India-US Strategic News and Discussion

merlin · Post by **merlin** » 23 Oct 2010 11:27

Will be interesting to see the flexibility of MMSs spine when Ombaba comes visiting

darshhan · Post by **darshhan** » 23 Oct 2010 11:35

abhishek_sharma wrote:Biggest US Inc team coming to India with Barack Obama

http://www.hindustantimes.com/Biggest-U ... 16654.aspx

So that they can earn profits from Indian market while US govt keeps on giving jiziya to the pakis.

darshhan · Post by **darshhan** » 23 Oct 2010 11:38

By the way there is an Interview scheduled with US ambassador to India Mr. Timothy Roemer at 10:30 PM at Headlines Today.

ShivaS · Post by **ShivaS** » 23 Oct 2010 12:13

Spine and MMS oxymoron?
Billary Clinton has just given 2 Billion dollars of Arms to TSP to protect Ombaba

VinodTK · Post by **VinodTK** » 23 Oct 2010 18:10

US could lift restrictions on hi-tech exports

“Certain to be on the agenda is the removal of the last remaining export controls on US dual-use technology and military hardware to India, including technology appropriate for development of space weapons,” says Mathew Hoey, founder Boston-based Military Space Transparency Project and a former senior research associate at the Institute for Defense and Disarmament Studies.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 23 Oct 2010 18:25

Our "strategic partner's" embarassing Iraqi torture expose by Wikileaks!''

Wikileaks: UN calls for US to investigate torture claims revealed in leaked reports
The United Nations has called for the US to investigate whether its officials knew about alleged torture and other ill-treatment of detainees held by Iraqi security forces.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldne ... ports.html

Secret Iraq war logs reveal how US turned blind eye to torture
Massive leak of military files exposes serial abuse of detainees, 15,000 previously unknown deaths and full toll from five years of carnage

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/oc ... f-comments

• US authorities failed to investigate hundreds of reports of abuse, torture, rape and even murder by Iraqi police and soldiers whose conduct appears to be systematic and normally unpunished.

• A US helicopter gunship involved in a notorious Baghdad incident had previously killed Iraqi insurgents after they tried to surrender.

• More than 15,000 civilians died in previously unknown incidents. US and UK officials have insisted that no official record of civilian casualties exists but the logs record 66,081 non-combatant deaths out of a total of 109,000 fatalities

AnuragK · Post by **AnuragK** » 23 Oct 2010 19:16

US modus operandi for total world hegemony: the last bastion - Asia

Post the demise of the Soviet Union, there has been a vacuum created for the post of global peer/co-hegemon cum regional hegemon for Asia/Eurasia. The Peoples Republic of China has been salivating at this opportunity and is leaving no stone unturned in its race to fill this vacuum. The USA which worked assiduously to dislodge/demolish its world co-hegemon - the USSR - and thus became the sole world hegemon, is in no mood to allow anyone else to even become a regional hegemon, leave alone a peer world hegemon.
The following article/opinion demonstrates how exactly the US is going about its gameplan with India as the locus in this gameplan:

