious ideology has taken advantage of the anger of the stawart Indian citizen, and turned it to their own twisted ends.

rohitvats · Post by **rohitvats** » 06 Apr 2010 23:45

munna wrote:The Red Corridor may try to secede very soon if this goes on for long. If Maoists have the military capabilities to take out a company of para-military then things are serious indeed. Something will give way-my fear is that India is headed towards its own version of financial crisis but in our case it will be a security crisis. For too long we have been fed opium by a propagandist media, effeminate government and clueless policy makers. This is a national failure of colossal proportions. We have a civil war at hands-much as I hate to say

My sincere condolences to families and organizations of the martyred personnel. Veergati...

There are many on this topic talking about the 'power' of Maoists and their planning and etc and the above post is symptomatic of such reaction. Munna, can you please answer the following questions:

--How the ambush of one company worth of troops from CPO means that Maoists have capability to take on Indian State? --What extraordinary effort is required to ambush and overwhelm a company of CPO which Maoists have demonstrated and hence, have 'arrived'?
--If Maoists are that good and have such firepower, why did they need 1000 personnel to mount the ambush?
--It has taken the might of Pakistan State and its Army to sustain the militancy in Kashmir? Naga insurgents are amongst the toughest of fighters and operate in an equally hostile terrain (to Indian security forces) and have open access to arms from international market. Last I checked, Nagaland is still part of India. How will Maoists sustain operation against the Republic of India? Mounting ambushes here and there is different from sustaining long term operations against Indian State?
--If push comes to shove, what prevents India to deploy Corps worth of troops (~50,000 personnel) in the areas or even more?

I will await your reply.

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 06 Apr 2010 23:45

ASPuar wrote:There you go.

Don't forget the legal system.

The maobadi kangaroo courts do brisk business apparently.

Gerard · Post by **Gerard** » 06 Apr 2010 23:53

This is war

Published excerpts from the diary of one of the EFR jawans killed in the Sildha raid are poignant testimony to the abject collapse of morale in the State’s agencies in Maoist-afflicted areas in West Bengal. Suraj Bhan Thapa’s diary recorded: “There is a threat to our lives at all times here. Anything can happen at any time”; and further, “The party politics of a few people has endangered the existence of the country. We are also suffering...”

Just before the attack at Sildha, Solicitor General Gopal Subramanium is reported to have told the Supreme Court, “Every officer in the area is marked for death”. The same news report records the conditions of the Sildha camp: “No sentries, no watchtowers, a fence with one entire side missing, a crowded marketplace, a public toilet — personnel of the EFR camp over-run by the Maoists were little more than sitting ducks.”

A societal consensus clearly does not exist with regard to the Maoist conundrum in India. A range of Maoist front organisations, as well as sympathetic and often simply confused ‘intellectuals’, systematically undermines the possibility of the crystallisation of such a consensus (it is unsurprising that, while making his conditional offer of a ceasefire, Koteswar Rao appealed to ‘intellectuals and human rights activists to mediate’ between the Maoists and the Government). This is to be expected, and can be countered, if the state and its agencies are able to project coherent assessments, policies, strategies and perspectives. When the state itself sows confusion, there can be no prizes for guessing who gains.

James Cockburn · Post by **James Cockburn** » 07 Apr 2010 00:02

NSA Must be very busy you know with what?
From what ever I am watching on the TV the Indian security forces strategy, preparation resembles closely the Mexican troops in Classic western movies of Clint Eastwood.

The HM looks like lost forlorn, clueless, and this is not like instigating agitations in AP to sit back and watch the fun.
But then in India its not a big deal if Naxals kill armed forces. We are sitting on hundreds on lawless NWF of Pakistan.
Just you wait and see.

Marten>> He who has the lance is the master of the people and will follow especially in view of Indian psyche. Shiv can answer better on this

ASPuar · Post by **ASPuar** » 07 Apr 2010 00:12

Its because the HM has relied heavily on his IPS advisors, and alas, he is finding out that many of them are not very clued up on this sort of counter insurgency thing, despite what it said they could do on the box. Most of them have never dealt with anything like what they are seeing right now, and are not equipped professionally, to do anything about it.

