Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): Sep 03, 2010

James B · Post by **James B** » 08 Sep 2010 14:38

Orakzai cleared of militants: security forces

Can some one estimate how many kiya-nahi units it will take for the Talibs to reappear in Orakzai??

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 08 Sep 2010 14:41

Yahya Khan on the situation in East Pak in July 1971
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s9cHUJBt2Sw

naved · Post by **naved** » 08 Sep 2010 14:47

It's my first post, and I'd like to begin on a happy note...

IED Mubarak!!! 2 killed in a blast in Hub

Itseems it was in a market that sold bangles for the wimmens

Cheers and happy hunting i say

shravan · Post by **shravan** » 08 Sep 2010 14:56

Landmine attack at former senator’s house in Mohmand

PESHAWAR: At least two people were injured in a landmine attack at the house of a former senator in Khuizai tehsil of Mohmand Agency, Geo News reported Wednesday.

Neela · Post by **Neela** » 08 Sep 2010 15:07

shiv wrote:Yahya Khan on the situation in East Pak in July 1971
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s9cHUJBt2Sw

Your link vs my link.

Time Magazine Aug 1971 - The World: Good Soldier Yahya Khan

Westerners who know him well describe Yahya as a reasonable man but stubborn, proud and discipline-minded,

Mine is from Time. And westerners call him a reasonable man.
I win!

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 08 Sep 2010 15:10

Musharraf on his plans for Pakistan - Oct 1999
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HogQ0vXYXu8

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 08 Sep 2010 15:11

Neela wrote: Your link vs my link.

Time Magazine Aug 1971 - The World: Good Soldier Yahya Khan
Westerners who know him well describe Yahya as a reasonable man but stubborn, proud and discipline-minded,
Mine is from Time. And westerners call him a reasonable man.
I win!

Altair · Post by **Altair** » 08 Sep 2010 15:40

naved wrote:It's my first post, and I'd like to begin on a happy note...

IED Mubarak!!! 2 killed in a blast in Hub

Itseems it was in a market that sold bangles for the wimmens

Cheers and happy hunting i say

And Naved is off the mark with 2 runs on the very first ball!!
Welcome to BRF.
Hope you score a triple hundred before Id.

Vivek_A · Post by **Vivek_A** » 08 Sep 2010 16:15

Fruitcake time..

Traversing a lose-lose path
Published: September 8, 2010

It will soon be nine years since the 9/11 attacks on the US homeland. Since that time the Muslim World has continued to be bled by the US which remains traumatised nine years on. And the world has not only become more polarised, but also more violent and more bloodied by conflicts and asymmetric wars. Meanwhile, the US has neither been able to restructure the Muslim World as it wished, nor has it been able to convince its people they are safer than they were before 9/11 happened. All that has happened is that after an inconclusive war in Iraq the US has had to withdraw its troops, leaving behind a dissipated country weakened and polarised – a ready breeding ground for external players to fight proxy wars, while seeking to fill the vacuum of power.

Unfortunately, Pakistan is the only country which has fallen in line with US diktat, thanks to it successive pusillanimous leaders. As a result, Pakistan has and continues to suffer, more than any other, directly as a result of 9/11 and its disastrous aftermath resulting from a vengeful and misguided US policy in this region. The irony is that none of the perpetrators of 9/11 were Pakistani or connected in any way to Pakistan. Yet, the world has conveniently forgotten the Arab origins of these terrorists as the US has successfully wedded their identity with Pakistan!

But surely Pakistan must have gained some advantages by becoming the frontline state for the US-led “war on terror”. Well, there were some short-term monetary benefits which could have translated into long-term gains had we reformed and restructured our economy. Instead we let ourselves become hostage to the IMF. Again, the market access promised to us by the US and EU never happened but we kept delivering to them as they dictated and still continue to do so.
Our military got some new tactical toys including the F-16s but all these have come with debilitating conditionalities and since we had fared well without US military toys we should have continued on that conditionality-less path.

Vashishtha · Post by **Vashishtha** » 08 Sep 2010 16:34

Yet, the world has conveniently forgotten the Arab origins of these terrorists as the US has successfully wedded their identity with Pakistan!

Don't pakistanis consider themselves as arabs hain??
Hypocrisy zindabad!!!!

