India-US News and Discussion

joshvajohn · Post by **joshvajohn** » 13 Apr 2010 03:38

Nuclear Arms Race in South Asia: Is the US-India Nuclear Pact Really to Blame?
http://thefastertimes.com/india/2010/04 ... -to-blame/

comments: US-India Nuclear pact is a business to produce electric power out of nuclear energy. China is trying its best either to block this by inducing Pakistan to make noice about this or even threatening to supply whatever Pakistan wants to have it even nuclear arms. China is clearly at proxy war with India by trying to isolate India using Pakistan all the time and by trying to block India getting nuclear energy from US as strategically China would have much of competition from India (though it is only marginal - but still afraid of India). In an indirect way China will try everything possible to stop this pact. For me the India- US nuclear pact is the right way forward even it can make impact on reducing or even stopping the nuclear arms race in South Asia. In fact it has many legal bindings for India not to use these facilities for any of their nuclear arsenal. In spite of this China is trying show that it is a threat for them and so announced publicly that they would make a pact with Pakistan in supplying nuclear fuel and arms. Unless US and India go ahead with this pact and plan to set up a few nuclear powerstations quickly this pact is going to be pending. In no way this energy produced is going to help India to make nuke arms and in no way the pact contributes towards arms race rather in some ways it controls or reduces the competition.

shukla · Post by **shukla** » 13 Apr 2010 11:22

US, India military brass discuss China's rising power

Wary as they both are of China’s long-term intentions, India and US came together on Monday to discuss Beijing’s galloping modernisation of its 2.25-million strong armed forces and its strategic moves in the Asia-Pacific region.

The ‘Red Dragon’, with its spreading wings, was a prominent presence in the room during the talks visiting US chief of naval operations chief Admiral Gary Roughead held with the top Indian military brass, including Navy chief Admiral Nirmal Verma and Army chief General V K Singh, on Monday.

Both sides, among other things, shared their assessments of China’s transborder military capabilities and its increasing presence in the Indian Ocean Region (IOR). China, of course, has also forged extensive maritime links with IOR countries like Myanmar, Bangladesh, Sri Lanka, Maldives, Seychelles, Mauritius and Madagascar. Sources said China’s ambitious aircraft carrier building programme was of particular interest since this is one arena in which it actually lags behind even India.

At present, while China may have as many as 62 submarines, with 10 of them being nuclear-powered and three armed with long-range ballistic missiles, and 75 major warships, it does not have an aircraft carrier.

A_Gupta · Post by **A_Gupta** » 13 Apr 2010 17:33

http://blogs.cfr.org/asia/2010/04/12/ob ... a-problem/

An excellent summary of the opportunities and constraints on Indo-US relations.
No excerpts here, just read it

NRao · Post by **NRao** » 13 Apr 2010 18:48

rohiths wrote:Does Mr. Obama Care About India?

The fact that President Obama didn't take questions from reporters after he left Sunday's meeting with Mr. Singh speaks volumes.

Obama did the very same thing with Israeli PM. Obama went to the WH to eat dinner with his wife and children - as an article stated.

Problems common to the two nations have un-common solutions.

Brad Goodman · Post by **Brad Goodman** » 13 Apr 2010 19:05

[quote="NRao

The fact that President Obama didn't take questions from reporters after he left Sunday's meeting with Mr. Singh speaks volumes.

Obama did the very same thing with Israeli PM. Obama went to the WH to eat dinner with his wife and children - as an article stated.

Problems common to the two nations have un-common solutions.[/quote]

NRao Ji, May be meeeting with Israeli PM was at odd time but MMS meeting was from 1:45PM to 3:00 PM so unless it was tea time in WH there was always time for a 1 -2 min press statement. I am curious if President Obama made any statements after his meeting with Chinese president?

RoyG · Post by **RoyG** » 13 Apr 2010 19:53

India not invited to NAM luncheon hosted by Biden

WASHINGTON: India, a founding member of the Non-Aligned Movement (NAM), was not invited to a luncheon meeting hosted by US Vice President Joe Biden, where he professed that the grouping and his country had similar goals on nuclear security and non-proliferation.

Only those member states of the NAM which are part of the Nuclear non-Proliferation Treaty (NPT) were invited to the luncheon hosted by Biden at his official residence on the margins of the Nuclear Security Summit here, a senior White House official said.

Since India is not a signatory to the NPT, it was left out, the official said.

