India-US News and Discussion

Rangudu · Post by **Rangudu** » 14 Jun 2010 21:14

Let me put it this way, a true Indian nationalist would more likely read Sanskrit shlokas first thing in the morning, not Urdu papers or English broadsheets. This may sound a tad bigoted but consider the fact that we all "think" and feel in our native tongues. You cannot come to grips with the ties between the modern Indian nation-state and the idea of the Indian civilization if your bedrock ideals are not grounded in some sort of Sanskrit-base.

This is why MMS really believes in the nonsensical notion of "we cannot grow unless we placate TSP" etc.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 14 Jun 2010 21:16

http://www.dailypioneer.com/262449/More ... hmadi.html

Monday, June 14, 2010
More trouble for Ahmadi

Abraham Thomas | New Delhi

Already in controversy for diluting charges against the accused in the Bhopal gas tragedy, former Chief Justice of India AM Ahmadi who scripted the 1996 judgment is in for more trouble.

A day after Union Law Minister M Veerappa Moily opened attack against Justice Ahmadi for reducing the tragedy to an “accident”, a petition is all set to be filed in the Supreme Court demanding removal of Justice Ahmadi from the chairmanship of Bhopal Memorial Hospital Trust.

Advocate Charan Lal Sahu, who had earlier challenged the settlement for compensation given to victims of the Bhopal tragedy as “illegal” has now decided to file a petition in the Supreme Court demanding removal of Justice Ahmadi from the Trust.

Speaking to The Pioneer, he said, “There is no provision of law to appoint an ex-CJI as chairman of a private trust. Moreover, nobody is made a lifetime chairman.” As a lifetime chairman of the hospital, Sahu alleged, “The hospital did not cater to the welfare of the victims. There were instances of misuse of funds and favourable appointments.”

Even in the 1996 judgment, the Bench of then Chief Justice Ahmadi and Justice SB Majumdar overlooked crucial evidence that linked Union Carbide, its Indian subsidiary UCIL and its officials as being liable under IPC Section 304 Part II.

Among the documents produced by the CBI to establish case was a document dated November 13, 1973 titled Foreign Collaboration Agreement. Under it, the US-based Union Carbide was solely liable for the supply of design, know-how and safety measures for the production, storage and use of the poisonous methyl iso-cyanite (MIC) gas. The court noted, “Investigation has, however, disclosed that the factory at Bhopal was deficient in many safety aspects.”

But despite noting so, the Bench held, “The erection and commissioning of the plant was done under the strict control of the experts of UCC. The Indians in this plant were only working under their direction.” Thus, instead of holding the UCC liable for the mishap, the court used the document to exonerate UCIL and its officials of its criminal liability under Section 304 Part II.

Another crucial document that was overlooked by the court was the communication exchanged between UCIL and UCC for closing down the factory as it incurred losses of over Rs 5 crore in the first 10 months of 1984. The letter dated October 26, 1984 (barely a month before the tragedy) by Union Carbide’s Hong Kong subsidiary to UCIL requested for a “feasibility report” for dismantling the Bhopal plant and the cost estimate for its shipment. This was the evidence to indicate that the plant had become useless and this showed lack of interest on the part of the management to correct the deficiencies pointed out by Operational Safety Survey Report carried out by the company in 1982. But even this fact was not considered by the court.

Commenting on the handling of the case by the apex Bench in 1996, Moily on Saturday said, “The case was converted to 304A, which is meant for car accidents. For an offence of this dimension, I am sorry it was reduced…It is the judiciary and not the executive that is to blame for the Bhopal mess.”

Carl_T · Post by **Carl_T** » 14 Jun 2010 21:24

Rangudu wrote:Let me put it this way, a true Indian nationalist would more likely read Sanskrit shlokas first thing in the morning, not Urdu papers or English broadsheets. This may sound a tad bigoted but consider the fact that we all "think" and feel in our native tongues. You cannot come to grips with the ties between the modern Indian nation-state and the idea of the Indian civilization if your bedrock ideals are not grounded in some sort of Sanskrit-base.

like Gandhi?