Dilbu · Post by **Dilbu** » 08 Sep 2010 16:56

Women, kids among 18 dead in NW Pakistani bombing

PESHAWAR, Pakistan — A car bomb ripped through a police compound in a northwestern Pakistani city, killing 18 people, including 14 women and children and four officers, the latest in a string of attacks proving that Islamist militants remain a potent force in the country.
The civilians killed were the wives and children of police officers, said Khalid Omarzai, the city's top government official. Another 94 people were wounded in Tuesday's bombing, he said, adding that they had been taken to hospitals after rescuers cleared rubble of over two dozen collapsed houses and shops.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 08 Sep 2010 17:00

Neela wrote:Time Magazine Aug 1971 - The World: Good Soldier Yahya Khan

From that competitive

link by Neela,

After partition, like most of the subcontinent's best soldiers, he opted to become a Pakistani (India, the saying goes, got all the bureaucrats).

Some fantastic myth-making by Pakistanis and their Western allies from very early time.

And, of course, like all true Pakistanis who trace their ancestry to either Prophet Muhammad, PBUH, or Babur, Ghazni etc,

Yahya (pronounced Ya-hee-uh) Khan claims direct descent from warrior nobles who fought in the elite armies of Nadir Shah, the Persian adventurer who conquered Delhi

Altair · Post by **Altair** » 08 Sep 2010 17:06

Dilbu wrote:Women, kids among 18 dead in NW Pakistani bombing
PESHAWAR, Pakistan — A car bomb ripped through a police compound in a northwestern Pakistani city, killing 18 people, including 14 women and children and four officers...

That is an expensive over!!
Seriously, Is killing women and children during supposedly holy month a sign of any civilization?

tejas · Post by **tejas** » 08 Sep 2010 17:15

^^^ One person's "adventurer" is another person's muslim mass murderer.

Dilbu · Post by **Dilbu** » 08 Sep 2010 17:16

I have a doubt if this is slow motion action replay of previous over. Attack on police compound was reported earlier.

A_Gupta · Post by **A_Gupta** » 08 Sep 2010 17:24

http://sify.com/news/pakistani-spy-arre ... dggcd.html
Pakistani spy arrested in Punjab

This is the fourth arrest of a Pakistani spy from this region over the last two months.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 08 Sep 2010 17:27

It is amazing going back to U-tube and seeing those great events of '71 once again.Bhuttos's "historic" speech at the UN,the "I'm going.." one takes the cake."Pakistan will fight again..we will build a new...better...great...Pakistan.."His verbiosity is what Pakis ned toady.After the floods,indeed a new Pakistan must be rebuilt,but left to the jokers at the helm of affairs,and the manner in which they are reacting to the crises that plague Pak,it will be the task of the survivors to build several new "Pakistan's" in he future!

Yahyah Khan was a man after my own heart.What a comedian lost to the silver screen! Blunt and to the point.His ability to show that he was anywhere in control of the situation was flawless.What a great team the late Peter Sellers,Herbert Lom and Yayha would've made.The current crop wouldn't fill a theater even if feee tkt. was given to the mob.

anupmisra · Post by **anupmisra** » 08 Sep 2010 17:29

IMF sets four criteria for $2.6bn loan tranches
Tough choice! But the pakis are used to such Hobsonian situations.

The International Monetary Fund has set four pre-conditions for continuing with Pakistan’s $11.3 billion standby arrangement (SBA) and withheld the release of two remaining tranches of $2.6 billion till the government meets the criteria.

The government did not meet the performance criteria set for the quarter (April-June 2010) and the review had to be delayed.

An official said Pakistan could have secured the emergency support through a simple letter, instead of spending a lot of time, energy and resources in the United States.

A 17-member Pakistani delegation stayed in the United States for more than 10 days for talks with the IMF on a belated macroeconomic review. A few members of the delegation have stayed back after completion of the official visit to celebrate Eid with their families.

IED Mubarak!

anupmisra · Post by **anupmisra** » 08 Sep 2010 17:32

SSridhar wrote:And, of course, like all true Pakistanis who trace their ancestry to either Prophet Muhammad, PBUH, or Babur, Ghazni etc,
Yahya (pronounced Ya-hee-uh) Khan claims direct descent from warrior nobles who fought in the elite armies of Nadir Shah, the Persian adventurer who conquered Delhi

So Yahya's ancestor was a common foot soldier in Nadir Shah's marauding army and left his "seed" in one of the local women. Did he stick around after that tryst with "Destinee" to raise his new found family? What does that make Yahya?

bart · Post by **bart** » 08 Sep 2010 18:01

Neela wrote: Time Magazine Aug 1971 - The World: Good Soldier Yahya Khan
Westerners who know him well describe Yahya as a reasonable man but stubborn, proud and discipline-minded,
Mine is from Time. And westerners call him a reasonable man.
I win!