India: U.S. Completes Global Military Structure

Opinion: Rick Rozoff
Friday, 10 September 2010

A September 8 report cited the Indian branch of the Deloitte consulting firm estimating that India plans to spend as much as $80 billion for its defense sector in the next five years. It quoted an Indian journalist, Rahul Bedi, a contributor to Jane's Defence Weekly, as stating "No one else is buying like India.”
Earlier this year the authoritative Stockholm International Peace Research Institute (SIPRI) disclosed that India had become the world's second-largest importer of weapons from 2005-2009, "importing 7% of the world’s arms exports." Only China imported more weaponry, though that nation is slated to purchase less foreign arms, both aggregate and percentile, in the coming years and the largest foreign supplier of its weapons is a non-Western country, Russia.
During the five-year period mentioned above, Indian arms imports more than doubled from $1.04 billion in 2005 to $2.2 billion in 2009. Over the past 20 years Russia has been far and away the main provider of arms to India, as the Soviet Union had been in previous decades, though "The United States, currently India’s sixth-biggest arms supplier, seems likely to leapfrog to second position once New Delhi starts paying for a series of recent and ongoing acquisitions."
Those contracts include $1.1 billion for C-130J Super Hercules transport planes, $3.4 billion for Globemaster airlifters and $2.1 billion for P-8I long-range maritime patrol aircraft. Reports in both the Russian and Chinese press speculate that when U.S. President Barack Obama visits India in November he "may secure $5 billion worth of arms sales," a deal that would make the US replace Russia as India's biggest arms supplier" and "help India curb China's rise."
The unprecedented weapons transactions could include "Patriot air defense batteries and Boeing mid-air refueling tankers.” "Observers point out that the role of India's biggest arms supplier is shifting from Russia to the United States." A Chinese news source added that Washington will also supply New Delhi with howitzers and that "the total cost of the deal may exceed $10 billion...."
The Economic Times of India disclosed in July that "talks are underway between Indian and US officials over a deal to sell 10 Boeing C-17 Globemaster III military transport aircraft to the Indian Air Force." Wang Mingzhi, a military strategist at the People's Liberation Army Air Force Command College, warned "once India gets the C-17 transport aircraft, the mobility of its forces stationed along the border with China will be improved."
In late August the U.S. signed a $170 million deal to supply India with 24 Harpoon Block II advanced air-to-surface anti-ship missiles.
This February the Wall Street Journal revealed that the Obama administration, with a renewed focus on the Asia-Pacific region, intends to massively increase arms sales to both India and its nuclear rival Pakistan. U.S. military sales to Pakistan have risen to $3 billion a year and are expected to nearly double in 2011. As for its neighbor, "India is one of the largest buyers of foreign-made munitions, with a long shopping list which includes warships, fighter jets, tanks and other weapons. Its defense budget is $30 billion for the fiscal year ending March 31, a 70% increase from five years ago." In January U.S. Secretary of Defense Robert Gates visited India and later in the month Washington secured a deal to sell India 145 U.S. howitzers for $647 million.
"The Obama administration is trying to persuade New Delhi to buy American jet fighters instead of Russian ones, a shift White House officials say would lead to closer military and political relations between India and the US. It would also be a bonanza for U.S. defense contractors, and the White House has dispatched senior officials such as Mr. Gates to New Delhi to deliver the message that Washington hopes India will choose American defense firms for major purchases in the years ahead."
The Wall Street Journal quoted Tom Captain, vice chairman and Global and U.S. Aerospace & Defense director at Deloitte headquarters in New York, as claiming "For 2010 and 2011, India could well be the most important market in the world for defense contractors looking to make foreign military sales," where Russian equipment accounts for about 70 percent of that currently in use.
Referring to India's plans to spend $10 billion for 126 multirole combat aircraft, Captain added: "That's the biggest deal in the world right now. If it goes to an American firm, that would be the final nail in the coffin in terms of India shifting its allegiance from Russia to the U.S."
Chairman of the U.S. Joint Chiefs of Staff Admiral Michael Mullen was in the Indian capital on July 22-23 and met with Defence Minister AK Antony, Air Chief Marshal Pradeep Vasant Naik and other military leaders. As a local news agency divulged, "Mullen's visit comes at a time when both sides are looking at expanding defense cooperation across a swathe of areas. "The visit also coincides with intensified lobbying for the $10 billion contract for 126 fighters for the Indian Air Force."
The White House is negotiating new export control agreements with India to assist American arms firms to sell more high-technology weapons to the Asian nation.
At the top of the list of U.S. objectives in expanding military ties with India are replacing Russia as the country's main arms supplier and the concomitant supplanting of Russian political influence, further tightening an Asian NATO around China and weakening the Shanghai Cooperation Organization, all to ensure unimpeded American presence and domination in Eurasia.
After the end of the Cold War and the fragmentation of the Soviet Union, the Pentagon was given free rein to operate worldwide, including in parts of the planet hitherto inaccessible to U.S. troops and bases.
U.S. European Command, through the expansion of NATO membership and graduated partnership programs, has secured the Defense Department a prevalent role in almost all of Europe and the South Caucasus.
Central Command has extended its role from the Middle East to Central Asia and further into South Asia and the Indian Ocean.
On October 1, 2002 U.S. Northern Command was established to oversee North America from Mexico's southern border to the Arctic Ocean. Six years later, US’ Africa Command was launched to subordinate 53 nations on and off the continent to American military and geopolitical strategy.
In the past decade the Pentagon has deployed troops, military equipment and ordnance - in some instances missiles - to new locations in Eastern Europe and the Black Sea region, the Middle East including the Persian Gulf, the Indian Ocean, Central and South Asia, and South America.
The final frontier is Asia, from China to Iran, with those parts of it not covered by Central Command assigned to U.S. Pacific Command, the largest overseas military structure in the world. Its area of responsibility takes in India, China and 60 percent of the population of the Earth.
In the 1990s so-called neoconservatives and realists alike from Paul Wolfowitz to Zbigniew Brzezinski triumphed in the emergence of the U.S. as the first, uncontested and only international superpower - what its current head of state Barack Obama called the world's sole military superpower in Oslo last December - and crafted plans to continue that unparalleled role into the indefinite future. What they agreed on was the need to guarantee that no other nation or group of nations rose to challenge American global supremacy, either on an international or a regional basis.