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 797588.cms

Hari Seldon · Post by **Hari Seldon** » 13 Apr 2010 20:11

Only those member states of the NAM which are part of the Nuclear non-Proliferation Treaty (NPT) were invited to the luncheon hosted by Biden at his official residence on the margins of the Nuclear Security Summit here, a senior White House official said.

Since India is not a signatory to the NPT, it was left out, the official said.

"The goals of the non-aligned movement and my country on the important issues of nuclear security, non-proliferation, as well as other issues have never been closer than they are today, in our view," Biden said addressing a group of leaders from NAM countries during the luncheon.

Thank you for the tactical brilliance, unkil. You're learning well from TSP, I reckon.

May your bone-headedness continue and awaken even the most yamrika-premi of GOI's netas and babus.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 13 Apr 2010 20:19

* Just before the eqk in Chile, the US was busy trying to remove HEU from Chile!

* KSA is widely known to have bankrolled the TSP acquisiton of nukes from PRC.

* Malaysia is the hub of the AQK Nukemart centrifuge suppliers.

NRao · Post by **NRao** » 13 Apr 2010 20:37

The acceptance of this invitation also reflects very, very poorly on those nations that accepted this invitation. They have aligned themselves and the US has hijacked NAM to some extent.

Shalav · Post by **Shalav** » 13 Apr 2010 21:01

RoyG wrote:India not invited to NAM luncheon hosted by Biden

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 797588.cms

They invited us to their house and insulted the Prime Minister of India! Despite this we will spend 10 of billions of $$$ buying sanction threatened US military and nuclear hardware.

Jai ho!

NRao · Post by **NRao** » 13 Apr 2010 21:15

Do not know if this has any significance, but MMS is as far as possible from the center:

http://www.chicagotribune.com/videobeta ... have-risen

Amber G. · Post by **Amber G.** » 13 Apr 2010 21:17

RoyG wrote:India not invited to NAM luncheon hosted by Biden

Since India is not a signatory to the NPT, it was left out, the official said.

Biden Always had a good judgement - who to mingle with in the invite list too.

arun · Post by **arun** » 13 Apr 2010 22:18

Sadanand Dhume in the Wall Street Journal:

APRIL 13, 2010, 11:16 A.M. ET

The Pakistan Problem

President Obama risks alienating India by courting Islamabad.

By SADANAND DHUME

Those who accuse Barack Obama of cold-shouldering Britain and stiff-arming Israel might find his choice of a country to shower with praise somewhat perplexing. According to the White House, the president opened a meeting Sunday with Pakistani Prime Minister Yusuf Raza Gilani "by noting that he is very fond of Pakistan, having visited the country during college." Mr. Obama also spoke about "shared values" between the United States and Pakistan, and "the fight we are both engaged in against extremists operating in South Asia."

For the most part, this kind of polite blather is par for the course in diplomacy. So we can ignore the incongruity of claiming shared values with a country that boasts a rogue nuclear program, a notoriously double-dealing intelligence establishment, a patchy commitment to democracy and one of the most virulently anti-American populations on the planet. (According to the Pew Global Attitudes project, only one in six Pakistanis holds a favorable opinion of America.) …………………

WSJ

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 13 Apr 2010 22:42

Its not a zero sum game. US can associate with anyone it chooses but cannot expect India to pay up for the US fiendship with TSP or PRC or any other nations with inimical interests visavis India.

fiendship = friendship with fiends

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 13 Apr 2010 22:53

arun wrote:Sadanand Dhume in the Wall Street Journal:

APRIL 13, 2010, 11:16 A.M. ET

The Pakistan Problem

President Obama risks alienating India by courting Islamabad.

By SADANAND DHUME
WSJ

Brilliant article except for the title. It gives the false impression that India is jealous of TSP because it is courted by USA. Rather, the title should convey the illegality and unethicalness of US's policy of propping up a terrorist state and wilfully hurtiung India.

Anujan · Post by **Anujan** » 13 Apr 2010 22:56

Unkil asking India to do A Monkey's asha and solution for cashmere problem is all nice and okay, doesnt have much impact on Mango SDREs

This DCH issue has the potential to massively shift the perception of mango SDREs. The only issue more dangerous is water -- Hillary motorma smartly sidestepped that one.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 13 Apr 2010 23:21

Anujan wrote:Unkil asking India to do A Monkey's asha and solution for cashmere problem is all nice and okay, doesnt have much impact on Mango SDREs

This DCH issue has the potential to massively shift the perception of mango SDREs. The only issue more dangerous is water -- Hillary motorma smartly sidestepped that one.

