Discussion on Indian Epics, Texts, Treatises & Kathas

Abhi_G · Post by **Abhi_G** » 02 Jul 2010 19:25

^^
I meant "aa" as the second vowel as in aakriti/aakruti. Not the one in "raant (rant), you mention. I do not know how to write the devnagari script in this editor.

PS: Not prejudice, but just a preference. The tendency to cut short end too abruptly in some parts of India gets extremely distracting - especially when listen to Vedas etc.

Yes, it depends on how the ear is trained.

jamwal · Post by **jamwal** » 02 Jul 2010 20:01

putnanja wrote:
Sanskrit has the "a", but Hindi doesn't. In sanskrit, when you spell राम , it is pronounced as "rama". In hindi, it is pronounced as "ram". In kannada, it is pronounced the same as in Sanskrit, though there are local variations too.

Isn't it written as राम: when pronounced as रामा?

Carl_T · Post by **Carl_T** » 02 Jul 2010 20:16

It is pronounced as RAmah, and that's what the final -a indicates, it does not indicate RAmA. In Hindi, the pronounciations change and the final -a is removed. Just like it should really be Krshna and not Krishna.

svenkat · Post by **svenkat** » 02 Jul 2010 21:35

I think Southern Brahmins when writing in English use the correct pronunciation rama(pronounced as Raama),krishna(krushna or krsna).It is not Ramaa or Krishnaa.The Sambhodhana in the Rama shabda is He Raama.My knowledge of samskritam is very limited.(again southerners use samskritam rather than sanskrit.,samsara than sansar or samskara than sanskar.The staccato ending ram,krishn,Dev,sanskrit does jar to southern ears.

Also Telugus and Tamils generally prefer the -m ending like nagaram than nagar.Almost as a reaction to the tamils,I might be wrong,Kannadigas prefer Ramanagara etc.Is it pronounced as SM Krishna or SM krishnaa? Can Kannadiga jingoes clarify?In tamizh,raman,krishnan,vishvanathan is used to indicate the masculine singular third person-avan-He.

No offense meant to people speaking Hindi.Clarifications welcome

putnanja · Post by **putnanja** » 02 Jul 2010 22:58

In Kannada, rama is pronounced as rama, where as in tamil, it usually is raman. Kannada follows sanskrit in that sense. nagara(city) is pronounced same way in kannada and sanskrit. it becomes nagar in hindi and nagaram in tamil.

Krishna is pronounced as Krishna, not Krishnaa(female form). In sanskrit and kannada, raama is written is राम and raamaa is written as रामा . similarly, krishna is कृष्ण and krishnaa (female gender of krishna, another name of draupadi) is कृष्णा

Sanskrit grammar is very beautiful, and it is very easy to memorize. I forgotten lots of it though, unfortunately. Since pronounciation is similar to sanskrit in Kannada and Telugu, sanskrit is very easy to grasp. I believe malayalam has lots of words common with sanskrit, so it may be even easier for them.

Carl_T · Post by **Carl_T** » 03 Jul 2010 01:22

putnanja wrote: Sanskrit grammar is very beautiful, and it is very easy to memorize. I forgotten lots of it though, unfortunately. Since pronounciation is similar to sanskrit in Kannada and Telugu, sanskrit is very easy to grasp. I believe malayalam has lots of words common with sanskrit, so it may be even easier for them.

You must be well removed from your student days.

I thought sanskrit grammar was quite hard, I remember trying to memorize the five different tenses, and each of these systems had a number of different tenses and each conjugated different roots differently. And that was just the beginning!

Nouns are easy for Indic speakers, verbs are whole nother story.

ravar · Post by **ravar** » 03 Jul 2010 14:52

I believe malayalam has lots of words common with sanskrit, so it may be even easier for them.

True. Being a native Malayalam speaker, I found it extremely easy to learn Samskrit. I also think it was because of my exposure to Malayalam classical literature (which has a lot in common with Samskrit) more than the vernacular.

I thought sanskrit grammar was quite hard, I remember trying to memorize the five different tenses, and each of these systems had a number of different tenses and each conjugated different roots differently. And that was just the beginning!

This was initially an issue for me as I was simply flummoxed by the different permutation combinations as I do not believe learning anything just by rote. But, I soon realized that was just a mental block since my teacher just coaxed me into believing that it is possible and soon I could master it without any difficulty. It truly was an experience in pushing my limits but not as much in flipping my mental switch to the realms of possibility.