By regional was understood any part of the world. The most likely rivals would arise in Eurasia, the American geopoliticians warned. The ultimate nightmare for the imperial strategists was some version of what former Russian prime and foreign minister Yevgeny Primakov promoted as a strategic triangle of Russia, China and India.
An Indian commentary of approximately ten years ago described the U.S. counter-strategy as a policy of cultivating closer state-to-state relations with every nation in the world than any of those countries have with any other state, even their neighbors.
Thus the U.S. is arming India and Pakistan, regional military rivals possessing nuclear weapons outside the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty regime, as it is deepening defense ties with other nations on both sides of local conflicts and disputes: Armenia and Azerbaijan over Nagorno-Karabakh, Greece and Turkey over Cyprus and the skies over the Aegean Sea, Croatia and Slovenia over the Adriatic coast, Serbia and Kosovo over the latter, recognized by almost two-thirds of United Nation member states as a province of the former, and so on.
As the American corporate consultant quoted earlier pointed out, the best way of transforming the foreign policy orientation of other countries and subordinating them to Washington's global political agenda is by penetrating and gaining control over their armed forces.
The North Atlantic Treaty Organization and Africa Command alone have provided the Pentagon mechanisms for initiating and consolidating bilateral military ties with over 100 of the world's 192 nations (in the UN). NATO and AFRICOM have given the Pentagon a continent apiece. That is in addition to other, frequently older, military client states in Latin America and the Caribbean, the Middle East and the Asia-Pacific region.
By supplying arms to those nations and eliminating traditional rivals from that role, Washington is laying the groundwork for integrating almost every country in the world into its military network. Weapons sales are followed by instruction, maintenance, upgrade and field training agreements, with U.S. military personnel assigned to the purchasing nations.
Regional and other multinational air, naval, interceptor missile, armored and ground combat exercises and war games are held to test weapons in live-fire and other maneuvers and to provide the U.S. opportunities for simulated warfare against potential rivals' equipment, tactics and warfighting doctrine.
Pilots, soldiers, marines and sailors, including special forces, from military client nations are provided training in their own countries, in the U.S and in third countries to ensure weapons, deployment, command, communication and combat interoperability with the Pentagon for global missions.
This July the Reuters news agency reported that U.S. arms sales abroad could surge from $37.8 billion to $50 billion next year, an increase of almost one-third.
Vice Admiral Jeffrey Wieringa, director of the Pentagon's Defense Security Cooperation Agency - in charge of international financial and technical assistance, training and services and other military-to-military contacts - estimated a year ago "that weapons sales could reach a record $50 billion this year."
He added that U.S. arms sales have expanded from $8 billion ten years ago to $37.8 for the fiscal year ending this September 30 "and they are likely to continue growing in coming years...."
"Among the biggest potential arms deals on the table now are huge fighter jet competitions in India and Brazil, various modernization programs for Saudi Arabia, and continuing support for arms sales to Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan and Lebanon."
Wieringa was also cited applauding "a drive by Defense Secretary Robert Gates and other departments to reform cumbersome U.S. export laws," thus opening the floodgates for U.S. weapons sales throughout the world. Four years ago the New York Times documented that "A total of $21 billion in arms sales agreements were signed from September 2005 to September 2006, compared with $10.6 billion in the previous year," according to Pentagon data.
Nations that had never purchased American weaponry before and that only had negligible armed forces now offer lucrative prospects for American arms manufacturers. India is preeminent in the first category.
The weapons manufacturers' wares are produced for - deadly - use and not for simple display, deterrence and (dubious) prestige.
Weapons sales are promoted not only through international arms shows and exhibitions, but more so through actual demonstrations. War games suit that purpose, but war itself does it to a greater degree. The U.S. offered the world large-scale military hardware expositions in the three wars it launched in less than four years: Yugoslavia in 1999, Afghanistan in 2001 and Iraq in 2003.
The recent announcement that the U.S. will supply Saudi Arabia with a staggering $80 billion worth of arms in the next few years is paralleled by its plans to become India's main arms provider.
Weapons transactions are inextricably connected with overall military integration, and since 2002 - immediately following the U.S. invasion of Afghanistan and the Pentagon and its NATO allies moving into new military bases in that country, Kyrgyzstan, Tajikistan and Uzbekistan - Washington began regular (annual) air, sea and land maneuvers with India of ever-increasing scope and intensity.
Last October 12-29 the U.S. Army participated in the latest and largest of Yudh Abhyas ("training for war") war games held since 2004 with its Indian counterpart. Exercise Yudh Abhyas 2009 featured 1,000 troops, the U.S.'s Javelin anti-tank missile system and the first deployment of American Stryker armored combat vehicles outside the Afghan and Iraqi theaters of war. The Strykers were tested against Indian T-90 tanks, "currently the most modern tank in service with the Russian Ground Forces and Naval Infantry."
The U.S. ambassador to India, Timothy Roemer, said of the military maneuvers: "The broadened and unprecedented scope of Yudh Abhyas stands as a testament to the growing people-to-people and military-to-military ties of the United States and India, one of the key pillars of the expanded U.S.-India strategic partnership."
The Pentagon showcased both the Strykers and the Javelin third generation anti-tank guided missiles during the biggest-ever joint U.S.-Indian ground combat exercises and not without the desired effect.
An American press agency disclosed on September 3 that "Russia has traditionally been India's largest arms supplier but following evidence of the capabilities of U.S. military equipment during joint exercises with the Indian army, navy and air force, the Indian army decided to purchase several hundred Javelin anti-tank guided missiles, demonstrated during the war games....The Javelins were deployed for Indian forces for the first time in the Yudh Abhyas 09 joint military exercise in Babina, the largest war game that the two armies have had." Last month the Times of India reported that "India will order a 'large' number of the quite-expensive Javelin ATGM systems from the US. "The deal for the man-portable, fire-and-forget Javelin ATGM systems will once again be a direct government-to-government one under the American foreign military sales (FMS) program, without any global multi-vendor competition. "While the exact number of Javelin systems India will induct is yet to be decided, it could well run into thousands. The Army, after all, has a shortfall of around 44,000 ATGMs of different types...."