Gerard · Post by **Gerard** » 07 Apr 2010 01:04

Delhi cut up over Lalgarh

Government outraged over Maoist massacre; BJP wants 'fight to finish'

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 07 Apr 2010 01:41

A Telugu news paper (andhrabhoomi) says that

83 jawans killed and and 53 were taken as prisoners. Is this true?

James B · Post by **James B** » 07 Apr 2010 01:45

Naxals had element of surprise: Home Secy

munna · Post by **munna** » 07 Apr 2010 01:46

rohitvats wrote: There are many on this topic talking about the 'power' of Maoists and their planning and etc and the above post is symptomatic of such reaction. Munna, can you please answer the following questions:

My sincere attempt is as follows Rohitji

--How the ambush of one company worth of troops from CPO means that Maoists have capability to take on Indian State? --What extraordinary effort is required to ambush and overwhelm a company of CPO which Maoists have demonstrated and hence, have 'arrived'?

First and foremost I will address the psy-ops value of their dastardly act. Maosists have orchestrated bloodiest ambush of all insurgents in recent times or maybe in the history of free India. For whatever it is worth these guys do have strategies and tactics-they are not rank amateurs when it comes to fighting the CPOs. Coming to the efforts I can list the following

(a) Penetrating the local police or CPO to gather intelligence of CPO movements
(b) Positioning a force of anywhere between 600-1000 men with the all agencies being clueless about it
(c) Mastering a chain of command to direct a Battalion level force for one operation
(d) The refined tactics and almost copybook style in which they effected their operation
(e) Having moles and intellectuals in Delhi defend them in media, government and bureaucracy even after this act

Do the above capabilities indicate that they can challenge Indian state now? No, but do they have the will and trojans within the current setup to support their bid? Yes. Will they be successful? I do not think so, but can they retard and halt India's development? Yes, it seems more and more likely that we will end up paying huge costs to recover the lost ground.

--If Maoists are that good and have such firepower, why did they need 1000 personnel to mount the ambush?

Those thugs are definitely inferior to Indian state in terms of weapons and firepower but as I said we CANNOT allow this sore to fester for long. Remember you crawl then walk and then run. These guys are attempting to walk now and should be nipped in the bud.

--It has taken the might of Pakistan State and its Army to sustain the militancy in Kashmir? Naga insurgents are amongst the toughest of fighters and operate in an equally hostile terrain (to Indian security forces) and have open access to arms from international market. Last I checked, Nagaland is still part of India. How will Maoists sustain operation against the Republic of India? Mounting ambushes here and there is different from sustaining long term operations against Indian State?

Rohit I am not qualified regarding the purely military matters (I lack a Phd with upper hand) but here is my take about the difference between the other insurgencies and this one. Maoists are an inter state group with pockets of influence in nearly all poor Eastern states of India. Unlike other insurgents these guys not only have inter state support base but also have sympathizers in bureaucracy, academia and political classes both in Dilli and states. Hence the political support that they enjoy to recover, replenishg and attack is by far the best and most broad based of all insurgent groups active in India. Therefore my fear is that over time these guys may attempt a state within state solution with active help of leeches in Dilli. Also, you know our neighbors are not helpful either and can feed these groups when the opportune time comes (or maybe they are).

--If push comes to shove, what prevents India to deploy Corps worth of troops (~50,000 personnel) in the areas or even more?

Nothing and I sincerely hope that they do it as soon as possible and be done with it. We cannot survive such challenges to our credibility time and again. My fear is that political will may be lacking due to a lot of wheels within wheels.

I will await your reply.

Hope it makes some sense, its been a sad sad day.

Rudradev · Post by **Rudradev** » 07 Apr 2010 01:48

G K Pillai: There is no question of intelligence failure. This was a team which went out based on specific intelligence inputs two days ago. They went looking for the Maoists this morning but they got ambushed in the jungles. This is not an intelligence failure because we don't have intelligence inside the jungles.