Atri · Post by **Atri** » 03 Jul 2010 17:15

Abhi_G wrote:^^^^
I am not sure about the Manipur connection and Uloopi. Uloopi was definitely Naag kanya but the northeastern India connection (Pragjyotish) was due to Chitraangadaa who bore Babhruvahan to Arjun.

Uloopi was one of Arjuna's wives. While Arjuna was in Manipur, the widow Naga princess became infatuated with him. She caused him to be abducted after he had been intoxicated with potent concoctions and had him conveyed to her realm in the netherworld. There, Uloopi induced an unwilling Arjuna to take her for a wife. She was the mother of Iravan. She later restored Arjuna to the lamenting Chitrangada, one of Arjuna's other wives. She played a major part in the upbringing of Arjuna and Chitrangada's son, Babhruvahan. She was also able to restore Arjuna to life after he was slain in battle by Babruvahana. When Arjuna was given a curse by the Vasus, Bhishma's brothers, after he killed Bhishma in the Kurukshetra war, she redeemed Arjuna from the curse.

Yagnasri · Post by **Yagnasri** » 04 Jul 2010 17:55

Funny thing is that the so called Dravida languages with exception to Tamil all have maximum no of Sanskrit words and most of the earlier litarature is mainly free transalation of sanskrit epics and ramayana or mahabharatha. in this of course I am not sure about malayalam correct me if I am wrong. Even the Great sangam peots of Tamil literature have invoked Hindu gods only in their classics. Kamban's ramayanam is said to be on par with Valmikis.

Yet we say that their is a ligustic division in the country.

Abhi_G · Post by **Abhi_G** » 04 Jul 2010 23:03

Atri wrote:
Uloopi was one of Arjuna's wives. While Arjuna was in Manipur, the widow Naga princess became infatuated with him. She caused him to be abducted after he had been intoxicated with potent concoctions and had him conveyed to her realm in the netherworld. There, Uloopi induced an unwilling Arjuna to take her for a wife. She was the mother of Iravan. She later restored Arjuna to the lamenting Chitrangada, one of Arjuna's other wives. She played a major part in the upbringing of Arjuna and Chitrangada's son, Babhruvahan. She was also able to restore Arjuna to life after he was slain in battle by Babruvahana. When Arjuna was given a curse by the Vasus, Bhishma's brothers, after he killed Bhishma in the Kurukshetra war, she redeemed Arjuna from the curse.

er...you seem to have copy pasted directly from wikipedia unless you have composed the wikipedia text yourself originally.

Can you post any other independent source on Uloopi and Manipur? I am not saying that there is NO connection between the two but just cross checking.

I am quite sure of Chitraangada and the Pragjyotish connection from Tagore's nritya natya which I am familiar of independent of wikipedia.

brihaspati · Post by **brihaspati** » 05 Jul 2010 02:56

Pragjyotish could be anywhere from north eastern corner of Varendri, into Srihatta and Assam Valley. That may not pinpoint location of Chitrangaada and her clan. Arjuna's marital diplomacy journey appears to have concentrated on the eastern side of the Ganges Valley and more to the eastern Himalayas.

Why is it that Arjuna was sent off by Krishna [ assuming the literary device of the excuse of breaking the "conjugal visit" regulation] to the east? Does it mean that at this stage, the "east" had resources in political and military terms that could match or surpass the Punjab-UP based power of the Kurus?

Even though other eastern powers appear to have fought on Kuru side, that in fact reinforces the importance of the "east" in the then equation. Should we also see the Kuruskhetra war as an east-west struggle along the Gangetic Valley between Indians for claiming hegemony over the whole of the north/subcontinent?

putnanja · Post by **putnanja** » 05 Jul 2010 03:45

Magadha was in the east, ruled by Jarasandha. And the kurus and Jarasandha were wary of each other. Jarasandha had harassed the yadavas and driven them to Dwarka. Before Rajasuya yaga by Yudhishtira, Krishna took Bhima and arjuna to Magadha and had Jarasandha killed by Bhima. He then crowned Jarasandha's son Sahadeva who pledged alligence to Yudhistira. Then when all the four brothers of Yudhistira went in different directions to conquer land in Yudhistira's name to perfrom Rajasuya yaga, Bhima went to the east and subjugated all the kings there. MB also mentions that Bhima defeated the mlecchas in the east too.

So by the time Arjuna went to the east in piligrimage for having entered Yudhistira's chamber, the east was already captured and they were paying royalty to the kurus.