Can you elaborate on the ramifications of DCH issue and how they impact the mango SDRE's perceptions of Uncle?

Anujan · Post by **Anujan** » 14 Apr 2010 01:31

Ramana-ji, this is pure speculation and warm and fuzzy feelings onlee. So TFWIW

The Indian intelligensia and common uninformed SDREs have an underlying assumption that India is inept in managing her statecraft. From this angle, Unkil forcing India to do a monkey's asha and give concessions on the Kashmir issue, is perceived as a good thing: India is intransigent and the gentle admonishments of Unkil is needed for her to conduct herself in a sane way. If people like a typical BRF-ite shouts from the top of a tree about Pakistan's perfidy, it is lost in the usual "noise-level" of dissenting opinions and points of view. So these are fuzzy issues.

However, the DCH issue is quite black and white. An American Paki aided and abetted a terrorist operation and Unkil is shielding him.

I *do not* expect mango SDREs to take note of this and suddenly get riled up about Unkil. However, black and white issues like these present fantastic opportunities to elements (Politicians, Newspapers, Business groups, India's own spooks who want to PsyOps) to stir up a ruckus quite easily and efficiently to get attention/TRP ratings/brownie points and so on. In an argumentative and chaotic society like India it is highly likely that somebody is going to latch on this and start screaming from the rooftops and start to sound quite convincing.

The issue has "potential"

NRao · Post by **NRao** » 14 Apr 2010 01:46

arun wrote:Sadanand Dhume in the Wall Street Journal:

APRIL 13, 2010, 11:16 A.M. ET

The Pakistan Problem

President Obama risks alienating India by courting Islamabad.

By SADANAND DHUME

Mr. Obama also spoke about "shared values" between the United States and Pakistan, and "the fight we are both engaged in against extremists operating in South Asia."

WSJ

Pakistan is in South Asia, but South Asia is not in Pakistan!!!!

A_Gupta · Post by **A_Gupta** » 14 Apr 2010 02:01

shiv wrote:
tejas wrote: APJ Kalam once mentioned India should export missiles and openly defy the MTCR. Alas no one in the GOI had the cajones to do so.
Alternative explanations exist

a) Indian cojones are in the grip of some squeezer
b) Indian missiles are no good

Or APJ Kalam's idea wasn't the best thing to do?

Gerard · Post by **Gerard** » 14 Apr 2010 05:06

No US firm keen to invest in Indian infrastructure

American companies have so far not evinced any interest in investing in the huge Indian infrastructure market, which is estimated to be worth over $200 billion, Civil Aviation Minister Praful Patel said on Tuesday.

"It is with anguish that I say that not a single US company is really keen on investing in physical infrastructure," he said while referring to the immense scope of developing greenfield airports in the country which allows 100 per cent FDI.

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 14 Apr 2010 05:51

Gerard wrote:No US firm keen to invest in Indian infrastructure
American companies have so far not evinced any interest in investing in the huge Indian infrastructure market, which is estimated to be worth over $200 billion, Civil Aviation Minister Praful Patel said on Tuesday.

"It is with anguish that I say that not a single US company is really keen on investing in physical infrastructure," he said while referring to the immense scope of developing greenfield airports in the country which allows 100 per cent FDI.

Do the Americans know what the Indians dont know. Do these infrastructure will be the target in the event of a war.

NRao · Post by **NRao** » 14 Apr 2010 05:56

In the event of a war all high valued items will be targets. However, this reference to "infrastructure" includes all sorts of things: road, airports, ports, railway, etc. Japan IIRC is investing rather heavily - Mumbai-New Delhi "links"? This investment - by itself - would prominently reflect on the GDP.

arun · Post by **arun** » 14 Apr 2010 07:30

Shalav wrote:
RoyG wrote:India not invited to NAM luncheon hosted by Biden

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 797588.cms
They invited us to their house and insulted the Prime Minister of India! Despite this we will spend 10 of billions of $$$ buying sanction threatened US military and nuclear hardware.

Jai ho!

The Hindu on the shocking exclusion of India from the lunch hosted by the US VP Joseph Biden for the members of the Non Aligned Movement.

This is a diplomatic insult to India given that India was one of the founder members of NAM.

I await to see how our Congress Party led UPA Government of PM Manmohan Singh is going to react.