In July, Raytheon announced that India is evaluating the Patriot ground-based anti-ballistic missile system for purchase and deployment and that the U.S. had provided New Delhi with "classified" material on it recently. Sales of Patriot Advanced Capability-3 interceptor missiles to India are reported to be on Barack Obama's agenda during his November visit. By acquiring them, India would join fellow Asia-Pacific nations Japan, South Korea and Taiwan as well as NATO members Germany, Spain, the Netherlands and Greece and U.S. Middle East military clients Israel, Kuwait, Saudi Arabia and the United Arab Emirates. Joseph Garrett, Raytheon vice president and deputy for Patriot programs, disclosed that "A number of exchanges have taken place between the government of India and the US and information has been given to India at the classified level."
Patriots were "successfully used during both Desert Storm and Operation Iraqi Freedom, Patriot's manufacturer Raytheon has said." Seven consecutive years of Yudh Abhyas war games aren't the only joint U.S.-Indian military exercises held each year of late. In fact they are full spectrum in their range.
Starting shortly after the end of the Cold War, Washington initiated joint Malabar naval exercises with India. Suspended after the latter's nuclear tests in 1998, they resumed in 2002 and have grown in scale over the years.
Malabar 2002 included standard maritime maneuvers but also anti-submarine warfare exercises. The 2003 drills featured an American guided missile destroyer, a guided missile cruiser and a nuclear-powered fast attack submarine and two Indian guided missile frigates, a submarine and several aircraft which concentrated on anti-submarine warfare tactics.
2004 saw a continuation of anti-submarine drills and included a U.S. nuclear-powered fast attack submarine and anti-submarine and maritime surveillance aircraft. The next year's war games featured a U.S. nuclear-powered aircraft supercarrier for the first time and included a 24-hour simulated "war at sea" with the two nations' navies engaging in mock combat.
In 2006 an American expeditionary strike group (the USS Boxer Expeditionary Strike Group) consisting of over 6,500 U.S. Navy personnel, amphibious ships, cruisers, destroyers and submarines participated in the exercise for the first time. Also, with the inclusion of the Canadian navy the 2006 Malabar exercises expanded for the first time beyond the bilateral format of the preceding two years.
The next year was a watershed one in many respects. Malabar 2007 included 25 warships from five nations: In addition to the U.S. and India, participating countries were Australia, Japan and Singapore, at the time leading to suspicions of American plans to forge an Asian NATO. The drills were held for the first time in the Bay of Bengal off India's eastern coast, which further raised Chinese concerns, and extended into the Andaman Sea near the strategic Strait of Malacca.
The U.S. supplied 13 warships including the USS Nimitz nuclear supercarrier, the USS Kitty Hawk aircraft carrier, the USS Chicago nuclear submarine, two guided missile cruisers and six guided missile destroyers. Japan provided two destroyers, Singapore a frigate and Australia a frigate and a tanker.
Malabar 2008 returned to a bilateral context with the involvement of the USS Ronald Reagan Strike Group, a nuclear-powered fast attack submarine and a P-3 Orion anti-submarine plane.
4,000 personnel from three nations - the U.S., India and Japan - participated in last year's exercise which included anti-submarine warfare, surface warfare, air defense and live-fire gunnery training drills.
Malabar 2010 was conducted in April with ships, submarines, aircraft and personnel from the U.S. Navy’s Seventh Fleet, among which were a nuclear fast attack submarine, two guided missile destroyers, a guided missile cruiser, a guided missile frigate, Sea Hawk helicopters, anti-submarine aircraft and Navy SEALS.
The Pentagon hasn't been content to exercise its troops and weapons on India's soil and off its coasts. Starting in 2004 the U.S. has also led annual air combat maneuvers called Cope India.
The first series of bilateral aerial warfare exercises tested U.S. state-of-the-art F-15 Eagle fighters against Russian-made MiG-21, MiG-27, MiG-29 and Sukhoi Su-30 opposite numbers along with French-made Mirage 200 fighters. The U.S. warplanes were consistently bested by their MiG-21 and Su-30 rivals.
The Cope India maneuvers, like comparable ones in Romania and elsewhere in Eastern Europe and the Red Flag air combat exercises in the U.S., provide the Pentagon an opportunity to engage and compete against advanced Russian military aircraft for use in real war scenarios in the future.
Cope India 2005 pitted American F-16 Fighting Falcons against India's most advanced, largely Russian-produced, fighters in - for the first time in joint U.S.-Indian air exercises - a combat environment controlled by airborne warning and control system (AWACS) aircraft.
The next year over 250 U.S. airmen stationed throughout the Pacific region accompanied F-16 Fighting Falcons to India for Cope India 2006. The F-16s were deployed against the most advanced fighter in the Indian Air Force's arsenal, the Su-30 MKI (adapted from the Russian Su-30) as well as MiG-21, MiG-27, MiG-29 and Mirage 2000 fighters.
In 2008 an Indian Air Force contingent of eight Su-30 MKI fighters, two Russian-made in-flight refuellers, a Russian heavy lift transport aircraft and almost 250 airmen "winged their way halfway across the globe to the deserts of Nevada," to participate in an Exercise Red Flag, held three or four times a year in Nevada and Alaska and "acknowledged to be the most advanced and professionally challenging fighter exercise conducted anywhere in the world."
The exercise marked several precedents: It included the largest single deployment of the Indian Air Force outside India. It was the first time that the air forces of nations not in NATO or those of major non-NATO allies - India and South Korea - participated in Red Flag air combat maneuvers. "It was also the first time that the SU30 MKI, a frontline combat aircraft of Russian design, made its appearance in the American skies and that too in a multi-national congregation."
India was elevated to the status of an American strategic military ally, on the level of a NATO partner, on June 28, 2005 when U.S. Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld and Indian Defence Minister Pranab Mukherjee signed the New Framework for the U.S.-India Defense Relationship, in effect a ten-year defense pact.
India has become the convergence point for the U.S.-led NATO bloc moving from the west into Central and South Asia and the expansion of an Asia-Pacific NATO growing from its Japan-Australia-South Korea-Taiwan nucleus to absorb the ten members of the Association of Southeast Asian Nations (ASEAN): Brunei, Cambodia, Indonesia, Laos, Malaysia, Myanmar, the Philippines, Singapore, Thailand and Vietnam. Afghanistan, Pakistan, Bangladesh, Sri Lanka, Nepal, Mongolia, New Zealand and the five former Soviet Central Asian republics - Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, Tajikistan, Turkmenistan and Uzbekistan - are to varying degrees being integrated into the structure as well.
India is also intended as a central locus for the U.S. global interceptor missile grid based on land and sea and in the air and space, linking deployments in Eastern Europe, the Eastern Mediterranean, the South Caucasus and the Middle East to those in Japan, South Korea, Taiwan, Australia and Alaska, including the latter's Aleutian Islands.
Moving India into the Pentagon's column will not only affect the balance of forces in Asia but throughout the world.