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 14 Jun 2010 22:33

Carl_T:

I am not so sure. I have thought long and hard; but Gandhi's non-violent BS in the face of irredentist TSP terror only invites desirion and contempt. Even for the so called liberal west which makes documentaries, confers Oscars on actors playing Gandee, Gandee is at best exotic, and they will be the first one to shoot first and talk later, if at all, if they can get away with it.

I don't think complete non violence is in tune with human characteristics. Just as greed is a natural human trait and thats why capitalism works better that communist ideology. So, yes Gandhi has some nationalist traits if you take away his cowardly non violence at any cost crap.

Carl_T · Post by **Carl_T** » 14 Jun 2010 22:36

Sorry, I spoke in jest. I was only referring to the part where Rangudu says a true nationalist will read Sanskrit shlokas first, and you know of Gandhi's affinity for the Gita. Point was - would he accept Gandhi as a leader because he read Sanskrit verse?

Rangudu · Post by **Rangudu** » 14 Jun 2010 22:41

Carl_T,

Gandhiji was a leader and nationalist that guys like me or you do not even deserve to critique. BTW, you are misrepresenting what I said.

Reading Sanksrit verses does not make a man a nationalist. I was referring to the grounding behind the person, for example, the first place you reach for insight or inspiration when in trouble, how you frame issues, etc.

Vashishtha · Post by **Vashishtha** » 14 Jun 2010 22:57

Guys, I was just watching ndtv 24/7 and news flashed by that anderson had me thet then president and the home minister narsima rao.

One serious question, what did the US do back then to arm twist India??

Nihat · Post by **Nihat** » 14 Jun 2010 23:07

'Strategic dialogue paved the way for Obama's visit'

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 14 Jun 2010 23:37

CRamS:
You make several good points. The ability to connect with the people and take them along with you towards prosperity. Right now he appears like a consultant. Even, Obama - considered as a good orator, is receiving flak from his own party and left wing for not displaying emotion during the BP-Gulf-Oil-Gate.

He would be good in Finance, Environment, Law & Justice, Commerce & Industry, HR Development itiyadi.

One more reason he (or for that matter Vajpayee himself) is not a good leader is that he has not been creating leaders. We all know the allegation/rumors against MMS - he is just keeping the PM seat warm for Rahul to get anointed. However it is reasonable to expect, a PM to not have time to groom leaders for the future as he has a job of running the country. But then because of his penchant to focus mostly on the domestic, he could be missing some opportunities of thrusting India in the global arena as much as jingoes want.

Rahul Shukla · Post by **Rahul Shukla** » 15 Jun 2010 00:03

Vashishtha wrote:Guys... narsima rao.

Shri. Pamulaparthi Venkata Narasimha Rao!

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 15 Jun 2010 00:08

CRamS wrote:
He comes across as a mere observer on India, not a leader of India.

How does he come across as a observer on India. Can you explain. Why is he not leading the country

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 15 Jun 2010 00:57

http://news.rediff.com/slide-show/2010/ ... -blake.htm

'US very proud of its progress with India'
( Shabash MMS)

Q. Since the inaugural US-India Strategic Dialogue, you have been on a veritable blitz in speaking about these meetings -- from briefings to Web chats to blog forums. What's with this campaign? Is it to show the US administration's commitment to this relationship, which some analysts and commentators in both India and the United States had raised doubts about?

A.It's certainly to show commitment to the relationship, but it's part of Secretary (of State Hillary) Clinton's priority that she attaches to public diplomacy and to doing as much public outreach as possible about the initiatives that we and the (US) State Department are undertaking.

We are very proud of the progress we are making with India and we think it's also important to try to dispel some of the doubts you referred to. So, as with any big dialogue that we have with China or Brazil or any of the other countries, we do this kind of thing. And, we are also expanding now to use a lot of the new social media.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 15 Jun 2010 01:24

Rangudu wrote:Let me put it this way, a true Indian nationalist would more likely read Sanskrit shlokas first thing in the morning, not Urdu papers or English broadsheets. This may sound a tad bigoted but consider the fact that we all "think" and feel in our native tongues. You cannot come to grips with the ties between the modern Indian nation-state and the idea of the Indian civilization if your bedrock ideals are not grounded in some sort of Sanskrit-base.