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 05 Jul 2010 05:03

>> Why is it that Arjuna was sent off by Krishna [ assuming the literary device of the excuse of breaking the "conjugal visit" regulation] to the east? Does it mean that at this stage, the "east" had resources in political and military terms that could match or surpass the Punjab-UP based power of the Kurus?

war elephants for one, the single most important military weapon of the day.

naren · Post by **naren** » 05 Jul 2010 14:56

Narayana Rao wrote:Funny thing is that the so called Dravida languages with exception to Tamil all have maximum no of Sanskrit words and most of the earlier litarature is mainly free transalation of sanskrit epics and ramayana or mahabharatha. in this of course I am not sure about malayalam correct me if I am wrong. Even the Great sangam peots of Tamil literature have invoked Hindu gods only in their classics. Kamban's ramayanam is said to be on par with Valmikis.

Yet we say that their is a ligustic division in the country.

Dravidianism is simply Bull-S. Dravidianists attempt to show that there existed a time, when there was pure Tamil, sans Hinduism. They attempted to use Thirukkural as the "secular" holy book to replace hindu texts (read yeevil vedas brought by invading Aryan Brahmins). Remember the Thiruvalluvar statue in Vivekanandar Rock ? The symbolism is "tamil is taller than hinduism". Funny thing, thirukkural is 400% halaal hindu literature. It talks about Dharma, Artha & Kama. There are explicit Kurals which make reference to God. Most of the tamil literature is religious in nature. There are many temples which have idols of Alwars and Nayanmars - tamil poets belonging to vaishnava & shaiva traditions who sung the praises of the gods. Hinduism and Tamil are inseparable. Fortunately, the "geniuses" down south attempted exactly against the same and failed at it.

Atri · Post by **Atri** » 05 Jul 2010 16:35

brihaspati wrote:Pragjyotish could be anywhere from north eastern corner of Varendri, into Srihatta and Assam Valley. That may not pinpoint location of Chitrangaada and her clan. Arjuna's marital diplomacy journey appears to have concentrated on the eastern side of the Ganges Valley and more to the eastern Himalayas.

The traditional knowledge places Pragjyotishpura as Guwahati...

Krishna himself ventured to Pragjyotishpura to defeat Narakasura and liberate the 16000 lady slaves. He installed naraka's son on the throne of pragjyotish who pledged subservience to Dharma as a ruler. His son (Bhagadatta) participated in great war from the side of kauravas and brought in a legion of elephants. He was killed by Bhima. Manipura is explicitly different from Pragjyotishpura.

As far as I remember, Ulupi released Arjuna back to earth (from Paatala OR Naga-loka) gates of Ganga (Ganga-Dwaar is the term used in Mahabharat). English translators translate it as place where ganga enters plains (modern Haridwar). By the name itself, I feel Ganga-dwar is place where she meets ocean.

He stays there for a some time when Iravaan was born. Then she released him to the place called Gangadwaar. He then proceeded to Kalinga and later met Chitrangada of Manipura. Then he goes on to burn Khandav forest and establish teh city of Indraprastha, abduct Subhadra. many years later, Raajsooya sacrifice is conducted when all these wives get to meet each other. (all this from aadi parva, chapter 206 to 215).

In later chapters during the Aswamedha sacrifice (after great war), when arjuna reached Manipur, babhruvahana (son of Chitrangada and Arjun) fought with him at the instigation of Uloopi and killed his own father. Chitrangada was annoyed at uloopi who then apologised and used her Sanjeevani mani to give "Jivan daan" to Arjun. She later explained that while visiting ganga, goddess ganga told uloopi that "vasu" were very angry with Arjuna for his cowardly slaying of Bhishma and had cursed him that Arjun will have to die at the hands of his own son. Hence her instigation to Babhruvaahana to fight against his father. (anugita parva, book 14 chapters 78 to 82).

Uloopi seems to have shifted the base from ganga-dwaar to NE India and ganges delta region, meanwhile..

Yagnasri · Post by **Yagnasri** » 05 Jul 2010 18:54

The word Naga was also used to for Andhras even during Shatawahanas period.

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 05 Jul 2010 19:05

Naren: Some scholars argue Tirukural is a Jaina literature too.

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 05 Jul 2010 19:06

Narayana Rao wrote:The word Naga was also used to for Andhras even during Shatawahanas period.

kashmir and areas around that too. taxila is supposed to have been set up by takshak, a naga king.