Counter-opinions and critical evaluations are invited from all knowledgeable BRFites.

Pratyush · Post by **Pratyush** » 23 Oct 2010 19:28

The source URL please.

pgbhat · Post by **pgbhat** » 23 Oct 2010 19:29

^ Boss please go easy on the font size.

Amber G. · Post by **Amber G.** » 23 Oct 2010 20:00

Kesavan wrote:
Amber G. wrote: ..As always, things are more complex .. for example in this figure.. not everything had a negative dy/dx.
Nice spin. Shall we read the question? Two things pop out:

No spin boss, I actually posted and quoted the source, one can draw and understand the poll as one likes. I did not spin. You of course free to read the "question", in fact, please do read the question.

a) "... of countries like India". The U.S. is in terminal relative decline and the whole world knows it. This is a no-brainer question and isn't India-specific

.

May be the whole world know it..but for a country in "terminal decline" why would

a) Tata (just recently) gave $20,000,000 to Harvard? (This of course in not an isolated instance, .. just look at few posts in this very own thread .. Mahindra gave $10,000,000.. Deshpande who gives regularly to his IIT alma matter gave $20,000,000 to MIT and countless others ordinary folks)

b) More students and others than ever before are choosing American for further their training.. including Indian armed forces and law enforcement people... why would they do it?

c) USA still produces more scientists, engineers...and their universities still top virtually any list.. and it still can attract best talent from the world...

I could go on.. but I certainly do not see US in a hopeless terminal decline.. call me optimistic but other than Pak I don't see too many countries in "terminal decline". Besides as you know there are about a million Indian Americans here who would have NOT chosen to raise their kids in US ... if the whole world really knew it why would they?

wrt of "

countries like India"....... This is a no-brainer question and isn't India-specific"

.. I am not sure, if you understood the poll. It (the poll) was "India specific".
For example, according to these polls, Pak has much more negative impression about US than India does.

****** Change of subject

Folks: Criticizing US (or GOI for that matter) is one thing, and should be okay but a few posts here are getting beyond silly... for example
- ..Wondering "where is shiv sena" to do demonstration against Obama (I don't know what they meant by "demonstration", I only hope that it is not what occurs in Pak in daily basis - that is burning flags/effigies/rioting). When all is said and done, India did the inviting. (I mean why would one invites anyone if one hates the invitee)

AnuragK · Post by **AnuragK** » 23 Oct 2010 20:09

Pratyush wrote:The source URL please.

Sorry! No URL. Taken from "Geopolitcs & Strategy" vol.III no. 42 pg 65-67. Author credit given. Everything does not necessarily have to have URL.

AnuragK · Post by **AnuragK** » 23 Oct 2010 20:12

pgbhat wrote:^ Boss please go easy on the font size.

Thnx. Edited after you pointed out. Regret inconvenience caused.

ajit_tr · Post by **ajit_tr** » 23 Oct 2010 20:16

AnuragK wrote:US modus operandi for total world hegemony: the last bastion - Asia

India: U.S. Completes Global Military Structure

Opinion: Rick Rozoff
Friday, 10 September 2010
Counter-opinions and critical evaluations are invited from all knowledgeable BRFites.

http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/WO1009/S ... ucture.htm

SureshP · Post by **SureshP** » 23 Oct 2010 20:42

This is

Rick Rozoff

Rick Rozoff has been involved in anti-war and anti-interventionist work in various capacities for forty years. He lives in Chicago, Illinois. Is the manager of Stop NATO international.

You can read all this loony lefty fantasist's articles here.

http://www.voltairenet.org/auteur124551.html?lang=en

Arjun · Post by **Arjun** » 23 Oct 2010 20:51

Amber G. wrote:Folks: Criticizing US (or GOI for that matter) is one thing, and should be okay but a few posts here are getting beyond silly... for example
- ..Wondering "where is shiv sena" to do demonstration against Obama (I don't know what they meant by "demonstration", I only hope that it is not what occurs in Pak in daily basis - that is burning flags/effigies/rioting). When all is said and done, India did the inviting. (I mean why would one invites anyone if one hates the invitee)

Shiv Sena woud be the wrong choice, given they are not exactly known for civilized protest...What is needed is a large group carrying placards protesting in silence and absolutely peacably, with the placards conveying the feeling of the street in India, while making sure the TV channels and media capture all details for a global audience. Absolutely nothing wrong in this.

I would recommend a separate thread for a BR competition on placards we would like to see for Obama's visit...

Kesavan · Post by **Kesavan** » 23 Oct 2010 23:35

Amber G. wrote:May be the whole world know it..but for a country in "terminal decline" why would

Do you understand the function of quotes in English? Do you understand what the the word relative means? Quoting something and tossing out a word in the middle is slimey. Nice try, though.

I am not sure, if you understood the poll. It (the poll) was "India specific".

The question was not India specific. I said nothing about the poll itself and it's not relevant to your attempt at spin. Now let me guess... American citizen?

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 23 Oct 2010 23:40

I must admit that I didn't read the WikiLeaks BS in detail, but it seems to me that most of the torture has been outsourced by US, so its like don't ask don't tell.

On a personal note, such is the level of cynicism in me that in my town here on the west coast, I got up this morning and driving to get some coffee, I was sickened to hear that sanctimonious "liberal" white nationalist SOB on NPR, Scott Simon, talking about some US missionary doctor helping Ethiopians despite the risk to him from disease & pestilence, and then an an ad for a documentary by "courageous" western journos including Aussie pipsqueaks on torture by the Burmese junta. Listening to all this self righteous cacaophony after WikiLeaks and $2 billion+ US military aid propping up TSP terrorists arrayed against India, there was such cognitive dissonance in me, I almost crashed into the pavement in anger laced with laughter, but then just a repititon of the primoridial mantra Om brought me back to the present moment

.