This is why MMS really believes in the nonsensical notion of "we cannot grow unless we placate TSP" etc.

Start the week with Vishnu Sahasranamam.

You are right. Its the frame of reference and all those long posts lamenting the DIEfication of Indian elite are about losing this frame of reference or normatizing.

Rudradev · Post by **Rudradev** » 15 Jun 2010 02:20

Normatization emasculates even well-intentioned people by cutting them off from their roots in a very fundamental sense. Most tragically seen when Michael Weasel was able to quote Sanskrit shlok at California Textbook Protestors who could not reply in kind... even as he was systematically demeaning Hinduism and Dharmic culture. If I think and feel as an American, I cannot fight for my civilization as effectively as if I think and feel as an Indian does. That is irrespective of what my passport may say, or even of my loyalty to political entities.

That is exactly my problem with the Jindals and Haleys of the world... not their choice of religion but their conscious decision to cut the civilizational umbilical cord. They should have kept it intact, if not for themselves then for their children.

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 15 Jun 2010 02:41

^^^
For the 2nd, 3rd... generations I don't understand the need for the umbilical cord if they are going to lead a life as an American. Can you elaborate your point little more?

Rudradev · Post by **Rudradev** » 15 Jun 2010 03:25

Nobody leads life as just an "American." Everybody in the USA has a distinct civilizational identity of some sort beyond that.

Everyone who isn't white does, anyway, and many who are white do as well.

If they don't have a strong enough identity, or a strong enough connection to their civilizational narrative, the children of SDRE immigrants will be poached. But that's not all.

A vast, untold number of fine SDRE genomes go to waste because the people carrying them die of diphtheria or malnutrition or monsoon floods; or because, even if they live, grinding poverty simply deprives them of any opportunity for realization whatsoever.

It is a lucky few of our people who manage to get to places where the necessities of life are amply met and opportunity is plentiful. They have a chance to realize themselves which, at this point in our history, only the tiniest fraction of our people can avail themselves of. Isn't it tragic for us, as a people, if those individuals should squander their civilizational heritage by succumbing to deracination?

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 15 Jun 2010 03:45

SwamyG, Thirty years ago I attended a gathering of intellectuals in New York. The proposition was should the Indian community oppose the Census counting us apart from the Caucasian population. Till then we were in the pool. The brightest of them were saying we are same as Caucasians and shouldnt let the census count us separately. One lady prof from Rutgers stood up and said yes its true we are the brighetst but how can we ensure that future gens will educate their children and get the quality of education which is the basis for our success? So let them count so in future we know what we are for now its lost in the Caucasian pool. In the end her views prevailed and the community did not oppose the count. Fortunately it showed we are doing well and her fears are unfounded in the short term.

1980 Census was the first to have Indian Americans among Asian and Pacific Islanders away from the Caucasian pool. I might be worng on details as I was a nunha munna thinker.

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 15 Jun 2010 06:35

Rudradev: Poached? In what sense? Religious? What is the harm in desis (or for that matter) others getting deracinated? Seeking better life is intrinsic human nature. As a desi jingo, I do see countries with excess land and resources as a good candidate for migration, example: Australia.

Ramana: How will counting Indian origin people separately ensure future generations educate their children? If the 1st generation considers education so valuable wouldn't they do all it takes to educate their kids irrespective of being counted as brown, black, white or something else.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 15 Jun 2010 07:26

Rudradev wrote:Nobody leads life as just an "American." Everybody in the USA has a distinct civilizational identity of some sort beyond that.

Everyone who isn't white does, anyway, and many who are white do as well.

If they don't have a strong enough identity, or a strong enough connection to their civilizational narrative, the children of SDRE immigrants will be poached.

This topic interests me greatly. And anything I say may be OT for this thread. I do not consider myself to be in a position to comment with authority here, but as usual I have some thoughts that are awaiting validation or dismissal.

