India-US Strategic News and Discussion

shukla · Post by **shukla** » 05 Nov 2010 18:32

US defence and nuclear deals could touch $15 bn

uddu · Post by **uddu** » 05 Nov 2010 18:48

Funny thing here.
Link

When did American President became an American agint?

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 05 Nov 2010 18:51

Pulikeshi: It is not NPR alone, that news is making rounds elsewhere too.

Looks like some NGO invited Michelle to meet some commercial sex workers. Geez, I have not been able to find the NGO's name. When we invite someone to our house, we show them the best parts of our house, not showoff controversial subjects. I hope the reports are false. But why places ourselves in a position for others to look down upon us?

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 05 Nov 2010 19:02

SwamyG wrote: I remember how some of us BRFites cried in the education dhaaga when India relaxed its policies in allowing foreign universities.
A pluralistic freedom loving ebil yindoo India has no chance against "Corporatism". Let us now see BRFites who supported that move what they have to say now.

http://forums.bharat-rakshak.com/viewto ... 14#p839014

I have an idea for a cartoon.
MMS is sitting on a chair. On his lap sits the kanya - India's map. Obama is the groom's father, poised along with his son - Corporations for the marriage. {MMS and others gloriously perform the Kanyadhaanam.}

SwamyG garu,

There is another lobby that supports foreign entry into edu-sector. It is the edu-professor lobby. They hope to make lot of dough out of it. I have a friend who is foregoing WB/IMF option as s/he thinks of earning more sitting at home, doing less intensive work.

rgsrini · Post by **rgsrini** » 05 Nov 2010 19:04

SwamyG wrote:It is indeed nauseating to see India handle the Obama visit with a degree of servility.

Talk about over reaction...

If the monkeys raids the visitors or if a coconut falls on someone's head then several of us will turn around and write scathing criticism on the organizers and security agencies. "In NY they weld every drainage shut when the president visits and keep every trash can under constant scrutiny for weeks even for Thanks giving parade, we don't even take simple precaution of harvesting the coconuts and driving the monkeys out, especially when we have known about the monkey issues for years... We are useless only and we don't deserve to be super power..."

Just like beauty, I think servility is also in the minds of the beholder. I believe our agencies deserve appreciation for their meticulous planning leaving nothing to chance.

ShivaS · Post by **ShivaS** » 05 Nov 2010 19:23

The 4.5 million per day is just the declared open expenditure.. If you want coconuts removed and other OSS 117s coming in droves then 200 million is very small change. Which Obama always touted the change I mean..

I would applaud if the expenses were incurred in India..

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 05 Nov 2010 20:00

RamaY wrote:
SwamyG wrote: SwamyG garu,

There is another lobby that supports foreign entry into edu-sector. It is the edu-professor lobby. They hope to make lot of dough out of it. I have a friend who is foregoing WB/IMF option as s/he thinks of earning more sitting at home, doing less intensive work.

There are certain things that a country has to control. Education is one such. Already we have "eminent historians" influencing our text books and crying foul over historical decisions. Why give "furriners" more say in how we educate our children. If one were to argue "hey they are just going to teach science and math. what can go wrong?", I like to remind them of the Arab and The Camel story. Some might say it is a slipper-slope logical fallacy. A country has to look out for itself.

rgsrini wrote: Just like beauty, I think servility is also in the minds of the beholder. I believe our agencies deserve appreciation for their meticulous planning leaving nothing to chance.

We take the concept of 'athithi devo bhavah" too far. Not all guests are equal and can be treated as Devas.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 05 Nov 2010 20:21

For those sitting outside India rading the news from India - it is easy to believe that India is going overboard.

I am happy with that because the media have little else to report. Until yesterday they were trying to report scams. Today its Ombaba. Tomorrow something else. As long as the media go overboard on utter crap as the most important thing to talk about - it makes me happy. Happy because they are not reporting terror. My mind goes back to 2008 - the worst year for terror in India. The anniversary of 26/11 is not far away.

