Indian Interests

[brihaspati]

Should we start inquiring into the off-shore "leaking" by British magnates or American magnates? Surely if the estimated tax-avoidance stuff is analyzed (Channel 4 Dispatches ran a program recently on this connecting teh dots between the "parties", MP's, government post holders, and overseas and ohffshore flows that never come into the country) - I think the great "God of all things" also recently railed in one of his speeches against such "evil" doing from US soil by US businessmen etc. - we will see many time the leak being ascribed to India.

Maybe the Indian and British and US leaks have a connection! It is said that thieves are all cousins!

[RamaY]

They changed the names of Airports, Hydal Projects, Ports, Stadiums, Govt Schemes etc to JN, Indira, Rajiv and so on.

Now they are on to changing district names. Few districts already named after political leaders in Andhra Pradesh
- Prakasam district
- Potti Sree Ramulu (nellore?) district
- YSR (Kadapa) district
Now they want to change Medak district to Indira districts...

Soon every state will have one JN district, one Indira district, and one Rajiv district and so on...

Bharat is being translated into India.

From Matai's book

In the Constituent Assembly, which met in New Delhi on 9th December 1945 and concluded its deliberations on 26 November 1948, a demand was spearheaded by Rajendra Prasad and some other obscurantists that the name of the country should be Bharat and not Inida in the Constitution. Nehru pointed out that in such a case, internationally India would loss all the benefits of a "succession state" such as original membership of the United Nations and various international bodies, and all the embassy buildings abroad and so forth. Pakistan was a new state seceding from India and had to negotiate for membership of international bodies. Nehru told Rajendra Prasad and others, "I do not want to put India in an absurd position internationally." He also told them that their suggestion would please Pakistan most. Rajendra Prasad and others hummed and hawed; but Nehru stood firm. Finally, he said he had no objection to mention somewhere in the constitution "India that is Bharat." When Rajendra Prasad became President of the Republic, he ordered that the armbands of his ADCs should contain the word Bharat and not India. This practice continues.

[ramana]

Also unstated is the danger of TSP being advised to take on the name India as successor to the Mughals.

[ramana]

X-Posted from Mil Forum


http://forums.bharat-rakshak.com/viewto ... 34#p981334

......

Despite BRF's (sometimes valid, IMO) reservations, India is using a wide spectrum of gaijin Masamunes to armor up. We have made clear we are NOT planning to fight the khan or bear and proved it by going for significant purchases with great dependency on them. In return, it *can* force khan to be less snarky and stupid around us. Kind of making khan, our own pakis - pay 'em to be less stupid It might be easy for khan to fade out, if he feels he is a master swordsmith. We might have to go along with that self-assessment for another few decades, if we want to take the reigns of khan's systems at a later stage in a **non-disruptive manner**. We dont want to reinvent anything that khan already did, just take over and IPL-ize it. .....

There is a line of thought that is the long term plan of the EIC. The control is by desi versions just as the others were local Constitutioners.

[RajeshA]

reposting an old post
Indian military procurements from USA

What we should aim for is to do in defense what we have managed to do in IT.

In the last century, India was hardly on the IT map. One decade into it, and our IT landscape looks totally different. We are the IT services outsourcing workshop of the world.

This is what we should strive for.

Most of the defense equipment is expensive. To keep all the research and manufacturing in defense items going, America needs to diversify its market. In the long run, American military budgets cannot finance the American defense industry. So where to look? It can hardly sell weaponry to its old-time rivals like Russia and PRC. Russia has its own defense industry. So do some of its own NATO Allies. The EU likes to buy military items produced in the EU itself. Besides countries like France, UK, Sweden are in competition with USA in other markets. The pacifist outlook of many European countries has meant, they are already cutting their military budgets. Its other big market, Japan is still shackled to its peaceful constitution. The Iranian bogey helps in selling a some items to the Gulf, but there are limits from strategic viewpoint.

What America really needs is a big trustworthy market for its defense items. It is clear to America, that India would never be challenging America or may become an adversary some time in the near future. There is a large overlap of long-term goals and adversaries, even if in the mid-term we will be having differing priorities. So America is comfortable selling to us, high value and relative new technology.