I suspect that our Governments reaction will be to shown that not even one of the tiniest pin feathers has been ruffled

.

The Hindu has thus been wise to have addd the word "May" in the article headline

.:

Wednesday, Apr 14, 2010

Biden's move may ruffle Indian feathers

Narayan Lakshman and Siddharth Varadarajan

India left out of lunch for NAM member states
Biden speaks on importance of NPT at gathering

Washington DC: In a move that is likely to ruffle some official feathers of the Indian delegation to the ongoing Nuclear Security Summit here, U.S. Vice-President Joseph Biden on Monday hosted a lunch for leaders and officials of 11 nations that “included heads of government and other representatives from nations in Africa, Asia and Latin America that are members of the Non-Aligned Movement”, according to a White House statement.

As one of the founding members of NAM the exclusion of India from lunch was a subject of discussion at a press briefing on Monday. To a question on what the Ministry of External Affairs made of Prime Minister Manmohan Singh not being invited to Mr. Biden's home, MEA spokesman Vishnu Prakash said he had no information about the lunch........................

Hindu

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 14 Apr 2010 07:44

arun wrote:
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 797588.cms

The Hindu on the shocking exclusion of India from the lunch hosted by the US VP Joseph Biden for the members of the Non Aligned Movement.

This is a diplomatic insult to India given that India was one of the founder members of NAM.

I await to see how our Congress Party led UPA Government of PM Manmohan Singh is going to react.

They are trying to force a change in the govt and maybe change in the party which rules the center inside India. The entire generation of the jolawala which was trained for NAM and is the current ruling elite is not a favorite of the western capital anymore.
They may want a quick change or a party revolt.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 14 Apr 2010 07:52

IOW don't be so gleeful. Its Indians who should change the UPA and not any interlopers, sorry interlocutors.

negi · Post by **negi** » 14 Apr 2010 08:11

Goes to show what happens when a group of sissies talk big and make a gang without any military/financial clout to back it but all they have is British era romanticism and some misplaced priorities .

This should be an eye opener for those who believed in the farce called NAM

, from Unkil's pov inclusion of India on any platform which is supposed to preach and ostensibly work towards disarmament would mean not only acknowledging India as a NWS but also giving it a platform to voice its opinion on matters where until now GOTUS has had the final say .

From what I have observed the way US and its poodles deal with any other country in these matters is that it takes either a bad boy like RU and China or a sore looser like TSP who can hold the rest to a ransom via nuclear blackmail for Unkil to pay attention and address their concerns , unfortunately India does not fall in either of above mentioned groups and hence it is of little significance to Unkil or any other world power for that matter who are very aggressive and assertive when it comes to pursuing their interests . As long as we have bunch of romanticists and 'healing touch' types formulating our foreign policy based on some sorry ideals we would continue to face the trishankoo treatment in world politics.

Pulikeshi · Post by **Pulikeshi** » 14 Apr 2010 08:23

Looks like the US wants to be non-aligned between India and China!

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 14 Apr 2010 09:21

ramana wrote:IOW don't be so gleeful. Its Indians who should change the UPA and not any interlopers, sorry interlocutors.

They tried to change the Indian govt by using the attack on Mumbai in 2008. But it failed. It got elected again in 2009

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 14 Apr 2010 09:26

What sort of pride can come from being included in NAM? Alternatively what sort of shame can come from not being included?

As a rhetorical question how many of us on here are clamoring for Nehruvian values to be strengthened and reimposed? Panchsheel anyone? UN mediation on Kushmeer? So why the takleef about Non aligned? Sauce for goose cannot become chutney for gander.

If India is not in NATO, and India is not in Warsaw pact, and India is not in NAM - it is truly trooly non aligned no?

As an aside I am not very well informed about events in the US. I sincerely hope Yugoslavia and Cuba were invited. Egypt? Was Egypt there. I am sure the Egyptians would be as insulted as we are at such a slight.

Pranav · Post by **Pranav** » 14 Apr 2010 10:04

Acharya wrote:
ramana wrote:IOW don't be so gleeful. Its Indians who should change the UPA and not any interlopers, sorry interlocutors.
They tried to change the Indian govt by using the attack on Mumbai in 2008. But it failed. It got elected again in 2009

Acharya ji, this appears to be pure speculation. I think western elites have a good equation with top leadership of present govt. There may be institutional inertia - for example not all cabinet ministers or bureaucrats will follow the western line on issues like global warming. But these functionaries can be eased out over time by the top leadership.