Jai Bhaarata.

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 05 Nov 2010 20:29

^^ SwamyG garu, no disagreements there.

Even in the old thread, I was pointing at the fact that the elites (people who can afford foreign education = families with >12L/Yr income) are so addicted to this concept that they would prefer a 3rd rate firangi-university to a 2nd rate Indian school. This causes multiple problems

- Flow of Indian money ($5-8B per year)
- Disconnection of educated youth from Indian problems
- Media fear-psychosis on desi-security issues in foreign lands (like in Australia. Not sure why we don't have all these racist issues during IT boom where indians went to Australia for work.)

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 05 Nov 2010 21:10

Shiv saar: It is a good example how "strategists", "analysts", "diplomats", "experts" ityadi can use media to mount or dismount pressures. Rightly used, it can become a weapon

Pulikeshi · Post by **Pulikeshi** » 05 Nov 2010 21:33

U.S.-Pakistan Ties Overshadow Obama's Trip To India

But Akbar says the United States should be more aware that India is really its natural ally in Asia.

"Americans must remember that India is the America of Asia. We are both modern nations. China may be an advanced nation, but it is not a modern nation because it has no democracy," Akbar says.

Like poles rarely attract each other

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 05 Nov 2010 21:39

Talking about the pompous antics, looking at India with contempt & racist disdain, and mocking Obama for giving importance to a bunch of SDREs, from morons both on left & right: Anderson Cooper (CNN) & NPR on the left & Nazis like Beck (Fox) and Congress woman Michelle Bachman (but boy was she hot looking in her glitzy sleeveless gown on election night

) on the right, here is what amuses me.

Obama is going to India not for fun, and neither out of egalitarianism or love of SDREs. He is going to bring home the bacon and securing the interests of the US Empire. Little do these mouthpiece monkeys in the US media realize that the reason why they can wear their suit, boots, and thongs with designer hairstyles and go on CNN/Fox and earn big bucks is precisely because of the simple economic ripple effect of Obama's efforts: He goes to India, SDREs swoon over him and offer useless defense contracts worth billions, the joe-six pack in the rust belt (Ohio, MI etc) get jobs, who in turn get to have their beer, hot dogs, watch to CNN/Fox and buy the products advertised; and part of the revenue that advertisers make then goes to Anderson Cooper & Beck, who after mouthing a few inanities every night and spew venom once in a while against us SDREs to boost their ratings, can go home & enjoy a kushy lifestyle.

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 05 Nov 2010 21:53

CRamS wrote:
saip wrote:Anyone watching CNN? Anderson 360 is on. It is all about $200 mil a day Obama's trip and 34 ships!
Ditto tea party uber Nazi Beckie boy on Faux nooge

Glen Beck has gone over board.
He was dissing Diwali and India in general.
He is inciting violence

http://mediamatters.org/mmtv/201011040016

http://www.politicususa.com/en/beck-obama-india

Glenn Beck should be fired immediately for inciting hatred and violence. The advertisers need to pull out immediately. I call for an immediate boycott of the all advertisers products. This guy needs to get a good dose of humility, maybe being on the unemployment line will kick his fat ass in shape.

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 05 Nov 2010 23:17

Wealthy and Worried, India Is Rich Arms Market

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/05/busin ... fense.html

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 05 Nov 2010 23:28

Great, they are off again.

And the DDM is eagerly helping out as usual.

http://news.rediff.com/report/2010/nov/ ... -irked.htm

Obama's security dog named 'Khan': Muslims irked

November 05, 2010

Muslims in Mumbai are up in arms against a United States military sniffer dog allegedly with name tag of 'Khan' that has landed in the city as part of President Barack Obama security arrangements.

On Tuesday, the German Shepherd arrived in the Mumbai airport from a Hercules C130 transport plane. The German Shepherd allegedly had a tag around its neck which read 'MWD Khan.' MWD stands for Military Working Dog. Khan is alleged to be the name of the dog.