There are certain things that are taught to children between the ages of 0 and 5 and never taught again. When people become adults and have children - they in turn teach that stuff to their children between ages 0 and 5 and those children in turn pass on that info to their kids between ages of 0 and 5. Yes there could be some modification from schooling and experiences, but it is entirely possible (and likely) that some vestiges remain, depending on what is instilled between ages 0-5 and how strongly it has been inculcated. I believe that racist beliefs, fear of blacks or "inferior humans" and some other traits are passed on in this way and may go on for 10 or 15 generations without modification because once the knowledge is "inside" and the knowledge does not interfere with day to day life (like getting you arrested or punished) there is nothing to modify that knowledge. Naipaul gives a classic example of this in which he is repulsed by the idea of "drinking from the same glass" ("jootha") despite the fact that his family had lost all contact with India for a century or more and the trait was absent in his adopted country.

If this observation is accurate, it should be possible to "retrieve" vestiges of old culture from seemingly "poached" individuals. My main interest in this area has been to see if ancient South American culture can be pieced together from the poached populations of South America. The study itself probably involves mulitiple specialities including archaeology, sociology, linguistics etc. It is definitely possible to pick up pre-Christian traits from European populations - the, songs and folklore. Similarly - it may be possible to figure out the pre Islamic stuff from Arabs and others. Sorry to go OT.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 15 Jun 2010 08:40

Good question. And think it through!

naren · Post by **naren** » 15 Jun 2010 09:00

Rudradev wrote:Nobody leads life as just an "American." Everybody in the USA has a distinct civilizational identity of some sort beyond that.

Not the regular whites AFAIK (may be some elite families). They proudly say "oh we are all American onlee". The "civilizational identitiy" people still carry was the result of segregation. Today even though there is no official discrimination, there are still race-exclusive neighbourhoods which contributes to this "civilizational identity". As far as the official principle is concerned, it is "e pluribus unum".

shiv wrote:There are certain things that are taught to children between the ages of 0 and 5 and never taught again. When people become adults and have children - they in turn teach that stuff to their children between ages 0 and 5 and those children in turn pass on that info to their kids between ages of 0 and 5. Yes there could be some modification from schooling and experiences, but it is entirely possible (and likely) that some vestiges remain, depending on what is instilled between ages 0-5 and how strongly it has been inculcated. I believe that racist beliefs, fear of blacks or "inferior humans" and some other traits are passed on in this way and may go on for 10 or 15 generations without modification because once the knowledge is "inside" and the knowledge does not interfere with day to day life (like getting you arrested or punished) there is nothing to modify that knowledge. Naipaul gives a classic example of this in which he is repulsed by the idea of "drinking from the same glass" ("jootha") despite the fact that his family had lost all contact with India for a century or more and the trait was absent in his adopted country.

IMO, the "forgotten" culture needs to exist on a social level in order to revive it.

If this observation is accurate, it should be possible to "retrieve" vestiges of old culture from seemingly "poached" individuals. My main interest in this area has been to see if ancient South American culture can be pieced together from the poached populations of South America. The study itself probably involves mulitiple specialities including archaeology, sociology, linguistics etc. It is definitely possible to pick up pre-Christian traits from European populations - the, songs and folklore. Similarly - it may be possible to figure out the pre Islamic stuff from Arabs and others. Sorry to go OT.

Chk this docu. Cracking the Maya Code. They talk about how they reconstructed the Mayan written language & the attempts to revive it.

We also have the case of Israelis reviving the Hebrew language.

Satya_anveshi · Post by **Satya_anveshi** » 15 Jun 2010 09:44

shiv wrote:My main interest in this area has been to see if ancient South American culture can be pieced together from the poached populations of South America.

Pardon my OT ( short one but no way meant to be a serious post

) Below is a snippet of a show by famous sf based stand up comedian but the relevent part may be of interest to you: (not for easily offended with language)

http://comedians.jokes.com/carlos-menci ... rist-pt--1

shukla · Post by **shukla** » 15 Jun 2010 19:27

Common sense prevails..

U.S. to object to China-Pakistan nuclear reactor deal

The deal is expected to be discussed next week at a meeting in New Zealand of the 46-nation Nuclear Suppliers Group (NSG), which monitors such transactions. Experts had said it appears to be a violation of international guidelines forbidding nuclear exports to countries that have not signed the nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty or do not have international safeguards on reactors. Pakistan has not signed the treaty.