India has the economic clout and scale to demand to be more than just a market. We have the chance of becoming a part of the most technologically advanced defense equipment supply chain in the world. We would want to get ever bigger share in research & development, production, assembly, field testing of defense equipment. Over the next 30 years, much of the military industrial complex of USA could have shifted to India.

The vision is for an empire in decline to transfer its life blood to the next empire in rise, which promises to uphold its values and look after its interests. That has to be India.

Just like we had a transfusion in IT from America, similarly its time to start a transfusion in defense equipment. Boeing and LM will some day be Indo-American companies.

If India believes in this vision, then EUMA is just a little bump on the way. The current leadership in India may be taking this route out of servitude and gratitude, but the coming generations of leaders in India will be reaching the end of this route with confidence, knowing that they decide how the world is to be run.

[ramana]

All thinking minds think alike!
To use Rahul Mehta's words.

[RamaY]

Also unstated is the danger of TSP being advised to take on the name India as successor to the Mughals.

Isn't it the idea to start with?

BTW, is it that difficult to change the name? Didn't PRC get the seat of Taiwan?

[Venkarl]

Is Burkha manipulating Cabinet positions here?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dqnAYhNa ... re=related

Nira Radia

Nira's talk with Vir Singhvi

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oIw7IfGY ... re=related

wow..I am new to this stuff. I hope nationalists have such consulting firms.

What wonders me is such leakages of telephonic conversations can happen only if their phones are tapped...and that tapping can be done by GoI agencies...and GoI is Congress now...and these leaks shows the other face of Congress...truly I am lost. whistleblowers??? why are they leaking now??

[Pranav]

The vision is for an empire in decline to transfer its life blood to the next empire in rise, which promises to uphold its values and look after its interests. That has to be India.

The way it has been done is that the elites of the declining empire infiltrate and seize control of the rising empire. That has happened in the cases Venice -> UK in the 1500's and then UK -> USA in the 1800's.

[JwalaMukhi]

Shri MMS uvacha:
http://www.rediff.com/news/slide-show/s ... 101120.htm

Consider the very creation of this blessed Republic of India. India was an imagined idea. We were a sub-continent divided at the time of independence. But through hard work, through wise leadership we have became a nation united.

One can only imagine, if the leadership was anymore wiser or was as wiser as today's caliber what would have happened.

[brihaspati]

^^^^The subcontinent could have been divided, but that subcontinent has still not become united - even through hard work! Is he not mixing up subcontinent with the Republic of India - or it is a Freudian slip? Subconsciously he thinks of the subcontinent as India- perhaps!

[JwalaMukhi]

Absolutely, if we were divided, that means that India is a mere imagination is bogus in his own mind. More likely, subconciously he knows Bharat, the subcontinent prior to 1947, but his training is pitting against his subconciousness. Cognitive dissonance plays out in different forms.

[Sanku]

O Man, Oh Man, O Man.

It is impossible to imagine that this person can do the right thing for Indian interests, way too much cognitive dissonance.

Just does not have the "large vision"

[Sravan]

Hi guys please give me some ideas to write about in my blog: http://sravan.us.

I mainly discuss about the existing problems and one of our core topics is India.

I'm starting a company and I need to try and influence the market perspective.

Any support in traffic or ideas would be great. If you guys also have any ideas for us to take and make into reality, please send us an email.

~Sravan

[Prem]

xxx post

Russia and China Will “Never Become Each Other’s Enemy”
http://noisyroom.net/blog/2010/11/24/ru ... ers-enemy/