He began a drive on corruption last year by summoning senior civil servants and telling them that they were all "a bunch of thieves." The bureaucracy ground to a halt in protest, and Yahya soon gave up the effort. But he shows no sign of yielding with the Bengalis, whom he reportedly calls macchar —Urdu for mosquitoes.

During World War II, he fought in the British Indian army in North Africa and Italy. After partition, like most of the subcontinent's best soldiers, he opted to become a Pakistani

I think the article nicely sums up American and Paki attitudes.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 08 Sep 2010 18:05

Raja of Mehmoodabad's son on why 'enemy property' should be returned to him etc.
I am posting this portion alone from an extensive interview because of its relevance here

My father was a very tortured and tormented soul. I was so privileged to be his son. He was a very fine man. A poet rather than a politician.

He was 40 something when Partition took place and was the youngest member of Jinnah's working committee.

In 1947 he was shocked to see what had happened and went into self-imposed exile to Iraq as an Indian and took all of us there.

We built a house in Karbala. It had two fountains -- one inside and one outside. There was a library with books and manuscripts.

He lived in Karbala and Baghdad for 10 years till '57. He lived there for two reasons because Karbala is city of the prince of martyrs and being in the vicinity of such a place, my father must have felt a certain solace that he was in the shadow of a shrine and this would be an expiation, a purging of the soul for sins he had never imagined could be committed as a result of Partition.

He was a very good man and had he not been that I would not have won the election with an unprecedented majority.

A majority of the people of Mahmoodabad are Hindu. They remembered the man and not the man connected in the creation of Pakistan.

When he was in Karbala perhaps he wanted his wounds to heal. He had a very ascetic life and great admiration for Gandhiji.

He went from there to Pakistan in '57, I came to India with my mother in '53-'54.

Of course, a son naturally will have affection for his father. But, the Raja of Mehmoodabad played a significant role in the creation of Pakistan. In 1940, at Lahore, when the Pakistan Resolution was introduced, he asserted that Pakistan would be an Islamic state based on Shariat. That tortured and tormented soul went to live in Pakistan, never to return to India.

Raja of Mehmudabad, a pillar of strength of the Muslim League in Dawn is a good read.

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 08 Sep 2010 18:09

the time article also highlights that the americans swallowed the paqui spin - hook(er), line and sinker!! this comes from their strategic ignorance of 'south asia' from post ww2

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 08 Sep 2010 18:18

Philip wrote: Yahyah Khan was a man after my own heart.What a comedian lost to the silver screen! Blunt and to the point.His ability to show that he was anywhere in control of the situation was flawless.What a great team the late Peter Sellers,Herbert Lom and Yayha would've made.The current crop wouldn't fill a theater even if feee tkt. was given to the mob.

Philip - you are a true judge of character. Yahya was a man to admire..read on

Neela · Post by **Neela** » 08 Sep 2010 18:35

Lalmohan wrote:the time article also highlights that the americans swallowed the paqui spin - hook(er), line and sinker!! this comes from their strategic ignorance of 'south asia' from post ww2

Lalmohan, please check the events of 1971.
Both Nixon and Kissinger were informed by the US embassies in the region.
IG also talked to Nixon.
IG went around the world apprising countries.
US knew of the genocide in Bangladesh.

Yahya Khan enabled Nixon' s visit to China in 1971.
India signed the friendship treaty with USSR in 1971.

To state that the Americans were gullible - does not add up.

I think the Americans first tried to test India with the USS Enterprise. I have heard of IAF considering Kamikaze tactics and also heard of a Soviet submarine ( can someone confirm ? ) on the Enterprises's tail which dissuaded the Americans.