China has suggested that the sale is grandfathered from before it joined the NSG in 2004, because it was completing work on two earlier reactors for Pakistan at the time. But U.S. officials disagree.

"Additional nuclear cooperation with Pakistan beyond those specific projects that were grandfathered in 2004 would require consensus approval" by the NSG, a U.S. official said, speaking on the condition of anonymity, "which we believe is extremely unlikely." State Department spokesman Gordon DuGuid said the U.S. government "has reiterated to the Chinese government that the United States expects Beijing to cooperate with Pakistan in ways consistent with Chinese nonproliferation obligations."

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 15 Jun 2010 20:41

What explains Chincom's brazeness in trying to prop up TSP? Is there nothing India can do to deter Chincoms from such abhorrent behavior?

Rangudu · Post by **Rangudu** » 15 Jun 2010 20:52

CRamS wrote:What explains Chincom's brazeness in trying to prop up TSP? Is there nothing India can do to deter Chincoms from such abhorrent behavior?

They do it because they can and they believe they need to prop up TSP or face an "unleashed" India.

Nothing worries the mandarins more than trouble in the periphery of their domain. The Northeast is fairly secure (Russian demographics), the East is contained (Divided Korea and a benign Japan after WW2), West is weak (CARs) and the Southern threat is fragmented (Vietnam, Cambodia, Philippines etc.). That only leaves India, which serves as a natural reserve base for the Tibetan nation to reclaim its place at an appropriate time.

That's why China has settled border issues with all but stubbornly refuses to do so with India.

A stronger India can tap the Tibetan anger and work to unify the ASEAN insecurities, while nudging Japan to abandon its diffidence. Regardless, this will happen sooner or later as a natural reaction to a belligerent and power drunk China.

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 15 Jun 2010 21:43

>>>That only leaves India, which serves as a natural reserve base for the Tibetan nation to reclaim its place at an appropriate time.
Yeah, when like all Tibetans are dead & gone elsewhere? Sabar ka fal meeta hota hain, only if one ultimately gets want one desires. I am sorry to say the current Dalai Lama is more of a rock-star celebrity who plays nice with everyone singing Khumbaya. He might have attracted other celebrities and created soft spot; but right now they all look like Zimbabwean currency.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 15 Jun 2010 22:28

I think its lip service by US to pretend they are against the nuke sale to TSP by PRC. The PRC will transfer more nukes to TSP and US wont and more importantly cant do anything about it.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 16 Jun 2010 08:51

Adil Shahriyar, the son of Muhammad Yunus (yes, Muhammad Yunus, at whose place Rajiv's brother Sanjay's wedding reportedly took place!) was tried in a US Federal Court by a jury, and convicted on a five count indictment and sentenced in 1982 by District Court to 35 years hard labour in prison for trying to blow up a ship, illegal possession of firearms and carrying them across State borders and drug trafficking.

He appealed to the 11th Circuit US Court of Appeals which rejected the appeal on 21 November 1983 saying, "We find that the evidence presented at trial was sufficient to support the verdicts and therefore affirm the district court's denial of the motion for judgment of acquittal"

Rajiv Gandhi became PM on 31st October 1984. It was just at that time -- 3rd December 1984 -- that the Bhopal tragedy shook the world. Reagan was the US President !

Warren is freed and soon after Adil Shahriyar was granted presidential pardon "as a goodwill gesture" on June 11, 1985 and went back to his doting father!!

Does that explain how Anderson got released? Quid pro?

Tell me is it just a coincidence!!

http://www.thehindubusinessline.com/201 ... 471000.htm

A riddle, wrapped in a mystery, inside an enigma

Oh what a tangled web we weave,

When first we practise to deceive!

– Sir Walter Scott

Since everybody is on the job of unravelling the mystery behind the abrupt release of the Chairman, Mr Warren Anderson, of the Union Carbide, after first arresting him on arrival in Bhopal after the horrendous tragedy, why not I throw my hat in the ring? But first, in fairness, I must make a disclaimer and ask for caution.