[quote]Petersburg, Russia – China and Russia have decided to renounce the US dollar and resort to using their own currencies for bilateral trade, Premier Wen Jiabao and his Russian counterpart Vladimir Putin announced late on Tuesday.Chinese experts said the move reflected closer relations between Beijing and Moscow and is not aimed at challenging the dollar, but to protect their domestic economies.“About trade settlement, we have decided to use our own currencies,” Putin said at a joint news conference with Wen in St. Petersburg.The two countries were accustomed to using other currencies, especially the dollar, for bilateral trade. Since the financial crisis, however, high-ranking officials on both sides began to explore other possibilities.The yuan has now started trading against the Russian rouble in the Chinese interbank market, while the renminbi will soon be allowed to trade against the rouble in Russia, Putin said.“That has forged an important step in bilateral trade and it is a result of the consolidated financial systems of world countries,” he said.Putin made his remarks after a meeting with Wen. They also officiated at a signing ceremony for 12 documents, including energy cooperation.The documents covered cooperation on aviation, railroad construction, customs, protecting intellectual property, culture and a joint communique.Putin said one of the pacts between the two countries is about the purchase of two nuclear reactors from Russia by China’s Tianwan nuclear power plant, the most advanced nuclear power complex in China.Wen said at the press conference that the partnership between Beijing and Moscow has “reached an unprecedented level” and pledged the two countries will “never become each other’s enemy.”Over the past year, “our strategic cooperative partnership endured strenuous tests and reached an unprecedented level,” Wen said, adding the two nations are now more confident and determined to defend their mutual interests.“China will firmly follow the path of peaceful development and support the renaissance of Russia as a great power,” he said.“The modernization of China will not affect other countries’ interests, while a solid and strong Sino-Russian relationship is in line with the fundamental interests of both countries.”Wen said Beijing is willing to boost cooperation with Moscow in Northeast Asia, Central Asia and the Asia-Pacific region, as well as in major international organizations and on mechanisms in pursuit of a “fair and reasonable new order” in international politics and the economy[/quote

[Prem]

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-04-1 ... tened.html
BRIC Leaders Pledge to Boost Trade in Local Currency as Meeting Shortened

Brazil, Russia, India and China pledged to study ways to use their currencies, instead of the U.S. dollar, in local trade at a heads-of-state summit of the four biggest emerging economies. The so-called BRIC summit taking place in Brasilia ended a day earlier than scheduled after Chinese President Hu Jintao decided to return home early because of an earthquake in the western province of Qinghai that killed at least 760 people and displaced another 100,000. The leaders, who oversee economies estimated to fuel 60 percent of worldwide growth through 2014, said in a statement yesterday they would make efforts to sustain their domestic expansion to aid a global recovery that’s “not yet solid.” Even while vowing to promote cross-border trade and investment, the leaders made no mention of China’s controlled exchange rate, which economists say is a barrier to closer commercial ties. The yuan was not discussed during the meetings, Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesman Ma Zhaoxu told reporters.

[Pratyush]

X posting from the Indo US thread.

The joint family system however desirable may not be practicable in conext of the life in a metro. Especialy for the first generation migrent to the city.

However, what can be done in the city itself is to recycle every thing that can be recycled, compost the biodegradable items. Convert the sewage treatment plants to biogas plants to generate energy. move towards solar and renewable sources of energy. The marginal lands in the country side reclaimed into green areas with vegatation capable surviving on low amounts of water.

Provide every village with a population of 500 and above with a community level bio gas plant that will covert the animal and human waste into green fuel for the households of the village. Thereby reducing pressure in the forests near the village.

If a start is made now tha same will reduce the emession of the green house gases a great deal.

Every village must be made self contained. The village republic must be realised by the Indian state. The panchayate Raj is a bigining.

[Sanku]

Well Pratyush, if you ask for a village or village like model, the joint family system is a integral part of it. Even in cities barring first generation immigrants all would be eligible for the same model.

Even in case of migration to cities, most migration is often by poorer sections, who move with large set of assorated relatives, brothers cousins etc. They too are eligible.

It is only the Yuppie class which is trying to ape the western DINK lifestyle. They must realize their waywardness and change before too late.

[Tanaji]

If a start is made now tha same will reduce the emession of the green house gases a great deal.

So, why cant the same be achieved by massive amounts of nuclear power plants?

[Pratyush]

Tanaji,

I see both existing side by side. Not at the exclusion of one from the other.