Angry Muslims in the city and the state are threatening to protest this 'insult' to the community.

The issue became a rage when a tabloid had reported the incident and quoted veteran actor Raza Murad objecting to the dog being named 'Khan.'

Though noted lyricist Javed Akhtar had been quoted to ignore the issue and focus on welcoming the VIP guest.

Maharashtra Samajwadi Party leader MLA Abu Asim Azmi also threatened to undertake a protest. He said that the US deliberately wants to incite the Muslims through such acts and the party would stage a protest on the issue.

Prominent Muslim religious heads have expressed anger and dismay on the information of a US dog being named 'Khan.' Maulana Syed Athar Ali said that it is a known fact that Muslims detest pigs and dogs.

"To name a dog a Muslim name by US security agencies is to deliberately incite the Muslim community. We would be meeting soon and devise a strategy to protest and seek apology from the US," said Maulana Athar Ali.

RajeshA · Post by **RajeshA** » 05 Nov 2010 23:48

The KMs can't be trusted. They can make an anti-American protest into an anti-Indian protest.

As far as Indian Muslims going after BHO is concerned, I'm all for it. I think Indians should welcome the guest with all dignity and warmth, but one needs to allow the Indian Muslims to go after the Americans with the choicest of curses.

The Americans need to know, that it is not sufficient to shove the Pakistanis all sorts of flowers in the musharraf to gain the sympathy of Muslims. Indians too have levers to incite Muslim wrath against America, should America do bull$hit with India.

darshhan · Post by **darshhan** » 06 Nov 2010 00:22

chetak wrote:Great, they are off again.

And the DDM is eagerly helping out as usual.

http://news.rediff.com/report/2010/nov/ ... -irked.htm

Obama's security dog named 'Khan': Muslims irked

November 05, 2010

Muslims in Mumbai are up in arms against a United States military sniffer dog allegedly with name tag of 'Khan' that has landed in the city as part of President Barack Obama security arrangements.

On Tuesday, the German Shepherd arrived in the Mumbai airport from a Hercules C130 transport plane. The German Shepherd allegedly had a tag around its neck which read 'MWD Khan.' MWD stands for Military Working Dog. Khan is alleged to be the name of the dog.

Angry Muslims in the city and the state are threatening to protest this 'insult' to the community.

The issue became a rage when a tabloid had reported the incident and quoted veteran actor Raza Murad objecting to the dog being named 'Khan.'

Though noted lyricist Javed Akhtar had been quoted to ignore the issue and focus on welcoming the VIP guest.

Maharashtra Samajwadi Party leader MLA Abu Asim Azmi also threatened to undertake a protest. He said that the US deliberately wants to incite the Muslims through such acts and the party would stage a protest on the issue.

Prominent Muslim religious heads have expressed anger and dismay on the information of a US dog being named 'Khan.' Maulana Syed Athar Ali said that it is a known fact that Muslims detest pigs and dogs.

"To name a dog a Muslim name by US security agencies is to deliberately incite the Muslim community. We would be meeting soon and devise a strategy to protest and seek apology from the US," said Maulana Athar Ali.

Are these guys morons?Khan is not even an Islamic name.It is more of a mongol/central asian title.It has nothing to do with Islam.In fact I know of some hindus also who use this surname.

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 06 Nov 2010 00:24

^ RajeshA garu

That is a strategy filled with IED's. I wouldn't distinguish between Indian Hindus and Indian Muslims for any reason, whatsoever.

Vasu · Post by **Vasu** » 06 Nov 2010 00:24

Despite the media circus, I think it is still a fairly obvious assessment to make by anybody with patience to read the news that Obama is only coming here as a glorified arms dealer and a peddler of American goods.