What I am going to set out falls within the domain of deductive logic, heavily borrowing from the tell-tale technique of fictional heroes, Sherlock Holmes and Hercule Poirot. The clues are all in favour of supporting the proposition that Rajiv Gandhi had a compelling reason to want to oblige the US Administration by releasing Warren Anderson.

I would not have ventured to come out with it unless I had thought it plausible after obtaining the honestly-expressed views of many friends with long experience of holding high responsibilities and eminent in their own spheres.

I simply narrate the happenings at the same period as when the gruesome catastrophe took place at Bhopal for you to mull over.

The happenings

Now, to the happenings before and after the Bhopal tragedy insofar as it relates to Rajiv Gandhi. Adil Shahriyar, the son of Muhammad Yunus, who was almost a part of the Indira Gandhi family, and a mentor of both Rajiv Gandhi and Sanjay Gandhi, was tried in a US District Court by a jury, and convicted on an indictment of five counts ( including trying to blow up a ship, illegal possession of firearms and carrying them across State borders and drug trafficking) and sentenced in 1982 to 35 years hard labour in prison.

He appealed to the 11th Circuit US Court of Appeals which rejected the appeal on November 21, 1983 saying, “We find that the evidence presented at trial was sufficient to support the verdicts and therefore affirm the district court's (judgment).”

It is not unreasonable to imagine what a shock this would have been toYunus and how desperate he must have been to get his son released by using the influence of his highly placed friends. The fact of his leaving no stone unturned is evident from the fact that at one stage, the famous actor Charlton Heston ( Ten Commandments, Benhur, The Bold and the Beautiful) got into the act to write to the US Attorney General, William F. Smith, asking him to intervene in the case. That he was sternly rebuffed is another matter.

When Rajiv Gandhi became the Prime Minister, it is not far-fetched to believe that he must have come under relentless pressure from Yunus to make the release of Adil from US jail his topmost priority, even if it be by using his position and broaching the matter directly to President Ronald Reagan.

It was just at that time — December 3, 1984 — the Bhopal tragedy shook the world. If Rajiv Gandhi's appeal to Reagan on Yunus' behalf were to succeed, it was imperative to make a gesture that would somehow make President Reagan deal with Rajiv Gandhi's request favourably.

Good bargain

Hey, presto! Warren Anderson is given VIP treatment and allowed to fly out of the country on December 7, 1984 and Adil Shahriyar is granted presidential pardon “as a goodwill gesture” and “for reasons of state” on June 11, 1985.

It certainly was a good bargain to exchange a convict undergoing a 35-year sentence for heinous offences in the US for an American corporate honcho, in order to oblige a long-time family friend.

B. S. RAGHAVAN

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 16 Jun 2010 09:09

Patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel: Samuel Johnson

http://www.dailypioneer.com/263013/Blam ... -Cong.html

Wednesday, June 16, 2010

Blaming Rajiv on Bhopal not patriotic: Cong

PTI | New Delhi

Reacting sharply to BJP's allegation that UCIL chief Warren Anderson could not have left the country without former Prime Minister Rajiv Gandhi's knowledge, Congress on Tuesday said those levelling such allegation were not patriotic.

"Rajiv Gandhi or his government had nothing to do with it. It is baseless and cheap to insinuate that a Prime Minister, who had to sacrifice his mother just one and half month ago (before assuming his office) and then sacrificed his own life five years later for the nation's integrity, allowed somebody to escape out of the country under any pressure (from the US)," Party spokesperson Manish Tewari said.

Tewari added, "I do not think that those who are levelling such allegations have any patriotism left in them."

His comments came a day after BJP spokesperson Rajiv Pratap Rudy said it would be impossible to believe Anderson left the country without knowledge of then External Affairs Minister, a portfolio held by Gandhi.

He said there were reports that Gandhi had received a communication from then US President on ensuring safe passage to Anderson.

Tewari said in the last twenty six years after the Bhopal gas tragedy in 1984, eight governments came at the Centre and pursued the case along with many national and international NGOs.

"After this, if the country feels and rightly feels so that justice was not done, it clearly points out it was a systemic failure and it needs to be addressed. That is why the Prime Minister has constituted a Group of Ministers. We need to address the systemic failure to see what amendments are required in legal structure and how to strengthen prosecution," he said.