The argument I make is made with a view of a lack of capital available in India to do a lot of things. When I speak of biogas plants I primarly see that as a way of the rural communities making use of localy available resources to generate economic value/ fuel. In that respect a majority of the rural communities have an abundence of live stock. You add to that the need to build toilets. (If you build a typical low cost toilet. I am takling of a hole in ground with a septic tank. You will realise that the risk of ground water contamination is very high. ) Add the toilet to the biogas palnt and use human waste as well. Don know if human waste can be used for the generation of biogas.

The Biogas so generate can be piped into the rural homes to be used for cooking. As opposed to using low energy cow dung cakes or wood. Or it can be used to run portable gensets to produce electricity. It is upto the rural population to decide what is to be done. But I see it as a readily available resource that can be utilised with relatively modest investment.

We need all the clean (Carbon neutral ) energy we can get. Whether nuke (No renewable ) or biogas (Renewable) or solar (In exhaustable).


JMT

[Pratyush]

Well Pratyush, if you ask for a village or village like model, the joint family system is a integral part of it. Even in cities barring first generation immigrants all would be eligible for the same model.

Even in case of migration to cities, most migration is often by poorer sections, who move with large set of assorated relatives, brothers cousins etc. They too are eligible.

It is only the Yuppie class which is trying to ape the western DINK lifestyle. They must realize their waywardness and change before too late.

I was primarly thinking of guys who migerate subsequesnt to finding a job.

For the poorer folk, even though they migerate enmass with nearly the entire family. The JFS is not really breaking down. If you look at it carefuly. As it is mearly getting transplanted from one location to another.

The yuppi crowd I am afraid is a lost cause. Better to give them up and seve ourselves a lot of hearache.

[brihaspati]

Tanaji,

I see both existing side by side. Not at the exclusion of one from the other.

The argument I make is made with a view of a lack of capital available in India to do a lot of things. When I speak of biogas plants I primarly see that as a way of the rural communities making use of localy available resources to generate economic value/ fuel. In that respect a majority of the rural communities have an abundence of live stock. You add to that the need to build toilets. (If you build a typical low cost toilet. I am takling of a hole in ground with a septic tank. You will realise that the risk of ground water contamination is very high. ) Add the toilet to the biogas palnt and use human waste as well. Don know if human waste can be used for the generation of biogas.

The Biogas so generate can be piped into the rural homes to be used for cooking. As opposed to using low energy cow dung cakes or wood. Or it can be used to run portable gensets to produce electricity. It is upto the rural population to decide what is to be done. But I see it as a readily available resource that can be utilised with relatively modest investment.

We need all the clean (Carbon neutral ) energy we can get. Whether nuke (No renewable ) or biogas (Renewable) or solar (In exhaustable).


JMT

Yes human waste is the same - except perhaps lower in potential methane content (generating potential). But it may have greater value in providing compost or "manure". The urine properly treated provides nitrogenous components too.

Perhaps a mixed urban-village concept should do well. Cities develop out of urbanization of the villages but keeping the productive fields and eco-systems more or less undisturbed. It is a matter of design and layout.

[Muppalla]

^^^ Please use my loo so that I will have more energy.

[brihaspati]

^^^water closet itself may not yield energy! Not much energy content in a huge amount of water containing a little nitrogenous chemicals. In several lines of organic farming, both urine and solid waste from humans are used, but needs proper "processing". Typically the simplest is to use sawdust or crushed wood/straw/grass based material over the excreta and allowing the degradation to happen slowly over a length of time. Many Indian village households [at least I have seen] had a spot designated for the compost heap. The open air toilet in the fields probably started out as a necessity or safe practice in less dense population times, but also acted by default as a composting process. Human excrement itself will not produce a huge amount of energy.

[RajeshA]

^^^ Please use my loo so that I will have more energy.

For more energy, try Chavanprash!

[ShauryaT]

I do not mean to post "another" corruption related article here, but for some time now, I have been looking for someone, who will express some of the thoughts in my mind, which relate to the current corruption related news in India. Pratap Bhanu Mehta is one such person, who looks beyond just the immediate controversy to see what it means.
Beware the single brush

The surface meaning of corruption, the use of public office for private gain, is now turning out to be a symptom of a deeper malaise. The threat to Indian democracy does not come merely from acts of corruption. It comes from the fact that the very sensibility that underlies corruption is beginning to infect much of public discourse, including efforts to counter corruption. To understand how insidious this deeper form of corruption is, we need to step back from debate over who is guilty and who is not and look at the larger institutional picture, which is revealing a deeper psychic malaise.