Some news in NYT today about Cold Start, and how its making America's ally feel uneasy - Obama Unlikely to Push India Hard on Pakistan

officials said they did not expect him to broach the subject of the doctrine, known informally as Cold Start. At the most, these officials predicted, Mr. Obama will quietly encourage India’s leaders to do what they can to cool tensions between these nuclear-armed neighbors.

That would be a victory for India, which denies the very existence of Cold Start....

It is also a victory for those in the administration who agree that the United States and India should focus on broader concerns, ranging from commercial ties and military sales to climate change and regional security. However vital the Afghan war effort, officials said, it has lost out in the internal debate to priorities like American jobs and the rising role of China.

“There are people in the administration who want us to engage India positively,” said an administration official, speaking on condition of anonymity to discuss internal deliberations. “They don’t care about Afghanistan. Then there are people, like Petraeus, who have wars to fight.”

Gen. David H. Petraeus, the top commander in Afghanistan, is among those who have warned internally about the dangers of Cold Start, according to American and Indian officials. He is joined in these fears by Admiral Mike Mullen, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, and Richard C. Holbrooke, the special representative to Afghanistan and Pakistan.

Pakistani officials have repeatedly stressed to the United States, most recently during a visit to Washington by Pakistan’s army chief of staff, General Ashfaq Pervez Kayani, late last month, that worries about Cold Start are at the root of their refusal to redeploy forces away from the border with India.

“We don’t know what Cold Start is,” said India’s Defense Secretary, Pradeep Kumar, in an interview on Thursday. “Our Prime Minister has said that Pakistan has nothing to fear. Pakistan can move its troops from the eastern border. India has no expansionist designs.”

Indian officials and some analysts say Cold Start has taken on nearly mythical status in the minds of Pakistani leaders, whom they suspect of inflating it as excuse to keep from engaging militants on their own turf.

“The Pakistanis will use everything they can to delay or drag doing a serious reorientation of their military,” said Stephen P. Cohen, an expert on South Asia at the Brookings Institution.

“They are grasping at straws because they have a predicament in the Afghan theater that they cannot fix without Pakistan’s help,” said Ashley J. Tellis, an former diplomat and South Asia expert at the Carnegie Endowment for Peace. “They are looking at India to do something to placate the Pakistanis.”

And yes, its so enjoyable to witness the media hysteria! Even the American media is quite enjoyable to read - India and US can be great allies, but for India to be America's great ally, India has to do this, this, this.....

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 06 Nov 2010 00:36

On the contrary the article is a very important one for its shown that there is a divide on how to approach India to placate the TSP to after their terrorists. And the whole DOD is lined up against India. The others say PRC and jobs are more important.

And Tellis says US wants India to do something for TSP. Would be wary of that.

GOI thru the Def Secy is saying there i s noting to fear form eastern borders. I guess they(TSP) want a no war pact even if TSP terrorists strike in India!

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 06 Nov 2010 00:40

May be we are not getting the message correctly.

USA is asking India to have its own strategy for TSP. We are thinking it means giving zam-zam cola to TSP.

Indian should present its own strategy on TSP to USA. Something like dismantling TSPA and fragmentation of TSP region under Indian influence. They ask USAwallahs for their support in piece 2, piece 8 etc.,

Cosmo_R · Post by **Cosmo_R** » 06 Nov 2010 00:46

RajeshA wrote:The KMs can't be trusted.

...Indians too have levers to incite Muslim wrath against America, should America do bull$hit with India.

Once incited, who controls them?. Right now, Franklin Graham can set off riots in India by saying something stupid in Florida.

One TJ Joseph in Kerala gets his hands cut off for including a 'blasphemous' question in an exam.

Marad http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marad_massacre is another example of the time bomb.

Let's not get religion mixed up with politics. In ten years, India will have enough economic levers on the US to surpass what Israel currently has on the political side.