Somebody on the other thread was lamnting NRI support to Dems, as through if all the NRIs cleant the toilets of Sarah Palin and other Reps like her, will result in any change in US policy towards TSP. Shows a very little understanding of how US works, and where India stands among the many pawns in US arsenal as it steers the course of its empire. US is no declining supoer power, thank you very much, it is reigning as supreme as it can get. It is India that is danger of lapsing into irrelevance if it follows the US-dictated "South Asian" agenda as supinely as the current "South Asian" CEO in Delhi.

AmberJi,

Is it India that bent down on its knees begging Obama to enjoy a red carpet fawning welcome in Delhi? I thought it was standard US used-car salesman chicanery at work, soothing India's neurotic quest to be seen at the hight table even if its devoid of any real substance. ToiLet had a good headline for once: "US gives billions to TSP, US takes billions from India". This is not even equal equal anymore

.

Ameet · Post by **Ameet** » 24 Oct 2010 00:13

US should have just outsourced the trip arrangements to Kalmadi

US takes no chances, books all 547 rooms at Taj for Obama

http://www.indianexpress.com/news/us-ta ... ma/701313/

“As expected, the US authorities are leaving absolutely nothing to chance. All 547 rooms as well banquet halls and restaurants at the Taj Mahal Palace Hotel have been booked by them, so that they have exclusive use of the building,” one senior official said.

“In addition to this around 80 to 90 rooms have been booked at the ITC Maratha near the airport to accommodate their airline staff. All three theatres at the NCPA (National Centre for Performing Arts) have also been booked in preparation for a possible business interaction. There will be around 45 cars in Obama’s convoy including the specially reinforced Lincoln Continental in which he will travel,” the officer added.

Amber G. · Post by **Amber G.** » 24 Oct 2010 02:10

Kesavan wrote:
Amber G. wrote:May be the whole world know it..but for a country in "terminal decline" why would
Do you understand the function of quotes in English? Do you understand what the the word relative means? Quoting something and tossing out a word in the middle is slimey. Nice try, though.

Yes, I do understand quotes in English. Okay here is your quote:

The U.S. is in terminal relative decline and the whole world knows it.

Instead of personal attack, can you explain what exactly is slimey?

.. I said nothing about the poll itself and it's not relevant to your attempt at spin.

Oh.. so you were saying NOTHING about the poll itself.. just making silly personal attack at my "attempt of spin"

Now let me guess... American citizen?

(What's your problem with American citizen?)

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 24 Oct 2010 02:23

chetak wrote:T

How 1 Parliament action can kill Indo-US nuke deal
Last updated on: October 21, 2010 11:06 IST

Aziz Haniffa in Washington

In a scathing indictment of the nuclear liability bill passed by Indian Parliament, Nicholas Burns, former under secretary of state in the Bush administration, has warned that if the bill was not amended it could sound the death knell of the historic Indo-US nuclear deal and adversely impact on the envisaged US-India strategic partnership.

Why does this guy shout so much
India cannot take care of US interest for its global plans.

An Indian commentary of approximately ten years ago described the U.S. counter-strategy as a policy of cultivating closer state-to-state relations with every nation in the world than any of those countries have with any other state, even their neighbors.

Thus the U.S. is arming India and Pakistan, regional military rivals possessing nuclear weapons outside the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty regime, as it is deepening defense ties with other nations on both sides of local conflicts and disputes: Armenia and Azerbaijan over Nagorno-Karabakh, Greece and Turkey over Cyprus and the skies over the Aegean Sea, Croatia and Slovenia over the Adriatic coast, Serbia and Kosovo over the latter, recognized by almost two-thirds of United Nation member states as a province of the former, and so on.
As the American corporate consultant quoted earlier pointed out, the best way of transforming the foreign policy orientation of other countries and subordinating them to Washington's global political agenda is by penetrating and gaining control over their armed forces.

The North Atlantic Treaty Organization and Africa Command alone have provided the Pentagon mechanisms for initiating and consolidating bilateral military ties with over 100 of the world's 192 nations (in the UN). NATO and AFRICOM have given the Pentagon a continent apiece. That is in addition to other, frequently older, military client states in Latin America and the Caribbean, the Middle East and the Asia-Pacific region.

By supplying arms to those nations and eliminating traditional rivals from that role, Washington is laying the groundwork for integrating almost every country in the world into its military network. Weapons sales are followed by instruction, maintenance, upgrade and field training agreements, with U.S. military personnel assigned to the purchasing nations.
Regional and other multinational air, naval, interceptor missile, armored and ground combat exercises and war games are held to test weapons in live-fire and other maneuvers and to provide the U.S. opportunities for simulated warfare against potential rivals' equipment, tactics and warfighting doctrine.
Pilots, soldiers, marines and sailors, including special forces, from military client nations are provided training in their own countries, in the U.S and in third countries to ensure weapons, deployment, command, communication and combat interoperability with the Pentagon for global missions.

Amber G. · Post by **Amber G.** » 24 Oct 2010 02:52

CRamS wrote:AmberJi,

Is it India that bent down on its knees begging Obama to enjoy a red carpet fawning welcome in Delhi? I thought it was standard US used-car salesman chicanery at work, soothing India's neurotic quest to be seen at the hight table even if its devoid of any real substance. ToiLet had a good headline for once: "US gives billions to TSP, US takes billions from India". This is not even equal equal anymore .

CramSji:
No I don't at all think that India that is bent down on its knees begging ityadi itaydi.... Some time ago you talked about your "vast experience in USA", and how you teach "every FOB Indian about the American way" (

), I have been here in US only just over 40 years, raised a family (kids went to school here), taught physics (interacted with young generation) in university etc .. but perhaps we have different perspective and/or move in different circle. Unlike you I have met people who know both Sanskrit and Science (:) ) ; Indian Americans who have money and at the same time NOT clueless (:)) , "Fareed bhai" to me a accomplished journalist and not a just another uncle tom or Islamist.