This phenomenon can best be understood by stepping out of a narrow understanding of corruption and returning to the core meaning of political corruption, most vividly outlined in the classical texts like Thucydides and Polybius. In this account, three elements are central to the moral psychology of corruption. The first is that every institution or act becomes merely instrumental to some extraneous end. A vocation is no longer defined by its core identity and mission; it is governed by external incentives. Using public office for private gain is merely one form of instrumentalism. But there are other manifestations of instrumentalism. The most obvious one is that lots of different institutions initially wear the mantle of virtue, and then use that mantle to further their own power beyond acceptable bounds. The aftermath of the “Raja” controversy has displayed this crass instrumentalism in full measure. Tapes of conversations between journalists and various lobbyists have been put online and some publications have carried stories on these conversations. The ostensible purpose is to show deep corruption in the media, where significant media personalities become power brokers and influence peddlers. To what extent these tapes establish corruption can be debated; and it would be inappropriate to comment on the guilt or innocence of particular individuals.

But we should worry about this. Often well-intentioned attempts to combat corruption enact the very instrumentalism that they seek to decry. First of all, there now seems to be virtually no check on the state in terms of what private conversations it can record, under what pretext. The state becomes even more deeply corrupt when it gives up the principles that should regulate its conduct; when in the name of pursuing investigations it gives itself carte blanche to do virtually anything. The fact that this “evidence” collected by the state is leaked, ostensibly for some instrumental purpose should worry us. The fact that all this purported evidence is published in the name of transparency, without context, without any institutional mediation at all, should worry us. We should worry that under the guise of promoting transparency we now promote a prurient interest in private conversations of people, irrespective of whether or not they are relevant to establishing guilt or innocence. Whether particular individuals are guilty or not should be investigated by proper means. But society exhibits a deeper form of corruption and corrosion of principles when all procedures and values are made instrumental to some external mission. What is now being revealed in the name of “anti-corruption” has echoes of totalitarian surveillance: the erasure of privacy, everyone is a snitch on everyone else, and every act other than it seems. I agree with this. The Indian constitution needs some serious ramping up on the concepts of privacy. NCRWC had major changes proposed on the topic under the NDA, but was not acted upon as the Congress did not agreeThe quest for justice becomes a rhetorical cloak for other vices: prurience, settling of private scores, or merely promotion of one’s own virtue.

Admittedly, it is hard to disguise the glee in some quarters that this has happened to the media; what goes around comes around. The philosopher Harry Frankfurt once wrote a great essay on how democracy was subverted more by “bullshit” than by “lies”. A liar at least acknowledges the distinction between a truth and a lie; he just wants to hide the truth. A “bull-shitter” is more dangerous because he does not care for the distinction between a truth and a lie: all subtle distinctions between innuendo and fact, speculation and reality, higher and lower values, relevant and irrelevant facts, are done away with. This is the point where you cannot tell the distinction between a lie and a truth; or rather even truth is simply a weapon for some other extraneous goal. All discourse operates at the same level. The danger is that in our democracy if there are no credible mediating institutions left, this is exactly the position where we end up: discourse without a sense of judgment and discrimination. Whether or not the media will now produce more measured discussions is an open question, but the corruption of discourse is hard to reverse.

The final element of the moral psychology of corruption is impatience with institutional forms.

Institutional forms matter in society because they are the only contrivances we have to mediate matters of truth. Otherwise the test of truth will simply be what any individual can declaim loudly: some claim authority to pronounce on the truth simply on the basis of their own virtue, some because they think they have served the poor, some because they think they are smart, some because they think they have access to secrets. We are, understandably, impatient that our institutions have not done the job of mediating these rival claims; no one has authority we can trust. It is this vacuum that literally allows anything to fill up the space.