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 06 Nov 2010 00:52

This would be my strategy

- Remove liability bill > Sorry can't do it especially after Bhopal gas. If you give me Anderson this year, I can push for this next year
- Buy Nuke-reactors > Ofcourse I want them yesterday. But your Hyde act is the problem. See if you can undo.
- Lets have a space treaty > I will sign it right now if you can remove the restrictions on my R&D units
- Peace with pakistan > That is what we want. But give control of Afghanistan to us.
- Have your own strategy on Pakistan? - We already have one. General pls present Indian vision for Pakistan. Obamaji - you need to remove your interests in this are in time for our strategy to be implemented.
- Outsourcing - That is our issue too. in 2010 we received $40B in ITES revenues where as our stock markets produced $100B revenues for your FDIs. You owe us $60B
- Buy F16/F18 - We cannot buy F16s. We will buy F18s if you sign a pact that no US military equipment will be supplied (including the projects in pipeline) to TSP or PRC.
- Open Indian market for Farm Products - We are yindoos only and cannot have your farm products
- Open your defence and telecom for FDI - Sure, once we sign the F18 deal as outlined above

***
- UNSC - We want your support on UNSC seat with Veto. But we understand your administration is constrained by recent election results
- NSG - That would be a prerequisite for us to buy your nuke reactors

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 06 Nov 2010 00:54

RamaY wrote:^ RajeshA garu

That is a strategy filled with IED's. I wouldn't distinguish between Indian Hindus and Indian Muslims for any reason, whatsoever.

I agree with you Rama garu. No way should India entertain the thought of using IMs as a tool to unglify Unkil; Unkil has experience in playing this game & could in fact use some IMs to needle India in turn.

Rama garu: That was a good one.

Cosmo_R · Post by **Cosmo_R** » 06 Nov 2010 00:56

@RamaY^^^. Correct. The US complaint is that all GoI comes back with is: "Don't leave Afghanistan" along with development projects. The latter is constructive but won't win the day.

What really needs to be done is to hive off Balochistan by funding and supporting an organized internal movement and the using it as an access route to Afghanistan. The US could be receptive to such a proposal particularly if preceded by an effective human rights/genocide story that lays the blame at the PAs door by tracing its brutal methods since the 1970s.

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 06 Nov 2010 01:16

Vasu wrote: Some news in NYT today about Cold Start, and how its making America's ally feel uneasy - Obama Unlikely to Push India Hard on Pakistan

Uneven's observation on TSP is right on the money. I don't think TSP is one bit worried, and neither is USA, that India will initiate cold start. Its just TSP's excuse to do nothing about LET. In fact, the rationale for cold start, even in theory, won't exist if TSP dismantles LET. Why isn't US focused on that? Why US, why not Indian officials starting with MMS? Why not say that in the spirit of GWOT, US must support India in demanding TSP to hand over a list of 20 starting with Hafeez Saeed?

Om Obama's plan to visit Taj and commisserate with the victims of Mumbai, its comical and tragic for its lack of teeth & punch. He is not going to mention that LET or TSP by name. Terrorists, presumably from Jupiter or Uranus descended on Mumbai on 26/11 and ravaged it for 3 days, and Obama is sympthising with India for that horror. I am sure none other than Ashfaq Kiyani, Shuja Paasha, and Hafeez Saeed will also join Obama at the Taj in the spirit of solidarity.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 06 Nov 2010 01:20

Definitely not from Jupiter. All from Kiyani's Uranus.

RajeshA · Post by **RajeshA** » 06 Nov 2010 01:26

ramana wrote:Definitely not from Jupiter. All from Kiyani's Uranus.

RajeshA · Post by **RajeshA** » 06 Nov 2010 01:43

RamaY wrote:^ RajeshA ~~garu~~

That is a strategy filled with IED's. I wouldn't distinguish between Indian Hindus and Indian Muslims for any reason, whatsoever.

RamaY ji,
I'll touch on the strategic dimensions of my message at some other time in the proper context.

There can be many Indian Muslims who would be welcoming POTUS to India along with Indian Hindus. All I'm saying is Indians shouldn't be too worried or embarrassed if a cross-section of Indian Muslims protest against POTUS.