All India Women Congress chief Prabha Thakur in a statement strongly objected to Gujarat Chief Minister Narendra Modi seeking a reply from Congress President Sonia Gandhi on the Bhopal issue.

"Modi's move to seek a reply from Gandhi on this issue is a cheap attempt to mislead people of the country... people know that Gandhi had no connection with politics 25 years ago," she said.

They are now politicising the issue, which is like applying salt instead of balm to the wounds of the victims. People know Modi's politics of baking bread on the pyres," Thakur said.

She, however, ducked queries on whether the then Madhya Pradesh Chief Minister Arjun Singh should break his silence on the issue.

"If Arjun Singh knows something and he speaks, what objection should I have? Why should he not speak? If you ask he will definitely speak," was her response to repeated questions on whether she would like to see Singh speak out on the issue.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 16 Jun 2010 17:13

Rajiv is a convenient scapegoat too.RK Dhawan's statements about PC Alexander and his shortcomings,ambitions,spy scandal,etc.,show that a coterie of advisors around Rajiv-including Arjun Singh (whose silence on the issue is deafening!) could've persuaded him that Anderson could be allowed to leave as he would return (which he never did).We will never know the truth though.MMS's diktat ,lampooned in a great cartoon,that the babus in "10 days time find out what happened in the last 26 years".

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 16 Jun 2010 20:33

Philip wrote:Rajiv is a convenient scapegoat too.RK Dhawan's statements about PC Alexander and his shortcomings,ambitions,spy scandal,etc.,show that a coterie of advisors around Rajiv-including Arjun Singh (whose silence on the issue is deafening!) could've persuaded him that Anderson could be allowed to leave as he would return (which he never did).We will never know the truth though.MMS's diktat ,lampooned in a great cartoon,that the babus in "10 days time find out what happened in the last 26 years".

Philip some news report revealed that:

Ronald Reagan-> Rajiv Gandhi-> Arjun Singh-> Chief Secy Madhya Pradesh-> Collector and SP to get Anderson released

At same time there was earlier coordination between US Embassy and MEA Secy M.K. Rasgotra to ensure he wont be arrested whcih he was.

M K Rasgotra is no talking yet.

Ameet · Post by **Ameet** » 16 Jun 2010 21:48

India invested $26.6 bn; created 60,000 jobs in US in last 5 years

http://www.hindustantimes.com/India-inv ... 58682.aspx

India, often accused by American politicians of hijacking jobs from "Buffalo to Bangalore", has actually created about 60,000 jobs in the US in the last five years with investments topping $26.6 billion, says a new study.

These investments included 372 acquisitions worth $21 billion by 239 Indian companies and 127 greenfield investments worth $5.5 billion between 2004 and 2009, said the report, "How America Benefits from Economic Engagement with India", released on Tuesday by Congressman Jim McDermott.

Karan Dixit · Post by **Karan Dixit** » 17 Jun 2010 07:15

Global Vehicles USA. Inc. claims Mahindra and Mahindra Ltd.'s haggling with emission and safety testing contractors has delayed the government certification the company needs to sell the compact diesel trucks in the US, according to a report by GlobalAtlanta.com, a business news publication in Atlanta.

http://www.newkerala.com/news/fullnews-128588.html

Muppalla · Post by **Muppalla** » 17 Jun 2010 07:37

Army chief warns against govt-to-govt deals with US

NEW DELHI: For the first time since India began big-ticket defence purchases from the US through government-to-government route, a senior member of the security establishment has red-flagged them, calling attention to the serious pitfalls of it.

In an unusual reflection of Army's frustration with its past FMS (foreign military sales) purchases from the US, Army chief General V K Singh has written to defence minister A K Antony, cautioning the government about the troubles with FMS.

Over the past few years, the Indian defence establishment has been using the FMS programme of the US government to carry out major defence acquisitions.

In these non-tender purchases, the US government procures the equipment on behalf of the Indian government from its military companies, and takes a commission for the services rendered through Pentagon's Defense Security Cooperation Agency (DSCA).