Read this fascinating piece. Save this article folks. IG calling the US bluff and the role of Tibetans and Tibetan lives lost for a nation that was not theirs.
http://www.rediff.com/news/2006/dec/26claude.htm

CalvinH · Post by **CalvinH** » 08 Sep 2010 18:44

SSridhar wrote:
Neela wrote:Time Magazine Aug 1971 - The World: Good Soldier Yahya Khan
From that competitive link by Neela,
And, of course, like all true Pakistanis who trace their ancestry to either Prophet Muhammad, PBUH, or Babur, Ghazni etc,
Yahya (pronounced Ya-hee-uh) Khan claims direct descent from warrior nobles who fought in the elite armies of Nadir Shah, the Persian adventurer who conquered Delhi

At least he didnt declared that he was direct decendent of Nadir Shah and the Lal-quila rightfully belongs to him.

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 08 Sep 2010 18:47

neela, thanks for the tip
i am refering to only one aspect of american perceptions of pakistan and india, specifically that of the media and how it engages with military strong men that are favoured by the US government, in that era there were also similar strongmen all over latin america, mid east and asia that fitted the mould the americans liked
(there were also a lot of american journalists who highlighted the genocide in e bengal)

Suppiah · Post by **Suppiah** » 08 Sep 2010 18:48

shiv wrote: Philip - you are a true judge of character. Yahya was a man to admire..read on

Thanks for posting this book excerpt...am reading it online now!

Brad Goodman · Post by **Brad Goodman** » 08 Sep 2010 18:51

Funny I always thought paki's took offensive to be called as "paki" but seems like now they have taken a liking to it

Culture of Corruption is deep-rooted in Pak

Look at the banner held up by a student on 1st slide.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 08 Sep 2010 19:27

Brad Goodman wrote:Funny I always thought paki's took offensive to be called as "paki" but seems like now they have taken a liking to it

Culture of Corruption is deep-rooted in Pak

Look at the banner held up by a student on 1st slide.

That is an excellent article that explores Pakiness from all angles after doing a minor equalequal.

Altair · Post by **Altair** » 08 Sep 2010 19:33

Neela wrote: Read this fascinating piece. Save this article folks. IG calling the US bluff and the role of Tibetans and Tibetan lives lost for a nation that was not theirs.
http://www.rediff.com/news/2006/dec/26claude.htm

Can we get the 929 page publication? It might contain nice tidbits. It can be useful now especially since the situation is eerily similar.

Harshad · Post by **Harshad** » 08 Sep 2010 19:42

[quote="shiv"]
Philip - you are a true judge of character. Yahya was a man to admire..read on
[imghttp://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a11/cybersurg/brf/pak-yahya-exploit-119au6t.jpg[/img][/quote

Madam Black pearl made the right move. After all Cox bazaar was under attack by IN on december 14th

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 08 Sep 2010 19:43

anyone got photu of black pearl (presumably she was sDre?)

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 08 Sep 2010 19:44

Philip wrote:
Yahyah Khan was a man after my own heart.What a comedian lost to the silver screen! Blunt and to the point.His ability to show that he was anywhere in control of the situation was flawless.What a great team the late Peter Sellers,Herbert Lom and Yayha would've made.The current crop wouldn't fill a theater even if feee tkt. was given to the mob.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s9cHUJBt2Sw
Yayha Khan - No wonder

Pranav · Post by **Pranav** » 08 Sep 2010 20:17

Neela wrote: Read this fascinating piece. Save this article folks. IG calling the US bluff and the role of Tibetans and Tibetan lives lost for a nation that was not theirs.
http://www.rediff.com/news/2006/dec/26claude.htm

Another aspect that is not well known is the dubious role played by Gen Maneckshaw ... see this interview of Gen JFR Jacob - http://www.hinduonnet.com/nic/karan-gen-jacob.htm

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 08 Sep 2010 20:37

Pranav, Take it easy. The thinking in ND at that time was to liberate a piece of EP and declare BD in that area. Maj Gen Jacob saw an opportunity to take Dacca to finish the business and planned accordingly. So suggest not using incorrect words for Sam Bahadur.

surinder · Post by **surinder** » 08 Sep 2010 20:50

Karan Thapar is fishing for dirt on FM Maneckshaw. Note the interview, he is egging Gen. Jacobs to say something bad about Maneckshaw, sometimes putting words in his mouth.

Jacobs says, "no comment", thapar says that that means Jacobs, "refuses to deny", which the implication being that Jacobs aggrees. Cant he understand what "No Comment" means and have the courtesy to leave it at that.