Pranav · Post by **Pranav** » 14 Apr 2010 10:13

Acharya wrote:
Gerard wrote:No US firm keen to invest in Indian infrastructure American companies have so far not evinced any interest in investing in the huge Indian infrastructure market, which is estimated to be worth over $200 billion, Civil Aviation Minister Praful Patel said on Tuesday.

"It is with anguish that I say that not a single US company is really keen on investing in physical infrastructure," he said while referring to the immense scope of developing greenfield airports in the country which allows 100 per cent FDI.
Do the Americans know what the Indians dont know. Do these infrastructure will be the target in the event of a war.

Yes that is a valid angle to explore. But OTOH it is also true that in present recessionary times, capital may be scarce.

Carl_T · Post by **Carl_T** » 14 Apr 2010 10:45

Or there is not a high enough return on investment?

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 14 Apr 2010 11:01

Audio file of the Press Conference by Prime Minister Dr. Manmohan Singh at the Willard Intercontinental in Washington, DC

http://www.indianembassy.org/Voice/PM%2 ... 132010.MP3

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 14 Apr 2010 11:02

Briefing by MEA Official Spokesperson on Prime Minister's bilateral meetings

http://www.indianembassy.org/newsite/pr ... /Apr/9.asp

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 14 Apr 2010 11:02

Statement by the Prime Minister of India Dr. Manmohan Singh at the Nuclear Security Summit

http://www.indianembassy.org/newsite/pr ... Apr/10.asp

csharma · Post by **csharma** » 14 Apr 2010 11:54

B Raman on Obama and India US relatioship. Similar to what I was saying about looking at the actions and not sweet talk.
That's why the CR piece in TOI seemed like spin to show all is well. Also suits PMO since they are seen as the biggest backers of pro US policies.

http://www.southasiaanalysis.org/papers ... r3761.html

What I Cautioned About Obama Before He Became President

There has been a gradual disenchantment with President Barack Obama in India ever since he became the President in January 2009. Despite all the visuals of Obama in the company of Prime Minister Manmohan Singh and his statements and remarks relating to India made by him or on his behalf by his officials during Dr.Manmohan Singh’s much-hyped State visit to Washington DC in November last year and during his current visit for the Nuclear Security Summit, Obama’s actions in matters of interest and concern to India have been either unhelpful or detrimental to India. His positive vibrations for Pakistan have come out clearly on many occasions----the latest being after his one-to-meeting with Prime Minister Yousef Raza Gilani of Pakistan in the margins of the Nuclear Security Summit. Whatever little I have studied of Obama since he first indicated his Presidential aspirations has strengthened my misgivings about him and created a suspicion in my mind that as a political leader he is as insincere as Richard Nixon though not as crude because he successfully hides his insincerity and as naïve as Jimmy Carter. I am giving below extracts from my articles on Obama written before he became the President for whatever they are worth.

shukla · Post by **shukla** » 14 Apr 2010 12:03

Headley: Obama assures access to India

US President Barack Obama has assured India that it would get access to Pakistani-American terrorist David Headley, who has confessed to plotting the Mumbai attacks, Prime Minister Manmohan Singh said on Wednesday.

"I raised that matter with the President and he did mention to me that he is aware of the legal position, and that we would get access to David Headley," Singh told a press conference here, wrapping up his 4-day US visit.

Pranav · Post by **Pranav** » 14 Apr 2010 12:23

csharma wrote:B Raman on Obama and India US relatioship.

http://www.southasiaanalysis.org/papers ... r3761.html

What I Cautioned About Obama Before He Became President

It is simplistic to blame Obama - he does not have that much control. The policies are decided by think tanks sponsored by the elite families - such as the CFR (Council on Foreign Relations) in the US and Chatham House in UK.

Carl_T · Post by **Carl_T** » 14 Apr 2010 12:45

I think Obama has been great for the US, but I feel that he simply doesn't care much for India or Israel. I think India is just not a priority for him. I don't think there's anything wrong with that, but we shouldn't complain about his approval.

On the other hand maybe the way to think about it is: US has a particular set of strategic interests, and in addition, Obama has strategic interests within the US just as well. Obama's concerns are primarily domestic, and a big part of that is closing the wars within a year or two. So I think whatever gets him there is what the US will plump for.

In his second term, when that equation changes, then relations might be different.

I think Israel has a real gripe though!