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 05 Jul 2010 19:10

Pulikeshi wrote:PS: Not prejudice, but just a preference. The tendency to cut short end too abruptly in some parts of India gets extremely distracting - especially when listen to Vedas etc.

It is distracting, annoying & fascinating.

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 05 Jul 2010 19:31

putnanja wrote:In sanskrit and kannada, raama is written is राम and raamaa is written as रामा .

Are you sure about the Sanskrit part?

brihaspati · Post by **brihaspati** » 05 Jul 2010 19:57

Pragjyotishpur identification with modern Guwahati is tenuous. The earliest settlement and urbanization discovered so far [of course it can change] centred around the Ambari area dates to the Mauryan [current academically approved] period. Moreover the historically verifiable narratives like that of Hieuen Tsang refer to Kamarupa and not Pragjytishpura.

It all depends on the crucial identification of "Sadanira" river of the Vedas, with Karatoa or Teesta-Karatoa combine in the ancient period as the eastern most boundary of Poundravardhan. Depending on the identification and location of the ancient confluences of Teesta [trisrota]-Karatoa, Ganga-Brahmaputra, etc, the identification of both "Kiratas" as well as Naraka's Pragjyotish could be anywhere to the east and south of modern Rangpur in BD is possible. MB itself gives little clue as to location.

The main claims of identIfying Kamarupa with Pragjyotish is primarily based on Bhagadatta's skill in using elephants, which led to identification of modern Goalpara region as the source. However, this does not rule out a kingdom that stretched further down the valley and into the flood plains of Ganga-Brahmaputra-Karatoa-Mahananda.

So if Pundrvardhan roughly coincides with north-western part of the Bengal delta, then anything to the south and east could belong to the kiratas, and denote Pragjyotish. We have to remember, that settlements in teh ancient period were restricted by the technology to clear land of forests. Flood plains were not that bad as now, because flood waters would rise slowly over vast plains and were not necessarily as damagaing as now due to intervention of dams. In fact most copper plate grants of the Kamarupa kings have been found in the plains around the brahmaputra-Ganga-Karatoa confluences in the ancient period [no longer active channels]. Extensive trade connections with west and south India and rouletted pottery of Roman origin is also found here. Confluences of rivers were typically used as ancient skandhabars and ports or capitals to control, trade, military and political resources.

MB also indicates that Naraka controlled people up to the "seas". So Gangadwar coudl actually mean the confluence of Ganges with Brahmaputra, which also perhaps had an ancient city or port city or settlement and centre of power of the south-east. Pargjyotish simply means "where the sun rises first" and could be a natural attribute given by later Gangetic valley civilizations to what they perhaps considered the "eastern" limit of their civilization.

putnanja · Post by **putnanja** » 05 Jul 2010 21:37

SwamyG wrote:
putnanja wrote:In sanskrit and kannada, raama is written is राम and raamaa is written as रामा .
Are you sure about the Sanskrit part?

Yes, in sanskrit it is more like रामः but I was simplifying it as it was more about the "a" sound at the end.

naren · Post by **naren** » 06 Jul 2010 03:35

SwamyG wrote:Naren: Some scholars argue Tirukural is a Jaina literature too.

I have heard that too. But there are problems with that argument. AFAIK, Jainism has no concept of God.

We have an entire adhikaram dedicated to "kadavul vazhththu" (praise to God).

பிறவிப் பெருங்கடல் நீந்துவர் நீந்தார்
இறைவன் அடிசேரா தார்.

(Check MK's psyops

He interprets "God", an unambiguous, explicit word, as husband/leader

)

So, the argument that Thirukkural is a Jain literature doesnt have much solid ground. May be politically motivated like the other loads of nonsense these guys propagate.

Chk this. Engey Brahmanan Tirukural and Geetha

putnanja · Post by **putnanja** » 17 Jul 2010 10:07

Prem wrote:One Bride for 2 Brothers: A Custom Fades in India

I first read about polyandry in some areas near Himalayas from the famous kannada novel Parva. This is a wonderful book written by a very famous Kannada write SL Bhyrappa. This has been translated into Telugu, Bengali, Tamil, English etc. This is a beautiful novel , which imagines how Mahabharatha would have taken place if there was absolutely no mythology associated with it. The story is written through the eyes of Kunti, Bheema, Draupadi, Satyaki, Arjuna etc. A very thought provoking novel. It sort of lingers in my mind long after I have finished reading the novel.

Brihaspati - I think this book might appeal to you guys too, given how you try to see beyond mythology in our narratives.