Thapar does not say they he has an ex to grind, his own father was involved with a fight with Sam Bahadur. He does not mention his own conflict of interest.

disha · Post by **disha** » 08 Sep 2010 20:52

Pranav wrote:Another aspect that is not well known is the dubious role played by Gen Maneckshaw ... see this interview of Gen JFR Jacob - http://www.hinduonnet.com/nic/karan-gen-jacob.htm

I would not call Sam Bahadur's role dubios. First of all, war plans break apart at the first contact with enemy. Second, based on our capabilities and perceived capabilities of the enemy, it is necessary to make realistic assessments. No 1 paki = 10 SDRE or vice versa kind of crap. Also note that the officers were generally from the same school, and some of them worked together in WWII, so they could make an assessment of the other.

Gen. Jacob saw an opportunity and seized it, the fact that he was there in the staff with a contrarian opinion to Sam Bahadur, itself is a testimony to Sam Bahadur's leadership skills. KT has an ax to grind so he will twist the outcome of the interview for his own selfish ends.

It is just that even with the help of the 3.5 friends, pakis broke apart like a house of cards on both eastern and western fronts. It was clear then and there that without them, and their help in the security council, in 1971 itself, bharat would have become akhand bharat stretching all the way to durand line (different issue on how the politics would have played out later).

It was again proved in 1999 with the downhill skiing of their peach bottom musharrafs. At the end all their TFTA did not help them a bit.

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 08 Sep 2010 20:53

shiv wrote:
Brad Goodman wrote:Funny I always thought paki's took offensive to be called as "paki" but seems like now they have taken a liking to it

Culture of Corruption is deep-rooted in Pak

Look at the banner held up by a student on 1st slide.
That is an excellent article that explores Pakiness from all angles after doing a minor equalequal.

Talking about equal equal, I am truly mystyfied why Paki corruption, spot-fixing and their expose causes so much self loathing introspection among deracinated Indian elites? The same elites who are ever so willing to pelase and suck up to the west as if the white are role models of honor and truthfulness. Here is Sagarika Ghose, "humble correspondent" as she refers to herself, with her filthy equal equal that is beneath contempt; so much so that she has to subtly drag in Hinduism to justify her self-loathing pain:

The degradation of religion is also one of the reasons why we have become personally dishonest. The founders of modern India were deeply secular and pluralist yet came from a society which drew strength from an un-self-consciousness religiosity.

Not religion defined by hatred of others, violence and noisy political ideology, but religion defined as an old quiet traditional faith that provided an unobtrusive moral compass. Today, multi-crore events like dahi handi show that religion is a stage-managed artificially euphoric extravaganza that is failing to create role models of passionate honesty and courage.

Recently, I met a former Hindustan Times reporter now working for a newspaper here in US. He told me that Sagarika's dad was some big wig in West bengal and thats how she managed to get into the higher echelons of India's pontificating elite. So much for her "humbleness". Furthermore, somebody should educate her on the "moral" and "righteous" path that whites took to reach where they are now; and with absolute power over us SDREs, racist pipsqueaks like Michael Atherton and Mathey Hayden can point a derogatory, condescending finger at us.

Better still, such self-loathing, diseased intellectual midgets like Sagarika and her hubby Rajdeep and kids migrate to Australia or UK and clean toilets of Atherton, Hayden and other whites that she so looks up to as a way of washing off her sins and easing her self-loathing pain.

negi · Post by **negi** » 08 Sep 2010 21:00

One has to first read the assorted list of trash from 'Chootiya-nandan' Thapar to get a drift of his 'takleef'.

Karan Thapar's Hatchet Job on Sam Bahadur

This one is height of mofo-ism .
Secrets from the past

Two years ago Ayub’s son, Gohar, claimed his father had given him the name of an Indian Director of Military Operations from the 1950s who had sold the country’s war plans to the Pakistanis for 20,000 rupees. At the time this was dismissed as a silly if not pathetic lie. However, a few journalists like me tried to take Gohar seriously. We quizzed him about the six officers who had served as DMO in that decade. They were brigadiers Manekshaw, Daulet Singh, RB Chopra, KS Katoch, DC Mishra and Amrik Singh. But Gohar refused to name the one. If I recall correctly, Pranab Mukherjee, who was then Defence Minister, dismissed the allegation as laughable. But now I wonder, does Gohar know something we don’t?

Manny · Post by **Manny** » 08 Sep 2010 21:06

Neela Ji.

That's an awesome article from TIME.

Maybe its time to send this article to TIME Magazine and remind them that they are nothing but good solders for Goebbels.