Edmund Burke was one the greatest political crusaders against corruption. He fought not just against patronage, but also deeper forms of corruption: the subversion by the state of its own principles, the propensity of society to make everything instrumental. But he warned that nothing is more dangerous to society than what he called “general invective”. He wrote: “An opinion of the indiscriminate corruption of the House of Commons will, at length, induce a disgust of Parliaments.” His point simply was that while specific cases of corruption needed to be pursued, the authority of institutions needed to be preserved. Fortunately our voters often exercise delicate political judgment in the face of limited choices. But there is a real danger that if we are not more discriminating in judging institutions we will suffer from a psychic corruption that is hard to rectify. We will legitimise the idea of a crass instrumentalism in the pursuit of goals; our impatience will prompt us to set aside basic values like privacy and due process. And the generalised climate of suspicion will also be self-defeating. After all, when you can’t presume to know who is corrupt and who is not, not being corrupt has no social meaning.

The writer is president, Centre for Policy Research, Delhi [email protected]

[Prem]

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/27/world ... .html?_r=1
A Yearning for the Soul of Two Nations

CAMBRIDGE, MASSACHUSETTS — Had the judgment come from a philosopher or sociologist or foreign journalist, it might have been unremarkable. But it came instead from the political matriarch of India’s governing party. “Our economy may increasingly be dynamic,” Sonia Gandhi, the president of the Congress party, said last week in New Delhi, “but our moral universe seems to be shrinking.
“It is impossible to feel calm and quiet in a society that only chases profits,” Ji Qi told me in the smoky lobby of a Marriott Hotel in Shanghai.A good civilization should be balanced between material and spiritual,” he said. He thinks that China will undergo, like South Korea before it, a rapid religious revival in the coming decades as more and more people come to feel what he feels. Lately he finds himself turning to ancient Taoist texts, to Confucius, to Buddhism, all to anchor himself. He said what so many others did, in different ways: “We need an evolution of thoughts and ideas.”
Indians and Chinese now have time to reflect about growth — as evidenced perhaps in the thousands who turned out last weekend to mourn those who perished in an apartment tower inferno in Shanghai. The questions they are asking are not only about superpowerdom and their place in the world. They are also about anchoring and purpose, about the quiet life within. For what great idea will each country be known? What counterweights will each poise against the pull of money? Who will be their new heroes? What kind of world will they summon? What will be, when the hot growth cools and the deeper reckoning comes, the meaning of their

rise?

[Airavat]

India wants MFN status from Pakistan

Dwelling views in a FICCI conference on India-Pakistan Economic Relations Prospects & Challenges, Nirupama Rao said,"There is the issue before Pakistan of the grant of Most Favored Nation (MFN) status for India......As things stand, Pakistan allows only the import of about 110 items from India through the land route while it allows the export of only one item, cement, to India by the road route. Pakistan should permit all permissible items for trade via the Attari-Wagah route."

Is it really in Indian Interests to engage economically with a failed state, a terrorist state, and most importantly a state whose army's whole ambition is to destroy India? A state which wants to destroy India's economy with forged currency notes?

India would get better returns by investing a little effort in destroying the various economies of Pakistan: the military economy, the jihad economy, and the drugs economy. And if these cannot be separated from the wider economy of that country, then so be it. Destroy the value of their currency, make their trade unprofitable, discredit their banking system.

[Airavat]

HC to decide on right to privacy of Indian citizens

A Bench headed by Chief Justice Mukul Mudgal will decide on Monday if the contentions of a former Director-General of Police-rank officer of Haryana that he was entitled under the RTI Act to obtain details of the religion followed by Sonia Gandhi, her daughter Priyanka Gandhi Vadra and son Rahul Gandhi, who is general secretary of the All India Congress Committee, are correct or not.

Former IPS officer P C Wadhwa had sought information from the Central Public Information Officer (CPIO) of the office of Registrar General, Census Operations, under the Union Ministry of Home Affairs about the religion mentioned by Sonia Gandhi and her children during the last census. However, in March 2008, the CIC rejected the prayer for a review of the earlier order, pointing out that the CIC has said it time and again that matters private to an individual couldn’t be forced out into the public under the RTI Act. “The sanctity of the private domain must be kept inviolate at all times,” the CIC order said.