So I really do not worry if " standard US used-car salesman chicanery at work" will sooth "India's neurotic quest" or not...To me India is a great country, with a great leader and people. It is doing things which needs to be done (that includes welcoming its guests, working out beneficial relationship with other countries etc etc..). Sure nothing is perfect, there are challenges.. Obviously aid to Paki scums is bad and we have to do what is needed to protect us.

But the huge narrative, and silly

's ("Messiah is false god

or mocking GOI leaders as has been done here by a few members is just plain silly.

My opinion only, of course.

Amber G. · Post by **Amber G.** » 24 Oct 2010 03:06

Arjun wrote: Shiv Sena woud be the wrong choice, given they are not exactly known for civilized protest...What is needed is a large group carrying placards protesting in silence and absolutely peacably, with the placards conveying the feeling of the street in India, while making sure the TV channels and media capture all details for a global audience. Absolutely nothing wrong in this.

I would recommend a separate thread for a BR competition on placards we would like to see for Obama's visit...

Thank you for articulating that what we don't need that (other) kind of protest. As you say "Absolutely nothing wrong in this [effective using media capture etc]" . Also available are press conferences, letters to editors or directly to press/GOI/US. India is democracy and has freedom of speech and press so this is actually desirable.
Important point is "cause" should come before "protest"..Eg Aid to terrorists (or country which harbors them) is bad and needs to be pounded in. OTOH burning effigies, or signs which just mocks GOI or USA without any messages, or protest for protest's sake would be silly.

RajeshA · Post by **RajeshA** » 24 Oct 2010 03:35

Effective logos would be - 'Stop Financing Terrorism, Stop Aiding Terrorist Pakistan'! or 'Terrorist Financier Go Home'! or 'Stop Bombing Innocent Pushtuns' or 'Pay Back Your Debts' or 'Good Taliban Cut Noses With American Knives'!

naren · Post by **naren** » 24 Oct 2010 04:37

Arjun wrote:
Amber G. wrote:Folks: Criticizing US (or GOI for that matter) is one thing, and should be okay but a few posts here are getting beyond silly... for example
- ..Wondering "where is shiv sena" to do demonstration against Obama (I don't know what they meant by "demonstration", I only hope that it is not what occurs in Pak in daily basis - that is burning flags/effigies/rioting). When all is said and done, India did the inviting. (I mean why would one invites anyone if one hates the invitee)
Shiv Sena woud be the wrong choice, given they are not exactly known for civilized protest...What is needed is a large group carrying placards protesting in silence and absolutely peacably, with the placards conveying the feeling of the street in India, while making sure the TV channels and media capture all details for a global audience. Absolutely nothing wrong in this.

I would recommend a separate thread for a BR competition on placards we would like to see for Obama's visit...

How about BRF youtube channel ?

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 24 Oct 2010 04:47

AmberJi,

sarcasam and humor aside, please answer my question, was it India who invited Obama or vice versa?

If you think Fareed Bhai is some accomplished journalist, I hope you are not a peer reviewer of top notch physics publications

. You standards are too mediocre I would say.

Fareed Bhai is a quintessential establishment mouthpiece, and one doesn't even have to be biased to say this. He serves US propaganda purposes of putting out a brown Muslim face, and have Tina Brown condescendingly praise him for his "bollywood looks". I don't doubt that he can reel off what the founding fathers said with eloquence, he can romanticize cowboy Regan's "achievements", and above all, he can be an Amercian jingo that would even embarass the Mayflower descendents. But the one thing he dare not do is point out some ugly truths about his benefactor. And why should he? Like another Uncle Tom who was recently fired from NPR, Juan Williams, he is making big bucks and hob knobs with the who is who among the power elites in Washington, and by default in other western capitals. But one thing I am indebted to Fareed Bhai for. Occasionaly, when its OK to do so, he does talk about LET.

Kesavan · Post by **Kesavan** » 24 Oct 2010 04:48

Amber G. wrote:
Kesavan wrote: Do you understand the function of quotes in English? Do you understand what the the word relative means? Quoting something and tossing out a word in the middle is slimey. Nice try, though.
Yes, I do understand quotes in English. Okay here is your quote:
The U.S. is in terminal relative decline and the whole world knows it.
Instead of personal attack, can you explain what exactly is slimey?

Now, now, don't get all butt-hurt. What's slimey? Quoting with removal of words to suit yourself. Terminal decline =/= terminal relative decline. But you knew that. Isn't the internet fantastic? Hide behind a screen and play dumb when you get called out. But keep up the spin for the country you're loyal to. After all, the rest of us do the same, albeit for a different country.

Hari Seldon · Post by **Hari Seldon** » 24 Oct 2010 06:09

x-post from the TSP thread.

Can only hope and pray this burdensome 'presidential visit' to Yindia passes by quietly and quickly and that this burden is not revisited on our country for years to come. Makes me wonder who was more interested in the visit happening - us or them? We've nothing to gain from the visit, I wish our MUTUs in gubmint could understand and curb their enthusiasm accordingly.