Can anyone explain WTF this statement is supposed to mean? Each of the highlighted phrases above contradicts at least one of the other two.

If the team went out "based on specific intelligence inputs" and got ambushed, how is that not an "intelligence failure"?

If "we don't have intelligence inside the jungles" (where the enemy is) then how is that not an "intelligence failure"?

If we "don't have intelligence inside the jungles" then how did the team go into the jungles "based on specific intelligence inputs"?

Does "intelligence" mean the same thing in the MMS administration as it does to the rest of the human race?

Because the MMS administration has certainly managed to redefine "failure" many times over.

Kavu · Post by **Kavu** » 07 Apr 2010 01:57

Rudradev wrote:
G K Pillai: There is no question of intelligence failure. This was a team which went out based on specific intelligence inputs two days ago. They went looking for the Maoists this morning but they got ambushed in the jungles. This is not an intelligence failure because we don't have intelligence inside the jungles.
Can anyone explain WTF this statement is supposed to mean? Each of the highlighted phrases above contradicts at least one of the other two.

If the team went out "based on specific intelligence inputs" and got ambushed, how is that not an "intelligence failure"?

If "we don't have intelligence inside the jungles" (where the enemy is) then how is that not an "intelligence failure"?

If we "don't have intelligence inside the jungles" then how did the team go into the jungles "based on specific intelligence inputs"?

Does "intelligence" mean the same thing in the MMS administration as it does to the rest of the human race?

As if ek haazar maoist made any sense?
There is no clear understanding of the task at hand, As simple as that.

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 07 Apr 2010 02:04

Vishwamitra wrote:A Telugu news paper (andhrabhoomi) says that

83 jawans killed and and 53 were taken as prisoners. Is this true?

Yes 84 massacred.

Kavu · Post by **Kavu** » 07 Apr 2010 02:06

Though as is expected in BR or any equivalent sites, a lot of whining about the Government, Buearcrats and Politics, and even IPS officers messing up the whole fight and Armed Forces the only answer to all.

I would differ and would agree with our good Chief

Deploying the army against Left-wing militants is impractical because the Maoists are not secessionists, the new army chief, General V.K. Singh, said here today.

“The Naxalite problem is a law and order problem that has stemmed from certain issues on the ground. Law and order is a state subject and I think our polity is astute enough to understand the implications of deploying the army against our own people,” the general said.

That said,
Where is our equivalent of Russian MVD ? Our Forces has been outclassed by these rag tag maoist, its no wonder especially with ill-trained, under-equipped, low on morale, and focus troops. So how do we make a new RR for Maoist? How do we train up and equip CRPF, what are the kind of timelines we are facing. How would other forces and organizations support them,How do we gag the Left-Leaning media, talking heads, supporters and financier's of these people!

Rudradev · Post by **Rudradev** » 07 Apr 2010 02:19

Kavu wrote:
As if ek haazar maoist made any sense?
There is no clear understanding of the task at hand, As simple as that.

No, it is not "as simple as that".

"Ek hazaar Maoist" was a concoction of our idiot media, who is not constitutionally charged with knowing any better.

GK Pillai's gibberish fails abysmally to cover up what is in fact an intelligence failure of the size of Kargil. At that time, when patrols of 10-20 men were ambushed on the LoC, these same cretins were hysterically bleating about "intelligence failure". Today nearly a hundred security personnel have been ambushed, 75 of them killed, not on the LoC but in the heart of Indian territory.

It seems that P.Chidambaram only appears a determined, effective leader when you compare him to Manmohan Singh... not by any objective standards.

negi · Post by **negi** » 07 Apr 2010 02:20

This is the bane of Indian system i.e. too sentimental and not practical enough , if that is indeed the case then why not arm and train the CRPF or whatever "gobbledegook" term one would wish to use for the men who would fight these cretins ?

This is so ironical i.e. people in this country yap about 'Dharma' and stuff but they develop cold feet while taking action against evil and shy away from their 'Karma' all in the name of not fighting 'our people' , what astute policy are we talking about here ?