I recently finished reading it for the second time a month or so back, and it still haunts me. It is one book which looks at the logistics of Mahabharatha and how it affects everyone. How were the lakhs of soldiers fed, how the smell of human excreta was overpowering in the battle field, how did the warriors fight etc.

Try imagining Mahabharatha where there are no miracles, no super-humans, no mysterious births, no magical powers etc, no living god(krishna is potrayed as a statesman, not as God) and then think how it would have played out in history. But it still upholds the vedas as basis of Dharma though. SL Bhyrappa provides such a narrative. It is thought-provoking and makes you think.

It is not for those who brook no re-interpretations of epics and don't want anyone messing about with Vyasa's version. It definitely brings a new perspective to Mahabharatha, at least it did to mine.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 19 Jul 2010 20:24

X-post...

brihaspati wrote:It is difficult to explain away persistence of polyandry over long genetic evolution in any isolated community - because over time the difference in birth rates of women and men would tend to cancel out. I guess it was a transitional compromise from more matriarchal forms to more patriarchal forms.

Polygamy in the "historical Hindu" could have come about in exactly from such "group marriage" arrangements in the warrior classes. If there is conflict more males are likely to be eliminated so that one brother could end up with the wives of other brothers too [one interpretation of the "dwivara" or "devara" is that it means the "second line to be husband" or a "second husband"].

There are more famous instances of sleeping with the brother's wife than that of the Pandavas. Heck that example reminds me of a possible culture of that from which the Kurus themselves could have derived!

Can you care to give details instead of casting hints?

brihaspati · Post by **brihaspati** » 20 Jul 2010 04:22

ramanaji, you put me in a spot!

Bharadwaja's mother, Mamata, was the wife of Utathya, who was the brother of Brihaspati. Brihaspati impreganted Mamata and according to some sources he got into a fight within the womb with a sharer of the womb - the son dirghatamas by Utathya. Dirghatamas kicked his half-brother out of the womb before his time, when Brihaspati said to Mamat, `Bharadwajam,' `Cherish this child of two fathers.' Now it could be a narrative device which covers for premature birth of Bharadwaja, and the epithet "child of two fathers" could be given even without any half-brother embryo kicking him out.

Bharadwaja was adopted as a son of Bharata, and in fact given the throne over the heads of biological sons of Bharata. The power went back to biological descent, but Drona the son of Bharadwaja remained close to the Kuru clan.

PS: I am an only child, no bro or sis, and I have had no disputes with the Moon.

naren · Post by **naren** » 20 Jul 2010 05:42

--- not-cool-post met its 72

---

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 20 Jul 2010 06:18

Wow! No wonder Drona was so close to the Kuru kingdom and ha royal airs. But was Bharata's Bharadwaja same as Drona's father Bharadwaja?

brihaspati · Post by **brihaspati** » 20 Jul 2010 07:37

Kashyapa, Agastya all appear in both MB and Ramayana as actual participants in early part of the dynasties. I don't think the MB refs distinguish between the two Bhardwajas.

Naren ji,
I defended M in some party's inner meetings in connection with some front'al work. I was against using the disparaging "agnikanya-fagnikanya" (the dialect has provision for dwitta - like khaoa-dawa) on public speeches. I never used it myself when speaking publicly and was accused of being TMC sympathizer behind my back. I would rather that this type of expression (as in your post) not be used for any Indian lady. It does not become us. She has done nothing to deserve this, even if I do not support her politics. Hope you do not mind my saying so.

naren · Post by **naren** » 20 Jul 2010 07:45

^^^ Joke made in poor taste onlee, nothing serious, removed now.

brihaspati · Post by **brihaspati** » 20 Jul 2010 07:54

My apologies too for having to say that! Let's forget it.

There are classical passages that ask that the ideal wife behaves as the "beshya" in bed among other "ideal" qualities. But it is said in context. I have similarly objected to disparaging SG too here on the forum, if it is any consolation.

BajKhedawal · Post by **BajKhedawal** » 22 Jul 2010 23:23

Brihaspati and other Gurus with local/rural, deity/folklore knowledge, can you please look at this post and comment. Thanks.

http://forums.bharat-rakshak.com/viewto ... 70#p909570

partha · Post by **partha** » 22 Jul 2010 23:36

putnanja wrote:
Prem wrote:One Bride for 2 Brothers: A Custom Fades in India
I first read about polyandry in some areas near Himalayas from the famous kannada novel Parva. This is a wonderful book written by a very famous Kannada write SL Bhyrappa. This has been translated into Telugu, Bengali, Tamil, English etc. This is a beautiful novel , which imagines how Mahabharatha would have taken place if there was absolutely no mythology associated with it. The story is written through the eyes of Kunti, Bheema, Draupadi, Satyaki, Arjuna etc. A very thought provoking novel. It sort of lingers in my mind long after I have finished reading the novel.