[brihaspati]

Is religion really a matter of "private affairs" in India? The civil law is based on religious affiliation, and hence it becomes a matter of public issue on the occasion of registration of marriages etc say under the respective code bills (marriage registers are public issue). How can one claim it to be private when the law does not make it private matter by depending a lot of stuff on religion's public nature for an individual?

[ShauryaT]

Will legalizing 'lobbying' prevent corruption in India?

Though used interchangeably with corruption, it can refer to a form of advocacy with the intention of influencing decisions made by legislators and officials in the government by individuals or groups. Indeed one could argue that lobbying is just a special form of corruption focused on legislative bodies or some other rule-making agency. However, there are some important differences between lobbying and corruption. They centre on the notions that corrupt practices are illegal, that corruption activities tend to involve bribes or illegal payments and, arguably the most important difference, that corrupt practices tend to directly benefit a small number of 'users' (often one individual) while lobbying activities are carried out in order to benefit a group of users that share a specific interest.

[ShauryaT]

Is religion really a matter of "private affairs" in India? The civil law is based on religious affiliation, and hence it becomes a matter of public issue on the occasion of registration of marriages etc say under the respective code bills (marriage registers are public issue). How can one claim it to be private when the law does not make it private matter by depending a lot of stuff on religion's public nature for an individual?

In the west, religion is private, till it is not. The notions of privacy has its roots in the ideas of possessions and ownership that form the basis of western laws on the concepts of privacy. However, Religion on the other hand has always been a public affair in western society, until the "secularism" bug hit them. With the advent of secularism, it is religion that lost its highly prominent public place in western society but society is not willing to totally forego the public aspects of religion, which forms the basis of the communities they live in. So an interesting and uneasy balance between religion as a private affair and its role and influence in public society exists.

Now, for India, my view is neither religion, in its Abrahamic forms (sorry Sadler) nor the the concepts of possessions and its derivatives by way of privacy have been core concepts of Indian society. Our modes of government and its laws are based on western models and to make it worse, we picked up over 85%+ of the laws of colonial India. These laws and systems are so divorced from Indian society that it is not funny.

[shiv]

Is religion really a matter of "private affairs" in India? The civil law is based on religious affiliation, and hence it becomes a matter of public issue on the occasion of registration of marriages etc say under the respective code bills (marriage registers are public issue). How can one claim it to be private when the law does not make it private matter by depending a lot of stuff on religion's public nature for an individual?

Aside from legalities let me enter into my favorite quibble. Semantics.

If you had looked at India say 1200 years ago you would have found many of the activities that you find now but without the "legal hassle" of whether "religion is private or public". I reiterate that India is a warm fertile country that has always had a high population. That population has, for millennia considered certain things as sacred and worthy of respect if not worship.

For example this includes certain trees like the Pipal (Ficus religiosa). You have a Pipal tree growing and you wil have Indians who come and worship there. This is part and parcel of being Indian. Another fundamental aspect of being Indian is that while you may not want to worship the tree yourself you respect the right of others to do that. It was particularly the entry of competitive, exclusionary religions into India that set the stage for conflict in Indian society. The minute you start classifying traditional public Indian activities as "religious and non religious" you are automatically restricting the right to be an Indian in India. If you don't like the Pipal example you can use some other natural feature that is a traditionally worshipped icon in India - such as a snake-mound.

[Prem]

China Clones, Sells Russian Fighter Jets
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000142 ... 98844.html