There are many different opinions in India about USA. All should be given freedom to express themselves. No Indian need to put the satisfaction of the Americans over the freedom of Indians.

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 06 Nov 2010 01:44

ramana wrote: And Tellis says US wants India to do something for TSP. Would be wary of that.

What is wrong with this Tellis guy? He wants us to dilute the liability bill for US companies.

rsingh · Post by **rsingh** » 06 Nov 2010 01:44

Honourable Prof Sumit Ganguly thinks India is already asking for too much without giving anything substantial. (Newsweek October 11, 2010)

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 06 Nov 2010 01:45

Pak steps up efforts to thwart U.S. concessions to India

http://www.thehindu.com/news/internatio ... 870482.ece

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 06 Nov 2010 01:46

‘Announcement likely on India’s role in Afghanistan’

http://www.thehindu.com/news/national/article870465.ece

darshhan · Post by **darshhan** » 06 Nov 2010 01:46

Prince Alwaleed opposes construction of ground zero mosque.

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/worl ... 841465.cms

Saudi Arabia's Prince Alwaleed Bin Talal Bin Abdul Aziz Al Saud has said he is against the construction of a mosque close to the 9/11 site in New York and also he had no part in financing the controversial project.

"I am against putting the mosque in that particular place. And I'll tell you why. For two reasons: first of all, those people behind the mosque have to respect, have to appreciate and have to defer to the people of New York, and not try to agitate the wound by saying 'we need to put the mosque next to the 9/11 site'," he was quoted as saying by the 'Arabian Business'.

"I heard and saw a lot of news about me being associated with it and this is all wrong. We did not finance this thing," he added.

"The wound is still there. Just because the wound is healing you can't say 'let's just go back to where we were pre-9/11'. I am against putting the mosque there out of respect for those people who have been wounded over there," he was quoted as saying.

The Prince also warned that Dubai's property market faces substantial further falls, and will take several years to reach its bottom.

Read more: Saudi Prince opposed to Ground Zero mosque in New York - The Times of India http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/worl ... z14RWKQmD5

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 06 Nov 2010 01:49

New Delhi Surprise
Beneath the smiles, India is not happy with Obama.

http://www.foreignpolicy.com/articles/2 ... i_surprise

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 06 Nov 2010 01:51

Weak Ties
For all the excitement about India’s rise, its economic relationship with the United States remains more anemic than it could be. Why?

http://www.foreignpolicy.com/articles/2 ... /weak_ties

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 06 Nov 2010 02:19

abhishek_sharma wrote:Weak Ties
For all the excitement about India’s rise, its economic relationship with the United States remains more anemic than it could be. Why?

http://www.foreignpolicy.com/articles/2 ... /weak_ties

Lots of BS advice. US firms invest in PRC to take advaantage of cheap labor and sell in US markets. In oterhwords they are a a off shore factory for the US markets. US firms invest in India for access to India markets. And hence liberal rules are for hit and run on Indian markets.

Strategic Consultant my foot.

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 06 Nov 2010 02:26

darshhan wrote:Prince Alwaleed opposes construction of ground zero mosque.

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/worl ... 841465.cms

Its possible that TSP will advice Mirwaiz Umar f***kroo to do the same, and even give him $s (that US doles out to TSP) so he can even buy a diamond necklece and pamper Sarah Palin; that would make tea party support Cashmere's "azaadi"

.

vera_k · Post by **vera_k** » 06 Nov 2010 02:43

Catch-22! Sarah prefers to get pink underwear, not diamonds. Won't that be a grave religious sin for TSP followers?

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 06 Nov 2010 03:25

all those super duper military a/c with its restrictions are simply Fnords! They are sure fire way to make India part with her hard earned wealth.
The marketig message is that India is nothing without all those goodies but in the real deal they can be used due to what ever. So why be a sucker.