The purchase of AN/TPQ-37 firefinder weapon-locating radars for the Army in 2002 was the first major deal that India did with the US under FMS in several decades. Ever since, India has been buying several major defence systems regularly, and the total contract value of US systems bought under the FMS deal runs into several billion dollars.

The Army chief's letter of caution comes at a time when the two sides are in the final stages of finalizing two major FMS purchases — one for the Army and the other for the IAF. The Army is proposing to buy 145 ultra light howitzers worth about $647 million, mostly for deployment along the China border, while the IAF is planning to buy 10 C-17 transport aircraft at a cost of over $2.2 billion.

Singed by the troubles with past FMS contracts, the Army top brass is now discussing the possibility of hiring corporate lawyers well versed in international negotiations and contracts to come on board for scrutinizing the upcoming contract for howitzers, authoritative sources said. These lawyers would ensure that the past troubles are kept away, source said.

Gen Singh is believed to have pointed out to Antony Army's trouble with maintenance of a dozen weapon-locating radars bought from the US firm Raytheon. At times, up to two-thirds of the radars have been in want of maintenance, Army sources said.

Gen Singh's letter to Antony is an unusual step, and was "forced by the troubles we have with maintenance of the radar systems", an Army source said.

India has been using the non-tender, FMS route to buy big-ticket defence items from the US since 2002, when the radars became the first items to be bought under the scheme in recent memory. Over the past eight years, the military has carried out a host of acquisitions through the route. Among them were the $2.21 billion purchase of eight Boeing P-8I maritime reconnaissance aircraft, $962 million deal for six C-130J Hercules transport aircraft for IAF and $88 million for USS Trenton and accompanying helicopters for the Navy.

The IAF is currently in the final stages of negotiations for purchase of $2.2 billion worth 10 C-17 aircraft and the Army is finalizing the purchase of howitzers.

Prem Kumar · Post by **Prem Kumar** » 17 Jun 2010 09:08

shukla wrote:Common sense prevails..

U.S. to object to China-Pakistan nuclear reactor deal

Its not about common sense. U.S blessing will be in exchange for some pound of flesh from both China & Pak. Or possibly, they might completely block the deal in exchange for nuke liability bill to be passed by India. Time will tell.

Prem Kumar · Post by **Prem Kumar** » 17 Jun 2010 09:10

Muppalla wrote:Army chief warns against govt-to-govt deals with US

Expect more Indian Army tarnishing articles to appear - of the upper brass - possibly against the Army chief himself. These will be faithfully blown out of proportion by Massa's front newspapers like TOI-let.

V_Raman · Post by **V_Raman** » 17 Jun 2010 13:53

Prem Kumar wrote:
shukla wrote:Common sense prevails..

U.S. to object to China-Pakistan nuclear reactor deal
Its not about common sense. U.S blessing will be in exchange for some pound of flesh from both China & Pak. Or possibly, they might completely block the deal in exchange for nuke liability bill to be passed by India. Time will tell.

what if india says go ahead and do as you wish?

Sanku · Post by **Sanku** » 17 Jun 2010 15:44

http://www.ndtv.com/news/india/bhopal-g ... php?u=1025

Bhopal gas tragedy: Centre arranged Anderson's release, says ex-US diplomat

Gordon Streeb: The only people I dealt with were at the ministry so as far as I know this was a decision by the Government of India at the federal level, at the central level.

shukla · Post by **shukla** » 17 Jun 2010 16:20

Prem Kumar wrote:
shukla wrote:Common sense prevails..

U.S. to object to China-Pakistan nuclear reactor deal
Its not about common sense. U.S blessing will be in exchange for some pound of flesh from both China & Pak. Or possibly, they might completely block the deal in exchange for nuke liability bill to be passed by India. Time will tell.

The nuke liability bill will go through irrespective (fortunately or unfortunately).. not related I am afraid.

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 17 Jun 2010 16:39

ramana wrote:I think its lip service by US to pretend they are against the nuke sale to TSP by PRC. The PRC will transfer more nukes to TSP and US wont and more importantly cant do anything about it.

Views from the Foggy Bottom is always different. Others do not seem to read it properly