Brihaspati - I think this book might appeal to you guys too, given how you try to see beyond mythology in our narratives.

I recently finished reading it for the second time a month or so back, and it still haunts me. It is one book which looks at the logistics of Mahabharatha and how it affects everyone. How were the lakhs of soldiers fed, how the smell of human excreta was overpowering in the battle field, how did the warriors fight etc.

Try imagining Mahabharatha where there are no miracles, no super-humans, no mysterious births, no magical powers etc, no living god(krishna is potrayed as a statesman, not as God) and then think how it would have played out in history. But it still upholds the vedas as basis of Dharma though. SL Bhyrappa provides such a narrative. It is thought-provoking and makes you think.

It is not for those who brook no re-interpretations of epics and don't want anyone messing about with Vyasa's version. It definitely brings a new perspective to Mahabharatha, at least it did to mine.

putnanja avare,
I am reading Parva currently and thoroughly enjoying it! Awesome book man..
There is a English translation of the book. Those who can't understand Kannada can read that.

putnanja · Post by **putnanja** » 23 Jul 2010 00:15

partha wrote: putnanja avare,
I am reading Parva currently and thoroughly enjoying it! Awesome book man..
There is a English translation of the book. Those who can't understand Kannada can read that.

cool! I hope you are reading the kannada version. The language and the emotions it evokes is unbelievable, at least to me!

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 23 Jul 2010 00:36

Atri,
Can you comment on Krishna's description of the power structure in Bharata before he urges Yudhistra to send his brothers on Dik vijaya?

Thanks, ramana

brihaspati · Post by **brihaspati** » 23 Jul 2010 03:15

putnanja wrote:
Prem wrote:One Bride for 2 Brothers: A Custom Fades in India
Brihaspati - I think this book might appeal to you guys too, given how you try to see beyond mythology in our narratives.

Getting the book in a week!

brihaspati · Post by **brihaspati** » 23 Jul 2010 03:30

BajKhedawal wrote:Brihaspati and other Gurus with local/rural, deity/folklore knowledge, can you please look at this post and comment. Thanks.

http://forums.bharat-rakshak.com/viewto ... 70#p909570

it would be nice to get a pic : the posture is important. Do you mean the padmasana or utthita-padmasana posture by "squatting"? Vairava is commonly seen as "urdha-linga" and "urdha-reta" - this is crucial in the tantric form where upward "travel" of the semen is seen to be the key to grasping kundalini. Urdhalinga Vairavas/rudras would be not uncommon in north-west India including Rajputana, and some of them date from Kushana/post Kushana times. There are several possibilities - but the picture may help clarify. The presence of the "she-demon" or one of the rudrani forms of kundalini/chandi, is not unexpected. In older times, they were perhaps brought together ritually. Depending on hints in the sculpture, it could date anywhere within the last 1500 years.

negi · Post by **negi** » 23 Jul 2010 03:49

Bhairav temples always have this haunting feel to them as they are located in remote hilltops . The prayers and offerings made are at odd hours so these are not frequented like Vaishnava temples. However I am yet to come across a sculpture as explicit as described by Bhaj

but given the kind of things people associate Bhairav with I am not at all surprised. In my village goats are sacrificed and alcohol and 'gur' offered to please our 'graam devata'.

BajKhedawal · Post by **BajKhedawal** » 23 Jul 2010 05:43

Negi this temple was right in the middle of the village square. Idol in clear display for all to see through iron rods spaced 2-3 inches apart, with villagers going about their usual business & rustic traffic with a few devotees of all sizes.

Brihaspati there's no way now that I can get a picture, I don’t even know the name of the place except that its on the way from Siwana to Nakoda. Idol posture was more like a wicket keeper sitting down but idol's back was straighter sort of rigid, knees more apart (90 degrees), and arms not in the way of his erect benis (unlike the picture attached for reference the idols butts were resting on his heels, more of a resting position rather than the ready to get up kind). Although the idol looked like painted with modern colors it could have been old as you suggest but the enclosure was new iron cast and unusually strong, why would they fortify him inside like that?

naren · Post by **naren** » 23 Jul 2010 06:10

^^^ may be like this ?