Quote:
This epochal turnaround was palpable in the Russian pavilion at November's Airshow China in the southern city of Zhuhai. Russia used to be the star of this show, wowing visitors with its "Russian Knights" aerobatic team, showing off fighters, helicopters and cargo planes, and sealing multibillion dollar deals on the sidelines. This year, it didn't bring a single real aircraft—only a handful of plastic miniatures, tended by a few dozen bored sales staff. China, by contrast, laid on its biggest commercial display of military technology—almost all based on Russian know-how. The star guests were the "Sherdils," a Pakistani aerobatic team flying fighter jets that are Russian in origin but are now being produced by Pakistan and China.We didn't pay enough attention to our intellectual property in the past," said a Russian defense official. "Now China is even competing with us on the international market."
• Few things illustrate this more clearly than the J-11B, a Chinese fighter that Russian officials allege is a direct copy of the Su-27, a one-seat fighter that was developed by the Soviets through the 1970s and 1980s as a match for the U.S. F-15 and F-16.The J-11B looked almost identical to the Su-27, but China said it was 90% indigenous and included more advanced Chinese avionics and radars. Only the engine was still Russian, China said.Now it is being fitted with a Chinese engine as well, according to Zhang Xinguo, deputy president of AVIC, which includes Shenyang Aircraft. "You cannot say it's just a copy," he said. "Mobile phones all look similar. But technology is developing very quickly. Even if it looks the same, everything inside cannot be the same."The J-11B presented Russia with a stark choice—to continue selling China weapons, and risk having them cloned, too, or to stop, and miss out on its still lucrative market.

( India's 2 neighbors Cloney and Clowny)

[RajeshA]

An interesting book
The Legend of the Peacock Throne by Theresa Edwards

[negi]

Parliament session faces oppn heat, adjourns for 19th day

No session for 19th straight day , nice going. Shows the kind of lowlife that has made it to through to the top.

[brihaspati]

neither grouping cannot retreat now - it will be seen as confirmation of the stand and position of the opposite/other party. But what it does is sort paralyzes the admin to a certain extent.

[RamaY]

India - World largest democrasy and worlds biggest Banana Republic

Check their pictures here http://164.100.47.5/council/RSalphabetical.aspx

Following ministers are not elected members of Parliament, so they are not required to be answerable or loyal to Indian Public. Check their portfolios and relate them to budget allocations...

All that is left to Indians is
- Home Ministry (All internal security issues of Indians are the responsibility of Indians)
- Finance Ministry (Manage your "Internal Finances")

Srno Minister's Name Portfolio
House
1 Dr. Manmohan Singh Prime Minister &
Rajya Sabha Ministry of Personnel, Public Grievances & Pensions
Minsitry of Planning
Department of Atomic Energy
Department of Space
Ministry of Culture
2 Shri Anand Sharma Minister of Commerce and Industry
Rajya Sabha
3 Shri A.K. Antony Minister of Defence
Rajya Sabha
4 Smt. Ambika Soni Minister of Information and Broadcasting
Rajya Sabha
5 Shri G.K. Vasan Minister of Shipping
Rajya Sabha
6 Shri Ghulam Nabi Azad Minister of Health and Family Welfare
Rajya Sabha
7 Shri Jairam Ramesh Minister of State (Independent Charge) of the Ministry of Environment and Forests
Rajya Sabha
8 Dr. M.S. Gill Minister of Youth Affairs and Sports
Rajya Sabha
9 Shri Mukul Roy Minister of State in the Ministry of Shipping
Rajya Sabha
10 Shri Murli Deora Minister of Petroleum and Natural Gas
Rajya Sabha
11 Shri S.M. Krishna Minister of External Affairs
Rajya Sabha
12 Shri Vayalar Ravi Minister of Overseas Indian Affairs
Rajya Sabha
13 Shri Vilasrao Dagadojirao Deshmukh Minister of Heavy Industries and Public Enterprises
Rajya Sabha

[negi]

And MMS yaps about parliamentary system.
RSS deadlier than Al-Qaeda, Indian state legislator says

NAGPUR, India: The Samajwadi Party legislator Abu Asim Azmi created a furor in a session of the Maharashtra Legislative Assembly on Friday when he alleged that according to the WikiLeaks disclosure the Hindu militant organization Rashtriya Sevak Sangh (RSS) was a thousand times more dangerous than the Al-Qaeda.

So now we have legislators quoting Paki wikileaks in our assemblies.

[BSR Murthy]

And MMS yaps about parliamentary system.

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 083467.cms
Prime Minister Manmohan Singh today said he is "worried" about the future of the Parliamentary system in the wake of a complete washout of the winter session of Parliament on the 2G spectrum issue.