Like sri Ssridhar said, US is being forked tongue in its dealings with Yindia. For some reason they seem to believe that mere empty words will be enough to deflect/divert from/hide the on-ground impact their actions (PA support, tech denials among others) continue to have on India. In some measurfe, it reflects poorly on GOI that we have allowed (encouraged?) such perception to form and muster force. Again, this Obama visit IMHO can produce nothing of tangible gain. Obama has neither the ability (political capital) nor the inclination (a pro-common values worldview) to make the visit meaningful. We are fighting defensive, rearguard action, again(!), hoping no damage occurs. Only. IMVVHO. Jai ho and all that.

sanjaykumar · Post by **sanjaykumar** » 24 Oct 2010 06:48

I expect major products from the Obama visit. There are pointers to this:

-US/China relationship
-US/Pakistan relationship
-US upping the pacifier to Pakistan because they know what is coming
-low key Indian commentary by GOI
-India's need for technology, the capital is flowing (which is an amazing change)
-MMS's legacy needs

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 24 Oct 2010 06:56

Kesavan,
You have 4 posts and want to attack AmberG? I suggest you learn some humility if you want to stick around.

Thanks, ramana

Arjun · Post by **Arjun** » 24 Oct 2010 08:27

RajeshA wrote:Effective logos would be - 'Stop Financing Terrorism, Stop Aiding Terrorist Pakistan'! or 'Terrorist Financier Go Home'! or 'Stop Bombing Innocent Pushtuns' or 'Pay Back Your Debts' or 'Good Taliban Cut Noses With American Knives'!

Good ones...how about-

'Obama - did you get your Nobel for appeasing terrorist states?'

'No defence contracts to US, until it stops military aid to terrorist nations'

'FBI agent Headley was mastermind of Mumbai 26/11. How about an apology Obama?'

'Stop outsourcing to American firms. Expel IBM, Citibank from India'

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 24 Oct 2010 09:34

Arjun wrote: 'Stop outsourcing to American firms. Expel IBM, Citibank from India'

Come on, your other placards make sense, but this one?

Arjun · Post by **Arjun** » 24 Oct 2010 09:42

CRamS wrote:
Arjun wrote: 'Stop outsourcing to American firms. Expel IBM, Citibank from India'
Come on, your other placards make sense, but this one?

Meant to convey a point, mainly to a US audience via TV images hopefully - that outsourcing is not all one-way and that we live in a globalized world where reciprocity matters. If the US is placing non-trade barriers against Indian firms (thru taxes, visa fees etc), then India can retaliate against US firms winning contracts in India. IBM does billions of dollars worth outsourcing for Indian corporates. Again using language that is now in fashion in certain US quarters, why should Indian corporates 'outsource' banking activity to an American firm, when there are enough and more able Indian competitors?

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 24 Oct 2010 10:32

US wants to talk business, India focus on strategy

http://www.hindustantimes.com/US-wants- ... 16980.aspx

naren · Post by **naren** » 24 Oct 2010 10:50

My placard submissions:

Only
Brings
American
Mismanagement.
Again

Only
Business
Approach ?
My
A$$

Our
Bastards
Are
Much
Angelic

Friendly or
Unfriendly ?
Cruel or
Kind ?
Obama -
Friend or
Foe ?

Hari Seldon · Post by **Hari Seldon** » 24 Oct 2010 11:28

Heard a wag on the web dissing sri Obama's domestic policies particularly w.r.t. banks and bailouts, with the following wisecrack:

Obama is Midas in reverse. Everything he touches turns into $hit.

Maybe apt in the international relations arena too, perhaps.

ShivaS · Post by **ShivaS** » 24 Oct 2010 11:32

What mockery, none at all just hold the placard how Non Nato munna is keeping bum under the uncles butt.
Put up a hoarding huge one on his way in Nai delhi.

****
Hari saar: Obama's S**** does not even decay or decompose

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 24 Oct 2010 11:37

Hari Seldon:

USA is not India where there is a dynastic rule, and one party's icon and her puppet rule the roost. of course, US is in some sense an oligarchy. I for one do not blame Obama one iota for his propping up of TSP terrorist arrayed against India. Its a systemic policy. For all the fawning adulation towards Bush that some have, has Bush ever mentioned LET? So, dems or reps, this policy of appeasing TSPA/ISI, and colluding with them as long as TSP terror is focused on India alone is a bi-partisan US objective. Obama has very little say in this. Its the Pentagon/CIA booses who rule the roost on this one.

darshhan · Post by **darshhan** » 24 Oct 2010 11:45

Its the Pentagon/CIA booses who rule the roost on this one

You can also add state department bureaucracy to the list.

darshhan · Post by **darshhan** » 24 Oct 2010 12:07

Meant to convey a point, mainly to a US audience via TV images hopefully - that outsourcing is not all one-way and that we live in a globalized world where reciprocity matters. If the US is placing non-trade barriers against Indian firms (thru taxes, visa fees etc), then India can retaliate against US firms winning contracts in India. IBM does billions of dollars worth outsourcing for Indian corporates. Again using language that is now in fashion in certain US quarters, why should Indian corporates 'outsource' banking activity to an American firm, when there are enough and more able Indian competitors?

Yes companies like IBM are landing up lot of work in India.For eg majority of Airtel's infrastructure is managed by IBM.But this work is not offshored to USA.Almost all the work is done locally by IBM here in india itself.Infact IBM now employs upto 100000 workers in India.So they are actually creating employment here.

So if you want to protest recent outsourcing decisions by US govt you have to come up with better arguments.By banning IBM and other US companies you will be doing lot of damage to India itself as they prefer to hire Indians and get the work done here.

Look every country has to watch its interests.The question that we should be asking is that why after 3 decades since the IT story started in this country, we are still dependent of outsourcing as the primary business model.Why we haven't been able to develop our own domestic market for IT services.Why we haven't been able to diversify into product development?

Instead we are looking to punish those entities who have actually done something for India.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_India

Infact by 2011 IBM will employ upto 154000 employees in India alone.

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 24 Oct 2010 12:46

India to sign nuclear convention

http://www.indianexpress.com/news/India ... ion/701598